I'm happy with seven. Do hope Aquaman is Peter David Aquaman though
Justice League in 2015
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Don't know how accurate the sources are, but there are plenty of places to mess up a movie like this. They're introducing characters that aside from name only, the general public really doesn't know too much about. They're bringing one of the biggest(if not the biggest recurring) villian in right after pretty much only the Superman movie. Still, I personally want the movie to succeed at least enough to maybe get the other superheroes the chance for their own movies.
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lol, so they're setting it in the real world setting of Man Of Steel eh?
"Well if the Avengers is comic-bookey and light, then Justice League needs to be realistic and dark!"
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I'm liking this less and less. The cast is too big, the villain is too strong and big tier, the tone isn't encouraging and there's just too much stuff going on without the buildup that Avengers had. This is looking like a convoluted mess.
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@Thousand:
I'm liking this less and less. The cast is too big, the villain is too strong and big tier, the tone isn't encouraging and there's just too much stuff going on without the buildup that Avengers had. This is looking like a convoluted mess.
The Avengers buildup was pointless. You didn't even need to know the characters to watch that movie.
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The Avengers buildup was pointless. You didn't even need to know the characters to watch that movie.
Yes, but they all had their origin stories out of the way. Justice League needs to explain Wonder Woman, Flash, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman and Darkseid out of the way before it can even start with the plot. Have fun putting that in a 2 hour movie.
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Yes, but they all had their origin stories out of the way. Justice League needs to explain Wonder Woman, Flash, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman and Darkseid out of the way before it can even start with the plot. Have fun putting that in a 2 hour movie.
Thats why you don't bother with individual origin story's and let the audience get to know the characters through their actions during the course of the film. If Hawkeye and Black Widow and freaking Coulson can walk out of the Avengers with a legion of new fans I don't see why some of the most iconic superheroes (and Martian Manhunter) can't do that either.
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Yes, but they all had their origin stories out of the way. Justice League needs to explain Wonder Woman, Flash, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman and Darkseid out of the way before it can even start with the plot. Have fun putting that in a 2 hour movie.
Word.
Thats why you don't bother with individual origin story's and let the audience get to know the characters through their actions during the course of the film. If Hawkeye and Black Widow and freaking Coulson can walk out of the Avengers with a legion of new fans I don't see why some of the most iconic superheroes (and Martian Manhunter) can't do that either.
Coulson's character wouldn't have worked if he weren't that guy who was in all the other movies and turned out to be secretly a badass. Black Widow and Hawkeye were all in previous movies as well.
With that said, you need to establish the characters, what they can do, what they're about before you can start doing things with them in the story. Avengers spent five movies doing this. This movie didn't so it has it's work majorly cut out for it.
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Yes, but they all had their origin stories out of the way. Justice League needs to explain Wonder Woman, Flash, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman and Darkseid out of the way before it can even start with the plot. Have fun putting that in a 2 hour movie.
I loved the way Superman : TAS explained darkseids origins:
Gave it a real Kirby vibe. As for the heroes, only the Manhunter really needs lengthy explanation. The rest are iconic.
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Thats why you don't bother with individual origin story's and let the audience get to know the characters through their actions during the course of the film. If Hawkeye and Black Widow and freaking Coulson can walk out of the Avengers with a legion of new fans I don't see why some of the most iconic superheroes (and Martian Manhunter) can't do that either.
Hawkeye didn't get a legion of new fans because of the movie. Widow's character had already been properly introduced in Iron Man 2. Besides, both of them are SHIELD agents and don't have superpowers. Their motivations are saving the world because they're government people. You can't do the same for half the Justice League. Wonder Woman is a wildy different character from Flash who is a wildy different character from Aquaman.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I loved the way Superman : TAS explained darkseids origins:
Gave it a real Kirby vibe. As for the heroes, only the Manhunter really needs explanation. The rest are iconic.
They aren't iconic in the international market. Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman are the only people who people know in general and most people think they're Marvel characters.
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I loved the way Superman : TAS explained darkseids origins:
Gave it a real Kirby vibe. As for the heroes, only the Manhunter really needs lengthy explanation. The rest are iconic.
Iconic? Flash is iconic?
Yeah, he's a huge comic hero, but he's not exactly iconic. Most people, I'm sure, don't know his origin!
Aquaman, too! He needs explanation. People ridicule him and don't even know he's the freaking king of Atlantis!
Yeah, they know Batman and Superman, and probably could remember Wonder Woman and Green Lantern, but not Flash and poor Aquaman! -
They aren't iconic in the international market. Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman are the only people who people know in general and most people think they're Marvel characters.
Maybe it's because I live in the UK and a lot of american stuff gets filtered through here, but I can say without even having to check that all of my friends know who aquaman and the flash are. Only the ones who used to watch the Justice League cartoon would know who J'onn J'onzz is though. Hal's Green lantern would have been even worse before the Movie as none of them are American comic book fans.
@Sniper:
Iconic? Flash is iconic?
Yeah, he's a huge comic hero, but he's not exactly iconic. Most people, I'm sure, don't know his origin!They know gotta go fast, thats enough.
@Sniper:Aquaman, too! He needs explanation. People ridicule him and don't even know he's the freaking king of Atlantis!
So? Most comic book fans ridiculed him until the Peter David run.
@Sniper:
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!
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Being fast isn't all Flash's powers. They're a little more fleshed out than that.
Some comic book fans STILL make fun of Aquaman! -
@Sniper:
Being fast isn't all Flash's powers. They're a little more fleshed out than that.
Yes, but they're all the audience needs to know about at the start of the movie. Vibration related powers can come as a surprise later on.
@Sniper:
Some comic book fans STILL make fun of Aquaman!
Well….how often has he been the least bit relevant outside of peter david's run. The only other half interesting storyline was the initial formation of the justice league when he kept mumbling because he was used to being underwater.
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Yes, but they're all the audience needs to know about at the start of the movie. Vibration related powers can come as a surprise later on.
Well….how often has he been the least bit relevant outside of peter david's run. The only other half interesting storyline was the initial formation of the justice league when he kept mumbling because he was used to being underwater.
Gah, you're right.
At least the next JL arc is centered around Atlantis. -
@Thousand:
Coulson's character wouldn't have worked if he weren't that guy who was in all the other movies and turned out to be secretly a badass. Black Widow and Hawkeye were all in previous movies as well.
I'm pretty sure they would have been just as well received even without the the one-two scene cameos in previous movies.
@Thousand:
With that said, you need to establish the characters, what they can do, what they're about before you can start doing things with them in the story. Avengers spent five movies doing this. This movie didn't so it has it's work majorly cut out for it.
Establish them, yes but you don't have go deep into their histories during the super team movie. You could go into Avengers with zero knowledge of who anyone was and still get was going on and who people were, that's one of the reasons it was so damn great. Aside from Cap and Hulks establishing scenes we got to know who everyone was watching them try to thwart Loki's world domination scheme.
Hawkeye didn't get a legion of new fans because of the movie. Widow's character had already been properly introduced in Iron Man 2. Besides, both of them are SHIELD agents and don't have superpowers. Their motivations are saving the world because they're government people. You can't do the same for half the Justice League.
I'm pretty sure protecting the earth from an army from a place called APOKOLIPS is something most people can get behind. Hell you could probably get Lex Luther in on it. Yeah the Avengers had a hard time pulling it together but that was mostly due to clashing ego's, SHEILD keeping secrets, and nobody knowing what the hell Loki was doing until the last minute.
@Kaiolino:Wonder Woman is a wildy different character from Flash who is a wildy different character from Aquaman.
Yeah but like I said, fighting the Apokolips army (an army lead by a guy named DARKSEID), is something everyone can agree on. Fuck with an enemy so damn straight up evil it would be stupid for them not to be able to work together.
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! • Superman is essentially the same character from Man of Steel, and Zack Snyder is consulting regarding the writing of the character.
! • Batman: The strategist of the group. Batman doesn't really want to be involved with these super powered beings he considers too powerful. Easily the most complex written.
! • Wonder Woman: She has only been in man's world a few short months. The Wonder Woman script Michael Goldenberg is developing will be set before the Justice League movie.
! • Green Lantern: Will be Ryan Reynold's character from the Green Lantern movie, but will be freshly written with a more serious tone.
! • Flash: The most popular hero in civilian eyes who loves media attention, but when called upon is very serious.
! • Martian Manhunter: Alien who has lived on Earth in secret for over a hundred years who has knowledge of Darkseid and his reign.
! • Aquaman: Will be the King of Atlantis who has a key role in the film.
! • There will also be a heavy military presence in the film which in future rewrites could include characters featured in Man of Steel or even Amanda Waller (Angela Bassett) of which neither are included in the first draft.
! • Alfred Pennyworth is in the film in a minor appearance.
! • Lois Lane is also in the film in a cameo.
! • Darkseid's Elite will be featured who go up against the Justice League early on in the film.
I guess that means I should finally watch that Green Lantern movie.So in other words: Superman is Captain America, Batman is Hulk crossed with Hawkeye/Black Widow (go ahead, laugh), Wonder Woman is Thor, and Flash is Iron Man.
Establish them, yes but you don't have go deep into their histories during the super team movie. You could go into Avengers with zero knowledge of who anyone was and still get was going on and who people were, that's one of the reasons it was so damn great. Aside from Cap and Hulks establishing scenes we got to know who everyone was watching them try to thwart Loki's world domination scheme.
True, but it was made even greater if you had seen the movies and gotten to know the characters in better detail, made a bigger connection with them. You can watch Avengers without knowing the heroes and it's still awesome, but for those who had seen all the origin story movies beforehand it was AWESOME.
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Thinking on it now, I think part of the problem I realized I had with them being introduced in 'Justice League' is how are they going to go into more detail with them in their individual movies if this does well? Obviously, they're not going to show how Flash got his superpowers in 'Justice League', and apparently, if they go with that version, he's a well-loved superhero in the same universe as Superman who looks like he's going to be mistrusted and the only superhero at first. Does that mean they plan on flashing back in the individual movie to show that, or just pretend he's always been Flash in the universe?
…..Also, I get the feeling the Superman movie series could get kinda weird since it was made obviously in mind with the 'man out of place' thing where he's probably the only superhero in the world except with the 'Justice League', he obviously won't be. I suppose they can still make that possible with him being much more powerful for being different. Of course, without seeing both Superman: MoS, and 'Justice League', this is just speculation(like much else in this thread anyway).
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Thinking on it now, I think part of the problem I realized I had with them being introduced in 'Justice League' is how are they going to go into more detail with them in their individual movies if this does well? Obviously, they're not going to show how Flash got his superpowers in 'Justice League', and apparently, if they go with that version, he's a well-loved superhero in the same universe as Superman who looks like he's going to be mistrusted and the only superhero at first. Does that mean they plan on flashing back in the individual movie to show that, or just pretend he's always been Flash in the universe?
…..Also, I get the feeling the Superman movie series could get kinda weird since it was made obviously in mind with the 'man out of place' thing where he's probably the only superhero in the world except with the 'Justice League', he obviously won't be. I suppose they can still make that possible with him being much more powerful for being different. Of course, without seeing both Superman: MoS, and 'Justice League', this is just speculation(like much else in this thread anyway).
Maybe a few of the Supes films could be a while before JL. Then he's beloved by the entire world and stuff after those?
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Thinking on it now, I think part of the problem I realized I had with them being introduced in 'Justice League' is how are they going to go into more detail with them in their individual movies if this does well?
I recently read somewhere that the Wonder Woman film was being written, and being set before the JL film, so they'll likely be going the reverse Avengers route, lol.
On a different note, I dno't see why so many people are complaining about the lack of origin stories. Not every single superhero film has to have an origin story, you know? In fact, I'd venture that most of the casual movie going audience doesn't really care, so long as you just explain a little about them. Dropping a line about metahumans appearing on Earth for insert various contrived reason works wonders. Which also makes me think the Starro storyline (something similar to the DNA altering aspect of New Frontier) would've been better for the first movie.
All that aside though, I can see this starting off like one of those heist films. Begin with a prologue involving Martian Manhunter. Depending on how much they're willing to abuse continuity make Darkseid the one responsible for the Martians death instead of the White Martians (and knowing Hollywood…). Batman and Superman somehow end up doing a mission together, possibly relating to a member of Darkseid's team, introducing us to their parallels and Batman's lack of trust early on in the film. They rescue someone who turns out be Martian Manhunter. He tells them of Darkseid's impending threat, and that no one man can handle it not even Superman. Batman has his qualms about the whole team up thing, but decides to stay on board and make sure the gathering of super power god-like men doesn't step outside the line of the law (also opening possibilities for a tower of babel type storyline as a potential sequel). We have clips of various super heroes, and a few good measured cameos as they debate on who to pick and who not to pick. Throw in somewhere how Superman was the first superhero and gave the others courage to go public, leading to his insecurities about not living up to the powerful icon he's become, and I'd say we'd have a pretty good set-up for a decent movie. Knowing DC though, theyll probably go the "show scenes of every character, and then have them all randomly arrive at the same crime scene of a boom tube opening" route. Which isn't too bad either.
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http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/03/04/report-bale-to-return-as-batman-in-justice-league
Apparently Bale is in talks to reprise his role
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Jesus Christ…I hope this thread doesn't turn back into: "Where da fuq was Superman when Gotham was in trouble (3rd movie)?" since I guess now he is canon in the Nolan universe (ASSUMING this article stated above is accurate).
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Just a quick question based on the article, wouldn't the inclusion of Nolan's universe in the JL movie serve to make it more..fantastical? meaning that a lot of people would feel the impact of demi gods more. For example how I felt when I saw supes in action in the dark knight returns part 2(fantastic movie by the way) he just felt like a man above men and I got that sense of whoa! that guy is powerful. In a Justice league movie where basically everyone is at least on some footing with him, I think Nolan's batman would serve to give us that normal guy in a group of super powered people vibe.
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Oh man I hope Nolan produces with Snyder directing and if Bale comes back; fuck yeah!
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http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/03/04/report-bale-to-return-as-batman-in-justice-league
Apparently Bale is in talks to reprise his role
Oh great, just what we need. More of the voice.
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Jesus Christ…I hope this thread doesn't turn back into: "Where da fuq was Superman when Gotham was in trouble (3rd movie)?" since I guess now he is canon in the Nolan universe (ASSUMING this article stated above is accurate).
Never was about just superman. Was about the entire world of DC.
There are thousands of superheroes. Someone should have popped up and tried something. I mean heck we have Batman, Robin, Catwoman, Joker, Scarecrow, Bane, ect. There are a ton of superheroes and supervillians in Gotham, in the Nolan Batman movies. So it should be expected that there are some other superheros and villians elsewhere in the world.
If you don't want superman to pop in and save everything, you can just guess he is say off planet doing shit. He has left Earth many times to be believable. But that still lives 1000 -1 superheroes left to chose from.
Him reprising his role will give some weight to the argument, but even without him it still has credence
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Christopher Nolan has too much respect for story and for his universe to remain independant from the other DC characters to actually do this this. But I do believe he could change his mind given the proper story or…...... paycheck he could come around to at least being the supervisior of DC on film. However, I'm wondering where it'd go.
I would be perplexed, even flabbergasted if Nolan does accept this task. Doubt Nolan's Batman will be in a Jutsice League film though.
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If Bale is Batman again they had best tell him to dialback the Dr. Girlfriend voice.
Or maybe they could have him dubbed over with the voice of the cartoon Batman >_>.
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But…Bale
s Batman quit being Batman at the end of DKR :blink:I liked him as Batman, but man, his version of Batman is done and I
m fine with the way it ended, so what sense would it make to have him reprise his role? Stupid. Theyre doing this because Nolans Batman is the only successfully established DC character in recent movies, so they would have atleast one character less to introduce to the audience, but it
s just so dumb, because a) this version of Batman is done, dammit and b) Nolans Batman wouldnt really fit in with the rest of
em. -
If it is true, I still can't believe that Nolan is agreeing to this. The VERY same guy who thought the Penguin was too goofy to be in his rendition of Batman is deciding to include a flying alien with laser powers. I know he produced Superman so he must be okay with the new representation of this super hero, but still it seems a bit…off. Maybe it is an alternate universe Nolan Batman or something...shrug
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Nolan is involved, Bale is not.
People need to stop taking Latino review as absolute Gospel remember they were completely wrong about Planet Hulk when they apparently confirmed it was being planned? Then days later Whedon and Marvel executives slayed that report?
Latino review has been wrong before could be wrong now, or at least a little off the mark in terms of accuracy. It could very well be that Nolan was persuaded both through story and little paycheck increase. There's no way Nolan's Batman is coming back,espcially after Rises. The link I just posted confirms in my mind that the Batman that will appear in this film will be a different one(not John Blake) but a different Bruce Wayne independant from the Nolan universe which could easily have fantasical elements in it. Either I heavily advise anyone to wait until at least after Man of Steel comes out because I'm relatively sure we'll have some official info. Either way, this hasn't even gone through fruition yet anyway and is most likely at meager discussion stages at best.
Untill I hear it from Nolan I will just pass this off as "wild rumor" that may have an ounce of truth in it. -
I think it would still be fine even if the universe was connected. "Where was insert superhero when this was happening?" isn't even a question worth asking.
That said, would Nolan's Batman even work in this universe? Even if not, I'd be interested in an entire Nolan DC verse (although I'm not a fan of the costume designs).
About the "Flash being accepted by humans and Superman isn't" deal, one could argue that its because Flash is still human and Superman well… isn't. I could see that angle working out, since it's kinda how the Marvel verse works with the "LOL Mutie Filth" and the Avengers.
but the thing about prejudice is, it doesn't have to be logical or fair. That's what makes it so disgusting.
Speaking of the flash (because I've never read a flash comic), this, JLU, and Young Justice have the Flash as a very popular hero that everyone loves. Is this a recurring thing in the comics?
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Speaking of the flash (because I've never read a flash comic), this, JLU, and Young Justice have the Flash as a very popular hero that everyone loves. Is this a recurring thing in the comics?
I haven't read through the thread yet, so not sure what the movie does, but yes The Flash being a popular hero is a highly recurring theme. In the comics his city has a whole museum dedicated to him, and he's typically the most "commercial" of the league.
Also, Flash comics are awesome. He's my favorite of all super-heroes.
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I think it would still be fine even if the universe was connected. "Where was insert superhero when this was happening?" isn't even a question worth asking.
That said, would Nolan's Batman even work in this universe? Even if not, I'd be interested in an entire Nolan DC verse (although I'm not a fan of the costume designs).
About the "Flash being accepted by humans and Superman isn't" deal, one could argue that its because Flash is still human and Superman well… isn't. I could see that angle working out, since it's kinda how the Marvel verse works with the "LOL Mutie Filth" and the Avengers.
but the thing about prejudice is, it doesn't have to be logical or fair. That's what makes it so disgusting.
Speaking of the flash (because I've never read a flash comic), this, JLU, and Young Justice have the Flash as a very popular hero that everyone loves. Is this a recurring thing in the comics?
Has it been said Superman isn't accepted in Justice League world by humans? and flash is?
That seems like a plot to Superman movie, where Superman works on getting accepted. But otherwise, Superman is like the golden idol in terms of human acceptance. there is not a person on the planet that doesn't adore superman beside Lex Luthor. Seems strange that Justice League movie would still have superman be an "outcast, untrusted alien" Would have thought he would have overcame that by the end of his stand alone movie.
Now I'm not against the idea that he is still not trusted. I mean he only had one movie, versus say Iron man had 2 before its mash up. But by the time Superman 2 comes out, the plot better not still be dealing with humans accepting and alien.
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I feel two movies with the theme would be fine with the first obviously reacting to Superman's presence and maybe a second one where Luthor does what he can to discredit Superman.
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If Bale is Batman again they had best tell him to dialback the Dr. Girlfriend voice.
Or maybe they could have him dubbed over with the voice of the cartoon Batman >_>.
Bruce Walks into Lucius Fox's Office
Fox: What is it this time Mr Wayne?
Bruce: Very Hoarse I've lost my voice… disguising my voice to be Batman is really straining it and now it hurts to talk
Fox: You need to disguise your voice?
Bruce: Yeah.
Next Scene
Bruce: Wearing Batman Cowl Kevin Conroy's Voice is coming out of him This will work!
Fox: It's a voice changing unit built into the next piece of the cowl. It'll make you sound however you want to sound.BEST BATMAN EVER
Also, it would work to fit he universes together but it has to be stated that at least the first 2 Batman movies happened before Superman went public AS Superman. Say it happened during the 8 year lapse between TDK and Rises. That way, it can be explained away that Superman wasn't available because he was [Insert stock catastrophe was taking all his attention]. Or they could even drop a nice comic book reference and give a good thought out reason. He showed up at one point but Batman told him to go home.
Rises clearly had a lot of influence from No Man's Land. And there was a part where the writers addressed the issue of "How could this be happening in a world where Superman exists" and there's a part where he shows up and tries to fix everything with his Superman powers by fixing the power plant and putting this guy in charge, thus stopping people from having to pay "Tributes" to the crime lords that run each part of the City, but then he realized that the guy he put in charge became the new lord of that district and they just started paying HIM tributes.
Batman explains to him that these peoples entire lives have been destroyed and they live in a whole new world with No Law and a New Order, and he doesn't understand it, so he can't help them. Supes acknowledges what Batman said, promises to stay away as long as Bruce promises to actually call him if something comes up where he actually can help.Something similar could work here…
Or he was in space fighting space Nazis at the time, both work.
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That just leads to more questions, I'd just say he was busy.
Hell, Nolan still owes an explanation as to how Batman survived a Nuclear Explosion when he only had 5 seconds left.
Although he could easily make me eat my words with:
"The flash did it"
Edit: And I'll get around to reading it. I'm still backlogged because I'm rereading through Amazing Spiderman plus an assload of manga.
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I haven't read through the thread yet, so not sure what the movie does, but yes The Flash being a popular hero is a highly recurring theme. In the comics his city has a whole museum dedicated to him, and he's typically the most "commercial" of the league.
Also, Flash comics are awesome. He's my favorite of all super-heroes.
The Flash in the Justice League animated series was my favourite because he provided a great deal of all the humor.
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The Flash in the Justice League animated series was my favourite because he provided a great deal of all the humor.
Too bad DC booted that character out of continuity because he wasn't hip in the Silver Age.
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Too bad DC booted that character out of continuity because he wasn't hip in the Silver Age.
Wally west is gone? No. No.
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Doesn't exist anymore. At least until the next reboot.
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Wally not being around anymore is a grave injustice that must be remedied immediately. Wally West is the best flash hands down and I don't care what anyone has to say about it.
Also, whether it's Barry or Wally in the movie (who am I kidding, it's gonna be Barry) they need to cast Neil Patrick Harris to play him.
I've said this before. I'm sure others have seen me say it before. It might be getting annoying. Tough. I'm gonna keep saying it and saying it. Because NPH as Flash would be amazing.
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Wally not being around anymore is a grave injustice that must be remedied immediately. Wally West is the best flash hands down and I don't care what anyone has to say about it.
Also, whether it's Barry or Wally in the movie (who am I kidding, it's gonna be Barry) they need to cast Neil Patrick Harris to play him.
I've said this before. I'm sure others have seen me say it before. It might be getting annoying. Tough. I'm gonna keep saying it and saying it. Because NPH as Flash would be amazing.
What about him makes him so qualified? Is he a huge flash fan or something?
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Uhhh, he's a great actor, really charismatic and has wonderful comedic timing. He kinda looks the part also.
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Uhhh, he's a great actor, really charismatic and has wonderful comedic timing. He kinda looks the part also.
^ This Pretty much.
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Uhhh, he's a great actor, really charismatic and has wonderful comedic timing. He kinda looks the part also.
Oh ok I wondered because i can name lots of celebrities that would fit parts but i don't usually see people rallying for a certain actor to play a part when there's no hint that they might do it because ya know… what are the odds?
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You weren't around when "ZOMG Patrick Steward would be so PERFECT as Professor X!" were you?
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You weren't around when "ZOMG Patrick Steward would be so PERFECT as Professor X!" were you?
Nope but I bet it was fun and Star Trek got brought up a lot
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well, that is something i didn't know of.. Hopefully, it is good and doesn't suck.. DC needs to have good movies besides the batman ones…
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Neil Patrick Harris also voiced Barry Allen–the Flash--in the animated movie, (based on a comic) DC: The New Frontier.