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    Is Haki a Technique? Should it be Translated?

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    • S
      Skull Kid
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      I still don't see any evidence for it being any different than say Soru or Gears, so what would it be if not a technique? And if it is a technique, then shouldn't it keep its original name as Haki like the other techniques?

      http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Haki

      Even this calls it an ability/technique and the way its used throughout the series and what it does makes it obvious that it is. So why the big debate over whether to call it Haki or Ambition? If its a technique and the name for it is Haki, then what is the controversy over?

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      • Crossword
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        The reason that there's a debate is that some people take this far too seriously and need to lighten up and accept that there is no universal rule regarding what should or shouldn't be translated within the fan community..

        Good night.

        ~Stargazer~, ~Distance~ original stories.

        3DS Friend Code: 2234-8294-8917

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        • Phoenix Zoan
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          Intercom: "Demon Rin being paged to AP Manga Discussion. Your input is needed ASAP."

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          • Captain Shmeckie
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            Because it's just strong willpower. That's all it is. Your will is so strong you can physically impose it on others. That's why, 'cause that's all it is. It's a cliche that's been in fiction forever, and the only reason people even think it's a technique is because they don't understand that, and some scanlators left it untranslated. So, limited understanding and lack of common sense kicks in, and viola; people think it's the Ki of One Piece.

            Also, "haki" is just the Japanese word for "ambition," "driving spirit," etc.

            My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

            Originally Posted by Buccaneer

            Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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            • onemoment
              onemoment @Captain Shmeckie
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              • S
                Sesshy @Captain Shmeckie
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                @Captain:

                Your will is so strong you can physically impose it on others.

                How are arrows breaking rocks imposing your will on others?

                Wheel of morality turn, turn, turn.

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                • Ao Kiji
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                  Doesn't soru mean shave and shigan is just "finger gun"?
                  It's really hard to tell and I agree, some people just need to lighten up.
                  I don't really think it makes a huge difference either way, although I prefer the term "Ambition" when people start infusing their arrows with it, it does take on a supernatural quality that makes it become somewhat of a super power.

                  He put his AMBITION into those arrows! Would confuse a lot of people. I think the scans translation team just wanted to signify that it was a supernatural power and not in the literal and traditional sense of the word.

                  Originally Posted by Mog

                  Also, it's a children's comic from Japan.

                  Why are you comparing it to cultural engravings and burritos.

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                  • R
                    Ryuksgelus @Ao Kiji
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                    Haki so far seems like "The Force" in Star Wars more than a simple technique.

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                    • S
                      silvers
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                      Haki != Ambition. I've said this a couple of times in other threads, and I will say it again.

                      It is understandable, however, that it is mistranslated, as there is no direct counterpart for "Haki" in the English language.

                      Haki (霸氣) is composed of two words, the first being the type, the second being the object. 氣 (qi) is a type of energy/aura that every person has. 霸 is related to words like "tyrant" and "dominant". The traditional usage for 霸氣 is to describe a person who's presence suppresses others.

                      So it is not a technique, but rather something not too different from the chi/qi we hear about in martial arts. It is not a matter of how Oda plans on using this, but rather what this phrase means (Oda is not the one to invent it. He can twist its powers and characteristics around, but the basic concept of it must stay within certain bounds)

                      Imbuing Haki into an arrow to strengthen it is already stretching it a bit, but if you think of Haki as ordinary Chi, and you simply apply it onto an object, such a definition is passable.

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                      • Darkstorm
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                        @silvers
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                        Stephen translated it as Ambition, right?

                        Good enough for me.

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                        • Captain Shmeckie
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                          Tonfa was right; it is the new "nakama!" Same argument and everything!

                          And yes, strengthening arrows and shit like that does count. They are not simply firing arrows! No! They're putting their very will into those arrows! Their spirit! Their firey passion! Blah blah blah you get the point!

                          Its' the whole "romance of One Piece" deal. You are overcoming physical weaknesses with your very spirit, and strength of will. The fact that this simple little concept is so hard for 90% of this forum to grasp is… Lets' call a spade a spade here; sad as all hell.

                          And on another note: can we get someone who actually knows some damn Japanese in here to make silvers look silly? Demon Rin? Someone get her in here.

                          My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

                          Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                          Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                          • S
                            Sesshy @Captain Shmeckie
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                            @Captain:

                            And yes, strengthening arrows and shit like that does count. They are not simply firing arrows! No! They're putting their very will into those arrows! Their spirit! Their firey passion! Blah blah blah you get the point!

                            Lol, I really could care less either way on the translation, I was just having a little fun with how you stated it.

                            Wheel of morality turn, turn, turn.

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                            • Captain Shmeckie
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                              I wasn't addressing you, I was addressing the geniuses in general.

                              My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

                              Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                              Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                              • Demon Rin
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                                @Phoenix:

                                Intercom: "Demon Rin being paged to AP Manga Discussion. Your input is needed ASAP."

                                Rushes in Sorry, I was downstairs getting a Drink…

                                I'm just gonna repost what I said in another thread

                                This particular... whatever it is, also has a moment where the translation of it comes into play for a particular scene.

                                In Amazon Lilly, Hancock says Luffy has the "Ambition of a King" (Ambition being "Haki")
                                Leaving it as "Haki", the viewer gets the notion that it's just a Random attack that means nothing, and the notion of that scene is lost on the viewer.
                                The Idea is that this thing, is that Luffy has "The Ambition of a King", (Haoshoku Haki) and his Ambition is to become "Pirate King".

                                Translating it out gets the point of that across. Leaving it untranslated causes the notion to go right over a person's head.

                                I actually agree with Shmeckie as far as it's Function goes.

                                And Skull Kid, Do NOT Trust the One Piece Wikia for ANYTHING factual. They make up shit ALL THE TIME!!

                                They claim Nami's "Tempo" attacks are a combination of "Tempus" which they say means "Weather", and "Kempo" which is a Fighting Style.
                                Oda has TOLD us it's because Tempo is "Weather" in Italian, that's it. Not to mention that Tempus actually means "Time", it has NOTHING to do with the Weather.
                                They just completely made it up, despite the fact that Oda's TOLD us what it means.

                                They also claim Sanji's fighting style is actually a Formal Fighting style and that Zeff taught it to him, and that it's Called "Red Leg" (after Zeff). Not a SINGLE place in Any Manga chapter or Databook is this Said. In the Yellow Databook, it lists Sanji's fighting style as "Black Leg's Attacks", it doesn't say it's a formal style, just that it's Sanji's attacks, and it doesn't mention Zeff teaching him any sort of Formal Fighting Style. If Anything, the Style is called "Black Leg" since that's what the Book lists it as, but it doesn't say "Black Leg Style" it says "Black Leg's Attacks" which appears to just be referring to Sanji as Black Leg.
                                The OP Wikia Makes shit up ALL the time.

                                Switch Friend Code: SW-1795-2519-1884 • Click Here to check out my Twitch Channel

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                                • S
                                  silvers @Captain Shmeckie
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                                  @Captain:

                                  And on another note: can we get someone who actually knows some damn Japanese in here to make silvers look silly? Demon Rin? Someone get her in here.

                                  If you don't know what you're talking about, then quit blabbing >_>

                                  I know both Chinese and Japanese, and 霸氣 is a common phrase in both languages. The reason they translated it as Ambition is because, sure, it is the closest word, but as most translations do, it leaves out a lot of the cultural meaning that the original language had. So I have no problems with people using "ambition" as the closest substitute (though leaving it in the original "haki" would be better), but just be aware that (and I'm sure many of the translators have said this) this is NOT the exact translation, so using "ambition" should be this, or "ambition" should be that is null in a debate.

                                  Edit:
                                  And yes, One Piece wikia is bull >_> that's the problem with the "anyone can edit it" policy

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                                    Freehaven @silvers
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                                    For the most part, Haki has been used by the monster trio and other high tier characters in One Piece.

                                    I would think that Sanji's Diable Jamble is haki based. Zoro's Asura is definitely haki based. and luffy's displayed massive haki three times.

                                    Red Haired Shanks also displayed an enourmous haki himself. Similar to Luffy's.

                                    So with mastery of haki, One can call it a techinique, or one could call it an ability. But it's certainly controllable.

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                                    • S
                                      Skull Kid @Sesshy
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                                      @Sesshy:

                                      How are arrows breaking rocks imposing your will on others?

                                      Exactly. It's obviously being used as a technique, even if it is related to will as well. If people do not want to translate techniques then that's fine, but it annoys me that people are saying Haki is not a technique when it clearly is implied to be one.

                                      @Demon:

                                      In Amazon Lilly, Hancock says Luffy has the "Ambition of a King" (Ambition being "Haki")
                                      Leaving it as "Haki", the viewer gets the notion that it's just a Random attack that means nothing, and the notion of that scene is lost on the viewer.
                                      The Idea is that this thing, is that Luffy has "The Ambition of a King", (Haoshoku Haki) and his Ambition is to become "Pirate King".

                                      Translating it out gets the point of that across. Leaving it untranslated causes the notion to go right over a person's head.

                                      I actually agree with Shmeckie as far as it's Function goes.

                                      Alright, but if its being used as a technique, then that line could easily mean that the quality of the technique is that of a king and easily keep the same meaning. Every single ability in One Piece up to this point outside of what a normal person can do has been seen as a technique, and I don't see why this would be any different. The name does not have to be changed for the viewer to see that its not a random attack, which is obvious just going by how its used. And if it was originally intended to be called Haki, then it also loses meaning by leaving that out and simply calling it by another name like "ambition", which probably wouldn't be a perfect translation. I just don't see a reason to treat this as any different from any other named thing in One Piece when it comes to translation.

                                      @Demon:

                                      And Skull Kid, Do NOT Trust the One Piece Wikia for ANYTHING factual. They make up shit ALL THE TIME!!

                                      They claim Nami's "Tempo" attacks are a combination of "Tempus" which they say means "Weather", and "Kempo" which is a Fighting Style.
                                      Oda has TOLD us it's because Tempo is "Weather" in Italian, that's it. Not to mention that Tempus actually means "Time", it has NOTHING to do with the Weather.
                                      They just completely made it up, despite the fact that Oda's TOLD us what it means.

                                      They also claim Sanji's fighting style is actually a Formal Fighting style and that Zeff taught it to him, and that it's Called "Red Leg" (after Zeff). Not a SINGLE place in Any Manga chapter or Databook is this Said. In the Yellow Databook, it lists Sanji's fighting style as "Black Leg's Attacks", it doesn't say it's a formal style, just that it's Sanji's attacks, and it doesn't mention Zeff teaching him any sort of Formal Fighting Style. If Anything, the Style is called "Black Leg" since that's what the Book lists it as, but it doesn't say "Black Leg Style" it says "Black Leg's Attacks" which appears to just be referring to Sanji as Black Leg.
                                      The OP Wikia Makes shit up ALL the time.

                                      Ok, but it seems reasonable for the site to refer to Haki in that manner when there seems to be no evidence to the contrary of it being a technique. It seems more like you and the Yibis people/everyone who dislikes the original names decided that it wasn't a technique (just because) so that you could translate it into your precious renamed English. >_>

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                                      • Y
                                        yawood
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                                        technique to use your ambition?

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                                        • Ao Kiji
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                                          It was pretty obvious silvers was fluent in Japanese–probably more so than Rin.
                                          That was pretty dumb to demand she rush in here and set him straight, Schmekie.

                                          Apparently, silvers is saying the term 'ki" you see commonly used in fighting shonen series is derived from the term haki and the idea of this innate special power people can harness. Sort of like the idea of a "spirit" present in western culture and the translation loses that special meaning?
                                          (Correct me if I;m wrong, Silvers) And Rin on the other hand, is arguing that the idea of it being related to an actual human emotion is more important so it should be translated to ambition in english to convey this. Like a lot of translating, it's a judgment call based on which aspect you think was more important in the author's intent.

                                          I actually agree with Rin that the idea of DREAMS and my AMBITION is a prevalent motif in One Piece and choosing THAT word means it should be associated with an its english equivalent to get that theme across. But Ambition is DEFINITELY the ki or spiritual pressure or Spirit Energy of One Piece. It's not like Navy guys are gonna charge Luffy shouting "Don't worry! I got strawhat because I infused my sword with SADNESS!" or something. In OP, a person's ambition grows so strong it takes on supernatural powers. When characters start saying Luffy has an ambition of a certain COLOR or TYPE, it's a power.

                                          People need to remember when they speak of ki or chi in fighting series, to Easterners it's not this foreign magical thing, it's like saying they're using their SPIRIT to fight him or they're firing their SPIRIT at him. Someone's spirit isn't exactly a magical technique, but in the concept of those shows, it's a magical power used to do battle with. Ambition is a magical power used to do battle with in One Piece.

                                          Originally Posted by Mog

                                          Also, it's a children's comic from Japan.

                                          Why are you comparing it to cultural engravings and burritos.

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                                          • Demon Rin
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                                            My problem isn't with the function of it.
                                            Obviously it's the person's Ambition being used as SOME FORM of an attack, however I don't think it's an attack in and of itself, it's like, one can use their Ambition to fuel an attack, but it's not an attack in and of itself, it's sort of like, something that can be used for a multitude of things, one of which being making you better in a fight. Luffy used it to intimidate someone for example, but he always used it on accident.

                                            My problem is no longer with the Function, I've accepted that we do not know what it is FULLY yet, so arguing is pointless about THAT, Oda will either explain it later, or it will turn out it was just a quick thing Oda used to show that Luffy is getting stronger (simply having the Kuja state his Ambition is so strong, and seeing him intimidate people like Shanks did in the beginning would be a Very good show of Luffy's transition from the Boy Shanks Saved to the strong man he's become)
                                            I didn't decide to do it in my "Precious renamed English" for No good reason. The rest of Yibis decided they wanted to use Japanese attacks, so they are.

                                            Just for Ease-of-reading, I'll call it "Haki" for the rest of this post, but it's only to educate.
                                            There is a VERY important scene character-wise for Luffy, and leaving it untranslated loses that.
                                            Plus, Haki is NOT an attack, at least not in the Traditional attack sense in One Piece.
                                            Example: Zoro calls out "Santouryuu: Sanjyuuroku Pondo Hou!!" Translation: Three Sword Style: 36 Pound Phoenix/Cannon!!"
                                            Luffy calls out "Gomu Gomu no Pistol!!"
                                            Has anyone EVER Called out "HAKI HOU!!" or something like that? All that's been spoken of is Haki as a concept, never has it been used as an actual attack.
                                            It's the Character's Ambition, the force of their will. It's not an attack, it's not a technique. People can do Techniques that USE their Haki, like using it to intimidate, or using it to power their weapons. THOSE are attacks, but Haki in and of itself isn't a technique. it's the force of someone's Ambition and Willpower. People appear to be able to do things in Battle that USE the force of their Haki, but the Haki itself isn't an attack. Get it?

                                            My Problem is, that the fanbase has gotten the wrong Idea about it because of this notion that it doesn't have a Translation, and I can prove it.
                                            Franky House has gotten to the point where they feel it is LITERALLY Untranslatable, so much so that look what they did here:

                                            The ENTIRE Meaning of the scene is COMPLETELY Lost, because instead of saying Luffy has The "Ambition of a [Warring] King", they Simply say he has "Haoshoku Haki".
                                            And Look, Franky House NOW seems to think Haki is SO much a Magical word, that it has NO TRANSLATION WHATSOEVER!! Do you see a Translation for it? EVEN IN THE MARGINS?!?!
                                            I Mean wow… just Wow... This is the impression people have gotten of it, that it's just a new Magical Mystical attack that has no ground other than "Yay, Luffy can now Magically do Haki!!", so much so that Franky House decided "Lol, not Gonna translate it AT ALL, EVEN IN THE MARGINS!!" I mean seriously, if you're not gonna translate it, AT LEAST tell us what it means with a Translation Note in the Margins!! But no, They decided Haki was TOO PRECIOUS to have a translation, so there you go.

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                                            • Captain Shmeckie
                                              Captain Shmeckie @silvers
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                                              EDIT: Damn you Dmeon Rin and your speediness… Now I just look redundant.

                                              @silvers:

                                              If you don't know what you're talking about, then quit blabbing >_>

                                              I know both Chinese and Japanese, and 霸氣 is a common phrase in both languages. The reason they translated it as Ambition is because, sure, it is the closest word, but as most translations do, it leaves out a lot of the cultural meaning that the original language had. So I have no problems with people using "ambition" as the closest substitute (though leaving it in the original "haki" would be better), but just be aware that (and I'm sure many of the translators have said this) this is NOT the exact translation, so using "ambition" should be this, or "ambition" should be that is null in a debate.

                                              Now waaaaaait a second here; you spent one post breaking down this word saying how you have proof that, based on the way it's written, that it's One Piece's Ki, and NOW you're saying that it's a common phrase?! Well la-dee-damn-da, looks like I don't even need to know what I'm talking about, you just came and set yourself straight! That's handy!

                                              I dunno why half this forum doesn't get this, but other languages do not work like decoder ring codes. One word doesn't mean the same damn word in another language most of the time. That's why, in English and other langauges, we often just borrow words we don't even have. This is why translators are often paid old fashioned money to do what they do. It's called context. Based on the context of the sentence, you decide what word in our language best fits! That way, it doesn't sound ridiculous!

                                              And I'm sorry, but the cultural meaning?! Unless you can trace some historical developments to the word "haki," I can fanbullshit.

                                              And Ao Kiji, really?! Did you miss, like, the last two posts?! There's no "types." Luffy has the ambition of a king. Gee, I wonder why that is. The color of his spirit indicates he has the ambition of a king. Holy shit, did you all see what I just did there?! My god, it's almost as if I… I...

                                              I actually translated that! My god! I must be some kind of freak! Aw man, I'm just ruining everybody's fun! Now how is Luffy gonna be over 9000 if it's just his willpower?! God dammit, Captain Shmeckie, you party pooping sumumabitch!

                                              My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

                                              Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                                              Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                                              • Demon Rin
                                                Demon Rin @Captain Shmeckie
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                                                @Captain:

                                                EDIT: Damn you Dmeon Rin and your speediness… Now I just look redundant.

                                                Now waaaaaait a second here; you spent one post breaking down this word saying how you have proof that, based on the way it's written, that it's One Piece's Ki, and NOW you're saying that it's a common phrase?! Well la-dee-damn-da, looks like I don't even need to know what I'm talking about, you just came and set yourself straight! That's handy!

                                                I dunno why half this forum doesn't get this, but other languages do not work like decoder ring codes. One word doesn't mean the same damn word in another language most of the time. That's why, in English and other langauges, we often just borrow words we don't even have. This is why translators are often paid old fashioned money to do what they do. It's called context. Based on the context of the sentence, you decide what word in our language best fits! That way, it doesn't sound ridiculous!

                                                And I'm sorry, but the cultural meaning?! Unless you can trace some historical developments to the word "haki," I can fanbullshit.

                                                And Ao Kiji, really?! Did you miss, like, the last two posts?! There's no "types." Luffy has the ambition of a king. Gee, I wonder why that is. The color of his spirit indicates he has the ambition of a king. Holy shit, did you all see what I just did there?! My god, it's almost as if I… I...

                                                I actually translated that! My god! I must be some kind of freak! Aw man, I'm just ruining everybody's fun! Now how is Luffy gonna be over 9000 if it's just his willpower?! God dammit, Captain Shmeckie, you party pooping sumumabitch!

                                                that's actually why at Yibis, we decided on "Will Power"
                                                Since Ki IS IN there and on it's own can mean power, we decided that was a clever way to get the point across that POWER is in there, but at the same time it's a Synonym for Ambition, so nothing will be lost when the Kuja Scene happens.

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                                                • Captain Shmeckie
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                                                  And that's why I use Yibis! 😄

                                                  Honestly, I think the whole reason this confusion even exists is that we're dealing with a shonen series. I suppose this is the unintended consequence of making your shonen series a mite bit too creative (and simultaneously cliche in some ways).

                                                  "A term used for various special abilities?! Why it must be like Ki, or Chakra! I understand this, now!"

                                                  My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

                                                  Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                                                  Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                                                  • Demon Rin
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                                                    @Freehaven:

                                                    For the most part, Haki has been used by the monster trio and other high tier characters in One Piece.

                                                    I would think that Sanji's Diable Jamble is haki based. Zoro's Asura is definitely haki based. and luffy's displayed massive haki three times.

                                                    Red Haired Shanks also displayed an enourmous haki himself. Similar to Luffy's.

                                                    So with mastery of haki, One can call it a techinique, or one could call it an ability. But it's certainly controllable.

                                                    This is my single biggest problem with This.
                                                    Most seem to think that now that Haki has been introduced, SUDDENLY EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING THAT'S HAPPENED UP UNTIL NOW HAS BEEN HAKI!!

                                                    And I say this Again. It's NOT an attack. It's the Force of the character's Ambition.
                                                    Oda has made it now so that Ambition can be used to Fuel attacks. It fuels other attacks but it isn't an attack in its own right.
                                                    You never see someone calling out "HAKI BLAST!!" or something. the Character can use their Ambition as a sort of fuel for an attack. People can embed the very force of their Ambition into their weapons, but The Ambition in and of itself is an attack. It's just like Crocodile. He can turn his body to Sand. His ATTACKS are stuff like "Sables Desado" and "Desert La Sparda" yeah. He USES Sand to execute those attacks, but you don't see anyone rallying that we start leaving sand Untranslated as "Suna" do you?
                                                    The Character's Ambition is the Fuel, it's what makes up the attacks, but it's not the attack in and of itself.

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                                                    • Captain Shmeckie
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                                                      Let it be known that "Haki" was the death of silly Oda logic within the fanbase…

                                                      Before it was mentioned? Sanji's Diable Jamble was simply friction heat, and his firey heart kept his clothes from catching fire.

                                                      After it was mentioned? OMG COULD SANJI HAVE A FIRE HAKI MAYBE PERHAPS MAYBE?!?!?

                                                      Also, you DO know that someone is going to twist that logic, right? "Ki isn't the attack itself, but it FUELS the attack! Like how the Kamaehamaeha is the attack, but it USES Ki..." Might wanna word that better... Personally, I'd compare it to some kind of Dungeons & Dragons enhancement charm or whatever. It adds some D4 damage, or something. Plus added effects.

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                                                      Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                                                      Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                                                        Skull Kid @Captain Shmeckie
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                                                        Even if it is being used to enhance a technique, such as arrow shooting or whatever, it's still a technique. It doesn't have to be a specific attack and that scene Rin pointed out doesn't lose any meaning at all if they explain it in advance. If you just call it willpower, it makes little sense because it just seems like the characters suddenly have magical willpower that can do all these things. The whole point is that its not normal ambition or willpower and is in fact a more specified thing that requires certain conditions in order to do or can only be done by specific people, meaning it should keep its original name.

                                                        That's just how I see it though.

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                                                        • Captain Shmeckie
                                                          Captain Shmeckie @Skull Kid
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                                                          @Skull:

                                                          If you just call it willpower, it makes little sense because it just seems like the characters suddenly have magical willpower that can do all these things.

                                                          So… characters suddenly having a magical japanese-named power makes more sense?!

                                                          And it's not "magical willpower," it's very very strong willpower.

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                                                          Originally Posted by Buccaneer

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                                                            People seem to want ambition to be some sort of silly DBZ style power-up, just because that's what they're used to. It's not.

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                                                            • Demon Rin
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                                                              It's not "Magical" Willpower, it's NORMAL Willpower.
                                                              In the One Piece World, the Sheer force of your Willpower or your Ambition to succeed is enough to power you up. That is the Idea behind this.
                                                              Luffy's got REALLY strong Willpower because his Ambition is to become Pirate King. Hancock has it too because she started out her Life as a Slave, and through sheer determination was able to bring herself to the level of being Empress of a Nation.
                                                              That Willpower can be used to do attacks, but it's not an attack in and of itself, it's the Catalyst for the Attack.
                                                              The Thing Shanks did to the Lord of the Coast and Luffy did to Motobaro and the Kuja wasn't an attack at all. It was just them Intimidating those people with the force of their Willpower. Now the Arrow thing pretty much IS an attack, but again, The Willpower itself isn't the attack, The Arrows are. They just use their Willpower to make the arrows more powerful.
                                                              Doesn't that Make a LOT more sense? That a Person's sheer force of Will makes them Strong? It's a much simpler explanation that actually makes sense Vs using the Deus Ex Machina Excuse that "It's a Random New Power that came from nowhere"

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                                                              • Captain Shmeckie
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                                                                @Darkstorm:

                                                                People seem to want ambition to be some sort of silly DBZ style power-up, just because that's what they're used to. It's not.

                                                                The One Piece fandom in a nutshell…

                                                                My deviantART|Project A.F.T.E.R.|My YouTube|Money and Power|AP Art Topic

                                                                Originally Posted by Buccaneer

                                                                Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.

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                                                                  John Giant @silvers
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                                                                  @silvers:

                                                                  Haki != Ambition. I've said this a couple of times in other threads, and I will say it again.

                                                                  It is understandable, however, that it is mistranslated, as there is no direct counterpart for "Haki" in the English language.

                                                                  Haki (霸氣) is composed of two words, the first being the type, the second being the object. 氣 (qi) is a type of energy/aura that every person has. 霸 is related to words like "tyrant" and "dominant". The traditional usage for 霸氣 is to describe a person who's presence suppresses others.

                                                                  So it is not a technique, but rather something not too different from the chi/qi we hear about in martial arts. It is not a matter of how Oda plans on using this, but rather what this phrase means (Oda is not the one to invent it. He can twist its powers and characteristics around, but the basic concept of it must stay within certain bounds)

                                                                  Imbuing Haki into an arrow to strengthen it is already stretching it a bit, but if you think of Haki as ordinary Chi, and you simply apply it onto an object, such a definition is passable.

                                                                  great post, i have been pissed off with the translation being ambition, from how it has been used, for instance what the hell is an ambitious arrow….lol

                                                                  but seriously though i think if we chose a combination of two of the words you gave then it would have been easier for people to understand, instead of this crap confusing translation we are currently using......

                                                                  i think we should have a better word instead of tyrant or dominant but apart from that it fits quite well e.g.

                                                                  the arrow is imbued with dominant energy/ dominant aura

                                                                  he knocked them out with his dominant aura…

                                                                  he has a kings dominant aura...

                                                                  Well i know some people wouldn't like this option but its a lot less confusing then ambition. just think that people starting to read op will always ask wft is ambition, where as this option gives a clearer indication to what it is.

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                                                                    @Ryuksgelus:

                                                                    Haki so far seems like "The Force" in Star Wars more than a simple technique.

                                                                    This answers it.

                                                                    There's no equivilent english word for haki, end of.

                                                                    Haki = Abit of
                                                                    ambition (ambitious) + aura + aggression + aspect + expression + aspiration + warlike + conquering + "there's something about him i cant put into word" + quality + character

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                                                                    • Demon Rin
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                                                                      Willpower
                                                                      It's a Synonym for ambition, and it has the word "Power" in it.

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                                                                        Rockschmock @silvers
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                                                                        @silvers:

                                                                        I know both Chinese and Japanese, and 霸氣 is a common phrase in both languages.

                                                                        You mean 覇気 is a common phrase in Japanese and 霸氣 is a common phrase in Chinese, right?

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                                                                        • brennen.exe
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                                                                          Hehe, I'm going to laugh if we find out that "the whole meaning of that scene" was in actuality lost to Demon Rin.

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                                                                            @Rockschmock:

                                                                            You mean 覇気 is a common phrase in Japanese and 霸氣 is a common phrase in Chinese, right?

                                                                            Yes, I can't get my laptop to type Japanese for some reason, so Chinese will have to do 😕 Mandarin is my mothertongue anyway, I've only learned 4 years of Japanese in highschool (though with all the manga hype and the fact that half the characters in Japanese are Han, I picked it up pretty quickly). And I think people have mistakened what I meant by "common phrase". I don't mean we talk about it everyday, but that it's open to discussion (the basic concept of the phrase is common knowledge, to both Chinese and Japanese people)

                                                                            And… Haki is willpower, yes, but that does not lead to Haki = Ambition. It just... doesn't make sense. Anyway, this is why I don't like discussing manga with those whose only language is English when it comes to things like this. You can't expect an absolute answer because it is not within your cultural understanding to get one.

                                                                            And no, the way that Oda has used it so far is a lot more subtle than the retarded concepts of Dragonball (it was original, but all the mangas that followed it were lame). Saying that they are completely different based on this assumption, however, would be jumping to conclusions.

                                                                            If I were to use a phrase to describe Haki, I would say it is "The will to dominate". This would best convey the original meaning. Don't ask me how that can be fused into an arrow (I've said that this IS stretching its original meaning). It also hints at some qi/chi/ki, which is common in Asian culture. Again, this is why English-only people do not get it. Ki didn't fucking come from Dragonball. If any of you is suggesting that, then get out because you obvious don't know shit. It's something with a VERY long history and a VERY deep/vague meaning. It's a sort of "spiritual energy" (energy of the soul/mind/will, if you want to put it that way) that is said to be able to be channeled. By channeled, the traditional idea of it is very subtle, like healing a person with it or something small like that, not OMFGMEGABEAM!1!111 style. If you still don't at least get a clue from this, Shmeckie, I suggest you never learn a second language because you will headache your teacher very much.

                                                                            And to first post: Haki is not a technique, like how "the force" in Star Wars is not a technique. Pushing objects with it IS a technique. Knocking people out with Haki is a technique. Fusing it into an arrow is a technique. But Haki is not a technique.

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                                                                              • MagneticMonkey
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                                                                                I'm interested in what technique can overcome DFs like we have seen in the fight sentomarou vs luffy and rayleigh vs kizaru.
                                                                                What thechnique can be fueled by the "will power" of someone to overcome DFs?
                                                                                To me Haki is a whole concept. I actually have a theory about how it works and how people can use it to fight DF users but hey let's wait for Oda to give more hints/ an explanation.

                                                                                The giant guy asking rayleigh (after knocking out disco the chief of the auction house) if that wasn't haki. Hacchi saying that they call this haki after seeing what rayleigh did with the guards of the auction house. Abd he say "they". That probably means the pirates who know about it and use it. Why would they name the technique after the power that fuels it? Wouldn't that mean the technique == the power and haki is actually a technique?

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                                                                                  I think I like my explanation as to how Sentomaru was able to bat Luffy around better than any of this ''AmbitionHakiKiGenkiHA!!'' crap: he was just that friggin' tough.

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                                                                                    @ MagneticMonkey
                                                                                    Haki is used like "mental energy" in those cases. It's still not a technique. Sorry to bring up Star Wars, but it is the closest western comparison I can find. "The force" is used like a technique pretty often, but "the force" itself is not a technique, but a source of energy which you draw from to power your techniques.

                                                                                    In One Piece's case, you use your mental energy to do certain things. Luffy has a strong mental energy, so he can knock out people when he really really wants to.

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                                                                                    • Urouge
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                                                                                      @Demon:

                                                                                      This is my single biggest problem with This.
                                                                                      Most seem to think that now that Haki has been introduced, SUDDENLY EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING THAT'S HAPPENED UP UNTIL NOW HAS BEEN HAKI!!

                                                                                      And I say this Again. It's NOT an attack. It's the Force of the character's Ambition.
                                                                                      Oda has made it now so that Ambition can be used to Fuel attacks. It fuels other attacks but it isn't an attack in its own right.
                                                                                      You never see someone calling out "HAKI BLAST!!" or something. the Character can use their Ambition as a sort of fuel for an attack. People can embed the very force of their Ambition into their weapons, but The Ambition in and of itself is an attack. It's just like Crocodile. He can turn his body to Sand. His ATTACKS are stuff like "Sables Desado" and "Desert La Sparda" yeah. He USES Sand to execute those attacks, but you don't see anyone rallying that we start leaving sand Untranslated as "Suna" do you?
                                                                                      The Character's Ambition is the Fuel, it's what makes up the attacks, but it's not the attack in and of itself.

                                                                                      The problem with bringing up attacks like Crocodile's that you just mentioned are that they aren't even in Japanese to begin with. The reader isn't expected to understand the meanings of those words, not that there's a problem if they do. This doesn't do a lot to tie in with the rest of my argument, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

                                                                                      I personally would have no issue with if subbers referred to classifying Croc's attacks as "sand powers" or "suna powers." I agree that by adding "powers" on to the end of it, you get the point across.

                                                                                      Willpower is an english word all by itself. The fact that "power" is on the end of it doesn't really get the point across. I think it would be FAR more effective to say "ambition energy," or "ambition powers." That would be a phrase that doesn't occur naturally in English, so it sticks out that there is something behind it. The word "willpower" doesn't nearly do "haki" the justice that it deserves to English speakers.

                                                                                      You say that "haki" is the power behind many attacks, and I completely understand and agree with that point. By the same token, "chakra" or "reiatsu" are also the power that fuels many attacks. I'm NOT saying that they're the same, please don't assume that I am. The only parallel I'm drawing is the one that you yourself have brought up, fueling other attacks. I could make all the same arguments for chakra or reiatsu that you're making for haki. Additionally, One Piece is obviously using haki beyond its real world context, just like Naruto uses chakra beyond its real world context. Does that mean that chakra should be translated to some common english word because it's not the name of an attack?

                                                                                      @Demon:

                                                                                      that's actually why at Yibis, we decided on "Will Power"

                                                                                      I will be very disappointed if Yibis translates haki as the common english word "willpower," which is common and carries no special meaning at all. At least make up a phrase that isn't used in every day life (so that it sticks out, like "ambition energy") if you really feel the desire to translate it. Willpower, like ambition, is a word that can be easily glanced over and missed completely.

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                                                                                        LeeWii @brennen.exe
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                                                                                        I think you all are wrong (DONN).
                                                                                        There is something special about the ambition in OP. I don't really get Smeckes reasoning for it not being a "technique" as what he have said so far is. "They should translate it ambition" and "it's not the same as ki in dragonball" . So i have to ask you personally, do you or do you not think Ambition is a technique!?
                                                                                        And i don't see how translation have anything to do with the arguing if it's a technique or not, as in japan were they just read the word "ambition, domination, full of spirit etc.etc.. the think it's natural for it to make people pass out or break use it with their arrows.
                                                                                        And since when do you have to learn how to use ambition?
                                                                                        the Kuja clearly states that they know luffy can't use it http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/518/15/ (middle panel middle box) unless you are retarded (as in brain disease not internet slang for"I have a different opinion then you") you don't need to learn how to use your ambition.

                                                                                        Now for my opinion of the matter i think learning ambition is a power up (sorry anti DB fans) as i can't see how it would other vise destroy rocks.
                                                                                        and i think it can neglect DF and i do not think this because of the Rayleight-Kizaru battle as everyone else seem to connect it to but the marigold-Luffy.
                                                                                        as Luffy states: am i not rubber? why does it hurt even as i am rubber? .
                                                                                        Against 1:
                                                                                        It might have an attack so strong it felt he wasn't rubber!
                                                                                        BUT: wouldn't that make him say the same think when Rob Lucci hit him as his attack clearly hurt him.
                                                                                        Against 2:
                                                                                        I't was never stated ambition was the reason her attack felt like he wasn't rubber.
                                                                                        I have no counter, there is no proof it was Ambition, that is purely my thought as Ambition was central in the chapters around the event.

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                                                                                          Does that mean that chakra should be translated to some common english word because it's not the name of an attack?

                                                                                          Chakra, however, is a real-world Hindu concept that has been passed down for thousands of years.

                                                                                          ''Haki'' is just a normal, everyday, Japanese word that Oda put emphasis on by putting the character in quotations, from what the RAWs tell me.

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                                                                                          • MagneticMonkey
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                                                                                            @ MagneticMonkey
                                                                                            Haki is used like "mental energy" in those cases. It's still not a technique. Sorry to bring up Star Wars, but it is the closest western comparison I can find. "The force" is used like a technique pretty often, but "the force" itself is not a technique, but a source of energy which you draw from to power your techniques.

                                                                                            In One Piece's case, you use your mental energy to do certain things. Luffy has a strong mental energy, so he can knock out people when he really really wants to.

                                                                                            Oh ok now that we're so far let me ask a second question:
                                                                                            Would you think that what people in the star wars games name "force pull, force push, lightning, grip etc…" aren't techniques? Cause they are basically relying on the force which is a power an or an energy field that tieds everything together in the universe. Without the force the jedis or siths won't be able to perform these attacks. But with the force they can run faster percieve better etc....

                                                                                            Ok i understood that there is an energy that can be used to boost attacks or can be used to attack people. My only question is "what are the attacks that only rely on the energy". Like those blasts. Aren't they techniques?

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                                                                                              "The will to dominate", "willpower", "mental energy" are only a few, but Haki covers a lot more.

                                                                                              And to the few people in the thread who keep thinking ki == Dragonball, you poor manga-enthusiast wannabes 😞

                                                                                              @Magnetic

                                                                                              Yes, blast = technique. What zoro did was a technique. Fusing it into an arrow is a technique. They haven't been named yet, but yes they are techniques.

                                                                                              @LeeWii

                                                                                              I think you mean "controlling", not "learning". You cannot "learn" Haki, but you learn how to control it.

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                                                                                              • Urouge
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                                                                                                @Crossword:

                                                                                                Chakra, however, is a real-world Hindu concept that has been passed down for thousands of years.

                                                                                                ''Haki'' is just a normal, everyday, Japanese word that Oda put emphasis on by putting the character in quotations, from what the RAWs tell me.

                                                                                                Are you saying that haki is a far better understood concept in Japan than chakra is? I honestly don't know since I can't speak much Japanese at all, but I actually care about it. I guess I just don't understand why the origin of the word itself makes much difference.

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                                                                                                • MagneticMonkey
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                                                                                                  So basically there are techniques relying only on that "force power will ambition etc".
                                                                                                  So your "haki" level determines how much you can boost your techniques using it. And the "haki" itselfs isn't a technique just your will, ambition, etc, to achieve something.
                                                                                                  Then let me ask you where does that power comes from?
                                                                                                  The problem with ambition is that the physically weakest mother in eastblue in a village can use her ambition to protect her kids to knock out an opponent who is stronger than her.

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                                                                                                    Are you saying that haki is a far better understood concept in Japan than chakra is? I honestly don't know since I can't speak much Japanese at all, but I actually care about it. I guess I just don't understand why the origin of the word itself makes much difference.

                                                                                                    Huh? From what I understand haki, has no special, mystical meaning within the Japanese language. It's just a common, everyday word. ''His ambition will get him far in life.'' Stuff like that. Chakra, on the other hand, is a religious concept, that involves a person's life force and plays a role in some Eastern medicine. It also translates to wheel or something like that.

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                                                                                                    • brennen.exe
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                                                                                                      @silvers:

                                                                                                      If I were to use a phrase to describe <the word=""></the>'Haki', I would say it is "The will to dominate". This would best convey the original meaning. Don't ask me how that can be fused into an arrow (I've said that this IS stretching its original meaning).

                                                                                                      There are many instances in fiction where an author will take a common word and use that word with different purpose than its intended meaning. Take Star Wars for example. Is "the Force" meant to simply be someone using force, as in 'to drive or compel against resistance'? No, it is simply a word that the author used to define a unique ability or power that exists only in the domain of the universe he created. He simply chose the word because its real definition is fitting for what it is. In Star Wars' case, "the Force" is 'power', and "force" essentially means "power". Should we call it, "the Power"? No. It is/was named "the Force". I see Haki the same way. Oda chose a word that was fitting of a theme in the comic and maybe even for the definition of the word, and used it to define – much like the force -- a unique power or ability that exists only in the domain of the world of One Piece. Think of it like a pun, where Oda is playing off the word "Haki" and the theme in One Piece of dreams, ambitions, determination, and force of will and then molding those ideas (themes) into a secret art or technique that exists and can be learned by anyone and everyone. So I wouldn't say it is directly connected to whatever you ambition in life is. Of course, I am not stating this is fact and/or what Oda has planned for it; I am simply explaining my view on the matter. I think it makes the most sense, fits with the themes of the series, and would be a fairly unique (not original) way for a Shonen to use "chi" or what-have-you.

                                                                                                      Edit: Oh! I forgot my point! Point is, it has been emphasized in this series, and always contains quotes around it. Those facts alone, as well as how they were used, suggest it is a proper noun or name given to a specific art or technique. I would think the name should stay the same and be capitalized. So, "Haki" would be what we stick with. Or at least, IMV.

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                                                                                                        @Crossword
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                                                                                                        @Crossword:

                                                                                                        Huh? From what I understand haki, has no special, mystical meaning within the Japanese language. It's just a common, everyday word. ''His ambition will get him far in life.'' Stuff like that. Chakra, on the other hand, is a religious concept, that involves a person's life force and plays a role in some Eastern medicine. It also translates to wheel or something like that.

                                                                                                        Ok, I understand where "the force" talk is coming in now then. "Force" being and every day word in english like "Haki" is in Japanese. In that case, "Haoushoku Haki" would be the same concept as "Force Push."

                                                                                                        My original point is still valid though. Haki clearly has a definition, even if its roots may not be as well defined as chakra. I understand that haki is a well understood concept in Japan, much like ambition is a well understood concept in English. My question is more about chakra than haki though. Is the concept of chakra understood in Japan very well like haki is? I can't think of a comparison in English, but one will probably come to me eventually.

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