Chapter 512 "No Contact From Zoro" Discussion

LightningAce

Am i the only one, who had problems reading the Chinese raw? Apart from the page 2-3 , the rest don't work for me.

Hinscher

1. Regarding Luffy, I don't care how tired Luffy was supposed to be. For starters, the SHs shouldn't have been that winded fighting the PX-4, and Oda is pulling the same card he did in W7. Luffy couldn't fight Blueno because he was distracted by Robin leaving, and now Luffy can't fight Sentoumaru b/c he's distracted by Zoro. And don't get me wrong, I don't mind characters being stronger than Luffy, but I feel like Sentoumaru is too much stronger than Luffy.

2. I really don't know if I buy this Luffy is suffering internal damage from using gear second. this was lucci's hypothesis about the side-effects of luffy's technique. lucci's doesn't have luffy's rubber body and can only guess at how much (if any) luffy's body is damaged by him using gear second. so i really don't think this is the reason for luffy's fatigue. i'd put my money on sentoumaru dealing the damage.

3. the point isn't being caught off-guard, b/c we've seen Apoo catch Kizaru off-guard before. the point is the rayleigh is capable of making kizaru bleed even though kizaru is a logia user, and we've seen no use of DF from rayleigh so far. this is the importance of the scene with the bloody cheek.

1. Why can't they be that tired. From what we saw of the fight it was basically them owning PX-4 the whole time, never taking a hit. So obviously a lot of off screen stuff cause we see them all bleeding and exausted and what not. And since Sentomouru is it appears the PX's or pacifistas commander/general/leader or whatever you want to call it, why would he not be able to just be way stronger than luffy. From what we saw of PX fight, it would seem Luffy would not even be able to win on his own.

2. Yea I wouldn't take Lucci's word for it normally, but pretty sure that is odas way of telling us that is what is going on, so it is true. But i don't think the whole damage from gear's is why he is so beat right now and getting owned. Sentemarou is that much stronger. He even knows he don't have to use his sword. (okay lets say we have Zoro tell someone that he ain't even gonna use his swords) Thats what Sentemarou is saying basically

3. Yea i can't really understand the whole people thinking rayleigh would catch him off guard. (umm he is rayleigh, first mate of roger, dark king, ect.) pretty sure no sane person would ever be caught off guard by hiim when you know him and he is standing in front of you

AlmostLegendary

@brennen.exe:

I am going to against all I have been rooting for up until now and go out on a limb here. Chances are I will have to recall this post later since it will get rolled over by so many "0MmGz Zoro!!!!!" posts and Thank-you posts.
I have to admit that I don't like it either, but two things come to mind:

[1] We know that Luffy is pretty tired out, and hasn't really taken the "I really have to fight this guy seriously" stance yet. So let's not give in just yet. (For Luffy, that is).
[2] This is the part I don't even want to say, but: ^^ Referring to your quote, maybe Oda really is trying to tell us something with the whole Haki jargan. We have another Logia pop up on the grid, another fighter capable of hurting Luffy without a DF / issue with Luffy's DF, and we have Rayleigh who can seemingly fight Logia's with something and can also use Haki ~~ and does so quite freely.

Maybe, and I do not want to think this way myself, but maybe Haki/Spirit will have something to do with Luffy's advancement in technique etc. Whether or not it is the means to fighting a Logia, who can say? Whether or not it is how Sentoumaru is attacking Luffy or not, we will have to find out. I am just tossing it out there for additional thought.

To bad luffy already said they should run since they can't handle the situation they're in right now.

Haki is shit. Doesn't do shit but make cannon fodder pass out. I wish you people would stop thinking it was some mystical superpower. Its not going to be effective in combat.

Neomaster121

@MonkeyDMalcolm:

To bad luffy already said they should run since they can't handle the situation they're in right now.

Haki is shit. Doesn't do shit but make cannon fodder pass out. I wish you people would stop thinking it was some mystical superpower. Its not going to be effective in combat.

so i guess ur explanation on silver cutting kizaru is seastones or df

cause i don't see none of them being used

Hinscher

I would put this show below Naruto level if Luffy is able to beat everyone here and save em all. You shoudl all realize how gay and stupid that would be.

The strawhats just got whiped out. That's it, accept it. It is just a matter of what the hell happens to them. "where is Zoro" "how many more get teleported away" "who manages to run away" "any get captured" "the marines get called back for some reason, though based on kizaur's tenruubito comment seems unlikely. or at least him" Those are really the only options right now, there is no winning.

igetownd

I wonder if a logia user with strong spirit is able to nullify spirit usage using his own spirit. It's like a double negative, except this time it means a positive. I mean if Rayleigh uses his will to cancel Kizaru's abilities, if a logia user could match Rayleigh in will, can he cancel out Rayleigh's will?

:ninja::ninja::ninja::ninja:

TokageMoria

Ama-no-Murakumo-no-Tsurugi

The original name for the Kusanagi no Tsurugi. Its the sword from the Three Sacred Treasures of Japan. It must be a shortened name (Amakumo no Tsurugi) or a slight mistranslation. I kept thinking it was Rayleigh who named his own sword, not Kizaru. I wonder what kind of technique is gonna be called "Yasakani no Magatama" the jewel or necklace from the tree treasures.

EDIT: I can see Luffy giving like one more punch that surprises whoever he hits, and thats why they get knocked over, but other than that, they're done for the day. There plan is gonna involve getting the fuck away from these monsters and then finding Zoro [With a hint from Kuma?] Also, If I were Kuma, I might want to smash the PX-1 for simply copying the way I look. Swear to God, Kumas characters is freaking based on Terminator and The 6th Day; Killer Robots and Clones. Bet 4kids would of given him an Arnold Schwarzenegger like voice if they were given the chance.

This is crazy.
Naruto and Bleach got 'translated' and updated on 'One Manga' last night.All the Bleach and Naruto forums I visit,mostly every member complains about the Manga yet it get's translated sraight away in tons of Languages.This is also the same for the anime's.

One Piece on the other hand get's lot's of praise eg. "Oda is God".OP is also the 3rd most popular manga in Japan.Yet it's been nearly 12 hours since the tranlators did Bleach and Naruto.This also applies to the anime.
I mean sometimes I have to wait a week for the subbed ep while other anime's e.g.Naruto,Bleach and Soul Eater get subbed straight off the mark!

EDIT:Sorry if this came off as me sounding ungrateful.I'm totally the opposite and applaud the translator's for thier awesome …...translation's.It's just that OP alway's get's left in the dust when it should be translated/subbed way before other manga's and anime's.It just get's on my nerves.

bedrock

@Hinscher:

I would put this show below Naruto level if Luffy is able to beat everyone here and save em all. You shoudl all realize how gay and stupid that would be.

The strawhats just got whiped out. That's it, accept it. It is just a matter of what the hell happens to them. "where is Zoro" "how many more get teleported away" "who manages to run away" "any get captured" "the marines get called back for some reason, though based on kizaur's tenruubito comment seems unlikely. or at least him" Those are really the only options right now, there is no winning.

I´d really love some realism like that, but actually I´m quite anxious that Oda (after that crazy buildup) might do something stupid like at the end of EL when the strawhats just jumped on to their ship and sailed away under the eyes of five vice admirals (that didn´t even try lifting a finger). I still feel sick when I remember that time. :sad:

brennen.exe

@MonkeyDMalcolm:

Too bad Luffy already said they should run since they can't handle the situation they're in right now.

From what I have read (only spoilers and a translation) he was saying that in their current condition they cannot fight/win. Meaning they are already too exhausted and tired/injured, so they need to retreat. Were you agreeing with me? Or being a smartass…? I wasn't sure.

@MonkeyDMalcolm:

Haki is shit. Doesn't do shit but make cannon fodder pass out. I wish you people would stop thinking it was some mystical superpower. Its not going to be effective in combat.

What do you mean, 'you people'? (j/k; j/k). I assume "you people" isn't referring to me because, since you quoted me, I know you read my full post, right? Like "going to against all I have been rooting for up until now", "I don't like it either", and "I do not want to think this way myself" ~~ were me only showing that with some of the potential evidence and hints Oda has been dropping I suppose it is possible. I mean, for instance, if it did happen you would look like an idiot, right? The only fact is, we do not know what Oda has planned to this "Haki". Only that it was significant enough to make comments among our protagonists, and even have it's own name and fame. It will develop more, and Luffy will end up using it intentionally eventually (foreshadowing), but do not know to what extent Haki's use will be.

m00n

I don't know for sure but since this is from Carlos, it's likely a Jp -> Eng Translation: http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37853

TokageMoria

@m00n:

I don't know for sure but since this is from Carlos, it's likely a Jp -> Eng Translation: http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37853

Oh, I was looking a a different one, but this one is much better.

Hinscher

@bedrock:

I´d really love some realism like that, but actually I´m quite anxious that Oda (after that crazy buildup) might do something stupid like at the end of EL when the strawhats just jumped on to their ship and sailed away under the eyes of five vice admirals (that didn´t even try lifting a finger). I still feel sick when I remember that time. :sad:

Well it will be some cheap way that they escape i'm guessing. You know like Rayleigh has kizaru totally preoccupied and maybe more so that even Sentomarou has to help out.

Kuma gets a call yelling at him for not heading over to WB, Chopper takes out Px1 or something. And then they basically limp away. but who knows. I would have never guessed all of this happening. And ha at all the poeple that though luffy would finally beat an admiral when the tenryuubito and punching was told by Hatchi.

smith

Kizaru: …Unfortunately, if I were to capture you here...... / You wouldn't exactly be... the easiest of captives to deal with, to say the least…

Now what does this mean?!

Zoro: Thanks to… the mercy you showed.

So Kuma did something off-screen.

Utoom

@Hinscher:

1. Why can't they be that tired. From what we saw of the fight it was basically them owning PX-4 the whole time, never taking a hit.

Owned it? With exception to Zoro (who's always injured) they were fully rested, went all out from the very start, and ALL of them fought him together. They used their best attacks, and after they took him down, they didn't even have the energy to move. How is that owning? Look at what's happening to them now as a result, they're getting completely wiped out -because- they had such a hard time with PX-4. And he didn't even have a DF fruit.

I'm hoping Zoro told Kuma to just teleport him somewhere nearby, to act as a distraction so the others can run…but the chapter title is more ominous.

Utoom

[quote=smith;942250
Zoro: Thanks to… the mercy you showed.

So Kuma did something off-screen.
The vastly more likely explanation is he's saying Kuma mercifully didn't completely expose him to all of Luffy's pain, so he was able to survive it.

smith

@Utoom:

The vastly more likely explanation is he's saying Kuma mercifully didn't completely expose him to all of Luffy's pain, so he was able to survive it.

Well, that would be "doing something off-screen", wouldn't it ?

Utoom

@smith:

Well, that would be "doing something off-screen", wouldn't it ?

Uh, how? He manifested the pain in front of Zoro. Zoro put his hands in it. The only thing that happened off-screen was Zoro taking all the damage. Which, as Zoro is implying, wasn't enough to kill him because Kuma didn't give it all to him.

CodedTech

@bedrock:

I´d really love some realism like that, but actually I´m quite anxious that Oda (after that crazy buildup) might do something stupid like at the end of EL when the strawhats just jumped on to their ship and sailed away under the eyes of five vice admirals (that didn´t even try lifting a finger). I still feel sick when I remember that time. :sad:

They didn't do that. There was a lot of preperation on the side of Sanji and Iceburg on top of the fact. They also fought back during that scene.

sugarboy

the raw is out in mangahelpers by franky-house
here is the link

PLEASE GUYS NO MIRRORS (request by original uploader)

^I love you^(In a non-gay way)

sugarboy

@Scratchmax:

^I love you^(In a non-gay way)

well… ummm... i l.o.v.e u 2 (in a non-gay way 2)..loooooool

don't mention it dude! actually i was waiting for the raw really bad so once i grabbed it i posted the link here..

cheers everybody!! another great chapter!!

Jacko

thx for the link
I'm really surprised that nobody is saing that Dragon will come to rescue.

Seriously, how could this situation be solved?
There has to be somebody who comes to help, but who?

I hope for the four owned captains, asking for a revenge.
I know that will never happen, but it would be an awesome oda move like always.

brennen.exe

Scanslated by Franky House

edit: I also cleaned up the Japanese RAW for a friend, if anyone is interested in it.

Neomaster121

i think i know why kuma there

kizaru's den den mushroom the one marines use to contact him was destroyed
Kuma can teleport from hq to kizaru to tell him and send him back instantly to hq for preparation for wb attack

he's the only one who can
it also explains what happened to garp n why he hasn't arrived

he could even say with Zoro taken care off the crew will be considerably weaker thus kizaru leaves n rest keave fight ends next chapter

then if he may have sent zoro back to the ship or wherever but not jail

KaizokuFan22

it would be intresting If Zoro is not the only one who gets teleported.
maybe the crew might be split up like part of the crew got teleported one place and the other part of the crew has to save the other team.
(stupid prediction, I know)

y2kyle89

@smith:

Kizaru: …Unfortunately, if I were to capture you here...... / You wouldn't exactly be... the easiest of captives to deal with, to say the least…

Now what does this mean?!

There would be a lot more paper work and general effort needed to imprison "Dark King and hey, I thought all of the Roger Pirates were executed?" Rayleigh than the effort to capture, say, "Some young upstart" Kidd.

mrkaizoku

Thanks so much for the raw! I was going crazy waiting for it!

I'm totally blown away by this chapter. I can't believe Raylee stopped Kizaru from 'teleporting'. Such an intense chapter. I'm off to read it again!

freedom

For the record, regarding Luffy and the other SHs being exhausted.
I'm not upset that the SHs just got owned, I expected this. I just would have liked some more information regarding why they were so exhausted after battling the Kuma-bot. From what we saw of the battle, the SHs did a few attacks, and then did their mega attacks to finish off PX-4. If there was off-screen action, it's not that I want to see it. But I want to at least have it acknowledged. Like a little panel, "Usopp: wow! we've been fighting him for 20 minutes now" or something.

About Sentoumaru owning Luffy, we already have tons of characters that can own luffy. maybe i'm just being a fan here, but having yet another one just pop up and even say, "i don't even need my axe" is a slap in the face and it seems like Luffy is out-classed even more than when he encountered Aokiji. I feel like the middle ground is missing.

Anybody got teh online version?

Blue-Eyes

@Utoom:

Uh, how? He manifested the pain in front of Zoro. Zoro put his hands in it. The only thing that happened off-screen was Zoro taking all the damage. Which, as Zoro is implying, wasn't enough to kill him because Kuma didn't give it all to him.

Its more like Zoro implies that Kuma showed mercy on him, because he chose this way for Zoro to die.

A survivable way!

Zoro took the pain and survived. Even Kuma is surprised! He really gave him everything, but Zoro's determination was bigger!

Guys… please don't make Zoro looking bad... Kuma didn't show mercy in that way... he is surprised AND it would crack his honor…

Besserwisser

@Urian:

The other part of the equation is Zoro, people says that he is out off the scene only because he is sustaining more injuries than the rest when the truth is that Kuma transferred Luffy pain and fatigue to Zoro and not his internal damage. Luffy was full of energy because the pain and fatigue in his body was in Zoro but the internal damage continued to be in Luffy.

@Utoom:

The vastly more likely explanation is he's saying Kuma mercifully didn't completely expose him to all of Luffy's pain, so he was able to survive it.

@Utoom:

Uh, how? He manifested the pain in front of Zoro. Zoro put his hands in it. The only thing that happened off-screen was Zoro taking all the damage. Which, as Zoro is implying, wasn't enough to kill him because Kuma didn't give it all to him.

Kuma: "So you actually lived.."
That is the proof that Kuma intent to kill Zoro. Further it proof once again that he transmitted all damage from Luffy to Zoro. You should read Thriller Bark again, the reason for this many blood next to Zoro is because he gets real damage not only pain and fatigue.

The line of argumentation you make to bash Zoro and let Luffy shine is embarrassing.

Neomaster121

@Blue-Eyes:

Its more like Zoro implies that Kuma showed mercy on him, because he chose this way for Zoro to die.

A survivable way!

Zoro took the pain and survived. Even Kuma is surprised! He really gave him everything, but Zoro's determination was bigger!

Guys… please don't make Zoro looking bad... Kuma didn't show mercy in that way... he is surprised AND it would crack his honor…

good point
Kuma could have killed Zoro by giving him luffy pain then when he took that pained blew his body to shreds but as u said maybe Zoro said that way was just a survivable way simular to mi hawk and the slash which really should have killed a normal man

Elric

Kuma's got to be the biggest coward ever to join the Chibibuki. Try coming out of hiding before everyone's wasted for a change.

Fiasco.

Anyone else interested to see how Chopper's monster form fairs against Sentomaru and Pacifista?

And it's good to see shounen characters showing their limits, especially sanji saying he could break his leg with another attack.

amizou

i just thought about something, luffy can take damage from sentoumaru even he is a rubber and sentoumaru is not a fruit user means that he fights the same way as Ray, so i guess there is a new fighting style which can stop not only logia but all fruit user.

freedom

@sugarboy:

the raw is out in mangahelpers by franky-house
here is the link

PLEASE GUYS NO MIRRORS (request by original uploader)

@brennen.exe:

Scanslated by Franky House

edit: I also cleaned up the Japanese RAW for a friend, if anyone is interested in it.

Thanks brennen.exe, can you post a link to the japanese raw. thanks.

Zkaiser

The sig of the scanlation provider. -not safe for work-
[hide][/hide]
That has to be the funniest thing I've seen all day.

Fiasco.

@amizou:

i just thought about something, luffy can take damage from sentoumaru even he is a rubber and sentoumaru is not a fruit user means that he fights the same way as Ray, so i guess there is a new fighting style which can stop not only logia but all fruit user.

Who was Ray again?

animegirl_117

Whoa! What an amazing chapter! Oda never dissapoints~ :D

amizou

@Fiasco.:

Who was Ray again?

i mean rayleigh just writing Ray is easier

DesertSpada

I must say that this chapter was amazing. Wow. To see everyone at their limit and try their hardest to get away from such powerful foes…..yet everything is so useless...

So the real Kuma showed up. I'm thinking that he got Zoro away on purpose, and this will actually help him. Moria was right when he said that Kuma troubled him the most. He's very unpredictable.

Wow. Great chapter.

EDIT: I'm thinking that with an Admiral and Vegapunk's Bodyguard seeing Chopper go into monster point, they'll adjust his bounty. Also, Brook will be added into the SH pirate posters.

Blue-Eyes

This post is deleted!

shen_ron

RAW - thanks to FH! -> Chapter 512

freedom

@Elric:

Kuma's got to be the biggest coward ever to join the Chibibuki. Try coming out of hiding before everyone's wasted for a change.

well, he is a pirate afterall :)

Miracles

@Scratchmax:

Anybody got teh online version?

http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-512/page001.html

@Freedom:

For the record, regarding Luffy and the other SHs being exhausted.I'm not upset that the SHs just got owned, I expected this. I just would have liked some more information regarding why they were so exhausted after battling the Kuma-bot. From what we saw of the battle, the SHs did a few attacks, and then did their mega attacks to finish off PX-4. If there was off-screen action, it's not that I want to see it. But I want to at least have it acknowledged. Like a little panel, "Usopp: wow! we've been fighting him for 20 minutes now" or something.

A few attacks? No the SH's used their BEST attacks, they even used "Mouton Jet" "106-Pound Cannon"!!! The fact that the SH's were shown bleeding and Zoro getting tag blasted by a lazer off panel shows how the SH crew was getting handled. The crew had to put even more effort in finishing the Pacafista [Luffy Gears 3 ect]. Not too mention Ussop and Robin being able to make the cyborg damage it's insides ALLOWING the Sh's to even finish the Pacafista off.

The reasons' why the SH's are fatigued is quite clear.

About Sentoumaru owning Luffy, we already have tons of characters that can own luffy. maybe i'm just being a fan here, but having yet another one just pop up and even say, "i don't even need my axe" is a slap in the face and it seems like Luffy is out-classed even more than when he encountered Aokiji. I feel like the middle ground is missing

What do you want? These are high tier Marines here.

Fiasco.

Kuma is a the fourth emperor, a double agent!

<<

I'm annoyed that ussop is so useless.

Wasurenai

After chopper goes all monster, theres someone on the tree, it could be Kuma but my guess is either Garp or Vegapunk.

Kaze

Wow if chopper loses to sentarumo I'm really going to be upset. :/
I mean I know he's slow but the axe guy doesn't look like he's much of a speed type. Which would be good for chopper since his speed is all but gone and turned it all into what can only be thought of as the stregnth of the Giants.

Man, I hope zoro's okay. I wouldn't be surprised if some one saved him. Ofcourse it would have to be some one we know who is fast enough to do that, in which case I would have no idea. lol

maybe it's one of the supernovas? I mean i highly doubt it, but hell you knever know. :P

Instead, if he WERE teleported, like someone else posted in another thread, maybe he was teleported in his book or something? I mean we can still only speculate on what that power is, and I think it's another devil fruit, if it's not I want an explination on how his paw paw fruit works! D:

So, Luffy is being beaten here by pushes. :/ uhhh what? Is what i thought when I first saw that, but I then realized that ofcourse there has to be way stronger people the the ones we already know about. Plus, add to the fact that he's already wooped from fighting at thehuman trade auction, beating a px-4, and now running away from an admiral. So yeah that guy doesn't need an axe to beat luffy, look at him he's completely spent. :P

and ha ha
lightsaber

Blue-Eyes

@Wasurenai:

After chopper goes all monster, theres someone on the tree, it could be Kuma but my guess is either Garp or Vegapunk.

Eh? You've seen someone in the tree or you think there might be someone?