About what shanks and garp said and asura

Kma

They are EQUAL.

In the RED book the japanese character they use more directly translate to power. Now if it meant strength alone I would be reluctant to say it means as much but power is a combination of speed and strength. Power is how much force you can apply in a time interval. THIS IS CRITICAL IN FIGHTS. STRENGTH ALONE WONT DO YOU ANY GOOD IF YOU CANT LAND A HIT.

Also sure Luffy gets the stronger guys. As seen in the battle against Croc.

But this book was created AFTER THAT!

Why did ODA STATE THEY HAVE THE SAME POWER LEVEL AFTERWARDS?

The same trend has continued so it isnt valid to say just because he gets the stronger opponents means he is stronger. Simply put Luffy just always wants to kick the stronger guys ass.

Other then Croc there is ONLY ONE person Luffy beat that is stronger then Zoro's opponent. Lucci. Enel does not count caus Luffy had an advantage over Zoro here.

Is there actually anyone else? Zoro could have owned Bellamy, Foxy, and Blueno. Also notice how Zoro beat Ohm who is stronger then Sattori? Luffy didnt even beat him one on one. I know Luffy probaly would have beat him one on one but still… Also Sattori got some huge hits on him.

They are both getting so much stronger! BOTH OF THEM are growing equally!! The promise Zoro made to Mihawk and Luffy. Hes stubborn as hell, he wont let Luffy outgrow him.

Have you seen how much Zoro has evolved? He is now shooting out beams, creating devil illusions! Jumping in front of the rocket man and accerelerating past it!

Until Whiskey peak I thought for sure Luffy was stronger. In East Blue Zoro did not seem as strong cause pretty much in all his fights he had a major disadvantage.

Oda used Whiskey Peak as a statement. They are equal. This picture just screams it:

Luffy vs Zoro

several chapters later it still seems like Oda is making that statement.

Luffy and Zoro

Also Im just wondering have you seen the anime version of that fight? I know the anime isnt done by Oda but if you watch it they both wanted to kill each other, BAD. Saying Luffy was not serious in that fight is BULLOCKS. Each blow was a deadly.

There was more stuff I wanted to add but it seems I have forgotten.

I apologize if sound angry or trying to flame someone. I respect your guys opinions but I just want to state some of my opinions. It always seems like my posts get ignored so Im trying to be more aggressive .

SabZ

@Bad-Beat:

If Oda had wanted to show a difference in strength between Luffy and Zoro then he would have done.

OMG SPECULATION! SPECULATION!

:whistling:

Bad-Beat, if you knew me, you'd know I hate backing down from these kind of things. The arguement may be pointless in terms of future events, but I can't back down.

Ms. Suave Debonair

Then I'm glad I don't know you. Just move back on topic.

ONEinchPUNCH

@$abZ:

OIP, I didn't want to argue with this, but I will… even though it ignores what I said. This is a one-man arguement... at least READ MY POST.

I read it and wasn't impressed.

I NEVER SAID THAT THE DATA BOOK WAS WRONG. I said Oda most likely didn't put great detail into it… putting 6 as the highest attribute number.

This on its own is disagreeing with the data book.

Had he done something like a PL list, that ranges from high number over 1000, I doubt he'd class them equal… or he MAY not class them equal. The chart you guys are talking about isn't the strongest of evidence.

Oda wanted 1-6 so he made a chart of 1-6. He obviously didn't want a 1-1000 one because he didn't feel it was neccessary.

Why? ask Oda not me.

I explained Whiskey Peak… just... read above will you. Another comment blatenly ignoring my post, and I'm outta this debate.

luffy grew during his fight like he has done in all his fights up until now (or will you argu this too?) While lucci didn't he remained the same and in the end he lost.

Zoro and luffy fought exactly the same and if they grew they grew together EQUALLY. Which made all growth pointless since they both either grew or didn't. However long the fight was means nothing, each blow was equal, everything they did was equal. It's just too much for an un-needed fight like that to be equal by coincindence.

It's a message from Oda saying "their equal"

Again, if you would just read my post, I believe I said I agree with CD about waiting longer for more info.

So you agree his half of Cosmics post.

Y'know… I'm on the verge to just drop out of this debate... because you guys just ignore what I say. Even if you are right (which I believe you're not) you still ignore... so I'm wasting my time. You'll understand soon.

I haven't ignored anything I've always made a comeback, you seem to ignore the facts.

'nuff said.

If you say so

Phenomenol

This post is deleted!

Final End

@Bad-Beat:

Then I'm glad I don't know you. Just move back on topic.

Well if you look at the first post, we are on topic.

SabZ

Okay… I have come to a reasonable conclusion, that might satisfy you all and end this Luffy vs Zoro debate for now.

You guys believe that Oda's work so far is enough to ONE HUNDRED PERCENT convince you that Luffy and Zoro are proven equal. Go by that, I'm not mad... or haven't been in the past. I fully understand why you may believe that.

I choose to believe that Oda hasn't finished showing us if they are equal or not, and the proof you guys have said so far hasn't ONE HUNDRED PERCENT convinced me, as I don't think Oda has explained to us fully yet.

Oda will explain further in the manga, I hope, and until then... our thoughts and opinions go seperate ways. Once Oda has given you guys, or me, the proof to support our arguements... none of us are going to agree with each other. Bad-beat talks sense... but don't count this as backing down. Just a matter of waiting and observing.

Done. (And please, don't reply back with your arguement, because I think the debate will be back on deeper into the manga, and then we shall hopefully "meet" again for this debate).

Kma

Man I swear my posts always get ignored… took me kind of long to write that too... Oh well...

abz is right though, no one is going to convince anyone...

Ms. Suave Debonair

@Final:

Well if you look at the first post, we are on topic.

I meant from his post.

ONEinchPUNCH

@Kma:

Man I swear my posts always get ignored… took me kind of long to write that too... Oh well...

I didn't ignore it, it was a great post, I actually watched the luffy vs zoro fight and found this next to it.

It's so damn funny

Final End

@ONEinchPUNCH:

I didn't ignore it, it was a great post, I actually watched the luffy vs zoro fight and found this next to it.

It's so damn funny

Its funny, and backing the argument that Luffy and Zoro are equals.

Kma

Hahaha ya I almost posted that one by mistake. That wouldn't have looked good. Just watched it again and I cant stop laughing . Zolo is just too damn funny.

Impel Down

It doesn't seem like Luffy vs. Zoro would be easy to pull off since one is melee and one is swords.

Hawkeye

Man what does oda know about one piece? i am the real one piece guru. I know more about one piece than oda ever will

Impel Down

I'm pretty sure the converse is true.

FireFistAce 0

Luffy and Zoro are equals in general strength. In endurance, Zoro clearly has an edge, but Luffy does from a strategic standpoint. In terms of stamina, they're both weak (They're always sleeping, Luffy getting tired at random moments, in addition to natural sleep). In a fight, they would probably tie.

But it stands to reason that because Luffy always gets the "Captain" for his opponent and Zoro the "First Mate", Luffy is having to put out much more effort than Zoro is in every fight. For whatever reason, in the One Piece world, the evil "captain" is usually twice as powerful as the "First Mate". Look at Kaku and Lucchi. Kaku's Doruki was 2200. Lucchi's Doruki was 4000. That's nearly double the level of difficulty. Most of the other "crews" they've faced have been this way. Even in Baroque Works, Though Boness was a helluva strong guy, Crocodile was stronger because of his Logia power.

They may be equals in strength, but their opponents aren't. And that's what sets them apart.

Phenomenol

@Fire Fist:

Luffy and Zoro are equals in general strength. In endurance, Zoro clearly has an edge, but Luffy does from a strategic standpoint. In terms of stamina, they're both weak (They're always sleeping, Luffy getting tired at random moments, in addition to natural sleep). In a fight, they would probably tie.

But it stands to reason that because Luffy always gets the "Captain" for his opponent and Zoro the "First Mate", Luffy is having to put out much more effort than Zoro is in every fight. For whatever reason, in the One Piece world, the evil "captain" is usually twice as powerful as the "First Mate". Look at Kaku and Lucchi. Kaku's Doruki was 2200. Lucchi's Doruki was 4000. That's nearly double the level of difficulty. Most of the other "crews" they've faced have been this way. Even in Baroque Works, Though Boness was a helluva strong guy, Crocodile was stronger because of his Logia power.

They may be equals in strength, but their opponents aren't. And that's what sets them apart.

I agree with your first post but the second part I have to disagree with.

Luffy fights the captain because he is the captain and Zoro as we know is his first mate, but that does NOT mean that Zoro could NOT have beaten the captain's of the SH opponents. Now Lucci having twice as much "Doriki"as Kaku is really not saying much because Te-awase's only a method to measure the level of your athletics!! Now Baroque works is the same, Zoro could have beaten Crocodile as well, Zoro could dip his swords in water and possibly beat Crocodile. It is even argauble that Daz Bones would have killed Luffy if they fought.

Kma

Actually when you look at it Luffy fighting the strongest guy it is usually just by chance or the fact that Luffy really wants to kick that guys ass.

1. Morgan - actually Zoro owned him

2. Buggy - Zoro actually fought him first but we all know what happened.

3. Kuro - Luffy ordered Zoro to bring Ussopp to Jango, also Luffy was "crushed" when the cat brothers came out

4. Krieg - not there

5. Arlong - Zoro injured

6. Uh Wapol dosent even count

7. Crocodile - Luffy wanted to kick his ass bad, Zoro wasnt even near the scene, Zoro was left with decoy plan and got pitted against Mr. 1

Also notice that in the Red Book is published after Baroque Works saga and Oda states they are equal in Power. So Luffy taking on Croc and Zoro taking out Mr. 1 because Luffy was stronger is a moot point.

8. Bellamy wasnt even a really a main villian and Zoro would have owned him too.

9. Enel - Luffy has a major advantage

In Skypia Luffy, Ussopp, Sanji had trouble with Sattori. Zoro took out Ohm, a stronger priest by himself.

10. Lucci - the ONLY guy SINCE Croc. Even then its caus Luffy really wanted to kick his ass too.

I excluded Foxy cause that was a captain vs captain duel and Zoro would have owned him too. Didnt even bother with Blueno who has a much lower Douriki then Kaku.

My point is ever since East Blue, there has only been 2 valid MAIN enemies where Luffy takes on the stronger guy.

Croc and Lucci. And notice how after the Red Book is after Crocodile so they were still equal then and whos to say its not the same trend after Enies Lobby?

FireFistAce 0

@Phenomenol:

I agree with your first post but the second part I have to disagree with.

Luffy fights the captain because he is the captain and Zoro as we know is his first mate, but that does NOT mean that Zoro could NOT have beaten the captain's of the SH opponents. Now Lucci having twice as much "Doriki"as Kaku is really not saying much because Te-awase's only a method to measure the level of your athletics!! Now Baroque works is the same, Zoro could have beaten Crocodile as well, Zoro could dip his swords in water and possibly beat Crocodile. It is even argauble that Daz Bones would have killed Luffy if they fought.

I'm not arguing the fact that Zoro could have beaten Crocodile or Lucci (Though he did even say he had no desire to fight Lucchi, for whatever reason). The point I'm trying to make is that Crocodile and Lucchi were stronger than their respective peers, and therefore Luffy had to exert himself more than Zoro did to fight his opponents. Regardless of the fact whether Zoro could have beaten them or not, the fact remains that Luffy fought them, and thus had to exert himself more than Zoro did. Being that this is ALWAYS the case (With Arlong Park being an exception), Luffy has a slight edge in this aspect because he's getting a better "Workout" everytime he fights compared to Zoro, who fights a weaker opponent.

Phenomenol

@Fire Fist:

I'm not arguing the fact that Zoro could have beaten Crocodile or Lucci (Though he did even say he had no desire to fight Lucchi, for whatever reason). The point I'm trying to make is that Crocodile and Lucchi were stronger than their respective peers, and therefore Luffy had to exert himself more than Zoro did to fight his opponents. Regardless of the fact whether Zoro could have beaten them or not, the fact remains that Luffy fought them, and thus had to exert himself more than Zoro did. Being that this is ALWAYS the case (With Arlong Park being an exception), Luffy has a slight edge in this aspect because he's getting a better "Workout" everytime he fights compared to Zoro, who fights a weaker opponent.

Well I agree with you concerning Luffy's growth because of the stronger villains he faces…but that still does NOT stop Zoro from increasing just as much as Luffy is. Check out his battle in the Baratie arc...Zoro fought Hawkeye's while Luffy fought Krieg. Also Daz Boness increased Zoro so much that he learned The "BREATH" of all things technique. If anything BOTH Luiffy and Zoro exert themselves and get better with every villain. It still shows how equally yolked they are in their battles as far as growth is concerned.

CosmicDebris

Zoro trains a heck of a lot more than Luffy though.
I don't think it's really logical to believe that Luffy's overall strength increases more because he's fighting stronger enemies. You don't get a "workout" from one fight. It's always been both Luffy's and Zoro's will and drive to succeed that overcomes whatever obstacle they encounter. We will likely never find out what exactly the outcome of Luffy v. Zoro would be in an uninterrupted, because Zoro only wants to defeat a swordsman, and Luffy needs to have a reason to beat Zoro like he would an enemy (I doubt there will be a repeat of Whiskey Peak). He's not like Naruto; he doesn't desire to see his crewmates as rivals.

Pants-eater

Naruto has a heck of a lot of paradoxes when it comes to character strength.

A beats B
B beats C
C absolutely fucks up A

All within the space of a souple of days or so, in-universe time.

In my opinion, it's plot which differntiates their strength. There is no fucking way Luffy will fight The Man of a Kajillion Blades since the plot would suck. Luffy fights the main baddy, no matter what the bad guy uses. Zoro specifically fights the guy with the sharp stuff. Sure, Crocodile had sand blades but they aren't swords or his main ability.

Luffy fights the baddy.
Zoro fights the swordy guy.
Sanji fights the martial artist.
Nami rubs her female playmates.
Chopper fight the quirky guy with funny hair.

theinvisibleworm

Luffy fighting the strongest character has more to do with the fact that Luffy feels responsible to fight the strongest enemy for the safety of his crew.

Zoro, on the other hand, only really needs to fight swordsmen and Zoro is COMPLETELY confident in Luffy's ability to handle himself, and so he never objects to Luffy fighting the strongest guy in a given area.

On the other hand, if you really want to look at who's fought the strongest opponent the Strawhats have ever faced in the entire series it's Zoro, who fought Mihawk. Luffy immediately tried to fight Mihawk once Zoro lost, but he faired no better.

When Mihawk is zoro's opponent it's likely that Mihawk will be the strongest opponent in the entire arc, and that Zoro will be fighting him.

In other words Zoro's not going to object to Luffy fighting the strongest opponents because a) He has full confidence in Luffy's ability to beat any opponent no matter what (in fact he maintains the most confidence in Luffy of ANY crewmember). b) He has no reason to fight the main opponent unless it is a swordsman, in which case he would object and Luffy would concede and let him fight the man (because Luffy has full confidence in Zoro).

odlam

I'm still interesting the most in the Asura stance because to me, it's the one powerup we still don't know the limits of.

Luffy's Gear 2 and Gear 3 we saw in depth and had really good explanations of.

But we saw so little of the Asura stance and what it can do - the first time it was used, it cut through Kaku's super move and Kaku himself effortlessly, and instantly ended the fight.

In other words Zoro's not going to object to Luffy fighting the strongest opponents because a) He has full confidence in Luffy's ability to beat any opponent no matter what (in fact he maintains the most confidence in Luffy of ANY crewmember). b) He has no reason to fight the main opponent unless it is a swordsman, in which case he would object and Luffy would concede and let him fight the man (because Luffy has full confidence in Zoro).

Completely agree here.

Angel emfrbl

Question: What is this topic about again?

Impel Down

Yeah, it's gone incredably off topic since, oh, post #2. I don't even know what it means by "what shanks and garp said".

Archtyrant

It doesn't matter; the OP already said that anything goes here, so we're free to get to a new topic whenever everyone is hyped for it.

I agree that Luffy and Zoro may be equal in power now, but lets face it; eventually Luffy will have to become the strongest in One Piece-verse. Just as Mihawk is the Strongest Swordsman and Whitebeard is the Strongest Man In The World, the Man closest to One Piece. Mihawk said so himself: "That would be an even harder task than surpassing me alone" or something along those lines.

igalsfy

… and i don't see what's so important in knowing if luffy is stronger than zoro.

BlackGalleon1

@Archtyrant:

It doesn't matter; the OP already said that anything goes here, so we're free to get to a new topic whenever everyone is hyped for it.

I agree that Luffy and Zoro may be equal in power now, but lets face it; eventually Luffy will have to become the strongest in One Piece-verse. Just as Mihawk is the Strongest Swordsman and Whitebeard is the Strongest Man In The World, the Man closest to One Piece. Mihawk said so himself: "That would be an even harder task than surpassing me alone" or something along those lines.

What Mihawk said does not mean Luffy would have to be stronger than Zoro to be PK. Its just means there are more (and probably more challenging) obstacles than Mihawk himself. If it was about being the strongest then WB would be PK already. Infact, during the time Roger was PK, Whitebeard was his equal. Whats to stop Zoro from being Luffy's equal in the end?

Impel Down

So Luffy'll be the Kaizagou, Zoro will be the greatest swordsman, Sanji will be the greatest chef, Nami will be the best cartographer, Usopp will be the bravest warrior of the sea/greatest sniper, Chopper will be the world's greatest doctor, Robin will the best greatest archiologist, Franky will be the world's (2nd) greatest shipwright, and Brook will be the world's greatest musician. Yeah, we've heard it all before.

AD-HD Pirate

Sanji will be the greatest chef,

Nope. That is not Sanji's dream. He will find All Blue.

Impel Down

And when you find All Blue, you will have access to the greatest fish in all of the world, making you the greatest chef.

BlackGalleon1

@Impel:

So Luffy'll be the Kaizagou, Zoro will be the greatest swordsman, Sanji will be the greatest chef, Nami will be the best cartographer, Usopp will be the bravest warrior of the sea/greatest sniper, Chopper will be the world's greatest doctor, Robin will the best greatest archiologist, Franky will be the world's (2nd) greatest shipwright, and Brook will be the world's greatest musician. Yeah, we've heard it all before.

Dude, what are you talking about. The only two that want to be the greastest in their respactive fields are Zoro (Greatest Swordsman) and Luffy (Pirate King = Greatest Pirate). The others have dreams that are to do with their fields but not to be the greatest (one could go on to argue that Robin is already the greatest archeologist whilst Sanji, Franky, Nami, maybe Chopper, are already the greatest/2nd greatest in what they do).

Phenomenol

@BlackGalleon1:

What Mihawk said does not mean Luffy would have to be stronger than Zoro to be PK. Its just means there are more (and probably more challenging) obstacles than Mihawk himself. If it was about being the strongest then WB would be PK already. Infact, during the time Roger was PK, Whitebeard was his equal. Whats to stop Zoro from being Luffy's equal in the end?

Finally, someone who makes sense!

Ronaldinho

@BlackGalleon1:

What Mihawk said does not mean Luffy would have to be stronger than Zoro to be PK. Its just means there are more (and probably more challenging) obstacles than Mihawk himself. If it was about being the strongest then WB would be PK already. Infact, during the time Roger was PK, Whitebeard was his equal. Whats to stop Zoro from being Luffy's equal in the end?

I do agree that Zoro will be almost as strong as Luffy at the end. But I think that Luffy is going to be slightly stronger. If Zoro would be as strong as Luffy, he could be world strongest swordman and PK which would make him far superior than Luffy. Also, I don't think that WB and Mihawk are equal.

BlackGalleon1

@Ronaldinho:

I do agree that Zoro will be almost as strong as Luffy at the end. But I think that Luffy is going to be slightly stronger. If Zoro would be as strong as Luffy, he could be world strongest swordman and PK which would make him far superior than Luffy. Also, I don't think that WB and Mihawk are equal.

How would he be PK if Luffy is. If the title was to go to anyone it would be the captain of the crew that found One Piece, not the first mate who beat the Greatest Swordman and took the title (even if captain and first mate were equal in strength).

Ronaldinho

@BlackGalleon1:

How would he be PK if Luffy is. If the title was to go to anyone it would be the captain of the crew that found One Piece, not the first mate who beat the Greatest Swordman and took the title (even if captain and first mate were equal in strength).

No I mean when Zoro would have the desire to be both Pk and Greatest Swordman, he could have reached both of the titles if he is going to be as strong as Luffy at the end. To be PK, you have to be stronger than anyone else. So far, we don't know what advantage Roger had over WB. But if there is someone who is 100% equal to the PK, than the title itself would be lame.

SabZ

@Impel:

So Luffy'll be the Kaizagou, Zoro will be the greatest swordsman, Sanji will be the greatest chef, Nami will be the best cartographer, Usopp will be the bravest warrior of the sea/greatest sniper, Chopper will be the world's greatest doctor, Robin will the best greatest archiologist, Franky will be the world's (2nd) greatest shipwright, and Brook will be the world's greatest musician. Yeah, we've heard it all before.

If you're talking about dreams… then some of them aren't about best. Robin will find Rio Poneglyph, Sanji will find All Blue, Nami will draw a map of the Grand Line, Franky will be the best shipwright. I think Luffy's PK status will last longer than Roger's, making Luffy the best PK ever, with the best ship ever... thus the best shipwright ever. And I think Brook's dream will be more than just music.

But all these accomplished dreams make them the best.

ONEinchPUNCH

@Ronaldinho:

No I mean when Zoro would have the desire to be both Pk and Greatest Swordman, he could have reached both of the titles if he is going to be as strong as Luffy at the end. To be PK, you have to be stronger than anyone else. So far, we don't know what advantage Roger had over WB. But if there is someone who is 100% equal to the PK, than the title itself would be lame.

Matching the PK in a fight doesn't make the title any worse. PK has the strength of the strongest person out there (whitebeard) but he also has the brains or whatever you want to call it. For adventuring, finding treasure and starting an era.

Whitebeard may have matched Roger in a fight but he doesn't seem to be very good at the other thing, since one piece still hasn't been found. The PK just gets the best of both worlds, strength and treasuring hunting and era changing skills.

SabZ

This post is deleted!

Angel emfrbl

Robin seems to be the ONLY remain Archeologist so naturally she would be the best…

Ronaldinho

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Matching the PK in a fight doesn't make the title any worse. PK has the strength of the strongest person out there (whitebeard) but he also has the brains or whatever you want to call it. For adventuring, finding treasure and starting an era.

Whitebeard may have matched Roger in a fight but he doesn't seem to be very good at the other thing, since one piece still hasn't been found. The PK just gets the best of both worlds, strength and treasuring hunting and era changing skills.

Well, I would agree with this but we don't know for sure if WB doesn't has the" brain". Also, when you match someone doesn't mean that it is impossible to beat the person you match. I think that Zoro will be almost as strong as Luffy at the end since his only function on the crew is to get stronger. But as you said, Whitebeard is the strongest person right now. He is stronger than Mihawk. Luffy's final opponent is going to be stronger than Mihawk.

Robin seems to be the ONLY remain Archeologist so naturally she would be the best…

I thought that there are archeologists in the other blues. But the best were probably all killed at Ohara.

ONEinchPUNCH

@Ronaldinho:

Well, I would agree with this but we don't know for sure if WB doesn't has the" brain".

I was using an example it's quite obvious he's lacking something, otherwise he would be the PK.

Also, when you match someone doesn't mean that it is impossible to beat the person you match.

He matched the roger, in other words they tied, roger an whitebeard were equal in strength.

I think that Zoro will be almost as strong as Luffy at the end since his only function on the crew is to get stronger.

I don't

But as you said, Whitebeard is the strongest person right now. He is stronger than Mihawk. Luffy's final opponent is going to be stronger than Mihawk.

Which changes what? Luffys opponents are always the stronger ones, it doesn't change the fact their equal.

DesertSpada

That's what makes finding out who's stronger than who in One Piece very difficult.

Archtyrant

Haha i hope this isn't gonna be one of those "power struggles" again..

Anyway I still think that Luffy would be the most powerful in the end. And if this means anything, I think facing stronger opponents DO mean you probably will become stronger than those who face lesser opponents. The experience gained from such a fight would be tremendous, thus this prepares your state of mind better for future challenges. But most of you probably won't agree anyway.

I think you don't exactly get to be Pirate King unless you've proven yourself to be the most powerful among all the pirates, that is, be the Strongest Man In The World. You can say that Roger and Whitebeard were evenly matched, but, as in those who argued in Mihawk's favour in Shanks vs Mihawk, this doesn't mean that Roger and Whitebeard were equal in strength.

Phenomenol

@Archtyrant:

Haha i hope this isn't gonna be one of those "power struggles" again..

Anyway I still think that Luffy would be the most powerful in the end. And if this means anything, I think facing stronger opponents DO mean you probably will become stronger than those who face lesser opponents. The experience gained from such a fight would be tremendous, thus this prepares your state of mind better for future challenges. But most of you probably won't agree anyway.

I think you don't exactly get to be Pirate King unless you've proven yourself to be the most powerful among all the pirates, that is, be the Strongest Man In The World. You can say that Roger and Whitebeard were evenly matched, but, as in those who argued in Mihawk's favour in Shanks vs Mihawk, this doesn't mean that Roger and Whitebeard were equal in strength.

Zoro has fought the strongest opponent out of ALL the SH's in Mihawk! Becoming PK does NOT make you the strongest pirate.

Radical jack

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Which changes what? Luffys opponents are always the stronger ones, it doesn't change the fact their equal.

Fact? what fact? where in the manga that its stated that there are in fact equal.also your saying that just because luffy beats stronger opponents that zoro can't beat that doesn't change that there equal?that doesn't sound right.There's still more odds in favor of luffy being stronger than the 2 being equal all Im saying is yeah they might end up being equal along the road but as of right now,nope.And even if luffy does end up stronger it does'nt kill zoro badass level

@phenomenol:and got his ass beat.Whats your point?

btw I didn't read the whole thread so forgive me if I missed points

Phenomenol

@Radical:

@phenomenol:and got his ass beat.Whats your point?

btw I didn't read the whole thread so forgive me if I missed points

Mihawk EMBARRASED both Luffy and Zoro, which showed they were equal.

Luffy facing Stronger opponents means nothing, because Zoro is able to defeat them as well. I could argue that Daz Boness (Luffy's walking weakness) would kill Luffy. Opponents don't matter the fact is that they both grow from fights equally.

FireFistAce 0

@Phenomenol:

Zoro has fought the strongest opponent out of ALL the SH's in Mihawk! Becoming PK does NOT make you the strongest pirate.

If the Pirate King could be defeated by anyone, then it would obviously mean that the title was a joke title. Stated from the 2nd chapter of the Manga, the Pirate King is unsurpassed in Wealth, Fame, and Power. Only one person could tie the previous Pirate King, and that's Whitebeard, currently the World's Strongest, NOT Mihawk, currently the World's Strongest Swordsman.

Even after 22 years of being the World's Strongest, Whitebeard is not Pirate King, indicating that he is lacking "Ultimate" status. if Luffy is to achieve this by the end of One Piece, it means he will surpass Zoro. They may still tie in strength, but Luffy will be superior.

Phenomenol

@Fire Fist:

If the Pirate King could be defeated by anyone, then it would obviously mean that the title was a joke title. Stated from the 2nd chapter of the Manga, the Pirate King is unsurpassed in Wealth, Fame, and Power. Only one person could tie the previous Pirate King, and that's Whitebeard, currently the World's Strongest, NOT Mihawk, currently the World's Strongest Swordsman.

Even after 22 years of being the World's Strongest, Whitebeard is not Pirate King, indicating that he is lacking "Ultimate" status. if Luffy is to achieve this by the end of One Piece, it means he will surpass Zoro. They may still tie in strength, but Luffy will be superior.

I am only talking in terms of STRENGTH!! Noone said that Pirate King makes you the strongest. Even Mihawk himself didn't mean that.