Chapter 588 "Sabo's Ocean" Discussion

[Zik]

@HaxeyeMihawk:

@Zik
An explosion like that would've left one wrecked corpse so again I bring up the question of whether it's Oda trying to give us the cliché "he obviously survived" situation or choosing not to depict a charred mangled child corpse?

I've already said that Oda does not have to draw some double page of Sabo's corpse. The retrevial of the body, letting us know it was found or someone carrying it covered in a blanket would be enough. Especially since a CLEAN UP crew was sent to take care of it. Unless you think that explosion eas big enough to leave no remains.

And if it's an option between cliche and predictable, in this case I'll take cliche.

[Sage]

@Hinscher:

so really look at your excuses to where he is now and answer to yourself how he survived that blast. it's almost embarrasing

I can care less about what everyone else thinks. Your going to have extreme left field points from both sides. I still firmly believe he is alive and I have reasonable and plausible reasons for believing so…which I have constantly stated throughout this thread.

The "referenced" argument from Haxeye can be debunked and isn't completely solid.

I believe that the fact people are so hard headed into writing in stone that Sabo is dead is more embarrassing than people wondering why Oda gave us a death scene so ambiguous and considering the obvious possibility of Sabo being alive.

[mickgreen58]

Actually, what is more embarrassing is folks adamantly proclaiming his death when it is very obvious that Oda made his death very open-ended.

I could see the point of the "Sabo is dead and that's that" crowd if Sabo died in a way that was similar to Ace but it was very ambiguous and left very open to interpretation by Oda.

[mickgreen58]

@Sage:

I believe that the fact people are so hard headed into writing in stone that Sabo is dead is more embarrassing than people wondering why Oda gave us a death scene so ambiguous and considering the obvious possibility of Sabo being alive.

Great minds think alike lol .

[huron]

@KiShiDo:

and the biggest thing… His entire face structure is different... Yeah now you will tell me he matured but look at all other kids in One Piece. You see Ace as child and know he is Ace from the present. Same for Nami, Zoro, Sanji, Robin, Franky, Usopp, Nojiko, Vivi, Wiper and some others.

But Law looks nothing like young Sabo

how can u forget coby?

[Hinscher]

no what i find really stupid is how nitpicky you all are and untrustworthy

you need to see a confirmed body and hey lets say someone to test his pulse too. oh but that might be a ploy, lets just cut off the persons head to be sure.

reminds me of the bitching for when mr. 2 impersinated magellan and your all bitching cause you didn't see in the scene the "actual" contact of his hand touch the face.

this isn't bleach or naruto. there are no illusions, besides mirage tempo, sabo didn't substitue with a log, he didn't use some illusion or magic eyes. and lets not forget he is a 10 year old boy. he wouldnt' hold a candle to pell in strength, and also being a 10 year old boy Oda isn't going to be inclined to show some dead floating body or something bad.
@mickgreen58:

Actually, what is more embarrassing is folks adamantly proclaiming his death when it is very obvious that Oda made his death very open-ended.

I could see the point of the "Sabo is dead and that's that" crowd if Sabo died in a way that was similar to Ace but it was very ambiguous and left very open to interpretation by Oda.

thing is, i don't see it open ended at all. it was as closed book as any book i have ever seen.
@huron:

how can u forget coby?

he was still instantly recognizable. it had the whole holy shit he went through insane puberty, but we coudl still all tell who he was

if Law was truly sabo we would have ALL clamored the first chapter we saw Sabo that omg its Law or omg is this person ect. but no that has just been recent talk in all efforts to come up with some plausable explanation to make him be alive somehow

[Kishido]

That stupid dead body talk…

So people will wait till the end of the manga now if Sabo will appear or not?

And what's wit Tom... he was just taken away. So maybe he is alive and was just forgotten at ID

EDIT
Matured Coby looked still like Coby not as fat as in the past.

[mickgreen58]

Not sure how anyone can argue that Sabo's death was extremely open-ended.

To me, that part is very obvious.

Personally, I would not be surprised that Sabo is dead, my argument centers around the fact that his death was pretty ambiguous.

[Kishido]

@mickgreen58:

Not sure how anyone can argue that Sabo's death was extremely open-ended.

To me, that part is very obvious.

Personally, I would not be surprised that Sabo is dead, my argument centers around the fact that his death was pretty ambiguous.

That's why the flashback isn't over now.

[Hinscher]

unless next chapter shows a body, those who WANT Ace alive will always argue till manga ends how it was open ended death, because they WANT it to be that way, not because it was that way.

[mickgreen58]

@KiShiDo:

That's why the flashback isn't over now.

We agree.

Along with some other "issues" I believe Oda needs to wrap up.

[mickgreen58]

@Hinscher:

unless next chapter shows a body, those who WANT Ace alive will always argue till manga ends how it was open ended death, because they WANT it to be that way, not because it was that way.

I'm pretty sure most people know that Ace is dead.

[Kishido]

@mickgreen58:

We agree.

Along with some other "issues" I believe Oda needs to wrap up.

Yeah that's why he have to wait. I agree that for now this death doesn't look all certain but many things are against a living Sabo as well. But knowing Oda he will clear that up.

But really. If people are talking about a dead body being carried away to state someone is dead… Why no one is talking SERIOUSLY about Tom being alive somewhere. Or even Jaguar D Saul. He was just freezed that doesn't mean he is dead

[Demon Rin]

The reason "Sabo is Alive" seems ridiculous is because, some convoluted explanation is required to explain why he's alive.

"Well, he jumped right as the blast hit and then swam down far and away enough for neither the blast or the suction of the ship to have harmed him, THEN he was able to swim all the way over to the coast without being seen by anyone, THEN something happened that conveniently explains why he NEVER got in contact with Luffy and Ace afterward"

It's called Ockhams Razor.

"Oda just killed another flashback character" is easier.
Otherwise, we could just be like "Well, we were TOLD Kuina was dead, but we never saw a body! She's TOTALLY Tashigi!"
Or.
"We saw Saul FREEZE, but we didn't see him DIE. Chopper was able to save Luffy and Robin from the same thing, so Saul MUST be Alive! Because he didn't get very much character development afterall, and we JUST Saw Olivia and Prof. Clover die. It would have been unfitting for Oda to kill THREE kind elder figures for Robin right after each other like that!"
Or
"We saw spears go into Tom, but we didn't see him DIE! He must be Alive, and must have been in hiding all these years on Fishman Island! Franky will TOTALLY see him again when the Straw Hats get there!"

I mean seriously.

[Deicide]

Sabo's death was really ambiguous. That's no way to argue that.

People may believe he's alive or he's dead, but it's dumb for anyone to dismiss the other possibility right now.

[Hinscher]

if sabo is alive we will know BEFORE the flashback is over

after reading chapter i had no doubt he was dead adn can't see how anyone woudl think otherwise, but my main arguing for those thinking he is alive is basically what demon rin said.

just think of what crazy theories you are all comign up with to come up with some excusse to how he is alive and what he is doign right now or where he is and so on. the more you have to explain something the less probable it is.

[mrkaizoku]

Sabo's death really wasn't very ambiguous in Oda land. It almost mirrors Dr. Hiruruk's death perfectly, right down to the flying hat. I don't see anyone arguing that Hiruruk is alive…

[I survived the buster call]

I agree the whole Sabo discussion just needs to wait for Oda to tell us what the truth is. It's his story. There's nothing wrong with people speculating on either side of the question, because we simply have no definitive proof either way. Saying one side or the other is what is truly ridiculous at this point. LOL

[Akumu]

@HaxeyeMihawk:

Question: How fast do you think Sabo is capable of moving? You do realize that the Tennryuubito was firing some sort of gun or cannon at him right? So you're telling me (and address the entire thing as a whole) that Sabo went from on his knee trying to put out a flame, and from just barely turning his head to his right as the shot was incoming to pulling some Matrix style dodge (that's what would be required for him to get off the ship in such a small amount of time) and getting off the ship before the next panel which is the immediate destruction of the ship and shows his torn hat sent flying.

Then he manages to somehow escape in such a short amount of time, dives down without getting pulled in by the current caused by the govt. ship mind you, (mentioned here:http://mangastream.com/read/one_piece/73205842/5) then swims all the way to the coast without being seen by any of the witnesses on shore or the clean u9p crew, am I following this correctly at this point? Then if you buy into this (I don't by the way), he for whatever reason chose not to get in touch with Luffy and Ace who up to present time still thought he was dead.

Oh that's right, I forgot he was stricken with amnesia .

First off, have you even read this manga? It's impossibly easy to dodge bullets being fired at you from point-blank range, and it's a very common occurance to survive explosions. Pell survived a fucking Nuke!

And as I have already stated. He jumps into the water, the wave caused by the explosion propels him away from the boat's current. Simple as that.

@Hinscher:

unless next chapter shows a body, those who WANT Ace alive will always argue till manga ends how it was open ended death, because they WANT it to be that way, not because it was that way.

No one believes Ace is dead. After all, we've seen his body. This death is VERY CLEARLY open ended. All we see is an explosion and then a hat floating on the water. Seriously people, if that happened in real life no one would assume someone was dead. They'd send out search parties, hoping that whoever was on the boat is still alive. There are only three reasons the search would be called off: 1)Person is found alive 2)Person is found dead 3)A week or so passes and nothing has been found

[HaxeyeMihawk]

@Demon:

The reason "Sabo is Alive" seems ridiculous is because, some convoluted explanation is required to explain why he's alive.

"Well, he jumped right as the blast hit and then swam down far and away enough for neither the blast or the suction of the ship to have harmed him, THEN he was able to swim all the way over to the coast without being seen by anyone, THEN something happened that conveniently explains why he NEVER got in contact with Luffy and Ace afterward"

It's called Ockhams Razor.

"Oda just killed another filler character" is easier.
Otherwise, we could just be like "Well, we were TOLD Kuina was dead, but we never saw a body! She's TOTALLY Tashigi!"
Or.
"We saw Saul FREEZE, but we didn't see him DIE. Chopper was able to save Luffy and Robin from the same thing, so Saul MUST be Alive! Because he didn't get very much character development afterall, and we JUST Saw Olivia and Prof. Clover die. It would have been unfitting for Oda to kill THREE kind elder figures for Robin right after each other like that!"
Or
"We saw spears go into Tom, but we didn't see him DIE! He must be Alive, and must have been in hiding all these years on Fishman Island! Franky will TOTALLY see him again when the Straw Hats get there!"

I mean seriously.

Thank you, exactly. It would require a very convoluted explanation as to how he survived and what's worse is that there was nothing hinted at in the scene to suggest that he had a way out.

@Sage
Sabo himself states that his ship would've been drawn in by that ship, so what do you think would happen to him if he was swimming near it?

@Zik
No what you're saying is a twist worthy of a soap opera and is both cliche and predictable which is why so many people think that Sabo being alive is so obvious, because it's been predictably done in so many stories beforehand.

[Zik]

@KiShiDo:

EDIT
Matured Coby looked still like Coby not as fat as in the past.

How can anyone take you serious with this? When was Coby fat? Oda reconstructed his entire face. Even his hair isn't the same yet Helemppo managed to have the same face.

You lying to yourself if you think old and new Coby look the same and the only discrepancy is weight loss. The motherfucker look like Haru Glory from Rave.

[Ivotas]

@Demon:

The reason "Sabo is Alive" seems ridiculous is because, some convoluted explanation is required to explain why he's alive.

Oda didn't give us a convoluted explenation why Franky was able to survive being run over head on by a friggin' train. He just was alive drifting around in the ocean until that abandoned ship mysteriously showed up. Oda didn't give us an explenation why Pell is still alive. It just so happens.

I really don't see any fail safe argument here against Sabo's survival at all. Especially since explosions in One Piece are lesser life threatening then stairs.

[Hinscher]

i mean Sabo, not Ace.

but what about robin's flashback we see cannon balls destroy the library with them in it. at end there is no bodies shown, just books in the water.

and he is f*ing 10 years old, he doesn't hold a candle to pell in strength. i swear you guys for some reason think ace and sabo are like super strong when they were ten.
@Ivotas:

Oda didn't give us a convoluted explenation why Franky was able to survive being run over head on by a friggin' train. He just was alive drifting around in the ocean until that abandoned ship mysteriously showed up.

Difference is we knew franky was alive before the flashback. any new characters besides enemies in flashbacks always die.

[Hinscher]

This post is deleted!

[loledinmypants]

I'm on the neither side side… but if Oda doesn't confirm Sabo as alive in the remainder of the flashback or shortly afterward, I think it's safe to say he's dead. If he gets a surprise reveal as alive too far down the line it will feel really cheap and lame to me, and that's not typical of Oda (even when he's had characters miraculously survive, it's usually found out about by the time the arc they're involved in ends). I will say that the death seemed weak to me until the letter and that weakness was probably due to the ambiguity.

[SabZ]

If Sabo has died, then Luffy will never find out who did it, which would make it a bit pointless. Somebody has to get revenge for Sabo directly on all those fucking Celestial Dragons.

[Akumu]

@mrkaizoku:

Sabo's death really wasn't very ambiguous in Oda land. It almost mirrors Dr. Hiruruk's death perfectly, right down to the flying hat. I don't see anyone arguing that Hiruruk is alive…

Except for the fact that we all saw the good Doc drink the potion that caused him to explode, and for the fact that we know what happens to his body. Chopper carried him down the mountain and buried him.

With Sabo, the explosion happened in his vicinity and there is no knowledge of what happened to his body. It is due to this that we are able to debate him being alive or dead.

Do you all think Oda knew the One-Piece fandom would go insane debating the death of Sabo and that's why he chose to take a break? Is he just toying with us? Laughing as we rip each other apart? Sigh…...

[Demon Rin]

@Akumu:

Except for the fact that we all saw the good Doc drink the potion that caused him to explode, and for the fact that we know what happens to his body. Chopper carried him down the mountain and buried him.

Wait. what? "Exploding Potion"?

That was Nihonshu wine, he was having a drink before his death. The bomb was probably in his bag.

[Ivotas]

@Hinscher:

Difference is we knew franky was alive before the flashback. any new characters besides enemies in flashbacks always die.

That's totally irrelevant here. The argument I'm responding to is that we require a convoluted explenation why Sabo would have survived. And that we knew that Franky was alive doesn't change the fact that we've never seen a convoluted explenation on how he managed to stay alive after being run over by a train. Meaning that One Piece is a story that works without these so called convoluted explenations on that front. Another example would be Pell, who mysteriously survived a bomb explosion that was supposed to annihilate two armies.

[Zik]

@HaxeyeMihawk:

@Zik
No what you're saying is a twist worthy of a soap opera and is both cliche and predictable which is why so many people think that Sabo being alive is so obvious, because it's been predictably done in so many stories beforehand.

I don't watch soap operas, make another analogy. How could it be predictable in OP if Oda's never done that in a flashback before? Why reach for other works of literature when labeling something cliche and bad writing like Oda doesn't make use of other well known literary devices? How is it anymore predictable than what you and others have been saying for weeks(Sabo dies, world noble will kill Sabo, Sabo's death motivates Ace and Luffy, flashback ends with that being the point of it) which would basically be Oda's first shitty flashback?

[Demon Rin]

Holy Crap, the One Piece wikia even says Hiriluk drank an "Exploding Potion"…
What makes people think that?!

[HaxeyeMihawk]

@Akumu:

First off, have you even read this manga? It's impossibly easy to dodge bullets being fired at you from point-blank range, and it's a very common occurance to survive explosions. Pell survived a fucking Nuke!

Quit mentioning Pell, his death would actually be pointless because it would really only overly affect Vivi who isn't all that important to the story, secondly if you have to argue using any of the same goofy arguments that people used to say, "No one dies in One Piece" then just stop, and atleast Pell was a Peregrin Falcon zoan, animals known for their high flight speed so that gives him far more survivability in his scene (because he could fly really fast to get away from the explosion) rather than attributing superhuman speed to Sabo. The strong dodge bullets in this manga not just anyone, there's nothing to suggest that Sabo has that ability.

@Akumu:

And as I have already stated. He jumps into the water, the wave caused by the explosion propels him away from the boat's current. Simple as that.

No one believes Ace is dead. After all, we've seen his body. This death is VERY CLEARLY open ended. All we see is an explosion and then a hat floating on the water. Seriously people, if that happened in real life no one would assume someone was dead. They'd send out search parties, hoping that whoever was on the boat is still alive. There are only three reasons the search would be called off: 1)Person is found alive 2)Person is found dead 3)A week or so passes and nothing has been found

Again you give him the ability to jump off that ship before the round could reach him, when nothing indicates that he could do that, that scene showed him looking over at the govt. ship as they fired, not he looks then seconds pass and they fire. And in real life if a ship is shot like that and there's an explosion they'll send a party out but you can bet that they won't be expecting to find anyone alive.

[Akumu]

@Hinscher:

and he is f*ing 10 years old, he doesn't hold a candle to pell in strength. i swear you guys for some reason think ace and sabo are like super strong when they were ten.

Maybe because they kicked a bunch of pirate ass? They were incredibly strong, that's why everyone in trash mountain told Porshemy not to mess with them; that's why Dadan knew who Sabo was before meeting him.
They were strong enough to build a reputation as fierce fighters.

And here's another notch in the Sabo is alive belt. He declared a dream worthy of the Straw Hats. How many other flash back characters have done that? Kuina inspired Zoro's dream; the good old Doc's dream was for Chopper to become a doctor and sail the seas; Olivia's dream was for Robin to live; Bellemere wanted Nami to draw a map of the world; Tom wanted Franky to always be proud of what he built; and so on. None of the flashback characters who have died have had a dream for themselves. Sabo does. He wants to sail the seas and write a book about it. That is something a Straw Hat would say.
Why would Oda give him a worthy dream if all he was to do with him is kill him off?

[Ivotas]

@Demon:

Holy Crap, the One Piece wikia even says Hiriluk drank an "Exploding Potion"…
What makes people think that?!

What do you think why he exploded out of a sudden while saying "don't worry Chopper, it won't be your mushroom that kills me"? :wassat:

[Kishido]

@AdmiralYonkouMt.Bandit:

How can anyone take you serious with this? When was Coby fat? Oda reconstructed his entire face. Even his hair isn't the same yet Helemppo managed to have the same face.

You lying to yourself if you think old and new Coby look the same and the only discrepancy is weight loss. The motherfucker look like Haru Glory from Rave.

Did I say that… I mean that you could clearly see that it is Coby even if changed. But Law looks nothing like Sabo

[Demon Rin]

@Akumu:

Why would Oda give him a worthy dream if all he was to do with him is kill him off?

Kuina's dream was to break the bounds of female swordsmanship.
Hiriluk's dream was to make Sakura Bloom in the country and save it.
Nico Olivia's dream was to learn the True History as well.
Ace's Dream was to make Whitebeard Pirate King.
Whitebeard's Dream was to make Ace Pirate King.

Just because someone dies before achieving their dream (whether or not they have Zoro, Kureha, or Robin to carry it on) doesn't mean they can't die.

@Ivotas:

What do you think why he exploded out of a sudden while saying "don't worry Chopper, it won't be your mushroom that kills me"? :wassat:

It was poured into a sake cup. It was Booze. The scene was mirrored with Kureha drinking Booze too.

He was having one last drink before blowing himself up.
The bomb blast was great enough to cause a billowing tower of smoke and to blow his hat away, yet there was no huge bloodspot in the snow that would happen if he just exploded from inside?…

He had a bomb on him, probably in his bag, it's not that hard.

[Akumu]

@Demon:

Holy Crap, the One Piece wikia even says Hiriluk drank an "Exploding Potion"…
What makes people think that?!

Cuz he did… http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/145/09/

@HaxeyeMihawk:

Again you give him the ability to jump off that ship before the round could reach him, when nothing indicates that he could do that, that scene showed him looking over at the govt. ship as they fired, not he looks then seconds pass and they fire. And in real life if a ship is shot like that and there's an explosion they'll send a party out but you can bet that they won't be expecting to find anyone alive.

You cannot judge time just off of the manga panels. For all we know he saw him cocking the gun, or he could have seen the bullet coming at him. Who is to say?
It's called a search and rescue mission. They always assume that someone is alive because assuming otherwise could cost someone their life.

[wintergt]

Had a quadruple chapter recap to write, first part is done (chapters 585,586,587)

http://wintergt.livejournal.com/4968.html

[Akumu]

@Demon:

Kuina's dream was to break the bounds of female swordsmanship.
Hiriluk's dream was to make Sakura Bloom in the country and save it.
Nico Olivia's dream was to learn the True History as well.
Ace's Dream was to make Whitebeard Pirate King.
Whitebeard's Dream was to make Ace Pirate King.

Just because someone dies before achieving their dream (whether or not they have Zoro, Kureha, or Robin to carry it on) doesn't mean they can't die.

I meant at the end, before they died.
Hiriluk's last was "Become a great doctor Chopper"
Olivia's last was "Live Robin"
Ace and WB don't count, they're not Flashback characters, and those are the specific case I'm talking about.
But anyways, Ace's last was that Luffy become Pirate King, so yeah…

[Deicide]

Oda doesn't need a complex explanation for Sabo's survival, but most fan explanations are kinda complicated.

Example of simple explanation: Sabo was hit, fell to the water and lost consciousness. He awakes by a beach, wounded but alive, days later, saved by pure luck. Simple. Easy to understand, just like how Franky survived being ran over by a train.

I still think Sabo's dead, however.

[Demon Rin]

@Akumu:

Cuz he did… http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/145/09/

I repeat from my post earlier:

"It was poured into a sake cup. It was Booze. The scene was mirrored with Kureha drinking Booze too.

He was having one last drink before blowing himself up.
The bomb blast was great enough to cause a HUGE Explosion and a billowing tower of smoke and to blow his hat away, yet there was no huge bloodspot in the snow that would happen if he just exploded from inside?…

He had a bomb on him, probably in his bag, it's not that hard."

[HaxeyeMihawk]

@Deicide:

Oda doesn't need a complex explanation for Sabo's survival, but most fan explanations are kinda complicated.

Example of simple explanation: Sabo was hit, fell to the water and lost consciousness. He awakes by a beach, wounded but alive, days later, saved by pure luck. Simple. Easy to understand, just like how Franky survived being ran over by a train.

I still think Sabo's dead, however.

Him only getting wounded by an explosion like that wasn't even played up to be a possibility in the manga.

[Ivotas]

@Demon:

I repeat from my post earlier:

"It was poured into a sake cup. It was Booze. The scene was mirrored with Kureha drinking Booze too.

He was having one last drink before blowing himself up.
The bomb blast was great enough to cause a HUGE Explosion and a billowing tower of smoke and to blow his hat away, yet there was no huge bloodspot in the snow that would happen if he just exploded from inside?…

He had a bomb on him, probably in his bag, it's not that hard."

So in this magical world where people heal themselves while using scrap metal to turn themselves into a cyborg, where you can fly to the moon with nothing more but a balloon in your hand, and have those magical fruits that give you super powers there is zero chance that this little cup could have blown him up? Wow, talk about intollerant denial. :getlost:

@HaxeyeMihawk:

Him only getting wounded by an explosion like that wasn't even played up to be a possibility in the manga.

Lol, what the hell? You expect the characters to be like "aww well, it's just an explosion, he should be fine perhaps wounded if anything"?

[Demon Rin]

I just don't see any pros to keeping him alive storytelling wise.

If he were alive, what would that do to the story later?

Right now we have a death that perfectly explains why Luffy and Ace acted the way they did in the story. It explains why Luffy does a lot of the things he does.

Vs. Deus Ex Machina save that brings Sabo back so he can… what?... What would the endgame be in bringing him back?

[HaxeyeMihawk]

@Akumu:

Cuz he did… http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/145/09/

You cannot judge time just off of the manga panels. For all we know he saw him cocking the gun, or he could have seen the bullet coming at him. Who is to say?
It's called a search and rescue mission. They always assume that someone is alive because assuming otherwise could cost someone their life.

The way it was portrayed suggests that the shot came right after Sabo looked towards their ship.

[Zik]

Maybe Sabo sank in to Davy Jones' locker and became a sea god? ofcourse after overthrowing Davy Jones.
@Deicide:

Oda doesn't need a complex explanation for Sabo's survival, but most fan explanations are kinda complicated.

Example of simple explanation: Sabo was hit, fell to the water and lost consciousness. He awakes by a beach, wounded but alive, days later, saved by pure luck. Simple. Easy to understand, just like how Franky survived being ran over by a train.

I still think Sabo's dead, however.

Even though you think he is dead the objectivity is appreciated. For some ppl an explanation like that is just too ridiculous ad bad writing or cliche.

I forgot about Franky too, had CP9 not already accuse him of being Cutty Flam and he had looked really different in the flashback I guess ppl would've been saying Cutty Flam is dead there was now way he could survive being hit by a train and then landing in the sea. BLAH BLAH BLAH.

[Demon Rin]

@Ivotas:

So in this magical world where people heal themselves while using scrap metal to turn themselves into a cyborg, where you can fly to the moon with nothing more but a balloon in your hand, and have those magical fruits that give you super powers there is zero chance that this little cup could have blown him up? Wow, talk about intollerant denial. :getlost:

And then we ignore the fact that it also showed Kureha drinking booze in the very next panel? That it was drawn as a mirror of one another?

Having one last drink before dying seems more poetic and plausible to me than "Lol, blew myself up with boom juice".

[I survived the buster call]

@KiShiDo:

Did I say that… I mean that you could clearly see that it is Coby even if changed. But Law looks nothing like Sabo

For the sake of argument, injury and burns received in the explosion could have been healed or operated on, etc. Hair color, especially blond, can change over time as a person ages, (I was white blonde as a kid, even have pics to prove it, and now my hair is very dark brown) kids at 10 still loose teeth, esp back teeth. etc etc etc.

Yes, it's unlikely, given Oda's penchant for making people look similar to their childhood selves when they get older, but it's not outside the realm of possible, there is a "vague possibility," LOL!

[Deicide]

@Demon:

I just don't see any pros to keeping him alive storytelling wise.

If he were alive, what would that do to the story later?

Right now we have a death that perfectly explains why Luffy and Ace acted the way they did in the story. It explains why Luffy does a lot of the things he does.

Vs. Deus Ex Machina save that brings Sabo back so he can… what?... What would the endgame be in bringing him back?

Well, I agree, since I'm on the "dead" camp, but I also can't really predict what Oda could do with Sabo surviving.

[Ivotas]

@Demon:

I just don't see any pros to keeping him alive storytelling wise.

If he were alive, what would that do to the story later?

Lol, this is always the best argument in these kind of talkback. "I lack the imagination to think of a plausible scenario/theme how/why x character should do y so it can't happen". Just because you or I can't think of it, it doesn't mean that the author who's writing the story and who's proven himself to be a tad more creative then a huge lot of us wouldn't have somehthing on his mind how and why such a development could work out.

@Demon:

And then we ignore the fact that it also showed Kureha drinking booze in the very next panel? That it was drawn as a mirror of one another?

Oh my good, hold the presses. Kuraha drank. That totally proves NOTHING!

Look, I'm not telling you that him blowing himself up with some liquid is 100% true. But it definitely possible so stop acting as if it is an impossible scenario when it clearly is not.