No, pretty sure paying for a 2 hour advert is worse.
Naruto Thread IV
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Why are we clumping Transformers 2 with Avatar thou?
I understand both are example for "bad movies" but Avatar at least used a decent clichéd storyline with amazing visuals.
Transformers 2 on the other hand had nothing resembling a plot and the most racist african american robot caricatures I've EVER laid my eyes on.
Just Saiyan.
We all know District 9 was THE sci fi movie to watch last year.
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The only good 3d films have been the cgi ones like Up and How to train your dragon.
Avatar was a terribly written movie. I can't believe the number of critics who rated it highly.
I love how some people complained that "Up" wasn't a good movie because a bunch of balloons aren't physically capable of actually lifting up a house. Yes, because children's films have always prided themselves on realism.
How to Train Your Dragon was good. I kept hearing people in school say how awesome it was, and then I finally got the chance to see it on an airplane flight. Even without 3D it was good.
Also loved Toy Story 3 to death. It's probably the one kid's movie where the third movie didn't suck. usually even the second movie is pushing it, but they did a marvelous job.
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Eye Ninja is like I, Robot (Movie) in the sense that both are crap.
They're also the same in that neither has Isaac Asimov, and by default, are shit.
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@robbybedfart:
Did you also like Transformers 2 or Avatar, perchance?
Actually, aside from the cool graphics, I hated Avatar. I'd rather watch Dancing with the Wolves.
As for Transformers 2
I can't explain it any better.
LAhNSXNTWKI -
About Avatar: Do I want to watch Avatar in order to get all the hate (despite the fact that I've seen the ending at Best Buy), or should I pass?
And yeah, the only 3D movies I've seen worth watching so far are HTTYD and Up.
Coraline…I'm actually pretty okay with. -
Why are we clumping Transformers 2 with Avatar thou?
I understand both are example for "bad movies" but Avatar at least used a decent clichéd storyline with amazing visuals.
Transformers 2 on the other hand had nothing resembling a plot and the most racist african american robot caricatures I've EVER laid my eyes on.
Just Saiyan.
We all know District 9 was THE sci fi movie to watch last year.
Indeed. Avatar was shlockish and boring and had one of the most hammy, in your face, do this or die plots for a while but at least the scenery was interesting enough. I could kinda daze out and not really focus on the characters and instead daydream about what a wellwritten movie would be like with this kind of technology. On the other hand, Transformers 2 actually offended me as a human being. It made me loathe Michael Bay for how he thinks of audience and made me loathe the audiences who are actually like that.
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Cuddles.
Watch it.
The hate is a bandwagon internet effect.
Nothing more.
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It's a 2 star film.
Yeah, Coraline & Toy story 3 were great. Also Cloudy with a chance of meatballs.
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Why are we clumping Transformers 2 with Avatar thou?
Special effects extravaganzas with little plot, that people excuse with "I just turn my brain off when I go in and want to see some action scenes."… that made crazy amounts of money.
They're bad in different ways, but still bad.
(Or so I've heard. I actually haven't seen TF2, the first one was terrible enough. But I believe the reactions.)
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Transformers 2 makes the first bay film look like a shining paragon of film making.
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We're talking about that CGI film now, are we? I watched it not too long ago. I liked it, it was good. A lot of important topics were touched upon, ones the public at large probably didn't know about before. Imperial power, subjugation, and the more modern evils we deal with on a day to day basis. Finding these things may have been tricky for those not acquainted with such things beforehand, but I felt it was rewarding whether you counted as part of them or not. And the alien species was fascinating, remarkable in their humanity. I never would have expected such a thing with all the oddities and strange knick-knacks that surrounded them. A true, solid film.
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It's a 2 star film.
Yeah, Coraline & Toy story 3 were great. Also Cloudy with a chance of meatballs.
W3RM5hHfvFA
Speaking of Best Buy, I also saw a little of this on their screens and my first thought was 'I should've seen this movie.'
I judged it by the trailer too much.
Doesn't look like it's amazing, but it did look fun. -
@Thousand:
Didn't they just go all, "Yeah the story sucks, who cares? Look how pretty it is!!!"
Most expensive screensaver ever
How to Train your Dragon was awesome.
@Badass:
Why is it that any character considered ninja-like in Naruto is now dead?
Naruto is all about magical "ninjas" nowadays.
You comparing that to what Naruto did? Spare me.
You are trying to prove Naruto vs Kyuubi was more creative than Kisame vs Killerbee. If you are going to use hand to hand combat as an argument, the same thing happened with Gai.
It was still part of the fight.
Still part of the fight.
Still happened during the fight.
It wasn't something Naruto did. Period. Are you going to count Killerbee in the Gai vs Kisame fight?
The jutsu Gai used against Kisame is still a form of opening the gates. FRS is treated as a different jutsu and its effects are different from the other rasengans.
I know that. I'm counting the summons, Kisame trying to get information out, using your surroudings to your advantage.
Much more interesting that rasenganrasenganrasengan.
Rasengan is a jutsu.
You don't say.
I'm comparing their intelligence. Who knows, maybe Shikararu has a better IQ than Batman.
Oh wait, you are serious.
Kakuzu died like a true warrior never giving up and having his own goals.
What goal? Making money? Died like a punk. And broke. An "experienced warrior" that was beaten by a genin level jutsu.
Kisame died as Madara's puppet and wanting to be controlled by Madara's mass genjutsu. Way to go Kisame.
Kisame died following his own ideals. Never give information to the enemy. Madara had nothing to do with the way he did things, since he killed his own teammates to protect information way before he met him.
He was still kakuzu's enemy and interfered in the fight.
He did nothing other than babysit Naruto.
They were still enemies.
Means shit is they are there as cheerleaders only.
Hidan.
LOL, such a feat.
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@Thousand:
Since when is characterization something you can have too much of?
Naruto? Sasuke?
Sometimes characters can have a simple theme, and the author can rotate that theme around so the readers get to see all the intricacies and details of said theme, but there's only so much detail that can be built into a single idea. Going further runs the risk of gutting the original theme with contradictions or superflous material.
Kisame's such a character. All he is as a force in the manga was a water jutsu user, high chakra, had a sword and an affinity for sharks. Pretty bare-bones, gimmick antagonist. His motivations for joining Akatsuki were just as unexplained as his abilities, but they were tersely yet effectively summarized in his flashback sequence. Do we really need more info about why he's got an affinity with sharks? It could just have been as trivial as Naruto gaining frog summons because Jiraiya, a frog summoning user gave him the contract to start using frogs. It's an interesting detail, but not something related to the big-picture character of "Kisame". It's more like something found in a data-book.
Basically what I'm saying is, I didn't buy into the hype of Guy vs. Kisame as being a huge manga rivalry. It seemed like a typical shinobi rivalry to me, one that should have been pretty common in the Naruto world in the rare case of repeat encounters but not featured often in the manga. I always felt this way because Kisame was an S-ranked (Kage-level) missing-nin from a broken country renown for violence, and one of the Seven Swordsmen of the Mist with the most powerful of the swords. Guy, a powerful Special Jounin should have been heavily disadvantaged, but the feud was made interesting because Guy was a better at Taijutsu than the well-rounded Kisame. I woudn't have believed Guy would have won in a prolonged fight against a beast like Kisame, and true to the ninja theme of this manga he won quickly using the element of surprise with his Afternoon Tiger, something Kisame wouldn't have been able to predict.
You could call it lowered expectations, but I've already accepted Kishimoto lacks creativity and I don't think he could have come up with more original Jutsu than what we saw in this match. Part of the brevity was out of necessity.
Part of the reason I enjoyed this chapter was because I wasn't invested in the rivalry. It's like how people bemoan the forsaking of the secondary characters because they're more interesting than Naruto. It's not a matter of the secondary characters being very interesting, but Naruto being completely bland and uninteresting.
How did he get that way? Too much character focus…too much development, so much so that he went in circles.
@Thousand:
You mean generic cookie cutter ninja? Talk about a lot of depth.
I don't see why this is a problem.
People are largely motivated by simple ideas. Kisame was a ninja dedicated to ninja ways. He doesn't need some sort of mangled childhood marred by a broken family, tyranny, dead puppies and war atrocities to define him as a character. He's a professional whose own dedication isolates him from everyone.
The only thing that bugs me given this is how Naruto sensed his "hatred"…if anything, he's not hateful, he's apathetic.
@Thousand:
That flashback was utterly pointless. It didn't tie into anything to the present in terms of either story development or characterization. It was just a brief bio for a near pointless character.
There's no way Kisame's background would have impacted the current flow of the story, he's too insignificant a character for that. But his background justified his current attitude, and gave insight into the philosophy that governed his life, and explained why he chose to die like he did.
@Thousand:
And in those few panels we got Zoro's dreams, aspirations and character drive. Not to mention since then, Oda's flashbacks have been long as he puts more care and effort and detail into them. In Kisame's flashback we got he's a vicious ninja that does whatever it takes and he didn't like his village. Stuff we already knew.
I actually think Oda's flashbacks have gotten worse (Robin, Luffy) since the early days, because he's trying to work in major plot events as seen through the eyes of the younger SH pirates. Most of what I get from his flashbacks are unsaid rather than mentioned outright. I actually wrote up a gigantic rant about Zoro's current motivation for Manga but felt it was too trivial to bother making a topic about
But anyway, a skilled author can manipulate both what he/she wants to reveal about a character and what should remain mysterious. A lot of Japanese writers seem to abuse the mysterious aspect because they can't write good development for the character in the first place. We all know Kishimoto is not skilled. However, I do think Kisame was intended to be a simple antagonist from the start, and the hyper surrounding him was more of imaginative invention because of how little was known about him. But I don't think he was deliberately mysterious (contrast Itachi), just self-explanatory. A character who's design tells you he's an antagonist, and nothing more than that.
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@robbybedfart:
Special effects extravaganzas with little plot, that people excuse with "I just turn my brain off when I go in and want to see some action scenes."… that made crazy amounts of money.
They're bad in different ways, but still bad.
(Or so I've heard. I actually haven't seen TF2, the first one was terrible enough. But I believe the reactions.)
Fine, did you like Paranormal Activity and the Last Exorcism which had little to no Special Effects and mainly focused on the plot?
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Avatar was at least pretty and had one good action scene.
Transformers 2 wasn't pretty, had no good action scenes, was painfully, painfully long, most of the jokes offended me (not in the "I'm an old lady and I'm offended way" but in the utter shock that a group of people put it in the movie and expected me to pay for it), most of the characters (half of them were gimmicky jokes) offended me, the plot was so laughably bad as to be non-existent or irrelevant and just the fact that people recorded this and put it on film….I hate the movie.
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I plan to watch Avatar some four years later, when it's finally released for the sixth time with all additional 12 minutes of film.
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We're talking about that CGI film now, are we? I watched it not too long ago. I liked it, it was good. A lot of important topics were touched upon, ones the public at large probably didn't know about before. Imperial power, subjugation, and the more modern evils we deal with on a day to day basis. Finding these things may have been tricky for those not acquainted with such things beforehand, but I felt it was rewarding whether you counted as part of them or not. And the alien species was fascinating, remarkable in their humanity. I never would have expected such a thing with all the oddities and strange knick-knacks that surrounded them. A true, solid film.
@Cuddles:
Speaking of Best Buy, I also saw a little of this on their screens and my first thought was 'I should've seen this movie.'
I judged it by the trailer too much.
Doesn't look like it's amazing, but it did look fun.Watch it.
very fun film.
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We're talking about that CGI film now, are we? I watched it not too long ago. I liked it, it was good. A lot of important topics were touched upon, ones the public at large probably didn't know about before. Imperial power, subjugation, and the more modern evils we deal with on a day to day basis. Finding these things may have been tricky for those not acquainted with such things beforehand, but I felt it was rewarding whether you counted as part of them or not. And the alien species was fascinating, remarkable in their humanity. I never would have expected such a thing with all the oddities and strange knick-knacks that surrounded them. A true, solid film.
QFT. District 9 is one of my top favorite movies. I heard there's going to be a sequel to this too. anyone know if the rumors are true?
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Actually, aside from the cool graphics, I hated Avatar. I'd rather watch Dancing with the Wolves.
As for Transformers 2
I can't explain it any better.
LAhNSXNTWKIThat guy basically argued that Transformers 2 was a good movie because it would make a good porno….....what?
Of course, i've never seen the movie, just the first one.
You know what was a bad movie? The Expendables. Rotten Tomatoes couldn't have been more right about it. With all the explosions, you'd think it was a Michael Bay film.
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QFT. District 9 is one of my top favorite movies. I heard there's going to be a sequel to this too. anyone know if the rumors are true?
The Creators/Directors said that there would never ever ever in a million years be a sequel.
But I did hear something about a Prequel.@Badass:
That guy basically argued that Transformers 2 was a good movie because it would make a good porno….....what?
Of course, i've never seen the movie, just the first one.
You know what was a bad movie? The Expendables. Rotten Tomatoes couldn't have been more right about it. With all the explosions, you'd think it was a Michael Bay film.
I liked Expendables.
You can add another Movie to the Mindless Genre. -
I plan to watch Avatar some four years later, when it's finally released for the sixth time with all additional 12 minutes of film.
With 8 minutes of Blue Kitty sex action!
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This is a film that really surprised me, despite the fact that I find that the beginning was stronger than the rest of the movie:
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While we're batting around films, anyone who hasn't should also watch Fantastic Mr Fox.
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Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs should have just used the first 2 minutes for its theatrical trailer instead of the usual montage.
Great, fun movie.
Fine, did you like Paranormal Activity and the Last Exorcism which had little to no Special Effects and mainly focused on the plot?
Haven't seen either of them. Not a fan of horror films.
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While we're batting around films, anyone who hasn't should also watch Fantastic Mr Fox.
Give 'em fair warning.
Guys, expect a lot of this:
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Robby… do me a favor hoss.
Watch Transformers 2.
You'll stop clumping it with Avatar in the 5-15 minute mark.
Guaranteed.
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Oh yeah, I need to go watch Fantastic Mr. Fox. I need to make a list of "movies to watch" for myself because I rarely go to the movie theater. horror films these days are just kinda sad. Piranhas? really? What's next: Killer Earth Worms?
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Piranhas is a remake from a 1970's Roger Corman movie…
Incidentally the critics are saying it's a good "fun horror" movie.
Provided you don't go in there expecting Citizen Kane (and if you do... you don't need to be watching horror flicks)
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While we're batting around films, anyone who hasn't should also watch Fantastic Mr Fox.
I still need to watch that.
I recommend Mary and Max. Bring tissues.
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Looks like it comes out in october here.
I'll keep an eye out for it.
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Robby… do me a favor hoss.
Watch Transformers 2.
You'll stop clumping it with Avatar in the 5-15 minute mark.
Guaranteed.
I hated the first one. I refuse to waste time on the sequal which is by all accounts, worse. But fine, I won't clump the two together anymore. Which films SHOULD I lump them with that I have no desire to see?
I'd rather watch a movie I like again instead.
@robbybedfart:
As for what I liked? Here's a list of good movies (in no particular order):
Moulin Rougue. Castle of Cagliostro. Princess Mononoke. Wayne's World. Jackie Chan's Drunken Master. Incredibles. Lilo and Stitch. Shakespeare in Love. Casablanca. Terminator. (The first two ONLY.) Risky Business. Betty Blue. Clue. Robin & Marion. Star Wars. The Empire Strikes Back. Prelude to a Kiss. Jungle Book. One Hundred and One Dalmations (the animated version). 12 Angry Men. Little Shop of Horrors. Some Like it Hot. Henry V. Much Ado About Nothing. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. Ran. The Third Man. Citizen Kane. Unforgiven. Ferris Bueller's Day Off. The Great Mouse Detective. Wrath of Khan. From Russia With Love. Her Majesty's Secret Service. Rear Window. Singing in the Rain. Stripes. Ghostbusters (the first one only). Vertigo. Almost Famous. The Lion in Winter. A Funny Thing Happened on the way to the Forum. 1776.
And many others. There's hundreds, thousands of good movies out there, and there's a ton that have good effects and good characters and stories. And some that have good characters and stories and NO effects and they carry through on that. There's room for dumb popcorn fun movies, but they shouldn't be excused from making sense or having good characterization or storytelling.
"Well its a blockbuster, what do you expect?" is the stupidest excuse EVER for movies being bad, and I hate that its so widespread.
Provided you don't go in there expecting Citizen Kane (and if you do… you don't need to be watching horror flicks)
Why do people always use that comparison? Kane was a fairly dry, pretentious movie. Its great, buts its also really old, many people that make the reference haven't even seen the movie to begin with, but no one expects anything like it. Heck, most people don't expect Citizen Kane to be Citizen Kane. Can we pick a more neutral more modern movie that isn't quite as good but should set a minimum standard of quality?
"Don't go in expecting it to be the Fifth Element" might be fair.
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@robbybedfart:
Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs should have just used the first 2 minutes for its theatrical trailer instead of the usual montage.
Great, fun movie.
Haven't seen either of them. Not a fan of horror films.
Then, how about we come to the conclusion, to each his own.
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man, I LOVE Citizen Kane
been a while since I last saw it though …
oh, and 12 Angry Men
fucking awesome
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Robby.
I used the Citizen Kane analogy cuz I'm kind of an anal film buff.
I blame being raised in a Video Store to the point where my life actually mirrors Dante from Clerks.
But yeah.
I'd lump Transformers 2 with Sex and the City 2.
Sequels no one wanted… nor we should have suffered thru (good thing I avoided the latter thou).
Avatar I would lump with Cameron's past epic Titanic.... since the hype/hate seem to be at the exact same level.
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My only problem with Avatar was that I felt no attachment to the characters. I was like, "Oh, who died? Why should I care? Obviously everybody else is pretty upset over it, so I should be, too."
With other movies, like Toy Story 3, Up, District 9, Vertigo, (even movie's like Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure), I cared about each individual character, and cared about what happened to them.
I haven't seen Transformers 2, and I honestly don't plan to. I liked The Last Exorcist, but Paranormal Activity was only about 17 minutes of real good movie.
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We watched Twelve Angry Men in gov class. I've actually seen some pretty good movies in school. I also really like Life is Beautiful and Truman show.
Has anyone seen Dark City? It's weird but pretty epic in a creepy messed up sort of way
! Truman show on crack and in the end nothing really changes
The weirdest kid's movie I have ever watched is the Marzipan Pig. wtf
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We watched Twelve Angry Men in gov class. I've actually seen some pretty good movies in school. I also really like Life is Beautiful and Truman show.
Has anyone seen Dark City? It's weird but pretty epic in a creepy messed up sort of way
! Truman show on crack and in the end nothing really changes
The weirdest kid's movie I have ever watched is the Marzipan Pig. wtf
I agree. Dark City's the cynical Truman Show.
I love the hell out of both movies.
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I think that the main problem Avatar had was that the more noticeable characters where essentially the bad guys.
The good guy crew was pretty vanilla.
Whereas the villains had a dickwad Giovanni and a epically scarred Colonel.
Both more memorable than the scores of Navi whose only real difference was roles in tribe and or facepaint.
The main character was alright I guess since he DID have the heart in the right place… outside of porking the Chief's daughter thou :V
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I told my friends I'd only go to Transformers 2 if they bought me the ticket. Unfortunately they did.
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Avatar I would lump with Cameron's past epic Titanic…. since the hype/hate seem to be at the exact same level.
Wasn't Titanic considered a good movie?
And you say Avatar is the same? Then why all the hate for it?
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Has anyone seen Dark City? It's weird but pretty epic in a creepy messed up sort of way
I really liked that movie, mainly the ending scene
! When dude realized he could control the city, reminded me of some of my lucid dreams
@Badass:
Wasn't Titanic considered a good movie?
I have a great memory of that movie. My buddies and I where waiting for my friend's mom to get out of Titanic so we stepped into the theater as it was almost over. It was at the scene where chick is on the ice float holding Leo and says "I'll never let you go", people were crying there asses off. Well right after she says that she let go, needless to say, we burst out laughing and had to leave.
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Titanic was ALSO considered a good movie by most critics.
Same with Avatar.
But the internet and most people outside of "critics" or marks hated Titanic.
Same with Avatar.
Both made ridiculous amounts of money and were overhyped.
The parallels are there.
Avatar is hated cuz of the cliched "Pocahontas" story and Titanic was hated for the cliched love story.
It's really on the eye of the beholder, provided you decide to approach both films from the same neutral perspective.
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Titanic was better than Avatar. The only reason I didn't like Titanic was because of the fact that my dad was so obsessed with Celine Dion's "My Heart Will Go On" that we literally never got to listen to any other song except that one in an endless loop.
To Live was also a really great film. It was only ruined because we watched it in class and my teacher kept pausing it practically every 10 seconds to explain an obvious plot point that was about to be explained anyway.
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Movie Matter:
I actually enjoyed 'I Robot' and 'Avatar'. They don't even come close to grazing movies like 'Inception' and 'District 9' but they were enjoyable nonetheless.
No one saw 'Scott Pilgrim vs. The World'? Awesome movie. Lot's of Bang-Bang-Flash, funny, and a nice soundtrack. Don't go in expecting much more than that.
Kakuzu's ending vs. Kisame's ending.
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! It says a lot when one goes out complaining and the other goes out with his enemies complimenting him.
Kisame and Gai "rivalry"
"Basically what I'm saying is, I didn't buy into the hype of Guy vs. Kisame as being a huge manga rivalry. It seemed like a typical shinobi rivalry to me, one that should have been pretty common in the Naruto world in the rare case of repeat encounters but not featured often in the manga. I always felt this way because Kisame was an S-ranked (Kage-level) missing-nin from a broken country renown for violence, and one of the Seven Swordsmen of the Mist with the most powerful of the swords. Guy, a powerful Special Jounin should have been heavily disadvantaged, but the feud was made interesting because Guy was a better at Taijutsu than the well-rounded Kisame. I woudn't have believed Guy would have won in a prolonged fight against a beast like Kisame, and true to the ninja theme of this manga he won quickly using the element of surprise with his Afternoon Tiger, something Kisame wouldn't have been able to predict."
This. I never saw it as a huge rivalry. They had 2 previous short encounters. The first encounter was a jump kick. The second…it wasn't even really Kisame. It was another body masquerading as a 30% clone of Kisame. A true rivalry fight would be something like...Gai vs. Kakashi. Now something like that can't be rushed.
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The only reason I didn't like Titanic was because of the fact that my dad was so obsessed with Celine Dion's "My Heart Will Go On" that we literally never got to listen to any other song except that one in an endless loop.
Why????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????:wassat:
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I actually enjoyed 'I Robot' and 'Avatar'. They don't even come close to grazing movies like 'Inception' and 'District 9' but they were enjoyable nonetheless.
A thousand times THIS.
On the subject of Scott Pilgrim… it's a shame that movie bombed in the box office.
But it goes to show that bringing gaming material in it's purest form to the big screen is a huge mistake.
It's the very reason the Resident Evil series is successful even if it doesn't resemble the games in any way shape or form.
His dad liked the song... nothing weird there ;P
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????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????:wassat:
Just to clarify, I loved that movie. It's just that my whole family was driven insane that's all.
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I didn't mind Titanic because I like disaster movies. I went to see it for the boat. Avatar was meh.
The first Resident Evil movie was a guilty pleasure. The rest are terrible.
@robbybedfart:
"Don't go in expecting it to be the Fifth Element" might be fair.
Now I want to see this again.