^^^^^ white? kiji is animal.
Chapter 508 "Isle of Carnage" Discussion
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^^^^^ white? kiji is animal.
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^^^^^ white? kiji is animal.
I remember the names from a older issue.
Maybe it was mistranslated or misspelled.After checking Wikipedia it's:
Blue Pheasant :) Blue, Yellow, Red the 3 primary colors.
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White Peasant = Powerful logia fruit.
Yellow Monkey = Powerful paramecia fruit.
Red Dog = Powerful zoan Fruit.Theory works, if Kizaru has Paramecia fruit. Uh, i btw… why mr ice ice is not animal named? If that is animal, what animal, never heard "Peasant"...
Well if Red Dog has logia... then i guess Earth Earth no mi...It is supposed to be pheasant not peasant. A pheasant is a type of bird.
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^ he's talking about Pheasant being misspelled as "Peasant" ^
edit: oops, I got beat XD
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No?
You can't freeze that guy anyway :p
edit: 3, 2, 1, go Aokiji vs. Kizaru! \o/
lol. Can someone refresh my memory, wasn't it stated that Aokiji is the strongest of the three?
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The whole "Aokiji is the strongest" was actually a mistranslation.
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No it wasn't. it stated he was the strongest of marie HQ meaning he is the strongest of the three.
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A few days ago someone started a thread about this at NF. The point is it's one of those vague Japanese wordings again and you need some context to translate it properly. Aokiji wasn't named the single most powerful man of the MHQ.
There are actually always the exact same kanji used to describe the power of one or more admirals
最高 = the highest
戦力 = war potential
which suggests that "MHQs/WG's/Marine's strongest fighting force" is actually something like their title and translators looking over their old scripts would describe Aokiji as one of the strongest now.Aokiji - Marine HQ's highest war potential
3 Admirals - WG's highest war potential
Kizaru - Marine's highest war potentialThose same words used on Kizaru as the whole marine's strongest would even put him above Aokiji if you translated it out of context.
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A few days ago someone started a thread about this at NF. The point is it's one of those vague Japanese wordings again and you need some context to translate it properly. Aokiji wasn't named the single most powerful man of the MHQ.
There are actually always the exact same kanji used to describe the power of one or more admirals
最高 = the highest
戦力 = war potential
which suggests that "MHQs/WG's/Marine's strongest fighting force" is actually something like their title and translators looking over their old scripts would describe Aokiji as one of the strongest now.Those same words used on Kizaru as the whole marine's strongest would even put him above Aokiji if you translated it out of context.
How so, if Marine HQ is higher than Marine?
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couse, Marine counts HQ's in it's name also…
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Well I am happy that none of the 11 supernovas has any logias.
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How so, if Marine HQ is higher than Marine?
Err, so the Navy doesn't include the Navy HQ? Well that's unexpected. But MHQ, WG or Marine isn't even the point here. If it was the argument would be for Kizaru as the one strongest admiral right now.
The idea is that the wording doesn't differentiate between "the" and "one of the" and the fact that it's used in the same way for single admirals and the whole group highly suggests that it's the admirals epithet.That should be about all the explanation I can offer. I'm simply reproducing the reasoning of the other thread. Obviously I can't read japanese raws myself.
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couse, Marine counts HQ's in it's name also…
what are you on about. you've read enough one piece to know that Marine HQ > Marine in terms of ability and rank.
Thus if Kizaru is the Marine's strongest while Aokiji is the Marine HQ's strongest, then Aokiji > Kizaru.
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Marine HQ is subset of Marine.
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what are you on about. you've read enough one piece to know that Marine HQ > Marine in terms of ability and rank.
Thus if Kizaru is the Marine's strongest while Aokiji is the Marine HQ's strongest, then Aokiji > Kizaru.
What he is trying to tell you I think is that as the marine is the "fruit", the marine HQ is an "apple", thus belonging into the fruit category. cough sorry for the teacher speak.
Also, all 3 supreme admirals are stationed in HQ, so even incase what you said should be correct, it still is misleading.
Anyways, I think that we had some good scenes this chapter, though nothing too unexpected, except for the fighting setup. I am however looking forward to how the fights will develop and how the situation will turn out.edit: Regasatanum beat me to it :P
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What he is trying to tell you I think is that as the marine is the "fruit", the marine HQ is an "apple", thus belonging into the fruit category. cough sorry for the teacher speak.
Also, all 3 supreme admirals are stationed in HQ, so even incase what you said should be correct, it still is misleading.
Anyways, I think that we had some good scenes this chapter, though nothing too unexpected, except for the fighting setup. I am however looking forward to how the fights will develop and how the situation will turn out.edit: Regasatanum beat me to it :P
I dunno, that seems extremely revisionist to me. Up until now we've been taught that Marine HQ is the cream of the crop while Marine [elsewhere] are more average. While i acknowledge that all three are stationed at Marine HQ, it isn't far fetched that each Admiral has different duties. i.e. Kizaru looks after Marines, Aokiji looks after Marine HQ and Akainu is in charge of their relationship with the WG or perhaps even in charge of the New World Fleet. (if there is a special fleet for the new world).
My point basically stands that up until now, the Marine HQ has never been described as a subset of the Marines, so why would that change all of a sudden? It's either been all encompassing (i.e. "arghh the marines are coming!") or it's been specific (i.e. "that's smoker of the marine hq!").
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@Fire Fist:
He seems to be Paramecia. When he's first introduced (formally), a dude shoots him in the back of the head and the bullet wound is shown smoking, so he can be physically hit.
I don't think we're seeing the whole picture, though. I think he actually ate the Chi Chi no Mi (Energy Energy Fruit), which allows him to convert himself into energy, and therefore enable him to kick things at the speed of light ( E = MC^2) and shoot Chi blasts.
Still confusing, he may also have the "speed" fruit. Unless speed is something abstract ? (I think you can't "be" speed)
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Up until now we've been taught that Marine HQ is the cream of the crop while Marine [elsewhere] are more average.
Thats because the cream of the marine gets stationed at HQ. The marine HQ is just the headquarters of the marine organization. If you are the best of the Marine HQ you are also best of the marine. You can't just seperate them like you are trying to do. When I read what you write I get the impression you think they are two seperate organizations.
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But if that the case then why isn't Kizaru station at Marine HQ too?
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He is. All the admirals are.
There no difference in saying Marine HQ or Marine in theese contexts, that's why Oda is varying it. -
Thats because the cream of the marine gets stationed at HQ. The marine HQ is just the headquarters of the marine organization. If you are the best of the Marine HQ you are also best of the marine. You can't just seperate them like you are trying to do. When I read what you write I get the impression you think they are two seperate organizations.
they are practically two organisations under one roof. No matter how high you go within the Marines, you'll never reach the heights of the Marine HQ plateau.
Marine HQ marines are considered a whole different threat to Marine (four seas outside the GL) marines.
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Sorry for changing the subject but i think i've realised what Hawkins DF ability is?
First of all if we look at Hawkins when he first get out his deck of cards they appear to be connected to some material holding them up.
My guess is that he was holding them up with STRAW.As we later see Two Voodoo dolls appear and fall from his arm that are made from what seems to be Straw.
My guess is that he is a STRAW man.In Japan it is said that Scarecrows ,although silent, know everything about the world.
Hawkins seems to be knowledgeable about a lot of things.Such as the future and Death.He also appears to be a very calm silent man.My guess as to where he got the name 'Magician' is from the fact that he can creat Voodoo dolls.
He probably creats them from his straw and then casts a spell on them… -
they are practically two organisations under one roof. No matter how high you go within the Marines, you'll never reach the heights of the Marine HQ plateau.
How did Coby and Helmeppo get into "the HQ Marines" if they just joined "the regular marines"?
I haven't really seen anything that has even suggested the difference you talk about sabert00the. I admitt I can't provide proof with my previous statements, but I've always assumed the homebase/headquarters would have the higher ranks since that makes sense… place the ones in charge some place centeral, like at the base of operations.
But assuming that you are right, do "the regular marines" have any admirals or fleet admiral on their own?
Marine HQ marines are considered a whole different threat to Marine (four seas outside the GL) marines.
This sentence doesnt make sense to me… Is the grammar correct? why would marines be a threat to marines?
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@Scratchmax:
Sorry for changing the subject but i think i've realised what Hawkins DF ability is?
First of all if we look at Hawkins when he first get out his deck of cards they appear to be connected to some material holding them up.
My guess is that he was holding them up with STRAW.As we later see Two Voodoo dolls appear and fall from his arm that are made from what seems to be Straw.
My guess is that he is a STRAW man.In Japan it is said that Scarecrows ,although silent, know everything about the world.
Hawkins seems to be knowledgeable about a lot of things.Such as the future and Death.He also appears to be a very calm silent man.My guess as to where he got the name 'Magician' is from the fact that he can creat Voodoo dolls.
He probably creats them from his straw and then casts a spell on them…good thoughts but in OP will never exist somekind of "magic"…only kind of that are the DF
s and everything between has a solution based on the structure of the OP-world...sure exist fishmen and such without a clear definition why...but this can
t be called magic... -
Thanks :)
Perhaps it's some sort of Complicated 'Power-up' that can be used through the power of his DF.Like Luffy's 'Gear 2nd'….
Oh well , whatever the case, I'm sure Oda won't dissapoint. -
@Trollom:
This sentence doesnt make sense to me… Is the grammar correct? why would marines be a threat to marines?
He wanted to say MHQ marines compared to marine marines.
Whatever, I can't believe we're discussing if Oda gave Kizaru the title of the strongest of all soldiers outside of the headquarters. What an idiotic way to hype someone who is even stronger than 99,99% of everyone at the MHQ as well. Not even the freaks at NF managed to cook up that kind of topic derailment.
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@ Elric: Not a threat to the marines. A different thread [when compared] to the [normal] marines.
@ Gorlom: Coby was recruited by Garp and was shown training along with other marines of a similar shitty rank.
@ Scratchman: His powers thus far seem simple. He actually appears to have a real affinity to the cards, however his powers have been shown to do with the dolls. One doll took and redirected the impact of the kick, while the other took and redirected the heat damage. Surely you can't do any of that with simple straw?!
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This chapter was awesome, the Kuma-bots are the perfect way to show the powers of the supernovas and we have three days to go. It would be a way to overcome the time with a lot of fights. I want to see all supernovas at once in an awesome doublepage fighting the pacifista.
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@Don:
good thoughts but in OP will never exist somekind of "magic"…only kind of that are the DF
s and everything between has a solution based on the structure of the OP-world...sure exist fishmen and such without a clear definition why...but this can
t be called magic...Look at Miss Golden week, so Hawkins could have this kind of power, without a devil fruit.
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that was hypnotism not magic.
Don Quichotte De Flamingo is reffering to some place where Oda said that he didn't want any unexplainable magic (aside from DevilFruits) in his manga.
I have no idea if this was before Goldenweek was introduced though.@ Gorlom: Coby was recruited by Garp and was shown training along with other marines of a similar shitty rank.
I still don't agree that they are two different organizations "under the same roof". To me it's all Marines and they have a main base where anyone refered to as "from the HQ" has been stationed at atleast once.
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that was hypnotism not magic.
Don Quichotte De Flamingo is reffering to some place where Oda said that he didn't want any unexplainable magic (aside from DevilFruits) in his manga.
I have no idea if this was before Goldenweek was introduced though.I still don't agree that they are two different organizations "under the same roof". To me it's all Marines and they have a main base where anyone refered to as "from the HQ" has been stationed at atleast once.
yep,was stated somewhere but i also lost where
and to the marine-discussion…head of the marine HQ is sengoku...and he`s also the head of the marines..when he order the marines in 1 of the 4 blues something they will act like he want...so how could this be 2 different organizations...
marine HQ just shows us that there is a harder training for the rookie marines and that there are all marines with high ranges cause these marines have to do their work at the GL cause there are the strongest opponents..also the marine HQ is the location where the marine control all their legions....all admirals and all marines around the world:getlost: -
Wow interesting discussions about who is the most powerful of the admirals. When I was introduced to Aokiji.. I got the impression that there were 3 admirals and that Aokiji was the admiral in charge of Marine Headquarters. Although it was never stated I presumed that the other 2 were in charge of something else (perhaps equally important). And yes. Marine Heard Quarters is home to the most powerful of the marines (this was stated many times I believe) so alot of people had the conclucsion that Aokiji, the admiral incharge of MHQ, would be the strongest of the 3. Although that might be the case, it's not guaranteed. I believe all 3 rival each other quite closely and no one knows for sure who would come out on top if it ever came down to a fight among them. If Kizaru really has eaten some sort of "light" fruit and is made of light and can control light… it would be quite difficult for Aokiji or anyone else for that matter to beat him.
As for the last admiral's power. Akainu (sorry if I'm spelling these names wrong, I read One Piece in another language) "Red Dog" someone gave the opinion that he might be made of lava; I think that's a fair guess... another guess I had which is more gruesome.. would be that he can control blood. He would be able to make someone explode.. or any part of their body explode. If that is the case.. then Luffy would be a challenge for him, because being made of rubber.. he would be more resistant to these sort of attacks. Just wild guesses... who knows.. he might turn into a giant red dog.. for all I know.. hahaha
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thaDon Quichotte De Flamingo is reffering to some place where Oda said that he didn't want any unexplainable magic (aside from DevilFruits) in his manga.
You got the interview where Oda said this?
It seems more like wishful thinking for the physics geeks and the "I always want a logical explanation to every phenomena in anime" fans to me.
It's far too late for One Piece not to have "unexplainable magic."
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Initially when Super Nova been introduced, i thought a couple of them are cannon fodder like those Zombie general in thriller bark:whistling:, i was wrong.. some of them turn out to be quite awesome characters, now i don't wish them die so easily.
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You got the interview where Oda said this?
It seems more like wishful thinking for the physics geeks and the "I always want a logical explanation to every phenomena in anime" fans to me.
It's far too late for One Piece not to have "unexplainable magic."
which "unexplained magic" do you mean???
wishful thinking of physic geeks….
haha youre funny, it isn
t always a geek who love to read a shonen manga series...and when you read through the series you will sooner or later know that some things wouldnt rly fit in the manga cause it would ruin the story..can
t detect their "wishful thinking":happy: but maybe youre not so good into that series so that you still think that some things could happen cause you wish so...but sry fanfic is fanfic and it was stated that their won
t be magic..i dont know where i read that(believe me ,read to much to remember every quote) but maybe you have some good examples where "unexplained magic" was in the manga...also i don
t need a logical explanation for a manga...just some things fit the series and some are just bad ideas or fanfics which could be easily disproved..and thats why we all talking here on the forum..to share our thoughts and to see "ohh this isn`t rly likely" or " yeah could happen" -
You got the interview where Oda said this?
It seems more like wishful thinking for the physics geeks and the "I always want a logical explanation to every phenomena in anime" fans to me.
It's far too late for One Piece not to have "unexplainable magic."
No sorry I don't, thus the "someplace" (hmm thought I specifically said I didn't know where though. strange)
Eh? exactly where is there magic (magic as in can not be explained by some psudoscience such as hypnotism that might still be considered magic in some peoples eyes) in OP (excluding devilfruits, haki or whatever Rayleighs ability was called and Goldenweeks/Jangos hypnotism)?
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Not to start anything or offend you, but if you ask a question you already know the answer to, but chose to exclude it, why ask the question in the 1st place?
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Not to start anything or offend you
Don't worry. =)
but if you ask a question you already know the answer to, but chose to exclude it, why ask the question in the 1st place?
Becuase I might have missed something.
And to be clearer with the definition of "unexplainable magic".
Hypnotism for example is something that, as far as I can tell, works in our world (for other purposes then profit or entertainment) while for example "fortune telling" imo is mostly very vagely constructed phrases fitting most situations, that are bended by belivers untill they reach the desired result.
Admittedly Oda added his own twist to Goldenweeks colour hypnotism.
It's similar with the haki ability. Sensing an atmosphere in a room is a commonly described human feeling that is taken to the extreme with Odas own little twist.
But spell casting such as throwing a fireball doesn't have any roots what so ever in the real world.
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/me quite likes the idea of a Deadman Wonderland style Akainu.
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that was hypnotism not magic.
Don Quichotte De Flamingo is reffering to some place where Oda said that he didn't want any unexplainable magic (aside from DevilFruits) in his manga.
I have no idea if this was before Goldenweek was introduced though.You got the interview where Oda said this?
It seems more like wishful thinking for the physics geeks and the "I always want a logical explanation to every phenomena in anime" fans to me.
It's far too late for One Piece not to have "unexplainable magic."
Thanks for the information, but this kind of Power isn’t unexplainable since everyone knows the power of Voodoo by movies. This doesn’t mean that I believe in Voodoo.
Hypnotism is never this strong in the real world and so could be slight of hand magic be really powerful, too. I don’t say Hawkins Power isn’t from one devil fruit but I see the possible. -
I have never said Hawkins abilities must be DF in origin. Just incase that was not clear. I was just explaining what De Flamingo meant with what he said.
but this kind of Power isn’t unexplainable since everyone knows the power of Voodoo by movies. This doesn’t mean that I believe in Voodoo.
I don't agree that Voodoo is "explained" by being commmonly known about through movies and fiction.
It seems more like wishful thinking for the physics geeks and the "I always want a logical explanation to every phenomena in anime" fans to me.
Granted not everything in Odaverse can be explained through physics and if I had heard nothing about it I probably would think it was very possible for magic to exist in OP. But I'm fairly certain I recall something about him saying it somewhere…. =P
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Except he's not gonna fight Kizaru, he'll just tear apart the Kuma-bot and run like fuck while Kizaru "talks" to Drake some.
omg, haahhaha. i laughed so hard when i read this, that i even made an acc to reply.
ryuksgelus, truly, thank you. i've had a long day, and this just made it. -
@Don:
which "unexplained magic" do you mean???
wishful thinking of physic geeks….
haha youre funny, it isn
t always a geek who love to read a shonen manga series...and when you read through the series you will sooner or later know that some things wouldnt rly fit in the manga cause it would ruin the story..can
t detect their "wishful thinking":happy: but maybe youre not so good into that series so that you still think that some things could happen cause you wish so...but sry fanfic is fanfic and it was stated that their won
t be magic..i dont know where i read that(believe me ,read to much to remember every quote) but maybe you have some good examples where "unexplained magic" was in the manga...also i don
t need a logical explanation for a manga...just some things fit the series and some are just bad ideas or fanfics which could be easily disproved..and thats why we all talking here on the forum..to share our thoughts and to see "ohh this isn`t rly likely" or " yeah could happen"But there is magic in One Piece….DEVIL FRUITS.
DON!
No sorry I don't, thus the "someplace" (hmm thought I specifically said I didn't know where though. strange)
Eh? exactly where is there magic (magic as in can not be explained by some psudoscience such as hypnotism that might still be considered magic in some peoples eyes) in OP (excluding devilfruits, haki or whatever Rayleighs ability was called and Goldenweeks/Jangos hypnotism)?
So you already knew where the unexplained magic was in One Piece and you excluded it.
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But there is magic in One Piece….DEVIL FRUITS.
So you already knew where the unexplained magic was in One Piece and you excluded it.
Ah perhaps I wasn't clear enough. Oda himself excluded the devilfruits from that statement about not being magic in One Piece. (And No i still can't source it… but I havent really been looking either.)
I have no idea where the hypnotism or haki stand in regards to that statement, but I do not consider them the same as spellcasting, which is what I mean when I say magic.
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I am guessing Haki and hypnotism would be a form of magic since it can not be explained really.
Well don't worry about the interview, I don't really care about the subject anyways. I am just praying we can get spoilers on early Tuesday.
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Why can't hypnotism be explained? It's used in real life in therapeutic purposes.
It might be disputed as a viable treatment but it's a lot more real then any of the powers granted by DFs.
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There are thinks that are better associated to magic because you know, even if cant explain myabe it could exist, but like sanji, you cant kick steel pretty hard and dont break your leg, you cant fall from the sky and not get damage like Strawhats did many times, there is no explanation for this stuff and it doesnt bother me at all!
While i was writing maybe you can call magic the sky opening in the fight of WB and Shanks, we saw just swords and no devil fruits powers, if that was because of them then you can cosider that magic and there is no explanation for that! I think you should stop discussing this, its pointless and a waste of time =)
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yall read way to much into a comic book
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boicote: Even if you thought that was an excellent way to end the discussion, all it does is prolong the discussion since ppl would have to explain to you that mysterious or unexplained events does not equal magic.
Unplanned unexplainable events are called miracles and are counted as religion, not magic.
also by OP world physics jumping in the air (geppou) is martial arts and not magic, even though it doesn't make sense…
Same with all the other strange bodily feats (such as the ones you mentioned). That is op world physics at work, not magic. -
/me quite likes the idea of a Deadman Wonderland style Akainu.
Having him look like the Bad Egg? Or having some sort of Blood-Blood Fruit?