As a guy who has absolutely no knowledge of Star Trek and was dragged along to watch the movie with friends, the movie was actually super fun.Really enjoy the character dynamics and the exploring of new environments. But it appears from the comments here that Star Trek is apparently supposed to be more than that. So, with that in mind, where should a new fan start exploring Star Trek?
Star Trek Franchise
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@Bond:
As a guy who has absolutely no knowledge of Star Trek and was dragged along to watch the movie with friends, the movie was actually super fun.Really enjoy the character dynamics and the exploring of new environments. But it appears from the comments here that Star Trek is apparently supposed to be more than that. So, with that in mind, where should a new fan start exploring Star Trek?
The Original Series and The Next Generation are both good series to start off with. Keep in mind though that TOS definitely suffers from outdated cheesiness, but a lot of it still holds up. Also, while TNG is a great show with more modern sensibilities, the first two seasons are pretty bad. So it depends on how much schlock you're willing to sit through for the good stuff.
Alternatively, if you want to check out more Star Trek movies, I'd recommend Wrath of Khan and The Voyage Home for TOS and First Contact for TNG.
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That's a pretty fair assessment. One thing about Star Trek series, you really don't have to watch them in any kind of order. Most of the episodes are fairly stand-alone, so you can search out what episodes are considered to be classics and watch those first.
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That's a pretty fair assessment. One thing about Star Trek series, you really don't have to watch them in any kind of order. Most of the episodes are fairly stand-alone, so you can search out what episodes are considered to be classics and watch those first.
Minus Deep Space Nine which is more interconnected.
I'd also recommend DS9 before TNG, but I'm the odd one out there. -_-' -
Saw it this weekend… it was definitely good and had a lot of great character moments. Also, I like the beats and shouting.
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Minus Deep Space Nine which is more interconnected. I'd also recommend DS9 before TNG, but I'm the odd one out there. -_-'
I enjoyed DS9, but honestly it has been so long since I've watched it that my memory is very hazy. I've probably watched every TNG episode multiple times over the years because they're just always playing on TV, but I haven't seen DS9 anywhere.
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DS9 is the best overall Trek series, but it's also a lesser Babylon 5. Next Gen is the next best though its first two seasons were weak. TOS and TAS are fine and have some really great stories and characters, but have aged really badly in terms of culture, effects, and attitudes towards women. Voyager was mostly a waste of potential, and Enterprise was okay in its final seasons but overall bad.
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DS9 is the best overall Trek series, but it's also a lesser Babylon 5. Next Gen is the next best though its first two seasons were weak. TOS and TAS are fine and have some really great stories and characters, but have aged really badly in terms of culture, effects, and attitudes towards women. Voyager was mostly a waste of potential, and Enterprise was okay in its final seasons but overall bad.
Another Babylon 5 fan You're a good man Robby.
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Tried to get into babylon 5 recently, but man is it hard to look past the cheap ass everything, story aside ofc. xD
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Tried to get into babylon 5 recently, but man is it hard to look past the cheap ass everything, story aside ofc. xD
One of the first shows ever to use CGI to that degree.
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Tried to get into babylon 5 recently, but man is it hard to look past the cheap ass everything, story aside ofc. xD
I'd hate to see you try to get through 60's-80's Doctor Who. XD
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I'd hate to see you try to get through 60's-80's Doctor Who. XD
It was already challenging to try to get through the first season of the new doctor series. xD
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It was already challenging to try to get through the first season of the new doctor series. xD
That's true, I forgot how cheesy the first couple of seasons's effects were. Now just imagine the equivalent of that with models, sets and costumes in the 60's. Star Trek actually looks great in comparison.
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That's true, I forgot how cheesy the first couple of seasons's effects were. Now just imagine the equivalent of that with models, sets and costumes in the 60's. Star Trek actually looks great in comparison.
Well the HD enhanced remasters do help in that regard…
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Yeah, I haven't watched them in full but the clips look nice. It's too bad DW can't get that treatment. They do have a few selected stories with updated effects, but the result is mixed and not as classy/subtle.
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@Bond:
As a guy who has absolutely no knowledge of Star Trek and was dragged along to watch the movie with friends, the movie was actually super fun.Really enjoy the character dynamics and the exploring of new environments. But it appears from the comments here that Star Trek is apparently supposed to be more than that. So, with that in mind, where should a new fan start exploring Star Trek?
There's actually going to be a new Star Trek series in January called Discovery. That might be a great place to start!
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I had to recommend one of the older ones, The Next Generation. And since I'm a nerd, here's a quick breakdown of how the Star Trek franchise looks. It so big it's easy to get lost.
! Right now there's two continuities, the original (which spans the TV series and a few movies) and an alternate (which are the recent movies). The original continuity contains five series. They all have their own strengths and weaknesses, and most of them have weak first seasons. With the exception of Deep Space 9 you can pretty much watch any episode you want without any confusion.
! The Original Series (1966-1969 - 3 Seasons). Features some familiar characters like Kirk and Spock. It can be very cheesy and silly, but that's part of what makes it enjoyable.
! The Next Generation (1987-1994 - 7 Seasons). Sequel to the original, and probably the most popular. It's a good show, it doesn't stand out in any way but it doesn't have any major weaknesses either.
! Deep Space 9 (1993-1999 - 7 Seasons). Takes place at the same time as TNG. It stands out by taking place on a station instead of a ship, and by being darker, more serious and more plot heavy than the other series. The only one where I recommend watching it in order.
! Voyager (1995-2001 - 7 Seasons) Takes place at the same time as TNG and DS9. People seem to either love or hate this one. It's a mixed bag, for every horrendous episode there's one that's outstanding. It tries to be something in-between the lighthearted TNG and darker DS9, and whether it succeeds or fails depends on who watches it. Personally I like Voyager (it's the series I grew up with), and while it has some big flaws there's something that makes me come back for more anyway.
! Enterprise (2001-2005 - 4 Seasons) A prequel to the original series. The general opinion is that the first seasons were horrible, but it picked up later on. -
Watched Beyond the other day. So much better then Into Darkness it's unreal. It kinda feels the most like proper trek of any of the nutrek films (still not there yet though). Still has plot holes here, there and everywhere, but it's at least the first time I enjoyed nutrek.
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With everybody heaping on the praise for Beyond (and yes, it is a good movie) it's unfortunate that it isn't doing very well at the box office. Like, it hasn't even made back its budget yet.
I guess Into Darkness and the trailer really turned a lot of people off from it.
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Also get ready for Suicide Squad marketing machine to help get that one a bigger box office than Beyond. Sad indeed.
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With everybody heaping on the praise for Beyond (and yes, it is a good movie) it's unfortunate that it isn't doing very well at the box office. Like, it hasn't even made back its budget yet.
I guess Into Darkness and the trailer really turned a lot of people off from it.
Yeah, the trailer was godawful. Made me think it was going to be just like 09 and ID.
Also get ready for Suicide Squad marketing machine to help get that one a bigger box office than Beyond. Sad indeed.
That may prove difficult as Squad's banned in china.
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That may prove difficult as Squad's banned in china.
Really, banned in china? What's the reason?
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Really, banned in china? What's the reason?
Too dark apparently
http://variety.com/2016/film/asia/china-unlikely-suicide-squad-release-1201830993/
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Apparently they didnt hear the news of it being chopped up and recut again to have a much lighter tone, lol.
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Just a reminder, Star Trek Discovery is premiering on CBS tonight at 8:30 EST.
I'll check it out, but I don't have the highest expectations.
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Watched the first episode, will watch the second today or tomorrow.
! While there's some problems, overall I'm impressed. I was worried it would be overly political and wouldn't feel at all like Star Trek but for the most part I was wrong. The visuals are stunning, the characters and story are interesting enough and I look forward to seeing where this will go. I especially like Saru. As for the downsides, my main ones are that the Klingons look hideous (biggest problem here is that the makeup obscures the actors faces. You can also hear how some of the actors have trouble with the language) and that the show looks more like an upgraded enterprise than prequel to the original (which takes place about decade later). But I can live with those things. The by far biggest problem is the camera work. I genuinely got nauseous. I get that they're trying to fit with modern themes but when they can't keep a single scene on the bridge straight and set in place for more than a few seconds there's a problem. If they could just calm down and let the characters breathe the show would improve immensely.
! Something interesting is that unlike all previous series, this one is driven by one character as opposed to a crew. However seeing how we haven't been introduced to the whole crew yet I'm not worrying to much.
! I genuinely enjoyed the show and will continue watching it not just because it's Star Trek, but because I enjoyed it. The biggest problems was the camera work and their inability to let the show breathe for a few moments (the camera is so bad that I might actually drop it if it continues like this). For some reason the Klingon language also hurt my ears…It's worth remembering that Star Trek is infamous for its terrible first seasons. The Next Generation, Deep Space 9 and Voyager were all a drag at first and not a single one of the pilot episodes impressed me. Enterprise (which I haven't watched, I'm only going off other's opinions here) went from being called the worst Star Trek in history to one of the best (some even claim it topped all previous four series in its last two seasons). I enjoyed the first episode of Discovery, but if you didn't or if you're having doubts, give it some room to grow. That's what Star Trek does best.
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People.actually wound up liking Enterprise?
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So far STD is pretty meh, it is clear that after throwing Fuller out that the writers on the show can not write great dialogue. Hope it will get better, but am not optimistic.
Heard The Orville is actually outtreking this new star trek, despite being more comedic?
Oh and I would highly reccommend checking out The Expanse. BEST sci fi show currently airing.
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People.actually wound up liking Enterprise?
Apparently. From what I've understood the first two seasons are shit. After that the creators knew they were going to get axed, and the higher ups didn't care for the project anymore and gave them more creative freedom. As a result the creators went all out and did what they wanted, leading to the third and fourth seasons to be some of the best in all of Star Trek. The exception is the final episode of the series, which is regarded as the worst final period. Thankfully its a stand-alone episode so it doesn't affect the story arcs, but just reading about it makes me understand why it's hated.
I remember seeing parts of the Xindi arc as a child and I loved it (had no idea it was Star Trek, that was a big surprise) so I can't wait to revisit that one day.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
So far STD is pretty meh, it is clear that after throwing Fuller out that the writers on the show can not write great dialogue. Hope it will get better, but am not optimistic.
That was another disappointment. The way they spoke ruined any feeling of it being a crew, instead it felt like "Michael's adventures in Space". And it was pretty bland. I'm not too picky about it, but at some point they'll have to slow down and actually say something meaningful. It's Star Trek after all. I'm worried they'll attempt to have the visuals and action carry the show and skip out on everything else…
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Watched the first two episodes of Star Trek Discovery. Not bad, and they clearly threw millions of dollars at it, so it looks crazy good for television. It doesn't quite feel like Star Trek, but given how the second episode went maybe it transitions in the later episodes to something closer to the old.
I get that they're updating the effects and not really being beholden to the old stuff in terms of tech and uniforms (Enterprise didn't bother either) nor would I want them to… but it is kind of jarring to get new extra aliens, and Klingons looking completely different. There's no need to go back to cheap 60's visuals, but... they basically look like a whole new species. Why do they have no hair and why are their outfits SO different?
Would it really have killed them to just move the timeline forward another century and have this be something new? Is there any reason it HAD to be 10 years before Kirk and we can't just move onto the 25th century already?
And even though I don't speak Klingon, it didn't really sound like Klingon when they were saying it. Did they actually make a new secondary Klingon dialect for this race of not-quite-Klingons?
These are fanboy nitpicks obviously. It was good, no actual problems with it... just feels weird.
People.actually wound up liking Enterprise?
It did in fact improve a lot in its final season when it got a new showrunner, but by then it was too late to fix.
@Zar:
That was another disappointment. The way they spoke ruined any feeling of it being a crew,
Well considering
! The captain dies in the end and the ship blows up, it's not super shocking that they didn't spend time on the crew in the first two episodes. The goal was to make you feel for the captain, and the actual lead character, and they managed that.
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Since I already have Amazon Prime and Netflix, there is no need to sign up for CBS Access so i'll have to wait until CBS stream it on Netflix. I would love to watch this series
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Yeah, I saw the first episode and though it was alright (not bad, just…different), but I certainly didn't like it enough to pay for CBS All Access. So when/if I do continue to watch it, it'll have to be on Netflix or Amazon or some other service.
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Well considering
! The captain dies in the end and the ship blows up, it's not super shocking that they didn't spend time on the crew in the first two episodes. The goal was to make you feel for the captain, and the actual lead character, and they managed that.
Understandable.
The real test will be if the next episodes continue doing that. Considering it's large cast I doubt it, but you never know.
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I watched the first two ep (I'm in the UK so the shit is one Netflix so yay!)
I'm intrigued so far. It is going to be a divisive Trek for sure though.
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http://www.vulture.com/2017/12/quentin-tarantinos-star-trek-will-be-rated-r-obviously.html
Quentin Tarantino is going to do an R rated Star Trek. Whut.
Patrick Stewart says he's willing to return as Picard for this.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/patrick-stewart-might-reprise-jean-luc-picard-role-tarantino-directs-star-trek-1065667 -
http://www.vulture.com/2017/12/quentin-tarantinos-star-trek-will-be-rated-r-obviously.html
Quentin Tarantino is going to do an R rated Star Trek. Whut.
What the diarrhea dogfuck?
…Well, I definitely didn't see that one coming.
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I'm surprise Tarantino would be interested in Star Trek at all. Star Wars maybe but not Trek. It is such a strange mix.
Always glad to see some Picard but that means he is doing a Next Generation movie?
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I'm surprise Tarantino would be interested in Star Trek at all. Star Wars maybe but not Trek. It is such a strange mix.
Always glad to see some Picard but that means he is doing a Next Generation movie?
Tarantino has said for years he'd love to do a Trek movie. And Bond.
He wouldn't count those against his "career 10."
And nothing has been said about anything. Just that Stewart would be up for it. As much as the entire next gen cast has aged (though not Stewart strangely) and them being scattered across the universe) I can't imagine them actually reuniting that group in its entirety. But a final story with Picard that isn't the trash that was Nemesis would be nice.
I also have to imagine Tarantino and the suits are more interested in Kirk era, since thats where all the shows and movies have taken place since Voyager. But hey, letting Stewart get another swan song on top of Logan would be swell.
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Star Trek… Rated R... I really wish I could say I was surprised but, you know, current Star Trek. :getlost:
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Give me a Tarantino Trek all day everyday, to wash away the star wars trek taste. And I actually enjoyed those movies.
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Finally sat down and got through the rest of Discovery.
It's good, but its not in any way, shape or form Star Trek. A couple decent plots twists in the second half (that I saw coming a mile away but surprised my wife).
But its a crew of assholes, characters die randomly, animal torture for their own ends is okay, there is bloody GoT style torture and gore in some spots, and a full blown Klingon on-camera nudity rape scene.
It's Star Trek because they use warp, transporters, vulcans,(including a super shoe horned in Sarek that makes no sense) a mirror universe, and they mention the Enterprise. It also has Klingons that aren't at all Klingons. But it is not in any way shape or form actually Star Trek in terms of real content. If this had been a wholly new property, or say, Battlestar Galactica it'd be fine to be dark and violent and full of asshole lead characters.
But…. it's Star Trek. Where the hell is the optimism? The bright future to strive towards?
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Finally sat down and got through the rest of Discovery.
It's good, but its not in any way, shape or form Star Trek. A couple decent plots twists in the second half (that I saw coming a mile away but surprised my wife).
But its a crew of assholes, characters die randomly, animal torture for their own ends is okay, there is bloody GoT style torture and gore in some spots, and a full blown Klingon on-camera nudity rape scene.
It's Star Trek because they use warp, transporters, vulcans,(including a super shoe horned in Sarek that makes no sense) a mirror universe, and they mention the Enterprise. It also has Klingons that aren't at all Klingons. But it is not in any way shape or form actually Star Trek in terms of real content. If this had been a wholly new property, or say, Battlestar Galactica it'd be fine to be dark and violent and full of asshole lead characters.
But…. it's Star Trek. Where the hell is the optimism? The bright future to strive towards?
In the continuity that starts in the era of the original series, silly.
Personally I'd have preferred something like Discovery to take place in the alternate timeline of the reboot films and just center on a different crew. They'd be less confined since they wouldn't have to worry about things interfering with the established timelines since it's supposed to be in the same timeline as TOS. Obviously Sarek has to survive, so that's one thing that has no stakes. Going in a direction with no firmly established future would have been more liberating.
That said, bring on the Tarantino R-rated Star Trek movie. Hell, do it Grindhouse style and have him and Robert Rodriguez do a two-part, back-to-back double feature.
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Finally sat down and got through the rest of Discovery.
It's good, but its not in any way, shape or form Star Trek. A couple decent plots twists in the second half (that I saw coming a mile away but surprised my wife).
But its a crew of assholes, characters die randomly, animal torture for their own ends is okay, there is bloody GoT style torture and gore in some spots, and a full blown Klingon on-camera nudity rape scene.
It's Star Trek because they use warp, transporters, vulcans,(including a super shoe horned in Sarek that makes no sense) a mirror universe, and they mention the Enterprise. It also has Klingons that aren't at all Klingons. But it is not in any way shape or form actually Star Trek in terms of real content. If this had been a wholly new property, or say, Battlestar Galactica it'd be fine to be dark and violent and full of asshole lead characters.
But…. it's Star Trek. Where the hell is the optimism? The bright future to strive towards?
I've got only two episodes left to go myself and…yeah, pretty much agreed on all accounts. Seems this series suffers from Nemesis syndrome.
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Like, why even set it before TOS except to shoehorn in cameos? Set it after DS9 and VOyager. Move it forward another hundred years. That clears out any continuity baggage, suddenly all the tech having moved forward is fine, and you can introduce a new, not Klingon race to fill the roll of Klingons.
Ah well. They've apparently fired all the showrunners and are bringing on new people, so maybe season 2 will be different.
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Well, let's also remember Star Trek series tend to have really sloppy early seasons.
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That's the thing. This season wasn't sloppy. It was polished and high budgeted and did exactly what it set out to do.
Which is to not be Star Trek.
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Not a fan. If it is a movie maybe… But to me Stark Trek has always been a show about ideas first and this seems like a classic sci-fi show/story.
I hope that at least they don't make the federation the villain since Star Trek is the only franchise where the future is optimistic is not shitty.
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Watched the first 2 episode of Picard. Its exactly what it and Star Trek should be.
Cripes guys, was it really THAT hard to finally get it right again? Only took you 21 years since DS9 went off the air.
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So, I'm not alone in loving this series.
The few YouTube reviewers I watched aren't loving it. Found a few people upset about the Admiral dropping the F-bomb, saying it isn't Star Trek and this Starfleet isn't Roddenberry's vision. But, people said that about DS9 and that's my favorite.Looking back on all the wars Starfleet fought over multiple shows I think this version of them makes sense.
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Many like Star Trek for being the one were the future is bright instead of a cautionary tale so I understand that depending on how bright you imagine Star Trek should be any new series might not stand up to scrutiny. Especially since as a show runner you are probably looking for an engaging conflict in your new show.
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Found a few people upset about the Admiral dropping the F-bomb, saying it isn't Star Trek and this Starfleet isn't Roddenberry's vision.
If this was Roddenberry's vision Stewart wouldn't be playing Picard or did they just forget that bit of history?