The game was hinted in 2011 and announced in halfway 2013. How is that rushed?
Super Smash Bros
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As someone who hasn't ever played a Smash game before, I'm finding it's plenty to just have 50 characters to play with, (plus miis which are craaazy different between their custom moves) in either smash mode, Classic, or Run..
In fact, that roster is so huge I actually still find the game kind of daunting and overwhelming. A month in I still have no idea who my mains are. (Well, I've narrowed it down some to a top 10 or so… but theres some I have interest in that I've barely touched)
(I already got the batting and target games out of the way... those took roughly an hour each, spread in between ten minute sessions over a week for everyone complaining about them being tedious grinds.)
I can understand where the problem lies if you're already comfortable with 35 of the characters, have a main pre-picked, jump into the hardest difficulty when you first turn the game on, and have already clocked 50-100 hours and feel like you've done everything after having conquered the game with your main in the first three hours and have spent the time since just briefly glancing at the others. (Though really if you've gotten in that much time then its done its job already, eh?)
But I'm going to be getting a one player, on the road experience for a long, long time to come out of this thing. Much like Dissidia. It's a fighting game, that's how they work. The story/travel mode is inconsequential. Where you earn the powerups is less than customizing and getting good with the characters, and then fighting others aint it?
The game was hinted in 2011 and announced in halfway 2013. How is that rushed?
A four year production cycle isn't nearly as good as an eight year one. Just look at Final Fantasy 15 and Last Guardian. Whenever they come out.
Of course, Brawl came out in 2008, so the director DID have 8 years to stew on changes he would have liked to make and ideas he would have had.
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The game was hinted in 2011 and announced in halfway 2013. How is that rushed?
Things can be added in the game that may not be fully polished/planned out by the time the game releases.
All in all one has to wonder what would've happened if Nintendo put the level effort into 3DS's design that Sony put into the Vita. Would we have gotten a handheld version of Smash on par with it's console counterpart (but with lower framerate). Or still be pissed at Sakurai for the compromises and oversight that was made on his part.
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If you are forced/pressured to get a game shipped before you feel it's ready, it is by definition a rushed release. It doesn't matter if you spent the last several millennia creating it.
As someone who hasn't ever played a Smash game before, I'm finding it's plenty to just have 50 characters to play with, (plus miis which are craaazy different between their custom moves) in either smash mode, Classic, or Run.. (I already got the batting and target games out of the way… those took roughly an hour each for everyone complaining about them being tedious grinds) A month in I still have no idea who my mains are. (Well, I've narrowed it down some)
I can understand where the problem lies if you're already comfortable with 35 of the characters, have a main pre-picked, jump into the hardest difficulty when you first turn the game on, and have already clocked 50-100 hours and feel like you've done everything after having conquered the game with your main in the first three hours and have spent the time since just briefly glancing at the others. (Though really if you've gotten in that much time then its done its job already, eh?)
But I'm going to be getting a one player, on the road experience for a long, long time to come out of this thing. Much like Dissidia. It's a fighting game, that's how they work. The story/travel mode is inconsequential. Where you earn the powerups is less than customizing and getting good with the characters, and then fighting others aint it?
There is naturally a difference if you're already familiar and comfortable with the roster. But it's more an issue of having all of these characters to choose from, and having very little options for what to do with them. Fighting against CPUs gets old pretty fast.
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And how do you know that that's what Sakurai feels ?
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Also… Target Smash does have some technique to it if you stick with one character and get used to the damage outputs, how much damage will launch it how high, and when you do the smash to launch it to affect where it explodes. This is mitigated by the fact you can accidentally get your highest score through a complete fluke... and it does suck it only has the one map. But there is some technique to working it, and the batting game, where you figure out what combos can best damage it in 7 seconds while leaving time to grap the bat, get next to it, and charge up a smash that you want to leave till the last possible half second.
Maybe not as intuitive as a "drag the bird and decide the angle" as Angry Birds, but there IS something there, its not entirely random... its just probably not interesting enough for anyone to care to get good at it.
All in all one has to wonder what would've happened if Nintendo put the level effort into 3DS's design that Sony put into the Vita. Would we have gotten a handheld version of Smash on par with it's console counterpart (but with lower framerate). Or still be pissed at Sakurai for the compromises and oversight that was made on his part.
Considering even Nintendo feels the 3DS is outdated after just three years and is replacing it…
Still say the 3D gimmick was the ill advised part, since that's gotta eat crazy processor power to very little benefit, which most peopel turn off eventually to avoid headaches, based on a trend that's already moved on.
If you are forced/pressured to get a game shipped before you feel it's ready, it is by definition a rushed release. It doesn't matter if you spent the last several millennia creating it.
That is EVERY book/movie/game/sculpture/piece of art ever made.
Things have deadlines, there is a production schedule. If you care about the product at all, you always want to tweak and add more and make it better. And sometimes, you can add an extra week, or a month, or even a year to the time you have to work on it… if the people paying you think the delay will be worth it and it doesn't mess with cash flow too badly.
But sometimes you just have to have a deadline set and hit it to the best of your artistic ability, pure and simple, or else you'll just tweak forever. You pick and choose your battles, you have weaknesses you're aware of, and you let it go because it has to be done.
(And in the day and age of DLC, even that's not as limiting as it used to be.)
Look what happened to Star Wars when Lucas took off the deadline and decided he could keep working on it 30 years later to make it just perfect like he always envisioned.
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And how do you know that that's what Sakurai feels ?
For starters, the fact that functions such as online tournament mode, and the Miiverse stage, were announced as part of the game last week with the sidenote of "in some future update."
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A four year production cycle isn't nearly as good as an eight year one. Just look at Final Fantasy 15 and Last Guardian. Whenever they come out.
Is that sarcasm or irony?
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There's an explanation given in the Direct for the Miiverse stage delay.
If that's all you got to call this game "rushed", I'm not convinced. Or I can settle with "very slightly rushed" if it pleases you. -
Does rushed mean its bad though? Because the way some of you are reacting you seem to imply it is.
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I was just giving a concrete example to prove that there was pressure to release the game ASAP. What do you want, a signed document by Sakurai of everything he wanted to put in the game? We don't know what else was planned or will be patched in later. We don't know if there would have been another single-player mode. We don't know if Target Blast was cobbled together with 3 stages for Wii U because they didn't have time to tailor real Break the Targets stages. Hell, we don't know if Mewtwo was supposed to already be in the game. The point is that being rushed is ALWAYS bad. It ALWAYS results in a final product that isn't what it should have been.
Does rushed mean its bad though? Because the way some of you are reacting you seem to imply it is.
No. A lot of people don't seem to grasp the idea that we can be critical of a game and its development and still want the game. If I wasn't such a big fan of the series and didn't want it to be as good as it could be, I wouldn't even care enough to complain.
Basically I'd be Robby. -
You know, i for one really like Smash Run.
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Foolio : Of course not . That was my point and that's why I disagree with people calling this game "obviously" or "definitely" rushed. Maybe what we got on the 3DS is exactly what he wanted to do (minus the IC cut).
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Maybe what we got on the 3DS is exactly what he wanted to do (minus the IC cut).
But that is far more depressing than the thought that the game was rushed (or in the 3DS's case, that he ran up against hardware limitations). Because that would mean his actual understanding of what makes a good, complete game has gone downhill steadily over the years.
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Our opinions differ on the matter since I'm satisfied with what I got.
Making speculations to explain how things didn't go the way you wished for is pointless. Maybe we will learn about cut contents in the future, maybe we won't.
All that matters now is what you thought about the released product, which by default should be considered "complete".
I respect the opinion of people who didn't enjoy the single player experience, but unless we learn that entire modes were cut, nothing will make me believe that we got is just a fraction of what was planned. -
You can believe whatever you want lol. And speculating is not pointless, it's what happens in discussions among fans; as was said before, if you're not interested in discussing it then don't. Yes, nothing is going to CHANGE what ends up being released. Glad you're satisfied. Sad you can't understand why I want something different. And no, I don't have to consider what gets released complete. I really don't.
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Had the game since launch and I'm just about done with all the challenges. Got 99 done so far. Almost beat classic on 9.0 with Ganondorf but Master Core got the better of me. Trying to get used to Greninja's moves. After seeing the 50 fact extravaganza for Smash Wii U, I can't wait until the 21st and until next year to get Mewtwo. Still can't believe Sonic's "You're to slow" taunt is gone. That was my favorite taunt.
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Just saw a video with someone describing smash tour extensively, and it definitely looks rather fun. Which makes it sad that it seems to be a local experience only and as a result I may not play it ever T_T
Also rather excited about amiibos, and their introduction kind of justifies collecting equipment. Gotta farm smooth landers …
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You know, i for one really like Smash Run.
Me too, but I feel like it needed some more polish, as in "realize that you have a incredibly fun game IF you let players interact in the prematch" or "realize that you have a game that doesn't need to synch up until the final battle, so allow freedom to play it whenever, and THEN synch up for the finishing part. Online." As it is, it seems like an idea that got parts cut down, untill they said "it's playable? Launch it!"
The engine is good, the basics are still strong, balance is more decent this time around, Rosalina double teaming you not withstanding, but yeah, WiiU version seems juicier. Mainly because graphics, because I don't see myself playing the events once I get them all, and abandoning clasic, all star and smash party once I get everything.
Break the targets and board the platforms for ever!
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Smash Run would be better if it had… options.
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Smash run is sadly very close to being a very good game.
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So close and yet so far
in the sense that anyone with a 3ds that I know is pretty damn far to play smash run… if I actually wanted to
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Well, in any case, I'm getting sick of this negativity so let's change the subject: What are you most excited about in Smash Wii U?
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BUTTONS !!
also using an actual controller
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Using an actual control stick, instead of the cpad.
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HIGH DEFiNITION!!
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Things have deadlines. People working on projects have to set their priorities and timetables accordingly. That's universal. If the director couldn't coordinate or pick and choose his battle accordingly then thats on him, not the timetable… unless its an incredibly unfair timetable that's way below industry standards.
(Barring a case where there was clearly not enough time by general industry standards such as Dragon Age 2 getting 1 year of development time instead of 3... or most movie or tv tie in games that are done in like 6 months to just make a quick buck.)
But sometimes deadlines and budgets prompt creativity and better products. How to Train Your Dragon was a complete rush job. So was Castle of Cagliostro and Ratatouille. But they're fantastic animated films, top of their genre. A few more months would have allowed prettier backgrounds or maybe some better animation in spots, or given the composer room to tweak the score a little more... but the product that came out was still great... and on time and on budget.
But that is far more depressing than the thought that the game was rushed (or in the 3DS's case, that he ran up against hardware limitations). Because that would mean his actual understanding of what makes a good, complete game has gone downhill steadily over the years.
Apparently its been a decline with each game anyway…?
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I also don't have people that play smash near me so i play my own version of smash run. I just take a glass of whiskey every round if i win. Since i don't like feeling bad if i lose i also take one if i lose. Just to get strength i also do one every minute it passes and i also do another glass for every large character i defeat.
Then i just down the bottle to ease the pain.
I call it The Johnny Cash.
I like whisky.
Edit: I swear i'm not drunk.
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Well, it's not "obvious" to me.
Same…maybe the game isn't fitting my own interpretation of what "rushed" is.
EDIT: all right, no need to extend this debate. I can't wait for the glorious HD, more control schemes, stage building/sharing.....and loads more!
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Stage Building is where it's at. You can make plenty of inspired creations with it. Like a swastika made of dicks, and I'm sure there are other ideas.
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Stage Building is where it's at. You can make plenty of inspired creations with it. Like a swastika made of dicks, and I'm sure there are other ideas.
Did you start that kickstarter yet
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@Purple:
Did you start that kickstarter yet
I wonder how far that would actually go, but I'm sure finding out the answer would just sadden me.
If you're offering, though…
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I wonder how far that would actually go, but I'm sure finding out the answer would just sadden me.
If you're offering, though…
I can't wait to get on the New York Times
"Magical Rubber Pirate Japanese comic book forum sponsors neo-nazi obscene art"
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This post is deleted!
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I'll just tell them I'm making an artistic statement.
About nazis.
And dicks.
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If you somehow manage to acquire a Wii U (I think nintendo refurbs are $200), I promise to pledge at least $5 (maybe $10) to a copy of smash
But only if you allow us to pummel Xanatos frequently
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@Purple:
If you somehow manage to acquire a Wii U (I think nintendo refurbs are $200), I promise to pledge at least $5 (maybe $10) to a copy of smash
But only if you allow us to pummel Xanatos frequently
It's a win-win. Exactly the kind of gambit Xanagoat likes.
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
I've been spending my Club Nintendo points on VC titles because I assumed they weren't going to be doing any physical gifts anymore….
NOW THEY HAVE SMASH BROS POSTERS!!!
I'm 315 Coins short!!! And like ALL of their prizes, they'll be giving them out for like, a week or two, and then Stop…
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Too rich my blood.
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I'm gonna ask my brother to see if he wants any of the posters, but if not I can probably trade the posters for something in return
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I'm waiting to see tomorrow if I can get my hand on an extra 200 coins I need. T_T
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I just cashed in all of the Wii Points I got a while back on some SNES and Genesis games I wanted (Chrono Trigger, Sonic 3, S&K), so that should net me a cool 60 points (each should have a 10 pt survey just for getting it, then a 10 pt "Post Play" survey)
Then I think I'll also do the dollar upgrade of a few of my other VC titles. That should get me a few points.Gonna get Bayonetta 2 Soonish too, so that's one…
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
I've been spending my Club Nintendo points on VC titles because I assumed they weren't going to be doing any physical gifts anymore….
NOW THEY HAVE SMASH BROS POSTERS!!!
I'm 315 Coins short!!! And like ALL of their prizes, they'll be giving them out for like, a week or two, and then Stop…
YES! Finally I can put my 1000+ coins to good use!
And two of them are the Rosalina/Palutena posters. <3
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
dat Awakening music!!!
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
I've been spending my Club Nintendo points on VC titles because I assumed they weren't going to be doing any physical gifts anymore….
NOW THEY HAVE SMASH BROS POSTERS!!!
I'm 315 Coins short!!! And like ALL of their prizes, they'll be giving them out for like, a week or two, and then Stop…
Welp, time to register the pile of game I have
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Two of those are level 50? They suck lol.
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I bought Resident Evil Revelations HD because it was on sale for $15 on the eShop and it was worth 50 points… now I'm less than 300 away... need eShop points... gotta hit up ALL My friends who have Games I don't and also don't use Club Nintendo...
Nintendo is notorious for selling out of this Club Nintendo swag FAST and then never restocking. I wanted those Zelda: ALBW posters, but nope.
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Two of those are level 50? They suck lol.
Honestly wasn't too far out of my expectation really…
Although I imagine that lv 100 cpus will be doing everything inhumanly possible to be just a smidge better than level 9's
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I'm pretty sure they announced that 50 is the level cap. That's why I'm surprised.
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Oh? I thought it was level 100. Well that's… disappointing.
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If only they allowed for personalized Mii Amiibos. Everyone deserves to own a Dick Hitler.
Seriously, though, if Harmonix could do that with Rock Band, I don't see why the great beast Nintendo can't with their much simpler and more limited avatar designs.