General Zelda thread
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And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Actually, it's Twinrova. He wrote Twinvora.
Seriously, just kidding. I know what he meant.
Haha, so he did! xD
I was so focused on the Twin part that I missed the one after. Epic fail.
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The Hoover Boots are slippery, but I would never take them off from the moment I acquired them. They made bosses like Twinrova, Ganondorf and Bongo Bongo easier for me and it was fun to see Link sliding after being hit by Ganon swords.
Volvagia and Barinade gave me trouble in my first playtrough because I coulnd't dogde effectively the random rocks and jellyfishes, besides the stun received from electric attacks is too long.
Gyorg is more annoying than hard. You have to play safe with the bow in the center of the platform which normally takes a long time or play risky with Zora Link which normally results in being chomped. I consider Goht is harder with its random bombs, stalactites and rocks but the fight is too fun to care about the difficulty.
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Looks nice, I wonder how far they will get in development untill the inevitable cease and desist.
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that project has been going on for like 2 years now. I thought it was just the one off video. Apparently they want to take it to nintendo to show what they can do but if that's the case i'm assuming they are making it playable? Because otherwise i don't see this going anywhere, if that is the intention.
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I like when you fight Wizrobe in Stone Temple the game don't even bother playing the mini-boss music since you faced him like four times already.
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I just want Nintendo to actually remake Majora's Mask on the 3DS already.
I mean, seriously. Fans have already made them more than aware it's something we want, and Grezzo (The studio that did OOT3D) should still have all of the assets from OOT3D. The fact that The ORIGINAL MM reuses assets from the original OOT means that half their work should already be done for them.
So Nintendo, you take all that, then spend that extra development time making a MM Master Quest, slap it onto a 3DS cart, ship it, then kick back and sip drinks from coconuts while you wait for an intern to wheelbarrow in the huge pile of money it will make you.
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Didn't Grezzo imply that they were recruiting people to work on a "legend" a month or so ago?
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@Purple:
Didn't Grezzo imply that they were recruiting people to work on a "legend" a month or so ago?
Yeah. And Zelda Williams teased the shit out of it too at E3. So I can only assume it's happening.
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@Purple:
Didn't Grezzo imply that they were recruiting people to work on a "legend" a month or so ago?
Just looked it up, and YES!! Yes they Did!!!!
Not only do they clearly use "Densetsu" which is the Japanese word for Legend, which happens to be the exact same word for "Legend" used in the Japanese title of LoZ! (Tho, to be fair, it's also by far the most commonly used word for "Legend" from what I've seen)
BUT… add that... to THIS.
Looks like someone at Target dun goofed and made an open slot at the store for an unannounced product. It has a release date listed as "20141231" which is probably a placeholder, but yeah. The evidence is piling up that they're working on this!!
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The target rumor looks way too casually produced to be true, but Grezzo's probably working on it, so it'll probably show up at some point.
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Just you wait. The "legend" they're working on will be a 3D remake of The Wand of Gamelon.
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Just you wait. The "legend" they're working on will be a 3D remake of The Wand of Gamelon.
updated cut scenes so you can enjoy them in full 3D!
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Just you wait. The "legend" they're working on will be a 3D remake of The Wand of Gamelon.
nope it's a remake of Superman 64
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. . . . . . . I'm never going to get this Biggest Arrow Quiver, am I?
continues to bleed Rupees as she flings arrows at pots and targets on horseback T_T
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. . . . . . . I'm never going to get this Biggest Arrow Quiver, am I?
continues to bleed Rupees as she flings arrows at pots and targets on horseback T_T
ah yes one of my least favorite mini games
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. . . . . . . I'm never going to get this Biggest Arrow Quiver, am I?
continues to bleed Rupees as she flings arrows at pots and targets on horseback T_T
Oh yeah. That one took me forever too.
Well, just remember, you only need to win once. And when you do, it's quite satisfying.
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what if they remade all 3 cd-i zeldas on one disc with new animation and 3d models?
It would still be shit.
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Gerudo horse archery was fun.
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Yeah I honestly love the horseback archery and I never found it super challenging. Back when I was a crazy little kid I made it my goal to get a perfect score. I actually came within one shot of doing it, and I was so pissed. So my score was like 1960 or something.
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My high score was something like 1880. I always felt a little bit bad about it because of some of the Gerudo warriors telling that basically every stupid Gerudo NPC gets a perfect score in every try.
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The Skykeep was the only memorable dungeon in Skyward Sword.
Also finding random crap to make upgrades sounded more interesting than it turned out to be.
Bring back finding and winning set permanent upgrades around the world in mini-games and otherwise.Gratitude Crystals turned out to be huge bore as well. lol at having 80 instead of 100, and having like 20 of those be randomly hidden around the sky at night.
Too much effort to think up ways to use other totally useless NPC's on Skyloft.
Really weak attempt to emulate the Bomber's Notebook overall. Oh look they still give shitty rewards like in the Gold Skulltula quest too! At least that was fun to complete!
I'm not even going to finish it because that would require that insanely horrible Harp playing quest at the Empty Pumpkin. -
Oh God the harp mini game at the Lumpy Pumpkin. Huuuuuuuggggeeee pain in the ass and a big reason why I loathe the harp the most among shitty zelda musical items. It's like the perfect showing of why the motion controlled strumming is godawful and a huge waste of potential of actually giving the option of actually strumming and plucking actual selected notes.
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I wish that the rest of the horseback riding had been as fun as the Gerudo Archery section. I understand now that it was just glorified on rails shooting, but it was a lot more fun than having Epona speed off in whatever direction my seven year old self had her fly while I desperately flung arrows as quickly as I could before Poes would go off screen.
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Zelda Monopoly comes out next month:
http://www.gamestop.com/toys/monopoly-the-legend-of-zelda-gamestop-exclusive-edition/115791
Looks a little shoddy but I don't know if I'll be able to pass up the chance to own a hookshot token…
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I personally wish it'd be a different board game that's not monopoly. You know, like Risk.
Granted, then it'd be Hyrule Warriors Risk, and that's just not the same.
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More thoughts built from basically beating the game (all that's left is the final battles).
-I revise my opinion on Faron and Eldin. Eldin is actually the worst province in the game. It's the most linear by far, and the least interesting.
-Lanayru was easily the best, but even that didn't escape all the problems every overworld area had aside from retreading (they gave you new stuff there at least).
-Controls hardly ever got better. Sword fighting got worse the more they expected precision from a control scheme that is NOT precise. The two pirate dudes especially pissed me off.
-Skydiving is horrible and honestly feels unfinished.
-The harp is garbage, though thankfully and also pathetically feels like they decided to not actually make you play it like an instrument. I'm guessing BECAUSE the controls sucked. Like they were self-aware lol.
-The plot is a confusing garbled joke. Momentum? What momentum? Zelda runs off, and you chase after her. Then she….goes back in time to escape Girahim?? Really? That's the only way to do that possible? That massive plot contrivance? That then becomes even more of one when...they let her come back to the present (by way of sealing her until Demise is sealed) but the problem wasn't Demise breaking out it was Girahim I thought! And he in undealt with! And he uses the plot contrivance to make his own plot contrivance so that you can still have a final boss fight!.....Most of this happening without you the player even knowing whats going on until it is explained to you. The first half of the game is spent following Zelda and almost finding Zelda, and being told you're not actually worthy. And then the second half is spent making your sword stronger... so that you can get Zelda out of the portal that isn't even explained to you until you do...and when it is see above for why that was dumb....only for her to tell you also that she can't actually do anything yet because Demise might wake up....even though he KEEPS ALMOST WAKING UP ANYWAY WITH HER IN THE CRYSTAL IN THE PRESENT. In fact old Impa keeps telling you he might wake up soon! And that it's BECAUSE YOU KEEP MAKING YOUR SWORD STRONGER WHAT. And the only solution to this issue ends up being finding the Triforce and using it's world altering powers to....drop a big building on top of his head. But then Girahim fucks all that up anyway...by kidnapping Zelda and...causing another timeline maybe.
God, so like most of the game is wild goose chases to poorly thought out and belatedly explained Zelda reaching. You don't even have a clearly explained antagonist for 75% of the series.
Compare this with any of the past games in regards to plot momentum:
OOT: As a kid you and kid Zelda make a plot to foil a power hungry war lord pulling a magical coup on her daddy. Very clear, get things, get magic doodad before evil man.
Then as an adult you fucked up because kids, and Ganondorf has taken over and fucked everything up so you have to get together the magic sages to combat his triforce powers. Where Zelda at? Who knows! But she is somewhere and it's not the MAIN plot. Though it ends up being a satisfying in your face answer the whole time.
Wind Waker: The first half gives you a sister rescue mission that is clear cut, and very heroes journeyish. Link starts out a doofus, but by the midpoint he's badass. Then it's revealed that the darker thing you sense is going on is that Ganondorf is out and about again after an apocalyptic attempt to destroy the world he was destroying and him. And you have to open up sealed stuff to stop him.
Twilight Princess: Honestly pretty convoluted itself.
Majoras Mask: FUCKING MOON GONNA DESTROY PLANET, STOP MOON. JESUS CHRIST ITS RIGHT THERE. YOU DONT EVEN HAVE ENOUGH TIME SO YOU HAVE TO TIME JUMP. FUCK. MOON.
-The game's art style sucks. Yeah technically it sort of looks good? But I don't mean the designs, I mean the color and lighting. It's SO FLAT.
Don't know what I mean?
Here's what I'm talking about.
Fire Temple entry hall in Ocarina, check the dim glow and murky vibe.
Goron Mines from Twilight Princess
Oh is that the more realistic vibe?
Yeah bullshit.The game is insanely one dimensional looking. It's colors are dulled, it's lighting is flat and stale. The odd good looking scene will pop up now and then, but overall it's actually incredibly dull to just LOOK at. Half the Dungeons were filled with HUGE rooms that barely filled their size. Large squares with flat colors. Even the Sandship managed this problem in spite of having so much going for it.
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The lighting and colors are pretty bland choices, yeah. I think among other things though is that the art style (as in the literal choices for bases of things) didn't look… Zelda-y? I'm not talking "Windwaker is Cel-shaded and doesn't look zelda!" I mean artistic choices for things like the fire dungeon you linked or the ancient cistern... they don't have the same charm in the art design as previous? The more time passes, the more I feel like Skyward Sword had a fairly bland style choice in visual and musical arts (though part of that is that I really wish that Koji Kondo were at the helm and didn't just leave as they switched to orchestrated music)
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Even from just the limited SS footage I've seen, there are a lot of weird color choices that seem to be made just to add a wider variety of colors. Like even in MK's screenshot, what is the deal with all those green stripes? They're just awful.
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I actually liked the IDEAS they had for the Fire Sanctuary and Ancient Cistern.
FS I think was supposed to be like some huge cliff and canyon hanging Chinese castle or monastery, really cool idea on paper.
And AC is like a Buddhist temple in an Indian style. Again good ideas.But just so blandly carried out. Bland bland bland.
And holy shit yeah, I forgot to mention the music.
The music in this game is sooooooooooo boring and generic. The best tracks were all like brief and single location stuff like the sword cutting game room.Eldin Province is the worst one.
Seriously this is some of the blandest shit on record.
It's ok, I get it. It sounds like they took it from the bland Goron City remix that
.Great guys, you can't even equal the awesome mountain music
.And ah, the majesty of entering a forest!
Sounds a lot like Kokiri Village….which was a village. Not the actual area of danger and mystery.
Woods should be magical and a bit eerie no?
(a Kokiri Village remix btw lol, and look how effective it was made)
WHY THIS GAME SO BAD
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The concept of the Chinese castle and Buddhist temple are neat, yeah (although straight putting Buddha in there in the Zelda world is still kinda weird to me), but they definitely lacked the charm you'd normally expect from a Zelda game. To me, looking back at it, it kinda feels like they just copy pasted generic elements into it so that nothing really fits.
Honestly though for me, music is possibly one of the big things I come to Zelda for because I think Koji Kondo does a damn good job of creating atmosphere with it. Yeah the visuals and enemy/NPC design are all creative, but Zelda pretty much always comes with some really great, more often than not catchy, background music. It's really a jarring change then for them to have Koji Kondo only do some music for the intro cinematic when you boot the game up the first time, and I feel like even he doesn't know the style they should be going for because that piece isn't that good. I can mostly forgive everything else in the game, but to me I think the music is the most glaring flaw and the biggest offender for me because it's just done so _wrong_.
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I cannot remember a single piece of music from Skyward Sword. Are you guys sure there was any?
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I cannot remember a single piece of music from Skyward Sword. Are you guys sure there was any?
Hell I feel like I'd be less offended if there was no music in there because then it wouldn't be as disappointing. The Koloktos boss music fight and Groose's theme are honestly the only ones I feel I actually liked and remembered. Even the main theme's "reverse Zelda's theme" is pretty jarring and not well written.
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It's hard to believe that the same guy responsible for the Majora's Mask soundtrack laid this turd.
With all of his experience, a ridiculous budget and all the musical connections in the industry Koji Kondo couldn't put together one memorable piece for Skyward Sword. Meanwhile this will forever haunt the back of my mind:
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I remember a ton of SS songs. Don't know what you guys are talking about there, honestly.
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I only remember the main theme, balad of the godess I guess. But I'm not that musical of a guy.
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It's hard to believe that the same guy responsible for the Majora's Mask soundtrack laid this turd.
With all of his experience, a ridiculous budget and all the musical connections in the industry Koji Kondo couldn't put together one memorable piece for Skyward Sword. Meanwhile this will forever haunt the back of my mind:
Except as I mentioned before Koji Kondo was only responsible for a single piece of music? He only did the opening cinematic for the first time you boot the songs. That's part of the reason why the soundtrack is so lackluster compared to older games.
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I only remember the main theme, balad of the godess I guess. But I'm not that musical of a guy.
It's one of the more distinctive and memorable pieces yeah, helped by the fact that everyone remembers what it's based off of, but really the rest of the themes are pretty unremarkable.
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I remember a ton of SS songs. Don't know what you guys are talking about there, honestly.
As memorable as the Final Fantasy XIII OST, really. Sure you can say you remember there was a faron woods theme or there was a theme for eldin province, but in terms of actually being able to recall precisely how those things went, unless you played the game recently, that's pretty unlikely. And even without the memorability factor, the tracks are just pretty poor in terms of their writing in general.
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Hm. I don't know why, but I never got people's complaints about SS's soundtrack. I thought there were plenty of great and memorable tracks (and yes, I remember the songs themselves and how they went), but I guess it's just a matter of preference?
I thought TP had the worse soundtrack, personally. Heck, I replayed the game recently and I still only remember a few songs from it that weren't based on old games. Granted, the ones I remember were good, but I remember far less compared to SS.
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When I listen to bits of the SS soundtrack, it just all sounds so casual. Like here we are, rediscovering the ruins of a fallen world on a quest to thwart the ancient evil that had claimed it. As you touch down to the untamed wilds that were lost beneath the clouds, a young schoolboy confronting the unknown abyss, the fanfare swells to bring you… something so idyllic that it could pass for an Animal Crossing theme?
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@Purple:
Except as I mentioned before Koji Kondo was only responsible for a single piece of music? He only did the opening cinematic for the first time you boot the songs. That's part of the reason why the soundtrack is so lackluster compared to older games.
Oh thank god. When I was looking up the composer, I thought something was wrong. I'm glad the fault is with my attention span and not Kondo.
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@Purple:
As memorable as the Final Fantasy XIII OST, really. Sure you can say you remember there was a faron woods theme or there was a theme for eldin province, but in terms of actually being able to recall precisely how those things went, unless you played the game recently, that's pretty unlikely. And even without the memorability factor, the tracks are just pretty poor in terms of their writing in general.
At least I remember one track from XIII-2:
[hide]
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I enjoyed gameplay and gameworld of Skyward Sword, but there were tons of things that were off with them.
Mainly the plot, the fact that the time travel aspect seems incredibly shoehorned, and underplayed.
Also, the ancient races of hyrule being: mole people, kiwi people, some kind of seahorse people, cute little extinct robots and… Gorons (or I missed one?)
I get that the races thing started with Ocarina of Time, before that Zoras were evil river monsters, and everyone was Human (not even Hylian) isn't it time to adpot the races and accept it? Do you inmagine a Kiwi sage? can you find the use of a... deer/yeti/penguin thing mask? At least the Kokor made sense..
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TP's soundtrack suffers from two things: Needing to follow in the same image as Ocarina of Time in a lot of ways and trying really really hard to set up that dark and moody atmosphere but in the latter case Majora's Mask already set up a precedent that does the atmosphere setup waaayyy better.
Still, the main theme and the overworld theme, Midna's theme, the boss fight music, the final boss music, what Twilight Princess does right it still does really well.
If I were to run down the different styles of the console Zeldas,
Ocarina of Time, if anything that there's to be enjoyed of it, is that the pieces are all pretty much vibrant, memorable, and incredibly charming. They have that element of being easy to hum and remember, but they're all constructed and flow pretty well on top of that.
Majora's Mask, coming pretty soon after, has a similar taste but adds that apocalyptic flair to it. And even better, you've got the Stone Tower Temple's music which is really awesome.
Wind Waker takes all the styles of ocean related cultures and integrates them with the usual charm of the series but I'd make the case that it's actually the most emotionally invested soundtrack out of all of them.
TP is the dark and edgy teenage son who's confused but still has a sense of its roots and produces some really great work from time to time.
SS is pretty disjointed (the Goddess theme is kinda a wreck and was jarring to me even from the trailers. The idea is understandable but execution-wise it really falls flat) and I think at best serves as elevator music, which I guess makes sense because all you do is go up and down Eldin anyway. Its direction is kinda all over the place and in spite of needing to create , and I only really remember character related themes, so I guess they were trying to really emphasize the story and character development at the cost of making everything else bland generic movie background music, but even then I wouldn't say those pieces are written well. If I were to sum it up in one word, I'd probably go with "lifeless"–- Update From New Post Merge ---
At least I remember one track from XIII-2:
[hide]
As far as XIII goes, the battle themes are all pretty good along with a few of the overworld themes, and I think Holy made the case that the OST is pretty well constructed but just not the usual flair of pop music, but I feel like it didn't really serve the game well or construct the right atmosphere.
This piece though obviously is what Final Fantasy really is.
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Chocorodeo.. I don't know how to react to this.
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Chocorodeo.. I don't know how to react to this.
Keep in mind that theme plays every time you get on a Chocobo.
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Keep in mind that theme plays every time you get on a Chocobo.
This is what I always felt was missing in old final fantasy games. Straight screaming into the microphone blaring from the speaker while I explored the continent with my Chocobo.
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I dunno. I LOVED Skyloft's theme, the theme for the Sky, most of the temple/dungeon music (especially for Lanaryu Mining Facility, Ancient Cistern, and Skyview Temple), the boss themes, the Lanayru desert and Sand Sea themes, Groose's theme, Ghirahim's theme, Fi's theme, the Ballad of the Goddess, the Song of the Hero, and more from SS.
Twilight Princess definitely had some good songs, but it suffered too much from trying to be OoT 2.0 imo. The overworld, main theme, and Midna's theme were all standouts for sure, though. I actually thought the boss music was pretty forgettable aside from the tune that starts off when you start damaging the boss, which was pretty awesome.
I think MM or WW have the best Zelda soundtracks, personally.
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I DID IT!!!!! falls over
Fucking Horse Archery. Oh well. I only had to refill my Rupee Pouch twice to do it. clutches Biggest Quiver to her chest
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Lanaryu had the best of everything and even then it feels kinda lifeless compared to the rest. That might play to its advantage though because it's, well, a desert. And yeah I'll agree that Skyloft had a good theme for the main hub world. But in terms of ambient temple music, I'd say at best the ancient cistern pulls it off thanks to the Buddha theme, but the tracks don't really supplement and augment the atmosphere they try to set up.
Like I said before, the soundtrack is at its best with character related themes because I suspect when they told the composer to create music to really emphasize the character driven plot of the game, but even then the problem there is that the characters themselves aren't all that well-written. Yeah Groose is great and Ghirahim is creepy, but I don't personally believe the tracks help to get more investment into those characters all that much. If TP suffers from trying to be OoT 2.0 in story, then SS suffers from trying to set up OoT
The other big thing I forgot to mention was that the orchestration of the music doesn't really give it much benefit if any, and really it sounds like you could create most of it by synth. I really really adore the orchestrated save data loading page, but just perusing the themes on youtube, the orchestration sounds… kinda bad. Some of it is because of how it's written so that it isn't enhanced by having live music, but ehhhh
Like this:
ZREO could probably do this and come out with a product real similar without any aid of live instrumentation.
But yeah MM and WW both are the best in terms of the soundtrack offerings because of the personal investment in the journey. MM is allllll about the personal trials and tribulations of everyone as they fear the apocalypse in T-3 days, and WW has that personal hero's journey Zeph mentioned. Plus, if you flip MM over you get WW, so there's that.
