Kingdom

[JarmenKell]

It was a guess, not my fault if it matches real history. I could spoiler tag it if you really want. Just wondering what kind of soldiers would control the battlefront if she were to take over it. Probably borrow Qin units from other factions, but obviously they wouldnt help her if she rebels. So maybe she has her own loyal soldiers? But we've never seen them so it'd be interesting to see them for the first time.

The vital stronghold strategy was mentioned ages ago, and the queen's move to obtain Sanyou/whereever is mentioned in 402.

[phoenix_fire]

Nice pacing. I'm still not too sure which direction that arc will take

[JarmenKell]

! After reading 403 spoilers, the thing I don't get is; even if she has enough money to create her own army to back her faction and declare civil war, wouldn't said army be split into two since she chose the strongholds nearest to the border?
! Basic strategy is to not fight on two fronts unless you have to, history is littered with wars won due to divide and conquer. Then again this is ancient china and I don't think this queen is any grand strategist.
! :ninja:"Sun Tzu" allegedly existed around this time so maybe she should hire him, lol.

[x20a]

@Darth:

! Nah, Lao Ai is the father of those kids. You know, Queen's lover? Any way, it is out of character for Sei, but not really out character for Zheng, and it would be a large departure from history if it happened otherwise, since that part is rather well documented.
! Zheng was not the nicest person alive, you know?

! I can see Hara having Sei kill the children. Any additional children would divide the court and after battling Ryofui for so long, Sei would be at the end of his witts. Allowing anything else to stand in his way of uniting all of China would be unacceptable, and the swift and brutal destruction of the Harem and Ryofui factions would be too good of an opportunity to pass up. By doing so, he could finally gain control of his court.
! It would also shift the story into a darker tone, which it technically should be pursuing as the subsequent wars go on. That blunder of the historical Li Xin could be a result of wanting to swiftly unite the nation so that Sei doesn't have to dirty his hands any longer.
! Or Hara could go the light route and have their deaths be faked. Hara gave Sei's brother a valiant death even though, historically, it was more likely that he incited a rebellion rather than have been a victim of it.

@JarmenKell:

! :ninja:"Sun Tzu" allegedly existed around this time so maybe she should hire him, lol.

! Plot Twist: Sun Tsu is actually Ten.

[JarmenKell]

@x20a:

! Plot Twist: Sun Tsu is actually Ten.

! rule 63 much? 16 chars of…

[Razh]

Just read the new chapter.

http://www.mangareader.net/kingdom/403

! So, is it the hunter from begining of the manga or is it someone from his tribe? I liked that guy.

[Purple Hermit]

From the tribe. Xin killed the guy from the beginning iirc

That or sei, I forget

[Razh]

@Purple:

From the tribe. Xin killed the guy from the beginning iirc

That or sei, I forget

Yeah, he supposedly "died", but not before giving Ten his darts. I don't remember every panel, but I don't think he was actually shown dying. His name is Muta, btw, just checked.

[Purple Hermit]

Oh, I thought you were talking about the first assassin they sent after sei

[sabret00the]

@Darth:

Historical spoilers.

! Yes they are. Altough I have to wonder how Hara will deal with it. He has been rather faithful to history thus far, but…
Well... historical, Lao Ai was ripped apart by horses, his children put into sacks and beaten to death, his other family executed to the third degree... All and all, it was quite gruesome stuff. Hara's version of Zheng seems a little bit too nice to do so... but who knows. This might be done to signify his growth...

! I have a feeling all of this will be handled off-screen

[x20a]

@JarmenKell:

! rule 63 much? 16 chars of…

! I didn't make the rules.
The rules were made by the man to keep you down.

[Porcelainpot]

Is Sei's wife off handedly mentioning Sei's other son? I didn't know he had one, but it makes sense considering it was mentioned that Sei had slept with other harem women before.

[Mizrath]

@Porcelainpot:

Is Sei's wife off handedly mentioning Sei's other son? I didn't know he had one, but it makes sense considering it was mentioned that Sei had slept with other harem women before.

http://bato.to/read/_/205587/kingdom_v24_ch261_by_turnip-farmers/8
bottom panel on the right

I can't find the source on the other child but I think both children are girls

[x20a]

@Porcelainpot:

Is Sei's wife off handedly mentioning Sei's other son? I didn't know he had one, but it makes sense considering it was mentioned that Sei had slept with other harem women before.

Uniting the nations is only half the battle. Sei needs to have a capable heir to make sure a united nation remains united for the coming generations.

[Mizrath]

@x20a:

Uniting the nations is only half the battle. Sei needs to have a capable heir to make sure a united nation remains united for the coming generations.

! He doesn't, fortunately Shin does

[Purple Hermit]

Suuure, when an emperor says "I need to make babies because it's for the welfare of the state", the ladies go with it, but when I say it, I get slapped in the face.

[Silverblade]

@Purple:

Suuure, when an emperor says "I need to make babies because it's for the welfare of the state", the ladies go with it, but when I say it, I get slapped in the face.

Hello, Purple.
Look at yourself.
Now back at the First Emperor of Qin.
Now back at yourself.
Now back at the First Emperor of Qin.
Sadly, you aren't the First Emperor of Qin.

But if you stopped your age of Warring States and switched to uniting China you could smell like you are the First Emperor of Qin.

[Purple Hermit]

New Old Spice: Ruthless Conqueror scent.

whistle plays in the background

[The Franky Tank]

Just finished the chapter talking about the 6 great generals (chapter 99). I love this chapter and the few before it. It introduces a bunch of characters and shows just how much of an influence they have, and the roles they will be playing now and later on. To me, it's always a good sign showing that there is planning being done, and builds up what to expect later on in a long running series such as this.

[sabret00the]

The new raw is out. Any spoilers?

[Big_Bad_Lith]

@Purple:

New Old Spice: Ruthless Conqueror scent.

whistle plays in the background

I want to see Ouki sponsoring some lip gloss or chapstick or something.

[Darth]

@sabret00the:

The new raw is out. Any spoilers?

http://forums.mangafox.me/threads/415850-Raws-and-Spoilers-Thread?p=13383604&viewfull=1#post13383604

Short summary.

[Enzeru]

Kingdom #404

http://bato.to/read/_/275479/kingdom_v37_ch404_by_turnip-farmers

In case some other group has already released this particular chapter, let's just say this is the actual quality release. Enjoy either way.

I'm so glad I picked this manga up last year. It's become one of my favourite ongoing series and the one I end up looking forward to the most. Be it exciting battles or intricate politics, it's getting the job done splendidly.

[JarmenKell]

I'm all for a politics focused arc or even anything as long as it's better than playing "legendary general of the week".
I'm also all for the mostly dramatised historical accuracy.

But this arc has killed a lot of potential interest for me, purely based on some amateurish moves that the harem queen made. Firstly, she has no notable military (soldiers or leaders) of any kind unlike the Lu Buwei/King factions who have some notable generals. Their vast wealth isn't a good substitute for military might. Even if their funds could raise an army, the army's loyalty would be shaky at best and lack any notable generals. So unless there are some really great mercenaries lying around or the harem has a hidden general, this won't end well. Secondly don't cause civil war if other factions could easily invade you, this goes double if your city is near the border.

Maybe this potential disaster is supposed to happen, but I don't enjoy conflicts in which the winning side was determined so easily (or in this case, the losing side).

[Darth]

@JarmenKell:

I'm all for a politics focused arc or even anything as long as it's better than playing "legendary general of the week".
I'm also all for the mostly dramatised historical accuracy.

But this arc has killed a lot of potential interest for me, purely based on some amateurish moves that the harem queen made. Firstly, she has no notable military (soldiers or leaders) of any kind unlike the Lu Buwei/King factions who have some notable generals. Their vast wealth isn't a good substitute for military might. Even if their funds could raise an army, the army's loyalty would be shaky at best and lack any notable generals. So unless there are some really great mercenaries lying around or the harem has a hidden general, this won't end well. Secondly don't cause civil war if other factions could easily invade you, this goes double if your city is near the border.

Maybe this potential disaster is supposed to happen, but I don't enjoy conflicts in which the winning side was determined so easily (or in this case, the losing side).

Hmm… but isn't that realistic? Neither she, nor her lover are specially talented military commanders, or even politicians.

And there is only so much Hara can change already existing history.

[Purple Hermit]

It will be revealed that the Harem has secretly been harboring another "Legendary General of Qin of the Week" that has been loyal to the harem faction but somehow completely hidden from public view up til now and came completely out of nowhere.

[Porcelainpot]

Probably that named eunuch we saw is some sort of top general/killer. Add to that mercenaries like the blow dart dude, and the loyal armed forces of those noble houses the harem has the backing of, and it's a pretty good army.

[Purple Hermit]

Rou Ai? I don't know about top general/killer, but we do know that one of his appendages is really large and in charge.

[Porcelainpot]

@Purple:

Rou Ai? I don't know about top general/killer, but we do know that one of his appendages is really large and in charge.

I meant this guy:
http://bato.to/read/_/187028/kingdom_v18_ch185_by_turnip-farmers/13
http://bato.to/read/_/187028/kingdom_v18_ch185_by_turnip-farmers/16
I think Choukou is also mentioned elsewhere, and he seems pretty high up among the eunuchs.

It seems Ryo Fui had to hire someone to find the man with the biggest penis in all of China. What a job.

[Darth]

@Porcelainpot:

I meant this guy:
http://bato.to/read/_/187028/kingdom_v18_ch185_by_turnip-farmers/13
http://bato.to/read/_/187028/kingdom_v18_ch185_by_turnip-farmers/16
I think Choukou is also mentioned elsewhere, and he seems pretty high up among the eunuchs.

Oh my god… that's Zhao Gao.

I haven't even thought to check it out earlier... but that's Zhao Gao.

Historical Spoilers.

! This man brought about the end of Qin Dynasty by his scheming.

[Strawhat Chan]

@Darth:

Oh my god… that's Zhao Gao.

I haven't even thought to check it out earlier... but that's Zhao Gao.

Historical Spoilers.

! This man brought about the end of Qin Dynasty by his scheming.

Not really. I checked on wikipedia how Zhao Gao is called in Japanese, and it was "Choudaka" not "Choukou".

[Purple Hermit]

@Strawhat:

Not really. I checked on wikipedia how Zhao Gao is called in Japanese, and it was "Choudaka" not "Choukou".

The characters used to write Chou Kou's name are literally the same ones for Zhao Gao.

Plus, it seems like you ran it through google translate and looked at the English translation rather than how it's actually pronounced, which Google Translate will actually give accurately, in which case it specifically says "Choukou"

[Darth]

@Purple:

The characters used to write Chou Kou's name are literally the same ones for Zhao Gao.

Plus, it seems like you ran it through google translate and looked at the English translation rather than how it's actually pronounced, which Google Translate will actually give accurately, in which case it specifically says "Choukou"

Yeah, I decided to go by characters, then machine translation, which seemed more accurate.

But it has interesting implication, now, does it? Chou Kou being Zhao Gao I mean.

[Purple Hermit]

@Darth:

Yeah, I decided to go by characters, then machine translation, which seemed more accurate.

But it has interesting implication, now, does it? Chou Kou being Zhao Gao I mean.

Yeah, I remember it when it first came up chapters ago, but I pretty much completely forgot that he's a part of the harem currently.

[Strawhat Chan]

@Purple:

The characters used to write Chou Kou's name are literally the same ones for Zhao Gao.

Plus, it seems like you ran it through google translate and looked at the English translation rather than how it's actually pronounced, which Google Translate will actually give accurately, in which case it specifically says "Choukou"

Oh, that's awesome then!

But isn't him being part of the harem is kinda different then what he was in history?

[Purple Hermit]

@Strawhat:

Oh, that's awesome then!

But isn't him being part of the harem is kinda different then what he was in history?

The harem is also the host of where the eunuchs are situated in this case, in particular serving the queen dowager so she doesn't get all frisky with her male servants, but obviously that didn't work out this time, but anyway not really, it's not different from history

[Strawhat Chan]

@Purple:

The harem is also the host of where the eunuchs are situated in this case, in particular serving the queen dowager so she doesn't get all frisky with her male servants, but obviously that didn't work out this time, but anyway not really, it's not different from history

But here he's working for the queen, while in history he was an advisor of Sei. Can't see Sei making him his advisor here.

[Purple Hermit]

@Strawhat:

But here he's working for the queen, while in history he was an advisor of Sei. Can't see Sei making him his advisor here.

He was a eunuch advisor to Zhao Zheng, just as Li Si was a bureaucrat who developed Legalism and taken under Zhao Zheng even though Li Si was previously allied with Lu Buwei.

[The Franky Tank]

Mangoku, did the whole cycle of hatred thing much better in a few chapters, than Naruto did in its entire series. Dude is awesome looking, and his backstory actually makes sense for what he is doing. Having to be buried alive with all those people and then coming out as the only survivor, then swears revenge on all of Qin, that works.

The Coalition stuff is pretty sweet so far. and Tou is a total badass. I've been wanting to see him in action, and I got my wish. While I've gotten used to Shin, I feel that either Mouten or Ouhon would've been much better to follow then Shin. That or Heki, cause he's a bro.

[Gatekeeper]

@The:

Mangoku, did the whole cycle of hatred thing much better in a few chapters, than Naruto did in its entire series. Dude is awesome looking, and his backstory actually makes sense for what he is doing. Having to be buried alive with all those people and then coming out as the only survivor, then swears revenge on all of Qin, that works.

I still don't see how that justifies his raping and killing of women and children.

While I've gotten used to Shin, I feel that either Mouten or Ouhon could've been much better to follow then Shin. That or Heki, cause he's a bro

IRL, Shin came from a background similar to both of them, an esteemed military family. I think it's argued that Shin's circumstances were made poor so we can watch him grow. Heki's a bro but he's also way too average and lackluster. Not MC material.

[The Franky Tank]

@Gatekeeper:

I still don't see how that justifies his raping and killing of women and children.

IRL, Shin came from a background similar to both of them, an esteemed military family. I think it's argued that Shin's circumstances were made poor so we can watch him grow. Heki's a bro but he's also way too average and lackluster. Not MC material.

It doesn't justify what he did, but overall the reasoning for what he did made sense. The fact he went through all that, and became what he was made sense. It in no way justifies what he did, which is what Ten pointed out. I was mostly making a point that in a short time, it made more sense what Mangoku did and became, then it did for the same type of thing that happened a number of times in Naruto. I do understand about Shin as far as the story is concerned, and he has grown on me over time. For some reason, I feel that focusing on Heki would've been cool. The story is based on the actual history though, so I can understand why he wouldn't be focused on, at least from the story perspective. I don't know the actual history, so I'm blind to what the actual events that will happen, which is a good thing overall.

[Purple Hermit]

@Gatekeeper:

IRL, Shin came from a background similar to both of them, an esteemed military family. I think it's argued that Shin's circumstances were made poor so we can watch him grow. Heki's a bro but he's also way too average and lackluster. Not MC material.

Shit, you mean average rich bloke Bi isn't the main character? I've been doing this manga all wrong

[Darth]

@The:

The Coalition stuff is pretty sweet so far. and Tou is a total badass. I've been wanting to see him in action, and I got my wish. While I've gotten used to Shin, I feel that either Mouten or Ouhon would've been much better to follow then Shin. That or Heki, cause he's a bro.

Oh, you are on Coalition already? Nice. What did you thought of Sanyou Campaign Arc? You know, the one with Renpa?

And Mouten, at least, I find very much more interesting then Shin. Be it in manga, or historicaly.

[AtomBreaker]

Last arc was pretty bland. Queen Mother coming back is for the better. We know we she's around, something big will happen.

[The Franky Tank]

@Darth:

Oh, you are on Coalition already? Nice. What did you thought of Sanyou Campaign Arc? You know, the one with Renpa?

And Mouten, at least, I find very much more interesting then Shin. Be it in manga, or historicaly.

That was a pretty good arc. I liked seeing Ouhon and Mouten in action, especially with them and Shin working together. It was quite tense even though I knew that the Qin army was going to win. Kanki is a beast, and very different when it comes to Tactics. I need to see more of Ousen before I can say more on him, but I like his design. Overall a solid arc to a solid series so far.

I do like Mouten much more then Shin as well. While he seems lazy and laid back, he is very intelligent, Not only that, but when the time comes, he puts out 100% effort that is awesome.

[Darth]

@The:

That was a pretty good arc. I liked seeing Ouhon and Mouten in action, especially with them and Shin working together. It was quite tense even though I knew that the Qin army was going to win. Kanki is a beast, and very different when it comes to Tactics. I need to see more of Ousen before I can say more on him, but I like his design. Overall a solid arc to a solid series so far.

Ousen and Kanki remain my favorite generals in Kingdom… partialy because of that arc, and partialy because of the arc you are just reading.

Coalition was fun. And it has my favorite two pages in the entire manga. More specificaly, the last two pages of chapter 305, not to spoil anything.

[Gatekeeper]

@The:

For some reason, I feel that focusing on Heki would've been cool. The story is based on the actual history though, so I can understand why he wouldn't be focused on, at least from the story perspective. I don't know the actual history, so I'm blind to what the actual events that will happen, which is a good thing overall.

I feel that Heki does get a good amount of screentime, although he has been "ousted" from the main crew. It's just that when we do see him, he looks like he's about to do something amazing and then just disappoint (arguably).

[Purple Hermit]

@Gatekeeper:

I feel that Heki does get a good amount of screentime, although he has been "ousted" from the main crew. It's just that when we do see him, he looks like he's about to do something amazing and then just disappoint (arguably).

So you're saying that Heki is Kingdom's version of a perpetual Vizard

[The Franky Tank]

@Darth:

Ousen and Kanki remain my favorite generals in Kingdom… partialy because of that arc, and partialy because of the arc you are just reading.

Coalition was fun. And it has my favorite two pages in the entire manga. More specificaly, the last two pages of chapter 305, not to spoil anything.

Just finished that chapter. It the second to last one was pretty cool, and then the spread the next chapter with the rain of arrows was pretty cool as well. With that move, Ousen has proven he is really awesome. I've liked all the various generals so far, and I can say Kanki is near the top. Ouki is high up as well.

[Gatekeeper]

@Purple:

So you're saying that Heki is Kingdom's version of a perpetual Vizard

Kinda, I was thinking more on the lines of a slightly less competent Isidro, a person who could accomplish something small but is overshadowed by awesome for big tasks.