Fairy Tail Series IV Discussion

Shobu Yoruichi

Now to look at the other side of that; Berserk, one of my favorite manga of all time, started off as a fairly mediocre dark fantasy series, and was like that for the first three volumes. It wasn't bad, but it wasn't that good either, and I was about to drop the series, but once the Golden Age arc hit, the series quickly became one of the best character-study/journey of all time that didn't pull any punches when it came to the characters, and their relationships.

Ja! I just dropped Berserk after ending that third volume. Still, i must say my very first one was Faily.

I'll use MHA manga as an example of this; When i picked up the series, and read through the first chapter, it made me interested in it because of its underdog character story, and how impactful the last few panels of the chapter were. It was a series that announced itself to be a interesting with an relatedable main protag. Fast forward to present, and the series is a very predictable shonen that hits pretty much every modern shonen trope ever. It was a series that started off with a high-note, and devolved into a mindless shonen action series.

Good to know. OumaZoo kinda had that very same pace at its end, Kouhei is not that good, but manages to give me some laughs, i think he resembles the style of Takei at Shaman King, don't know why but can't stop comparing them.

Outerspec

It's over!? It's finally over!!!

I stopped reading at some time in the war. I can't believe it went on so damn long.

Ruin

@Outerspec:

It's over!? It's finally over!!!

I stopped reading at some time in the war. I can't believe it went on so damn long.

your avatar is representative of the all the people that stuck out to the end

Thatanas

@Outerspec:

It's over!? It's finally over!!!

I stopped reading at some time in the war. I can't believe it went on so damn long.

You can't rejoice in the fact that it's over when you stopped reading, you slacker!

Domingo

The war, ahaHahAhahHAHahahaha. It's so irrelevant everything aftermath was wrapped offscreen. The large-scale invasion left no negative impact on either side whatsoever and it even ended on hopeful note that the Alvarez might be able to get along with Fiore very soon, somehow. I just can't even.

black-leg jex

Well at least it's over now. I dropped it after the GMG arc because it was just not getting any better. In all honesty, it should've probably ended after the tower arc. We might not have got all the answers but at least it was consistently good up to that point.

maxterdexter

Considering that the cause of the war was zeref going "let's go get me a barefoot loli" the general alvarez population shouldn't care that much about fiore.

Fiore on the other hand should be pissed off at Alvarez.

ARTEMlS

However, FT makes a lot of things wrong, but really not everything. I guess in order to bring a sufficient proof you really let me no other choice…

Behold as I now will present you something that's worse than FT on every level. If the genericness and blehness just is too much, feel free to punish me in any appropriate manner. It's an indie-RPG I betatested and it basically gets EVERY possible level (be it storytelling- or gameplay-related) just plain wrong. Starting with the hook which basically is non-existent and just boils down to doing random fetchquests because why not. so here it comes...

!

Just look at the respective very first scenes, both show us some higher authority/important persons, however whereas FT actually is subtle (writing together subtle and FT sounds so wrong), the game actually flat out not only tells us that there's a conspiracy but also who the conspirators are. And that before we learn anything about the conspiracy or the world in general.

So you want one thing the very first FT scene does right: Not telling us explicitly who the conspirators are in the/a possible upcoming conspiracy plot.

Long John Silvers Rayleigh

@Domingo:

The war, ahaHahAhahHAHahahaha. It's so irrelevant everything aftermath was wrapped offscreen. The large-scale invasion left no negative impact on either side whatsoever and it even ended on hopeful note that the Alvarez might be able to get along with Fiore very soon, somehow. I just can't even.

Idk if it was the anime improving it but tartaros felt so much more like a final arc

Domingo

@Long:

Idk if it was the anime improving it but tartaros felt so much more like a final arc

It would have been probably a good point to end the series right there and then, IF:

Acnologia had also been killed in fight with Igneel, with Natsu's assistance.
With Acnologia defeated, Zeref had to reconsider his plan and give humanity another chance. He would still be around, sure, only with no grand evil goal to achieve for awhile.

Raffy

@Outerspec:

It's over!? It's finally over!!!

not till the fish jumps!

!

ARTEMlS

After jumping the shark finally another fish jumps.

ARTEMlS

Well, nevertheless I really, really like Lucy. On a metalevel she basically is a representation of Mashima's awareness that his storytelling indeed is flawed. I recently bought volume 52 and in the Q&A corner she blatantly criticizes Mashima's ability. And I mean sometimes, though more subtle then, she even does so in the actual story. Lucy is a great character who just deserves a better… anything else - and deep inside she absolutely knows.

Long John Silvers Rayleigh

The characte development would have only been undone if they reset their characters but it didnt, of course lisanna was completely an afterthought afterwards…but her being brought back regardless of how out of nowhere it was didnt ruin the affect it had on them from how they acted moving forward

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

@ARTEMlS:

Well, nevertheless I really, really like Lucy. On a metalevel she basically is a representation of Mashima's awareness that his storytelling indeed is flawed. I recently bought volume 52 and in the Q&A corner she blatantly criticizes Mashima's ability. And I mean sometimes, though more subtle then, she even does so in the actual story. Lucy is a great character who just deserves a better… anything else - and deep inside she absolutely knows.

Interested how you rate the expanded main cast

Natsu,Lucy,Gray, Erza, Wendy, Juvia, Gajeel

ARTEMlS

@Long:

Interested how you rate the expanded main cast

Natsu,Lucy,Gray, Erza, Wendy, Juvia, Gajeel

Uff, I think I cannot really rate them because I actually cannot ANY memorable moment with some sufficient emotional weight behind it. (Aside maybe how Lucy's worldview got scattered in chapter 1, but other than that…)

As I said I actually rate Lucy high for stuff like that:
http://www.mangareader.net/fairy-tail/468/6

"What am I supposed to be doing here… I have no idea what's going on..." - One of Lucy's best lines, really as if she is speaking directly to Mashima here.

Seriously, that is the only memorable moment I can think of regarding the (expanded) main cast. Other than that, really, I remember nothing noteworthy...

KageKageKing

5 months later….

ARTEMlS

Just the very first panel says… classic Fairy Tail!

Halfmetal-lich

That tweet sums up Fairy Tail almost perfectly.

It has nothing of any literary value, tells no interesting stories, has no long term character development and was religiously devoted to that fucking status quo.

Just sexy girls and stupid fanservice.

Naruto had interesting stories, had emotional moments, Bleach had them. That's what makes them better than this, because even if Naruto and Bleach are flawed (deeply flawed in the case of Bleach) pieces of work, they actually tried to put their characters through something.

Fairy Tail is the worst piece of literature I've ever seen produced out of the Japanese Manga industry.

Your Boy

Stop writing/drawing manga, Mashima. I'm begging you.

Nekketsu

Daily reminder this is the same author who wrote Rave Master, an endearing fantasy story that is light years away from FT.

AfroSamurai

I found the whole thing quite endearing, just goes to show that the only valuable thing fairy tail had to offer were the character relationships, so much so that the 10+ panels of everyone having fun and drinking at the onsen really connect.

EDIT: Tbh… I thought that NaLu was canon. I never read the last chapter of FT, didn't realize it was never confirmed. That said... for the sake of this comic and avoiding a discussion on sexual assault, I'm gonna assume they have a fully developed romantic sexual relationship and Natsu didn't just strip a drunk girl who most certainly wouldn't consent to being naked in front of him for the sake of a prank...

Mashima's prior posts on twitter seem to confirm NaLu being a thing too... they're pretty kinky posts at that.

Robby

@Halfmetal-lich:

Fairy Tail is the worst piece of literature I've ever seen produced out of the Japanese Manga industry.

In terms of successful long runners, maybe its kind of bland and pointless.

But it's nowhere neeeeeear the actual worst. Not by a long shot.

Halfmetal-lich

@AfroSamurai:

I found the whole thing quite endearing, just goes to show that the only valuable thing fairy tail had to offer were the character relationships, so much so that the 10+ panels of everyone having fun and drinking at the onsen really connect.

Except there are no character relationships, well aside from the ONLY worthwhile developed one in the entire series: Gajeel and Levy

Because that actually goes through development and growth, from enemies, to allies to a couple

Everyone else? They are literally the exact same from the start of the series, until the end. Nothing changes.

We see Grey go through..what three different attempts to be like Sasuke and NOTHING comes of it. NOTHING.

There is no meaningful long term character development in any of the main cast at all.

AT. ALL.

Johnny B. Decent

If nothing else, Fairy Tail showed me how tired and lame the villain motive of "I want to destroy the world/humanity, because humanity/the world is evil!" really is.

KageKageKing

@Nekketsu:

Daily reminder this is the same author who wrote Rave Master, an endearing fantasy story that is light years away from FT.

Rave was a disappointment at the end of it's run.

ARTEMlS

@S.C.:

If nothing else, Fairy Tail showed me how tired and lame the villain motive of "I want to destroy the world/humanity, because humanity/the world is evil!" really is.

Wasn't it more like "I want to destroy the world/humanity because I can… I AM STRONG!!!"?

Nekketsu

@KageKageKing:

Rave was a disappointment at the end of it's run.

Can you elaborate?

Johnny B. Decent

@ARTEMlS:

Wasn't it more like "I want to destroy the world/humanity because I can… I AM STRONG!!!"?

That was Acnologia. The one I mentioned was Zeref.

Nekketsu

The "I want to exterminate humanity because of its evils" is a valid argument and can potentially develop into something more complex and interesting as long as you do it well. Which is not the case here.

ARTEMlS

@Robby:

In terms of successful long runners, maybe its kind of bland and pointless.

But it's nowhere neeeeeear the actual worst. Not by a long shot.

Well, Sturgeon's law says something like 90% of everything is crud.

It's just so bland, generic and mediocre. B… But... J-Just the mere thought scares me, b-but...

! it's not even part of that 90%?! Just the single fact that it starts with a decently working first chapter puts it somewhat high. Really, if that were true, what does the actual worst really look like?!

KageKageKing

@Nekketsu:

Can you elaborate?

That Ellie Twist was lame. Was even explained how did she lived through almost 100 years without aging? 2 characters, one being a last minute party member and ProtoNatsu were supossed to have died but survived with no clear explanation. Julia was handled badly. Why the fuck was Ruby still around? What does Haru's ultimate sword really does? What is the deal with the four arms dude hanging around with them for a short while?

Also, Earth Demon Orácion Seis that whooped their asses earlier came back just to be one-shotted by Haru.

Nekketsu

@KageKageKing:

Also, Earth Demon Orácion Seis that whooped their asses earlier came back just to be one-shotted by Haru.

I remember that one. For some strange reason I found that part hilarious, probably because I had forgotten about that guy, and by the time he came back the Orácion Seis were no more.

Robby

@ARTEMlS:

Well, Sturgeon's law says something like 90% of everything is crud.

It's just so bland, generic and mediocre. B… But... J-Just the mere thought scares me, b-but...

! it's not even part of that 90%?! Just the single fact that it starts with a decently working first chapter puts it somewhat high. Really, if that were true, what does the actual worst really look like?!

Fairy Tail at the very least had decent art to look at, and did reasonable on the fanservice if that's your thing. It may have failed on the development and plot, but it's basically an unoffensive shonen adventure. In that genre at least, SAO is probably worse just off the top of my head.

But then you get to the hentai and the horror comics, there's a lot of ground for bad bad stuff. Then you get things like Kodomo no Jikan which is about a third grader trying to seduce her teacher….

But as a general rule, if a series ran for 10+years... it may be bad compared to the stuff you've read, but it's almost certainly not the worst.

AfroSamurai

@Halfmetal-lich:

Except there are no character relationships, well aside from the ONLY worthwhile developed one in the entire series: Gajeel and Levy

Because that actually goes through development and growth, from enemies, to allies to a couple

Everyone else? They are literally the exact same from the start of the series, until the end. Nothing changes.

We see Grey go through..what three different attempts to be like Sasuke and NOTHING comes of it. NOTHING.

There is no meaningful long term character development in any of the main cast at all.

AT. ALL.

Go through Mashima's twitter feed and let me know if Natsu and Lucy playing kinky bondage with a leash choker doesn't confirm them as a couple. It sure does for me.

and reverse

not to mention this adorable thing

and this one too

Also, in the same Onsen tweets we see Juvia and Grey naked together in the Onsen. That's another ship confirmed. (NSFW)

and

(lol)

Erza's ship is also confirmed in a few tweets by Mashima where he draws them kissing and stuff. (he calls it a crappy idea though)

and

Nekketsu

Some people are going to be mad he didn't do that in the manga itself. Though is not like there's any need for.

Don Quichotte De Flamingo

Mashima should produce ecchi of his own series, just as he always wanted to do.

KageKageKing

Natsu and Lucy are as much a couple as Ash and Dawn were.

Halfmetal-lich

@AfroSamurai:

Go through Mashima's twitter feed and let me know if Natsu and Lucy playing kinky bondage with a leash choker doesn't confirm them as a couple. It sure does for me.
and reverse
not to mention this adorable thing
and this one too

Also, in the same Onsen tweets we see Juvia and Grey naked together in the Onsen. That's another ship confirmed. (NSFW)
and
(lol)

Erza's ship is also confirmed in a few tweets by Mashima where he draws them kissing and stuff. (he calls it a crappy idea though)
and

So Mashima decided to play the shipping card, because his characters were worth nothing else aside from showing them in increasingly pornographic situations. Instead of, actual character development.

Did you see that in other long running manga? You never saw that in Bleach, or Naruto, or One Piece, or Dragon Ball.

onemoment

@KageKageKing:

5 months later….

That's pretty blatant sexual harassment. I've always assumed that Natsu was supposed to be like an immature big brother of Lucy, but there is a limit. I love that kind of joke initially, but after realizing how much time Natsu took stroking Lucy's nipples it's clear he went too far.

Is that comment more or less sexual in the context of this tweet? I'm not sure. I mean, it's literally what happened–there's no denying it.

AfroSamurai

@Halfmetal-lich:

So Mashima decided to play the shipping card, because his characters were worth nothing else aside from showing them in increasingly pornographic situations. Instead of, actual character development.

Did you see that in other long running manga? You never saw that in Bleach, or Naruto, or One Piece, or Dragon Ball.

I mean… don't get me wrong I really don't like the stupid amount of fanservice in fairytail, I think the story is trash, and I didn't even finish the manga! But the ships are all well foreshadowed, so having them confirmed on twitter a few months after the series ends is nice. I agree that the motive is pretty shit, but I'm still glad he's recognizing the ships.

Oh and Naruto and Bleach both completely offscreened their characters reaching meaningful stable relationships, I don't mind Mashima showcasing it (even if it's lewd), it's more than what Naruto and Bleach did.

Halfmetal-lich

True, but I wasn't talking about ships or romance, if I was, Fairy Tail would get an A grade.

I'm talking about everything else that Mashima either failed, or refused to deliver in a manga that, when I first started reading thought had TONS of potential, but it was squandered more and more over time.

I'm not even mad, just disappointed. Like Mass Effect Andromeda Disappointed.

KageKageKing

Natsu and Lucy didn't even became official couples in the end.

Kaido King of the Beasts

This post is deleted!

Neaeran

https://www.inquisitr.com/4855519/fairy-tail-2018-release-date-new-manga-sequel-confirmed-by-hiro-mashima-new-anime-season-is-final/

Rejoice!! Our prayers have been answered! We're getting more Fairy Tail!

Halfmetal-lich

Well, at least it gets its ending.

Looking at you Bleach.

onemoment

You know what? Good. I'm glad this is coming back. Things have happened between now and then that have opened me up to this. Plus, heck, good for anime followers that they get their conclusion.

I'm going to change my expectations, and maybe I'll have more fun this time. Maybe I'll take a drink every time Natsu does something to Lucy that would be either horrible, illegal, or both in real life. I probably won't, but I'm thinking. :ninja:

Long John Silvers Rayleigh

I predict the anime will make things 20% better, so whatever you're number is out of 10 for the manga, just multiply it by 1.2 and the anime will get there.

! In before 0 x any number = 0

Thatanas

So it's a spin-off manga? Is it for sure we'll get the entire maincast to participate?

Anyhow, glad the weekly complaints are returning, not enough of those these days.

Dark-Abel

Now the question is will this spin-off be a hentai ? :ninja:

Halfmetal-lich

@Dark-Abel:

Now the question is will this spin-off be a hentai ? :ninja:

I mean, probably?

And hey, one of Mashima's best qualities is his sheer love and effort he puts into his work. You can tell he loves the world and the characters. I just find his characters and world to be shit.

But I respect that passion and his drive. So good on him.