@Outerspec:
@Nectar: Stop being so silly and melodramatic. We do have an anti-3rd Party ability. It's the same one we use against Mafia. It's called lynching.
You know I'm talking about abilities.
And it's not just about your win condition, but ours too. For Town it basically says eliminate "all threats". Where is your guarantee that at the end of the game if we kill all the Mafia and we all get altered it won't just say, '3rd Party Wins'?
'Town does not win because all threats weren't eliminated. You allowed 3rd Party to alter every single one of you and reach their win condition.'
Look at Trapped's death text. She died a Townie. Cults (and others like them) change a player's alignment one at a time. That's how they work. They don't all turn cult when a quota is reached.
If we did make Robots, again, Foolio wouldn't have to out himself. I'd die and Trapped/Harvady become Robots.
I bet you do not have a guarantee. What you have is a pedestal where you can high and mightily condemn Town's actions because we feel vulnerable from both sides. Mafia can't touch you but we just had our doctor killed. We mislynched twice and the second time was because of 3rd Party information (R.I.P. Iceburg) and a paranoid Townie who lied about his possible alteration (srry Ben).
Don't throw that in my face. I was given false information to form my conclusion.
How does "eliminate all threats" translate to, "you can also win if you've all been altered and another party reaches their win condition."
"Eliminate all threats" is standard wording in a Mafia game, Third-party or not.
I'm not saying it's possible but you are asking us to trust…what?
What we said and compare to it Trapped's death text and converted Townies.
@SpaceCowboy:
Or he died because he revealed that he had an ability and thus became a number one target, probably alongside with Harv
When playing as Mafia you lynch the biggest threat you can. This wasn't a flip-the-coin action. The Mafia was scared more of Trapped than Harvady.
You are not in mine, Outer´s and Harvs group (and i assume Tyrano and Gerri)
I know. And you know because I told you. As you can see, knowing I'd be killed for lying I either tell the truth or don't answer.
I can´t see what´s the problem.
Killing you would put us all in the same page in case you people have good intentions.
I would sacrifice a rook to get a queen, and everyone seems to have the same opinion.
I'm a poor man's Cop. A useful role. A role (by pairing up with Foolio) that will guarantee an accurate clear everyday even if Peter is randomly blocked.
@Wooden_Giraffe:
@Nectar: easy, you could be considered a "threat" to the town. Therefore we need you eliminate in order to win.
Honesty a lot of what you two say makes sense and I find much of it believable. But one of you has to flip before I can really trust it.
You've seen death text. My whole outing was about not being about to convert Mafia. Are you really not able to put it all together? Dead players show their alignment. If Trapped (and all converted Townies) became a Robot, again, Foolio outing himself would make NO sense.
@SpaceCowboy:
Also, and this is a question/proposal for everyone
I think it would be reasonable, if huey dewey and louie are as reliable as they claim, that, in the beginning of each day, the altered players come out from the start and claim they were altered, like what Outer did today.
Tyrano, Trappe, Outer and Harv (and Ben, or so he claims) have already been altered and they have written messages about that.
I feel like if Foolio or Nectar ask a direct question to a certain person, that person might say "Yes, I was changed" only because he was questioned and falsify his claim basing himself on the posts of the mentioned players.
By this point there are still a lot of players unchanged:
- Huschel
- Kubi
- Gerri
- Wooden
- Holly
- Me (assuming they can try to change me again)
Basically, this system would present a greater risk for a potential mafia liar trying to disguise himself.
Assuming Nectar will die, that person will only have a 1/3 change of getting it right.
If he is asked directly, than it´s 50%.
Also, this is not 100% reliable, considering someone can be blocked, but it can give us some clues.
Outer and Harv: What do you think?
Do you think this is a reliable system, or do you guys think you can make questions that can help identify a potential faker based on your messages?
There is no or little need for us to ask question because we were never converted. Tyrano and Outer are the ones who'll have to do the questioning.
@Harvady:
Continuing with what I just declared, if there is in fact, only one roleblocker, then that means you…machinists(?) can convert two people a day UNIMPEDED.
You really think the Mafia will waste their roleblocker on a Townie whose power they don't know instead of Foolio? You get one convert a Day.
Mafia can't kill you, which means that their bullets are only going to be for us townies with powers. Because of your claims, you have taken all of the mafia's attention off of you, and put it on US.
The Mafia's eyes are on cleared Townies who won't be lynched. You're welcome.
Speaking of which, keeping me alive will help clear Townies at a faster rate than the Mafia can kill them.
Every time you guys help yourselves, (determining role blockers, pushing wagons on townies, claiming to avoid lynches) you hurt TOWN.
Yes, our clearing Townies and coming up with plans to find Mafia is destroying the Town.
The Mafia was ALWAYS after the Town. Now, they have to deal with another group aiding them.
If Nectar is lynched, then we will gain new information that will make this either viable or impossible. I think it would be premature to determine its usefulness at this time.
However, in the event that a joint-win is possible, I would still argue that a townie who has not claimed a power is safer from a Night-Kill.
Killing me will hurt the Robots effectiveness clearing Town/finding scum. But, tell me what are you afraid of? Give me a way which the Robots can win given the information you have without the Town winning too.