baseless statement =/= baseless opinion.
atleast my post didnt (try to) turn the discussion back to square one.
Yea… more like... rectangle negative one!!
baseless statement =/= baseless opinion.
atleast my post didnt (try to) turn the discussion back to square one.
Yea… more like... rectangle negative one!!
@Lobster:
Yea… more like... rectangle negative one!!
LPS attacks: causes 0 dmg
Gorlom suffers affliction: confusion.
Mario appears:
(couldnt find the jean-luc pic)
I don't think Garp is THAT powerful. I don't doubt he was a force to be reckoned back on the old days, just like I bet that Whitebeard could have been more powerful before being slashed or whatever that happened to almost dead by Roger, but I think that Luffy's fear is more of a psychological thing. I'm just saying that even if Luffy was actually stronger than Garp (Wich I doubt), he still wouldn't hestitate to escape from the intimidatory figure that Garp represents in his mind, and about the other Straw Hats, it does make sense that they would be worried if their dumb, almost fearless leader sunndely got panicked so much at the mere presence of an enigmatic figure with power (In this case being a Vice-Admiral) like Garp. Besides, Garp is the freakin father of Dragon, that's enough to make people like Nami, Robin, Sanji and perhaps even Zoro to fear him.
I don't think that lifting a frickin giant cannonball which is bigger than a frickin big ship is a "psychological" force , the guy was about to kill them all with one hit .
The worst part is him saying that with that level of strength he is weaker than what he was in the past .
Sure luffy is afraid of him but the power gap between him and the strawhats is real , it's not in"luffy's mind" .
People should stop thinking that the cp9 is the highest level of strength in the OPverse when it has been hinted that the next level is in the New World .
The only warlord lucci can hope to beat is crocodile due to his exploitable weakness , the 6 others don't have the same weakness nor the same DF power .
Stop overestimating lucci , being able to beat one warlord doesn't mean that he can beat the whole group especially when one of them can make him kill himself without effort .
So, okay, I think we've established Lucchi could beat Crocodile. End point unless someone has new evidence.
The question is how big of a gap is there between Crocodile and the other Shichibukai?
I agree, probably he couldn't beat Garp becuase let's face it, Garp is pretty damn powerful if what we've seen is any indication. But there's no point carrying on the debate if people are just going to say 'he can't beat them because the World government can't go up against the Shichibukai.'
That's like me saying 'I can't bitchslap a mod in real life because they're a higher level on the board'. Agreed, as a whole the Shichibukai are incredibly powerful, probably a match for the WG, but that doesn't mean individual members of CP9 couldn't go up against individual members of the Shichibukai and win.
I think it's really impossible to say unless they actually fought, because you know how Oda tends to work. Lucchi flattened Luffy first time around. Then Luffy came back in a couple of episodes and not only held his own but beat Lucchi.
What's to say Oda would have the Shichibukai and CP9 fight head on? We need to be specific here.
So, okay, I think we've established Lucchi could beat Crocodile. End point unless someone has new evidence.
The question is how big of a gap is there between Crocodile and the other Shichibukai?
I agree, probably he couldn't beat Garp becuase let's face it, Garp is pretty damn powerful if what we've seen is any indication. But there's no point carrying on the debate if people are just going to say 'he can't beat them because the World government can't go up against the Shichibukai.'
That's like me saying 'I can't bitchslap a mod in real life because they're a higher level on the board'. Agreed, as a whole the Shichibukai are incredibly powerful, probably a match for the WG, but that doesn't mean individual members of CP9 couldn't go up against individual members of the Shichibukai and win.
I think it's really impossible to say unless they actually fought, because you know how Oda tends to work. Lucchi flattened Luffy first time around. Then Luffy came back in a couple of episodes and not only held his own but beat Lucchi.
What's to say Oda would have the Shichibukai and CP9 fight head on? We need to be specific here.
You know, I think somebody should ask Oda if Lucci could beat Crocodile XP in an SBS
@Kitsune::
You know, I think somebody should ask Oda if Lucci could beat Crocodile XP in an SBS
I think it's obvious really. I mean, Luffy figured it out, and don't forget that Lucchi worked out the connection between Franky and Iceburg AND figured out how Luffy's Gear Second worked. So he's obviously pretty damn smart.
Having said that, Oda works in mysterious ways.
I think it's obvious really. I mean, Luffy figured it out, and don't forget that Lucchi worked out the connection between Franky and Iceburg AND figured out how Luffy's Gear Second worked. So he's obviously pretty damn smart.
Having said that, Oda works in mysterious ways.
Oh, no, I agree completely. Lucci would wipe the floor with crocodile….sort of.....maybe....but he'd still win.....I just want to see what Oda would say.
Yes, it would be interesting.
I really think the only one who'd know who could beat who is Oda himself.
Yes, it would be interesting.
I really think the only one who'd know who could beat who is Oda himself.
Indeed ^^
Although I really do think that no villian so far could beat Eneru, that's something only Luffy could do XP
Well Moria might be able to since even Enel had a shadow so if he went into sunlight… you get the picture. And who knows how electricity would fare against shadows. But we don't know enough about Moria so we can't really say. Oh and Lucci just might be able to. With soru, he might be able to dodge Enel's attacks. Even if Enel has the mantra, it's useless if he can't kepp up with Lucci. Hmm, but Enel is as fast as lightning but there's a moment of weakness where he reappears. And Lucci should be smart enough to figure out his weakness but where would he get that rubber...? Ahh it's too complicated!!!>< There are so many factors. Let's just leave this thread for Lucci vs the Shicibukai.
@Kitsune::
Indeed ^^
Although I really do think that no villian so far could beat Eneru, that's something only Luffy could do XP
Ah! Now I must disagree with that.
True, lightning is a powerful element to control, but there are ways around it. I believe the 'rubber suit' idea has been used to death.
If you used something to conduct the lightning away from you it is theoretically possible that Eneru's attacks wouldn't hit you at all. Again, it's down to how Oda handles practical methods of defeating an element and putting them into his own context.
Also, Eneru uses lightning blasts. Soru could probably dodge around that, as could Geppou. Also, we don't know if Tekkai works with elements or not.
Well Moria might be able to since even Enel had a shadow so if he went into sunlight… you get the picture. And who knows how electricity would fare against shadows. But we don't know enough about Moria so we can't really say. Oh and Lucci just might be able to. With soru, he might be able to dodge Enel's attacks. Even if Enel has the mantra, it's useless if he can't kepp up with Lucci. Hmm, but Enel is as fast as lightning but there's a moment of weakness where he reappears. And Lucci should be smart enough to figure out his weakness but where would he get that rubber...? Ahh it's too complicated!!!>< There are so many factors. Let's just leave this thread for Lucci vs the Shicibukai.
Yeah Eneru's got his lighting and mantra, but I wasn't really trying to start an argument so I'll leave it at that XP
Indeed. Well, I've already voiced my opinion, so I'll leave it at that.
Also, I believe Lucchi vs. Crocodile vs. Eneru has been covered elsewhere.
Indeed. Well, I've already voiced my opinion, so I'll leave it at that.
Also, I believe Lucchi vs. Crocodile vs. Eneru has been covered elsewhere.
Well, I'm actually quite glad this diddn't trun into an argument ^^ You are quite awesome.
@Kitsune::
Well, I'm actually quite glad this diddn't trun into an argument ^^ You are quite awesome.
Oh? I'm glad you think so.
You do pretty well for yourself also.:happy:
Oh? I'm glad you think so.
You do pretty well for yourself also.:happy:
Why thank you ^^ I believe we'll get along quite fine here.
Indeed. Well, I've already voiced my opinion, so I'll leave it at that.
Also, I believe Lucchi vs. Crocodile vs. Eneru has been covered elsewhere.
Hmm, now wouldn't it be awesome if Oda-sensei made a special where all three of them fought in a three way royal rumble^^
Ah yes! I'd enjoy that very much!
perhaps we should get a letter to Oda-sensei with all our requests and questions.
Couldn't BB just suck Enel and waste him? lol…
depends on if you think enel can run away fast enough useing his power or not…
some people seems to think he isnt fast as lightning.
PHA and Kitsune: "get a room" ... j/k =P
depends on if you think enel can run away fast enough useing his power or not…
some people seems to think he isnt fast as lightning.
PHA and Kitsune: "get a room" ... j/k =P
Well, he probably isn't since he just controls lightning, he doesn't have its attributes.
is hurt Hmph! Maybe I will! flounces off dramatically
i thought the logia power was to turn into the element? how can he not have the attributes? nvm i dont want to go that far offtopic.
i thought the logia power was to turn into the element? how can he not have the attributes? nvm i dont want to go that far offtopic.
Ah, yes. But he's never displayed the ability to actually move that fast. Regardless, you can still see lightning, it doesn't move as fast as Soru from what I've seen…
But you're right, best save that for somewhere else.
Ah, yes. But he's never displayed the ability to actually move that fast. Regardless, you can still see lightning, it doesn't move as fast as Soru from what I've seen…
But you're right, best save that for somewhere else.
mind if i facepalm?
by definition a human movement can logically never be faster then lightning (ofc this is a manga so logic does not allways apply). why? because the nervsignals that control human movement is electricity and needs to travel internally to execute any movement. most likely it needs to travel faster then the movement so that the human can perceive his surroundings and react to it.
but if we ignore that lets bring up why you can see lightning even if you cant spot soru. clouds are generally positioned 2 000 meters up in the air… meaning a lightningbolt will be 2km long the very least. also a lightningbolt isnt just one electron jumping from the cloud to the earth. its a constant (but finit) flow of a great number of electrons.
the most iv seen any soru user travel is some tens of meters, the shorter distance traveled the less time you have to spot the movement. if Lucci was forced to soru those 2km (and we would be able to make adjustments for the distance) im pretty sure we would be able to see his movements too...
reversed i dont think you would spot anyone going past you 45km/s...
its alot easier to spot a stream then the fish swimming in the stream, even if the stream moves faster then the fish. (you will have to assmue the fish is swimming against the stream)
mind if i facepalm?
by definition a human movement can logically never be faster then lightning (ofc this is a manga so logic does not allways apply). why? because the nervsignals that control human movement is electricity and needs to travel internally to execute any movement. most likely it needs to travel faster then the movement so that the human can perceive his surroundings and react to it.
but if we ignore that lets bring up why you can see lightning even if you cant spot soru. clouds are generally positioned 2 000 meters up in the air… meaning a lightningbolt will be 2km long the very least. also a lightningbolt isnt just one electron jumping from the cloud to the earth. its a constant (but finit) flow of a great number of electrons.
the most iv seen any soru user travel is some tens of meters, the shorter distance traveled the less time you have to spot the movement. if Lucci was forced to soru those 2km (and we would be able to make adjustments for the distance) im pretty sure we would be able to see his movements too...
reversed i dont think you would spot anyone going past you 45km/s...
its alot easier to spot a stream then the fish swimming in the stream, even if the stream moves faster then the fish. (you will have to assmue the fish is swimming against the stream)
Indeed, but again, the key word there is 'logically'. It's not logical for a person to move that fast. It's not logical that a mortal could course lightning through his hands without dying. Oda doesn't work well with logic.
I see what you're saying, but I still think it's be possible to dodge such an attack, because Robin saw Eneru's attacks since she had the time to look shocked before it hit. Also, Lucchi wouldn't be dodging upwards, but probably sidewards, which means he wouldn't have to use Soru to travel 2km.
And as I've said before, we've never seen Eneru display the ability to move that fast himself.
http://groups.msn.com/OnePieceMangav-2/volume28.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=17461
I think that he is pretty fast based on that page.
True, but it was a relatively short distance and…
sigh You know what? I can see I'm not getting my point across very well, so I'm going to just pack it in before I either:
Go completely off-topic and end up getting a warning.
Or:
Get so into the debate that I end up going overboard and/or offend someone.
True, but it was a relatively short distance and…
sigh You know what? I can see I'm not getting my point across very well, so I'm going to just pack it in before I either:
Go completely off-topic and end up getting a warning.
Or:
Get so into the debate that I end up going overboard and/or offend someone.
Actually, I'm really not into some debate right now. Just wanted to point it out.
just one more thing. short compared to what? to me it seems further then most, if not all, soru travells.
just one more thing. short compared to what? to me it seems further then most, if not all, soru travells.
I know…like I said, I'm not getting myself across well. I'm starting to confuse myself.
So I'll concede the point to you guys, because I'm obviously outnumbered and outclassed here.
I'll just leave it at this: It is my belief (character bias aside) that Lucchi could defeat Eneru, even if it was just by a narrow margin. I believe that Rokushiki is capable of standing up to Eneru's attacks given they're used correctly.
And now I will say no more for my prior reasoning.
… werent we discussing if Enel could outrun BB?
=P
I can't even remember anymore…
Regardless, isn't anything about Eneru a bit off-topic here?
yes… it is =P
sigh Well, it was fun arguing with ya Gorlom! See ya around!
wanders out of the thread
Oh yes, I forgot about BB XP…I would put him @ posibly able to win, I'm not certain.
I'm sorry PHA, but I am already taken
XP XD
@Kitsune::
Oh yes, I forgot about BB XP…I would put him @ posibly able to win, I'm not certain.
I'm sorry PHA, but I am already taken
XP XD
gasps dramatically Oh! No, my one true love! How could you betray me for another!? There is no reason to go on living!
I must diminish! Gods, claim this foul flesh that has failed to capture my true love's heart! stabs self with 4kids rubber knife, which fails miserably
…Oh...Well that was anti-climactic...
On-topic: Hmm, I don't have much of an opinion on BB, besides the fact he's an arse...
gasps dramatically Oh! No, my one true love! How could you betray me for another!? There is no reason to go on living!
I must diminish! Gods, claim this foul flesh that has failed to capture my true love's heart! stabs self with 4kids rubber knife, which fails miserably
…Oh...Well that was anti-climactic...
On-topic: Hmm, I don't have much of an opinion on BB, besides the fact he's an arse...
Damn you 4Kids for ruining the dramatic tension!!!!1
But I'm glad your not dead ^^ XP
Well, the truth is, I'm actually a Man!
Indeed he is…I really don't like him but I'm convinced he's going to end up the main villian which makes me angry as hell. XP
If you really want to hear, I have a well thought out fight match up involving him as a Shickibukai and his crew + Remaining Shickibukai vs. Mugiwara Crew at the end of the series....
@Kitsune::
Well, the truth is, I'm actually a Man!
:wassat:
suggesting PHA is lesbian or is it a play on nami telling Lola she was really namizou?
:wassat:
suggesting PHA is lesbian or is it a play on nami telling Lola she was really namizou?
That second one XP It just seemed appropriate
:wassat:
suggesting PHA is lesbian or is it a play on nami telling Lola she was really namizou?
But really, I'd be interested to hear your theory Kitsune.
Luffy has a bounty of 300million, Goku has a power level over 9billion so i guess Lucci should be weaker then the Shichibukai.
Ooohhhh, let's not get back to the bounty thin. It's already been said that in the OP universe bounties don't matter.
And…WTF!? Comparing OP and DBZ is just...pointless! They're two completely different shows! And how do you figure Lucchi or the other Shichibukai's strength from something like that!?
I would be really interested how a debate with PHA and WB would end…
Ooohhhh, let's not get back to the bounty thin. It's already been said that in the OP universe bounties don't matter.
And…WTF!? Comparing OP and DBZ is just...pointless! They're two completely different shows! And how do you figure Lucchi or the other Shichibukai's strength from something like that!?
i think he was doing something my uncle used to do… whenever there was a debate about a random topic he didnt care for or thought was pointless, he would point to a random direction and say "north is that way". effective way to end a discussion... atleast when he did it.
its not supposed to make sense.
I would be really interested how a debate with PHA and WB would end…
…WB? Ummm....I'm now gonna be a noob and ask: Who's that?
@Gorlom: Ah! But it is difficult to get whether or not people mean it to be serious here, since there are some dumbasses on this board that would put in something random to either be 'funny' or just because they're stupid.
If that wasn't your goal CoCo2576, then my apologies.
There! Loose ends are no fun.
WB = White Beard. this forums most famous troll… everyone that is suspected of beeing a troll is accused of beeing White Beard
I…see.
I'm not sure what to make of that... Why would I debate with a troll? I like smart peoples!!!
You guys are confuzzling me!
...And now I'm OT again...
I…see.
I'm not sure what to make of that... Why would I debate with a troll? I like smart peoples!!!
You guys are confuzzling me!
...And now I'm OT again...
Yeah I don't know XP I complimented you for NOT arguing with me, I dunno what other peoples is saying XP
I feel stupid for this but, OT?
EDIT: Oh snaps! I just realized it stood for Off-Topic >< I fell the idiot now
Great it seem like this thread will not be dead…
Recently, like about three weeks ago, there was a little information tat was regarding the Power of Lucci compared to the Shichibukai. In chapter 474 Bartholomew Kuma himself stated tat NO ONE would had even guess that Lucci would be defeated…
Check through a few translation, all says the same thing.
This sentence itself is something. It was as good as saying Lucci is bloody strong and the World Government never expect him to fail any mission.
Althought i always believe Lucci will PWN the Shichibukai, no one will ever know for sure...
Another thing is, for those who like to look at the bounties, Luffy was given a 300million price on his head for declaring WAR with the World Governent...
In a way it was NOT for taking down Lucci.. Hell Lucci (the CP9) didn't even existed!!
Thus given the claim by Bartholomew Kuma I would like to believe that...
LUCCI >= Shichibukai