I am so sorry for the wall of text. hope you don't tl;dr me. :·S
@Ryuksgelus:
Pretty sure Jet Gattling can go through bedrock since it went through Enies Lobby stone walls. You have to assume a military fortress has reinforced buildings to survive possible battleship assaults from pirates or whatever. Luffy strength isn't really inconsistent. Like real life a person like Luffy isn't going to hit full force all the time. Like Sanji attacking the Fishrider boss, possibly Blueno, clearly didn't Bellamy as hard as he could. Luffy's strength can't fluctuate so much that poisoned and exahausted he managed to pull out more strength than WB 3rd division captain. That bleach/Ichigo level nonsense.
You can add all the mortar or "reinforcement" you want to a wall that is about 3-6 feet thick and in an upright position, but it's NEVER going to offer more resistance than the full weight of 30 - 60 feet of earth and rock. Never. That is quite beyond anything we've seen so far that isn't Gear 3rd, and that's back in the time we're Luffy wasn't capable of anywhere near that destruction. Hell, without Gear 3rd, he probably isn't now. Really, punching through bedrock is just insane, completely insane. So I'd say it's pretty inconsistent, at least in the sense that he is capable of extraordinarily superhuman feats of strength that just aren't available to him most of the time. I dare you to find reasonable people in this forum who think that punching through bedrock was at the time something he should've been able to pull off. And I agree with them.
@Ryuksgelus:
Unphased? He never screamed out in pain but he had bruises and blood gushing everywhere so its a little much to say he was unphased. He has high pain tolerance, but that shouldn't matter against Joz.
Okay, unphazed may be an incorrect evaluation, but up to that point he had taken a lot of large hits from Luffy and yet was nowhere near collapsing. He never even made an exclamation. Pain tolerance aside, his body could have taken a lot more punishment.
@Ryuksgelus:
No. Think Lucci was more than a little winded. He had lots of collected damage which is why Luffy had to hit him so many times.
Okay. Well, it depends on what you consider "more than a little". What we know was that he thought he was fully capable of Geppou-ing over to where the Strawhats were and killing them all, even the strong ones. So unless you believe his own assessment of his battle strength at the time was wrong, I'm thinking he was relatively okay. Bruised, but nothing he couldn't handle. Yet when Luffy hit Lucci, every single punch he landed broke Lucci's tekkai. Luccis tekkai was stronger than a regular Jet Pistol. Are you implying that normally a Gatling's punches are stronger than a regular Pistol? I'd say equal, at most. And yet all of those punches broke through tekkai as if it were styrofoam. Again, a completely different power from what we had previously seen. I don't have a big issue with this strength coming from determination and desperation at all, but you seem to.
@Ryuksgelus:
All Blueno said was that Luffy suprised him because he didn't show that strength at the mansion. Their strength didn't skyrocket due to pure willpower. They were confused about Robins allegiences and caught off guard at CP9's highly impressive physical abilities. Nobody since Barouqe works had matched them physically. Simply weren't trying their hardest and before they could get their barrings Luffy of all people took both of them out. All blueno did was use the paper dodge move to avoid a half-assed gatling. Once they got to Enies Lobby all they did was use their full strength, only pulling out new power to finish off each member. Adrenaline also has to be taken into account, not outter physical manifestations a persons spirit.
Sure they were confused about Robin's allegiances, but that aside, they also had self-preservation to take into account, not only Robin. They got completely owned and launched a half an island away. Zoro got fucked up with one Shigan. Later on he took like a gazillion Rankyakus and a ton of hits. Luffy was completely humilliated. There was an actual real danger of getting killed, and yet you are saying that they half-assed it because they were confused? They were completely outclassed. Yet when they achieved the motivation and drive to fight for something they outgrew any possible predicitons.
They leaped in power without any "training arcs" that we so hate. In any other Manga we would have called total bullshit on the fact that suddenly all these enemies were supermen that seemed completely out of their league and suddenly they were fighting equally. One Piece is all about how motivation and amibition make you fight harder towards getting what you want. I believe this is the reason for the Strawhat's insane powerup that made them able to face up to the seemingly insurmountable challenge.
@Ryuksgelus:
Yes he has. In Arlong park Luffy couldn't even get his feat unstuck from a stone panel, he had to use two arms to throw a boulder(long way from an Iceberg) at Kuro, then in Skypiea he ran up the beanstalk with the gold ball, also pushed apart two large buildings after being stabbed by Lucci. Having such strength after getting stabbed is also a sign of improvement, as Crocs hook completely incapacitated him. Its subtler than most series but their base physical strength has gone up slighly every arc.
It's kind hard to break free from something when you have nothing to push or pull against. Besides, you seem to forget Luffy flinging a multi-ton seaking with relative ease. Also, are you saying that this http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/30/14/ isn't enough strength to break himself off of the floor if he could've used his whole body strength? 'Nuff said. Just venture a guess as to how much strength that requires.
The Gold Ball is fairly unimpressive, and more a feat of stamina than anything else.
The other is more endurance, not pure physical strength. He could've done the buildings before as well.
What I mean is that I don't believe he has gotten that much stronger at all. The strength has been there since the beginning. Now he needs the mental strength to push his body and mind above the limit of his current strength. Gear 2nd is a temporary crutch, but it's clearly not enough.
@Ryuksgelus:
It sounds like the rest of your post is trying to say determined convicted Luffy>Serious Jozu and that just cannot be right due to a lot of things I've brought up and other factors others could
The rest of my post is saying that if and when Luffy unlocks his true potential strength he will be stronger than Jose. Luffy is a purely physical fighter. Jose seems to be one as well. If he doesn't become more powerful than Jozu then he will never be the Pirate King. So if at some point, Luffy inadvertently unlocked part of that potential, then yes, I have no problem in saying that the strongest attack from a (haki?) or super strong Luffy, that deals out 1000+ punches is more powerful than 1 Jose body slam.
In an earlier post you said that Luffy was simply more serious and not as careless or reckless with his actions. While that may be true, his recklessness and devil may care personality was a sign that he was truly confident of his power. I believe that until he regains that confidence, and truly believes that he can measure up to the powers that surround him, he won't be able to use haki or win in the New World. Luffy may have gotten wiser, but I believe that he has to unlearn his caution, because it was when he was the least doubtful and most determined that he managed to surpass his own strength. Caution = Doubt. He needs to attack with all his heart if he ever hopes to use Haki.
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