Pages and pages , then walls of text, of why/why not Carrot will/won't be next namaka.
Personally I don't know if Carrot will join or not, but I can say that Carrot is the new Perona.:getlost:
Next Strawhat Crewmate (Vol. 6)
-
-
That´s only part of what people claim.
The biggest argument regarding her fighting style compared to the other Strawhats is, she is not unique in the world:Luffy is a rubber man with incredibly comical attacks
Zoro is a three sword user, the only one seen so far with a sword in his mouth
Nami uses a staff that can control the weather
Usopp uses a slingshot and is a sniper
Sanji uses a mix of capoeira and taekwando that nobody in One Piece uses
Chopper has six transformations, the only Zoan so far
Robin can sprout limbs or even herself from whenever she wants to
Franky is a cyborg that can fart, create huge air blasts, has rockets in several parts, can create a laser
Brook is a skeleton that can separate his soul, has a connection to the underworld, can hypnotize people with his music
Jinbe is the best fishman karate user that has access to abilities nobody else has, can talk to fish and whales as the only fishmen in the worldCarrot uses a fighting technique everybody on her island can use.
I do not think i have to further explain the huge difference in uniqueness.
Also a character that was not remotely focused on for 90 chapters beyond a Shoujo drawing and a preview to the true form of minks that is gonna be very relevant in Wa No, a character who has no significant interaction with the main character, which has always been the most crucial aspect, has nothing unique about her, her so called development hinges on the death of a character we know is alive and even then their connection was shoehorned right after his supposed death, even Pound was better developed than that.
Let´s not pretend anybody looks at anything substantial here.
No need to be so defensive with the last line. I already said that there are good argument on both sides of this discussion and I'm not trying to throw every single argument in the same trash can. There's only so much I can answer each time and, btw, I also gave my opinions on some other topics of this discussion too.
"Carrot uses a fightning technique everybody on her island uses".
Carrot uses electro like her entire race, but her fighting style doesn't end there. Oda made the case about that claw-thing being something very personal to her instead of training with regular swords like most musketeers/guardians (and this doesn't have an equivalent inside the crew), she jumps around like a rabbit and even kinda floats in the air. Carrot is also trained in Sulong, something that even seasoned pirates like Pekoms don't control yet. So here we have a set of fighting traits particular to her.
In any case, the uniqueness of a fighter isn't defined only conceptually, but also visually by imprinting a wide range of qualities in the drawings (the character design itself already plays a role in this). For example, Zoro is not only the conceptual 'Santoryuu guy', but a swordsman that exhales a very sinister aura and have very muscular attacks with brutal appearances, so even when Zoro is fighting with one or two swords, it still feels just like him, because Oda is a genius ilustrator. As for Carrot, she is a light and dynamic meelee fighter that looks very graceful and majestic doing so, especially after she transforms.
Let's not forget that it took a lot of time for many of them to develop their conceptual fighting style, like Nami's clima tact, Brooke's soul powers and Usopp's proeminent role as a sniper (and pop greens). Jimbe himself uses regular fishmen karate, even if he's the best at it.
As for your other comments quoted here, they were not justified enough for me to answer them. And Pedro is dead.
-
No need to be so defensive with the last line. I already said that there are good argument on both sides of this discussion and I'm not trying to throw every single argument in the same trash can. There's only so much I can answer each time and, btw, I also gave my opinions on some other topics of this discussion too.
"Carrot uses a fightning technique everybody on her island uses".
Carrot uses electro like her entire race, but her fighting style doesn't end there. Oda made the case about that claw-thing being something very personal to her instead of training with regular swords like most musketeers/guardians (and this doesn't have an equivalent inside the crew), she jumps around like a rabbit and even kinda floats in the air. Carrot is also trained in Sulong, something that even seasoned pirates like Pekoms don't control yet. So here we have a set of fighting traits particular to her.
In any case, the uniqueness of a fighter isn't defined only conceptually, but also visually by imprinting a wide range of qualities in the drawings (the character design itself already plays a role in this). For example, Zoro is not only the conceptual 'Santoryuu guy', but a swordsman that exhales a very sinister aura and have very muscular attacks with brutal appearances, so even when Zoro is fighting with one or two swords, it still feels just like him, because Oda is a genius ilustrator. As for Carrot, she is a light and dynamic meelee fighter that looks very graceful and majestic doing so, especially after she transforms.
Let's not forget that it took a lot of time for many of them to develop their conceptual fighting style, like Nami's clima tact, Brooke's soul powers and Usopp's proeminent role as a sniper (and pop greens). Jimbe himself uses regular fishmen karate, even if he's the best at it.
As for your other comments quoted here, they were not justified enough for me to answer them. And Pedro is dead.
That´s not being defensive, that´s asking for getting real and not pretending you have a point.
I have yet to see any good argument from the Carrot has to join faction.Electro
People having pointed out that several minks were shown having claws
Animals jump, every mink floats
Pekomz can´t control it because he never trained it, because he left the island.
Inu can use Sulong, Neko can, PEdro could, Wanda can, the musketeers can, and these are the ones confirmed.
The entire mink race has access to the ability, and Inu poitns out that they will show the true power of the minks next time, the emphasis is on they.
So no, nothing about these are particular to her.Conceptually is the first prerequisite.
And there is nothign visually except her design in Sulong form.
He is a santoryuu guy with a sword in his mouth though, it fits all together.There was nothing about Carrot´s fighting style that is particular, have you seen Neko, Pedro and the minks fight in the flashback? Yep…
Only that it didn´t, even Nami with her staff had already somethign unique, albeit weak.
Brook´s soul powers were shown when Brook hypnotized people by humming Binks Sake.
Usopp has been shown sniping since his arc.
Jinbe has access to unique abilities that nobody else has.Please stop this charade. The fact that you can´t point out one unique trait or one moment of substantial character development underlines the lack of justification in any post,
And no, Pedro is not dead.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Pages and pages , then walls of text, of why/why not Carrot will/won't be next namaka.
Personally I don't know if Carrot will join or not, but I can say that Carrot is the new Perona.:getlost:
At least Perona stood out. A goth girl with a psychological ability? That´s what you call unique.
Her personality sucked though.
-
All I'm trying to say is that we haven't seen her in action for a very long time and have no real way to determine what her current abilities are. What little we've seen suggests she's more physically able than before, but she's never been and is never going to be a "combat monster" in the vein of the Monster Trio/Quartet/Whatever.
The true measure of her fighting prowess and potential depends entirely on her weapons and her skill with them, which hasn't been on display since Alabasta and predate most of Usopp's more fanciful inventions and tech.
I just think it's too early to count her out of the running quite yet.
I believe that even if Vivi were to eat a logia, become a better fighter and join, as much as that would be cool, most readers (myself included probably) would still be left unsatisfied (expecially after so many arcs of wanting someone new) and the crew wouldn"t feel complete.
Since the last nakama will probably be the last, it would be better if it was a character who has yet to be introduced and who will have more stuff to surprise the reader with. Also since character design seems to be one of the things Oda enjoys the most, I would be very surprised if he were miss the opportunity to create a new nakama.Also I agree with every word MiyamotoMusashi and Count Mario have said about Carrot and what I have wrote about Vivi can sort of apply to Carrot too (and even as a side character Vivi is way better developed than Carrot).
-
"The Night Is Dark And Full Of Terror"
-
-
@.access:
Need to bookmark this for next year. Didn't you also win the award 2017?
-
Not even close lol.
Then why are certain people dedicating pages upon pages to discussing if she will join or not?
Its was the same with Perona, it seems one or two die hards (or more- but I only remember one 'mega-fan' for Perona right now) are focused on the merits of gal joining and then there's someone (or 2 or 3) focused on refuting the arguments the mild "nah won't happen" that pops up. That was the resemblance I meant. This really reminds me of the 'debate' on if Perona would join or not. The pro-Carrot camp may be more reasonable than that one certain person whose name is forgotten that was very pro-Perona, but the page on page on page of going over nearly same points reminds me of that debate. -
Perona can float, so I think she'd make a perfect lookout.
:ninja:
-
Perona can handle the night shift while Miss Valentine's Day covers the daytime.
-
I dare say Kaku would be a natural as well and Bellamy would do well covering vacations.
-
But all these floaters and spring hoppers and Giraffe swordsman aren't bunnies that hop on their own merit, other than Kaku who was basically Mr. Parkour in Water 7.
Carrot isn't the new Perona, whoever was head over heels for Perona was blinded by their love. The Carrot camp aren't showing this blind devotion, we're bringing sensible, even if easily refutable, points to the table.
Most of them have been rehashed over and over and over across countless pages on this thread but so have the anti-carrot camp's points. Something about bland design and being a cookie cutter Chopper, not having enough screen presence, and when she does it's just not meaningful enough, there's no substance. Then we have Miyamoto saying all her kind have the same shit and she doesn't stand out from them, but then there's me saying she doesn't have to stand out from her kind if she's not going to be anywhere near them on her voyage. Then we have the argument of Carrot is only a precursor to the showing in Wano, so no one can call asspull when the hordes of mink suddenly transform. But then there's us thinking why the fock does it have to be her who is used for this showing when there's literally Pedro and Pekoms in this arc who could have been used for this same purpose? Then there's Robby saying she's another side character because Oda just gets bored of drawing same characters each arc and wants to keep himself entertained (to be fair these aren't his words they mostly come from the anti-carrot establishment that he's a part of) but completely throws that out of the window because she's just someone for Chopper to bounce off of in this arc, but why does that have to be Carrot? Chopper is never going to learn electro. Few chapters back a big hoo haa was made about Chopper being the one keenly looking through the binocular at the transformed Carrot. Next chapter that was debunked because they all practically took turns to observe this marvel. Then we have Count who is thoroughly underwhelmed by her base design and cannot accept that this is the potentially last and final female addition to the crew, he simply won't stand for it. Galaxy 9000 just stating all his opinions in a matter of fact tone, as he does. Katzztar is almost bored at this point. BattleFranky69 is agreeing and nodding his head to points that have been made against her for weeks now like they're new points.
All while, Shift is trying his pragmatic best to be the voice of reason "hold on there could be something here, don't completely dismiss her". Avacado is trying his darned hardest to find bits and bobs scattered across the arcs featuring her to make a case but they're just simply not good enough because hey everyone can jump high right? To me everyone can do everything on that blasted ship, but when someone who seems like they would excel at doing something more than the others it is shut down.
Blissed is not convinced and is waiting for further developments, as we should all be really. Our friendly neighbourhood Long John chipping in with his carefully crafted points on a consistent basis without stepping on toes or offending anyone, nominee for 2018's friendliest award for sure.I don't think Carrot will join end of this arc but she is staying for Wano and all these what ifs that we're spewing might come to fruition. If Pedro is dead (let's face it he is, even if he makes a homie return to say his final peace, the Pedro as we knew him is smithereens) it will only propel Carrot further into contention. I may eat all my words based on how this arc ends but I'm not going to stand for the anti-carrot team to shut my fellow brethren down in a condescending way. We can do that too if we wanted to in a more concise way: "your points are garbage and very superficial, focusing so much on appearance, heck 90% of the shit you guys talk about is appearance, be more imaginative pls" doesn't really read nice does it?
#TeamCarrot #AllHailShift
! in the words of FelRes who has had their Pudding heart broken from 6 years ago: I'm just bored
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
@Galaxy:
Perona can float, so I think she'd make a perfect lookout.
:ninja:
I fondly remember some arguing her for lookout due to her holo holo security system or whatever. Not the best nostalgia.
-
The interest in a new crewmember is so great that I'm honestly already excited with the female shinobi shown IN SHADOW during Kinemon's speach about his allies in Wano.
-
The interest in a new crewmember is so great that I'm honestly already excited with the female shinobi shown IN SHADOW during Kinemon's speach about his allies in Wano.
Yo legit, if I see a hot/femme fatale kunoichi character in Wano my memories of Carrot will become non-existent. Unfortunately, the goofy appearance of Raizou all but extinguished my hopes for that. (He's still cool and loveable, don't get me wrong).
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
@.access:
That is so much meme potential with this. Do one with Momo please.
As much as I dislike him for being cartoonish evil, Caesar does have many comedy potential with the strawhats.
-
Blissed is not convinced and is waiting for further developments, as we should all be really.
Hmm? Nah, I've long been convinced for the most part (post-Wano anyways), I'm just nowadays generally trying to avoid being stuck in the same arguments repeatedly. So not much I can do other than to wait for new developments that either push or tank her.
-
Hmm? Nah, I've long been convinced for the most part (post-Wano anyways), I'm just nowadays generally trying to avoid being stuck in the same arguments repeatedly. So not much I can do other than to wait for new developments that either push or tank her.
Haha I was trying to be modest on your behalf because our team need to look like the good guys, I am well aware of your disposition regarding this matter
Forgot to write about our friend Long John he has modestly chipped in with strong arguments consistently too.
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
Haha I was trying to be modest on your behalf because our team need to look like the good guys, I am well aware of your disposition regarding this matter
I mean, it's a female candidate, we were all screwed to begin with lol
-
But all these floaters and spring hoppers and Giraffe swordsman aren't bunnies that hop on their own merit, other than Kaku who was basically Mr. Parkour in Water 7.
Carrot isn't the new Perona, whoever was head over heels for Perona was blinded by their love. The Carrot camp aren't showing this blind devotion, we're bringing sensible, even if easily refutable, points to the table.
Most of them have been rehashed over and over and over across countless pages on this thread but so have the anti-carrot camp's points. Something about bland design and being a cookie cutter Chopper, not having enough screen presence, and when she does it's just not meaningful enough, there's no substance. Then we have Miyamoto saying all her kind have the same shit and she doesn't stand out from them, but then there's me saying she doesn't have to stand out from her kind if she's not going to be anywhere near them on her voyage. Then we have the argument of Carrot is only a precursor to the showing in Wano, so no one can call asspull when the hordes of mink suddenly transform. But then there's us thinking why the fock does it have to be her who is used for this showing when there's literally Pedro and Pekoms in this arc who could have been used for this same purpose? Then there's Robby saying she's another side character because Oda just gets bored of drawing same characters each arc and wants to keep himself entertained (to be fair these aren't his words they mostly come from the anti-carrot establishment that he's a part of) but completely throws that out of the window because she's just someone for Chopper to bounce off of in this arc, but why does that have to be Carrot? Chopper is never going to learn electro. Few chapters back a big hoo haa was made about Chopper being the one keenly looking through the binocular at the transformed Carrot. Next chapter that was debunked because they all practically took turns to observe this marvel. Then we have Count who is thoroughly underwhelmed by her base design and cannot accept that this is the potentially last and final female addition to the crew, he simply won't stand for it. Galaxy 9000 just stating all his opinions in a matter of fact tone, as he does. Katzztar is almost bored at this point. BattleFranky69 is agreeing and nodding his head to points that have been made against her for weeks now like they're new points.
All while, Shift is trying his pragmatic best to be the voice of reason "hold on there could be something here, don't completely dismiss her". Avacado is trying his darned hardest to find bits and bobs scattered across the arcs featuring her to make a case but they're just simply not good enough because hey everyone can jump high right? To me everyone can do everything on that blasted ship, but when someone who seems like they would excel at doing something more than the others it is shut down.
Blissed is not convinced and is waiting for further developments, as we should all be really.I don't think Carrot will join end of this arc but she is staying for Wano and all these what ifs that we're spewing might come to fruition. If Pedro is dead (let's face it he is, even if he makes a homie return to say his final peace, the Pedro as we knew him is smithereens) it will only propel Carrot further into contention. I may eat all my words based on how this arc ends but I'm not going to stand for the anti-carrot team to shut my fellow brethren down in a condescending way. We can do that too if we wanted to in a more concise way: "your points are garbage and very superficial, focusing so much on appearance, heck 90% of the shit you guys talk about is appearance, be more imaginative pls" doesn't really read nice does it?
#TeamCarrot #AllHailShift
! in the words of FelRes who has had their Pudding heart broken from 6 years ago: I'm just bored
I feel snubbed for my optimistic yet cautious discussion of carrot fitting in between sides and that she could go either direction lol
Chapter 437 Discussion after franky decides to join the Strawhats:
So who think Usopp is inside that duffelbag?
H x H Chimera Ant Arc / OP Manga Spoiler
Spoiler:
-
@Long:
I feel snubbed for my optimistic yet cautious discussion of carrot fitting in between sides and that she could go either direction lol
Read my last post lol! Got there in time!
-
@Long:
I feel snubbed for my optimistic yet cautious discussion of carrot fitting in between sides and that she could go either direction lol
I demand that Long John receive proper recognition.
EDIT: I am satisfied.
-
I demand that Long John receive proper recognition.
EDIT: I am satisfied.
It's late and I am sorry for glaring absences of our team roster, I humbly apologize.
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
But all these floaters and spring hoppers and Giraffe swordsman aren't bunnies that hop on their own merit, other than Kaku who was basically Mr. Parkour in Water 7.
Carrot isn't the new Perona, whoever was head over heels for Perona was blinded by their love. The Carrot camp aren't showing this blind devotion, we're bringing sensible, even if easily refutable, points to the table.
Most of them have been rehashed over and over and over across countless pages on this thread but so have the anti-carrot camp's points. Something about bland design and being a cookie cutter Chopper, not having enough screen presence, and when she does it's just not meaningful enough, there's no substance. Then we have Miyamoto saying all her kind have the same shit and she doesn't stand out from them, but then there's me saying she doesn't have to stand out from her kind if she's not going to be anywhere near them on her voyage. Then we have the argument of Carrot is only a precursor to the showing in Wano, so no one can call asspull when the hordes of mink suddenly transform. But then there's us thinking why the fock does it have to be her who is used for this showing when there's literally Pedro and Pekoms in this arc who could have been used for this same purpose? Then there's Robby saying she's another side character because Oda just gets bored of drawing same characters each arc and wants to keep himself entertained (to be fair these aren't his words they mostly come from the anti-carrot establishment that he's a part of) but completely throws that out of the window because she's just someone for Chopper to bounce off of in this arc, but why does that have to be Carrot? Chopper is never going to learn electro. Few chapters back a big hoo haa was made about Chopper being the one keenly looking through the binocular at the transformed Carrot. Next chapter that was debunked because they all practically took turns to observe this marvel. Then we have Count who is thoroughly underwhelmed by her base design and cannot accept that this is the potentially last and final female addition to the crew, he simply won't stand for it. Galaxy 9000 just stating all his opinions in a matter of fact tone, as he does. Katzztar is almost bored at this point. BattleFranky69 is agreeing and nodding his head to points that have been made against her for weeks now like they're new points.
All while, Shift is trying his pragmatic best to be the voice of reason "hold on there could be something here, don't completely dismiss her". Avacado is trying his darned hardest to find bits and bobs scattered across the arcs featuring her to make a case but they're just simply not good enough because hey everyone can jump high right? To me everyone can do everything on that blasted ship, but when someone who seems like they would excel at doing something more than the others it is shut down.
Blissed is not convinced and is waiting for further developments, as we should all be really. Our friendly neighbourhood Long John chipping in with his carefully crafted points on a consistent basis without stepping on toes or offending anyone, nominee for 2018's friendliest award for sure.I don't think Carrot will join end of this arc but she is staying for Wano and all these what ifs that we're spewing might come to fruition. If Pedro is dead (let's face it he is, even if he makes a homie return to say his final peace, the Pedro as we knew him is smithereens) it will only propel Carrot further into contention. I may eat all my words based on how this arc ends but I'm not going to stand for the anti-carrot team to shut my fellow brethren down in a condescending way. We can do that too if we wanted to in a more concise way: "your points are garbage and very superficial, focusing so much on appearance, heck 90% of the shit you guys talk about is appearance, be more imaginative pls" doesn't really read nice does it?
#TeamCarrot #AllHailShift
! in the words of FelRes who has had their Pudding heart broken from 6 years ago: I'm just bored
Lol, yeah, I definitely do that. It's probably because I wasn't seriously considering that Carrot might join until Pedro blew himself up, so I'm recontextualizing what some of the stuff we've seen before means in the long run.
Purely coincidence
-
Lol, yeah, I definitely do that. It's probably because I wasn't seriously considering that Carrot might join until Pedro blew himself up, so I'm recontextualizing what some of the stuff we've seen before means in the long run.
Only noticed your signature now lmao, purely coincidental indeed.
-
Hahahahahahahaha
Everyone that supports Carrot for Strawhat theories is a wonderful person and do great work and everyone who doesn't is awful and wrong and should feel bad. The Anti-Carrot establishment is trying to keep to Pro-Carrot movement down, man.
Hahahahaha, I love what this thread has devolved into.
-
Replace every instance of Carrot with Looney Tunes Show Lola and then they'll be on to something.
-
It's late and I am sorry for glaring absences of our team roster, I humbly apologize.
Haha thats alright. Now I feel like a gun-jumper lol
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@Below:
Hahahahahahahaha
Everyone that supports Carrot for Strawhat theories is a wonderful person and do great work and everyone who doesn't is awful and wrong and should feel bad. The Anti-Carrot establishment is trying to keep to Pro-Carrot movement down, man.
Hahahahaha, I love what this thread has devolved into.
…I dont see how Dranza's post conveyed that at all.
-
@Below:
Hahahahahahahaha
Everyone that supports Carrot for Strawhat theories is a wonderful person and do great work and everyone who doesn't is awful and wrong and should feel bad. The Anti-Carrot establishment is trying to keep to Pro-Carrot movement down, man.
Hahahahaha, I love what this thread has devolved into.
Hopefully it's working
@Long:
Haha thats alright. Now I feel like a gun-jumper lol
…I dont see how Dranza's post conveyed that at all.
There's strength in unity. They've joined forces and that's why they appeared to be in the ascendancy all this time but we have now discovered their trick.
! chapter 900 couldn't come sooner
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
Hahahaha, this is all an elaborate practical joke. Good job, guys. You got me.
-
Yo legit, if I see a hot/femme fatale kunoichi character in Wano my memories of Carrot will become non-existent. Unfortunately, the goofy appearance of Raizou all but extinguished my hopes for that. (He's still cool and loveable, don't get me wrong).
So… at the end of the day, she becomes forgettable the moment another attractive female shows up?
-
There's a whole lot worse characters people have put forward to join then Carrot (Seriously, people who thought Caribou was a valid candidate should have been Stalinized-styled purged), but Oda really had not built her up as a really interesting crewmate at all, especially compared to Jinbei,
-
@Galaxy:
So… at the end of the day, she becomes forgettable the moment another attractive female shows up?
But…Ninja :ninja:
@S.C.:
There's a whole lot worse characters people have put forward to join then Carrot (Seriously, people who thought Caribou was a valid candidate should have been Stalinized-styled purged), but Oda really had not built her up as a really interesting crewmate at all, especially compared to Jinbei,
OK, I know Jinbei is the most recent addition and is the reason why he is used as comparison a lot, but his build up hasn't been that great. It has been obvious, sure, and you could see how telegraphed his joining has been for a while now. Everything from Luffy outright inviting him to his willingness to die for the Strawhats (only Pedro can give Jinbei a run for his money on that self sacrifice stuff) but the build up hasn't been THAT great. Substantial is probably the word I'd use. He's had so many arcs to do so, Carrot doesn't have to have that instant impact because in comparison it's still early days. Inb4 Robby, Count and Kira come and say she has had 100 chapters or so already and has done Jack shit. She's done plenty, just not hitting the right notes with everyone is all, hence the divide in opinions.
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
There's strength in unity. They've joined forces and that's why they appeared to be in the ascendancy all this time but we have now discovered their trick.
! chapter 900 couldn't come sooner
Wait a second? I cant believe Ive missed this connection. Trick? Trix are for kids? The Mascot who wants to get them is a rabbit. Trix is a cereal. One Piece is Serialized in Shonen Jump. So that means in-story opposition is stopping carrot from joining. But who? Well look at the commercials again, "Trix are for Kids". Now ypu may think this referring to the charlotte family standing in the way but their is another possibilty. Eustass Kid. Oda gave his nationality as Irish and rabbits are not a native species.
https://www.irishnews.com/lifestyle/2017/10/21/news/take-on-nature-the-common-rabbit-is-ireland-s-resilient-intruder-1164809/ They were introduced to Ireland in the 12 century which could mean anywhere between 800-900 years. Does that ring a bell. 800 years ago in One Piece was the void century. Which could hint to the minks being from the moon around the time. Also Normans introduced them and who has been hinted as having the strongest north blue ties amongst the strawhats.
!
So Carrot accompanying the retrieval team for sanji also foreshadows the previous event of the germa helping the minks mind their home. But wait wasnt ireland just considered their homeland but now its being used to refer to zou yes. Because Zou fuctions as Ireland here. The Kid Family 800 years ago was forced to leave the elephant and Kid's grudge will cause him to refuse a team-up with luffy and carrot beating him into seeing the light in luffy will lead to kid as a future ally. Coincidentally but very much planned also concretifying carrots place in the crew as both a lookout and an emotional person. Damn I cant believe I solved the mystery. :ninja:
Chapter 437 Discussion after franky decides to join the Strawhats:
So who think Usopp is inside that duffelbag?
H x H Chimera Ant Arc / OP Manga Spoiler
Spoiler:
-
@Long:
Wait a second? I cant believe Ive missed this connection. Trick? Trix are for kids? The Mascot who wants to get them is a rabbit. Trix is a cereal. One Piece is Serialized in Shonen Jump. So that means in-story opposition is stopping carrot from joining. But who? Well look at the commercials again, "Trix are for Kids". Now ypu may think this referring to the charlotte family standing in the way but their is another possibilty. Eustass Kid. Oda gave his nationality as Irish and rabbits are not a native species.
https://www.irishnews.com/lifestyle/2017/10/21/news/take-on-nature-the-common-rabbit-is-ireland-s-resilient-intruder-1164809/ They were introduced to Ireland in the 12 century which could mean anywhere between 800-900 years. Does that ring a bell. 800 years ago in One Piece was the void century. Which could hint to the minks being from the moon around the time. Also Normans introduced them and who has been hinted as having the strongest north blue ties amongst the strawhats.
! [qimg]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11118/111180705/4059215-sanji.jpg[/qimg]
So Carrot accompanying the retrieval team for sanji also foreshadows the previous event of the germa helping the minks mind their home. But wait wasnt ireland just considered their homeland but now its being used to refer to zou yes. Because Zou fuctions as Ireland here. The Kid Family 800 years ago was forced to leave the elephant and Kid's grudge will cause him to refuse a team-up with luffy and carrot beating him into seeing the light in luffy will lead to kid as a future ally. Coincidentally but very much planned also concretifying carrots place in the crew as both a lookout and an emotional person. Damn I cant believe I solved the mystery. :ninja:
Shit, I know we're nakama and all but wth did I just read looool. This is reaching for the moon level of reaching
! but on a serious note, I think you're onto something
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
Count Mario, I don't know yet how to break down a quote in multiple parts like you did, so I'll try to respond you in this simpler flashion.
A "vague comparison" is one that takes very broad concepts to equivalate different objects. This vagueness is different from an abstract concept like "aiding the crew that will bring the dawn of the world", that is something very specific even though it sounds a little too poetic. I'll talk more about Carrot's archetypes later in this post, but as I said before, I see too much generalization of her character or even exaggerations like "her portrayal has been mainly nonexistant", that her transformation is there to "hype up her chieftains" and that all she's done in 100 chapter is to fodderize some fodder, do some mirrorworld shenanigans, wreck some ships and look through binoculars. When she shows a quirk, it is "out of nowhere", and when she shed tears for her mentor in the rush of a escape, they are "last minute rushed developments", even tough Pedro's beautiful last words to Carrot were shown during the explosion itself for higher emotional impact and you could see all her anger and grief in the next chapter. With this kind of tone, it doesn't look like anything will ever be good enough, since everything can be downplayed.
But hey, that's your perception and it's fair enough, really. Execution is important and Carrot's execution has worked for some people and hasn't for others. I would only argue the obvious: your perception is very subjective (just like mine), so, in case Carrot joins, you could understand that Oda have created solid foundations from where to build upon, but the execution just didn't work for you. Her joining the crew woudn't come out of nowhere. In any case, when this arc is over, Oda will settle all the hanging plot points, like Sanji's "betrayal" and the burden of Pedro's death. At that point, we'll have a glimpse of how this will affect Carrot in the future and maybe you will get what you're looking for.
Execution is an important topic because a lot of people have argued against other Strawhats for this very same reason. Oda will not always write things perfectly. For instance, not that I agree with this opinion, take the case of Brooke: his joining the crew felt obvious from the start, but he was extremely secondary throughout Thriller Bark, then got a flashback at the very end of the arc only to proceed to be treated as a secondary comic relief again. For a lot of people the execution was poor, because he was very unique in theory, but he barely had any highlights and got reduced to skull jokes. This whole situation is not very different than some of the arguments regarding Carrot right now, apart from the fact that he eventually got a flashback. Sure, you will say that at least Brooke's design was not bland, but I don't think Carrot's design is bland.
Anyway, let's go to the important stuff now.
First, I'd like to note that I don't consider Carrot as a complete character already, but rather one that is occupying a position in the narrative that is much closer to a future Strawhat than anything else. Even the fact that Carrot was secondary in Zou kinda plays into my perspective, because she feels detached from that storyline and more aligned to the personal struggles of the crew. As a lot of people have noted, it is a weird position, even more when she's building a loving relationship with the main cast, that her personality is very convenient and that she doesn't have any of the constraints I mentioned in my previous post. The only other case remotely close to this one was Vivi, but she was too much linked with Alabasta's plotline (even though she almost broke out of that mold) while Carrot kinda exists in the story for no other purpose than to just be there. Just look at Kinnemon that tagged along for plot purposes only to do nothing (outside his own goals) in every arc he was in, then becoming much closer to his samurai peers than any Strawhat. Or think about the other characters that were aboard the Merry/Sunny only to serve as exposition of something else (Jonny and Yosaku, Hacchi and Camie etc). Maybe I could see Trafalgar Law as something in the vein of Carrot, but his role in the story is still mysterious to me.
When I say Carrot is not a complete character yet, that doesn't mean that her character is lacking in personality (for me, anyway, I'll talk about this later). What I mean is that her motivations are under construction instead of being established from the get-go. (Btw, on a side note, people mistakingly complain that we don't have character development in One Piece, but that's because the Strawhats are mostly developed in their own respective arcs in a very condensed manner instead of having their core identity built during the larger journay). If Oda keeps doing a good job with Carrot, this is a very fresh way of doing things with a main character in One Piece. If you take the standard plot structure since Aristotle described it in Poetics, the three acts are as follow for Carrot: (1) the set up in Zou finishing with the first turning point being when she took the opportunity of following the Strawhats to meet her desire to have an adventure in the sea (obs.: the opportunity doesn't define the story concept, but is the catalyst); (2) the second act is the fun, obstacles, struggles and stakes of her adventure in WCI, with its mid-act climax happening with Pedro's death, that also works as her moment of enlightment that reinforces her commitment to the journay and reshapes her original goals (becoming a Strawhat?), leading to the next crisis that is overcome by her trying to show her worth to the crew with the Sulong transformation that saved them from that pinch; (3) the third act is what is left to come in the story, but it's when she crosses the last line in her personal journay and becomes who she is meant to be. A Strawhat? Or not…
Of course, all that is happening in an arc that does not revolve around Carrot. Regardless of whether she joins or not, the New World is being written much more focused in the progression of the main storyline, so everything else is kinda being developed together in the middle of the chaos. Aren't people complaining about that all the time? Why would it be different with a new Strawhat? The consequence is that Carrot (or anybody else for that matter) will not get all the screentime in the world and her development will happen in small steps. In WCI, her accomplishments are feats inserted in a bigger picture that is doing a lot of other stuff, notably against powerful enemies that the Strawhats are avoiding to fight directly. The most important thing is that Oda is making us get used to her and developing her bonds and interactions with the crew. Therefore, she did more than wreck some ships and do some mirrorworld shenanigans, mostly creating intimacy and friendship that is constantly shown in a lot of chapters.
Finally, her archetypes go beyond Furry and I wouldn't completely characterize her as a Tomboy because she is very feminine. Carrot's archetypes starts as a Manic Pixie Dream Girl, has traits of Yangire (although we have to see more of that) and she's a Fighter. Your expression "energetic rabbit girl" shows some of her main behaviour traits, but I'd also mention that she is openly affectionate, joyful, curious, clever, aggressive, cute, naive without being silly (unlike other naive Strawhats) and she's in a quest to prove herself right now. She fills the role of the little sister in the Strawhat family. Her character design is catchy, charming and mass appealing both as a mink and as a female. When I say her Sulong transformation is more "mystic" is because she looks more like a classy japanese monster-godess (a top class Youkai from other animes) than a beast-monster like Chopper. Well, that's it, I don't think I need to describe her to people that already read the series.
-
But…Ninja :ninja:
OK, I know Jinbei is the most recent addition and is the reason why he is used as comparison a lot, but his build up hasn't been that great. It has been obvious, sure, and you could see how telegraphed his joining has been for a while now. Everything from Luffy outright inviting him to his willingness to die for the Strawhats (only Pedro can give Jinbei a run for his money on that self sacrifice stuff) but the build up hasn't been THAT great. Substantial is probably the word I'd use. He's had so many arcs to do so, Carrot doesn't have to have that instant impact because in comparison it's still early days. Inb4 Robby, Count and Kira come and say she has had 100 chapters or so already and has done Jack shit. She's done plenty, just not hitting the right notes with everyone is all, hence the divide in opinions.
Thing is, Jinbei has already really shown true pride in being a Straw Hat, like that one line at Big Mom. Carrot hasn't really shown she wants to be a pirate. If she had a line like "Wow, they're so cool! I wish I was a Pirate!", that would be something to debate on, but she hasn't.
-
Count Mario, I don't know yet how to break down a quote in multiple parts like you did, so I'll try to respond you in this simpler flashion.
Press 'Reply with Quote", then do this.
-
Shit, I know we're nakama and all but wth did I just read looool. This is reaching for the moon level of reaching
! but on a serious note, I think you're onto something
Something I made in 15 minutes, but I have supreme confidence in.
! Time to go to other forums with it and become a theory god lol. Stream of consciencess theory crafting with logically circular reasoning hasnt ever failed right?
Chapter 437 Discussion after franky decides to join the Strawhats:
So who think Usopp is inside that duffelbag?
H x H Chimera Ant Arc / OP Manga Spoiler
Spoiler:
-
@Galaxy:
Press 'Reply with Quote", then do this.
Thanks for the help, Galaxy!
-
@S.C.:
Thing is, Jinbei has already really shown true pride in being a Straw Hat, like that one line at Big Mom. Carrot hasn't really shown she wants to be a pirate. If she had a line like "Wow, they're so cool! I wish I was a Pirate!", that would be something to debate on, but she hasn't.
It's still too early for that given all the stuff going on. She just wanted to go on an adventure. She'll more than likely get a WG sanctioned bounty for her troubles. She's expressed a lot of optimism for the larger world (her comment about giants existing), which proves that she wants to see more of it.
Her going back to Zou and trying to live a normal life (with a bounty) after WCI and Wano seems almost impossible at this point. She's already had a taste of adventure. Some may say she will try to revive the Nox Pirates, but there's been zero indication why she would. Some have also said she'd lead the minks for the final war, but we already have Neko, Inu, Wanda, etc. for that
-
@Long:
Something I made in 15 minutes, but I have supreme confidence in.
! Time to go to other forums with it and become a theory god lol. Stream of consciencess theory crafting with logically circular reasoning hasnt ever failed right?
I feel the confidence oozing out of you, I am not worthy theory god. The circular reasoning is as round as the moon it's foundation is based upon.
! honestly though I have seen some disturbingly bad theories being praised on the YouTube and I think that's the way to go to gain recognition lol
Can I just add that theackwardstation seems like Shift made another account and is pretending he doesn't know how to break up quotes and do certain things to sell you guys the idea that he truly is a new member of the Pro-Carrot union. That join date is as fishy as Jinbei.
Year of Sanji, let's go!
-
Her going back to Zou and trying to live a normal life (with a bounty) after WCI and Wano seems almost impossible at this point.
Pedro lived on Zou with a bounty. It isn't an issue. That said, I don't think she'll go back to Zou.
She's already had a taste of adventure. Some may say she will try to revive the Nox Pirates, but there's been zero indication why she would. Some have also said she'd lead the minks for the final war, but we already have Neko, Inu, Wanda, etc. for that
[HIDE]
[/HIDE]Finding the Poneglyphs and helping to bring on the "New Dawn" is what the Nox Pirates' purpose was. It would certainly fit more with carrying on his will if that's what she did.
-
Regardless of whether she joins or not, the New World is being written much more focused in the progression of the main storyline, so everything else is kinda being developed together in the middle of the chaos. Aren't people complaining about that all the time? Why would it be different with a new Strawhat?
Yeah, even Jimbei was secondary, at best, in his flashback.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@S.C.:
Carrot hasn't really shown she wants to be a pirate.
She's shown that she wants to adventure and has no problem stowing away on a pirate ship to do that. Zoro, Nami, Robin, and Franky never specifically set out to be pirates, or showed interest in piracy.
Purely coincidence
-
@Galaxy:
Pedro lived on Zou with a bounty. It isn't an issue. That said, I don't think she'll go back to Zou.
True, but the main distinction is that she's associated with the SHs. There are plenty of people in the world with bounties, but the WG sees the SHs and their allies as the biggest threat.
@Galaxy:
Finding the Poneglyphs and helping to bring on the "New Dawn" is what the Nox Pirates' purpose was. It would certainly fit more with carrying on his will if that's what she did.
Finding poneglyghs would be redundant given that Robin will always end up with any poneglygh that's relevant. Before his sacrifice, he realized that the SHs were the ones he was waiting on. As a result, he was willing to pay the ultimate price for it. The Nox Pirates wouldn't exactly be needed for poneglyghs or supporting the SHs. The important poneglyghs will show up in the story eventually and all of the minks will be there to support the SHs, not just a small fraction of them who would call themselves the Nox Pirates.
-
Can I just add that theackwardstation seems like Shift made another account and is pretending he doesn't know how to break up quotes and do certain things to sell you guys the idea that he truly is a new member of the Pro-Carrot union. That join date is as fishy as Jinbei.
If that's Shift, then he's been reading up on his philosophers. I don't recall Shift ever making that kind of arguments.
-
Yeah, even Jimbei was secondary, at best, in his flashback.
The Tiger & Otohime flashback was not his flashback. He was a part of it, but he wasn't the main focus.
So we probably have a childhood flashback or other flashback to look forward to.
-
@Galaxy:
So we probably have a childhood flashback or other flashback to look forward to.
???
Why? Do we really need to know how he went from a ruffian to a soldier (something that he seemed to abandon easily enough)? Would One Piece be incomplete without that?
I like your new profile pic btw.
-
???
Why? Do we really need to know how he went from a ruffian to a soldier (something that he seemed to abandon easily enough)? Would One Piece be incomplete without that?
Because every Straw Hat has been the main focus of their flashbacks. It wasn't the Hiluluk flashback, featuring Chopper. It wasn't the Zeff flashback, featuring Sanji. And it wasn't the Tom flashback, featuring Franky.
Jinbe has an entire childhood that remains mostly unaccounted for. And then there's the period after the Otohime/Tiger flashback, where he got his scar.
You could say the same for Brook's childhood, but he at least got a flashback where he was the main focus. Even he is due his own flashback to before he became a pirate. When it'll come up though, who knows.
I like your new profile pic btw.
Thanks! I thought it was fitting thinking about the event to come.
-
This post is deleted!
