Well Oda just mentioned it here and there. SH were pretty excited about it so you couldn't help but do the same. And yes, the Fishman Dojo thing. I think it's the first time I've seen Oda mention a person or a locale that didn't appear in the story afterwards.
One Piece Chapter 747: Executive Officer Pica
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Well Oda just mentioned it here and there. SH were pretty excited about it so you couldn't help but do the same. And yes, the Fishman Dojo thing. I think it's the first time I've seen Oda mention a person or a locale that didn't appear in the story afterwards.
Well yeah, they were excited, but we got to see all the stuff they were excited for.
It wasn't the hype that made Fishman Island inferior to a lot of other arcs, it was a lot of other things lol
Did we even get any mention of the dojo? I really need to read through it again.
With Hack and Koala apparently both being instructors and on the move, maybe the dojo has just been relocated.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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Well yeah, they were excited, but we got to see all the stuff they were excited for.
It wasn't the hype that made Fishman Island inferior to a lot of other arcs, it was a lot of other things lol
Did we even get any mention of the dojo? I really need to read through it again.
With Hack and Koala apparently both being instructors and on the move, maybe the dojo has just been relocated.
Oda first mentioned it in an SBS way back, when someone asked him where does one learn fishman karate. I think it was around Arlong arc.
And Hachi mentioned it was the pride of Fishman Island, or a big tourist spot. That was just before the time skip. Caimie mentioned wanting to go to Mermaid Caffe and Hachi was all for the Dojo. I guess it's possible it moved in the course of 2 years, but I think it would at least have been mentioned.
http://mangasee.com/manga/?series=OnePiece&chapter=593&index=1&page=14
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Oda first mentioned it in an SBS way back, when someone asked him where does one learn fishman karate. I think it was around Arlong arc.
And Hachi mentioned it was the pride of Fishman Island, or a big tourist spot. That was just before the time skip. Caimie mentioned wanting to go to Mermaid Caffe and Hachi was all for the Dojo. I guess it's possible it moved in the course of 2 years, but I think it would at least have been mentioned.
I meant whether we got any mention of the dojo while the SH's were actually on Fishman Island.
Hack and Koala could easily have joined the revolutionaries in the last 2 years and uprooted the dojo (metaphorically).
To be fair, there were some bigger things going on in Fishman Island that kind of obscured the possible removal of the dojo lol
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I still believe it will pop up somewhere. Oda doesn't forget stuff.
Maybe in a Revolutionary base in New World.
On the island of Zou.(?)
This guy here, Zou Rong, wrote a fucking book called "The Revolutionary Army".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zou_Rong -
Yeah, I expect the dojo will turn up at some point.
I wonder if Sanji would be able to assimilate some aspects of fishman karate into his kicks.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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I wonder if Sanji would be able to assimilate some aspects of fishman karate into his kicks.
Well, with Jinbe joining the crew, I don't think it's all that likely, to be honest. Oda likes to keep the fighting styles of his characters fairly distinctive, and that would infringe quite heavily on Jinbe's personal territory, wouldn't you say?
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Well, with Jinbe joining the crew, I don't think it's all that likely, to be honest. Oda likes to keep the fighting styles of his characters fairly distinctive, and that would infringe quite heavily on Jinbe's personal territory, wouldn't you say?
I said assimilate aspects, like the whole delayed reaction shit they have going on and whatever.
Nothing that would seriously overlap with Jinbei's consummate mastery of Fishman Karate.
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shrugs
I could see him figuring out a trick or two on the basis of how Fishman Karate works, but not directly borrowing their techniques. Of course, if that's what you meant by assimilating aspects, I fully expect this to happen.
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shrugs
I could see him figuring out a trick or two on the basis of how Fishman Karate works, but not directly borrowing their techniques. Of course, if that's what you meant by assimilating aspects, I fully expect this to happen.
That's precisely what I mean.
Like Luffy assimilating the ideas behind Soru.
I don't mean Sanji might start using 5000 tile kicks or anything lol
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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That's precisely what I mean.
Like Luffy assimilating the ideas behind Soru.
I don't mean Sanji might start using 5000 tile kicks or anything lol
He should do the same with friction that Jinbe does with the water in the air and in people's bodies and just remotely light people on fire. I think a few of us could use an occasional fodder steak well charred.
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Well, considering how flexible Luffy's morality is…
But seriously. It's the critisism againts narrative for not providing that stuff. Rebecca, Law and some similarities to Goa? That's bloody weak, compared to what we've got in other arcs.
But, for example, I would've liked more if the final battle was between Law and Doflamingo. Who have much deeper connection to one another. Or Fujitora and Doflamingo, but that's partialy my fanboyism speaking. But, as well, his dream is deposing Shichibukai, and I, for one, would like if he got some moraly good actions under his belt.
Luffy, in this scenario, feels like a tool. Or rather, like the raging dog, to be released upon arc's boss and beat him senseless. His personal stakes in this are not completly lacking... but weak, nonetheless.
at the end of the day luffy just wants to be the man with more freedom and become the pirate king. freedom (wether applied to him or somebody else) should be his only morality, and he's willing to kick dd ass because of that. If you don't think freedom is a worthy motivation to do something like that it's perfect fitting your personality (at least what you show here) and the characters you like. but if you think the morality of akainu is better only for his lack of flexibility i just can't say nothing more.
But seriously..it's not that i think the storytelling as of late is flawless, i just think we have to see it on perspective. we don't know yet the future role of a lot of characters so it's too early to mark as bad writing some choices.
besides of that i appreciate that oda is stressing the narrative limits of the format he's choosen 20 years ago. we got more characters, more things to consider, more details and more subplot. and its really more difficult to manage spacing, storytelling and actions finding a balanced result.i'm seeing this arc as the introduction of luffy to the new world, the occasion where he got the proper bulk of allies to compete with yonkous, marines, other supernovas or with guys like dd and i expect he has to overcome more and more difficulties and become more and more powerful striving to reach his goal.
one piece at the beginning was simple, few characters, few ideas well developed and so on. was oda so much younger too. oda right now (i guess) is a very different person from the one who started one piece, like we were, and we should not expect the same recipe he gave us 20 years ago.
wether you like the actual one piece or not is subjective, but i really don't see the point of a lot of talks besides the cult of your own personality
"I'm simply an accident. Why take it all so seriously?"
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at the end of the day luffy just wants to be the man with more freedom and become the pirate king. freedom (wether applied to him or somebody else) should be his only morality, and he's willing to kick dd ass because of that. If you don't think freedom is a worthy motivation to do something like that it's perfect fitting your personality (at least what you show here) and the characters you like. but if you think the morality of akainu is better only for his lack of flexibility i just can't say nothing more.
Straw man.
Also, it would be fine if his stated reason of going after Doflamingo was his need for freedom. It's not.
But seriously..it's not that i think the storytelling as of late is flawless, i just think we have to see it on perspective. we don't know yet the future role of a lot of characters so it's too early to mark as bad writing some choices.
besides of that i appreciate that oda is stressing the narrative limits of the format he's choosen 20 years ago. we got more characters, more things to consider, more details and more subplot. and its really more difficult to manage spacing, storytelling and actions finding a balanced result.For the same, it's too early to mark them as good.
Logicaly, if we cannot judge something as negative, we cannot judge it as positive as well.
So, if we go by your logic, we would need to stop discussing chapters entirely until the entire story is done.
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It was always a means to an end ie it was a necessary stopping point to get to the New World.
It's a pretty grand sign of Fishman Island's failure as a story that you think of it like that.
At least Vivi had some interesting qualities. Law is… well, his only quality is being cool. In that quite annoying way. Well, I guess having hax powers could be a quality as well...
Yes. I'm still hopeful that Law will shine later on, and hence that we will look back on this all fondly :p
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It's a pretty grand sign of Fishman Island's failure as a story that you think of it like that.
I was talking purely in terms of "hype".
An arc like Wano, now that has been superhyped.
Fishman Island was only ever a location to go through to get to the New World, up until they got there, obviously
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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I think the reason Fishman Island was so hyped was because of a potential confront with Jinbe.
Then later, his potential joining.
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I think the reason Fishman Island was so hyped was because of a potential confront with Jinbe.
Then later, his potential joining.
I wouldn't say it was even particularly hyped by that tbh.
Even at that, that was one of the things Fishman Island actually delivered, so once again, I don't think the failure of the arc had anything to do with hype.
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I wonder how he will join, also makes you think around what chapter that will happen. The crew seriously needs a badass fishman like Jinbe.
"I live Based, so don't try to be Based" - Lil B
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I wouldn't say it was even particularly hyped by that tbh.
Even at that, that was one of the things Fishman Island actually delivered, so once again, I don't think the failure of the arc had anything to do with hype.
Why was fishman island a failure in your opinion?
Sig commin soon.
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Why was fishman island a failure in your opinion?
It was just pretty bland.
The villains weren't great, I mean they were always going to be punching bags coming immediately after the SH timeskip training but their personalities did very little to make up for it.
Hody, in particular, was just really, really two-dimensional. Especially in comparison to his mentor, Arlong.
The setting was likewise very, very basic and didn't offer any of the creativity we usually see in OP locations.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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You know, at this point, the only for an arc to not be disappointing is if it comes from nowhere and has no foreshadowing whatsoever, so it can't be affected by hype backlash.
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_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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I wouldn't say so.
There's a big difference between hype and foreshadowing.
Foreshadowing wasn't the right word I was looking for. I was thinking more on "build-up".
God knows how disappointing it would be if Raijin Island was never visited.
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I wonder how he will join, also makes you think around what chapter that will happen. The crew seriously needs a badass fishman like Jinbe.
Even thought jinbe already agreed, i am not so sure he will. Has he something special? Former shichibukai, master of the fishmen karate or his mere appearance as a fishmen? Sure that could count as special, but imo it needs something that is special for a fishmen. Fishmen with devilfruit or maybe a human who can use fishmen karate. Just some thoughts ^^. Jinbe imo has only brutal force and knowledge what he can add. And of course a convenient ability. Maybe it's enough "uniqueness"…
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It was just pretty bland.
The villains weren't great, I mean they were always going to be punching bags coming immediately after the SH timeskip training but their personalities did very little to make up for it.
Hody, in particular, was just really, really two-dimensional. Especially in comparison to his mentor, Arlong.
The setting was likewise very, very basic and didn't offer any of the creativity we usually see in OP locations.
I wouldn't say it was a bad arc though . Average by One Piece standards but it did / does get lots of hate for no reason .
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It was just pretty bland.
The villains weren't great, I mean they were always going to be punching bags coming immediately after the SH timeskip training but their personalities did very little to make up for it.
Hody, in particular, was just really, really two-dimensional. Especially in comparison to his mentor, Arlong.
The setting was likewise very, very basic and didn't offer any of the creativity we usually see in OP locations.
Well thats where opinnions differ.
IMO Hody is a great excample that Arlong was a great villain.
His hatred was justyfied because he was with the sun pirates. He lived Tigers death.
Hody was just born by it. That was the theme. He had to be shallow. Or else the Queens death
and everything she was fighting for was meaningless.Also we learned alot on Jinbe, Luffy claimed FI and got alot of info on different kind of things.
Big mums apearance, Admirals fight, Ancient weapons etc. etc.
Plot-wise it was necesary.
I Still think that FI should not be judged for its fights.Sig commin soon.
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The only thing i didn't liked about FMI is Luffy vs Hody and Noah. That just lasted way too long.
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Hody was just born by it. That was the theme. He had to be shallow.
Hody didn't have to be shallow. He was only shallow because Oda made him that way to in part show how stupid, empty, and meaningless racism is. Hody was just a racist. Stupid, empty, and meaningless. He wasn't even a villain you loved to hate. You just hated him.
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Hody was a fine villian… but only on paper. The way his was handled by Oda is dissapointing
Thing is, Luffy should have one-shotted him and his entire crew without all that crap with kidnapped king, handicapped fight etc. Then the arc would last 30-40 chapters and would have been much more bearable. -
Going full circle: So he had to be shallow to fulfil his role.
That doesn't make the FI fiasko any better though.:ninja:
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Well thats where opinnions differ.
IMO Hody is a great excample that Arlong was a great villain.
His hatred was justyfied because he was with the sun pirates. He lived Tigers death.
Hody was just born by it. That was the theme. He had to be shallow. Or else the Queens death
and everything she was fighting for was meaningless.Also we learned alot on Jinbe, Luffy claimed FI and got alot of info on different kind of things.
Big mums apearance, Admirals fight, Ancient weapons etc. etc.
Plot-wise it was necesary.
I Still think that FI should not be judged for its fights.It's not just the fights. Everyone there was kind of lame. Except Jinbe, of course. Just compare people from FI to comparable characters in Alabasta or Dressrosa (okay, the second is harder because it's unfinished).
Like Neptune. He was boring. See Cobra and King Riku.
Or Shirahoshi. She was just about okay, but she's no Vivi. I feel like she's about as interesting as Rebecca, and Rebecca's role is so much smaller.
Or the princes. They were actually atrociously bad. Two of them were barely even worth remembering. Even Fukaboshi is forgettable compared to the likes of Pell or Igaram. Or Kyros?
You could go on for a little bit, and then you'd run out of people to compare. Fishman Island has kind of boring villains. I think Hody being as he is would have worked fine if it hasn't been treated as a big reveal, but the arc really needed better supporting characters to keep it exciting. Alabasta got a great selection of supporting characters (Vivi, Cobra, Pell, Carue (lol), Kohza, Smoker and Tashigi were all indicidually excellent) and it's got a somewhat similar structure, so the comparison … hurts :p
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Straw man.
Also, it would be fine if his stated reason of going after Doflamingo was his need for freedom. It's not.
For the same, it's too early to mark them as good.
Logicaly, if we cannot judge something as negative, we cannot judge it as positive as well.
Sure, and I don't mark them as good. There's just something somebody already accomplished that I liked. Like Sabo winning the Mera Mera, and others.
So, if we go by your logic, we would need to stop discussing chapters entirely until the entire story is done.
I understand what you say and I usually tend to be too much polarized on my opinions so in a certain way you are right. Still we could talk about what already happened and what could happen in the next episodes. Anyway, i don't want nobody to act like I would and i am sorry I mostly reply with negative matters, but I always feel like I'm on the verge of stopping reading this forum because of the time I loose reading uninteresting thing. I'm not the type of guy with ignore list, and still if I keep reading it it's because I learn so much, it's just that it's time consuming and it bothers me. Me complaining too won't do any better tho
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Don't know why you guys are bashing FI so much, I mean Oda already foreshadowed what might happen on the near future, so I can definitely see Oda showing us the promise land at large this time around with Fishmans like Hack who are pirates, revolutionaries or Marines but are working their ass off somewhere else and will join hands in order to fight whoever is going to go to Fishman Island to destroy it later on, we can even argue that this is Oda's plan after all and that's the reason he didn't show the Dojo the first time
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Don't know why you guys are bashing FI so much, I mean Oda already foreshadowed what might happen on the near future, so I can definitely see Oda showing us the promise land at large this time around with Fishmans like Hack who are pirates, revolutionaries or Marines but are working their ass off somewhere else and will join hands in order to fight whoever is going to go to Fishman Island to destroy it later on, we can even argue that this is Oda's plan after all and that's the reason he didn't show the Dojo the first time
Whatever Oda's plans for the future are, they don't change the fact that the FI arc we're discussing right now was pretty damn bad by OP standards.
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good chapter. Very good chapter
