I think the specific turning point was when Jinbei had his mini-flashback with Ace after Ace had died.
It was the timeskip that made most all the objections moot.
Mine anyway.
I think the specific turning point was when Jinbei had his mini-flashback with Ace after Ace had died.
It was the timeskip that made most all the objections moot.
Mine anyway.
I'll let Urouge reply to the rest of the post, since… well, you are quoting him and all, but I can answer the above question: Referencing the poll, there seems to be a decent amount of people that think Jinbei has the best chances now; I don't know of anyone off the top of my head who thinks Jinbei will certainly join, however. I introduced the theory, almost exactly as it is now, a few chapters before Jinbei was seen. (Around chapter 525). Since then, aside from me, Urouge has been the only other major voice for Jinbei, with a couple people making small arguments here and there, but mostly bouncing off of our arguments. I certainly wouldn't call the two of us (Urouge and I) the 'general consensus'. Some time during the war at Marineford, however, more people began agreeing with our speculation. I think the specific turning point was when Jinbei had his mini-flashback with Ace after Ace had died.
You two are clearly the most vocal supporters, but you're not alone and you're not the strongest supporters. My theory has always been that he will become Luffy's Vice-Captian. I came up with it just after his introduction at Impel Down…
I say that the best candidate won't show up till march.
We meet Sanji, Robin, Chopper, Franky and Brook in march.
You two are clearly the most vocal supporters, but you're not alone and you're not the strongest supporters. My theory has always been that he will become Luffy's Vice-Captian. I came up with it just after his introduction at Impel Down…
You've also always been sort of an insufferable twat as well.
I mean come on "HEY BREENAN YOU AREN:T THE BIG WIGS HERE< AS YOU CAN SEE I HAVE MY OWN REALLY AWFUL TWIST ON JIMBEI SUPPORTING THAT BLOWS YOU GUYS OUT OF THE WATER".
lolll
Flagg, I salute you. It seems like a long time since I've defended against a decent argument.
I don't really see what you mean with this one. Jinbe being an exception among Fishmen doesn't really seem to qualify him for Luffy's crew. This'll also carry on to the next count-point I'm going to make.
But it's almost purely the exceptional cases that wind up joining. That's why we should look for those cases. Does this make sense?
Personally I think that this strength and reputation are a little bit over-board for joining the Straw Hats. Jinbe is obviously very strong, strong enough to fight to a stalemate with Ace years ago. We can't be sure how strong the current Straw Hats are now, but I'm pretty sure that Jinbe joining with circumvent the growth that the Monster Trio has had from the start. They're the three muscles of the Straw Hats, and I don't see Jinbe joining and not changing that to a quartet.
We've had Zoro, Luffy, and Sanji growing and getting stronger since East Blue, always being the strongest of the group. Jinbe joining would add him into that, because while I can see Luffy maybe being stronger than Jinbe, I can't for Sanji and Zoro. Plus could you imagine the Straw Hats running around with a former Shichibukai? That'd almost be ridiculous for a crew to have.
I think Jinbe is too big for the Straw Hats, even if they have become fairly famous themselves.
I happen to think his standing is about perfect, but I'll attack it in parts. First, Luffy showed that he was around warlord level strength back during the first half of the Grand Line. He also showed us that PX-4 was about his limit on what he could handle, even with the help of the entire crew. Post timeskip, we see Sanji and Zoro treat one of those things like trash. Logic would have to conclude that their strength has reached warlord level, and beyond in some cases. There's no reason to assume they haven't surpassed Jinbe, as well. Franky could even be on par with him. Jinbe can easily be funneled into a rather middle-of-the-line strength character with a cool specialty.
Second, his reputation. My first read through of this story happened early in Impel Down, and throughout the story I noticed that Oda has a propensity for the grand. Whether it was slipping Robin onto the crew, when only a few chapters earlier her bounty was more than double Luffy's, or destroying entire islands. Also, Luffy was traversing a gauntlet of Warlords. He was involved with every one of them in a row for one reason or another, and they seemed to serve as the main obstacle of the first half of the Grand Line. Going into Impel Down, I felt like it was the natural progression of the story for a Warlord to join the crew as symbolism of him "conquering" the first half. It's a difficult topic to argue, but whether my gut feeling is right or wrong, I do believe it would work.
Also, if a Warlord were going to join the crew, would there be any better way to script it than Jinbe has gotten so far?
Jinbe did bet his life on Luffy getting out of Marineford alive, and then he left him with Rayleigh, in more than enough good hands. Since then Luffy has exponentially grown and Jinbe should be able to tell this when they meet again. I can see Luffy's growth until this point being enough for Jinbe to consider his job of protecting Luffy done. There doesn't really seem like there's much he can do after training him with a legend like Rayleigh. Jinbe has definitely looked out for Luffy already. I think he can consider it a job well done.
Yes, he'd be justified to consider his job finished, but he doesn't seem like the type. There's also the thing with Arlong that came up while they were traveling to Marineford as another debt he had to Luffy that would have to wait for another time. Then, whatever happens at Fishman Island is likely to play a factor, as well.
Jinbe originally took in the Shichibukai status to help relations between Fishmen and Humans, and his goal has always seemed to be the protection of Fishman Island as first and foremost. It seems to me that it'd be more important for him to stay there and hold down the fort than it would be for him to go off adventuring with Luffy to extend his promise to Ace.
First off, you're assuming that Jinbe is acting as some sort of protector to Fishman Island right now, yet we've seen no signs of that. Not even a mention. Secondly, Luffy never leaves friendly islands in chaos. In some way, shape, or form, things will be looking rosy when he leaves. A lot of people seem to like the prediction that Fishman Island will fall under Luffy's "protection" (possibly even mistaken), and in such a situation, protecting that lingering threat would be an admirable way for a noble fishman to support his homeland.
I can definitely see a flashback for Jinbe, and I'm looking forward to something like that, and his mentor figure will more than probably be Fisher Tiger. However I don't think that everybody with a sad past should join the Straw Hats. I'd like to see good character development for somebody important to the story, but not a crew-member.
I don't think they should either, but this has never been about saying he has to join. This has been about establishing it as a legitimate possibility.
You two are clearly the most vocal supporters, but you're not alone and you're not the strongest supporters. My theory has always been that he will become Luffy's Vice-Captian. I came up with it just after his introduction at Impel Down…
You think he will be in a vice captain role, past the likes of Zoro/ Nami? Who act like vice-captains even though they aren't officially called the vice-captains.
Jimbei vice-captain? really? lol. Looks like some people try so hard to be regarded as the "best theorists ever".
I've begun to reflect. Is it Jinbe's character that makes me think he won't join or the horrid theories for why he will join that make me think he won't join?
@JERK:
You've also always been sort of an insufferable twat as well.
I mean come on "HEY BREENAN YOU AREN:T THE BIG WIGS HERE< AS YOU CAN SEE I HAVE MY OWN REALLY AWFUL TWIST ON JIMBEI SUPPORTING THAT BLOWS YOU GUYS OUT OF THE WATER".
lolll
I guess it takes one to know one.
I guess it takes one to know one.
OH, SNAP!
It's funny because Jacoobus is insinuating that JERK DISEASE is in fact also an insufferable twat. It is indeed a zinger.
Jimbei vice-captain? really? lol. Looks like some people try so hard to be regarded as the "best theorists ever".
The trick is to never have to try hard, because the right theories should be natural and easy flowing. No friction.
I guess it takes one to know one.
Of all the come backs in the world, you picked one that means validating the initial insult. Bravo.
@JERK:
The trick is to never have to try hard, because the right theories should be natural and easy flowing. No friction.
So how do you assess them - checklist - common sense - mixture of the 2?
I am acutally curious - not trying to fight. Just noticed I haven't invoked your wrath of late, so I am wondering if I am getting better at getting my point across.
But it's almost purely the exceptional cases that wind up joining. That's why we should look for those cases. Does this make sense?
I see what you're saying, but it seems iffy for "exceptional case" to be enough to call somebody a candidate. Such a qualification seems far too vague.
First, Luffy showed that he was around warlord level strength back during the first half of the Grand Line. He also showed us that PX-4 was about his limit on what he could handle, even with the help of the entire crew. Post timeskip, we see Sanji and Zoro treat one of those things like trash. Logic would have to conclude that their strength has reached warlord level, and beyond in some cases. There's no reason to assume they haven't surpassed Jinbe, as well. Franky could even be on par with him. Jinbe can easily be funneled into a rather middle-of-the-line strength character with a cool specialty.
There really is no set Shichibukai level of strength though. Luffy could fight with Crocodile and Moria, but in front of Kuma he was absolutely worthless. Not all Shichibukai are equal, so Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji being able to easily destroy Pacafistas now does not put them at or above somebody like Jinbe, who was able to wipe the floor with Moria.
Jinbe was also comparable to Ace, who was a Whitebeard Commander on the same level as Marco and Jozu (Jaws?), who put up decent enough fights against Admirals. To say that the Monster Trio is on that level of strength is something I find hard to believe. Jinbe is certainly strong and I don't see the Monster Trio eclipsing him right now.
Second, his reputation. My first read through of this story happened early in Impel Down, and throughout the story I noticed that Oda has a propensity for the grand. Whether it was slipping Robin onto the crew, when only a few chapters earlier her bounty was more than double Luffy's, or destroying entire islands. He was also traversing a gauntlet of Warlords. He was involved with every one of them in a row for one reason or another, and they seemed to serve as the main obstacle of the first half of the Grand Line. Going into Impel Down, I felt like it was the natural progression of the story for a Warlord to join the crew as symbolism of him "conquering" the first half. It's a difficult topic to argue, but whether or not my gut feeling is right or wrong, I do believe it would work.
I wouldn't call the Shichibukai the ones who symbolized the first half, so that if Luffy had one in his crew it'd be a sign of him conquering that sea. They will definitely run into other Shichibukai as the story goes on. Doflamingo has been hyped up pretty well, and they definitely need to run into Mihawk and Kuma again. Shichibukai exist in both seas as power-houses, albeit not on the level of Yonkou.
I don't think Luffy needs any more signs that he's conquered the first half of the Grand Line when he has the highest bounty in the series so far and has been established by other characters as a legitimate candidate for Pirate King.
Also, if a Warlord were going to join the crew, would there be any better way to script it than Jinbe has gotten so far?
If they were going to have a former Shichibukai in the crew then Jinbe would hands down be the obvious choice. I just don't see any Shichibukai joining. They all have their reasons for doing things and their own paths. It is more than possible for one of them to support and be friends with Luffy while still doing their own thing.
See: Hancock
Yes, he'd be justified to consider his job finished, but he doesn't seem like the type. There's also the thing with Arlong that came up while they were traveling to Marineford as another debt he had to Luffy that would have to wait for another time. Then, whatever happens at Fishman Island is likely to play a factor, as well.
Jinbe certainly seems like the honorable type. But there may be things he needs to stay for despite his debt to Luffy. Vivi certainly owed him a lot but stayed in Alabasta because of her responsibilities there. Jinbe might take responsibilities upon himself. In fact with Jinbe's character that seems fairly likely to me.
First off, you're assuming that Jinbe is acting as some sort of protector to Fishman Island right now, yet we've seen no signs of that. Not even a mention.
This is just an inference from Jinbe putting such emphasis on his respect for Whitebeard for saving Fishman Island and taking his Shichibukai title to help relations with humans and Fishmen. It is not far fetched at all to say that he puts the safety of Fishman Island over things like watching out for a single boy who should be more than equipped to handle himself from now on.
Secondly, Luffy never leaves friendly islands in chaos. In some way, shape, or form, things will be looking rosy when he leaves. A lot of people seem to like the prediction that Fishman Island will fall under Luffy's "protection" (possibly even mistaken), and in such a situation, protecting that lingering threat would be an admirable way for a noble fishman to support his homeland.
I wouldn't mind seeing Fishman Island fall under Luffy's protection. But I'm confused at the bold part. I'd definitely agree with it, but wouldn't the best way for Jinbe to protect Fishman Island with Luffy's name be to stay at the Island and enforce it himself?
A Shichibukai protecting an island in the name of a famous pirate seems to have more pull in protecting his homeland than a Shichibukai riding around the seas with said pirate. It sounds like you just gave an instance where it'd be better for Jinbe to not join the crew.
I don't think they should either, but this has never been about saying he has to join. This has been about establishing it as a legitimate possibility.
Well I would say that he has the best chance of joining out of any other candidate who is brought up, so the possibility is there. But discussing just "is it possible" seems like a cop-out when we can just go ahead and discuss predictions for if he actually will or not.
I see what you're saying, but it seems iffy for "exceptional case" to be enough to call somebody a candidate. Such a qualification seems far too vague.
By itself, I agree. However, It does narrow down the options considerably, so it should be stated.
There really is no set Shichibukai level of strength though. Luffy could fight with Crocodile and Moria, but in front of Kuma he was absolutely worthless. Not all Shichibukai are equal, so Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji being able to easily destroy Pacafistas now does not put them at or above somebody like Jinbe, who was able to wipe the floor with Moria.
Jinbe was also comparable to Ace, who was a Whitebeard Commander on the same level as Marco and Jozu (Jaws?), who put up decent enough fights against Admirals. To say that the Monster Trio is on that level of strength is something I find hard to believe. Jinbe is certainly strong and I don't see the Monster Trio eclipsing him right now.
No, there isn't a set level of strength for Warlords, but it's safe to say there's a perceived "floor" for how weak they can be. Zoro and Sanji should easily eclipse that mark now. Jinbe, Zoro, and Sanji can all wipe the floor with Moriah now, so he loses credibility in the argument. It's difficult to compare the maximums of the three without just guessing since we haven't seen them yet.
Jinbe was comparable to Ace when Ace first came through at 17. It's true he was a logia, but water was probably effective against him. There's no reason to assume that Ace was already on the level of Marco and Jozu at that early age, though.
I wouldn't call the Shichibukai the ones who symbolized the first half, so that if Luffy had one in his crew it'd be a sign of him conquering that sea. They will definitely run into other Shichibukai as the story goes on. Doflamingo has been hyped up pretty well, and they definitely need to run into Mihawk and Kuma again. Shichibukai exist in both seas as power-houses, albeit not on the level of Yonkou.
I don't think Luffy needs any more signs that he's conquered the first half of the Grand Line when he has the highest bounty in the series so far and has been established by other characters as a legitimate candidate for Pirate King.
In the first half, there was a feeling that the seas were sort of controlled by the Warlords. I seriously doubt I'll have that same feeling in the New World, which is supposed to be controlled by the Emperors. Yes, they'll still be some great and significant characters, but their perch won't seem nearly as lofty.
Luffy doesn't need more, no. But as I said earlier, propensity for the grand.
If they were going to have a former Shichibukai in the crew then Jinbe would hands down be the obvious choice. I just don't see any Shichibukai joining. They all have their reasons for doing things and their own paths. It is more than possible for one of them to support and be friends with Luffy while still doing their own thing.
See: Hancock
You sort of miss the point on this one. It's not about comparing Jinbe to the other six Warlords. It's about what a good writer would do differently with the storyboarding of Jinbe if he was planned to join. Not much that I can think of.
Jinbe certainly seems like the honorable type. But there may be things he needs to stay for despite his debt to Luffy. Vivi certainly owed him a lot but stayed in Alabasta because of her responsibilities there. Jinbe might take responsibilities upon himself. In fact with Jinbe's character that seems fairly likely to me.
Yes, Jinbe might decide his responsibilities lie at Fishman Island, and I've never disputed the possibility of him not joining. It's a fairly strong possibility. He's no princess, though, he's an outlaw.
This is just an inference from Jinbe putting such emphasis on his respect for Whitebeard for saving Fishman Island and taking his Shichibukai title to help relations with humans and Fishmen. It is not far fetched at all to say that he puts the safety of Fishman Island over things like watching out for a single boy who should be more than equipped to handle himself from now on.
I wouldn't mind seeing Fishman Island fall under Luffy's protection. But I'm confused at the bold part. I'd definitely agree with it, but wouldn't the best way for Jinbe to protect Fishman Island with Luffy's name be to stay at the Island and enforce it himself?
A Shichibukai protecting an island in the name of a famous pirate seems to have more pull in protecting his homeland than a Shichibukai riding around the seas with said pirate. It sounds like you just gave an instance where it'd be better for Jinbe to not join the crew.
We know that Whitebeard's words saved the island, and Jinbe was willing to put his life on the line to protect Whitebeard for that reason. The worst thing that could happen to Fishman Island was Whitebeard dying. If it falls under Luffy's protection, then the same thing applies. Fishman Island would be invested in Luffy, and it makes sense to protect your investment.
I think we're going to find that Fishman Island doesn't rely on Jinbe for its military strength as much as a lot of people seem to believe.
Well I would say that he has the best chance of joining out of any other candidate who is brought up, so the possibility is there. But discussing just "is it possible" seems like a cop-out when we can just go ahead and discuss predictions for if he actually will or not.
Well, nobody in their right mind will feel sure of Jinbe joining, I don't think. There are still too many unknowns and too many possibilities. I do think it's a plausible idea, though, as the story seems to line up with it from what I can tell, so I'm happy to argue the pro side of it.
Yes, Jinbe might decide his responsibilities lie at Fishman Island, and I've never disputed the possibility of him not joining. It's a fairly strong possibility. He's no princess, though, he's an outlaw.
I agree w/ you on the part of Jinbe currently having the feel of a character that "would" join and another point of the difference in Vivi and Jinbe is despite WBs death, Fishman Island most likely isn't going to be a nation at each others throats decimated by struggle the way Alabasta was.This one chapter has shown that there are fishman there basically seeming to be on guard for anyone that comes near, I don't think there would be any fishman pirates outside of fishman island if they were having too much trouble inside the bubble.
We know that Whitebeard's words saved the island, and Jinbe was willing to put his life on the line to protect Whitebeard for that reason. The worst thing that could happen to Fishman Island was Whitebeard dying. If it falls under Luffy's protection, then the same thing applies. Fishman Island would be invested in Luffy, and it makes sense to protect your investment.
I gonna throw in my two cents on this. WB protected quite a few islands and everybody new not to mess with them because WB would retaliate in a most vicious manner. He had to get this reputation, he would actually have to carry out his threats a few times for them to have enough effectiveness. Luffy is on an adventure, he's not just going to drop everything to go chasing after some pirates who attacked FI. It's inevitable that someone will attack it, look a Caribou, he knows the SH reputation but he's planning on killing them all, other pirates of that level aren't going to be any more cowed by Luffy's name than he is. If Luffy were to be able to use his name to protect FI he would need to chase down and deal with everyone who attacked the place and that's just not feasible.
Also, this becomes very easy bait for the WG. If Luffy says, right now, that FI is under his protection, and the WG doesn't use it to bring him down right away they are bigger 'tards then George W. Bush. Also, if Luffy intends to protect it, he will have to face the marine admirals right away, if the WG provokes injustice against fishmen to provoke Luffy, which really isn't that far-fetched.
So, there really is no benefit to the story for Luffy to declare he is going to protect the island.
Why doesn't Jinbe fit in with the rest of them again? He's not the kind to serve under anybody and he's more of a friend on the level of Rayleigh. If Jinbe was the kind of person to join a crew then he would've joined Whitebeard–somebody he is indebted to a lot more than Luffy--but he didn't. Him joining the Straw Hats just because Luffy and him are friends is nothing but wishful thinking.
I like Jinbe, and I hope we see a lot of him at Fishman Island, but he just doesn't belong on Luffy's ship as a permanent crew member.
I realize this was probably discussed into the ground before I registered here but I just don't see why he's a viable candidate.
AMEN!! this is EXACTLY why jinbe will NOT join. this man knows what he's talkin about lol
I gonna throw in my two cents on this. WB protected quite a few islands and everybody new not to mess with them because WB would retaliate in a most vicious manner. He had to get this reputation, he would actually have to carry out his threats a few times for them to have enough effectiveness. Luffy is on an adventure, he's not just going to drop everything to go chasing after some pirates who attacked FI. It's inevitable that someone will attack it, look a Caribou, he knows the SH reputation but he's planning on killing them all, other pirates of that level aren't going to be any more cowed by Luffy's name than he is. If Luffy were to be able to use his name to protect FI he would need to chase down and deal with everyone who attacked the place and that's just not feasible.
I find it ironic that I'm on this side of this debate, as I've always had a hard time buying into it. The process of backing up the claim is exactly the issue I've always had with it, too. However, even the threat of him possibly taking vengeance would have its effect. Sure, it wouldn't stop everyone, and it wouldn't bring retribution down upon those who don't. It could easily be written to stop a large percentage of them, though, enabling the fishmen to defend themselves against lesser numbers. Or as Luffy would say, "I'm sure they can handle the rest."
AMEN!! this is EXACTLY why jinbe will NOT join.
The fact that he didn't join Whitebeard back when he was still a Warlord?
The fact that he didn't join Whitebeard back when he was still a Warlord?
What makes luffy any better than WB? Jinbe was more in debt to whitebeard than he ever may be to luffy. And even though he was still a warlord during that period, I wouldnt hesitate to say that Jinbe still wouldnt have joined WB without that title.
Well, at least you have no hesitation, even if you have no reasoning to back it up. Wait, that's not a good thing.
Hopefully you'll provide me with some.
Well, at least you have no hesitation, even if you have no reasoning to back it up. Wait, that's not a good thing.
Hopefully you'll provide me with some.
I just dont see a Warlord joining, excuse me, former warlord. He has resposibilities else where. But I am only judging the situation by the current information givin to us now. Maybe more evident clues will appear later in the series. We will see what happens in the future. I may be wrong.
No, there isn't a set level of strength for Warlords, but it's safe to say there's a perceived "floor" for how weak they can be. Zoro and Sanji should easily eclipse that mark now. Jinbe, Zoro, and Sanji can all wipe the floor with Moriah now, so he loses credibility in the argument. It's difficult to compare the maximums of the three without just guessing since we haven't seen them yet.
Jinbe very easily surpassed that floor, so comparing Jinbe to the minimum Shichibukai level of strength is iffy at best. Would you say that Zoro and Sanji are both stronger than Jinbe now?
Jinbe was comparable to Ace when Ace first came through at 17. It's true he was a logia, but water was probably effective against him. There's no reason to assume that Ace was already on the level of Marco and Jozu at that early age, though.
Makes sense. But we can still somewhat measure Jinbe through how effortlessly he beat Moria, even if it doesn't give us an exact measure of his fighting ability.
You sort of miss the point on this one. It's not about comparing Jinbe to the other six Warlords. It's about what a good writer would do differently with the storyboarding of Jinbe if he was planned to join. Not much that I can think of.
It is possible to storyboard and give depth to a character that won't join.
We have a sense of who Hancock is as a character, why she hates men, why she hates the government, and why she holds on to her Shichibukai status despite this. She is a rather fleshed out character who supports Luffy and would go to his aid in the case that he needed it. However, it would be ridiculous for her to be a crew-member.
Yes, Jinbe might decide his responsibilities lie at Fishman Island, and I've never disputed the possibility of him not joining. It's a fairly strong possibility. He's no princess, though, he's an outlaw.
An outlaw to the Marines is not the same as an outlaw to Fishman Island, as we can see from how Luffy was greeted and how they idolize Fisher Tiger.
We know that Whitebeard's words saved the island, and Jinbe was willing to put his life on the line to protect Whitebeard for that reason. The worst thing that could happen to Fishman Island was Whitebeard dying. If it falls under Luffy's protection, then the same thing applies. Fishman Island would be invested in Luffy, and it makes sense to protect your investment.
Right, Jinbe was willing to do whatever he could to protect Whitebeard when the war against him was announced. He did not join the Whitebeard pirates to keep an eye on Newgate as he ventured around the New World. Jinbe did his own thing and only aided Whitebeard when he needed it. Luffy can handle himself for the most part, and I can understand Jinbe coming to his aid when he needs it, but that's different than joining his crew and being with him for the rest of his journey.
I think we're going to find that Fishman Island doesn't rely on Jinbe for its military strength as much as a lot of people seem to believe.
I'd agree with that. Especially now that we've got the sea monsters and New Fishman Pirates guarding the entrance. But there's really no denying that compared to a lot of other pirates in this series, Jinbe is pretty damn strong. Strong enough to back up any potential "threat of Straw Hat" that might be placed on Fishman Island for protection better than a group of Sea Monsters or New Fishman Pirates.
Also, this becomes very easy bait for the WG. If Luffy says, right now, that FI is under his protection, and the WG doesn't use it to bring him down right away they are bigger 'tards then George W. Bush. Also, if Luffy intends to protect it, he will have to face the marine admirals right away, if the WG provokes injustice against fishmen to provoke Luffy, which really isn't that far-fetched.
So, there really is no benefit to the story for Luffy to declare he is going to protect the island.
Except the Marines never attacked any pirate's staked territory. If they were the kind to do this, then they would've done it years ago to lure out Whitebeard, and they'd be doing the same thing to Kaidou right now, or any other pirate who has territory.
I just dont see a Warlord joining, excuse me, former warlord. He has resposibilities else where. But I am only judging the situation by the current information givin to us now. Maybe more evident clues will appear later in the series. We will see what happens in the future. I may be wrong.
The current information is: the guards at fishmen island didn't bother to mention him even though he played a major role in the biggest war since Roger's time. It implies he is not in high favour with his people.
Except the Marines never attacked any pirate's staked territory. If they were the kind to do this, then they would've done it years ago to lure out Whitebeard, and they'd be doing the same thing to Kaidou right now, or any other pirate who has territory.
Luffy is not Whitebeard. Whitebeard had a 15 division (i think?) pirate fleet, with over 40 additional allied pirate crews (I think?). Engaging in warfare with Whitebeard proved extremely problematic even when the WG had the upper hand in every way, from a strategic standpoint.
Luffy has a 9 person pirate crew, Rayleigh, Shanks (maybe), and hardly any additional strong allies. I doubt the repercussions of engaging in war with Luffy would prove as problematic as it would have with Whitebeard, as we clearly saw in the War saga.
The WG destroyed an entire civilian island to protect a secret. I don't put it past them to use dirty means to defeat a growing threat.
I just dont see a Warlord joining, excuse me, former warlord. He has resposibilities else where. But I am only judging the situation by the current information givin to us now. Maybe more evident clues will appear later in the series. We will see what happens in the future. I may be wrong.
You're not judging based on information, you're judging based on your perception. The only piece of hard information in your 3 posts combined is that he's a former Warlord.
Jinbe very easily surpassed that floor, so comparing Jinbe to the minimum Shichibukai level of strength is iffy at best. Would you say that Zoro and Sanji are both stronger than Jinbe now?
If I had to guess, I'd say yes. The truth is, though, that there isn't enough information to base an argument on, and Oda has left himself with total freedom to go either way with it.
Makes sense. But we can still somewhat measure Jinbe through how effortlessly he beat Moria, even if it doesn't give us an exact measure of his fighting ability.
Sure, just like we can somewhat measure Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji on how effortlessly they curbstomped those pacifistas. In both cases, we get no information beyond "ok, at least this strong."
It is possible to storyboard and give depth to a character that won't join.
We have a sense of who Hancock is as a character, why she hates men, why she hates the government, and why she holds on to her Shichibukai status despite this. She is a rather fleshed out character who supports Luffy and would go to his aid in the case that he needed it. However, it would be ridiculous for her to be a crew-member.
Yes, storyboarding isn't restricted to the crew at all. You're still missing my point here completely, and the thought of re-explaining it differently tires me, so I'm just going to move on.
An outlaw to the Marines is not the same as an outlaw to Fishman Island, as we can see from how Luffy was greeted and how they idolize Fisher Tiger.
That's certainly true, but any political obligations he had were lost with his Warlord title. I don't know how he's thought of at Fishman Island, but he doesn't seem to be idolized by the current pirates, at least. As a notorious criminal, his presence may even draw unwanted attention that FI could do without.
Right, Jinbe was willing to do whatever he could to protect Whitebeard when the war against him was announced. He did not join the Whitebeard pirates to keep an eye on Newgate as he ventured around the New World. Jinbe did his own thing and only aided Whitebeard when he needed it. Luffy can handle himself for the most part, and I can understand Jinbe coming to his aid when he needs it, but that's different than joining his crew and being with him for the rest of his journey.
He was also a Warlord and had other responsibilities. With everything remaining equal, I feel this would be a valid argument. In this case, however, the situation seems to be quite different. Of course, I'd expect a dream to pop up and be a factor, as well. I don't like to rely on it because it's a total unknown, and it could be viewed as a wild card for theorists, but it's more fuel for why things could be different this time.
I'd agree with that. Especially now that we've got the sea monsters and New Fishman Pirates guarding the entrance. But there's really no denying that compared to a lot of other pirates in this series, Jinbe is pretty damn strong. Strong enough to back up any potential "threat of Straw Hat" that might be placed on Fishman Island for protection better than a group of Sea Monsters or New Fishman Pirates.
Absolutely, Jinbe is a monster. I just think they can back up any potential threat without him, as well. We certainly haven't seen all they have to offer. Sure his presence will make them stronger, but it's all relative, and it's also possible that the negative attention he attracts works to cancel it out.
The current information is: the guards at fishmen island didn't bother to mention him even though he played a major role in the biggest war since Roger's time. It implies he is not in high favour with his people.
so, youre implying that Jinbe may possibly join the SH's because he is basically not wanted by fishman island?
When you focus on Jinbei like he is the best candidate for NN..I'm speechless..There's too many pros and cons to talk about but still there's one thing that SH crews shared in common..that is "Silly Jokes"..I don't think Jinbei can keep up with this..for now at least..
When you focus on Jinbei like he is the best candidate for NN..I'm speechless..There's too many pros and cons to talk about but still there's one thing that SH crews shared in common..that is "Silly Jokes"..I don't think Jinbei can keep up with this..for now at least..
Variety is the spice of life, perhaps Oda wants someone in the crew who doesn't make any jokes.
but don't you think it'll make the scene "dull"..look at how Oda did manage to turn Robin characteristic?
Variety is the spice of life, perhaps Oda wants someone in the crew who doesn't make any jokes.
We have Robin. That's enough.
I think a cool fishman (NOT JIMBEI OR ARLONG!!!!) would be good. With a deer, skeleton and cyborg, they need another unique person. And this one will kind of help them a lot when it comes to water stuff.
I think Jimbei is too experienced to come, and too powerful, even if Luffy and maybe Zoro and Sansji are on the same level. He has been to the New World, he's been around.
He'd have to be pretty special for a fishman as well though.
It'd be cool to have a flying fish fishman, and I'm sure Luffy would like that as well. xP
He'd have to be pretty special for a fishman as well though.
It'd be cool to have a flying fish fishman, and I'm sure Luffy would like that as well. xP
Something to represent the fishmen from the Straw hats. Like if there would be some kind of war in the future were a lot of fishmen would be involved, that one dude would kind of be the bridge in their unity. Like the government liked having Jimbei as a Shichibukai because it created an alliance between the 2 races, or whatever Sengoku said.
Flying fishman? You mean… a fish with wings?
Something to represent the fishmen from the Straw hats. Like if there would be some kind of war in the future were a lot of fishmen would be involved, that one dude would kind of be the bridge in their unity. Like the government liked having Jimbei as a Shichibukai because it created an alliance between the 2 races, or whatever Sengoku said.
Flying fishman? You mean… a fish with wings?
Remember the flying fish riders?
I guess it'd mean Oda reusing that idea so it'd be kinda lame but…
No! I want Caribou as NN!
Remember the flying fish riders?
I guess it'd mean Oda reusing that idea so it'd be kinda lame but…
oh right, I forgot, I thought they could fly because of some mechanical stuff. If so, then it has to be exactly like those fish, that he can fly for a limited amount of minutes.
@Louis: Your sig, is it your creation or picking from somewhere in manga? I like to re read that part/scene if can..
During the skypiea arc, when Sanji kicks that cloud ball and it explodes. That scene never gets old to me.
so, youre implying that Jinbe may possibly join the SH's because he is basically not wanted by fishman island?
Yes, I am saying to ignore those features in the story and coming to the conclusion that Jinbe won't join is premature. He has the best chance of any character revealed so far, if you don't believe that, you need to test your reading comprehension and see how much you need to improve just to be able to pick up on subtle story aspects.
@Louis: Yea, I got it finally! It's Ch 246 pg 11..Thanks to you.
Aw man..OP really fun even if we re-read it plenty of time..
Just noticed I haven't invoked your wrath of late, so I am wondering if I am getting better at getting my point across.
Are you that insecure about yourself? Are you so worried about his opinion on you?
According to the RA's information, you are just trying to make better points and following points from good posters. You don't dare to risk anymore, ever since you became aware of what this forum is, and where you are in it.
No! I want Caribou as NN!
Nutritious Noodle? Nonsexual Nudity? National Nanny? Nazi Noob?
@Sea:
Are you that insecure about yourself? Are you so worried about his opinion on you? LOL.
According to the RA's information, you are just trying to make better points and following points from good posters. You don't dare to risk anymore, ever since you became aware of what this forum is, and where you are in it.
Curiosity should not be confused with insecurity. I'm not seeking his approval or looking to join his biggest fan club.
I'll never deny JD is an intelligent person - nor would I question his knowledge in all things Manga related. He can shoot down arguments with decent logic, while I don't approve of his method and abuse of people I am certain he doesn't give a flying f**k what I think. More importantly it doesn't stop his points being any more true or to the point.
A lot of the arguments in this thread have been shot down by a multitude of members, their reasoning seems to be included in the posts. But I was interested in his perspective of viewing things in this subject, just because I may not like the way he presents his view doesn't mean I can't learn from them.
I would like to be able to join in with a bit more authority in voicing my opinion of who will join next - not just run off a listing of "ME TOO" to other peoples statements.
Also what is RA's? - Regardless i've had my batism of fire from those with skill and wit and a few wet jabs from those trying to follow the styling of others but coming off as smoked glassed image of someone else.
I think Jinbei is growing on me from re-reading, but that said I am more in favour of their being an offspring of Jinbei's he askes them to take. There is no forsdhadowing to follow for it but meh I'd enjoy seeing that facet of a story explored.
I think Jinbei is growing on me from re-reading, but that said I am more in favour of their being an offspring of Jinbei's he askes them to take. There is no forsdhadowing to follow for it but meh I'd enjoy seeing that facet of a story explored.
If the person has no goals other then fulfilling Jinbe's dream, he has no place on the ship. Luffy is not one to force people to come anyways.
If he does have other goals Jinbe should not have to convince him to come. The next character doesn't need to be Franky 2.0.
refreshing question: Why this thread stated "Last Two Nakamates"? I thought the most additional crew will be the last one??
If the person has no goals other then fulfilling Jinbe's dream, he has no place on the ship. Luffy is not one to force people to come anyways.
If he does have other goals Jinbe should not have to convince him to come. The next character doesn't need to be Franky 2.0.
Franky wanted to go - he felt he had to protect his crew - or didn't feel worthy enough to live out his dream.
There are many stories out there some quite powerful ones where a rebel child is encoraged to go with others and comes back stronger for it. Think like Usopp who wants to become brave "like" his father.
This one could already be strong but just not have enough real world experience to use that strength to better himself and better his enviroment, if there was a child of encorraged to go with Luffy you have actual conflict amongst the crew without it tearing them appart. Also the ability to show growth of character the Rebel discovering a cause he can follow.
That is a character I would like to see - I might be alone in that, I can accept that.
refreshing question: Why this thread stated "Last Two Nakamates"? I thought the most additional crew will be the last one??
It's been answered a few times - question pops up every 100 posts or so - Going off the original quote Luffy wanted "At least 10" crewmates - not counting Luffy there is 8. It's a point of contention that easily leads everyone to arguing that point - sometimes used to interrupt the thread.
^bwahahaha..the thread got too many pages for me to scroll it down..pardon me..
The current information is: the guards at fishmen island didn't bother to mention him even though he played a major role in the biggest war since Roger's time. It implies he is not in high favour with his people.
There are pirates, I don't think that they are anykind of guard.
As I already said, I don't think that all the fishmen are pirates and it's not because some fishmen pirates are favorable to Arlong's ideology, that all the fishmen are with him…
^somehow agreed..but still Arlong NOT for SH crews. The End.