Sanji could totally defeat a Vice Admiral. It's not like rank determines strength :P And if you believe that, you're a marine.
If you believe bounty determines strength, you're a pirate.
If you think rank and bounties are stupid measures of strength, you are a mercenary/bounty-hunter.
Are you sure you quoted the right person? I never implied any of those things.
I totally forgot everyting about that, cant wait to see what it is.
I've always thought that this arc would be the kick-off to the New World equivalent to the Baroque Works saga, so a Poneglyph or some hint to one of the Ancient Weapons?
Sanji could totally defeat a Vice Admiral. It's not like rank determines strength :P And if you believe that, you're a marine.
If you believe bounty determines strength, you're a pirate.
If you think rank and bounties are stupid measures of strength, you are a mercenary/bounty-hunter.
The thing is, not all Vice-Admirals are equal in strength.
It's highly implied that Vergo is stronger than Smoker. Sanji is most likely not strong enough to beat a guy like that in a straight fight right now.
The thing is, not all Vice-Admirals are equal in strength.
It's highly implied that Vergo is stronger than Smoker. Sanji is most likely not strong enough to beat a guy like that in a straight fight right now.
How is it highly implied?
!
The two tops of the G-5. We're invincible now.
Vergo is in charge of the base, which makes only sense considering that he was there first and needed 15 years to climb up the ranks (to be honest, taking this long is not a sign of extraordinary power in my book). Anyway, it doesn't look like the G5 put him above Smoker.
Then there is Tashigi who worries about Smoker taking on Vergo
!
Which makes sense considering that a loss is possible, even if they clash equally.
Anyway, maybe he really is stronger, but nothing is highly implied (unless I'm missing something).
I always thought that Vergo was Smoker's superior, even though they were of the same rank.
That perhaps implied how vergo was stronger.
I don't think sanji will be able to beat vergo, but he will probably buy enough time for tashigi to esacepe.
BTW, are all of smoker's crew dead now?
How is it highly implied?
! http://i999.mangareader.net/one-piece/680/one-piece-3572519.jpg
The two tops of the G-5. We're invincible now.
Vergo is in charge of the base, which makes only sense considering that he was there first and needed 15 years to climb up the ranks (to be honest, taking this long is not a sign of extraordinary power in my book). Anyway, it doesn't look like the G5 put him above Smoker.Then there is Tashigi who worries about Smoker taking on Vergo
! http://i8.mangareader.net/one-piece/678/one-piece-3540979.jpg
Which makes sense considering that a loss is possible, even if they clash equally.
Anyway, maybe he really is stronger, but nothing is highly implied (unless I'm missing something).
Well, the point is that Vergo is above Sanji's level.
Well, the point is that Vergo is above Sanji's level.
You cannot say this with any basis though. Vergo has done nothing more than defeat Law (by squeezing his heart), and a few fodder marines.
Let's just wait for the next chapter and see what happens.
Plus, Sani's attacks were on par with Jimbe's during their fight with Wadatsumi and I don't think that most Vice-Admirals are so strong that someone like Jimbe couldn't fight evenly with most of them.
Well, the point is that Vergo is above Sanji's level.
…I see^^.
Anyway!
Would anyone have guessed that this scene:
!
Would be buildup for this, over 100 chapters later?
!
He was introduced as a semi-fodderish pirate who supposedly had the shadow of death upon him. Now look at his greatness.
@Galaxy:
You cannot say this with any basis though. Vergo has done nothing more than defeat Law (by squeezing his heart), and a few fodder marines.
Vergo is at least on the same level as Smoker, who, in his case, should be very close to Luffy in terms of strength. Sanji is still not in that level for obvious reasons.
Plus, Sani's attacks were on par with Jimbe's during their fight with Wadatsumi and I don't think that most Vice-Admirals are so strong that someone like Jimbe couldn't fight evenly with most of them.
In a fight where both Jinbe and Sanji didn't even try, against fodder. Which is the real problem here, Fishmen Island didn't show anything of the SH's new strength. Names were lacking, and Vergo has one. That's why I said Oda can let Sanji win this fight to "prove" something.
In a fight where both Jinbe and Sanji didn't even try, against fodder. Which is the real problem here, Fishmen Island didn't show anything of the SH's new strength. Names were lacking, and Vergo has one. That's why I said Oda can let Sanji win this fight prove something.
I'm agreeing with you. I think Sanji should win this fight because it shows just how strong the Strawhats have become. I honestly think that Sanji v. Vergo fight would be a better indicator of their strength than Caesar versus Luffy will be.
I don't see why Vergo and Sanji can't trade blows (or Vergo can get owned for a bit, whatever) before Shinokuni comes in and they are forced to split up. It gives Sanji a graceful way to exit without throwing the fight; Smoker and the rest of G5 need to show their stuff, and Vergo has a personal connection with Smoker and Tashigi for obvious reasons.
Vergo is at least on the same level as Smoker, who, in his case, should be very close to Luffy in terms of strength. Sanji is still not in that level for obvious reasons.
I've never thought of Smoker as a strong person. He had the logia advantage pre-skip, but not anymore.
Sanji and Zoro are pretty close to Luffy's level, so Sanji can handle Vergo just fine.
We'll see in the upcoming chapters.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I don't see why Vergo and Sanji can't trade blows (or Vergo can get owned for a bit, whatever) before Shinokuni comes in and they are forced to split up. It gives Sanji a graceful way to exit without throwing the fight; Smoker and the rest of G5 need to show their stuff, and Vergo has a personal connection with Smoker and Tashigi for obvious reasons.
This is the only thing I can see happening.
I'm agreeing with you. I think Sanji should win this fight because it shows just how strong the Strawhats have become. I honestly think that Sanji v. Vergo fight would be a better indicator of their strength than Caesar versus Luffy will be.
You're forgetting the fact that Sanji is fighting with a handicap (his whole body was injured earlier). It would be extremely hard to make Sanji win this fight in a believable manner.
@Galaxy:
I've never thought of Smoker as a strong person. He had the logia advantage pre-skip, but not anymore.
Sanji and Zoro are pretty close to Luffy's level, so Sanji can handle Vergo just fine.
We'll see in the upcoming chapters.
Maybe if Sanji was in top condition, that could happen.
…I see^^.
Anyway!
Would anyone have guessed that this scene:
! http://i23.mangareader.net/one-piece/594/one-piece-2423399.jpg
Would be buildup for this, over 100 chapters later?
! http://i996.mangareader.net/one-piece/680/one-piece-3572507.jpg
He was introduced as a semi-fodderish pirate who supposedly had the shadow of death upon him. Now look at his greatness.
And such things are one of the many reasons I love Oda. <3
Vergo is at least on the same level as Smoker, who, in his case, should be very close to Luffy in terms of strength. Sanji is still not in that level.
And why should he? Just because we saw him as a rival doesn´t mean he has to stay one. If it really were that important to show that Smoker is close to Luffy, Oda wouldn´t have let Smoker lose to Law, a fellow Supernova who is not necessarily stronger than Luffy, at least Luffy spent the last 2 years training. Over the years i really learned to be flexible concerning OP because almost nothing is set in stone. Best example would be the 3 Admirals. I always thought that it was such a nice build-up with the 3 Admirals and their respective abilities with Sengoku the Strategist as their superior. Many users started to imagine matchups for the end of the series (Aokiji vs. Zoro because Kuzan used an ice sword before, Kizaru vs Sanji because of their kicks etc.). After the timeskip we learn that Aokiji has left the Marines, something totally unexpected. I think people have to start to let go of the idea of Smoker being Luffy´s rival. Smoker was invincible against Luffy pretimeskip because of his Logia, that was his only advantage and that´s gone now.
Yeah. If you want to have a serious, wankfree discussion about the chapters, this is definitely not the place.
Spare yourself the pain.
Crap it's the automatic argument destroyer. I can't escape it! It's closing in on me! Seriously though, I can't control my wanking ways. Just yesterday, this dude next to me had the jitters - probably from the crack he was tripping on, he looked kinda shady - and his arm kept rubbing against my pants. The sensation was just too much and I had to relieve myself furiously in the bathroom. Now I seek out guys like that on every bus I go on just to get my fix.
I guess it's just not in my nature to bitch very much… I haven't attained that high level Nirvana yet.
And why should he? Just because we saw him as a rival doesn´t mean he has to stay one. If it really were that important to show that Smoker is close to Luffy, Oda wouldn´t have let Smoker lose to Law, a fellow Supernova who is not necessarily stronger than Luffy, at least Luffy spent the last 2 years training. Over the years i really learned to be flexible concerning OP because almost nothing is set in stone. Best example would be the 3 Admirals. I always thought that it was such a nice build-up with the 3 Admirals and their respective abilities with Sengoku the Strategist as their superior. Many users started to imagine matchups for the end of the series (Aokiji vs. Zoro because Kuzan used an ice sword before, Kizaru vs Sanji because of their kicks etc.). After the timeskip we learn that Aokiji has left the Marines, something totally unexpected. I think people have to start to let go of the idea of Smoker being Luffy´s rival. Smoker was invincible against Luffy pretimeskip because of his Logia, that was his only advantage and that´s gone now.
Why do you talk like Smoker and Law stayed the same thing while Luffy was the only one that got stronger?
Modern Sanji would have gone spinning in a love cyclone across town shrieking "ROBIN-CHWAAAAAN" and then been punched out by CP9 before lamely telling the rest of the crew where she went.
Old Sanji was chivalrous, among many other things. New Sanji is lecherous.
I'll take this chapter as a step in the right direction for one of the series' better characters.
I think you're overreacting. Nothing has happened as big as Robin leaving them, giving Sansji a reason to be mad in a personal way and beat all in sight.
Anyway, glad to see Sanji finally have his moment. Luffy had his. Zoro basically beat Hordy or Hody underwater. I'm very sure that he won't lose; wouldn't be stylish to have him do such a badass entrance only to lose. Obviously one does loose, but it's not far fetched that Sanji would be able to stand up against a VA. Although the story does have a long way, the Trio can't be miles away from achieving the power that will make them into the world's strongest.
But I doubt it will be finished. Either interrupted by natural causes or Smoker cuts in. Either way, if Smoker gets back and with a defeated Vergo, Donflamingo's in trouble.
And why should he? Just because we saw him as a rival doesn´t mean he has to stay one. If it really were that important to show that Smoker is close to Luffy, Oda wouldn´t have let Smoker lose to Law, a fellow Supernova who is not necessarily stronger than Luffy, at least Luffy spent the last 2 years training. Over the years i really learned to be flexible concerning OP because almost nothing is set in stone. Best example would be the 3 Admirals. I always thought that it was such a nice build-up with the 3 Admirals and their respective abilities with Sengoku the Strategist as their superior. Many users started to imagine matchups for the end of the series (Aokiji vs. Zoro because Kuzan used an ice sword before, Kizaru vs Sanji because of their kicks etc.). After the timeskip we learn that Aokiji has left the Marines, something totally unexpected. I think people have to start to let go of the idea of Smoker being Luffy´s rival. Smoker was invincible against Luffy pretimeskip because of his Logia, that was his only advantage and that´s gone now.
OR he could get redeemed in a fight with Vergo or Caesar and cement his place as the guy chasing after the future pirate king. Smoker has other ways to fight besides his fruit.
Originally Posted by CCC
Man, woman, who cares!? Sure, they love show tunes, but who doesn't?
Never said that they stayed the same, please read carefully. Smoker spent the last 2 years in the NW, of course he got stronger. He learned Haki which i´m pretty sure he didn´t have before. Law probably got stronger, too, but we also know that he isn´t the type of guy who gets into unnecessary fights. He probably spent the last 2 years following his plans to obtain the position of Shichibukai. Still, it´s a way different situation than having spent and trained 1 1/2 years with maybe the best Haki user alive. Smoker getting stronger is logical but since other than his Logia he was never that strong, keeping up with Luffy who by learning Haki practically erased the only disadvantage he had against Smoker shouldn´t be possible anymore.
his fruit doesn't even have much fatal properties to it like magma or light he essentially just uses it for agility
_Bitch! I love you. Stars above you.
Shine like wine, girl you be fine!
Now it's time to suck my dick!
You better not spit, out our lovee <3_
his fruit doesn't even have much fatal properties to it like magma or light he essentially just uses it for agility
He should be able to easily suffocate people with his smoke if we apply real life logic. Which would make him insanely dangerous I guess.
But it seems Oda decided to give a similiar ability to CC instead.
He should be able to easily suffocate people with his smoke if we apply real life logic. Which would make him insanely dangerous I guess.
But it seems Oda decided to give a similiar ability to CC instead.
well I wasn't saying it like it was a bad thing if anything it's more impressive that with such a fruit that he made it this far in the ranks which proves how physically strong he is especially now with a haki boost.
…I see^^.
Anyway!
Would anyone have guessed that this scene:
! http://i23.mangareader.net/one-piece/594/one-piece-2423399.jpg
Would be buildup for this, over 100 chapters later?
! http://i996.mangareader.net/one-piece/680/one-piece-3572507.jpg
He was introduced as a semi-fodderish pirate who supposedly had the shadow of death upon him. Now look at his greatness.
What was it your were showing? Can't see stuff from mangareader.
You know, I understand getting upset that Smoker isn't getting a fight, I was looking forward to it too. The thing is, Smoker doesn't need a fight. He needs to arrest Vergo and expose him for a fraud, if Sanji beats him then that's just proof that he was never a match for Smoker to begin with. After this, Smoker will still be the same badass he's always been, an invincible marine who only loses under the oddest circumstances.
To anyone who says "why does Sanji need this fight?" Then I'll point to the time skip. The crew still needs to prove themselves in the New World. Smoker doesn't need that.
Also, why are people clinging to Vergo being an ultra powerful marine? Yes, I know he could be, but think of what he's done so far. He knocked out an incapacitated Law and talked a lot of big game. Sad truth is, he could easily be weaker then Law and Smoker, and in turn weaker then Sanji. Yeah, the guy looks like a bad ass, but he's also a scumbag child kidnapper who deserves to get the crap kicked out of him. I don't see a problem with him getting trounced in this arc.
What was it your were showing? Can't see stuff from mangareader.
Maybe mangafox?
http://c.mfcdn.net/store/manga/106/60-594.0/compressed/c594.0.18.jpg
http://c.mfcdn.net/store/manga/106/65-680.0/compressed/p006.jpg
Also, why are people clinging to Vergo being an ultra powerful marine? Yes, I know he could be, but think of what he's done so far. He knocked out an incapacitated Law and talked a lot of big game.
My thoughts exactly. However, because he is all words and hype (so far) people think he has to deliver, and with Sanji a worthy opponent is available to make him shine.
It would appear everyone has their marching orders. This arc might just tie itself up nicely. OR WILL IT?
Ceasar will definetly get his licks in before facing defeat. Sanji the cook will hopefully show the "grill master" who's boss. Zoro will rescue those kids… assusming he doesn't get lost.
With an arc like this, you know there's gonna be a huge knowldge bomb dropped right before the Straw Hats move on. Don Flamingo anyone?
Well, the point is that Vergo is above Sanji's level.
"Level" here isn't a very tangible thing. Remember that Caesar had most of Strawhats dead to rights at one point Luffy included.
Which didn't stop Luffy from attacking him just now again. Same with every other villain he took on in fact, with a few minor exception early on. Luffy gets beaten, comes back stronger.
Happened with others in the crew within a span of single fight also, think Daz vs Zoro or Sanji vs Jabra to a lesser extent.
Granted, his kick didn't seem to have much of an effect but it connected and knocked Vergo down, so unless he suddenly powers up Sanji clearly has a fighting chance.
Drawing is fun
"Level" here isn't a very tangible thing. Remember that Caesar had most of Strawhats dead to rights at one point Luffy included.
Which didn't stop Luffy from attacking him just now again. Same with every other villain he took on in fact, with a few minor exception early on. Luffy gets beaten, comes back stronger.
Happened with others in the crew within a span of single fight also, think Daz vs Zoro or Sanji vs Jabra to a lesser extent.
Granted, his kick didn't seem to have much of an effect but it connected and knocked Vergo down, so unless he suddenly powers up Sanji clearly has a fighting chance.
There is blood coming out of every hole, or is that dirt from Sanji's shoes?
!
Ahh thanks Jabra.
I think Zoro will get stuck with the dragon. Animals seem to just find him lol.
Ahh thanks Jabra.
I think Zoro will get stuck with the dragon. Animals seem to just find him lol.
I can't really believe Zoro will get a serious fight with a dragon that small, even if its supposed to be stronger then the last. It's boring to have the same fight happen again you know?
Plus, the thing is scared of Vergo. Now, if we all assume Sanji vs. Vergo goes like normal, we can't have more of a fight with a guy who's scarred of the same guy Sanji fought right?
It makes me wonder who Zoro is gonna fight though. I doubt we'll get an arc were Sanji gets a 1v1 and Zoro doesn't. Where are the other swordsmen on the island?
This is just a build up arc to something better not all of them really need a major fight at this point in time so they're just along for the ride to fight fodder or keep running away
With an arc like this, you know there's gonna be a huge knowldge bomb dropped right before the Straw Hats move on. Don Flamingo anyone?
Law: Oh yeah, by the way Straw Hat
Luffy: ..?
Law: Joker–Doflamingo, I think he already knows you.
Luffy: How's that?
Law: He said something about time travel, a head injury and a top hat. Apparently you knew each other as kids
Luffy: . . . Nope, I still don't know.
OP Fans: XD
There is blood coming out of every hole, or is that dirt from Sanji's shoes?
! http://img.mangastream.com/m/51/82521962/b73530420f5501d2092b7449ab5f323c.png
Difficult to say.
But he got up very quickly regardless, and didn't look the least bit perturbed or concerned.
When Luffy was hitting Lucci with his second gear he reacted similarly, not to say Sanji doesn't stand a chance or anything like that, but Vergo clearly is quite tough.
Than again this arc has been weird so far, what with Luffy and Caesar knocking the hell out of each other back and forth, so it's impossible to predict how this fight will go.
From what I've noticed Vergo seems to be easily distracted and so if he does have CoO then it might be weak or he doesn't use it that well. I could see him turning out to be a CoA masters but having little efficiency with CoO then beating Sanji pretty bad but I don't think we are at a point where the Strawhats will be on the verge of total defeat until they face Dofla or BM. Still I predict either Vergo gets the upper hand or the fight is even and before the tide can turn in Vergo's favor the gas interrupts. The again as people have pointed out power levels are very odds in the OP minus the 3 admirals being similar, the Yonkou, VA, Shichibukai, WB division commanders haven't all been the same even within their group or so it seems.
Why do people think that Sanji will lose? I t would suck if he lost.
Hey, what are the odds that this chapter will be censored in the manga, and Tashigi will lose in a way humilating way.
Hey, what are the odds that this chapter will be censored in the manga, and Tashigi will lose in a way humilating way.
you mean anime?
yeh i was thinking about this, and the heart situation.. given that they censored that part in the HxH new remake when killua ripped jon Heart.. maybe same thing will happen with Law and smoker.
Dont see how toei's going to deal with this heart removal.
Hai guys do you hoppen to member dat time wen Zolo was injured fiting Haci?
Ya, zoro has had numerous fights handicapped and so has Zoro. I believe that if Zoro was in this situation people would be screaming first mate trumps all and that he's almost Luffy's level while Sanji is low-tier shit by now. I believe that Sanji will win if there is a fight between them and if there isn't that he will get his chance to shine like in the days of spy Sanji and Mr.Prince. So please people have more faith and let Oda do Oda.
Why do people think that Sanji will lose? It would suck if he lost.
Yeah but it wouldn't make a whole lotta sense if he won
#45lyfer
Why do people think that Sanji will lose? I t would suck if he lost.
For starters, Sanji's body got in the way of an explosion not a long time ago while Vergo is still relatively unscathed except for a kick in the face. Also, Sanji is facing somebody that is at least about as strong as Smoker.
The scenario simply doesn't look favorable to Sanji, especially when the best argument people can come for him winning is "he needs to shine!".
Yeah but it wouldn't make a whole lotta sense if he won
Why??
When training Luffy, Rayleigh used his CoO and he could tell the number of beasts Luffy couldn't defeat.
It means CoO can predict the strength of someone.
And Zorro didn't even worry a bit about Sanji, it means that Zorro was sure Sanji and the strange aura is on par.
Still, I believe that the fight will be interupted by the gas and Smoker will eventually run into Vergo.
Originally Posted by Emporio Ivankov
"Miracle only descends upon those with the will to carry on. Do not take them so lightly"
Yeah but it wouldn't make a whole lotta sense if he won
Yes it does.
For starters, Sanji's body got in the way of an explosion not a long time ago while Vergo is still relatively unscathed except for a kick in the face. Also, Sanji is facing somebody that is at least about as strong as Smoker.
The scenario simply doesn't look favorable to Sanji, especially when the best argument people can come for him winning is "he needs to shine!".
Who says Vergo is as strong as Smoker? I've seen nothing to evidence that.
? I've seen nothing to evidence that.
There isn't any, and there's no need for it too. All these arguments actually just boils down to "I like/don't like Sanji". If u like him, u'll expect him to shine, u'll come up with reasons and arguments for him to win the fight. And vice versa
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