Ugh. I just started getting into this show too! It's getting really good.
What is wrong with CN? Do they WANT people to hate them?!
Ugh. I just started getting into this show too! It's getting really good.
What is wrong with CN? Do they WANT people to hate them?!
A little less than 2000 away from 10K signatures on that petition.
It's so frustrating that CN keeps screwing over their shows by doing stuff like this. I can't see any sense in these decisions. Unless the goal is to piss off people.
A little less than 2000 away from 10K signatures on that petition.
It's so frustrating that CN keeps screwing over their shows by doing stuff like this. I can't see any sense in these decisions. Unless the goal is to piss off people.
Ubiq posted the ratings. Thats the sense for you right there, the shows weren't performing that well compared to things like Dragons.
Throwing stuff around timeslots, not advertising and cancelling randomly are all problems… the execution and delivery is a huge problem on their end, but the reason behind it makes some sense... they aren't doing it just to piss piss people off.
That's just a bonus for them.
Yeah, but if it's really because of ratings, then they would let DC Nation airs without interruption and cancelling them at the end, ensuring no season 2 for GLTAS and no seasno 3 for Young Justice. I wouldn't like it, but that at least make sense because it's not profitable enough. What I don't get is why they wouldn't want to promote the two shows, to the point where they might downright sabotage its chance of success by randomly shuffling it around timeslots, even hiatuses. Obviously this will just hurt its ratings, yet this seem like it's deliberate to me. It's like they want to do a self-fulfilling prophecy - they expect it to have lower ratings than their other shows, and they'll do their best to be proven right and as such have a good reason to cancel it.
Seriously, it just seems petty to me. Not to mention it's a bad business decision, for not using to their best the resources that's available to them. The huge backlash following this debacle shows it has a strong fanbase, and it's proven with how the two episodes immediately soared to the top 10 of iTunes charts downloads. Sure, not every fan that's raging over tumblr or twitter is as willing to shell out actual money, but with such strong franchise there's sure money to be made there, money beyond just ratings numbers. After all, the disastrous CNReal shows that they can't compete with the numbers pulled by their rival stations in Hannah Montana or iCarly, so why not go back to their strength and their niche, of making a network based on cartoons?
@Saturn:
Yeah, but if it's really because of ratings, then they would let DC Nation airs without interruption and cancelling them at the end, ensuring no season 2 for GLTAS and no seasno 3 for Young Justice. I wouldn't like it, but that at least make sense because it's not profitable enough.
they don't WANT to kill a show that has potential or a fanbase. But a show might work better at a different time, against different competition, or during the summer. (For instance, Nick now has their new Ninja Turtles in roughly the same time slot)
Pulling a show doesn't mean outright they want to be rid of it, it means it is not working where it is right now and they may be trying to figure out how to, because they know it can.
What I don't get is why they wouldn't want to promote the two shows,
because they want to promote other shows with their time and money instead, for a variety of reasons. If a show belongs to the network it makes them more money for instance. Or it might have been a show from the previous administration. Or the head honcho might simply not get it.
to the point where they might downright sabotage its chance of success by randomly shuffling it around timeslots, even hiatuses. Obviously this will just hurt its ratings, yet this seem like it's deliberate to me. It's like they want to do a self-fulfilling prophecy - they expect it to have lower ratings than their other shows, and they'll do their best to be proven right and as such have a good reason to cancel it.
No one goes out of their way to invest in a show or a movie with the intent of having it fail. (Springtime for Hitler aside.) Mismanagement can and easily does kill properties that otherwise had a chance though.
Stupidity or simple oversight accounts for things a lot easier than actual malicious intent.
No one behind their scenes is twirling their mustache and going "bwa haa haa, now I will make this good show fail and disappoint children!" They're going "this show is making .7 in the ratings in this timeslot… this other show is making 1.8 in roughly the same timeslot." its simple math for part of it.
Hell, Adult Swim posts their ratings on the channel all the time. You can see that Family Guy gets 2 million viewers a night and a random anime 270,000, and its easy to understand why they schedule the way they do, and its pretty amazing they keep showing some of that stuff at all. They WANT stuff to succeed, of course they do. But its a business before a personal playground.
Gargoyles was a fantastic show that should have run for ten years. But Power Rangers destroyed it in the ratings, so it was eventually pulled and cancelled. Its how it goes.
How many shows did DBZ and Naruto destroy during those periods where they were super popular?
Advertising and promotion is part of it, of course. But results are part of it too.
Seriously, it just seems petty to me. Not to mention it's a bad business decision, for not using to their best the resources that's available to them. The huge backlash following this debacle shows it has a strong fanbase,
is thousands that huge, when they're dealing with ratings trying to court millions?
and it's proven with how the two episodes immediately soared to the top 10 of iTunes charts downloads.
That's good for the shows and the company that makes them. It doesn't do anything for Cartoon Network (aside from the obvious advertising). My Little Pony is doing great too, how does that concern them?
Sure, not every fan that's raging over tumblr or twitter is as willing to shell out actual money, but with such strong franchise there's sure money to be made there, money beyond just ratings numbers.
yes, and money in products they own outright like Adventure Time and Ben 10 is better for them, because they get all the merchandising and ads. Stuff from outside companies like the DC shows may have a fanbase, but they don't get DVD or itunes or action figure profits off that stuff.
After all, the disastrous CNReal shows that they can't compete with the numbers pulled by their rival stations in Hannah Montana or iCarly, so why not go back to their strength and their niche, of making a network based on cartoons?
That's exactly what's already happened. The old president has come back and replaced the idiot in charge for the last few years, since the ratings were declining across the board. Aside from Level Up, which has actual online game product revenue tie ins and so has to be part of the block for a while, all the live action stuff is gone now. Toonami is back on. They're celebrating their 20th anniversary by bringing back classic shows. They're showing Symbiotic titan and Thundercats again (at a terrible time, and it won't get them renewed, but they're showing them.) The complaint of "they're just doing live action" doesn't hold the same ground it did half a year ago.
Their previous president was on record as disliking the "cartoon" part of the channel's name. The guy back in charge gets it.
Okay, I admit some of the rage may be carryover from the previous president, but while I acknowledge that DC Nation will never be a rating juggernaut, I still feel that they could have done so much better with it. I mean, it has all that DC connection, surely you can mine something off that (not that DC editorial did that good a job advertising their own comics, mind you)? I mean sure, they're probably just thousands compared to the millions that you said, but with that level of devotion from fans I'm wondering if there's some way CN can profit off that…I'm not sure how the economics work here, but for the iTunes for example, does CN profits from the increased downloads there?
I mean, I know everything is governed by ratings, but as a fan who doesn't live in the US (and I'm not the only one) it really hurts to see those low numbers without being able to do anything about it. Hell, even if you live in the US but doesn't have a Nielsen Box, you're worth nothing to CN as well. How about merchandises and toys then, I know there's the comic and video game later for YJ, does CN profit off that? Sorry, I'm just brainstorming for any possibility to save this.
bringing back a cartoon after it's been canned is pretty much impossible… ironically, Teen Titans is the only one I can think of off the top of my head right now that's been cancelled and brought back.
saving a show from the can is an entirely different thing. there's isn't any official announcement that YJ has been cancelled which is a huge plus. Now's the time to make a stink and write a polite letter, cuz once a show's been canned, that's when people are laid off and rehired onto other shows and it's really hard to re-create the crew of the original show
tldr: complain now, or forever hold your peas
bringing back a cartoon after it's been canned is pretty much impossible… ironically, Teen Titans is the only one I can think of off the top of my head right now that's been cancelled and brought back.
saving a show from the can is an entirely different thing. there's isn't any official announcement that YJ has been cancelled which is a huge plus. Now's the time to make a stink and write a polite letter, cuz once a show's been canned, that's when people are laid off and rehired onto other shows and it's really hard to re-create the crew of the original show
tldr: complain now, or forever hold your peas
Futurama, and that show that I won't name.
i thought about those but i'm thinking regular cartoons
Kim Possible probably counts. They had a blatant series finale and then got another season two years later after massive fan demand.
Fans responding can save a show, since the execs aware that for every one fan that knew to write in, there are 10 or 50 that don't do so. Now is the time to try and do it.
Not including "non-regular" cartoons like Futurama, and Family Guy… You've got Fairly Odd Parents was also canceled and brought back for additional seasons with a tv special. Like the above mention Kim Possible.
I'm going to list TV tropes;
Celebrity Deathmatch (3 Years)
Dexter's Lab (3 Years)
Drawn Together
Ed Edd N Eddy (2 Years)
The Jetsons
Johnny Quest
Johnny Bravo
Ren and Stimpy
Rugrats
Pingu
Code Lyoko
Beavis and Butthead
Xiaolin Showdown
I'm sure there's more.
But the follow up Dexters, Jonny Bravos and Ren & Stimpy were terrible.
Jonny Quest wasn't so much an extension as much as a Jonny Quest: The Next Generation. Considering it was made decades after the first show and shifted the cast focus. And Beavis and Butthead is so far removed from the original I wouldn't really count it either. 10 or 20 years later its basically a new show even if you get the same talent on board.
And when did Xiaolin Showdown get a follow up?
oh yeah i forgot about xiaolin showdown
it's coming back next year
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fffff nm
@RobbyBevard:
But the follow up Dexters, Jonny Bravos and Ren & Stimpy were terrible.
Jonny Quest wasn't so much an extension as much as a Jonny Quest: The Next Generation. Considering it was made decades after the first show and shifted the cast focus. And Beavis and Butthead is so far removed from the original I wouldn't really count it either. 10 or 20 years later its basically a new show even if you get the same talent on board.
And when did Xiaolin Showdown get a follow up?
Regardless of quality, it still a revival.
oh yeah i forgot about xiaolin showdown
it's coming back next year
Did anybody ever explain how it was that Warner Brothers wound up owning the rights to the Shen Gong Wu, but not the characters, setting, or concept of the show?
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Beavis and Butthead
That's pretty much the only show on that list that came back without missing a beat.
Drawn Together just came back in the form of a movie and is dead. Ed, Eddy, n Eddy had two breaks of two years, but I think that was more because of the production schedule than cancellation since they actually extended it by two years.
I'd also argue that most of those shows on that list were a lot more popular than either Green Lantern:TAS or Young Justice have proven to be.
I don't know Pingu, but Code Lyoko is getting a reboot rather than being brought back from cancellation as I understand it.
Code Lyoko is going to actually be live-action/3d animated. Lyoko scenes will still be the same but the school will involve real actors. Good for France (if it does turn out good, I never finished the final season but remember liking the show well enough during its run), but I don't think it will be getting an American release.
It'll still be the same story in the same canon from what I understand, so it'll be a sequel/hook kinda series.
I really hope xialon chronicles isnt cgi, theres too many shows like that. i like jack's design though
Apparently its going to to be the same style as before, but when they do Showdown bits it goes into a 3D style.
Argh. I forgot about the change up. Wanted to watch some YJ, cause my tv said it was a new episode…instead it was that How to Train Your Dragon show.
man CN are dicks with any show the don't produce. they high on regular show and adventure time.I love them but give YJ some time to shine outside f DC nation and show it in a regular time slot and replace those horrible new Johnny Test episodes they show all the time.
Beyond the ratings, there's apparently some issue over Milestone characters like Rocket and Icon since the agreement DC made with the creators of that line only included print and not animation like DC and Cartoon Network thought.
Beyond the ratings, there's apparently some issue over Milestone characters like Rocket and Icon since the agreement DC made with the creators of that line only included print and not animation like DC and Cartoon Network thought.
Both characters have been written off anyway.
On a side note, I like to mention that Adventure Time isn't completely a Cartoon Network property and is owned by Frederator.
Beyond the ratings, there's apparently some issue over Milestone characters like Rocket and Icon since the agreement DC made with the creators of that line only included print and not animation like DC and Cartoon Network thought.
…shouldn't that have come up when Static Shock was its own show?
Both characters have been written off anyway.
It's probably a question over money from the episodes that they appeared in as well as whether or not they can claim revenue from episodes without those characters.
I'm pretty sure that it was strictly a ratings issue but a question mark like that surely didn't help.
@RobbyBevard:
…shouldn't that have come up when Static Shock was its own show?
Keep in mind that Static Shock predated the current deal and was probably covered by a different contract.
But even if that's the case… why not air last weeks and a new Greenlatern back to back til it was decided?
Green Lantern got worse ratings than Young Justice and the lack of a renewal even before the hiatus didn't show much faith in the show.
They probably wanted Riders of Berk earlier in the morning since the kid demos are better even if the overall ratings are about the same or worse. But this buys them buying time until they can reconstruct the block with the new Titans and Batman shows in the hopes that those shows will draw more viewers and is better where advertising is concerned. They might also be waiting until after the end of the first season of the new TMNT show to bring back the block. The Milestone issue is just secondary at best.
Oh how did Cartoon Network end up like this?
@Money:
Oh how did Cartoon Network end up like this?
Healthier overall than they have been in years with higher ratings, the return of classic shows, the toonami block, custom commercial breaks, and being almost cartoons once again (aside from one show and a small portion of the Adult Swim block)?
yeah the DC block is the only thing i really have a problem with
they even brought back symbionic titan, so
i'm frustrated but i havent lost faith. just patience
Honestly, I think it would've been cooler if DC nation was a 2 hour block and they followed the Toonami Formula with a host, someone kind of like Batmite or something would've been fun. I mean they wouldn't do that now because raitings, but Iunno would've been neat.
They've mismanaged here and there and made some bad scheduling decisions, but given the ratings, its not a bad call pulling the DC block from where it is. The current management is a lot better than what they had just a year ago. (And is the management they had several years ago, so…)
Though pulling their Friday block to Saturday pretty much killed everything that was in there, including Generator Rex. Thundercats getting cancelled at least was partly its own fault for just kind of sucking after the first eight or so episodes, in addition to the timeslot switch... not sure if that timeslot move and all the hiatuses was under the new guy or if it was a last bad decision of the old guy.... but the DC shows were never there to begin with.
Given all that they were trying to put into the DC block, (With all the shorts and all) hopefully it means they're just trying to find a better place for an action block, (just waiting for TMNT to run its course, for instance) rather than just killing it entirely. Or not partnering it with dead weight that is the boring and ugly looking Green Lantern cartoon. (Sorry Bruce Tim, your stuff doesn't look good in 3D)
Honestly, I think it would've been cooler if DC nation was a 2 hour block and they followed the Toonami Formula with a host, someone kind of like Batmite or something would've been fun. I mean they wouldn't do that now because raitings, but Iunno would've been neat.
Its possible thats EXACTLY what they're trying to do. Holding it back so they can throw it together with a whole block of shows. Throw Ben 10 next to it or whatnot with new episodes and stuff.
they followed the Toonami Formula with a host, someone kind of like Batmite or something would've been fun.
I like this though I think Ambush Bug would be a million times better.
If anything has really hurt Cartoon Network in the past few years, it's been losing 9PM to Adult Swim (and 10PM to much lesser extent) since that cost them an entire hour of primetime and forced them to shuffle their shows around. Of course, Generic Live Action Vanity Project #57 taking up valuable primetime real estate makes the situation even worse. Level Up's season finale even lost to the previous Sunday's replay of DC Nation and those were the sort of ratings that got that block put on hiatus.
There's a lot to like about what Cartoon Network has been doing lately; I really think that they need to shake up some of their executives, but CN is infinitely healthier right now that Nickelodeon. Nick even scrubbed about half their lineup last Saturday with four shows that were supposed to be premiere episodes suddenly being replaced with more episodes of Spongebob.
How are they going to do a new showdown?
If I recall correctly they already diffeated all the villans, and I think thw white kid (Not the country guy) became the leader.
I don't really understand what they'll do with that.
They didnt beat them all, the last ep ended with them all fighting.
I'm guessing that last week's leak was just a fluke, right?
I'm guessing that last week's leak was just a fluke, right?
Yup, but the ep info gave a summary
and we're back.
Albeit it an odd choice of placing. But no complaints here.
So they're showing repeats of YJ on Boomerang for the next few months, and then we get new eps back in January. I can accept that, even though I personally don't get Boomerang…
than k
We'll get 3 more eps then have to wait till April, right?
@Conekiller. I have no idea. There's descriptions for three future episodes that haven't been shown and titles for four, but all I'm sure of is that release date.
And as per usual, here's a spoiler filled promo under the tags.
!
! >! So it's pretty much confirmed Mal is going to become the second Guardian, and given various spoilers, it can be assumed it will occur in episode 11.
! And Static speaks, but I can't pinpoint the name of the VAv.
@Conekiller. I have no idea. There's descriptions for three future episodes that haven't been shown and titles for four, but all I'm sure of is that release date.
And as per usual, here's a spoiler filled promo under the tags.
!
! >! So it's pretty much confirmed Mal is going to become the second Guardian, and given various spoilers, it can be assumed it will occur in episode 11.
! And Static speaks, but I can't pinpoint the name of the VAv.
Phil LaMarr was supposed to voice him, but that doesn't sound like him.
Sad to say all the hiatuses have kind of made me lose interest in this show.
Awsome trailer, now all that's left is for them to actually air the ad like they do those damned Hall of Sports awards things.
@Badass:
Sad to say all the hiatuses have kind of made me lose interest in this show.
That's the point Sparky keep putting shows on unnecessarily long hiatues or at different times/days. And you and anyone else will stop giving a shit and CN willl have Just Cause to cancel the show no fuss no muss.
Awsome trailer, now all that's left is for them to actually air the ad like they do those damned Hall of Sports awards things.
Hey, those Hall of Sports awards are the most important show in the history of humanity, even more than the moon landing, if the commercial frequency is any indication.
3 months of nonstop advertisement for a 1 hour special that has nothing to do with the channel that they'll show once that won't even do anything in the ratings. What the hell.
Isn't the Hall of Game a two hour thing? I seem to recall Cartoon Network preempting their entire programming block for Friday and Monday nights for the two previous entries.
And I don't know which is worse; the Hall of Game ads or the ads for that Incredible Crew show that is coming in January. It looks like yet another godawful teen sketch comedy.
i hate all the commercials on cn very much