Arlong Park Forums

Are you seriously basing this on Zoro's words?

"Don't worry, Giant. Once you wake up again, this cage will be gone."

Not to mention the whole "I can cut anything" was used when he was cutting… regular stone. It was incredibly out of place.

And really, what would've be the point of Oda drawing him failing to cut the Birdcage? Waste of panels. That thing already survived a flaming meteor shower. It doesn't need to prove anything more.

How would one go about destroying Birdcage anyway? It's such an all encompassing structure where would one begin if they were to hypothetically try and take it down? Do people expect Zoro to do a 360 slash and cut all the strings simultaneously? We don't even know whether the cage can regenerate itself or not, what if he managed to break a few strings and it immediately comes back? It just makes more sense to stall the damn thing then try and take it down, since all around the country people are about to get sliced like tomatoes there's hardly any spare time to actually experiment on what would work and what wouldn't. Though I don't discredit people saying it being a plot device I don't think many people can explain HOW one would go about busting the damn thing. So I would like to ask people how they would ideally want to see the birdcage be brought down, taking into account that it's such a grand structure that can swallow an entire country?

SuburbanErrorist

Saw the chapter… I wouldn't say easy though - Dofla was expecting that move (it seems that way to me) and Dofla has to grab his hand cuz it seems like Law made a little struggle before getting his arm cut.

At least you don't make it seem as easy as Oars lol

Yeah not like Oars, Although different scenario. In the end plot armour needs to be broken and then armament armour. I think people like myself got hyped on all the crocodile head and oars leg slice and then saw nothing of the sort in the fights shown in this arc.

LuffydaPirateKing

idk why people thought the meteor shower would do anything to the bird cage, its sharp, it cut it. Those meteors haven't damaged a single important character the whole arc. People think zoro could cut the BC bc slashing attacks are different from brunt ones like a meteor. The reason zoro didn't try was plot

SuburbanErrorist

@LuffydaPirateKing:

idk why people thought the meteor shower would do anything to the bird cage, its sharp, it cut it. Those meteors haven't damaged a single important character the whole arc. People think zoro could cut the BC bc slashing attacks are different from brunt ones like a meteor. The reason zoro didn't try was plot

Or maybe he secretly tried off panel but the cage re-grew. So to stop his own shame, he mentioned nothing and pushed.

Simple isn't it?

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

Or maybe Gear 4th > Jozu.
Is it so hard to imagine ?

I don't think it's a matter of Gear 4th > Jozu.

Whilst i would believe that Gear 4th > Jozu, the simple difference was that Luffy grew so big and rapidly in an instant the strings snapped off. They are physical invisible strings after all.
Why Doflamingo didn't use it on a Gear 4 Luffy I don't know.

ICEMAN

@LuffydaPirateKing:

idk why people thought the meteor shower would do anything to the bird cage, its sharp, it cut it. Those meteors haven't damaged a single important character the whole arc. People think zoro could cut the BC bc slashing attacks are different from brunt ones like a meteor. The reason zoro didn't try was plot

Zoro, Kinemon and Fujitora, just slammed the sharpened side of their haki infused swords into the birdcage, yet it didn't cut the strings. The toughness of those strings used in the birdcage, was enough to hold Bartoloemo's shield, a tower of sea stone and 4 blackened swords.

Kishido

Still talking about Birdcage? I think we should simply ignore the worst plot device ever… It's not even funny how Oda let this cage unexplained.

joekido the Second

Define the Birdcage being left unexplained please

Dark-Abel

The birdcage not disappearing after Doflamingo goes unconscious would be hilarious :ninja:

RamistaR

I don't really care about the birdcage. Doffy controls the strings from a distance and can even create more. Of course he can regenerate the Birdcage.
But I have an other nitpicking.
Rebecca was with the gladiators and managed to reach Doffy. It means that all the gladiators could have reached Doffy.
This is a pretty clumsy move IMO. But maybe I'm overthinking this.

Kishido

@joekido:

Define the Birdcage being left unexplained please

Why the fuck is it "unbreakable"? But no… For da drama just push it all the time.

For me it's the worst plot device ever

Thatanas

@Kishido:

Why the fuck is it "unbreakable"? But no… For da drama just push it all the time.

For me it's the worst plot device ever

Nah, it was nice to see the whole island work togehter. Godo for you though.

ICEMAN

@Dark-Abel:

The birdcage not disappearing after Doflamingo goes unconscious would be hilarious :ninja:

Only if Sanji shows up and destroys it with Hell Wink.

andy

I don't really care about the birdcage. Doffy controls the strings from a distance and can even create more. Of course he can regenerate the Birdcage.
But I have an other nitpicking.
Rebecca was with the gladiators and managed to reach Doffy. It means that all the gladiators could have reached Doffy.
This is a pretty clumsy move IMO. But maybe I'm overthinking this.

If anything they were just smarter than her for not trying to fight don.
Looking at this chapter all of them would have die rather easy lol

Razh

What would that have helped though? Doula wanted to fight, not run.

Really, it appears you and Sparkle are mad that Doula didn't uncharacteristically try to run away a la Usopp.

That's right, I was suggesting Dofla runs away by using a clone, you got it spot on. :ninja:

I was suggesting Dofla might have used baits to land a hit on Luffy, the way he used his clone to attack Luffy from the back in the palace. It could have done no harm.

As far as the other stuff goes, we have differing oppinions. You say I'm nitpicky, I can say you're not critical enough, or that you're easy to please. Of course neither of those have to be bad traits.

Krillin

so the indestructible birdcage was made using the first dofla clone…....which got cut by kyros......... Kyros could have stopped the birdcage?

RobZilla

@Krillin:

so the indestructible birdcage was made using the first dofla clone…....which got cut by kyros......... Kyros could have stopped the birdcage?

The birdcage may have been produced from the string used to make the clone, but I'm assuming it went through some pretty drastic changes in terms of density and what not.

Hnikarr

^ Or, put another way, Doflamingo/Oda strenghtened birdcage with a mysterious element: plotium.

Razh

The less I think about the Birdcage, the better. It's just one of those things.

After last Saturday and already second day of hangover, I'm not that excited about liquor, but when that Birdcage falls down, I'm gonna drink like there's no tomorow.

uniaka ikuzakas

This arc had ups and downs, but itt's still one of my favorite arcs.

My only real problem is that we din't see sunny team for…what 1,5 years? And I hope they will shine with big mom pirates, but something tells me it's too early for half of the weaker crew to shine with a yonkous crew.

RamistaR

@Dark-Abel:

The birdcage not disappearing after Doflamingo goes unconscious would be hilarious :ninja:

Many non-haki users are currently pushing the cage with Barto's barrier.
It will get dangerous if the birdcage is still there when Barto faints at the sight of the King Kong Gun.

Jabberwok

@Hnikarr:

^ Or, put another way, Doflamingo/Oda strenghtened birdcage with a mysterious element: plotium.

Plotium is actually a highly malleable substance capable of altering its hardness and spread as the plot demands, even vanishing at some points if necessary. What you're actually thinking of is Plotonium, which is impervious to all forces until it has decayed sufficiently to be broken in accordance with the plot. It's the same material with which Doffy's glasses were made.

RamistaR

Hulk's pants = plotium ?

Razh

@Jabberwok:

Plotium is actually a highly malleable substance capable of altering its hardness and spread as the plot demands, even vanishing at some points if necessary. What you're actually thinking of is Plotonium, which is impervious to all forces until it has decayed sufficiently to be broken in accordance with the plot. It's the same material with which Doffy's glasses were made.

Also the material with which Dofla's coat was attached to his body.

I'm so disappointed it wasn't actually made from strings and turned into a weapon or an armor. Oh well.

Shobu Yoruichi

Noooo the glasses =(

nice chap, didn't like the fact of Rayleigh meddling in the Gear Fourth training.

sgamer82

@Shobu:

Noooo the glasses =(

nice chap, didn't like the fact of Rayleigh meddling in the Gear Fourth training.

But isn't Rayleigh, as Luffy's mentor, there on that island for the express purpose of helping Luffy become stronger? I'd be more annoyed if he didn't help in at least some way, even if it was just too give a hint for Luffy to work out.

King Cannon

@LuffydaPirateKing:

idk why people thought the meteor shower would do anything to the bird cage, its sharp, it cut it. Those meteors haven't damaged a single important character the whole arc. People think zoro could cut the BC bc slashing attacks are different from brunt ones like a meteor. The reason zoro didn't try was plot

Because damaging an important enemy completely matters.

By that logic, Magellan's Venom Demon move is completely useless because it didn't damage anyone of notice.

And again, Zoro slammed his hardened swords on the cage and it didn't do a thing.

skoopa

i don't know if it has been said , in the flashback rayleigh tells luffy that gear 4 is too taxing for the body and he need to come up with something else but then its all g4 again ?

when luffy got parasited he went g4 without blowing air in his arms ( just a little detail )

King Cannon

@Razh:

That's right, I was suggesting Dofla runs away by using a clone, you got it spot on. :ninja:

I was suggesting Dofla might have used baits to land a hit on Luffy, the way he used his clone to attack Luffy from the back in the palace. It could have done no harm.

The first thing Doula did after restarting his fight with Luffy again was hold him with strings and then use his strongest move on him while aiming at his vital points. Is that really an unreasonable thing for him to do? Especially considering that he could barely stand at the time.

I mean, he literally does the opposite of what Crocodile did. And we all thought it was weird how Crocodile didn't really use his power as much as he should have.

Shobu Yoruichi

@sgamer82:

But isn't Rayleigh, as Luffy's mentor, there on that island for the express purpose of helping Luffy become stronger? I'd be more annoyed if he didn't help in at least some way, even if it was just too give a hint for Luffy to work out.

Yes, but felt kinda like a scold from a father to his child. He's the next Pirate King, not a child.

sgamer82

@Shobu:

Yes, but felt kinda a scold from a father to his child. He's the next Pirate King, not a child.

And Rayleigh was the #2 of the previous Pirate King. I don't necessarily disagree with the child thing, but if there's anyone in the world who could do that it's Ray.

RamistaR

@sgamer82:

But isn't Rayleigh, as Luffy's mentor, there on that island for the express purpose of helping Luffy become stronger? I'd be more annoyed if he didn't help in at least some way, even if it was just too give a hint for Luffy to work out.

I thought G4th was one of the techniques Luffy created alone in his last 6 months of training. Rayliegh said that he only teached him the basis of Haki before leaving.

@skoopa:

i don't if its been said , in the flashback rayleigh tells luffy that gear 4 is too taxing for the body and he need to come up with something else but then its all g4 again ?

Classic Luffy. Always going for the option that shorten his lifespan, as long as he can save everyone.

Shadowgreed

And again, Zoro slammed his hardened swords on the cage and it didn't do a thing.

Zoro pushing is not the same as Zoro slashing.

King Cannon

Zoro pushing is not the same as Zoro slashing.

Regardless of that, Barto's barriers and a seastone building were all getting pushed by the strings.

That would be impossible to do if the strings weren't crazy strong. Otherwise, they would just get torn, or the Birdcage would've stopped completely.

garie234

Classic Luffy. Always going for the option that shorten his lifespan, as long as he can save everyone.

It didn't say that using G4 shorten Luffy's life span, and the only reason Gear second shorten Luffy's life span in his fight with Lucci is because his stamina(lacked training) is still not enough to handle Gear second

RamistaR

@garie234:

It didn't say that using G4 shorten Luffy's life span

His Hp if you prefer. Well, the general idea is that he doesn't care about what happens to his body as long as he can defeat Doffy.

Shadowgreed

Regardless of that, Barto's barriers and a seastone building were all getting pushed by the strings.

That would be impossible to do if the strings weren't crazy strong. Otherwise, they would just get torn, or the Birdcage would've stopped completely.

The strings pushing those two objects doesn't mean that they cannot be cut, it just means that the force in which the strings shrink is greater than the force being applied by the Warriors.

Ida hasn't shown Zoro trying to cut them, so that's a plot armor right there. There's not excuse for it!

NER

Wouldn't it have been much better if the cage was an actual cage made of seastone as a countermeasure of sort that doffy prepared if pushing came to shove? If that was the case we wouldn't have any argument about it being a plot device or why zoro and Fuji couldn't cut it.

Edit: I mean, many things would have changed, but overall I think the idea of the cage being some kind of a mechanical device much better than a power of doffy's fruit.

GetsugaZoro

@Shobu:

Noooo the glasses =(

nice chap, didn't like the fact of Rayleigh meddling in the Gear Fourth training.

Read Aohige translation is sounds a lot better than mangapanda.

garie234

His Hp if you prefer. Well, the general idea is that he doesn't care about what happens to his body as long as he can defeat Doffy.

HP and and Life span is a different thing, and G4 makes him lose all of his Haki(haki drain) when used very long and not affecting his life span

LuffydaPirateKing

Because damaging an important enemy completely matters.

By that logic, Magellan's Venom Demon move is completely useless because it didn't damage anyone of notice.

And again, Zoro slammed his hardened swords on the cage and it didn't do a thing.

yeah that move sucks too

RamistaR

@garie234:

HP and and Life span is a different thing, and G4 makes him lose all of his Haki(haki drain) when used very long and not affecting his life span

Just trying to explain the sense of this flashback. I mentioned the life span as a reference to similar scenes of the show.
Rayliegh: you should use something that doesn't take a toll on your body
Luffy: I don't care about my body, I have to save everyone

King Cannon

The strings pushing those two objects doesn't mean that they cannot be cut, it just means that the force in which the strings shrink is greater than the force being applied by the Warriors.

Ida hasn't shown Zoro trying to cut them, so that's a plot armor right there. There's not excuse for it!

You think if Oda did show Zoro trying, he would be able to cut it? You're working under the assumption that if Zoro was shown slashing those strings, they would be cut, which is flawed thinking.

You can't even burn those things going by the meteors.

Shadowgreed

You think if Oda did show Zoro trying, he would be able to cut it?

You can't even burn those things going by the meteors.

It would have been really helpful If Oda showed us Zoro cutting them and them regenerering right on the spot.

are you seriously using the heat of a meteor in an argument…

King Cannon

It would have been really helpful If Oda showed us Zoro cutting them and them regenerering right on the spot.

Yeah, or Zoro simply failing to cut them.

But then, the cage has already survived a lot of things. Zoro not being able to cut it shouldn't be that surprising.