Posting for relevance
Talk Religion And Be Nice About It
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Until recentely I figured it out something that changed my whole idea about religion. This is, that god is not a person, god is a concept. I always thought that compassion (for exemple) was something human, its not, its religious.
I know some atheists, and what I found funny is that, they talk about Christian morals not knowing that its Christians morals, thinking its something everyone has.
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Before I bombard this thread with studies that desribe how compassion is a trait intrinsic to the emotional and behavioral repertoire of almost all humans (and an impressive amount of non-human animal buddies too) i wanna make sure I got this right: Are you implying compassion is a trait only religious people can have? If yes, conceptually, you're stepping into very dangerous territory, my friend. If you're saying compassion is something that originates from God, I can't argue with that, since it's your belief and were chill. If you believe compassion is some kind of "chosen people" trait, I really gotta stop you and discuss this more with you all relaxed, and chill in this beautiful thread. Of course religion is like a sharp lens that aims to guide and increase human kindness to the max. But it's also been abused as a tool to exclude others and it doesn't do it justice.Now I know that I am a pile of shit compared to Jesus and I probably will not go to heaven (that is, if I believed in heaven and hell) nevertheless, I am a Christian because of who I am, I was always a Christian and I never knew.
On a completely different note: Dude. don't talk about yourself like that. We all have imperfections but the thing that Jesus stands for is love and that includes self love. Of course we should always strive to better ourselves so if you're struggling to be the best person YOU can be (which you have), Jesus would have been down with that I'm sure :)
What matters is that you learn from the past and become a person you can be proud of one step at a time. Just a lil step each day. -
Still waiting for the "Talk Nihilism and Be F*cking Nice About It" thread.
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Shia Muslim, ask me anything
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My beliefs have changed recently. I used to consider myself as a Pagan, but after going to some events that was related to it, it was not really for me.
First, I bow down to no one, and I don't really believe in a higher power per say. When I think gods/goddesses I see it as a title like king/queen/etc. Not some almighty being and all that. Second, I rather "worship" myself, as I see myself as a goddess, but in my meaning of it, as a leader. (I want to be a leader, not a follower.) Third, I do still believe in spirits and stuff, but I lean more towards the science side of things really. So, technically, I am an atheist since I don't believe in a higher being. (According to one of my friends, when I asked anyway.) So, yeah o:
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Set Art by Daily Rowlet -
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1 bowl on average
1.5 on ramadan modeWhere is your Shia ancestry from? Like what part of the world?
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@Monkey:
Where is your Shia ancestry from? Like what part of the world?
Middleeast/Lebanese
I have a "saed" title in my name meaning that my roots could be related to Mohamad's bloodline
(I say could because many faked their roots in history to get benefits).
@Femme:When I say hey, do you say ho?
Heeeeeey
yo ho ho and a bottle of rum
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Is the Ramadan really something harsh ? Because lot of people enjoy making it sound like it was one month of hell even though everyone knows (that ain't a secret) people are waking up very early and eating a lot and doing the same at night.
People bragging about not eating during the day couldn't keep up a hunger-strike for 2days.
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Personally, it really depends on the time and space. If it's in the winter time, it's really easy since you have a lot of time to drink and eat and drinking is not an issue because it's cold. This summer was really, really tough though because I was in a country where drinking and eating were possible only from 10 P.M. to 4 A.M. (eating time depends on the times the sun rises and sets and are thus different depending on your city) plus it was really really hot in the day time. I didn't really care about food, it was the drinking that was tough. But food wise it wasn't too cool either since I wasn't able to eat a second meal since I was too stuffed from the first one and had to get up early because of work and was too stressed to munch. So it felt a little bit like a strategy game to efficiently squeeze in enough water food and sleep to survive the next day. I think Scandinavian Muslims are playing the actual hard mode since the nights are even shorter in the summer time.
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Ramadan can be surprisingly difficult on many days if you're not careful with your activities and eating schedule. Depends on the individual. Like, I find it very hard to wake up early and eat a decent meal. And you have to do this fast for an entire month which, depending on the year, can happen right in the middle of summer where you have longer days and shorter nights. So, yeah, it can be harsh depending on a multitude of factors.
As for the people bragging about how hard Ramadan is, I think that kinda ruins the spirit of the whole thing. It's not supposed to be about you . It's a celebration of the revelation of the word of Allah and this month is a month of fasting, charity, and prayer. It's ok to be happy and celebrate that you're able to do Ramdan, but don't make it all about how great you are at fasting and, man, it was so hard you have no idea.
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Is the Ramadan really something harsh ? Because lot of people enjoy making it sound like it was one month of hell even though everyone knows (that ain't a secret) people are waking up very early and eating a lot and doing the same at night.
People bragging about not eating during the day couldn't keep up a hunger-strike for 2days.
like everything else, it's hard the first 2-4 days then you get used to it
it's just you shifting from a eating 3-4 times a day diet to a single big one at a certain timeit also depends on the season (summer hot), your type of work (working in the fields all day for example) without being able to drink a drop of water, and how early you wake up for work
in summer eating time is at like 8:00 pm while in winter it might be at ~4:00pm-ish, which means a teen who has nothing better to do can wake up at 2 and just wait for 2 hours and eat.
so it's all basically situational, and even that, your body adapts to the diet after a hard start.
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Is the Ramadan really something harsh ? Because lot of people enjoy making it sound like it was one month of hell even though everyone knows (that ain't a secret) people are waking up very early and eating a lot and doing the same at night.
People bragging about not eating during the day couldn't keep up a hunger-strike for 2days.
Does France as a society not have any massively participated in tedious social obligation that everyone makes lots of jokes and elbow nudging exaggerations about?
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@Monkey:
Does France as a society not have any massively participated in tedious social obligation that everyone makes lots of jokes and elbow nudging exaggerations about?
Is this rhetorical ? And no, I don't think so. You have something in mind ?
Are people in the US doing that ? -
Is this rhetorical ? And no, I don't think so. You have something in mind ?
Are people in the US doing that ?As people in a society yes, Americans comically exaggerate collectively about tough annually observed rituals to one another.
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I say this to everyone who asks me, personally, but Ramadan isn't supposed to be easy. If it were easy then your struggle to relearn patience and self-restraint wouldn't exist. If it were easy then it wouldn't be as much of a month of cleansing and renewal as it is. People quit bad habits in Ramadan. People donate much more than they're comfortable with in Ramadan. People sacrifice their time and energy to help others in Ramadan. It's a struggle, but as Muslims we believe that the sacrifices made in Ramadan will be rewarded in this life and in the hereafter, so it's worth it. You come out of the month feeling like you accomplished something. It's a pretty special feeling.
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Ramadan sorta sounds familiar to Lent in the Christian religion with giving up something for the weeks that come along with it. And I believe Lent also had its own fasting period, but I am not certain if it was or not. I know now, there is no fasting involved in that religion whatsoever, as far as I know. But anyways, I am just trying to understand the different religions and how they compare and contrast to one another.
By the way, I know with Islam you have to eat kosher at times. How does that compare with the Jewish form of kosher eating?
Avatar: Series: Neptunia; Character: Neptune; Artist: Unknown
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The only problem I have with Ramadan is that it's time is based on moon calender which makes it's time diffrent every year
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Ramadan sorta sounds familiar to Lent in the Christian religion with giving up something for the weeks that come along with it. And I believe Lent also had its own fasting period, but I am not certain if it was or not. I know now, there is no fasting involved in that religion whatsoever, as far as I know. But anyways, I am just trying to understand the different religions and how they compare and contrast to one another.
By the way, I know with Islam you have to eat kosher at times. How does that compare with the Jewish form of kosher eating?
Lent as far as I'm aware used to be specifically about not eating certain food (no meat) and not sinning (no sex). Not that I've ever celebrated it, but in Catholithism, you even have a festival called 'Carnival' (or in italian, Carnevale) which takes place right before Lent and is appropriately called Carne (meat) Vale (is acceptable, has worth, has value, is valid/allowed) due to the 40 days of no meat consumption that will follow.
I know in the US it's become 'giving up something' but I'm not sure that's how it's done in Italy at least. Also, in Christianity you're not supposed to eat meat on fridays, if I'm correct.
Admittedly it's been a long time since I learnt about christian practices in Italy, but I'm certain that Lent is a 'no eating X' policy that is comparable to a (much easier) version of Ramadan. What with is being also based on a changing date like Easter.
Side Note: Islam eating Kosher? Isn't the Kosher equivalent in Islam called Halal? Or are there times when both Halal AND Kosher apply?
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
yo ho ho and a bottle of rum
Careful with that Rum it's not Halal :P
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You can eat when the sun is down, is that how Ramadan works? Because I'm insanely curious what you do if you live in the arctic circle, if you're unlucky there'll be days when the sun never sets. Not that a whole lot of muslims live there, but there's bound to be someone.
Every time Ramadan comes around I've been tempted to try a fast of my own. I'm atheist so obviously the religious aspects are lost on me, but the idea of fasting in order to better understand those in need, appreciate what you have and learn some diligence are good morals for anyone. From what I've understood we used to have a fast in Sweden, right before Easter, could be fun to try reviving that (would also make Fettisdagen actually mean something besides eating lots and lots of Semla).
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Ramadan sorta sounds familiar to Lent in the Christian religion with giving up something for the weeks that come along with it. And I believe Lent also had its own fasting period, but I am not certain if it was or not. I know now, there is no fasting involved in that religion whatsoever, as far as I know. But anyways, I am just trying to understand the different religions and how they compare and contrast to one another.
By the way, I know with Islam you have to eat kosher at times. How does that compare with the Jewish form of kosher eating?
Muslims have a dietary restriction similar to, but a bit more relaxed than kosher rules and guidelines.
We are asked to eat what is "halal", which means "permissible", and those things that are prohibited are specifically mentioned in the Quran in pretty much one verse, but there are other places.Here's the prohibited list:
[hide]Prohibited to you are (1)dead animals, (2)blood, (3)the flesh of swine, and (4)that which has been dedicated to other than Allah , (5)and [those animals] killed by strangling or by a (6)violent blow or by a (7)head-long fall or by the (8)goring of horns, and (9)those from which a wild animal has eaten, except what you [are able to] slaughter [before its death], and (10)those which are sacrificed on stone altars, and [prohibited is] that you seek decision through divining arrows. That is grave disobedience. This day those who disbelieve have despaired of [defeating] your religion; so fear them not, but fear Me. This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful." (Surat Al-Maidah, 5:3)
1. Maytah, the ‘Dead Animal’ – It is unlawful to consume the flesh of an animal that has died a natural death, without being slaughtered.
2. Al-damm, Blood – It is unlawful to consume blood that exits from the slaughtered animal. As for residual blood that remains in the flesh after the animal has been slaughtered, then this is not ‘damm’ and is permissible.
3. Swine (Pork) – Every portion of the pig: its bones, flesh, skin, and hair.
4. That which is dedicated to other than Allah – It is unlawful to consume foods that are prepared or slaughtered and then offered to idols or other gods.
5. Animals killed by asphyxiation
6. Animals killed by a violent strike/blow
7. Animals killed by a headlong fall
8. Animals gorged by other animals
9. What was eaten by other animals – This refers to the remains of a kill by another carnivorous animal.
10. What is offered at stone altars - Animals slaughtered for idols or demi-gods, etc.Other than this list above, and alcohol, domesticated donkeys, carnivores, and birds of prey, everything else is permissible. Kosher meat is also permissible to Muslims. (I love visiting kosher restaurants!)[/hide]
There's an interesting implication since so many of what is haram (prohibited) is defined by the way the animal is slaughtered.
! There's a practice in the meat industry called "captive bolt" where cows are basically shot in the brain before being slaughtered, which is basically "being killed by a violent blow". Which means that this method cannot produce halal meat. Some countries have regulations in place where this practice is mandatory, but in Canada for example, hand slaughtering exists so that's how most halal meat here is produced.
@Zar:
You can eat when the sun is down, is that how Ramadan works? Because I'm insanely curious what you do if you live in the arctic circle, if you're unlucky there'll be days when the sun never sets. Not that a whole lot of muslims live there, but there's bound to be someone.
Every time Ramadan comes around I've been tempted to try a fast of my own. I'm atheist so obviously the religious aspects are lost on me, but the idea of fasting in order to better understand those in need, appreciate what you have and learn some diligence are good morals for anyone. From what I've understood we used to have a fast in Sweden, right before Easter, could be fun to try reviving that (would also make Fettisdagen actually mean something besides eating lots and lots of Semla).
Correct, the time for fasting is between dawn and dusk. When a person lives in a place where there is no clear distinction between night and day, or when there is only very little time of "night time", then their community makes a decision to either:
a) fast according to the times of the nearest city that has day and night time
b) fast according to the times of Mecca.Scholars are consulted beforehand and then they just do that. The practice stems from a Hadith (saying if the prophet Muhammad) where he said that at the end of times, there will be days, weeks, and years with perpetual daytime. His companions asked him how then are we able to know the times for the daily prayers, since those times are based on the position of the sun. He told them that we should estimate, so this is a direct example of using the same solution.
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Correct, the time for fasting is between dawn and dusk. When a person lives in a place where there is no clear distinction between night and day, or when there is only very little time of "night time", then their community makes a decision to either:
a) fast according to the times of the nearest city that has day and night time
b) fast according to the times of Mecca.Scholars are consulted beforehand and then they just do that. The practice stems from a Hadith (saying if the prophet Muhammad) where he said that at the end of times, there will be days, weeks, and years with perpetual daytime. His companions asked him how then are we able to know the times for the daily prayers, since those times are based on the position of the sun. He told them that we should estimate, so this is a direct example of using the same solution.
That's interesting! Fascinating that it was thought of so long ago. I assume they do the same during perpetual nights.
I wonder if there are any other places besides the arctic circles where this is observed.
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If someone fasts according to the times of Mecca, and if he is living somewhere where it's night when there is daylight at the Mecca. Is this cheating?
I mean all Muslims should just move in America for the month of the Ramadan and that'll just be easy.Careful with that Rum it's not Halal :P
It is not, for Alawites. It's forbidden to get drunk though.
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If someone fasts according to the times of Mecca, and if he is living somewhere where it's night when there is daylight at the Mecca. Is this cheating?
No, they are just using the times of the prayers of Mecca as if it was their own times.
There are 5 daily prayers, each based on the position of the sun during the day. Remember there were no clocks 1400 years ago in arabia so this was how they determined times. The dawn prayer ends just before the sun itself peeks from the horizon, the next prayer "dhuhr" is when the sun is at the zenith, "asr" prayer is when an object's shadow is equal in length to the object, "Maghrib" is when the sun is setting and is past the horizon, and then the last, "Isha" is shortly after Maghrib, around twilight.
So if people were to be using Mecca's times, they're using their prayer times because the time of fasting is when fajr prayer comes in to when maghrib prayer comes in. Like when the call for prayer at dawn starts, you stop eating, and when the call for the sunset prayer starts, you start eating lol.
I mean all Muslims should just move in America for the month of the Ramadan and that'll just be easy.
Alas! The other tidbit about the month of Ramadan is that Ramadan is literally the name of a month in the Islamic calendar. Unlike our calendar, the Gregorian calendar, based on the position of the sun, the Islamic calendar is a lunar calendar. The lunar calendar differs each month, because the lunar phases may have 29 or 30 days. Thus, the year is much shorter than our gregorian year, and the Islamic months shift up by about 2 weeks every year. Meaning, the month of Ramadan becomes earlier and earlier each year. I remember when I was a little kid, Ramadan was in the dead of winter. Now, it's in the hottest part of the year. Soon, it'll be in winter again. Meaning, it doesn't really matter where you live, eventually you'll have to fast a 17 or 18 hour day in the summer lol.
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Lent as far as I'm aware used to be specifically about not eating certain food (no meat) and not sinning (no sex). Not that I've ever celebrated it, but in Catholithism, you even have a festival called 'Carnival' (or in italian, Carnevale) which takes place right before Lent and is appropriately called Carne (meat) Vale (is acceptable, has worth, has value, is valid/allowed) due to the 40 days of no meat consumption that will follow.
Oh, I see. I used to be Catholic, but never heard of Carnival. But then again my parents came from Poland, so there probably was different traditions for the country.
I know in the US it's become 'giving up something' but I'm not sure that's how it's done in Italy at least. Also, in Christianity you're not supposed to eat meat on fridays, if I'm correct.
From what I remember in school, it was people who were Catholic that did not eat meat, while I saw other sects of Christianity eat meat. (This is a memory of back when I was in a food class in high school.)
Admittedly it's been a long time since I learnt about christian practices in Italy, but I'm certain that Lent is a 'no eating X' policy that is comparable to a (much easier) version of Ramadan. What with is being also based on a changing date like Easter.
Ah, okay. Yeah, Ramadan also has the no water besides the no food, so it is a little harder, but possible. As you can fill yourself up with food and worry before the day starts and ends. I think anyway.
Side Note: Islam eating Kosher? Isn't the Kosher equivalent in Islam called Halal? Or are there times when both Halal AND Kosher apply?
Oh, okay o: Yeah, Femme mentioned it was called Halal. I learned the practice of it from a Muslim customer back when I worked at Dollar General, and she could not eat the cheese because it was not considered Halal. (I was doing a return for her by the way.)
Muslims have a dietary restriction similar to, but a bit more relaxed than kosher rules and guidelines.
We are asked to eat what is "halal", which means "permissible", and those things that are prohibited are specifically mentioned in the Quran in pretty much one verse, but there are other places.Here's the prohibited list:
[hide]1. Maytah, the ‘Dead Animal’ – It is unlawful to consume the flesh of an animal that has died a natural death, without being slaughtered.
2. Al-damm, Blood – It is unlawful to consume blood that exits from the slaughtered animal. As for residual blood that remains in the flesh after the animal has been slaughtered, then this is not ‘damm’ and is permissible.
3. Swine (Pork) – Every portion of the pig: its bones, flesh, skin, and hair.
4. That which is dedicated to other than Allah – It is unlawful to consume foods that are prepared or slaughtered and then offered to idols or other gods.
5. Animals killed by asphyxiation
6. Animals killed by a violent strike/blow
7. Animals killed by a headlong fall
8. Animals gorged by other animals
9. What was eaten by other animals – This refers to the remains of a kill by another carnivorous animal.
10. What is offered at stone altars - Animals slaughtered for idols or demi-gods, etc.Other than this list above, and alcohol, domesticated donkeys, carnivores, and birds of prey, everything else is permissible. Kosher meat is also permissible to Muslims. (I love visiting kosher restaurants!)[/hide]
There's an interesting implication since so many of what is haram (prohibited) is defined by the way the animal is slaughtered.
! There's a practice in the meat industry called "captive bolt" where cows are basically shot in the brain before being slaughtered, which is basically "being killed by a violent blow". Which means that this method cannot produce halal meat. Some countries have regulations in place where this practice is mandatory, but in Canada for example, hand slaughtering exists so that's how most halal meat here is produced.
Oh, okay, that is interesting indeed. Though, I did not think there were people that actually would eat donkey 0.0…. (That are not Muslim.) And thanks for sharing the list of the different rules! ^^
Also, it seems it mostly goes with meat products. By the way, how does Halal work with like eggs, cheese, and other diary products? -curious- -points to my above message about the customer returning the cheese because the conditions were wrong-
Avatar: Series: Neptunia; Character: Neptune; Artist: Unknown
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Cheese! My friend and my foe.
There are two ingredients in some cheeses that may be pork-based. Rennet, and Enzymes. Rennet is always animal based, but Enzymes are fine only if it's labeled "microbial enzymes", which are plant based. This is a topic that differs from person to person, though. Some people don't really care. I follow it cuz there's always another brand of cheese without rennet and with vegetable enzymes instead, so it's not difficult.
Eggs are always halal no matter what, and other dairies are completely fine, unless there's rennet, enzymes, or gelatine in the case of yogurt. Gelatin is animal based most of the time.
It sounds like a lot but I eat cheese and yogurt all the time without difficulty.
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Cheese! My friend and my foe.
There are two ingredients in some cheeses that may be pork-based. Rennet, and Enzymes. Rennet is always animal based, but Enzymes are fine only if it's labeled "microbial enzymes", which are plant based. This is a topic that differs from person to person, though. Some people don't really care. I follow it cuz there's always another brand of cheese without rennet and with vegetable enzymes instead, so it's not difficult.
Eggs are always halal no matter what, and other dairies are completely fine, unless there's rennet, enzymes, or gelatine in the case of yogurt. Gelatin is animal based most of the time.
It sounds like a lot but I eat cheese and yogurt all the time without difficulty.
Oh, okay. Now, I get it o:
Thanks for clarifying on that! ^^
Avatar: Series: Neptunia; Character: Neptune; Artist: Unknown
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Oh, okay. Now, I get it o:
Thanks for clarifying on that! ^^
Anytime! Islam has a scary reputation but when you look closely, there's always something interesting to learn that may surprise you. As an animal lover, the Islamic attitude of mercy towards animals, even during slaughter, always fascinated me. In the Quran there's a lot of references to animals as like complex and awe-inspiring creatures that God created that are always my favourite bits.
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Anytime! Islam has a scary reputation but when you look closely, there's always something interesting to learn that may surprise you. As an animal lover, the attitude of mercy towards animals, even during slaughter, always fascinated me. In the Quran there's a lot of references to animals as like complex and awe-inspiring creatures that God created that are always my favourite bits.
Oh, okay. Yeah, if only the companies nowadays treated animals we slaughtered with more respect.
And what do you mean by scary reputation? O.o
Avatar: Series: Neptunia; Character: Neptune; Artist: Unknown
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Oh, okay. Yeah, if only the companies nowadays treated animals we slaughtered with more respect.
And what do you mean by scary reputation? O.o
Well yknow, the whole "Islam is terrorism" and "all Muslims are evil terrorists" stereotype lol. :P
But honestly, I found that for every person who just mindlessly hates on Islam, there are more people who are interested in understanding it, like you guys.Hidden:
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Well yknow, the whole "Islam is terrorism" and "all Muslims are evil terrorists" stereotype lol. :P
Oh, that. I thought you meant there where quotes in the Koran that were bad 0.0…... Sorry for misunderstanding! ^^;;;;;
But honestly, I found that for every person who just mindlessly hates on Islam, there are more people who are interested in understanding it, like you guys.
Well, that's a good thing. If people tried to understand things, and not listen to propaganda, than there be more peace in the world in my opinion. And I like learning about new things too, as I crave knowledge.
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Cuz knowledge is Power!
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Oh, okay, that is interesting indeed. Though, I did not think there were people that actually would eat donkey 0.0…. (That are not Muslim.) And thanks for sharing the list of the different rules! ^^
I might be alone on this, but I'd probably eat anything that moves as long as it tastes nice… But that's an atheist for you, very shady set of moral values :ninja:
Donkey is the least of those! I've heard deep fried tarantula is tasty, I'm hoping to get a taste of dog (or maybe even cat? you never know) if I ever go to rural china, guiney pig is also supposed to be tasty and I already happily eat horse, rabbit, pigeon... any of those slightly different meats that anglosaxons don't approve of :P
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Cuz knowledge is Power!
lol XDDDDD
I might be alone on this, but I'd probably eat anything that moves as long as it tastes nice… But that's an atheist for you, very shady set of moral values :ninja:
Donkey is the least of those! I've heard deep fried tarantula is tasty, I'm hoping to get a taste of dog (or maybe even cat? you never know) if I ever go to rural china, guiney pig is also supposed to be tasty and I already happily eat horse, rabbit, pigeon... any of those slightly different meats that anglosaxons don't approve of :P
Oh, I see. I'm scared to try new foods because if I don't like it, the food will go to waste, and I don't want that. (I don't like to waste food…) I do want to try crickets at one point in my life, as I heard they are healthy for you. (I am being serious about this.)
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Wow a living religion thread. Things have changed around here :)
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Hehe, never I thought I'd see the day that this forum would have religion thread let alone one that lasted this long despite how taboo the subject normally is in these kind of message boards.
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Alright, so this is gonna be a kinda weird, very asinine question. So I’m gonna put the explanation for my question first and my question at the end so it makes more sense.
Ok. So I was listening to this song. And it starts off like this:I remember when, last past November when
Clown kid got pounded in with the Timberlands
They left him trembling, he was not remembering
Never tuck your denim in just to floss an emblem
Some would debate you, "Wait, the fella ate gelatin
Or he been listening in to what his weathermens was telling him"And that bolded part stuck out to me. One cause it sounded kinda cool and two cause I had no idea wtf it meant. So I looked it up on the tubes and found out it’s apparently shorthand amongst particular practicers of Islam for people who aren’t “enlightened”. Now if you’re just reading this and aren’t familiar with Islam as far as I can understand the explanation I got was basically that: pork is a forbidden food –> gelatin is a derivative product of pig lard (and is therefore also a forbidden food) --> foods like some marshmallows and candies are made from gelatin (and are therefore also forbidden foods) --> eating these foods is therefore reflective of one’s lack of knowledge. I apologise in advance if I’ve butchered that explanation somewhat (or more than somewhat).
But my question is: does anyone know if this sort of shorthand (or something like that) actually exists? And if it exists is it a common (at least from the perspective of whoever might answer this question) sort of phrase?
This isn’t a particularly urgent or pressing question or anything. I just find the layers of implication in the phrase…linguistically interesting? I guess? So I was interested in seeing if anyone knows if the explanation I found is (likely to be) the actual explanation, or if it might just be some anonymous someone on the internet making up stuff. thumbs up emoji
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Being as that's MF Doom, a New York rapper, and a song from the 90's…
Gonna go with a sizeable no, that it's local New York black Muslim (or "Muslim" in the case of NOI) slang, possibly circa 20 years ago.
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Nah there isn't any sorta idea about people eating gelatin being worse or better than others. Gelatin can be halal, FYI. If it's made from beef bones or other non-pig animals that were slaughtered in the halal method, its fine. In fact there's a popular brand of halal gummies and marshmallows here that uses halal gelatin.
I mean it is true that if a Muslim who chooses not to eat pork goes ahead and eats non-halal gelatin they're uneducated about the issue, but that's just them acting in ignorance which is fine. But no, there isn't any stigma about it.
Edit: MK's point is true as well. Nation of Islam isn't Islam, and they've got some really offshoot beliefs and practices. So if the rapper was NOI as most people were back then, they might have developed some terminology within their group.
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Huh. Fair enough. Thanks for the info. I had figured from what little I'd found earlier that it probably was likely to just be an esoteric turn of phrase but I figured since it seemed like a slow news day (so to speak) it was worth asking about.
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A lot of mid-90's NY hip-hoppers were into some bizarre religious groups, ideologies, and gonzo mysticism laced conspiracy theories. Most of it is kooky at best, and dumb at worst. Though it resulted in some fantastic music!
Much like how my other favorite musical era and locale, UK Post-Punk, was laced with kooky and dumb communist apologia.
Dark cold urban post-industrial decay music about kooky crap….UNITE.
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Oh yeah, definitely come across a lot of that just making my way through DOOM's discography. I can only imagine what else is out there :/
But then I'd be more than willing to accept that sort of weirdness in a modern artist if they were also to adopt a weird, retro sci-fi kaiju as one of their rap alter egos.Also, I love that "We are all prostitutes" song hahaha. I can't help but smile at any song with lyrics that are about as subtle as a 2x4 to the face
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I grew up with my best friend, who I love like a brother that came from a religious household. They went to church every Sunday and said Grace at every dinner. However his parents never pushed it onto me or any of my other friends in the almost 2 decades we've known each other. Hell I (who only went to church as a young boy and stopped short afterwards) even went to church with them and said grace sometimes, mostly just out of sheer "Can I give it a go?"
Frankly I always viewed that as a positive relationship between a religious family and one that couldn't give a shit. It was part of their lives, but it was never forced on us, nor was I or any of my friends looked down upon because we didn't do what they did or believed like they did. I grew up with a great respect to those types of Christians because of that. I still hold that respect.
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That's the best kind of relationship between religious and non-religious people.
I never believed in god, but as a kid I sometimes attended Sunday church school, the end of the autumn and spring terms was celebrated in church and I even got the offer to attend confirmation (I declined). I never felt pressured, was given a choice and got to learn about what's lovely about religion. Sometimes I miss church, the priest's ramblings were boring but there's few things as beautiful as church bells and singing with everyone else.
When I got older my class visited a mosque which was also very pleasant. There's some things I disagree with, but the imam (I think) who showed us around was very kind and accepting. Now all I'm missing is a visit to a Synagogue.
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I haven't visited a synagogue either, actually. I've been to a couple churches with friends, which was a nice experience.
Mosques are usually pretty chill unless you come at a busy time, but I like the community feel I get at them. -
If you want to learn about Islamic Philosophy (Which also covers Andalusian Jewish philosophers such as Maimonides, Crescas and Ibn Gabirol and Christians who were living under Islamic rule), listen to this podcast from Peter adamson 'History of Philosophy without any gaps'. He is close to wrapping up on Latin Christendom philosophy (catholic scholastic ) and will move on to Byzantine philosophy (Orthodox christians). Also has a spin off on Indian Philosophy (Jain/Buddhist/Hindu).
https://historyofphilosophy.net/ also covered episodes from Roman/Hellenistic world who were practicing pagans. Highly recommend this brilliant podcast.
