Well, since way back in chapter 1 Luffy he said to Shanks ''I'll have a ship and crew better than yours!'' which means that Luffy could fight and defeat Shanks, and, I'm standing by my theory that Whitebeard might not be the strongest pirate on the Grand Line as he hasn't yet fought Luffy, plus the other two don't look that strong.
Could Luffy become one of the Yonkou? (Spoilers? I dunno)
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at present….. Luffy isn't at Shanks level yet.... so no.... but eventually, Luffy will get to that level...it's just a matter of time..... but that's assuming the World Government stopped him from getting into the second half of the GrandLine......
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at present….. Luffy isn't at Shanks level yet..
I would like to remind everyone that we have not yet seen how strong Shanks is. Even way back in chapter one, he did no fighting, preferring to leave that to Ben Beckman and Lucky Roux.
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I would like to remind the person that was reminding everyone that Shanks is being called an equal to Whitebeard….... although that's not prove enough that Shanks is strong, but to be called one of the 4 great pirate on the GrandLine isn't something a normal pirate can be given the title......
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I would like to remind everyone that we have not yet seen how strong Shanks is. Even way back in chapter one, he did no fighting, preferring to leave that to Ben Beckman and Lucky Roux.
True, but Shanks managed to scare off a Sea King just by looking at it. I somehow doubt most people can do that.
There is a slight possibility but at the moment I say we just sit back and wait.
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Could Luffy become one of the Yonkou?
What for? He's going straight for pirate KING anyway^^
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I would like to remind the person that was reminding everyone that Shanks is being called an equal to Whitebeard….... although that's not prove enough that Shanks is strong, but to be called one of the 4 great pirate on the GrandLine isn't something a normal pirate can be given the title......
I'd also like to remind you that even though Whitebeard is known as 'The Strongest Man in the World', that does not neccesarily mean he's stronger than Luffy, as they've not fought yet.
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I'd also like to remind you that even though Whitebeard is known as 'The Strongest Man in the World', that does not neccesarily mean he's stronger than Luffy, as they've not fought yet.
I'd like to remind everyone that Luffy will in the end become Pirate King. So once he encounters Whitebeard or one of the other Kings and fights them, there's a very high chance that he'll win. Luffy WILL be stronger, but he probably isn't stronger YET.
Because that's still far away. You should see people like those Kings or the next Shichibukai as "stations" on the Strawhat's voyage from East Blue to the end of the Grandline.
Right now Luffy is still not even on the 2nd half of the Grandline. So if currently Whitebeard is seen as the strongest Pirate in the world, then Luffy still has about the half of the Grandline in front of him to get to him and to get that strong.
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Or in other words:
It is almost safe to assume that Luffy will fight a lot of strong enemies before he encounters and defeats one of the 4 Kings.
And it is safe to assume that he'll grow with each of his enemies and will develop a lot until then and that he will still have a hard fight against that King - simply because we will (!) get an interesting and long fight. An 1-hit-k.o. would be really boring after all.
That's why Luffy must be weaker than them right now. The future Luffy that defeats one of the 4 Kings will be a nuance stronger than his enemy. And the future Luffy will be a dozend times stronger than the current Luffy. That's why the current Luffy obviously is a dozend times weaker than his future self and weaker than those kings XDDDD Twisted Logic.
But if Luffy is stronger than Whitebeard/Shanks whoever right now, then that would mean that two people with the strength of Lucci teamed-up could kill each of those kings easily, simply because Luffy almost died against Lucci - not to speak of 2 Luccis.
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What for? He's going straight for pirate KING anyway^^
Exactly. I doubt that Luffy will get time to "live like an emperor" until after he's taken One Piece for himself. Besides, "Emperor" is still just second place to pirate king right now.
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I don't think he may end up defeating them and sending them packing. These guys are important pirates right? He may fight them, but I think he would end up winning their support.
I think this from playing a game called 'Morrowind'. In it, to fight Dagon Ur you had to do (out of many things) was win support from the 3 great houses in Morrowind and the 4 tribes. Once you had their support, the other people on Morrowind respected you from then on and you had political power backing you.
To be declared King, Luffy may have to convince the 4 big emperors he is worthy of the title, even with or without One Piece. Once he has their support (either through fighting them or otherwise) he will have one hell of a supporting force behind him. They don't have to loose their positions, just show their respect and loyaly by supporting him with a force. Maybe even to attack the WG. I don't know…
... I think Luffy is turning out to be another Dragon. XD
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You're kidding, right?
…...You're kidding, right?
We haven't even hit the red line again yet.
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You're kidding, right?
**lol
:::Luffy might be considered one of the Yonkou, for a short while. Or it could be that when he becomes strong enough there will be Gonkou.
Remember that, unlike the WG and the schichbukai, the Yonkou aren't an "official" group. It's not like they came toeghter and decided to rule thee Grand Line.**
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How can you think luffy can beat Whitebeard or shanks i remember the government seeing those two meeting up being a massive threat and whitebeard completely embarassed that guy called Rockstar(94 million bounty) he wasn't at all bothered who he was, doesn't that give you an idea of how strong he is?
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@Octogon:
Luffy might be considered one of the Yonkou, for a short while. Or it could be that when he becomes strong enough there will be Gonkou.
You mean 'Gokou'. 'Yon' means 'four' in japanese, 'go' means five, 'roku' means six, 'shichi' means seven and so on.
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Originally Posted by blacky
Right now Luffy is still not even on the 2nd half of the Grandline.You're kidding, right?
Well, I feel the same way, but when you think about it right now they aren't on the 2nd half of the Grandline…they have to get past the Red line first. It's kind of like saying the SHs aren't a match for the shichibukai right now...it doesn't mean they won't be later.
I mean, they are definitely going to the 2nd half of the grandline.
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That is why he said "Right now"
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How can you think luffy can beat Whitebeard or shanks i remember the government seeing those two meeting up being a massive threat and whitebeard completely embarassed that guy called Rockstar(94 million bounty) he wasn't at all bothered who he was, doesn't that give you an idea of how strong he is?
I agree with you 22768 %
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If Luffy will become one, some might foresee him being the Pirate King. No shit, I wanted him being the Pirate King be a suprise to all the ppl who didn't know him closely.
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@yokaiforte:
…...You're kidding, right?
We haven't even hit the red line again yet.
Jesus. All those chapters, and they still aren't near the end yet?
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Luffy is nowhere near the level of a Whitebeard or Shanks! Hell, it is arguable that he is not even the Strongest pirate in his own crew! Zolo might be equal or stronger.
Anyways the strongest people right now look like
1.Whitebeard
2.Mihawk
Those are the two strongest.
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I think its plausible that Luffy will be so legendary now, after leveling Eins Lobby, that no one except for the strongest of the strong would dare mess with him. Islands that the Strawhats visit will probably quake in fear lest these terrors decimate them like they did one of the greatest marine strongholds.
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I think its plausible that Luffy will be so legendary now, after leveling Eins Lobby, that no one except for the strongest of the strong would dare mess with him. Islands that the Strawhats visit will probably quake in fear lest these terrors decimate them like they did one of the greatest marine strongholds.
In a couple hundred chapters**.**
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I disagree; taking down Eins Lobby is unprecedented in the history of the marines as a superpower according to what we've been told so far. Even though the marines have clearly been overestimating themselves, such a feat isn't something that just any person could accomplish. Isn't this kind of destruction and undermining of government power what led to the creation of the 7 pirate warlords and to the fear of the great pirates like Shanks and Whitebeard?
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I disagree; taking down Eins Lobby is unprecedented in the history of the marines as a superpower according to what we've been told so far. Even though the marines have clearly been overestimating themselves, such a feat isn't something that just any person could accomplish. Isn't this kind of destruction and undermining of government power what led to the creation of the 7 pirate warlords and to the fear of the great pirates like Shanks and Whitebeard?
Yeah, like Kokoro said, this sort of thing makes the SHs famous. Odds are only the really big guys–you know who--and some strong people we dont now about (giants?) and people who don't know any better (the next "Foxy) will mess with them.
Of course, I doubt Whitebeard, Shanks, or any of the emperors would be intimidated by the SHs for wrecking Enies Lobby. In this chapter, the SHs have entered the "big leagues," but are far from on top of them.
Yet, too many people on this board are trivializing the destruction of Enies Lobby.
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Yeah, they wrecked enies lobby and dodged a buster call.. that should put the mugiwara crew right up there as one of the big powers lol
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lol some people are amazed by such little things Whitebeard probably could've taken enies lobby with his eyes closed. Think about what your saying about shanks he used to rival Mihawk before he lost his arm, so if you think luffy can beat shanks then you also believe luffy can rival Mihawk.
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lol some people are amazed by such little things Whitebeard probably could've taken enies lobby with his eyes closed. Think about what your saying about shanks he used to rival Mihawk before he lost his arm, so if you think luffy can beat shanks then you also believe luffy can rival Mihawk.
If taking out the World Government's judicial island were such an easy to accomplish feat then how does the world government even exist? I can't believe that Luffy is the first person who wanted to take someone back from the judicial island so if it were so easy to do then why has no one ever done it before? I'm not disputing that White Beard could have done it too, the point is that there probably are not too many individuals between Luffy's level of power and Whitebeard's (if we take Luffy as the minimum power needed to destroy Enis Lobby) to make Luffy's accomplishment unimpressive to the masses of pirates.
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Jesus. All those chapters, and they still aren't near the end yet?
Have you even been following the story? O_O
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Yeah.. in all fairness, Luffy and the gang destroying EL + a buster call.. that should put them right up there with the other superpowers in the world.
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They didn't destroy EL nor the BC though. They kicked CP9's ass and then escaped alive from the BC. Impressive? Yes. Putting them on an even remotely equal level than the Emperors or higher class Shichibukais? Not likely.
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The only plausible way I see Luffy fighting Shanks, is he encounters Shank and heads his way to Raftelt o become "Pirate King". And Shanks goes "sorry, I can't let you do that. That is meant for me."
Then fight!
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Well, since way back in chapter 1 Luffy he said to Shanks ''I'll have a ship and crew better than yours!'' which means that Luffy could fight and defeat Shanks, and, I'm standing by my theory that Whitebeard might not be the strongest pirate on the Grand Line as he hasn't yet fought Luffy, plus the other two don't look that strong.
No, because:
"Ore wa kaizoku oo ni naru otoko da!!"
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They didn't destroy EL nor the BC though. They kicked CP9's ass and then escaped alive from the BC. Impressive? Yes. Putting them on an even remotely equal level than the Emperors or higher class Shichibukais? Not likely.
Now you're downplaying their achievements. Enies Lobby was supposed to be an impregnable fortress. The mugiwara crew just walked right through it to save Robin. I think they also defeated just about anyone in there. So I think the gourousei need to have a little meeting now to discuss a sudden very big threat - and the total loss of face they suffered.
Also, weren't some of the buster call warships destroyed by friendly fire because of the current change or whatnot?
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I'm not downplaying it as I said it was impressive, I'm saying it's not enough to put them on the same level of threat than the Emperors.
These 4 guys rule the second half of GL, they probably toppled and now control whole kingdoms, the Strawhats destroyed the super secret assassination squad which spend the last 5 years pretending to be shipwrights while the Marine HQ fought against the Emperors, see the difference?
They'll get fully noticed by the Marine higher ups as a serious threat, but far below the 4.
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I don't see the point of hyping the YonKou and Dragon so much this chapter if the SH are already near their level. I just don't.
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I don't remember exactly, but wasn't the Shichibukai hyped a bit right before the croc arc?
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The Shichibukai were first mentioned (and "hyped") before the Arlong Park arc.
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I don't remember exactly, but wasn't the Shichibukai hyped a bit right before the croc arc?
They were hyped one big arc and a few mini-arcs before they beat croc. And since the number of the yonKou are less than the schichbukai, it makes sense that they are closer to each other in strength than the schichbukai are to each other.
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@Octogon:
They were hyped one big arc and a few mini-arcs before they beat croc. And since the number of the yonKou are less than the schichbukai, it makes sense that they are closer to each other in strength than the schichbukai are to each other.
Why is that so? They could just be the top 4 pirate crews in an area that extends beyond the world government's main base of power, ie across the red line. It isn't unreasonable to speculate that Luffy might be capable of defeating the weakest of the 4, though I agree that he isn't at Whitebeard's level yet and I doubt he'll ever fight Shanks. My point is not that he is at the level of the emperors, but that he is now a contender, if you will, with enough strength and accomplishments to be widely notorious.
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Why is that so? They could just be the top 4 pirate crews in an area that extends beyond the world government's main base of power, ie across the red line. It isn't unreasonable to speculate that Luffy might be capable of defeating the weakest of the 4, though I agree that he isn't at Whitebeard's level yet and I doubt he'll ever fight Shanks. My point is not that he is at the level of the emperors, but that he is now a contender, if you will, with enough strength and accomplishments to be widely notorious.
**Why's that? Because it makes sense.
Remember when Luffy defeated Don Krieg, "the strongest pirate in the world" or Kuro? Or Arlong. they were at the top of the world. And look at them now.**
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They didn't destroy EL nor the BC though. They kicked CP9's ass and then escaped alive from the BC. Impressive? Yes. Putting them on an even remotely equal level than the Emperors or higher class Shichibukais? Not likely.
Hey hey, beating a lage amount of those 10,000 soldiers, the cannons, the various special squads, and the CP9 were the undefeatable part. No one ever thought of destroying it's infastructure. A base without people isn't a base. It did add insult to injury, though.
But either way, no, it doesn't neccessarily put them on par with those guys….yet. It's a big feat that none of the big pirates have accomplished, not "how much you can bench." This adds to there legend, or more like, starts their legend.
After all, destorying a base isn't neccessarly a factor in a one-on-one fight. Take Mr.2 for example, he's a strong guy who focuses on damaging little areas.
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@Octogon:
**Why's that? Because it makes sense.
Remember when Luffy defeated Don Krieg, "the strongest pirate in the world" or Kuro? Or Arlong. they were at the top of the world. And look at them now.**
What does that have to do with anything? There's a difference between the testimony of Luffy's grandpa, a Vice Admiral of the marines, and the boastings of Dong Krieg who we knew only lasted a single day in the Grand Line or Arlong who was thought to be an invincible monster only by normal people like Nami who had been bullied by him for years. Those guys were easily spotted as big fish in a small pond. Enis Lobby was also hyped up big time by everyone including the marines, as was the invincibility of the buster call. The precedent then is that whatever gets hyped is Luffy's next target to defeat.
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What does that have to do with anything? There's a difference between the testimony of Luffy's grandpa, a Vice Admiral of the marines, and the boastings of Dong Krieg who we knew only lasted a single day in the Grand Line or Arlong who was thought to be an invincible monster only by normal people like Nami who had been bullied by him for years. Those guys were easily spotted as big fish in a small pond. Enis Lobby was also hyped up big time by everyone including the marines, as was the invincibility of the buster call. The precedent then is that whatever gets hyped is Luffy's next target to defeat.
Truely. It's so fickle and naive to think that one thing that was hyped up is truely invincible after what we've seen. It's like people are just forgeting about the defeated, marking them as losers, and moving on to the next character without learning the lesson. Yet, people like Enel and Crocodile were developed to be unbeatable before they were defeated. So was Enies Lobby.
So, why is anyone else any different? Aokiji's strength is in many ways just a "next level" Crocodile, for example. Yeah, he seems unbeatable, but so was Croc after he nearly killed Luffy. I just don't get it. It must be good storytelling, since the current plot relies on the Strawhat's not seeming to be able to beat these new enemies. Wow, are those guys gonna be surprised.
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**There is a clear cut difference between defeating Crocodile and defeating AoKiji. Crocodile's frozen bounty was hyped to be less than three times Luffy's. AoKiji was hyped to the point that we found out he is on the level of pirates so powerful their bounties weren't mentioned yet. Huge difference.
Crocodile was hyped to be on the next level, AoKiji was hyped to be on THE level.
We need another major arc before Luffy can contend with even the weakest of the YonKou. You guys are saying that they were able to beat croc after he was hyped. But even for arguably the weakest schichbukai, we had to wait: some of whiskey peak, Little Garden, Drum arc and most of Arabasta before Luffy could be seen on the same level as croc.
But this is more comparable to when we just found out about the schichbukai, so you might want to ass in Arlong park, Lougetown and the rest of whiskey peak.**
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@Octogon:
We need another major arc before Luffy can contend with even the weakest of the YonKou. You guys are saying that they were able to beat croc after he was hyped. But even for arguably the weakest schichbukai, we had to wait: some of whiskey peak, Little Garden, Drum arc and most of Arabasta before Luffy could be seen on the same level as croc.
Exactly if luffy was at their level they would not be hyped he would probably have his usual "am gonna kick your ass" phrase like he did when the crocodile battle was close.
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@Octogon:
**There is a clear cut difference between defeating Crocodile and defeating AoKiji. Crocodile's frozen bounty was hyped to be less than three times Luffy's. AoKiji was hyped to the point that we found out he is on the level of pirates so powerful their bounties weren't mentioned yet. Huge difference.
Crocodile was hyped to be on the next level, AoKiji was hyped to be on THE level.
Now wait, who ever said that? Aokiji has no bounty, so he can't be compared to in that way. And no one ever said he was on par with "bountiless" pirates–Aokiji is most likely quite weaker then Whitebeard.
And it could be seen as more or less the same thing. The "next level" vs. "The level?" How can you say that, when their is very likely a few people above him. After all, Croc has a few arcs before he was beaten, so for a little while he was "the level" too. That is, we knew nothing about the shichibukai at that point.
We need another major arc before Luffy can contend with even the weakest of the YonKou. You guys are saying that they were able to beat croc after he was hyped. But even for arguably the weakest schichbukai, we had to wait: some of whiskey peak, Little Garden, Drum arc and most of Arabasta before Luffy could be seen on the same level as croc.
Yes, we'll most likely need a good period of wait. However, no every shihcibukai/admiral will take the same time Croc did. After all, having to take so much effort to beat the weakest shichibukai serves to hype up the stronger ones.
Also, with each defeat the shichiubkai and other powers becomes more underwhelming. Most likely, the some of the powers will be defeated close to each other.
For example, I have a personal theory that one of the world powers will be defeated at some point in the story–throwing the world into climatic chaos. Which one? Most likely the Admirals. Think about it, there's only three of them, and Aokiji wouldn't just sit around while Luffy and co beats the other two powers right?
Also, the emerors are too strong and there are too many shichibukai. But that's speculation again.
Exactly if luffy was at their level they would not be hyped he would probably have his usual "am gonna kick your ass" phrase like he did when the crocodile battle was close.
Good point, but no one should be saying that the SHs on on their level now. I thought the point was they'd be stronger later.**
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Good point, but no one should be saying that the SHs on on their level now. I thought the point was they'd be stronger later.
It seems we misunderstood each other.
Now wait, who ever said that? Aokiji has no bounty, so he can't be compared to in that way. And no one ever said he was on par with "bountiless" pirates–Aokiji is most likely quite weaker then Whitebeard.
AoKiji was basically stated to be the top of on of the world powers. Whitebard is the same. And there's isn't going to be a huge difference between them.
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Shanks, Mehawk, Whitebeard, Aokiji… Their strengths relative to each other is kinda fuzzy. They're all clearly still much stronger than Luffy. That doesn't mean that Luffy can't be a widely feared renowned power though.