General 'Four Emperors' Discussion
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A clubhouse that the Strawhats can duck into when they're being hounded by overwhelming forces.
I always wanted to see a nice cavalry charge to the rescue in One Piece.
I imagine a treehouse that only Marco can reach, cause he's the pseudo captain.
Jozu sits, slowly swinging on a tire swing, lamenting the loss of his arm.
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^and who's playing the banjo?
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Oh we are doomed, doooooomed. Oh wait is that a blue bird and some kind of weird buff Zorro.
Cue the cavalry
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I really wonder what they were doing when Teach took over Whitebeard's territory. Looks like Marco and the gang knew they wouldn't stand a chance and decided to let Teach have his fun for the time being while secretly preparing some form of counterattack (I refuse to believe they did nothing to avenge their former captain).
I suppose Teach avoid them until they were the one which had to run.
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If the WBs arent laying low in Red Hair territory they should at least be picking off Tech's allied crews.
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I consider there to be a substantial difference between the circumstances, and therefore, the implications of the outcome. When Jozu attacked Aokiji, Aokiji was caught off guard, but because he was fighting someone else at the time; he was prepared to get hit, he just wasn't expecting a hit from Jozu. When Akainu was hit by Whitebeard, he was warned by his men first, and by any reasonable set of expectations, was ready to get hit at any time.
Jozu lost specifically because he was distracted from the fight by what happened to Marco. He should still have his head in the fight for pragmatic reasons, but the way it was portrayed clearly suggested he lost focus and was distracted from fighting completely (which is also how the VAs got kairoseki cuffs on Marco moments earlier). That's very clearly why the events were portrayed the way they were; Marco and Jozu were shown briefly able to fight the admirals on equal terms, and were defeated due to both getting distracted from their fights. Maybe they're weaker than admirals, but the whole reason Oda went to the trouble of panels and dialogue of them getting distracted was to leave it ambiguous about whether they are actually weaker or not.
You know… Maybe I should stop. Just give up and all...
Or not. However, I will just point out few things:
A) They are not shown fighting on equal terms. You are simply assuming they are.
B) Jozu got distracted by Marco getting hit... before they've put Kairoseki cuffs on. Yes, the mere sight of the self healing mythical zoan user was distressing enough for him to instantly lose fight. Yay for the pirate idiocy.
C) And yet you will notice that not even Whitebeard was capable of taking out an Admiral in one hit. And he possess better haki, physical strenght, and the most powerful power in the world. You are saying that Jozu, for example, would be able to do the same, given enough time? Give me a break.
D) Again, there are no panels suggesting Kizaru was fighting Marco off-screen. You are speaking of context. Show it. Because I just checked, and Marco and Kizaru don't share A SINGLE PANEL OF INTERACTION after the Yasakami not Magatana scene until Kizaru shoots him.
I will not stand for this! Yonkou commanders are NOT on Admiral level! As long as I'm alive I will not let that statement stand!
Which is another annoying tendency I see all of the freaking time: Every time someone is not curbstomped in seconds by an Admiral people go "Oh, this guy is on a Admiral level". Which makes no sense. At all. Last time it was when Fujitora and Zoro fight was going on.
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You know… Maybe I should stop. Just give up and all...
Or not. However, I will just point out few things:
A) They are not shown fighting on equal terms. You are simply assuming they are.
B) Jozu got distracted by Marco getting hit... before they've put Kairoseki cuffs on. Yes, the mere sight of the self healing mythical zoan user was distressing enough for him to instantly lose fight. Yay for the pirate idiocy.
C) And yet you will notice that not even Whitebeard was capable of taking out an Admiral in one hit. And he possess better haki, physical strenght, and the most powerful power in the world. You are saying that Jozu, for example, would be able to do the same, given enough time? Give me a break.
D) Again, there are no panels suggesting Kizaru was fighting Marco off-screen. You are speaking of context. Show it. Because I just checked, and Marco and Kizaru don't share A SINGLE PANEL OF INTERACTION after the Yasakami not Magatana scene until Kizaru shoots him.
I will not stand for this! Yonkou commanders are NOT on Admiral level! As long as I'm alive I will not let that statement stand!
Which is another annoying tendency I see all of the freaking time: Every time someone is not curbstomped in seconds by an Admiral people go "Oh, this guy is on a Admiral level". Which makes no sense. At all. Last time it was when Fujitora and Zoro fight was going on.
And with what exactly are admirals suppose to dominate Marco on a 1 vs 1?
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And with what exactly are admirals suppose to dominate Marco on a 1 vs 1?
A) Attrition warfare. His power is limited after all.
B) If I was, let's say, Kizaru, I would shot one of his allies. He will be so suprise and distracted by people getting hurt in the war, that he will lose istantly.
C) No evidence that he can't be frozen in his half-form.
D) Kick to the head, to stun him, and therefore keep him from concieusly healing, and then headshot.
E) Akainu could just burn his innards or rip most of his head off, multiple times, and see when his powers do run out. Also, Marco was shown to be incapable of hitting him, so he can do it as many times as he wants.
Want me to keep going?
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You know… Maybe I should stop. Just give up and all...
Or not. However, I will just point out few things:
A) They are not shown fighting on equal terms. You are simply assuming they are.
B) Jozu got distracted by Marco getting hit... before they've put Kairoseki cuffs on. Yes, the mere sight of the self healing mythical zoan user was distressing enough for him to instantly lose fight. Yay for the pirate idiocy.
C) And yet you will notice that not even Whitebeard was capable of taking out an Admiral in one hit. And he possess better haki, physical strenght, and the most powerful power in the world. You are saying that Jozu, for example, would be able to do the same, given enough time? Give me a break.
D) Again, there are no panels suggesting Kizaru was fighting Marco off-screen. You are speaking of context. Show it. Because I just checked, and Marco and Kizaru don't share A SINGLE PANEL OF INTERACTION after the Yasakami not Magatana scene until Kizaru shoots him.
I will not stand for this! Yonkou commanders are NOT on Admiral level! As long as I'm alive I will not let that statement stand!
Which is another annoying tendency I see all of the freaking time: Every time someone is not curbstomped in seconds by an Admiral people go "Oh, this guy is on a Admiral level". Which makes no sense. At all. Last time it was when Fujitora and Zoro fight was going on.
When WB started fighting the Admirals he was already badly injured with a stab wound - and was doing just fine vs Akainu the first time till his bad health acted up and Akainu got that hit on him which left a hole in his chest - and i seem to recall the fact that once Ace died, WB did away with Akainu in just 2 or 3 attacks based on the proper Manga version of the fight.
And pls stop coming upo with these BS power levels of "Admiral level, Yonkou level" etc Its complete BS.
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I imagine a treehouse that only Marco can reach, cause he's the pseudo captain.
Jozu sits, slowly swinging on a tire swing, lamenting the loss of his arm.
wait what?!
when did Jozu lose an arm?
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_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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You can't see any of his arms in the funeral pic. His body is large enough to block sight of his left arm as it does for others in the panel. But Im sure this has been discussed to death.
But clearly thats one broken arm in the battle pic. I can't believe i missed that. I went back looking for it too but I did find this it looks like ghandi one grows a beard then loses it…
clearly i need to reread the entire manga.
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You can't see any of his arms in the funeral pic. His body is large enough to block sight of his left arm as it does for others in the panel. But Im sure this has been discussed to death.
But clearly thats one broken arm in the battle pic. I can't believe i missed that. I went back looking for it too but I did find this it looks like ghandi one grows a beard then loses it…
clearly i need to reread the entire manga.
Then there'll be a pop quiz.
A whole round of questions will be dedicated to the former WB Pirates and their various body parts.
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You can't see any of his arms in the funeral pic. His body is large enough to block sight of his left arm as it does for others in the panel. But Im sure this has been discussed to death.
But clearly thats one broken arm in the battle pic. I can't believe i missed that. I went back looking for it too but I did find this it looks like ghandi one grows a beard then loses it…
clearly i need to reread the entire manga.
The second picture I linked was the volume version. The magazine one had Jozu with his right arm still attached and also shown but that was later on changed to emphasize the loss of it.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Then there'll be a pop quiz.
A whole round of questions will be dedicated to the former WB Pirates and their various body parts.
Oda already confirmed that Jozu has a diamond penis, and that's the question everyone wanted to see answered the most I reckon.
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_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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Can Marco lay eggs?
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Does he ressurect after death, arising from the ashes? isnt that sort of the Phoenix "Schtick"?
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Does he ressurect after death, arising from the ashes? isnt that sort of the Phoenix "Schtick"?
I think his regenerative abillities are suppose to represent that.
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A) Attrition warfare. His power is limited after all.
B) If I was, let's say, Kizaru, I would shot one of his allies. He will be so suprise and distracted by people getting hurt in the war, that he will lose istantly.
C) No evidence that he can't be frozen in his half-form.
D) Kick to the head, to stun him, and therefore keep him from concieusly healing, and then headshot.
E) Akainu could just burn his innards or rip most of his head off, multiple times, and see when his powers do run out. Also, Marco was shown to be incapable of hitting him, so he can do it as many times as he wants.
Want me to keep going?
A) attribution warfare? Like the shower of meteor that Whitebeard just needed to puff away. He can dodge since he is a bird and he is a phisical fighter. And we have yet to see his limit.
B) We are talking strength and one on one. So no allies to shoot and I don't see why that would make him loose. But I suspect a joke referring to how Marco got distracted.
C) Aokiji is definiely the most suitable. Although since we are talking a one vs one and Aokiji wasn't able to freeze Joz before he got distract it is uncertain how useful that move is on th middle of a fight. But it is a good finisher.
D) We don't know how much conciousness is needed to heal or Kizaru can pull out such a combo on Marco. Have we ever see someone who got stunt on this manga?
E) Akainu can be blocked and can't get to people inside casually. Like Jimbei did when he wanted to fist Luffy or how Curiel was just burning in the ground. And we saw Marco casually talking with half of his body gone(includding a good chunk of his face) I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work that well. AndMarco knows haki. So he can indeed hit Akainu. And we saw that he had a gret kick when he kicked kizaru and he possess claws. -
A) attribution warfare? Like the shower of meteor that Whitebeard just needed to puff away. He can dodge since he is a bird and he is a phisical fighter. And we have yet to see his limit.
B) We are talking strength and one on one. So no allies to shoot and I don't see why that would make him loose. But I suspect a joke referring to how Marco got distracted.
C) Aokiji is definiely the most suitable. Although since we are talking a one vs one and Aokiji wasn't able to freeze Joz before he got distract it is uncertain how useful that move is on th middle of a fight. But it is a good finisher.
D) We don't know how much conciousness is needed to heal or Kizaru can pull out such a combo on Marco. Have we ever see someone who got stunt on this manga?
E) Akainu can be blocked and can't get to people inside casually. Like Jimbei did when he wanted to fist Luffy or how Curiel was just burning in the ground. And we saw Marco casually talking with half of his body gone(includding a good chunk of his face) I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work that well. AndMarco knows haki. So he can indeed hit Akainu. And we saw that he had a gret kick when he kicked kizaru and he possess claws.
A) But he did not blow it away. If Marco could block as much stuff as people think, he could probably do something against Ryuusei Kazan. And he did not.
B) Yeah, that was me being slightly sarcastic.
D) Just a theory. Plus, we do see that Kizaru kicks are good at stunning people at saboady.
E) Have you forgot this page?
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A) But he did not blow it away. If Marco could block as much stuff as people think, he could probably do something against Ryuusei Kazan. And he did not.
B) Yeah, that was me being slightly sarcastic.
D) Just a theory. Plus, we do see that Kizaru kicks are good at stunning people at saboady.
E) Have you forgot this page?
! http://i25.mangapanda.com/one-piece/574/one-piece-1202142.jpg
A) That thing was being rained in the battlefield. Marco can't be everywhere and was busy talking strategy with Whitebeard. At best he could shield them from 2 or three. It's not like we saw people get vaporized by the attack.
D) He didn't stunt anyone. It hurts them like any powerful kick would.We saw people people badly hurt. And in this case we are talkingabout someone who was casually talking with part of his body blow up.
E) So you think Marco can't hurt Akainu?Anyway we saw Akainu with 2 scars where Marco and Vista attacked him when he is getting treat. -
A) But he did not blow it away. If Marco could block as much stuff as people think, he could probably do something against Ryuusei Kazan. And he did not.
How is he supposed to "block" a massive hailstorm of magma that covered a vast area with his relativley small size? What do you expect him to be able to do about it, really?
Think of it like this: if you wear a winter coat, falling snowflakes wont even give you as much as a cold, right? but does that mean you could somehow run around on your backyard and "tank" all of the snowflakes and prevent them from piling up on the ground? No.
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16chars of Marco could
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lol nothing I was trying to say that Marco could tank a yard's worth of snowfall with just his winter coat. as a joke
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How is he supposed to "block" a massive hailstorm of magma that covered a vast area with his relativley small size? What do you expect him to be able to do about it, really?
Think of it like this: if you wear a winter coat, falling snowflakes wont even give you as much as a cold, right? but does that mean you could somehow run around on your backyard and "tank" all of the snowflakes and prevent them from piling up on the ground? No.
I shall remind you that he did in fact block a rather large Yasakami no Magatana, and was show expanding a little to do so. While he could not every single one, he could try to minimise the damage, instead of, you know… doing nothing.
A) That thing was being rained in the battlefield. Marco can't be everywhere and was busy talking strategy with Whitebeard. At best he could shield them from 2 or three. It's not like we saw people get vaporized by the attack.
D) He didn't stunt anyone. It hurts them like any powerful kick would.We saw people people badly hurt. And in this case we are talkingabout someone who was casually talking with part of his body blow up.
E) So you think Marco can't hurt Akainu?Anyway we saw Akainu with 2 scars where Marco and Vista attacked him when he is getting treat.A) Yeah, who cares if they are going to get by few more magma fists… it's not like it does something. And yes, that was sarcasm.
D) Theory, just theory...
E) Peculiar. I recently both re-read and re-watched the War... again. I can't seem to recall Akainu being hurt by Marco and Vista in any way whatsoever. Will you point me out towards panel where that was shown, please?
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I shall remind you that he did in fact block a rather large Yasakami no Magatana, and was show expanding a little to do so. While he could not every single one, he could try to minimise the damage, instead of, you know… doing nothing. A) Yeah, who cares if they are going to get by few more magma fists... it's not like it does something. And yes, that was sarcasm.D) Theory, just theory... E) Peculiar. I recently both re-read and re-watched the War... again. I can't seem to recall Akainu being hurt by Marco and Vista in any way whatsoever. Will you point me out towards panel where that was shown, please?
Kizaru was targetting the king or the boat. And Marco didn't spread. He used his wings.A) Well they didn't care when lasers were devastating the troops either. And The dude was surely just like everyone was. He isn't here to babysit the pirates here.E) It was after the war. When we see Akainu getting treat shirtless we also see two scars close to each other and on his neck.
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E) It was after the war. When we see Akainu getting treat shirtless we also see two scars close to each other and on his neck.
Are you sure it wasn't anime filler? Cause that feels like an anime filler. I believe Sakazuki was not shown once, between the end of the war, and him apprehending Bonney.
Feel free to prove me wrong on that one though.
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Are you sure it wasn't anime filler? Cause that feels like an anime filler. I believe Sakazuki was not shown once, between the end of the war, and him apprehending Bonney.
Feel free to prove me wrong on that one though.
Could be this one. We see a few stitches here and there, but no scars whatsoever.
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Are you sure it wasn't anime filler? Cause that feels like an anime filler. I believe Sakazuki was not shown once, between the end of the war, and him apprehending Bonney.
Feel free to prove me wrong on that one though.
I don't watch the anime. But maybe it was a cover page. I will check when I can.
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Could be this one. We see a few stitches here and there, but no scars whatsoever.
I thought it might have been this one.
Altough I'm not convinced those are stitches, to be honest. Looks more like… I dunno, shade lines? I'm not a professional artist, I can't really tell. But if the Marco attack worked, he should have a lot more than few stitches.
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I thought it might have been this one.
Altough I'm not convinced those are stitches, to be honest. Looks more like… I dunno, shade lines? I'm not a professional artist, I can't really tell. But if the Marco attack worked, he should have a lot more than few stitches.
I'm pretty sure those are scars, bud.
Sakazuki was obviously in some discomfort after Vista and Marco's attack, but was still able to reform effectively.
A scar seems like a pretty reasonable outcome to me.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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I'm pretty sure those are scars, bud.
Sakazuki was obviously in some discomfort after Vista and Marco's attack, but was still able to reform effectively.
A scar seems like a pretty reasonable outcome to me.
Mhm… now that I'm looking closely, they do seem like scars.
However, the artwork does not match up. Look here.
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Do you see? Two cuts, one exactly on the neck line, and the other, a little below his shoulder.
Now, the other picture…
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One scar, that below his neck, is a little lower than it should be, considering Vista's slash. There are no visible scars, nor other wounds on the tatoo, where Marco struck. And considering it's a rather intricate design, a scar would be visible.
So yeah, it is my opinion that those scars were given to him before he became Logia user, or before he learned how to negate haki attacks. Most certainly not during the war.
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Those aren't stitches. You can see the same lines on his neck, chest, abs, arm, palm and forehead. And what do you know, Kizaru also has "stitches" on his neck, forehead, palm, even his collar. Even that poor elephant has "stitches".
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Mhm… now that I'm looking closely, they do seem like scars.
However, the artwork does not match up. Look here.
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2011/07/22/o/read4e298b9d3ebba/One_Piece_574_07.png
Do you see? Two cuts, one exactly on the neck line, and the other, a little below his shoulder.
Now, the other picture…
! [http://img.batoto.net/comics/2011/07/08/o/read4e172a69ad8e1/592 MANGARULE_one-piece-v60-1494e172a69d6d1a.png](http://img.batoto.net/comics/2011/07/08/o/read4e172a69ad8e1/592 MANGARULE_one-piece-v60-1494e172a69d6d1a.png)
One scar, that below his neck, is a little lower than it should be, considering Vista's slash. There are no visible scars, nor other wounds on the tatoo, where Marco struck. And considering it's a rather intricate design, a scar would be visible.
So yeah, it is my opinion that those scars were given to him before he became Logia user, or before he learned how to negate haki attacks. Most certainly not during the war.
We only ever see him taking the wounds in magma form, which doesn't necessarily match up exactly to his usual form.
He received wounds from the WB's around the collarbone area, and after the war he has scars around that area.
It's not something that really needs to be over thought, or even really matters.
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Those aren't stitches. You can see the same lines on his neck, chest, abs, arm, palm and forehead. And what do you know, Kizaru also has "stitches" on his neck, forehead, palm, even his collar. Even that poor elephant has "stitches".
Yeah, that's what I initialy thought, but people insisted that those are scars/stiched… I do not claim to be an expert on artwork, you know?
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
We only ever see him taking the wounds in magma form, which doesn't necessarily match up exactly to his usual form.
He received wounds from the WB's around the collarbone area, and after the war he has scars around that area.
It's not something that really needs to be over thought, or even really matters.
Well, it kinda does, because it changes our perception of effectivity of that attack from "not effective at all" to "effective, but not as good".
I gravitate towards the former, to be honest.
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Yeah, that's what I initialy thought, but people insisted that those are scars/stiched… I do not claim to be an expert on artwork, you know?
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Well, it kinda does, because it changes our perception of effectivity of that attack from "not effective at all" to "effective, but not as good".
I gravitate towards the former, to be honest.
Yeah, but then there's the fact that you seem completely unable to look at Sakazuki objectively.
I'm not surprised that you're over-thinking whether he ended up with a scar from that attack or not.
It's pretty clear that the attack was at least a little effective for sure, judging by Akainu's grimace and comment about facing haki users.
Him ending up with a pretty small scar from an attack that did minor damage isn't a big deal at all.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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Yeah, but then there's the fact that you seem completely unable to look at Sakazuki objectively.
I'm not surprised that you're over-thinking whether he ended up with a scar from that attack or not.
It's pretty clear that the attack was at least a little effective for sure, judging by Akainu's grimace and comment about facing haki users.
Him ending up with a pretty small scar from an attack that did minor damage isn't a big deal at all.
Already told you that I'm biased
And unable to let things go. But you are right. This discussion is getting kinda ridicoulus, and we won't see if either side is correct for years to come, because I don't expect Sakazuki to take the field in a long time.
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Already told you that I'm biased
And unable to let things go. But you are right. This discussion is getting kinda ridicoulus, and we won't see if either side is correct for years to come, because I don't expect Sakazuki to take the field in a long time.
I doubt the origin of the scars will ever be referred to tbh.
Just one of those things you can interpret your own way.
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Rob, it sounds to me like you're overthinking it, trying to assign some vague scar-ish looking thing that isn't even really in the right spot anyway to an attack that you want to believe hurt him.
I'm on Darth's side here. Whatever grimace Akainu made was probably the same kind of thing that Luffy does when repelling/taking an attack that ultimately leaves him unscarred as well.
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Rob, it sounds to me like you're overthinking it, trying to assign some vague scar-ish looking thing that isn't even really in the right spot anyway to an attack that you want to believe hurt him.
I'm on Darth's side here. Whatever grimace Akainu made was probably the same kind of thing that Luffy does when repelling/taking an attack that ultimately leaves him unscarred as well.
I don't really want it to go either way lol.
I'm just going with the fact that Oda doesn't generally give a character something like a scar without some kind of meaning behind it.
We saw him take an apparently kind of effective attack in the same kind of area as he has been shown to have a scar.
It's not the wildest theory to put the two together.
Although, as I've said a few times, it ultimately doesn't matter. It's just a little easter egg that'll have no real relevance and never be stated to have been given to Sakazuki by x, y or z.
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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I don't really want it to go either way lol.
I'm just going with the fact that Oda doesn't generally give a character something like a scar without some kind of meaning behind it.
We saw him take an apparently kind of effective attack in the same kind of area as he has been shown to have a scar.
It's not the wildest theory to put the two together.
Although, as I've said a few times, it ultimately doesn't matter. It's just a little easter egg that'll have no real relevance and never be stated to have been given to Sakazuki by x, y or z.
Already told you that I'm biased
And unable to let things go. But you are right. This discussion is getting kinda ridicoulus, and we won't see if either side is correct for years to come, because I don't expect Sakazuki to take the field in a long time.
Anyway the guy who injured Akainu made a big mistake. With these scars, he only increased his sexyness…
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_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
I want to believe too big guy3ds code friend:0404-6254-1866
