@taiyou-burst:
Wanna know something really messed up: I know all this, I am confused by this, and most of the time I am enraged about how you have to move on (Demyx battle, Ice Cream Beat, Riku Replica to name a few), and yet due to having Aspergers Syndrome I can't get enough of the game…
Well, wouldn’t use Riku Replica as an example. I think it was well done, but I love Chain of Memories to bits anyway.
Roxas was always destined to be whiney, he's voice by Jesse McCartney for crying out loud… but all jokes aside, yeah Roxas had a lot of potential being the only true Nobody member of the Organization to have genuine confirmed emotions (I have a rant about this), but he can't just have anger, hatred, joy, and slight depression, he needs the whole emotional spectrum, so I can understand the whiney, still it was a bit of a let down. Roxas needs to be a lovable idiot like Sora... Then again maybe he gets his personality from both Ven and Vanitas: Ven's big brother worshipingness, and Vantias' non-idiocy
Played the German version of KH, so I hadn’t the honor to hear his beautiful voice. But I didn’t find him too bad in comparison to some other dub voices.
But why did we need her in the first place? The explanation which was given in KH2 was fine and how he reacted to all of this. Perfectly fine. Roxas leaving the Organisation, because they lied to him, because they used him for collecting hearts for them. How he found out? Maybe Axel let something slip, maybe he saw through them, maybe his dreams of Sora got him to this conclusion. And then he started to feel anger and the other emotional stuff. It was totally fine and reasonable without her. Now it seems like he left the organization because she was the reason.
And even today I’m cringing about the fact that she was the motivation behind Deep Dive, even if it doesn’t make any sense and is totally retconned.
No, no, no no nonononono, no, please I get it, people need to rant, in one way or another, and rants are usually meant to inform people of a person's own two cents, without interruption, so I understand (I have rants about some other characters as well)
But yeah don't let my friend hear you dis FF7: not only is he a die hard fan of FF7, all of it's prequel/sequel games, and is even willing to buy a PS3 just because of a potential remake of the main game with the PS3 graphics, but if the laws of nature would allow it, he would give birth to Vincent Valentine's children.
Haha :D No, no, I’m not ranting about the original game, just about its spin-off and Genesis. Genesis
Ahhh yes BbS, answered so little questions, but raised so many more, like is it something about Sora's heart that makes other Keyblade worthy hearts go to it when lost in the ether, did Xion's hair color come from Vanitas, how come Aqua hasn't aged a day in the ten-eleven years since being in the realm of darkness, what is so different about the realm of darkness compared to the realm of nothingness that made Ansem the Wise lose most of his memories, who was that Unknown fought at the Land of Departure, are Master's Xehanort and Eraqus going to have their own Lingering Sentiments, can Master Xehanort now wield 3 Keyblades (his, Terra's, and Eraqus'), was Terra or Master Xehanort gaining control of Xemnas/Xehanort's Heartless with influence from the other, are Riku and Kairi going to join Sora on his next journey, will their be a return of Mickey, Donald and Goofy as other party members, will Data Sora, Heartless Sora, and the real Sora merge together to make Sora fully complete, what was Isa's and Lea's plan that involved the castle Hollow Bastion, was Ienzo a willing part of the other apprentices' experiments with the heart or not, did Even think he would meet again with Ven, or did he predict he'd meet Roxas, or did he predict he'll meet with Sora who contains Ven's heart, did Axel lie about not finding the Chamber of Waking because he remembered Ven as a friend from before, and thus made a more active pursuit of his friendship with Roxas, is it that Ansem survived his machine's explosion a link to Riku Replica's return… and this is the tip of the question iceburg on anything Kingdom Hearts related, but it is all the questions revolving around Birth by Sleep
Since KH2 I wasn’t expecting something else. But what makes BBS in every way superior to 358 was its execution, its plot and the characters.
But yeah, this shows obviously how messed up and confusing a simple collaboration between Square Enix and Disney became. Oh Nomura.
I’m not quit good with words myself, because English isn’t my first language and I’m trying to improve it, but I’m leaving this essay from KHInsider here, because it sums everything perfectly fine up why 358 and Xion IMO sucked:
[hide] ** Xion is more or less, a watered down version of Kairi with more angst. Her personality was bland. Boring. Nothing new we've seen, and nothing compelling. Nothing extravagant, and nothing original. Being cute does not constitute as a reason: why in the world would it? I'll be propping up a million female characters in my favorites list if that was the case. Especially when the truth on whose appearance we see, and who, in fact, "she" really is. I'm not so fond of Kairi either. I'm neutral until she is able to come out and be able to stand on her own. But I can at least give Kairi some appreciation because she seems to have flaws as a character (being impulsive, stubborn, and sort of asking for trouble when she can't really do much at the moment to defend herself. Kairi haters can give you a lot more). Xion has no flaws in personality. Absolutely none. The only problems she causes are on the thought that it's for the sake of everyone and her friends, and forcing Roxas to kill her is more or less a die or die situation of choices to the point where there isn't a good escape. So we have this sweet, kind, spunky, nice, giggly, perfect angel who oh so much suffers such travesties and tragedies. And who still, by the end of the game, remains this sweet, kind, spunky, nice, giggly, perfect angel, only more brave or something. Of course, give her more positive aspects, why don't you. If there is a perception of Mary Sue that she fits, is perfection. There's nothing wrong with the girl. Being a clone is circumstance.
I wouldn't have a problem with Xion hanging around good-looking guys (or else I wouldn't love Larxene)…if she hadn't kept fainting all the time, and in "coincidence", all three (Roxas, Axel, and Riku) where there in time to capture her faint, weak self in their arms, hold her (or in Riku's case, brush her bangs too), or save her. That's where the line blurs. If this wasn't canon, I bet people reading this in fanfiction would immediately stop reading.
** Her tragedy. Don't get me wrong, I don't usually bash people who end up with sad fates. It's when the game forces it on me that I have a problem. And I said this before somewhere else. The whole game felt like Xion was merely created to be pitied, and we had to see how much she suffered, how a pathetic scream and tears got to her when Riku was a complete and utter stranger, whose words shouldn't even be trusted. Then the nightmare, how the evil villains (except the main characters, naturally) were so cruel to poor Xion, especially Saïx D:. Lord help us all for this sweet little girl, let's cry us all a river, shall we please? It's a ploy to get us all to like her and forget the fact that she came out of nowhere. So, please, fall for it. And all this wrapped up in her sparkly, more long than needed, death. The whole thing seemed so shoved down my throat that my response was negative, especially when the game actually stated "poor Xion" (which, if it didn't turn me off by that point, permanently did there). It couldn't get as more obvious as it was then what they were trying to do to the audience. And from what I see, it worked. To some, anyway. Roxas nor Riku Replica never made me feel like this, neither did Naminé. Their stories were pretty passive, and while you feel for Roxas, he was more angry than a moper, and Riku Replica is just full of antagonism. Naminé we didn't see much of her until the end (where, yes, it was possible for her not to steal screen time), but it was enough to understand her feelings. Both three of these people did not take over the story, plot, or overall game just to explain the reason of their angst. That's where Xion fails. Let alone the fact that when Xion isn't there, there is either the topic of her being discussed, or Roxas worrying about her. Or constant mentions. It's like impossible not to have her name in the topic long enough. I'm surprised the game wasn't called Kingdom Hearts: XION and leave it at that. We instead had some unneeded difficult title like Three Five Eight Days Over Two when it turned out it was really just...days. Go figure.
It's okay for you to love this. I don't.
And, seriously. Take out the music or drown it out, and her death isn't exactly so great. It was more of Shimomura's talents that made the scene close to worth it.
My Organization development and depth other than the one dimensional characteristics they kept throughout the game was forsaken for this wangstfest? :/ As if the series isn't turning into the greatest wangsfest of all.
** Of course, since Nomura couldn't screw up the sequel, with no one mentioning her in any way whatsoever in the series, they made everyone lose the memories. The cop out didn't sit well with me at all, because if you were aware of the plot hole, why create it? For the sake of some story that could've been anything else? (or couldn't have been at all, actually. Unless people were so needing to know the "daily lives of the Organization", lulz Nomura, which the game wasn't even about that anyway except them being wallflowers in the end with half of them wiped out from the beginning, then there's nothing an interview question or two couldn't answer. Or even a line in the game, to be honest) That's another one of my main gripes. And it isn't even starting.
** Roxas himself has proceeded to mature on his own, and with the probability of him having a heart, the "emotions" that are quoted are more or less possible to be real and have a life of their own.
The truth is: it all started with Axel and Roxas.
Sea salt ice cream, which was Axel's idea, was way more important, more meaningful, and more symbolic to the situation. It's even the icon that you see in the DS screen. It's what Roxas constituted as what friends do, to the point where it was his words as Xion was dying. You mean to tell me he learned how to care, worry, and defend a friend because of her? His attitude? His personality? All that he's shown since the very beginning? Smart-aleck words like "I could've done that blindfolded" and speaking back to Vexen wasn't Xion's doing. And feeling alone when eating ice cream by himself was her cause? So Axel has no role, right? Roxas never mentioned him, of course. And yes, I'm not being serious. Aren't these natural feelings in themselves? Just like he was feeling sick about whether or not Axel was dead?
In reality, from what I see, Roxas (and her, if we have to) learned a lot more from Axel, who not only taught him many meanings, but solidified what friends do the most. He was the teacher and the adult figure, the person that was most went to when he wanted answers. The other half was covered by the Disney worlds Roxas visited. Most of the questions, if not all, stem from what he witnesses every moment he goes on a mission and the people there. Which was even made a point of by Nomura before 358/2 Days came out about what role the worlds play in an interview. And these said questions hauled over to the Organization and their motives. Even before Xion ever died or he discovered the truth, I remember a conversation with Axel very clearly where he inquires a lot about what Organization XIII does. I'll find the quote if I have to.
Xion didn't change Axel either. Axel doesn't even remember Xion and he has, like Roxas, no problem recalling anything else as to what made him different. He wouldn't have stated Roxas made him feel like he had a heart, was the only one he liked, and basically got through the whole of KH2 trying to protect and bring him back. As it was originally. Again, natural reactions to people you care about. Xion also wasn't in Castle Oblivion, where notes of Axel changing began to be said in the game after his return. In the secret reports, he also doesn't alienate Roxas when he said they remind him of his childhood memories. It was both, but if you wan to take Xion out, we all know it could have been Roxas only as well if she didn't exist (which, let's face it: she didn't). To be truthful, he never alienates Roxas when concerning his views. Xion just sort of tacked on.
So don't peg all this growth solely on her part, because that's not true. There were other forces at work. I can safely even bigger ones.
** Xion had no purpose. Anything that had to do with BBS didn't concern her, and the only part that did was more or less the fact that Xigbar saw her as Ven at one point (and that rests on Sora and Roxas, considering that was more of a reaction to Sora's memories that Xion only holds, not her exactly).
2. Dual wielding can be easily explained by Sora or Ventus. You know it's true.
3. The Deep Dive scene....did anyone notice the fact that Riku was already there waiting in the skyscraper? What was going to happen, a peaceful talk? Tea party? So you mean to tell me he wasn't there in any possible way to stop Roxas, when Diz came right after Roxas was defeated, and had Data Twilight Town all set for this moment? Did Xion went into everyone's mind, then? That was perhaps the biggest slip of the whole game. Sorry, don't buy it, can't buy it. Especially since Roxas throwing the keyblade could be explained in pure action that he was surrounded by heartless, succumbed, jumped out of the way and looked around the swarm (honestly, why make it look this way if it wasn't going to serve anything?), and saw the hooded figure on top, and asked silently for his aid. Granted, we don't know the reason, but Roxas and Riku did meet in the game before. Something else could've went on. Or it can be the Sora inside Roxas, which also appeared when Riku was taunting him, and when he finally admitted, "You really are his Nobody." Done deal.
4. Roxas turned out to be needed regardless of whether Xion had been there or not. It's not like Sora recovered when she died, after all, even though his memories either returned to him or Roxas (still confused on that aspect). Take it this way - if Sora's memories did leak, and it was made a plot point still, it would go to Roxas if Xion was nowhere in the game (considering the interview with the creators stated that Sora's memories went through Roxas and into her...after) like 358/2 Days finished with. If Sora's memories didn't leak, they will remain with him or a part of Roxas like 358/2 Days finished with. Spot a pattern? KH2 wouldn't have changed, in other words. Roxas was more of the rightful key, no matter how it went. Xion exists? Xion does not exist? Makes no scratch, end of.
So it was back to square one anyway. I mean, does anyone actually see the sense of this? Honest answer?
358/2 Days basically made a simple explanation more complicated, confusing, and convoluted.
** As if all this wasn't enough, we'll take the "impact" she had on Roxas. It's one thing to not remember somebody, even when some memories of your past life comes back, like Roxas's time in the Organization's did. Except that, for Xion being this GREAT, IMPORTANT REASON for Roxas to leave, and the "main", he finds no problem as to why he abandoned his former comrades when the supposed "source" of it is gone. Especially when you consider his argument with Axel in 358/2 Days and the "no one would miss me" scene. If someone had this much influence, wouldn't you think a huge part or piece is missing? Wouldn't Roxas think that there are some dots not connecting? He didn't question it, and whatever he did figure out, was fine with him as good reasons to have ditched Organization XIII, apparently. Which brings to question Xion's role as a whole. If you have an explanation, please, do so. Other than it was made up, because, that's as obvious as the computer screen you're staring at.
Overall, it was a big waste of time. 358/2 Days was probably the most filler I have ever seen of a side game, and most of what happened isn't even remembered. ALL of it. It's not just Sora who forgets (who even was hinted to possibly have gained it back in KH2: FM+). ALL. And the reason why was the cop-out said above. Was Xion advertised and made to be important? Maybe. Was she really? Not in the spam of things. She's a 'clone' of Sora/Roxas, created by the Organisation that nobody mentioned by out of something-about-Sora's-lost-memories-complicated-mumble-something contrived and convoluted because they apparently needed an extra keyblade user cause is whatever contrived and convoluted (and it's funny, considering that Nomura never had come up to what Xion would be, so I wonder what he thought about having only Roxas be the Organization's prime keyblade wielder. What? Couldn't have done it without her?). Nomura finds it clever, I find it nonsensical.
Yet, I've already lost faith in the director (this isn't even accounting to his meddling in the FF series and FF7 compilation). Too many asspulls to account for, and it keeps multiplying. I don't know how many people Sora can have inside him (because, apparently, no game is ever without a "Sora" or some trio poo, it's impossible) without somehow breaking apart or have his soul be completely firetrucked up by this point. Seriously. It's ridiculous. He's not even just Sora anymore: he's the physical body bin out of all the Sora selves he has within. Whether it be his memories, his heart, his soul, his hair, his boots, his face, his energy, his arm, his ass, his blood vein...[/hide]