Katekyo Hitman REBORN! Discussion

KaizokuJinbei

Is no one concerned that without Daemon to bring them out, Hibari, Yamamoto, and Gokudera are trapped inside that illusion world?

Mukuro will probably pull bullsh** and get them out

choperman

@Silverblade:

Daemon knocked up some girl, but Vongola was all bros before hoes, and so begins this incredibly sad story.

that was a good post, I laughed with ice cream in my mouth…. not a fun experience

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

@Big_Bad_Lith:

Is no one concerned that without Daemon to bring them out, Hibari, Yamamoto, and Gokudera are trapped inside that illusion world?

Seeing as how the vindice flame is like a teleportation device they'll probably teleport inside of the illusion and pull those guys out an they will all celebrate, cake and icecream than the next arc will begin. Prepare for the rest button people.

Big_Bad_Lith

I sincerely hope the next arc is a proper inheritance ceremony. And then the manga ends. That's what I want most of all.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

At the rate it's going it should end. KHR had it's time to shine an now it's time for it to just lay back and die

pyromonki

It's pretty low on the rankings so yeah it really should. It's amazing how long hibari has kept this manga alive. Tsuna's only cool when he fights. Gokudera went from being cool to being insufferable.

Yamamoto still lost to a wall… I'm still laughing about it.

I miss the misquito guy.

ButternutSquash

I remember how this manga used to be good. Future arc should have been the climax of this manga. Everything after the future arc looks like a drag. Characters with the same cliche attitude & the arbitrary power ups after every fight is just kind of ruining all the good works done earlier by the author. But I must admit after a long time I liked a chapter, mostly because Daemon is dead(most probably) and the photograph of the mysterious girl looks interesting. I also liked how Daemon was full of himself running away from the scene, only to be denied by a ludicrous law by the Vindice. It was funny.

There are still many things unanswered. The thing that intrigues me the most is the mystery behind the Arcobalenos. I would like the author to give us a backstory explaining their reason of existence. I believe there is some kind of hidden power in the Acrebalenos, especially Reborn. Reborn for one is yet participate in a serious fight, always bound by some absurd rule or prevented by the situation. He seems like an incredible fighter, atleast gives that kind of feeling. The author better not disappoint.

pyromonki

@ButternutSquash:

I remember how this manga used to be good. Future arc should have been the climax of this manga.

Future should have NEVER existed.
Rule of thumb in a semi-serious series is to NEVER, EVER do time travel. EVER. There were so many things wrong with the future arc I can't even begin. Mainly the flame system. That should've never existed. Especially in a BLACK AND WHITE COMIC BOOK. Not only did I have to stop and think about some flame bs, the fights were ranged from a mess to downright awful. Hibari's fight against the pool ball guy was the only time I was truly entertained. The rest of it I just sludged through.

ButternutSquash

@pyromonki:

Future should have NEVER existed.
Rule of thumb in a semi-serious series is to NEVER, EVER do time travel. EVER. There were so many things wrong with the future arc I can't even begin. Mainly the flame system. That should've never existed. Especially in a BLACK AND WHITE COMIC BOOK. Not only did I have to stop and think about some flame bs, the fights were ranged from a mess to downright awful. Hibari's fight against the pool ball guy was the only time I was truly entertained. The rest of it I just sludged through.

I actually liked the start of the Future arc. Avenging your own death was quite an interesting concept. Especially getting out of your coffin and nailing your murderers was a good plot. She could have finished the manga with good fights and a final hurrah against Byakuran.

project1980

Chapter's out
http://mangastream.com/read/katekyo_hitman_reborn/50534489/1

Damn Daemon you were really that bleeping whipped. Meh chapter but still better than Bleach…....fuckin Bleach.

project1980

This post is deleted!

Silence

This manga is singularly terrible.

project1980

@Silence:

This manga is singularly terrible.

Understood but it's ending soon so I can tolerate it for now unlike an certain series that sounds like leech (I really hate you Kubo I mean truly truly hate you) . Just explain the Arcobaleno and we'll call it even.

IceBorg

The final villain will totally be that Vindice Arcobaleno.

city_lights31

Whenever I skim threw the new chapters for this series I have a hard time believing it was ever a gag manga.

KaizokuJinbei

And now the Vindice dude will probably say something to spark the next arc

loledinmypants

Meh… Daemon's backstory was pretty cliche, but at least it wasn't as terrible as the past like 7 chapters of "Daemon is hax, team-up/one-time power-up, cliffhanger of 'will Spade survive?'"

LuffyWinner

I don't think I like this series anymore, although that may be because I skim through the pages. That gag manga years back is now this?
Also the art style of this manga makes me wanna puke..

Oga Simpson

Chapter was pretty boring, nothing unexpected. Roll on next week I guess.

pyromonki

@Oga:

Chapter was pretty boring, nothing unexpected. Roll on next week I guess.

Blegh, Daemon Spade is right, Tsuna tried the exact same thing as the Primo in the future arc and look where it got them.

The manga is trying to make it seem like power alone is evil, when it's not the case. The Vongola could easily pull a white beard and claim territories to protect them.

I'd like if they'd at least address the morality of it instead of trying to make everything so black and white. :getlost:

I didn't hate this chapter, but I'm hoping the next arc is the last one. We don't need anymore plot pieces, just solve the old ones and move on.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

@pyromonki:

Future should have NEVER existed.
Rule of thumb in a semi-serious series is to NEVER, EVER do time travel. EVER. There were so many things wrong with the future arc I can't even begin. Mainly the flame system. That should've never existed. Especially in a BLACK AND WHITE COMIC BOOK. Not only did I have to stop and think about some flame bs, the fights were ranged from a mess to downright awful. Hibari's fight against the pool ball guy was the only time I was truly entertained. The rest of it I just sludged through.

The problem with time travel arcs is that whenever they happen the group allways ends up going to the past, I did time travel with my series and I never went back to the past cause that would just be stupid.

@pyromonki:

Blegh, Daemon Spade is right, Tsuna tried the exact same thing as the Primo in the future arc and look where it got them.

The manga is trying to make it seem like power alone is evil, when it's not the case. The Vongola could easily pull a white beard and claim territories to protect them.

I'd like if they'd at least address the morality of it instead of trying to make everything so black and white. :getlost:

I didn't hate this chapter, but I'm hoping the next arc is the last one. We don't need anymore plot pieces, just solve the old ones and move on.

Couldn't agree more.

I'm starting to notice this cliche in some shounens how the villian was just misunderstood and that they had good intentions all along but went about them all wrong.

IceBorg

Yeah I think we should have a final arc now, as much I like Reborn I think it should end because I am starting to get a bit tired of it.

pyromonki

@GEPPETTOSMONSTER:

The problem with time travel arcs is that whenever they happen the group allways ends up going to the past, I did time travel with my series and I never went back to the past cause that would just be stupid.

Yeah going back to the past was the problem. But they had to, Tsuna and them are alive and grown in the future, but the fact that they were there created so many problems.

I.E. if Tsuna became that powerful and went back to the past, how did everyone lose?

As ButternutSquash said, avenging your own death is a cool concept, but the Future arc was written to all heck.

Does this arc mean we have to put up with the Simon family? Because I don't like any of them.

Can't we just have Dino, Trident, and Bianchi back? And I swear if this next arc doesn't have a problem that's actually mafia related I'm going to flip a desk.

Gerri

Sooo much cheese.

Silverblade

This is terrible.

And I like how the imprisoned people reappear, Vongola being drawn even smaller then Shimon, as if Amano tries to remind you not to care about these guys.

luffyg2

Can't wait to see what the revelation of the Vendice will be… and I wonder if Mukuro will go back to jail or is he free like the others... I wonder what the next arc will be...probably one related to the Vendice

pyromonki

@luffyg2:

Can't wait to see what the revelation of the Vendice will be… and I wonder if Mukuro will go back to jail or is he free like the others... I wonder what the next arc will be...probably one related to the Vendice

Free? He's still very evil…

loledinmypants

@GEPPETTOSMONSTER:

I'm starting to notice this cliche in some shounens how the villian was just misunderstood and that they had good intentions all along but went about them all wrong.

I don't think this is a bad idea in itself, but the execution of it in a handful of recent manga ranges from passable to outright stupid. It's stupid in this case because the justification for Spade's actions was given as he died and was cliche as hell. If the justification is given before or during the final confrontation and the backstory isn't cliche love story #952, it can work just fine.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

@loledinmypants:

I don't think this is a bad idea in itself, but the execution of it in a handful of recent manga ranges from passable to outright stupid. It's stupid in this case because the justification for Spade's actions was given as he died and was cliche as hell. If the justification is given before or during the final confrontation and the backstory isn't cliche love story #952, it can work just fine.

I've seen it work in older series but than again when I watched them I was younger an couldn't tell a good storyline from a mediocre one. So I would have to rewatch or re-read those older series to see whether or not I would agree to them.

If Elena was mentioned earlier than this would have not felt cheesy.

loledinmypants

It helps too when the well-intentioned big bad dies bad instead of having corny repentance dying words. Instead of trying to turn our feelings about him/her around on his/her deathbed, let them die and then when we look back and think "well, he actually wasn't so bad, he just went about things in a wrong and extreme way", you'll have done it right. Or do something more like what Oda's done with Arlong, who is not a well-intentioned fellow, but imagine how much more forced and stupid it would have seemed to find out about the fishman racism as Arlong lay defeated. A lot of manga seem to like waiting to give the villain's goals/backstory until the villain is defeated lately, and that just doesn't work, it's too forced and feels tacked on.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

Only two characters that I can currently think of that had that happen where it worked (for me) was Shishio Makoto and Shinobu Sensui

Silence

@GEPPETTOSMONSTER:

Only two characters that I can currently think of that had that happen where it worked (for me) was Shishio Makoto and Shinobu Sensui

Well even with Shishio, you knew enough about what had happened to him (he was betrayed by the government and set on fire, he was Kenshin's "successor") that you knew that Kenshin defeating him was a personal matter. Shishio also had Yumi, who he seemed to have a deep connection with, who we saw well in advance of Shishio's last moments, so you knew he wasn't completely heartless. There was a lot that went into characterizing Shishio that made him an incredible villain; before AND after his death.

Spade had absolutely NONE of that. You can't give a villain a cheap, one chapter flashback after their defeat and expect us to care. When you know what's on the line in the final battle - know what both the hero and the villain are fighting for and represent - THAT's good writing. You feel like there's something at stake. When it isn't until after a villain's gone down that you learn anything about him, and the results of that battle don't have any repercussions at all, it's hollow. It's empty. The good guy has already won, after all.

pyromonki

Or it could be like the beginning chapters of Ippo where you feel bad for both boxers. I used to hate that manga for that.

"IF you lose this match, you're through."
"What?! but I love boxing! It's my life! "
"I'm sorry, I have no choice. Face it kid, you're washed up!"
"I'll show him.. prepare yourself… IPPO!"

FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUU-

I agree with what you guys are saying, knowing his motivations before the fight would've been awesome. In fact, his determination could've been resolved in a better way over the course of the fight since all he wanted was Vongola to be stronger.

"My Elena... was killed because you guys are weak! How can I trust the Vongola to you? That's why... I'll show you... just how dangerous it is to be so weak! Try and stop me from killing your beloved guardians! Does it hurt Tsuna and Emma? Does it hurt know you are to weak to protect the ones you love?"

I would enjoy that much more. Tsuna and Emma would have to show Spade they are strong enough through battle, crushing his insecurities during the fight, rather than at the end.

Spade really didn't teach Tsuna anything, because he didn't really show case the pain he felt to them.

Leon S.

The newest chapters are pretty boring and predictable. I mean the last chapter were it said why Daemon started to hate Vongola and suff like that was really cliche and I hated it. First of all, the story about Elena and Daemon wasn't really developed very well. It's the same as always. Someone can't protect their beloved ones and then he/she dies. Then Daemon swears that he will create a new Vongola more stronger and blah blah blah. It was pretty obvious what was gonna happen. And also I really hated that the guardians were released so quickly. Maybe if Vindice told the thing he's going to tell before the guardians were free, that would give more suspense to that scene.
And as always, Amano turns someone bad into someone good. That has happened every single arc (Byakuran, Mukuro, Xanxus, etc)

FireFistAce 0

@Leon:

And as always, Amano turns someone bad into someone good. That has happened every single arc (Byakuran, Mukuro, Xanxus, etc)

Xanxus is still an asshole, it's just the rest of Varia that's "good" now. And Byakuran was never redeemed… we honestly don't know yet why he healed Takeshi. Hopefully Amano didn't forget about that and will revisit it.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

@Silence:

Well even with Shishio, you knew enough about what had happened to him (he was betrayed by the government and set on fire, he was Kenshin's "successor") that you knew that Kenshin defeating him was a personal matter. Shishio also had Yumi, who he seemed to have a deep connection with, who we saw well in advance of Shishio's last moments, so you knew he wasn't completely heartless. There was a lot that went into characterizing Shishio that made him an incredible villain; before AND after his death.

Spade had absolutely NONE of that. You can't give a villain a cheap, one chapter flashback after their defeat and expect us to care. When you know what's on the line in the final battle - know what both the hero and the villain are fighting for and represent - THAT's good writing. You feel like there's something at stake. When it isn't until after a villain's gone down that you learn anything about him, and the results of that battle don't have any repercussions at all, it's hollow. It's empty. The good guy has already won, after all.

What would of made this arc better is if they went with what was obvious which was defeat the shimon family, prove that the betrayal didn't happen an go to the vindice prison to release all of those who were captured. Reveal daemon to be behind it but don't make him be the big bad yet, they could of saved daemon for an arc or 2 down the line and build up on his character hell mention elena waaaay before his final defeat.

To me daemon becoming the main villian of this arc felt completly out of left field, I was expecting tsuna to fight a crazed enma an in a sence he did but that battle was lack luster compared to the fight at the end of Shitt.P and Gokuderas match.

pyromonki

@Fire Fist:

Xanxus is still an asshole, it's just the rest of Varia that's "good" now.

She didn't really try to redeem any of them really. I loved the Varia and their insanity. Too bad Amano kept them alive, I'd prefer if they died. However, the future arc did show that inner family squabbles could be put aside for the family, as it should be. That was of course before the future arc went into complete madness..

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

I still think the future arc was enjoyable.

this current arc was passable until the whole daemon spade thing went into effect than it felt like aizen all over again just done more quickly.

loledinmypants

Future went completely bad just after Irie being a good guy. In other words when we got "lulz REAL Six Funeral Wreaths, oh and letz play a children's ~~card game ON MOTORCYCLES~~war game ON MOTORCYCLES, except irl dis tiem!" Oh and MORE training, yay! Seemed like they trained a ton of times in the Future arc…

Though the box animals were pushing it prior to everything else becoming a mess.

Simon was pretty much bad from very near the start when Simon became the bad guys. I was hoping a kind of "big brother mafia family helps lesser mafia family" setup for a few chapters since it seemed like thing should have been heading toward a close and having the Vongola mentor/train/support a weaker family seemed like a good way to show that they were ready to become the actual leaders of Vongola. But instead... we got predictable match-ups, stupid fights save one or two, though a few powers were interesting despite the fights sucking or not making sense with the element in Ryohei's case. His power has usually been a healing thing, but his VG works by him taking damage... And not healing?

iMustang

The Varia redeemed the future arc for me to an extent. I did like their battle they had, and when they first showed up it was pretty awesome. And Xanxus's quote of despite their internal problems when an enemy attacks, the vongola fight as one. It showed a lot for his character and for the overall theme of the series.

Other than that yeah, the future arc definitely had it's level of bad.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

What I couldn't understand was how no one saw the shimon becoming the enemies of the arc, when it was quite obvious from a mile away.

loledinmypants

@GEPPETTOSMONSTER:

What I couldn't understand was how no one saw the shimon becoming the enemies of the arc, when it was quite obvious from a mile away.

It was. I HOPED for otherwise. Anything to keep away from the formula "here's about 6 named bad guys, get to it Vongola!"

KaizokuJinbei

@loledinmypants:

Future went completely bad just after Irie being a good guy. In other words when we got "lulz REAL Six Funeral Wreaths, oh and letz play a children's ~~card game ON MOTORCYCLES~~war game ON MOTORCYCLES, except irl dis tiem!" Oh and MORE training, yay! Seemed like they trained a ton of times in the Future arc…

Though the box animals were pushing it prior to everything else becoming a mess.

Simon was pretty much bad from very near the start when Simon became the bad guys. I was hoping a kind of "big brother mafia family helps lesser mafia family" setup for a few chapters since it seemed like thing should have been heading toward a close and having the Vongola mentor/train/support a weaker family seemed like a good way to show that they were ready to become the actual leaders of Vongola. But instead... we got predictable match-ups, stupid fights save one or two, though a few powers were interesting despite the fights sucking or not making sense with the element in Ryohei's case. His power has usually been a healing thing, but his VG works by him taking damage... And not healing?

If you watched the anime first and then read the manga (which is what I did) the anime makes it seem like they barely trained at all in the manga

loledinmypants

@KaizokuJinbei:

If you watched the anime first and then read the manga (which is what I did) the anime makes it seem like they barely trained at all in the manga

The anime seemed to use the training time as dragging filler time (though not much worse than the manga, though I can power through a manga chapter while I take 20 minutes covering what takes me maybe 5-10 minutes to read, so…), but also added in two filler arcs that were actually not too bad. I can't really tell which I felt seemed like it had more training in it, but the anime had more action amidst it at least.

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

@loledinmypants:

It was. I HOPED for otherwise. Anything to keep away from the formula "here's about 6 named bad guys, get to it Vongola!"

I remember when it was finally revealed that the shimon were the antagonists of the arc. That there were people on this forum that said "whoa didn't see that coming" or "that was a shocking revelation" I was thinking "are you fucking kidding me?"

The biggest give away was when the russians were defeated and adelhied coincidentally came from the same direction the russians were defeated and she was whiping her clothes off. That should of rung a bell in peoples heads.

loledinmypants

Yeah that's the really early point I implied things went bad with the arc at, good enough confirmation Simon was the bad guys, though there was just enough vagueness to hope it was just Adelheid… Until Yamamoto was attacked. Then the arc very definitely and irreversibly fell apart and checked off practically every obvious prediction you could make.

The only surprise was less training and more deus ex machina with the old guy making VG. And when terrible writing substituting for dull training arcs is your shocker, something is terribly wrong...

GEPPETTOSMONSTER

Not just that but having them have another upgrade was completly fucking stupid. The rings made sense, hell even the box animals made sense from the future, so what should of happened was Amano should of had it to where they strategically used there regular weapons and there animals and not introduce cambio forms, which some looked cool but alot of it was pointless. I was talking to a friend on Skype and I told him that it feels like some characters will get these amazing power ups and still be useless. It's like if Yamcha got a gigantic buster sword that could shoot out a devasating beam from it while fighting a saibaman and the result was him getting killed by that saibaman. THAT is how useless the power ups in this series are.

FireFistAce 0

New Chapter's out on Mangastream. Not much to say, it's a wrap-up chapter. Nothing really to complain about, everything seems back to normal.

The next arc looks to be a "Daily-life" Varia arc. If Amano is shifting focus to Varia for a bit, that actually sounds like it has a lot of potential. Too bad Fran won't be there… But still, the other Varia are actually some of the best characters this series has.

Oga Simpson

That was okay, thought Tsuna and Enma getting hit with the loose baseball was actually kinda funny.

pyromonki

I couldn't not laugh at this chapter. That Lambo scene was hilarious. I still don't understand why Tsuna lets people beat him up…. Or why his testicles haven't dropped yet.