It's literally impossible for there to be backwards compatibility of any kind. It's a completely different architecture. You might as well hope your new Android tablet can run native iOS apps. The only way you're going to play a Wii U game on the Switch is if they take the time to port the game code and re-release it.
The Nintendo Thread
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Everyone who compares the NX to the Wii U fails to understand what the Wii U actually was about.
There I said it.
Isn't early to be comparing them I mean the only similarity are their controllers and that's about it.
The upshot is that with one system to develop for, Nintendo won't spread their heavy-hitters across two systems.
If they drop support for the 3DS in favor of the Switch they'd still be putting out Mario, Metroid, & Zelda games on mobile platforms…...provided they don't get discouraged and pull the plug on that idea.
Two screens has been Nintendo's thing for a while now and I'm sad to see it go, but with the Wii U tanking and the 3DS doing okay but not great,
The 3DS is doing fine especially when compared to how it was doing when it first launched back in 2011.
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Switch looks cool.
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Any illusion of this being a decent product was just basically dashed.
Not exactly surprised, but certainly disappointed beyond belief. Relevant quote:
@Some:
The main function of the Nintendo Switch Dock is to provide an output to the TV, as well as charging and providing power to the system
Okay, so yeah. I'm sorry but I'm not going to mince words: the Nintendo Switch, down to its name, is nothing but a fucking marketing scam. Ladies and gentlemen, the Switch is literally just a tablet. It has awkward-as-shit controller add-ons that stick on the side, so they call it a portable. It has a charging dock that has HDMI output, so they call it a console. It is neither. At the end of the day it's just a fancy locked-down tablet that plays games. With no additional performance-enhancing hardware, the specs make it look at best like a shitty attempt to make a portable Wii U that leverages none of the Wii U's innovative assets. I am super annoyed. Like, I absolutely don't want to buy one of these and have the thing, the insult to my intelligence, taking up space in my room. They're going to have to show truly mind-blowing performance compared to the Wii U and completely convince me about Splatoon being slick on it before I even consider dishing out money. Fuck Nintendo. If this is the only platform I'll be able to play their new games on, they can go shove those games up their clueless asses. Thank god Zelda is launching on Wii U. Not that I'm anywhere close to convinced they know what they're doing with that, either.
Oh and I will now be referring to the abomination exclusively as the Nintendo Bait-and-Switch.
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Guess I'll be sitting on Wii U as well. Sucks because Switch _looks_ so cool.
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None of the latest news changed my mind. It still has great potential IMO.
I think it will be powerful enough for my standard.
If the battery can last at least 3 hours, I'll be completely sold on that concept. -
Yeah… after reading that article Foolio posted I'm definitely way more skeptical about the Switch. I love the idea, but all hopes of playing current gen quality games on the Switch have pretty much been destroyed especially after seeing the devkit's specs. I'm not saying that we won't get good games out of this, but I can see that third party support dying quickly a year after launch which would basically leave Nintendo on the same spot it's on now.
I'm definitely buying it day one for sure though. The experience of being able to play games on the go is something I've always wanted and preferred, but my hope for its success is waning after the info I've received so far.
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Any illusion of this being a decent product was just basically dashed.
Not exactly surprised, but certainly disappointed beyond belief. Relevant quote:
Okay, so yeah. I'm sorry but I'm not going to mince words: the Nintendo Switch, down to its name, is nothing but a fucking marketing scam. Ladies and gentlemen, the Switch is literally just a tablet. It has awkward-as-shit controller add-ons that stick on the side, so they call it a portable. It has a charging dock that has HDMI output, so they call it a console. It is neither. At the end of the day it's just a fancy locked-down tablet that plays games. With no additional performance-enhancing hardware, the specs make it look at best like a shitty attempt to make a portable Wii U that leverages none of the Wii U's innovative assets. I am super annoyed. Like, I absolutely don't want to buy one of these and have the thing, the insult to my intelligence, taking up space in my room. They're going to have to show truly mind-blowing performance compared to the Wii U and completely convince me about Splatoon being slick on it before I even consider dishing out money. Fuck Nintendo. If this is the only platform I'll be able to play their new games on, they can go shove those games up their clueless asses. Thank god Zelda is launching on Wii U. Not that I'm anywhere close to convinced they know what they're doing with that, either.
Oh and I will now be referring to the abomination exclusively as the Nintendo Bait-and-Switch.
Saying this as someone who has been really, REALLY cynical about Nintendo lately:
I'm sorry, but how exactly is this a bait and switch? What I got from their video is exactly what it is; the Nintendo Switch is essentially a tablet designed specifically for games, that can also be plugged into the TV to give more of a console experience. I mean, if you don't like it, that's fine, I'm not completely sold on the idea myself, but at no point did their teaser try to claim that the dock would give extra power, or anything other than what it is. All of that came from people making predictions and assumptions, not Nintendo. The whole "it's a console AND a handheld!" idea is basically marketing speak, but is it really a lie? Technically speaking, it CAN act as both. Sure, it's a tablet when it comes down to it, but the advertised purpose isn't somehow compromised because of that. Leave it on the dock and grab a controller, and it's no different from a console - or, take it out of the dock and play on it like a tablet or handheld.
Don't get me wrong; this could still easily suck, and be as much of a failure if not more so than the Wii U if Nintendo doesn't pull it off right. We still don't really know the specs (not confirmed anyway, at least from what I've seen), so it could definitely still suck in that regard. We also don't know how good it's online capabilities are, or what else it can do besides playing games (if that matters to you, and it seems to matter to a lot of people, so it is significant). We also don't know for sure if a dual screen experience is possible (maybe there's a way it can communicate with the dock without being docked itself?), and if it's not, then a lot of what set apart the Wii U is lost.
I'm very much hesitant about the idea, but nothing in that article contradicts what Nintendo showed of the system. If you still don't like the idea, that's fine, but acting like this is a "bait and switch" and saying "fuck Nintendo" because you thought it would be something it's not seems kind of silly to me.
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Yeah, if the bay did increase performance, game development would still be limited by playability on the tablet. They couldn't just make games that ran on console only and such.
Even considering tablet mode, only, the thing can play Skyrim, meaning that its power has to be around that of the PS3 at least, which is pretty impressive for something portable.
Downsides are that current gen content will probably not port well, limiting 3rd party support, and the console ends up being vastly underpowered compared to any computers. It's not like the PS4 or Xboner, though, compare favorably to computer gaming, either, and Nintendo's style and games never really needed more power. Plus, it's Nintendo, and at this point whoever was loyal enough to buy the Wii U probably didn't really give a shit if the new console was going to be any good, so long as Nintendo still kept its IPs hostage. I'm not gonna condemn complaining about it, since I have and I will, but if any straw was going to break the cliché's back, it would have been the Wii U, and I bought it anyways, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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Saying this as someone who has been really, REALLY cynical about Nintendo lately:
I'm sorry, but how exactly is this a bait and switch? What I got from their video is exactly what it is; the Nintendo Switch is essentially a tablet designed specifically for games, that can also be plugged into the TV to give more of a console experience. I mean, if you don't like it, that's fine, I'm not completely sold on the idea myself, but at no point did their teaser try to claim that the dock would give extra power, or anything other than what it is. All of that came from people making predictions and assumptions, not Nintendo. The whole "it's a console AND a handheld!" idea is basically marketing speak, but is it really a lie? Technically speaking, it CAN act as both. Sure, it's a tablet when it comes down to it, but the advertised purpose isn't somehow compromised because of that. Leave it on the dock and grab a controller, and it's no different from a console - or, take it out of the dock and play on it like a tablet or handheld.
Don't get me wrong; this could still easily suck, and be as much of a failure if not more so than the Wii U if Nintendo doesn't pull it off right. We still don't really know the specs (not confirmed anyway, at least from what I've seen), so it could definitely still suck in that regard. We also don't know how good it's online capabilities are, or what else it can do besides playing games (if that matters to you, and it seems to matter to a lot of people, so it is significant). We also don't know for sure if a dual screen experience is possible (maybe there's a way it can communicate with the dock without being docked itself?), and if it's not, then a lot of what set apart the Wii U is lost.
I'm very much hesitant about the idea, but nothing in that article contradicts what Nintendo showed of the system. If you still don't like the idea, that's fine, but acting like this is a "bait and switch" and saying "fuck Nintendo" because you thought it would be something it's not seems kind of silly to me.
I think you're talking my joke name a little too literally; I wasn't really trying to say they're pulling a texbook bait-and-switch, it's just a little pun (and can abbreviate conveniently to Nintendo BS).
Anyway I wouldn't say they're overtly lying but it's very, very misleading to call it a hybrid (which is the often-used term to describe it now, which has been floating around for months due to rumors, even if Nintendo might not have officially used that word yet?), because hybrid implies it actually has two distinct modes of operation, not just "plugged into TV and unplugged from TV." Almost any modern portable device can output video; hell my phone FIVE YEARS AGO had mini-HDMI out, but it was still a phone, not a hybrid media device. It would also sync via bluetooth with controllers, but it wasn't a hybrid portable gaming device. And I find it very line-treading to have dinky attachable buttons.
Like, they just had this trailer and haven't said much of anything really, so in that sense maybe I'm getting slightly ahead of myself, but it seems clear that the case they're making is for a single device that can satisfy console and portable gaming needs. I think that's some marketing BS. I don't think it has a place alongside actual consoles at all. And might barely have a place as a portable, because let's be honest it looks awkward as hell and the battery life can't possibly be very good.
Yeah, if the bay did increase performance, game development would still be limited by playability on the tablet. They couldn't just make games that ran on console only and such.
It's not that hard to code the games to take advantage of extra resources when available. They're already doing that with their New 3DS. In portable mode it would just render in lower quality, lower resolution, and game-specific tuning such as draw distance and whatever else. The goal would be something that looks pretty damn great on a big TV and still decent on the smaller 720p screen.
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As a lifelong Nintendo loyalist, I'm sure I'll pick up the Switch at some point. That said, it may not be launch date, like I did with the Wii U and attempted to do with Wii.
Granted, part of that is because I have a pretty big backlog of games that I'm trying to get through, but…I dunno. The Switch seems kind of cumbersome.
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Just play at home like everyone else.
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https://mynintendonews.com/2016/10/21/earthbound-fan-puts-his-entire-collection-on-ebay-for-10000/
If anyone has $10,000 to spend lol
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I'm … I'm dead. My wallet will be dead. MY LIFE WHAT IS IT.
D: I already convinced myself to NOT get the new Skyrim for the PS4, damn it! WHAT NONSENSE IS THIS, NINTENDO.
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Just play at home like everyone else.
You mean buy a possibly $300 device that offers less features than the Wii U to play games that are hardly a step forward in any way whatsoever? Sounds like a waste of money.
The way I see it the only thing that can redeem this for Nintendo is having a quality software lineup. And considering the only thing we've seen are ports, beta trailers and a game ALSO coming out on Wii U, I don't see the point at all.
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At least there is no mandatory evil camera.
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Any illusion of this being a decent product was just basically dashed.
Not exactly surprised, but certainly disappointed beyond belief. Relevant quote:
Okay, so yeah. I'm sorry but I'm not going to mince words: the Nintendo Switch, down to its name, is nothing but a fucking marketing scam. Ladies and gentlemen, the Switch is literally just a tablet. It has awkward-as-shit controller add-ons that stick on the side, so they call it a portable. It has a charging dock that has HDMI output, so they call it a console. It is neither. At the end of the day it's just a fancy locked-down tablet that plays games. With no additional performance-enhancing hardware, the specs make it look at best like a shitty attempt to make a portable Wii U that leverages none of the Wii U's innovative assets. I am super annoyed. Like, I absolutely don't want to buy one of these and have the thing, the insult to my intelligence, taking up space in my room. They're going to have to show truly mind-blowing performance compared to the Wii U and completely convince me about Splatoon being slick on it before I even consider dishing out money. Fuck Nintendo. If this is the only platform I'll be able to play their new games on, they can go shove those games up their clueless asses. Thank god Zelda is launching on Wii U. Not that I'm anywhere close to convinced they know what they're doing with that, either.
Oh and I will now be referring to the abomination exclusively as the Nintendo Bait-and-Switch.
Like, I absolutely don't want to buy one of these and have the thing, the insult to my intelligence, taking up space in my room.
yo trust me, you don't have to worry about nintendo insulting your intelligence, you're doing a good enough job yourself by throwing a hissy fit over a 3 minute reveal trailer and one article that basically says "hey we managed to condense a dedicated game console into tablet for". maybe chill out for a bit until the actual system comes out or we get more detailed specs before acting like this is the worst thing in gaming history.
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People in this thread acting like in a post-Wii world, Nintendo consoles are something we buy for the specs.
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I thought that the switch would have the functionalities of the Wii U. What is the spec difference betweem Wii U and Switch?
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If the hardware is not compatible with Wii U or 3DS titles then even with a VC download it would be impossible to play them.
It's literally impossible for there to be backwards compatibility of any kind. It's a completely different architecture. You might as well hope your new Android tablet can run native iOS apps. The only way you're going to play a Wii U game on the Switch is if they take the time to port the game code and re-release it.
If that's the case, then I would have to wait for a re-release for one of the games I listed, if they choose to (other than Splatoon and maybe Pokken). That really sucks because the Switch looks cool and I find playing Nintendo games in 1080p (60 fps, maybe) on the go pretty awesome. Oh well, at least Breath of the Wild, a new Mario 64/Galaxy esque game and Project Sonic 2017 (even though I'm getting it for PS4) will be on it.
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At least there is no mandatory evil camera.
That's a low bar you have there
yo trust me, you don't have to worry about nintendo insulting your intelligence, you're doing a good enough job yourself by throwing a hissy fit over a 3 minute reveal trailer and one article that basically says "hey we managed to condense a dedicated game console into tablet for". maybe chill out for a bit until the actual system comes out or we get more detailed specs before acting like this is the worst thing in gaming history.
This is coming from someone involved in the gaming industry:
What to you is a hissy fit is a real concern to others. The success or failure of this console has repercussions across the industry in that it affects Nintendo's role within it, a role that has always been to pursue sideways approaches to the gaming market instead of just competing for graphics.
In this situation, we are talking about Nintendo taking an angle that puts it behind competing consoles AND behind competing hardware when it comes to the mobile market. Ever thought why they didn't want to reveal this too early? Because the obvious result from this is that tablets will try to mimick that controller set up and therefore effectively render this thing useless. Because really, that is the only thing that is currently setting it apart aside from exclusive Nintendo software. WHICH, if you haven't been paying attention has been rather lackluster this past year.So yea, in the sense that Nintendo is breaking a strong legacy of consistently delivering new experiences, seeing them falter when justifying this one after faltering for four years in convincing people about their previous one… it's a dangerous prospect and will without a doubt change the outlook of the market and how mobile gaming and console games go from here.
What I'm getting at is that when you come in here and reduce a thorough evaluation of what the NS ACTUALLY is there is only one individual that comes off like a condescending piece of stupid, and that's you. IF it is the case that your feelings are not as strong because perhaps you disagree or don't find video games to be that important to you, then there are ways to kindly express that and it's conversation that's worth having; definitely much more useful than starting your post by being a dickbag. I myself am still not even convinced you understand what is being said.
People in this thread acting like in a post-Wii world, Nintendo consoles are something we buy for the specs.
While this is accurate, even keeping in mind that the expectation was that the NS would be less powerful than the PS4 and the Xbone, the current implied set-up is still a huge step back, in that the power of the machine fails to justify new hardware, particularly one that will be obsolete even faster than the Wii U was graphics-wise. So it's a minimal capacity update that also removes previous features.
Selling a console with very little technical improvement, that removes input options and features that the previous one had, that also steps into the territory of a handheld that ALSO has more features and input options… it's a very ballsy move, and I myself find it hard to justify ~$300. Software will have to be REALLY REALLY good to get people to make that investment, particularly considering that it's not unlikely devs will prefer to develop for more powerful consoles that offer more options and an established user base.
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I thought the Nintendo rage was saved for e3 seasonI myself am probably not going to be taking advantage of its "on the go" function so strictly, because….well I committ on the NYC subway, it just screams "pls steal me". Definitely would use it on road trips though.
Then there's the line-up. I would like a good line-up to justify even thinking of purchasing it on launch, y'know? Mario Bros U, Nintendoland, and last gen ports weren't exactly enticing me back in 2012.
-Zelda is one thing, but that's going to Wii U as well....talk about a rock and a hard place.
-new 3D Mario(?) is a plus.
-MK8 port...yeeeeeh.....it would have to bring a lot of new stuff while also not being super expensive? Not very likely, but....I dunno.
-Splatoon 2 is also a plus. Splatoon port/1.5.....again, same deal as above.I really don't want to start getting all negative so soon, but I am being cautious all the same. As for backwards compability....shrug all the more reason for me to keep my Wii U. It sucks, but I don't exactly have an alternative.
/2cents
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Wii U's launch lineup was shit, and its gimmick, though some liked it, was an obstacle in between me and Nintendo's games. I still payed $300 for it.
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Why is it that when Foolio comes in throwing some pretty relevant and valid points, someone tries to box it under: Why so serious, Fool-io? The BoTW analysis was spot on; that it was just an engine exposition. Seeing the N(B)S as a tablet with controllers on the side might be an oversimplification given the trailer and limited information we have on the new conso-held device. However it is a pretty valid simplification to make. We might be swayed by the practicality of the Switch, but as Nokanqy mentioned what is stopping other companies of doing the same. Pretty much the Nintendo Seal would be the only thing Nintendo would be going for. I stopped acquiring Nintendo products after the Gamecube, and a friend gave me a Wii he never used, so I'm out of sync with the ups/downs and overall scene. However the mobility of the switch should be the most basic of the specs they have in store. Nintendo has not been one for graphics, so their [out of the box] ideas have to be what drives the N(B)S, not the mobility. I have a laptop, not too heavy and a controller. How are they going to ~convince~ me to use their machine instead of: not caring about having their games, and using the money to buy a cheaper Wii U.
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Wii U's launch lineup was shit, and its gimmick, though some liked it, was an obstacle in between me and Nintendo's games. I still payed $300 for it.
At launch?
I'm probably just kidding myself: I've had a nasty habit of buying video game stuff and letting my impulses drive me. Still….I would like try to be practical this time lol.
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Then there's the line-up. I would like a good line-up to justify even thinking of purchasing it on launch, y'know? Mario Bros U, Nintendoland, and last gen ports weren't exactly enticing me back in 2012.
That was the main reason I chose to buy a PS3 instead of the Wii U. Then The Wonderful 101, Wind Waker HD and Bayonetta happened…
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At launch?
I'm probably just kidding myself: I've had a nasty habit of buying video game stuff and letting my impulses drive me. Still….I would like try to be practical this time lol.
Nah, I didn't buy at launch, haha. I doubt I'll buy this one at launch either. Buying at launch seems premature.
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Nah, I didn't buy at launch, haha. I doubt I'll buy this one at launch either. Buying at launch seems premature.
lol.
Come to think of it…..yeah, I've never done that with a Nintendo console. (or any)
-N64 I don't really remember when I got it.
-Gamecube I got it the Christmas in the year it came out, but that was a month after launch.
-Wii was definitely a few months after its launch, because I remember playing it first at my cousin's and being jealous.
-fast forward to the Wii U. Debated in November 2012, I got it May 2014. ....actually, looking at the dates, it came out exactly 11 years after the Gamecube. Same month and day! -
I was buying Nintendo consoles at launch from the moment I had spending money up until the Wii. So really just Gamecube, GBA, GBA SP, DS and Wii. Getting Gamecube at launch was a particularly phenomenal idea and to this day I remember how much use that purple cube saw from the moment I got it up until the Wii.
When the 3DS came out there were no games I was interested in, but then with the price drop and Mario Kart 7 release I finally went in and am happy with it. Same with the Wii U, I kept distant from it up until the moment they revealed in a direct all the upcoming games and offers, at which point I got it and used it primarily for Netflix until Earthbound VC, Wind Waker HD and Pikmin 3 led the wave of actual software to play.
Nowadays, I think the Wii U does have its faults but as a whole I really really like the utility of the gamepad. Pikmin 3 sold me on it the most, and things like Splatoon reinforced just how useful having two dedicated screens can be, much like the DS did.
I do not look forward to going back from gyroscope aiming, segmented spaces for equipment and maps, and clunkier multitasking. -
I mean don't get me wrong, it's still looking to be beefy by tablet standards. I'm not saying that it will be no better than an iPad with a plastic peripheral, because clearly it's being targeted toward gaming, not being light-weight and general use. But that doesn't change what it fundamentally is. Actual detailed specs aside, it's the concept itself that really irks me. Nintendo is known for taking risks and innovating (both in hardware and software), and that's supposed to be why they get a free pass on not really being up to modern standards (both in hardware and implementation, by which I mean things like online gaming and account management). So it really disappoints me when their new, secretive, cutting-edge industry-revolutionizing invention is a tablet with handles and a video out port. Like I'm sorry, that's not a genius move that suddenly fuses home and mobile gaming masterfully. That doesn't justify the awkward amalgamation of peripherals and knick knacks that collectively form a vision much weaker than anything in the past, and also does not justify the dissolution of everything the Wii U had going for it.
I keep bringing up Splatoon and I think it's a great example because I cannot imagine playing Splatoon without the second screen. It's vital to always know the status of the map (without cluttering the UI) and being able to select a teammate to warp to at moment's notice. I want to see how they think they can tackle that. Furthermore, the gyroscopic aiming is absolutely crucial. And for a game where you're constantly turning your camera, often dramatically and abruptly, I want to know how they think that is doable in portable mode. I kind of have to be able to see the screen while I do it. So like I said, if they have some genius unrevealed card that will convince me that gameplay did not suffer, then great.
Also it's important to remember that while having the latest and greatest specs does not necessarily carry importance, having good enough specs for developers' visions definitely does. That's where 3rd party support crumbles, and it would be foolish to act like it hasn't ever been an impediment. There are plenty of games where it's either been openly stated, or is just plainly obvious, that with some better hardware they could have done awesome things. Even looking at Xenoblade Chronicles X, an amazing game, you can see the places where the massive world made compromises. Or for a perhaps apt example, let's look at how Ice Climbers didn't make it into Smash 4. Because they were trying to make it run on both a console version and portable version, and one of them just couldn't quite handle the extra load.
And lastly, a true hybrid system is such an exciting prospect that it's frustrating to hear how they blew such a great idea. I mean imagine how a modular design like that could allow for different pricing tiers depending on how much you care about performance. Imagine if instead of releasing a brand new $400 mid-generation hardware revision like the PS4 Neo (or hell let's look at Nintendo and mention the DSi or New 3DS), you could simply put out an upgraded base station for half the price to those who want it. You could embrace or avoid the possibility of games that only run on the upgraded version, but it's not like that would be a first for Nintendo either given that the two above examples had exclusives. There were also N64 games that only ran on the memory Expansion Pack. I think THAT is what would have pushed the industry. Made people think. In an age where we complain that consoles are kind of bullshit given the widespread availability of affordable computers, where people are actively trying to find a new solution such as Steam with its flexible Steam Machines, this would have been the place to push some real hybrid innovation.
So yeah. You can be in denial or believe in unicorns, whatever. Or maybe you really actually think what we know about the NBS is actually compelling, and if so good for you. But it's not like I'm not thinking things through.
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tbh the thing that compels me most about the Switch is not having a gamepad.
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The biggest thing I loved about the Gamepad was off-tv play. I will never not love being able to watch muh cartoons while hitting people in Smash.
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So what is the ideal release of this?
A Wii U that is portable?
In regards of splatoon, how big does the second screen need to be? What if…the switch has three screens. Seeing as how things attach and dettach, maybe there is a monitor add on? Would this just piss everyone off, if you need to buy a 60-100$ extra monitor to play certain games?
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@Tamiel:
So what is the ideal release of this?
A Wii U that is portable?
In regards of splatoon, how big does the second screen need to be? What if…the switch has three screens. Seeing as how things attach and dettach, maybe there is a monitor add on? Would this just piss everyone off, if you need to buy a 60-100$ extra monitor to play certain games?
Well, based on what they revealed one of my hopes was that the principle of the Wii U remained while indeed crossing the line into making it an actual portable device as well. When that wasn't the case, there was at least the hope of stuff like foo said where they could have had the dock itself add sufficient power to the system to actually justifiably call it a console. And then it really would be super easy in that you could across years offer hundred dollar upgrades to that core dock without having to re-do the platform or re-release it every 2-3 years like Sony and Microsoft are doing with Scorpio and Pro.
For the other question, I think having extra add-ons would just highlight even more the absurdity of a system that has its own screen AND can use the TV screen to fail to use both at the same time. I doubt many people will want that set up, much less pay for it.
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@Tamiel:
So what is the ideal release of this?
A Wii U that is portable?
Maybe sort of? I mean in portable mode the NBS already resembles a Gamepad, just dumber-looking. So yeah ideally it would contain enough internals to run the titles on its own, albeit with reduced visuals in some capacity, but the main base unit would boost it to respectable performance levels when connected. Of course it would also be much more capable spec-wise than the Wii U. And hell if it makes Wagomu happy why not just have a requirement that all games have to support standard controllers. They already showed a "Switch Pro Controller" in the demo that I imagine most self-respecting gamers will buy.
@Tamiel:
In regards of splatoon, how big does the second screen need to be? What if…the switch has three screens. Seeing as how things attach and dettach, maybe there is a monitor add on? Would this just piss everyone off, if you need to buy a 60-100$ extra monitor to play certain games?
But why would I want more expensive add-ons to keep track of when I have a perfectly good, ample 720p display that's just being completely wasted by sitting in a charging station? How about letting me use it as the second screen and just having a cable connect it to the base. But from a conceptual standpoint what you're saying is kind of interesting. Not sure it could be too small and still useful though.
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I'm certainly interested in the capabilities of the NS, though I do have my share of worries.
Pros:
*Pure flexibility, playing where you want at any time.
*Beefy games on the go, hopefully without performance issues for things like Skyrim (should that really come out, Bethesda said it's not final).
*Traditionally portable games like Pokemon, Kirby and FE in HD and on the TV; I think everyone's asked for a mainline Pokemon title in console form least once.
*Local multiplayer practically being built in, at least for games with simpler controls.
*Having VC games consolidated on a system that can play both portably and on the big screen, all with traditional controls, would be a dream come true, ESPECIALLY if GCN games are added.Cons:
*Storage space is not likely to be great; rumors of 32GB internal storage are worrying, and it probably won't get the benefit of 500GB+ external hard drives if it's being carried around. If 128GB SD cards are the current limit, besides being just as/more expensive, it may very well not be enough to support many full retail downloads.
*Likely no support for Wii and Wii U games with no sensor bar, camera, touch screen in TV mode and possibly no gyro controls.
*The benefits for portable gaming become a bottleneck for console gaming; no telling if we'll get anything like what the PS4 or XB1 get.
*The probable high price point will really hurt games that require more than one system for multiplayer, such as Pokemon. -
Well, based on what they revealed one of my hopes was that the principle of the Wii U remained while indeed crossing the line into making it an actual portable device as well. When that wasn't the case, there was at least the hope of stuff like foo said where they could have had the dock itself add sufficient power to the system to actually justifiably call it a console. And then it really would be super easy in that you could across years offer hundred dollar upgrades to that core dock without having to re-do the platform or re-release it every 2-3 years like Sony and Microsoft are doing with Scorpio and Pro.
For the other question, I think having extra add-ons would just highlight even more the absurdity of a system that has its own screen AND can use the TV screen to fail to use both at the same time. I doubt many people will want that set up, much less pay for it.
1st paragraph: that makes sense. Having the dock work as an expansion system would probably save them some money. Too bad this route was not taken. The 2-3 year lifetime of consoles has always been a bummer. It is almost like there is a fear that if somethong new is not released, then they would lose buyers. I mean I get the why's and technology improving constantly. I guess it might be too late now, I guess the Steam machines are more in line woth that, although I am not sure how much you can tweak those.
2nd paragraph: Absurd is pretty much my middle name. However, the add on would come into play when using portable mode. It is highly unlikely, I was just thinking on how tablets users have keyboard docks and wondered if the same principle could be applied here. It could be as simple as the system already having two screens, much like the DS. But with 6 months for launch this would be highly unlikely
So the portable side will not be able to handle some UI like the DS or Wii U did.Another "fake solution" would be that the dock is for charging, etc on thenother functionalities, but that players have a wireless/wired adapter that allows you to connect to other monitors without the need of the dock.
Maybe sort of? I mean in portable mode the NBS already resembles a Gamepad, just dumber-looking. So yeah ideally it would contain enough internals to run the titles on its own, albeit with reduced visuals in some capacity, but the main base unit would boost it to respectable performance levels when connected. Of course it would also be much more capable spec-wise than the Wii U. And hell if it makes Wagomu happy why not just have a requirement that all games have to support standard controllers. They already showed a "Switch Pro Controller" in the demo that I imagine most self-respecting gamers will buy.
But why would I want more expensive add-ons to keep track of when I have a perfectly good, ample 720p display that's just being completely wasted by sitting in a charging station? How about letting me use it as the second screen and just having a cable connect it to the base. But from a conceptual standpoint what you're saying is kind of interesting. Not sure it could be too small and still useful though.
Absolutely, it was mostly for the portable part of the system. I guess the question is if the handheld part will have a hdmi output for my fake solution. I understand the frustration though. This concept has potential, especially coming from Nintendo. However, it is impossible to not see the clear obstacles ahead for the system. Like I said mobility should be priority 3. The innovative functionality I have seen since the Wii is what needs to come out strong.
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I think it's best to recognize the Switch as the in-between of console and portable play. What may be considered a 'worse console' is also a 'better handheld'. It isn't really a worse console, tho, since its specs are good enough to play Wii U games
If you're wondering who that even appeals to, see: everyone who owns a tablet. The idea clearly resonates, judging by the positive reception to the unveiling. As far as why a tru gamr should care, tho, what's there to say? It's got Nintendo games. It's a console, so it's not better than a PC, but what really is when it comes to games?
If there's anything to be skeptical of, it's whether or not Nintendo is going to gear towards casual audiences again, since it seems like that's where the appeal lies.
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See, but you keep saying what pissed foo off in the first place and what exists as the main marketing lie in all of this.
THE NS IS NOT A CONSOLE.
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Also, if there's any part that's a scam, it's that the thing is going to come bundled with all those parts. Someone using this as a console only isn't going to want to pay for portable peripherals, and someone who's only going to use it as a tablet is going to have to foot the bill of the dock, anyways. I hope they release packages geared towards those two people for a lower price point.
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See, but you keep saying what pissed foo off in the first place and what exists as the main marketing lie in all of this.
THE NS IS NOT A CONSOLE.
That's kind of semantic at this point.
If they sell this with a price inflated for its functionality, then you may have a point, but I don't think most people who are enamored by the concept really care about its power classification more than 'it plays modern Nintendo games, doesn't have a weird gimmick that directly gets in the way of things, and it's portable, so I can be antisocial with it at parties.' I've seen more people on my Facebook hyped about the portable capabilities than anything else, so in that case, the fact that it's a console doesn't even come into play, except in that it is high power. Plus, remember that the launch price of the 3DS was $250, so if this thing is $300, like you posited earlier, then it's a pretty relatively fair deal?
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$300 is indeed the price I'm assuming for it to be competitive, considering the 3DS and the Wii U pricings and how those worked. I'd also say they need to bundle something with it.
And I don't disagree that ultimately the software and the experience will sell it. But what it actually is in terms of power and capabilities matter A FUCKTON when it comes to the longevity of the system. If its spec are already outdated before it even releases, nothing stops competing tablets to simply make a gaming-dedicated tablet with controller dongles and with more power and larger platforms like steam compatible with it.
That affects developer support, which affects how much content people can actually have access to and it affects the value of the system after its release.
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So the NS isn't a console, but it's also not a convenient portable. The people who liked the Wii U pad will probably like the NS, and the people who want to game on TV will use it for that purpose.
That leaves out people who rely on ultra-portable pocket gaming devices… which makes me wonder if Nintendo will release a 3ds successor after all.
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no second gameplay screen while playing on TV it seems.
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Well that pretty much settles it. Way to lose toes. They basically are making an Apple move, make it so your hardware is pretty much only compatible with your own stuff. Don't get me wrong, but what is the point of "switching" if at the end of thebday you still need both sets for the full experience. To expand, let's say i am going on a road trip, rarely would i want to bring my consoles on a trip, there is so much risk of it getting bumbed/damage while travelling. Switch comes by and says: hey but you can take me! And that's cool…but what when i get to my destination, can I just plug in the thing to any TV? Probably not. Forcing you take carry the entire shit if you'd like to hook the handheld system to your hotel TV. I still find it hard to understand what is the plus side of replacing my laptop with N(B)S. The games...sure...
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I think the real question to ask is what does the dock contribute that just using an HDMI cable wouldn't? We really don't know much about the experience, other than that the dock is focused on charging and outputting. If it doesn't add anything, then HDMI out on the tablet would have been the better option.
I'm not really the target of the portable features, though, since I'm the kind of guy that mostly plays my 3DS at home, so I'm not sure what specs a person might want. A musician friend of mine said that he wanted to take it touring with him. Short trips and stuff where you don't need a computer more powerful than a smart phone seems to be the niche, which is a pretty big niche. Short-term travel, day trips, hangouts with friends, just choosing to lounge around a different part of your own house are probably what this thing targets. Of course, that's just with the assumption that it's a only a monitor with games and controllers. If it has a touch screen, and internet browsing, then it could easily aim for the tablet market, and make a splash due to the weight of Nintendo's IPs.
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I keep bringing up Splatoon and I think it's a great example because I cannot imagine playing Splatoon without the second screen. It's vital to always know the status of the map (without cluttering the UI) and being able to select a teammate to warp to at moment's notice. I want to see how they think they can tackle that. Furthermore, the gyroscopic aiming is absolutely crucial. And for a game where you're constantly turning your camera, often dramatically and abruptly, I want to know how they think that is doable in portable mode. I kind of have to be able to see the screen while I do it. So like I said, if they have some genius unrevealed card that will convince me that gameplay did not suffer, then great.
I feel like the fact that there are hundreds of shooters that control just fine on a standard twin-stick format ought to let know you know the gyro aiming isn't crucial. In splatoon specifically, the gyro disabling one axis of your control stick was terrible for me. If I'm gonna have gyro, then I want that in addition to my normal stick control, like how WWHD did it. and imo having a minimap showing the ink would be better than placing it on the gamepad, out of my line of sight. Again, many games have maps on their HUD and still manage to be fine. as for quick-jumping, how about mapping that to the D-pad, one direction for each teammate and a fourth for home? it's a better use than being able to spam the same vocal taunt over and over again.
I guess what I'm saying is, these all don't seem like insurmountable design hurdles to me.
@Tamiel:
but what when i get to my destination, can I just plug in the thing to any TV? Probably not. Forcing you take carry the entire shit if you'd like to hook the handheld system to your hotel TV.
Why wouldn't you be able to plug it into any TV that has an HDMI port? and it's not like the dock is that much bulkier than the tablet, neither of them are going in a pocket anyway - if you have room for the tablet, you can carry the dock, too.
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Splatoon at its best would have been a PC game, anyways.
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Why wouldn't you be able to plug it into any TV that has an HDMI port? and it's not like the dock is that much bulkier than the tablet, neither of them are going in a pocket anyway - if you have room for the tablet, you can carry the dock, too.
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I don't know if you can or not, it seems that to plug in to a TV you need the docking platform. The hdmi connection would have to be from the handheld part of the system, which then leaves the docking as a glorified charger if that is the case.
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it is true the dock does mot seem bulky it still occupies space though. Also my concern is, that during trips things can bang against each other. The tablet is flat-ish if you remove the controls, and you can store it in a tablet case, but you would have to carefully pack the docking platform. Also my point was not about that precisely. Yes, I can carry the dock everywhere if i want to, but…then what is the point? If i am Going to be carrying the entire thing, why not just make it a console. The mobility part should function independently from the dock, as in, it should be able to charge without it, and it should be able to plug and play to any tv without the dock. At least from my perspective, your dock should just stay at home(unless it also enhances the hardware, which also comes with some issues.), And you should be able to carry the tablet and play on a big screen without the console part.
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@Tamiel:
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I don't know if you can or not, it seems that to plug in to a TV you need the docking platform. The hdmi connection would have to be from the handheld part of the system, which then leaves the docking as a glorified charger if that is the case.
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it is true the dock does mot seem bulky it still occupies space though. Also my concern is, that during trips things can bang against each other. The tablet is flat-ish if you remove the controls, and you can store it in a tablet case, but you would have to carefully pack the docking platform. Also my point was not about that precisely. Yes, I can carry the dock everywhere if i. Carrying the tablet, but…then what is the point? If i. Going to be carrying the entire thing, why not just make it a console. The mobility part should function independently from the dock, as in, it should be able to charge without it, and it should be able to plug and play to any tv without the dock. At least from my perspective, your dock should just stay at home(unless it also enhances the hardware, which also comes with some issues.), And you should be able to carry the tablet and play on a big screen without the console part.
Going by the trailer, they intend for you to leave the dock at home, because when you're on-the-go you can just prop up the tablet by itself and play. That's their intended function.
But you want to take it with you to a place with a TV, and also presumably an HDMI cord, and also a charging cable because clearly you're in for a longer than 3 hour session, but bringing the dock is too much? If anything, that would make transport ideal - dock it, which protects the screen, then throw that biz in a bag. I'm just having trouble imagining a scenario where I both A. want to play on a big-screen TV away from my house and B. have no means of carrying the dock with me.
Though now that I think about it, more concerning for me would be if there's a way to charge it without the dock. I can imagine waiting at an airport, playing on the tablet, and I'd want to take that opportunity to plug in and play at the same time.
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Bringing the dock requires you to bring a power cord and HDMI cable, anyways, though, so it's necessarily an increase in space. It about volumetrically doubles the spatial load of the tablet, and is entirely rigid. I could easily fit clothing, toiletries, the table, and its cord in a backpack. I couldn't do that with the dock included, though.