About what shanks and garp said and asura

Phenomenol

@$abZ:

Oh right… my mistake... Lucci is actually stronger than Luffy. My bad. Who won again?

The manga did, you're right. It backed up that Luffy and Zoro were both 6.

So tell me, if I enjoyed two Wii games so much that I almost loved them, and classed them both as 10 (as 9 is too low for them, and I class other games as 9), however I liked one slightly better than the other... does that make them equal in my view?

Luffy won, BARELY but only because of the words of Ussop!!!!

You would only give the game that you are better at a higher rating!!! Oda is good at drawing both Luffy and Zoro so he classes them equal….

SabZ

@Hawkeye:

YES I CAN MAKE AN ARGUEMENT WITH THIS MUWHAAAA!!!!!!

See if whitebeard were to get a score he would also get a 6 out of 6 so that doesn't mean Luffy and Whitebeard are equal does it? Case and point

Oh… and that makes my theory of "6 is too small a number for Oda to be serious and for two to be equal" correct.

ONEinchPUNCH

_> YES I CAN MAKE AN ARGUEMENT WITH THIS MUWHAAAA!!!!!!

See if whitebeard were to get a score he would also get a 6 out of 6 so that doesn't mean Luffy and Whitebeard are equal does it? Case and point_

@$abZ:

You… are... a... GOD!

Only one very important flaw….... Whitebeard isn't in that book

Ronaldinho

I actually don't think that you guys should look too deep intp the databook. It's a rough estimation. It says that Chopper and Ussop are equal in strength. As far as we know, both of them could win but there is higher chance that Chopper wins after recent development. Nami is said to be the weakest SH, but that doesn't mean she can't win against Chopper and Ussop.

SabZ

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Only one very important flaw….... Whitebeard isn't in that book

So… it shows the scale is too small to be taken seriously.

Luffy and Zoro both being at 6 makes them completely equal? So if you divided the strength of all the SH together by six... a whole 1 would not be one single power level... it'd be a range of different PLs. Oda isn't stupid, he has logic. So it shows that the chart isn't good evidence to proove Luffy = Zoro.

Hawkeye

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Only one very important flaw….... Whitebeard isn't in that book

I bet you if Luffy even did beat Zoro they would say they were equal…

ONEinchPUNCH

@$abZ:

So… it shows the scale is too small to be taken seriously.

No it shows Whitebeard is in another league and isn't to be compared with the SH. That book is a data book for the strawhats not for anyone else, otherwise we would have everyones stats.

Luffy and Zoro both being at 6 makes them completely equal. So if you divided the strength of all the SH together by six… a whole 1 would not be one single power level... it'd be a range of different PLs. Oda isn't stupid, he has logic. So it shows that the chart isn't good evidence to proove Luffy = Zoro.

Did he tell you that over the phone?

He chose 6 becuase he chose 6, I don't need to prove anything I'm agreeing with the author. You are the one disagreeing with the author you need PROOF.

@Hawkeye:

I bet you if Luffy even did beat Zoro they would say they were equal…

Wrong

When I see a data book showing luffy stronger, a quote of zoro saying he is weaker or zoro losing in a fight against luffy. That will show me luffy is stronger otherwise I go by what Oda says "THEIR EQUAL"

Nauykuyr

Laboon isn't in the book either. He'd obviously be a 6.

Enel would be a 5. That means Sanji would end up in a draw with Enel.

Hawkeye

@ONEinchPUNCH:

No it shows Whitebeard is in another league and isn't to be compared with the SH. That book is a data book for the strawhats not for anyone else, otherwise we would have everyones stats.

Did he tell you that over the phone?

He chose 6 becuase he chose 6, I don't need to prove anything I'm agreeing with the author. You are the one disagreeing with the author you need PROOF.

If Oda made a new book… the pink book... which stated that WB and Luffy where 6s i would think some of us would use common sense and say WB is still stronger then Luffy but apparently some people are low on that now a days.......... AND WHERE THE HELL DOES IT STATE WB IS IN A DIFFERENT LEAGUE?

SabZ

@ONEinchPUNCH:

He chose 6 becuase he chose 6, I don't need to prove anything I'm agreeing with the author. You are the one disagreeing with the author you need PROOF.

I'm agreeing with the author, XD. I agree that Luffy and Zoro are 6. Heck, I'd put them both at 6. You fail to understand that 6 isn't a fixed power level… division, my friend. Oda knows maths.

So no... I just have the correct view on the chart... and agree with what oda has put.

Ronaldinho

Guys, the best thing to do is to wait for the new databook which will hopefully solve some questions. This discussion is going nowhere.

Phenomenol

@$abZ:

So… it shows the scale is too small to be taken seriously.

Luffy and Zoro both being at 6 makes them completely equal? So if you divided the strength of all the SH together by six... a whole 1 would not be one single power level... it'd be a range of different PLs. Oda isn't stupid, he has logic. So it shows that the chart isn't good evidence to proove Luffy = Zoro.

If you read that chart carefully that would be a scale for the Strawhat Crew ONLY!!!!!!!!!!

I just crushed your dreams…...........:sad:

ONEinchPUNCH

@$abZ:

I'm agreeing with the author, XD. I agree that Luffy and Zoro are 6. Heck, I'd put them both at 6. You fail to understand that 6 isn't a fixed power level… division, my friend. Oda knows maths.

So no... I just have the correct view on the chart... and agree with what oda has put.

That's just a guess on your part.

@Hawkeye:

If Oda made a new book… the pink book... which stated that WB and Luffy where 6s i would think some of us would use common sense and say WB is still stronger then Luffy but apparently some people are low on that now a days..........

If it happens I have no objections, but the fact he uses only the strawhats shows me it is only for them.

AND WHERE THE HELL DOES IT STATE WB IS IN A DIFFERENT LEAGUE?

Erm… are you serious? WORLDS STRONGEST MAN!! ring a bell? Part of the YONKOU, a WORLD POWER

But you're just joking right?

Hawkeye

@ONEinchPUNCH:

That's just a guess on your part.

If it happens I have no objections, but the fact he uses only the strawhats shows me it is only for them.

Erm… are you serious? WORLDS STRONGEST MAN!! ring a bell? Part of the YONKOU, a WORLD POWER

But you're just joking right?

Aye man i just felt like putting something in caps to get rid of stress but now that i think about it Luffy is said to be at Shichibukai's level so i guess he is in the Emperors league i guess…

Phenomenol

@Hawkeye:

Aye man i just felt like putting something in caps to get rid of stress but now that i think about it Luffy is said to be at Shichibukai's level so i guess he is in the Emperors league i guess…

No, Luffy is NOT on ANY world power level.

SabZ

Okay… let's base the SH crew powers in 30 seperate PLs.

1-5 = 1, 6-10 = 2, 11-15 = 3, 16-20 = 4, 21-25 = 5, 26-30 = 6.

So, let's say Sanji's PL is 24... that makes him 5. Let's say Zoro's is 27... that makes him 6. Let's say Luffy's is 29... that also makes him 6. Luffy is still stronger because 29 > 27.

Do you not see... Oda's chart is not good enough to proove that Luffy and Zoro are equal, because Oda may have thought like this. This is normally how a chart works, so Oda probably does think like this.

Hawkeye

@Phenomenol:

No, Luffy is NOT on ANY world power level.

WIKIPEDIA SAID SO!!!!

Phenomenol

@$abZ:

Okay… let's base the SH crew powers in 30 seperate PLs.

1-5 = 1, 6-10 = 2, 11-15 = 3, 16-20 = 4, 21-25 = 5, 26-30 = 6.

So, let's say Sanji's PL is 24... that makes him 5. Let's say Zoro's is 27... that makes him 6. Let's say Luffy's is 29... that also makes him 6. Luffy is still stronger because 29 > 27.

Do you not see... this chart is not good enough to proove that Luffy and Zoro are equal, because Oda may have thought like this. This is normally how a chart works, so Oda probably does think like this.

Was any of those numbers in the manga or databooks?:wassat: I guess not..

b…b...b...but WIKIPEDIA SAID SO * sticks tongue out in a childish manner*

:Wikipedia? LOL~~~

Ronaldinho

@Phenomenol:

No, Luffy is NOT on ANY world power level.

Do you count Croc as a world power?

SabZ

@Phenomenol:

Was any of those numbers in the manga or databooks?:wassat: I guess not..

Was there a fixed PL number… I guess not. Your proof fails.

ONEinchPUNCH

@$abZ:

Was there a fixed PL number… I guess not. Your proof fails.

Eh? All Oda has shown us is they are a 6, you are the guy coming up with all these other speculative ideas. We don't need to prove anything, you however have alot of proving to do.

Hawkeye

@Ronaldinho:

Do you count Croc as a world power?

EXACTLY!!! Technically he was so Luffy is also

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Eh? All Oda has shown us is they are a 6, you are the guy coming up with all these other speculative ideas. We don't need to prove anything, you however have alot of proving to do.

Can't think of anything else to prove out thoeries wrong? Poor OIP

SabZ

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Eh? All Oda has shown us is they are a 6, you are the guy coming up with all these other speculative ideas. We don't need to prove anything, you however have alot of proving to do.

If you believe that Oda created that chart partly to prove that Luffy and Zoro are equal, then you are also speculating, because you did not read Oda's mind as he created it. He may have been thinking similar to me… who knows... do you?

That's why the chart proof fails.

Nauykuyr

@Phenomenol:

If you read that chart carefully that would be a scale for the Strawhat Crew ONLY!!!!!!!!!!

I just crushed your dreams…...........:sad:

Hmmm, can you point out where it says that?

At the moment it's people claiming speculation as fact. I've never claimed Luffy to be better or equal to Zoro in a fight, because we DON'T know that with the information given, and neither do any of you.

This would be settled right now if people would stop implying that they are equal because of an unclarified databook chart. If it were really the case, it would've been stated squarely. At the mmoent Oda has dodged answering such a detail. I've never seen those shonen anime attribute charts used to mean equality, only estimation. Same goes for American superhero cards.

DesertSpada

I've been thinking the same thing. Luffy and Zoro both have 6 as strength. However, Luffy always fights the strongest guy and has displayed greater strength than Zoro has. I can't see it as possible as Zoro and Luffy to be perfectly equal. They are very strong, but Luffy has shown above and beyond what level of power that he is on compared to Zoro.

ONEinchPUNCH

@$abZ:

If you believe that Oda created that chart partly to prove that Luffy and Zoro are equal, then you are also speculating, because you did not read Oda's mind as he created it. He may have been thinking similar to me… who knows... do you?

That's why the chart proof fails.

You know what I believe?

I believe Oda made his chart with his own ideas and he believes 6 is enough, otherwise we'd have seen a different chart.

You believe Oda is wrong and should have used a higher max number. I also believe I have nothing to prove since I am agreeing with Oda.

So how on EARTH am I speculating?

Phenomenol

@Nauykuyr:

Hmmm, can you point out where it says that?
At the moment it's people claiming speculation as fact. I've never claimed Luffy to be better or equal to Zoro in a fight, because we DON'T know that with the information given, and neither do any of you. This would be settled right now if people would stop implying that they are equal because of an unclarified databook chart. If it were really the case, it would've been stated squarely. At the mmoent Oda has dodged answering such a detail. I've never seen those shonen anime attribute charts used to mean equality, only estimation. Same goes for American superhero cards.

Captain: Luffy D. Monkey*
Bounty: 100,000,000 Belly “Most Wanted Pirate in East Blue”
(Formerly 30,000,000 Belly)

Attributes-
Adventuresome: 6
Strength: 6
Intelligence: 1
Dexterity: 1
Fashion Sense: 1
Curiosity: 6

As you can see that these ATTRIBUTES! only concern the SH pirates. The strength is the highest for Luffy and Zoro!

@DesertSpada:

I've been thinking the same thing. Luffy and Zoro both have 6 as strength. However, Luffy always fights the strongest guy and has displayed greater strength than Zoro has. I can't see it as possible as Zoro and Luffy to be perfectly equal. They are very strong, but Luffy has shown above and beyond what level of power that he is on compared to Zoro.

Please do tell…......

Ronaldinho

Phenomenal, please tell me how you would rank the SH(only Luffy, Nami, Zoro, Sanji, Chopper and Ussop)

Nauykuyr

@Phenomenol:

As you can see that these ATTRIBUTES! only concern the SH pirates. The strength is the highest for Luffy and Zoro!.

Huh? No where does it say it's only for SH. Where in the text does it say that it's for SH? Did you derive that from the word attribute?

You know what I believe?

I believe Oda made his chart with his own ideas and he believes 6 is enough, otherwise we'd have seen a different chart.

6 is enough for something. It never says it means that they're are equal enough to draw.

It's never implied that the stats were meant to "fight" eachother. It's just a general chart.

Oda got the idea for the chart from other charts like it (it's not a new idea to have stat charts like that one). Have you never seen a chart like that before? Stat charts are integer estimations.

ONEinchPUNCH

@Nauykuyr:

Huh? No where does it say it's only for SH. Where in the text does it say that it's for SH? Did you derive that from the word attribute?

How about the fact, it's got only detailed info on the strawhats? Or is that too difficult to take in?

6 is enough for something. It never says it means that they're are equal enough to draw.

So two 6kg weights don't weigh the same?

It's never implied that the stats were meant to "fight" eachother. It's just a general chart.

Is it? Give Oda my number too, I want exclusive info too

Oda got the idea for the chart from other charts like it (it's not a new idea to have stat charts like that one). Have you never seen a chart like that before? Stat charts are integer estimations.

You really need to give him my number too, I want to know where Oda got his other ideas.

Nauykuyr

@ONEinchPUNCH:

How about the fact, it's got only detailed info on the strawhats? Or is that too difficult to take in?

So you're saying if it was expanded for everyone ona scale from 1 to 1000, zoro and luffy would have the same exact number? Speculation.

So two 6kg weights don't weigh the same?

What part of estimation don't you understand?

Is it? Give Oda my number too, I want exclusive info too

We don't know, and neither do you, so stop claiming that they are equal.\

And yes, Oda the idea for the hexagonal chart from previous charts. You think he invented them?

Impel Down

I think in the next color book, Luffy's fasion sense will rise because of his new pants.

Phenomenol

@Ronaldinho:

Phenomenal, please tell me how you would rank the SH(only Luffy, Nami, Zoro, Sanji, Chopper and Ussop)

What do you mean?:ninja:

@Nauykuyr:

Huh? No where does it say it's only for SH. Where in the text does it say that it's for SH? Did you derive that from the word attribute?

Yes, that is concerning the SH's ATTRIBUTES…the data book does NOT list Buggy's attributes or Kuro's. Those numbers concern the SH crew only.

Impel Down

Wow, Nauykuyr, seriously.

Ronaldinho

@Phenomenol:

What do you mean?:ninja:

and so on.

ONEinchPUNCH

@Nauykuyr:

So you're saying if it was expanded for everyone ona scale from 1 to 1000, zoro and luffy would have the same exact number? Speculation.

I don't think anything, I agree with the red book. It's you who doesn't agree and thinks 6 isn't 6.

What part of estimation don't you understand?

I understand all of it thankyou, but why speculate when Oda has direct number written in his data book?

We don't know, and neither do you, so stop claiming that they are equal.\

6 isn't equal to 6?

And yes, Oda the idea for the hexagonal chart from previous charts. You think he invented them?

?

What are you talking about? I'm just commenting on how you seem to know Odas life story. Has he released a book or something? Is that where he says his chart is inaccurate and he should have used $abz idea?

Phenomenol

Well Luffy and Zoro would both have to be 1.

Ronaldinho

@Phenomenol:

Well Luffy and Zoro would both have to be 1.

No seriously. Please make a ranking based on your opinion and believes.

Nauykuyr

@Impel:

I think in the next color book, Luffy's fasion sense will rise because of his new pants.

Yes, then he and Zoro would do a runway battle Zoolander style and come out exactly equal. The chart says so.

Also: Zoro lost to Enel, but Luffy beat Enel. They are exactly equal in battle, though, so the battle must've been fake. The chart says so.

Phenomenol

I said Luffy and Zoro would BOTH be number 1!!!! as equals….......

DesertSpada

There can only be one…

Phenomenol

@DesertSpada:

There can only be one…

I gave you a number 1

1. Luffy/Zoro
2. Sanji
3.Franky
4.Nico Robin
4.Chopper/Ussop
5.Nami

After Luffy and Zoro at number one, the rest is my opinion….........

Georgey D. Loopey

IMHO, belonging to same class/category/rank does not necessarily mean equality. Luffy might be stronger but Zoro is in the same class as he is, or vice versa, or they can be equal. From the chart, it cannot be determined with certainty on who is stronger (Luffy or Zoro). The manga offers the best proof. Luffy wants to be the PK, Zoro wants to be the Strongest SM. One wants to be an apple and the other an orange. Zoro followed Luffy and became his crewman. Logic dictates that Luffy>Zoro, albeit by a little because they belong in the same rank in power. Thank you.

DesertSpada

There can only be one as in there can only be one being in the spot.

Phenomenol

Well, Oda does NOT have it that way so I will not try and play God…...

ONEinchPUNCH

@DesertSpada:

There can only be one as in there can only be one being in the spot.

Well apparantly there isn't because luffy and zoro are equal, if you were to put either of the 2 first you would contradict the manga.

Nauykuyr

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Well apparantly there isn't because luffy and zoro are equal, if you were to put either of the 2 first you would contradict the manga.

If they're equal, then how did Luffy beat Enel? A 6 is a 6, right?

Nauykuyr

This post is deleted!

ONEinchPUNCH

@Nauykuyr:

If they're equal, then how did Luffy beat Enel? A 6 is a 6, right?

Rubber? If you read the same fight as me luffy would have been owned if it weren't for the rubber.

Or did you read another chapter of Oda's life story?

Nauykuyr

@ONEinchPUNCH:

Rubber? If you read the same fight as me luffy would have been owned if it weren't for the rubber.

Or did you read another chapter of Oda's life story?

But they're equal fighters because they have 6s, so that means they would draw in a fight. That means for every battle, whoever has a 6 would end up in a draw (by your logic). If Enel lost to Luffy, then Enel is not a 6, but Zoro lost to Enel, so that means Enel can't be lower than a 6. A 6 is a 6? That's your logic, not mine.

Are you gonna admit that fighting strength does not determine a win, draw, or loss?