The All-New FUNimation Dub Discussion thread!

[GaryPotter]

@indigo~ink:

^ I agree with you, "kiddy" makes One Piece sound like something like Teletubbies/Barney… like for younger children. Describing One Piece as a kids' show would be more fitting. I think of children as 6-8 and kids as 9 to like 12 or 13. Kiddies I don't really think of at all... but seems like 5 and under. xD It's so easy to interpret words slightly differently.

Edit: This is the dub I'm talking about... I don't think the unedited version would fly as a kids show in the western world.

Are you referring to the fact that it has blood? pffh. I used to watch cartoons that had blood in it all the time. Remember X-Men on Fox Kids? That show had blood in it all the time, and it didn't traumatize me. It all depends on the context something is presented in. If Wolverine is attacking someone and he slices them, its only logical to assume that person would bleed. As for smoking and drinking, there isn't a kid alive who doesn't know what tobacco and alcohol are. They're well aware that those things are bad for you and won't try to emulate it just because they see it on TV.

To your credit, though, there are some things, such as Bellemore getting shot and Hiriluk blowing himself up, that would definately scare kids. That doesn't mean, though, that we should just censor everything.

[RomanGod]

Well, it looks like One Piece is doing well with Toonami's intended audience.

http://mag.awn.com/index.php?ltype=pageone&article_no=3436&page=2

Doesn't list the exact ratings, but it is one of the four shows that draws the most 9-14 aged viewers. Including Goosebumps…

[GaryPotter]

@RomanGod:

Well, it looks like One Piece is doing well with Toonami's intended audience.

http://mag.awn.com/index.php?ltype=pageone&article_no=3436&page=2

Doesn't list the exact ratings, but it is one of the four shows that draws the most 9-14 aged viewers. Including Goosebumps…

I laughed when I read about how they like "sophisticated humor." There is NOTHING sophisticated about the shit on nowadays. Hanna Montana? I hate that bitch.

[RomanGod]

Well it get's the ratings so people must like something about it… However, it'd be off-topic is we continue to talk about it...

[KaizokuFan22]

if the rest of the opening themese get dubbed, what episode would we start seeing the Dub of Op4 Bon Voyage?

And I think its great we are getting the missing arcs in the dub

[firecrouch]

Well when was this report made? I mean we've already known it's been doing well with the 9-14 year-old crowd, but has there been a change since FUNimation took over?

[ViewtifulV]

@KaizokuFan22:

if the rest of the opening themese get dubbed, what episode would we start seeing the Dub of Op4 Bon Voyage?

It should be ep 169.

@firecrouch:

Well when was this report made? I mean we've already known it's been doing well with the 9-14 year-old crowd, but has there been a change since FUNimation took over?

Well, the first page of the article says October 26. I have no idea how up to date their numbers are though.

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

I don't understand how television raitings work anyway…

How can they tell the age of people watching there programs?

This seems very inaccurate to me; and inaccuracy is becoming the bane of aku no media.

[RomanGod]

@Lobster:

I don't understand how television raitings work anyway…

How can they tell the age of people watching there programs?

This seems very inaccurate to me; and inaccuracy is becoming the bane of aku no media.

It's always been like that. It's called demographics. Please know what you're talking about before you debunk it as inaccurate.

Anyways, this must be pretty recent given that they say Bo-Bobo is no longer airing. As for it having any significant jump over the 4Kids dub… Well, who knows. But at least this confirms it's still doing well.

[CosmicDebris]

Nielsen sends boxes and questionnaires out to specific age groups and tracks their ratings, that is how.

[indigoink]

@GaryPotter:

Are you referring to the fact that it has blood? pffh. I used to watch cartoons that had blood in it all the time. Remember X-Men on Fox Kids? That show had blood in it all the time, and it didn't traumatize me. It all depends on the context something is presented in. If Wolverine is attacking someone and he slices them, its only logical to assume that person would bleed. As for smoking and drinking, there isn't a kid alive who doesn't know what tobacco and alcohol are. They're well aware that those things are bad for you and won't try to emulate it just because they see it on TV.

To your credit, though, there are some things, such as Bellemore getting shot and Hiriluk blowing himself up, that would definately scare kids. That doesn't mean, though, that we should just censor everything.

Mnn… hate to say it but I disagree, One Piece is a pretty bloody show and I don't think it would be suitable to air it uncensored on a channel for kids at the times that it's currently shown. When I first started watching the Japanese version (sorry to keep using myself as an example but I'm the only One Piece fan I know xD) I was actually really surprised at the amount of violence in the show, specifically the amount of blood in some parts.

Besides if the networks thought it was okay to show that stuff to kids then why would they even bother to censor it out?

[GrizzlayLeslay]

@GaryPotter:

I laughed when I read about how they like "sophisticated humor." There is NOTHING sophisticated about the shit on nowadays. Hanna Montana? I hate that bitch.

Don't even get me STARTED ON THE PURE FERMENTED SHIT THAT IS HANNA MONTANA, SUITE LIFE, AND ALL THAT OTHER LIVE ACTION SHIT WHERE EVERY "JOKE" WARRANTS USE OF THE GODDAMN LAUGH TRACK BUTTON. SERIOUSLY DISNEY, YOUR LIVE ACTION SHOWS ARE NOT FUNNY. FIRE THE FUCKER THAT GOES ALL PARKINSON'S ON THE LAUGH TRACK BUTTON.

Ah crap, you got me started >_<

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

@CosmicDebris:

Nielsen sends boxes and questionnaires out to specific age groups and tracks their ratings, that is how.

That's still a pretty inaccurately representation. It's even worse then election polling. Only a certain type of people fill out the serves in the first place, or have the option to; yet many people have televisions. Even when done at random, it's still taking it out of the small quantity of people that already have the nelson boxed. Isn't there something that just monitors what stations are switched on? That would be more accurate.

And there must be something like that… or else, why do channels say "thanks to viewers like you"?

peh =(

[kenjarrettson]

Check this out, I found a pdf file for the Nielson ratings for the week of Oct 15-21. It doesn't tell what One Piece is, but it does list CN in two categories, prime time and day. Just thought if someone wanted to see it here a go: http://www.tvweek.com/ratings/101507.pdf (make sure you have adobe reader)

[Aethos]

@CosmicDebris:

I guess people have different definitions of "kiddy". when I hear kiddy I think of shows aimed at toddlers with no substance to them. One Piece is a kids show filled with stuff intended for kids, but kiddy is a word that I would not use, even when I was a kid. But that's my perception of the word. I find it derogatory.

I would have to agree with that. I mean when I think Kiddy I think of the stuff that's on PBS. I would never consider One Piece that way at all because it in no way even comes off as kiddy.

[FUNimationRules]

Go to Yahoo Answers and type in One Piece Toonami and click on the first question and you`ll be suprised.

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

I don't think One Piece is really "kiddy". I mean, people consider Shrek to be mature because of the innuendo. One Piece has the same amount + blood. I would rate it more of a tween/teen target target group. Teen Titans had a "tweens" target age group; and we're saying that One Piece is "only a kids show"? And another thing, I don't understand why you guys were turned off by the art at first. The art actually drew me to it. I thought it was original and fresh, so I decided to check it out. Stereotypical art is sometimes a turn off for me (like in the show Blood +) I really got exited after hearing about it for the first time, from this promo. Even if it too spectacular looking back at it.

Anyway, I'd consider One Piece for just about all ages. And not "kiddie". There is a difference between "targeted for kids" and "kiddie". Kiddie is defiantly lower on the totem pole.

[MugiwaraShinigami]

@Lobster:

I don't understand why you guys were turned off by the art at first. The art actually drew me to it. I thought it was original and fresh, so I decided to check it out. Stereotypical art is sometimes a turn off for me (like in the show Blood +) I really got exited after hearing about it for the first time, from this promo. Even if it too spectacular looking back at it.

I really hate to say it, but I kinda agree with what Lobster's saying. The art actually made me want to get into the series, because the art didn't look like every other anime out there. In fact, I didn't even KNOW One Piece was an anime until I looked into it a little more after watching it, because the art style had me thinking it was an American cartoon.

I think the people who were turned off by it prefer the "pretty-looking" anime like Bleach, Naruto, and Death Note or whatever, thinking that that's what an anime has to look like to be good. I mean, there a quite a few anime I hate that have very nice-looking art (Prince of Tennis to name one).

In my opinion, I don't think of One Piece as kiddy in the slightest. The humor, story, mood themes and such are things you'd hardly ever find on a REAL kiddy show.

[Aethos]

@MugiwaraShinigami:

I really hate to say it, but I kinda agree with what Lobster's saying. The art actually made me want to get into the series, because the art didn't look like every other anime out there. In fact, I didn't even KNOW One Piece was an anime until I looked into it a little more after watching it, because the art style had me thinking it was an American cartoon.

I think the people who were turned off by it prefer the "pretty-looking" anime like Bleach, Naruto, and Death Note or whatever, thinking that that's what an anime has to look like to be good. I mean, there a quite a few anime I hate that have very nice-looking art (Prince of Tennis to name one).

In my opinion, I don't think of One Piece as kiddy in the slightest. The humor, story, mood themes and such are things you'd hardly ever find on a REAL kiddy show.

Well those who have seen other series first might get turned off by it because it's an anime and people are too used too the anime art style that it takes a bit to adjust.

[MugiwaraShinigami]

@Aethos:

Well those who have seen other series first might get turned off by it because it's an anime and people are too used too the anime art style that it takes a bit to adjust.

Exactly, that's the point I was getting at.

[KagePakkun]

Stereotypical art is sometimes a turn off for me (like in the show Blood +)

Seriously, I wish people would stop downing Blood+, Its a SUUUUPA show!!
But yeah, the face Luffy made on SJ Issue 4;(Here's the link http://i21.ebayimg.com/06/i/000/84/26/7e1b_1.JPG) really turned me off.
Anyways, I've been gone for a few days and just checking like half a page,did I miss anything?

not really seeing how that counts as three things to say…)

Yeah..I was only going for 3 but I got carried away. I meant to say something about that.

[KagePakkun]

This post is deleted!

[Aethos]

@KagePakkun!:

Seriously, I wish people would stop downing Blood+, Its a SUUUUPA show!!
But yeah, the face Luffy made on SJ Issue 4;(Here's the link http://i21.ebayimg.com/06/i/000/84/26/7e1b_1.JPG) really turned me off.
Anyways, I've been gone for a few days and just checking like half a page,did I miss anything?

Yeah..I was only going for 3 but I got carried away. I meant to say something about that.

Don't people down Blood + because it's MST3K material?

[indigoink]

The art style thing is simply a matter of taste, you can't help it if certain styles appeal to you more.

Heh, yeah at first I wasn't sure whether or not One Piece was an American or Japanese show. I do love it how the style is so unique though especially for an anime.

[l2agnarok]

I only disliked One Piece when I saw Luffy stretch punch someone. I thought it the art was so bad that the punch only looked like it stretched. Then I watched an episode, and I understood everything about that punch and thought the art was fine.

[Mr. Evil]

I never thought the art was "bad" per se, just over the top. When I read the series, I found that that "over the top" style fit perfectly with One Piece's themes.

If anything, that fact that One Piece didn't look like an average anime helped attract me to it, since back when I found it, I HATED anime, especially the drawing style. I'm wondering if any other non-anime fans would think that way…

(Actually I still hate the majority of anime, but that's a story for another day)

[firecrouch]

My question is, why does it matter what kind of art style it is? Just enjoy it for what it is, I think that's why a lot of anime fans have a hard time enjoying "One Piece".

[Buuhan1]

@firecrouch:

My question is, why does it matter what kind of art style it is? Just enjoy it for what it is, I think that's why a lot of anime fans have a hard time enjoying "One Piece".

It's perfectly normal, the first time you watch something the first thing you exposed to is how it looks. The look of what you're watching is generally what eventually has you continue to watch.

For example, if someone prefers new movies and flips to one which is black and white, or old looking film they generally feel alienated and flip it off. The visuals is what you are exposed to before a story or personality of the characters.

So yeah, One Piece would more than likely be massively popular in the US if the males were bishie, but THANK GOD they aren't.

Just look at Naruto and Bleach, two series which share the basic manga/anime art-style with a few modifications. Anime fans are generally right from the start attracted to these series cause they look familiar.

Then you get One Piece, a series which story and characters are infinitely better than the previous mentioned series but walked down a less people filled road to be unique. Thus, unlike the typical ones which walked down the populated street and got much attention, it doesn't get as noticed as much.

It's a shame, but it's one of the points of hand drawn things. In live action everything looks the same due to it being normal people, so you focus on the characters and the plot right away. But with hand drawn due to it being so different, the visuals is the first people take in to check.

I however never wish for One Piece to get a generic art-style just so it's more generally accepted.

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

Just look at Naruto and Bleach, two series which share the basic manga/anime art-style with a few modifications

Bleach and Naruto have vastly differen't art styles…

[indigoink]

@Lobster:

Bleach and Naruto have vastly differen't art styles…

They still look like the basic, generic anime style. 'Vastly' different is stretching it… the closest to vastly different would be One Piece imo.

[Aethos]

Naruto and Bleach pretty much do have the same art style with their overuse of bishounen with various attachments like piercings and crap.

[indigoink]

Mnn well back to the actual topic of the thread, isn't there another Funi ep coming out soon? 149, when they have to catch a southbird according to Wikipedia. Can't wait wooo~

Whoaa has it really been five weeks already since the dub first aired??

[Aethos]

Yup can't wait till saturday. The epsode is going to be awesome, but expect 20 or so pages of bitching over something really stupid.

[Ao Kiji]

Holy Christ, Buuhan. What's with all the backwards and completely ridiculous post today?!

He purposely did such and stated he did it so "no matter how gloomy the situation got, the art style will lessen the negative impact".

You're completely misquoting Oda-sensei. I have the US SJ where he says this in an interview. And he says characters DONT DIE because he doesn't want the manga to feel gloomy after big battles are won. It has nothing to do with the art style.

It is a kids show in Japan, I find it hard to believe but I guess that's due to the fact I don't live in Japan and I don't see tons of little Japanese kids running around in the streets yelling gomu gomu no attacks out.

I think the term "Kid show" is really misleading. I'd call it family show as in, OP has older fans as well in Japan. It's hard to explain since there is no equivalent for this kinda thing in the western world. I mean it's closer to like Shrek or SPongebob maybe? LAWL..sry those're the closest metaphors I could think of./

But what I'm saying is though, it is pegged as slightly kiddy, adults and the like watch it as well and there are things obviously put in OP to draw in older folks too. Y'know sex injokes, fanservice, drama,etc. It's meant to be something you can park your kids infront of to enjoy Luffy and Usopp's silly antics,but enjoy yourself for the more mature things that're going on in the show as well. I mean, I've seen lots of adult Japanese celebs mention being avid readers of the One Piece manga,so it's not STRICTLY some kiddy things, the way "kiddy" things are over here. But meh..I'm sure reading the manga over watching the anime is more accepted regardless of the series.

And yeha, I think American fans are turned off of OP because part of the reason they like anime is BECAUSE it seems so different from "cartoons". OP is a series that resembles american cartoons, so it's gonna turn people off. Not to mention it's about pirates, which doesn't feel Japanese enough for many anmeritaku or whatever. Part of the reason Naruto and Bleach are popular is because they immediately have more generic looks so you can tell they're anime. And also because their concepts are centered around traditional(and generic) japanese anime themes like ninjas and samurai. While Japanese fans are obviously alittle sick of these concepts, a big portion of american fans watch anime FOR things like samurai and ninja. I mean look at Samurai Champloo. It's popular in the west and totally bombed in Japan.

Frankly, OP isn't "Japanese-y" or anime-ish looking enough for many american fans. The same concepts that appealed to Japanese fans wanting something different and unique will defintely turn off the western audience who wants something different from cartoon (i.e. generic anime).

[Buuhan1]

cracks opened March 2003 issue of Shonen Jump

SJ: How did you come up with the idea for a main character with stretching powers, instead of another kind of technique or attack, such as projectile weapons?
O: I wanted the fighting style itself to be something silly, so that no matter how tense the situation gets, you can relax and read it without becoming too stressed out.

We BOTH mis-quoted. My bad, but still the point stands, he purposely made his style silly so it wouldn't get too intense.

[firecrouch]

While I've heard the argument for things being different being unpopular before, I always disagree with them because there isn't enough evidence to back up that claim, plus a lot of things are popular for being innovative. But that's not what this is about, I mean all things considered you have to admit "One Piece" isn't as unpopular in America as its made out to be, in fact it is one of the most popular series in the fansub community. It's just that as a popular series that represents things that many other anime fans, fans of more popular series like "Naruto" and "Bleach, don't like, it gets a lot of noticeable hate. Plus the criticism "One Piece" gets from American fans is more than just than art style. "One Piece" also has a somewhat slower, less action-packed narrative compared to "Naruto" and "Bleach".

But it does frustrate me a bit that "One Piece" misses alot of viewers because it's different, just because it doesn't represent what a Japanese anime generally does to an American viewer. Now it makes sense when it's just a personal taste, plenty of "Naruto" fans never got into animation before they watched anime. But lots of anime fans that don't like "One Piece" because of the way it looks are into other "silly" and "ugly" cartoons such as "Family Guy". The idea that "One Piece" gets flak for not fitting into the general idea of a Japanese cartoon, a Japanese action/adventure cartoon at that, is kind of pathetic to me.

Maybe it's just 'cause I'm coming from a different perspective, but I've been passionate about cartoons since I was four years-old and after an entire life observing the artform to me the only real difference in every cartoon is that each one comes from a different creative mind, it's basically all the same to me. I dont' see the point of judging something because it doesn't fit into a certain "style" which isn't even required to fit into a broad medium, and the fact that both non-fans and fans familiar to Japanese animation associate an entire nation's cartoon output based on certain genre archetypes is pretty sad to me, and makes me question whether Americans really understand what anime/cartoons really are about.

And the fact that "One Piece" has gotten such vocal criticism over its art style isn't too surprising now, but back when I first got into it in 2003 I would've been surprised. When I first started reading it I said to myself, "The guy who made was definitely inspired by 'Dragonball' ". I also noticed shades of Disney in the manga. So even though it was done different, it wasn't like "One Piece" was coming from some kind of out-there weird, non-mainstream mindest.

[joekido the Second]

Well, having to read the Triller Bark arc, the art style don't look strange as it was in chapter 1, so people should read that arc.

And having to call One Piece a kiddy show is so misleading, if it's a kiddy show then why was Water 7 dark and gloomy? One Piece often has an adult material so I would'nt call it kiddy.

[Buuhan1]

It's not kiddy in a sense, but according to people who definitely know more than I do it IS a children's show in Japan. Hell, just recently they moved it to Saturday mornings.

As said earlier, it's shocking to us cause we have the standards the US and like have. But in Japan their standards are totally different. It actually makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside. XD

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

@indigo~ink:

They still look like the basic, generic anime style. 'Vastly' different is stretching it… the closest to vastly different would be One Piece imo.

Nope. They are just different in "different" ways. Shows like One Piece, Naruto, Dragon Ball, Bleach, Samurai Champloo, and Gash Bell all have unique art styles.

Shows like Mar, Prince of Tennis, Blood +, and Trinity Blood have the more generic anime styles. But I suppose the untrained eye, it's easier to tell when looking at the manga.

Whoaa has it really been five weeks already since the dub first aired??

I know it's crazy. It defiantly doesn't seem that long. @_@

[Darknessslayer]

I thought One Piece was really interesting when the first issue of shonen jump came out, the art sty.e was interesting and almost no one had those generic anime eyes.

[Death-T]

Sighs You guys are probably gonna hate me for this, but I do kindif get tired of reading One Piece praise when that's all people are talking about and how they got into it, etc. It seems just about every thread I see at least has SOME of that. We already know the show is great, the art style is unique, etc. Can't we just make a thread for that ?

So um.. I hear there's a new episode tomorrow…

[Aethos]

Yeah it's hard for me to believe tthat One Piece gets so much criticism when the people who are criticizing it seem to love many of the American cartoons roaming around the airwaves. Honestly sometimes I think people just hate on One Piece because they think it makes them cool or something. Like how people hate on Pokemon and Yugioh and DBZ.

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

The next episode has a good cliffhanger…

Hopefully we will get a "next time" preview.

[indigoink]

Lobster: Naruto, Bleach, Samurai Champloo etc may have art styles quite different to one another, but they are still immediately recognisable as being anime. One Piece on the other hand can be mistaken for an American cartoon easily, which suggests the style of drawing is quite different from the mainstream anime style.

Death-T: Hehe, well it's a little hard to avoid people praising One Piece in a One Piece fansite.

Aethos: Yes, over here One Piece is definitely not cool. Hence that the One Piece fan inside of me must be unleashed only online. xD

Yes! Episode tomorrow! Woop woop. Then two more eps to go til we can see how Funi will handle Luffy punching Bellamy. I hope they pull it off well…

[Ao Kiji]

I completely agree with FireCrouch on this.

It's not kiddy in a sense, but according to people who definitely know more than I do it IS a children's show in Japan. Hell, just recently they moved it to Saturday mornings.

Which is weird considering Family Programming as well as top ten shows usually air in primetime. Like I said, I don't think kiddy is the right word here. It's aimed at 13 yr olds mostly and that is the majority of the demo but it's like saying american comics are kiddy when the majority of serious fans are college aged.

Nope. They are just different in "different" ways. Shows like One Piece, Naruto, Dragon Ball, Bleach, Samurai Champloo, and Gash Bell all have unique art styles.

Bleach looks exactly like a generic anime. All manga generally looks similar. The difference is with styles like the ones Oda-sensei and Toriyama use you can instantly tell THEY drew it. That's why it's different from the norm. If Kubo or Kishimoto don't draw Naruto or Ichigo and do fanart in their own style of another series, it's pretty hard to tell who drew it,because it looks so similar to the standard anime/manga drawing style. Samurai Champloo has it's own visual sense of style but the art is completely generic. Stop being biased simply because you enjoy those shows. You can enjoy a show even if the art is generic.

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

Lobster: Naruto, Bleach, Samurai Champloo etc may have art styles quite different to one another, but they are still immediately recognisable as being anime. One Piece on the other hand can be mistaken for an American cartoon easily

That makes no sense. American cartoons don't have a "look". compare Teen Titans to Avatar to Invader Zim. All completelly different. Which "steriotypical" American art style were you refering to.

Bleach looks exactly like a generic anime. All manga generally looks similar. The difference is with styles like the ones Oda-sensei and Toriyama use you can instantly tell THEY drew it. That's why it's different from the norm.

No. It's extremely easy to tell Kishimoto and Kibo's art styles. They aren't the "generic" anime art style at all. Especially not Kishimoto's.

NOW BACK ON TOPIC

[Jay_n_Silentbob]

@Lobster:

That makes no sense. American cartoons don't have a "look". compare Teen Titans to Avatar to Invader Zim. All completelly different. Which "steriotypical" American art style were you refering to.

Avatar's art styles are based on anime (and, to an extent, Invader Zim and Teen Titans are, too).

He means One Piece looks closer to American cartoons like Loony Toons, I guess. (One Piece doesn't have the stereotypical "anime eyes")

[indigoink]

Lobster: Egads. I'm not comparing different styles of American art here, or saying One Piece looks like stereotypical American artwork. It was an example demonstrating that One Piece looks quite different to a lot of anime out there. I get the feeling we're actually arguing about different things…

(Edit: Jay, if you're talking about me I'm a girl xD;;)

[Lobster Pot-Sticker]

@Jay_n_Silentbob:

Avatar's art styles are based on anime (and, to an extent, Invader Zim and Teen Titans are, too).

You think that Jhonen Vasquez has draws in a steriotypical anime style…?

(One Piece doesn't have the stereotypical "anime eyes")

I'm not saying it does.
I'm just saying that Naruto and Bleach don't either.
Everybody is unique in their own unique and individually unique way~ Well… the ones listed anyway...

!

!

Now back on topic please…

**Questionable scenes coming up in the next Funimation One Piece dub episode:** 
-Drinking party
-Cricket hitting on Nami

Any else?

[Aethos]

@indigo~ink:

Aethos: Yes, over here One Piece is definitely not cool. Hence that the One Piece fan inside of me must be unleashed only online. xD

Yes! Episode tomorrow! Woop woop. Then two more eps to go til we can see how Funi will handle Luffy punching Bellamy. I hope they pull it off well…

lol well I wish it was cool so that way we weren't just restricted to online. XD

Heh I can't wait to see Dub Luffy pwn Bellamy it's going to be awesome and soon Skypiea shall begin.