Toriko II: Ichiryuu's Slimy Insides!!

Sâuza

! Jirou knocking the planet caused the meteorite shower.

Gizmo

! The rain light isn't from Joa but from Ichiryuu.

! Are you basing that off the international scanlator's comment? Cause from the pictures alone of raining down meteors at the stadium seems like a horrible thing to do and leave on a cliffhanger if it turns out to be from the good guys, especially since Neo was whisked away.
! Also didn't catch Komatsu there in his panel at the end.

Nekketsu

@Gizmo:

! Are you basing that off the international scanlator's comment? Cause from the pictures alone of raining down meteors at the stadium seems like a horrible thing to do and leave on a cliffhanger if it turns out to be from the good guys, especially since Neo was whisked away.
! Also didn't catch Komatsu there in his panel at the end.

! Well, who else could be? Mansam remembers something the President told him, and right after he raises his head looking up in the sky and a rain of light falls.
! Jirou's previous knocking might have been a signal.

Area51

! In the end Shigematsu "helped" Mansam preventing him from going definetly wild. He never threatened Mansam to death, if you think about it.
I need translations though. I don't understand the last panels. And why Joa left Starjun go with Komatsu?

Nekketsu

@Area51:

! In the end Shigematsu "helped" Mansam preventing him from going definetly wild. He never threatened Mansam to death, if you think about it.
I need translations though. I don't understand the last panels. And why Joa left Starjun go with Komatsu?

! He didn't. Joa is the only NEO who stayed, and he's about to summon a storm from the looks of it.

Area51

@Nekketsu:

! He didn't. Joa is the only NEO who stayed, and he's about to summon a storm from the looks of it.

How can you say this?

Nekketsu

@Area51:

How can you say this?

! Look at the panel with the dark clouds. Also, Joa says that the other NEO members must leave the area in order to not get caught in the fire, because they would surely die.

Area51

@Nekketsu:

! Look at the panel with the dark clouds. Also, Joa says that the other NEO members must leave the area in order to not get caught in the fire, because they would surely die.

! Didn't you say Ichiryuu was the one who sent meteorites rain?

Nekketsu

This post is deleted!

Nekketsu

@Area51:

! Didn't you say Ichiryuu was the one who sent meteorites rain?

! It's an assumption because of Mansam, Jirou and Setsuno's reactions. The panel with the dark clouds and the storm is a different attack, summoned by Joa as you can see yourself in the page.

Well, Area51 will like this.

! The rain of light is a result of a confrontation… between Ichiryuu and Midora!
! So Shima showing that simultaneous developments can also happen in the history he's telling.

Area51

@Nekketsu:

! The rain of light is a result of a confrontation… between Ichiryuu and Midora!
! So Shima showing that simultaneous developments can also happen in the history he's telling.

WHAT?!?!?!?!
Did you read some translation?

Nekketsu

@Area51:

WHAT?!?!?!?!
Did you read some translation?

! The page with Jirou looking at the rain of light, you should be able to identify the kanjis of "Ichi" and "Mi" there.

Area51

@Nekketsu:

! The page with Jirou looking at the rain of light, you should be able to identify the kanjis of "Ichi" and "Mi" there.

! I hope Shima won't skip any Midora vs,Ichiryuu battle instead. Anyway I can't read any kanji :(

Nekketsu

! I very much doubt it. This is just like with the battle between Shanks and Kaidou that wasn't shown. Besides, GOD hasn't revived yet, but his other holy ingredients are, and the IGO and the Bishokukai are fighting to seize them.
! By the way, the rain of light is Midora's technique, and is called "Meteor Spice".

Skadi

@Gizmo

! There are only three pets there: Grinpatch´s (Jack), and Starjun´s (Braga Dragon and BBS)

Also

! Apparently Midora and Ichiryuu fought, and Ichiryuu lost. The meteor rain was Midora´s fault.

Nekketsu

! So the first assault ended with the 0th Biotope lose? I just wonder what ingredient there was in line.

Gizmo

@Skadi

! yeah I get you. Misread the page.
! Also it seems Grinpatch isn't part of Neo if anyone's wondering.

Area51

But…where the heck did you find the translation?

Skadi

mangahelpers is translating a few things

Nekketsu

! I knew Midora was stronger than Ichiryuu, but for the first confrontation between them to have happened this early is truly a shock.

EDIT:

! Kuribou escaped before Joa's pet could pick him up.

choperman

! If Ichiryu got defeated off screen and they don't show the epic brawl that went down that we've been waiting for say a hundred or so chapters, I think I may drop the series out of pure spite

Nekketsu

! If you think Shima won't show that epic battle in case Ichiryuu lost, you're naive to say least. The only fight that wasn't shown was Coco's and for a good reason.

Area51

@choperman:

! If Ichiryu got defeated off screen and they don't show the epic brawl that went down that we've been waiting for say a hundred or so chapters, I think I may drop the series out of pure spite

! If this battle is just a confrontation like what happened between Shanks and Kaido in ONE PIECE or if this is just the first round it's ok. But I think, like others before, that the climax of this arc will come in the next chapter.
! And yes, Kuribou seems to have gone before Joa's pet could take him.

choperman

@Nekketsu:

! If you think Shima won't show that epic battle in case Ichiryuu lost, you're naive to say least. The only fight that wasn't shown was Coco's and for a good reason.

! I'm pretty sure he will show it but I still don't have 100% faith in this author yet like you do, plenty of mangakas start a great series and head south, I would never have thought in my wildest dreams that naruto and Bleach would be as bad as they are today when I started reading the series
! beelzebub one of my new favorites has taken a dramatic drop in quality lately,
! series can start to go bad at anytime, I'm assuming he will show it and it will be spectacular but like I said it's still got a ways to go before I can put absoulute faith in it
! and a couple fights you forgot
! shingematsu vs mansam
! Setsuno vs Zaus, Kousairou and Kuriboh
! Setsuno and chiyo's match was extremely lame to
! and now I'm sure I'll get a shit storm of replies on how that was all good writing and excellent fights because there's obviously a few people who've shielded themselves from the idea that this series may not be perfect
! and if your asking the reason I don't have absoulute faith in him…. we've been over these subjects 10000 times
! cooking fest being cut short of actual cooking and character development for fighting, the four beast arc, choosing some of his blandest characters to have major roles where the other interesting characters don't get as big as a role (Toriko, Coco, and Staar), still haven't seen Liverbearr do shit etc etc...
! don't get me wrong I really like the series it's very fun to read but it doesn't have my absoulte undying faith... not many series do

@Area51:

! If this battle is just a confrontation like what happened between Shanks and Kaido in ONE PIECE or if this is just the first round it's ok. But I think, like others before, that the climax of this arc will come in the next chapter.
! And yes, Kuribou seems to have gone before Joa's pet could take him.

! This is what I'm hoping happens!!
! and I'm pretty sure that's what will happen, just afraid is all

Nekketsu

! So following your logic, should Oda have developed every fight that was taking place during the Marineford arc? Because this is the same, and all out brawl between two major factions and one third hidden in the shadows. There's no reason to develop them if it serves no purpose.
! And what was wrong with the Four Beasts arc, the monsters getting defeated so easily by the kings? That doesn't diminish that they were extremly dangerous beasts.
! I won't bother talking about this further, so I'm done.

Area51

@choperman:

! shingematsu vs mansam
! Setsuno vs Zaus, Kousairou and Kuriboh
! Setsuno and chiyo's match was extremely lame to

! Mansam vs. Shigematsu
The IGO vice-president arrived with the intent of stopping Mansam. He didn't even remove his nose plug and didn't open his left eye. He didn't want to kill Mansam.
! NEO members vs. Setsuno was a confrontation between 3 monsters against one super monsters. And Setsuno wasn't really serious. So who cares.
! Setsuno vs. Chiyo was interrupted so no problems there.
! The only fight unseen was Coco vs. Grinpatch…who knows why...

choperman

@Nekketsu:

! So following your logic, should Oda have developed every fight that was taking place during the Marineford arc? Because this is the same, and all out brawl between two major factions and one third hidden in the shadows.
! And what was wrong with the Four Beasts arc, the monsters getting defeated so easily by the kings? That doesn't diminish that they were extremly dangerous beasts.
! I won't bother talking about this further, so I'm done.

Oh come on man, How many times have we been over what's wrong with the four beasts arc, how many times has Daz ripped you a new one on how shitty the ending was and yet you still can't even think of even one reason why most people would view it in dim light?!?

when I talked about people giving me shit for this I pretty much meant you and two other people, you refuse to see anything wrong with this series no matter how obviously it's laid out for you, your starting to become the juju of the toriko thread….. (okay I'm sorry that was harsh)

and this is coming from a guy who really likes this series a lot, no other series besides One Piece has me dying to read spoilers each week to see what happens, I mean come on man how many times have we been over these arguments

Nekketsu

Oh, the ending you meant? Yeah, it wasn't the best, this is for sure, but it didn't bother me because it was just one more ingredient research arc. Sorry I missread ryou.

Porcelainpot

! You can have faith that an author will do something if you want to. Shima isn't the best writer, but he's not an idiot, and he considering a lot of his decisions are based on making the most epic, over the top things happen instead of the most logical, deep things happen, I doubt he'd skip a fight like Midora vs. Ichiryuu.

choperman

@Area51:

! Mansam vs. Shigematsu
The IGO vice-president arrived with the intent of stopping Mansam. He didn't even remove his nose plug and didn't open his left eye. He didn't want to kill Mansam.

why set it up if your not even gonna show what they can do? even if the fights not serious

@Area51:

! NEO members vs. Setsuno was a confrontation between 3 monsters against one super monsters. And Setsuno wasn't really serious. So who cares.

hmm… Just about everyone on these forums! and even you, until you found out the author wasn't going to pursue that and now it's apparently a bland fight you wanted to know nothing about

@Area51:

! Setsuno vs. Chiyo was interrupted so no problems there.

YES THERE IS!!!

@Area51:

! The only fight unseen was Coco vs. Grinpatch…who knows why...

and that's literately the only one I had no problem with

Nekketsu

@Porcelainpot:

! You can have faith that an author will do something if you want to. Shima isn't the best writer, but he's not an idiot, and he considering a lot of his decisions are based on making the most epic, over the top things happen instead of the most logical, deep things happen, I doubt he'd skip a fight like Midora vs. Ichiryuu.

He's also very good at foreshadowing things and future developments. I still remember when Toriko and Komatsu paid a visit to Acacia's temple that only had 7 shrines instead of 8 and we learned much later the reason why the 8th shrine was missing.

Or the GT-Robo/Nitro connection, or much more recently when Starjun killed Gido because he was a NEO member and pretended to be on a rampage yet he only gave Cedre a good beating as opposed to killing the other member.

! Also, do you think Shima would skip such an epic fight when he spent 3 chapters with the Sunny vs Tommyrod, 2 in the Brunch vs Elg and almost 5 chapters in the decisive confrontation between Toriko and Starjun, not to mention how he showcased Joa, Setsuno and Jirou's abilities?

Porcelainpot

@Nekketsu:

He's also very good at foreshadowing things and future developments. I still remember when Toriko and Komatsu paid a visit to Acacia's temple that only had 7 shrines instead of 8 and we learned much later the reason why the 8th shrine was missing.

Or the GT-Robo/Nitro connection, or much more recently when Starjun killed Gido because he was a NEO member and pretended to be on a rampage yet he only gave Cedre a good beating as opposed to killing the other member.

! Also, do you think Shima would skip such an epic fight when he spent 3 chapters with the Sunny vs Tommyrod, 2 in the Brunch vs Elg and almost 5 chapters in the decisive confrontation between Toriko and Starjun?

Someone pointed that out about Gido somewhere else and I was really impressed by Shima. same goes for the previous examples of impression routine, which is odd how there are so many (seeming) inconsistencies in early chapters.

@choperman: You surely can't hope every fight could've had proper screen time. Shima set up fights so it looked like the rest of the stadium was in battle, not so we would see all of them. Most of them we saw small glimpses of as examples of what we'll see from these characters in the future.

Area51

@choperman:

why set it up if your not even gonna show what they can do? even if the fights not serious

It was a good chance to show us Shigematsu's betrayal and a bit of Mansam's past. There could be a rematch in the future, a serious rematch.
@choperman:

hmm… Just about everyone on these forums! and even you, until you found out the author wasn't going to pursue that and now it's apparently a bland fight you wanted to know nothing about

Yes, everyone was waiting to see Setsuno, Zaus, Kousairou and Kuribou fighting. But since this didn't turn to be a decisive fight it's ok. And since no one among these fighters died it's even more ok.

! And now the fact Kuribou left before being taken by Joa's pet opens to new scenarios for the future.
@choperman:

YES THERE IS!!!

Why? We saw Setsuno and Chiyo fighting, the first with her pressure abilities and the last with her knife+food honor/food pressure abilities. Then the fight was interrupted.
@choperman:

and that's literately the only one I had no problem with

Yes, because no one knows what happened there.

Nekketsu

@Porcelainpot:

Someone pointed that out about Gido somewhere else and I was really impressed by Shima. same goes for the previous examples of impression routine, which is odd how there are so many (seeming) inconsistencies in early chapters.

The routine one is to me the most impressive, because the first glimpse we saw of it was what, 200 chapters back?

And I just noticed Shigematsu has 3 identical scars on his left arm. Another foreshadowing?

! By seemingly inconsistencies you mean Starjun being the second strongest in the Bishokukai? Today's chapter will pretty much explain it. Whatever, they are inconsistences only while they're not explained.

Porcelainpot

@Nekketsu:

The routine one is to me the most impressive, because the first glimpse we saw of it was what, 200 chapters back?

And I just noticed Shigematsu has 3 identical scars on his lef arm. Another foreshadowing?

! By seemingly inconsistencies you mean Starjun being the second strongest in the Bishokukai? Today's chapter will pretty much explain it. Whatever, they are inconsistences only while they're not explained.

By inconsistencies I mean stuff like the Devil Serpent being strong enough to fight battle wolves who are meant to be top tier gourmet world beasts (and being weak enough for beginning of series Toriko and Coco to defeat it), and an example of one of those so called top tier gourmet world beasts, namely Terry's mother, being shot and killed by a low level GT Robo. That makes no sense. Also normal state Mansam being weak enough to be shot through the neck by a GT Robo is also iffy, such a massive power up between states doesn't seem like it was planned by Shima.
I think there were a couple others too.

Area51

@Porcelainpot:

By inconsistencies I mean stuff like the Devil Serpent being strong enough to fight battle wolves

That was a legend, you know.
@Porcelainpot:

one of those so called top tier gourmet world beasts, namely Terry's mother, being shot and killed by a low level GT Robo. That makes no sense. Also normal state Mansam being weak enough to be shot through the neck by a GT Robo is also iffy, such a massive power up between states doesn't seem like it was planned by Shima.
I think there were a couple others too.

You answered yourself: a Gourmet World beast, a top tier Gourmet World beast could be shot and deadly wounded by GT Robo, and so Mansam too if he's inattentive. But Mansam healed himself in one moment and was ready to destroy the GT Robo in a easier way than Toriko did.

Nekketsu

And such legend got proved wrong soon.

Those were just surprise attacks, I wouldn't call it an inconsistience.

Zp1

@Porcelainpot:

By inconsistencies I mean stuff like the Devil Serpent being strong enough to fight battle wolves who are meant to be top tier gourmet world beasts (and being weak enough for beginning of series Toriko and Coco to defeat it), and an example of one of those so called top tier gourmet world beasts, namely Terry's mother, being shot and killed by a low level GT Robo. That makes no sense. Also normal state Mansam being weak enough to be shot through the neck by a GT Robo is also iffy, such a massive power up between states doesn't seem like it was planned by Shima.
I think there were a couple others too.

Hardly any manga properly plans its power curves, because most simply don't expect to be going that long.And even then, the examples you gave aren't even anywhere near as glaring as some of the awful examples that exist in early One Piece. OP started out with a narrow power structure in where Luffy was originally going to be painted as one of the top fighters in the world after beating Crocodile. Then Oda has an oh shit moment and realizes that the series is going to last so long that he quietly (and drastically) powers up the rest of the Shichibukai to levels far, far exceeding Luffy's strength.

I don't think there's much doubt that Shima didn't originally have things fleshed out for how far he wanted to take the characters of Terry or Mansam. But fucking up with minor characters like that is still leagues ahead of the screwed up power retcons you see in OP/Naruto/Bleach.

tatermoog

Eh, think it's more that Shima has no restraint. He's really given himself very little room to grow if this is really just the launch to the second half.

Whereas in One Piece, there were some definite hints that things were going to get far crazier in the late-game (the "Paradise" nickname for the first half of the Grand Line was revealed pretty early on), and Oda did some nice tricks to get Luffy victories over far superior villains early in the game (i.e., Enel). The only real mistake in "power levels," so to speak, was probably Strong World, and that's not really canonical.

I just feel like Shima has tried so hard to make every next step a huge step that he's run out of turf.

Nekketsu

Little room to grow? Lol, no one should say this after what we just saw one chapter ago.

Smiley

By using confusing as hell imagination powers(not to call another name) and stand like powers(jojo)?
tough the imagination is the one i'm disliking the more and probably will never like it.
And i just realise and correct me if i'm wrong but don't you think its weird that Toriko intimidation always talks to him evertime he faces Starjun?

Essam Ismail

We still have GW, space , Nitro civilization and history, God , etc

Nekketsu

@Essam:

We still have GW, space , Nitro civilization and history, God , etc

Yep. The room for development is limitless.

@Smiley:

BAnd i just realise and correct me if i'm wrong but don't you think its weird that Toriko intimidation always talks to him evertime he faces Starjun?

Just a coincidence.

Smiley

@Nekketsu:

Yep. The room for development is limitless.

Just a coincidence.

Are you sure?:ninja:
It could be foreshadowing something.

Lazy Ass Justice

! Ummm…does anyone find the way Coco is presented in the double page spread a bit...shady?

Skadi

http://mangahelpers.com/t/kewl0210/releases/38485

Gizmo

! So the #2 wasn't necessarily holding back. The eye grew after Toriko's fight. The whole number 2 thing still bothers me, and seeing as how he's still unlocking new abilities just makes it more frustrating to figure out what the line means other than a way to hype up Starjun.
! And the knocking was apparently still in effect? Given the questions from last time about the knocking I'm just more confused by how that worked too.
! And yeah it seems Ichiryuu might be defeated off screen. I'll wait until the arc finishes it's aftermath chapters, then give my thoughts completely.

choperman

chapters out!!

umm… so it seems like Ichiryu is dead, or definitely out for the count for a while before he makes a dramatic reappearance, either way like I said I'm not really happy about how this was handled

even if they show a flashback to the fight, knowing the conclusion (however obvious the result may be) kind of ruins it a little, at least for the first read

Gizmo

I think what makes it fail as a cliffhanger/reveal is that there was no indication that the two were even facing off during the Cooking Festival. Sure, the two groups were obviously were going after Acacia's full course, but no real foreshadowing of the two were going to face off or both sides preparing to hunt for a certain ingredient on the menu, if that's even the reason why the two were fighting. It could even involve protecting the chefs at the festival somehow, but that's the problem: we shouldn't know the result of an important fight without context/foreshadowing.

Guess Kuriboh though is the double agent? Seems odd given how rough he acted towards Ume (and by odd I mean off putting). I dunno, thinking I've finally reached the point where I should probably stop posting here every week/take a break because my respect for the series has steadily dropped and I think I finally reached the point that a lot of people reached during the Four Beast arc. Just really annoys me because this is the only other series I've actually started collecting the physical volumes for. It'd be painful if the series drops in serious quality (though the art, creative over the topness and manliness is still as strong as ever).

RCat

@choperman:

chapters out!!

umm… so it seems like Ichiryu is dead, or definitely out for the count for a while before he makes a dramatic reappearance, either way like I said I'm not really happy about how this was handled

even if they show a flashback to the fight, knowing the conclusion (however obvious the result may be) kind of ruins it a little, at least for the first read

If you have anyone to blame for this, blame Komatsu, Yuu, Setsuno, Alfaro, and everyone else that was at Ice Hell, and Tina. If Midora hadn't gotten the Century Soup and leveled up, then Ichiryuu would've had the advantage.