I think saying they fear them is the wrong word to use really, if anything saying they're wary or cautious would be more appropriate IMO.
Chapter 511 "Sentoumaru and his Broadaxe" Discussion
-
-
My predictions:
1. Zoro is as injured and immobilized as Luffy was after his fight with Lucci. In fact, probably moreso.
2. Rayleigh has a fruit advantage over kizaru and aura does not overcome logia unless the user has a weak will and passes out or is immobilized. I believe the strongest military force in the world can handle even rayleigh aura at it's max. He will not be able to defeat ray.
3. When ray stops kizaru and makes him retreat garp will arrive and will be stronger than ray, in willpower, the ability to take damage, and in strength. He will sacrifice himself to garp so the strawhats can escape. He will not be defeated and were he not protecting the strawhats he would be able to escape garp, he will turn himself in his life for theirs like zoro tried to give his life for luffy and shanks gave his arm for luffy.
4. There is no easy solution to logia. The strongest fighters overcome logias in the same ways the strawhats have up to this point. There is no ace against them except for Blackbeard,that is why he wanted that in the first place. Someone stronger enough to defeat ace and scar shanks whose aura is already demonstrated against the strongest crew in the world and the fact that the ranks as high as ace can overcome it imply that ace certainly had an aura and so did Blackbeard but he could only hit ace because of hisfruit. If you believe Blackbeard will defeat whitebeard you can't in the same sentence claim he doesn't have comprable aura to the big leagues. We all want an easy solution to logias but there isn't.Also remember when seastone was used against enel, he was immediately unable to use his power. This means if ray was using stone no explosion beam would have occurred at all, instead we saw blatantly that his attack was redirected, not stopped. It shows this onnthe last page.
Ray has the rubberto kizarus lightning, figuratively speaking. This makes sense as he is called the dark lord prpbably because he can scatter light, creating total darkness. This is likely why he has t been found in all these years and why he's confident he can hide the ship and his huge advantage against kizaru is a nice side effect like luffy against enel.
Also is it just me or does kizaru have to charge his attack or focus it to get moreeffect. If not he could have instantaneously hit zoro again, I think he delayed to charge it to ensure a killing blow. It certainly seems like that second attack had a much bigger explosion than the initial one that hit zoro and it would make sense since ace had to charge his final most powerful attack against Blackbeard and so did blackbeard. This could be a real weakness that logias have. It has been shown that people like Blackbeard can take immense damage, forcing a logia to go for his big delayed attacks. I am certain that even with no easy solution to logias the top tier cannot be steamrolled by them for the same reasons luffy and crew have been able to defeat them but on a higher level.
Thoughts?
-
-
t was hard to type it all on this phone LOL
-
Lol, you just earned your AP hardcore member stripes.
-
I am addicted I will not lie.
Seriously though am I off base with my thoughts? I've also considered the possibility of aura as the solution to logia but after much thought found it unlikely for the reasons I gave. I am relatively certain that what sets a big leaguer apart from your average pirate is that they can find solutions to logias when they need to, not that they have a gimmic way of auto negating their fruit. It is pods
-
-
Noticed this…
Since the SH beat PX-4 and PX-1 was the one with Kizaru, and there's another Pacifista fighting Kidd/Law, that only adds up to three, which means another Pacifista is probably on the archipelago, correct?
Or maybe there was a Pacifista with Sentoumaru all along and Kizaru ditched his, which would make 4.
-
You are a SHP fanboy. We get enough of them already, seeing Kid and Law would be very refreshing. And LOl, what do you mean you wanna see the SH crew fight? They can't, those weak trolls are down for the count, they needed saving from Dark King. Also if Kidd could "absorb" the Pacifista I am quite sure he would have done it the last time we seen him.
well if they are to weak to fight then they all should die.
-
No MHQ Admirals or Ouka Shichibukai fear them.
Shichibukai know their place ask Moria the only one that gets a pass is Mihawk but out side of him I don't think any of them could fight on that level.
-
I wonder if Rayleigh's actually a devil fruit user
I mean, didn't HACHI had to save his life once? I like to assume he just had an accident halfway whatever underwater path pirates have to take to get to Fishman from Shabondy and vice-versa (and that would also explain why he became a ship coater, and why he's kinda good at what he does), but the fruit explanation would also make sense, especially since Rayleigh's such a monster
Seltzer's makes me wonder if he's a ground logia, but that's just me being silly
-
oh yeah ! I forgot that Garp was on his way …
Garp is famous for almost get Roger right ? He and Rayleigh sure know each other ... -
I don't think the strawhats will beat Kizaru, or Aokiji. I think the only admiral Luffy will face One on One and win against is Akainu, due to his personality.
This^ is random I know
-
Longtime lurker here…
I don't know if this came up in a previous discussion, but does anyone think that the glass armlet that Luffy picked up on Thriller Bark might be useful or important in the near future? (Here, in chapter 486.) Oda made a special point of his acquisition of it, after all.
Here's a hypothesis: if the glass armlet is more like a prism or crystal, would it be possible to use it to "split" Kizaru's beams or deflect them in some way? It would interesting to see how strong Luffy's luck still is, though it seems a bit gimmicky.
Of course, Rayleigh might finish things himself.
-
@MonkeyDMalcolm:
well if they are to weak to fight then they all should die.
Too bad Dark King saved them. Are you reading the story man?
I have a feeling people, I have a feeling that something disturbing will happen in next weeks chapter. Everyone is anticipating some type of showdown between Silvers and Kizaru right? And maybe even some hints at damaging Logia's right? I think before They even clash I think Oda will throw a wrench in the well-oil machine and that wrench will be Garp to STOP the fighting. Lord Knows I don't want this to happen and I know I shouldn't even be speaking it into existence but it's been bothering me and it might happen.
-
@MonkeyDMalcolm:
Shichibukai know their place ask Moria the only one that gets a pass is Mihawk but out side of him I don't think any of them could fight on that level.
Your not serious, I know your not serious, but I have been wrong before, Moria rivaled Kidou, not to mention Doflamingo look as if he was about to die flat on his feet from the excitement of facing off against the Strongest the Yonkou's have to offer.
Edit:My Sig contains a strong point.
-
Probably dinosaurs as Drake turned into one. But a Dragon Zoan Fruit would be awesome.
yeah a dragon will be cool. i checked online it seems that ancient zoan fruits have animals that have been extinct and in the one piece world who knows
what have been extinct. Maybe a major strong sea king 0.0? -
I would like to see a kangaroo Zoan, now that would be a sight :D
-
yeah would hit as much and as fast as luffy XD
-
lmao why're you whining? They haven't been shown to be that powerful so chill, every Shonen has it's who's who of uber strong individuals. This one isn't any different, anyways saying you're going to pretend Logias don't exist is beyond ridiculous.
They haven't been shown to be that powerful yet no effort has been made to explain why they aren't that powerful. I mean this light guy just doesn't make any sense. I'm sorry I don't want One Piece to go the way of DBZ where every character just keeps falling ass backwards into untapped power.
It may sound ridiculous but it's better than just not reading OP anymore…or is it? I mean a few weeks ago I couldn't have loved OP more with all the new captains and their entertaining abilities. Now we have light-man fucking everyone's couch and the only reason Zoro isn't dead right now is because of some unexplained counter-fruit/ability.
I was actually able to forget about Ao Kiji...this time will be much harder. Having everything the straw hats have done become this trivial is hard to get over. Lets not forget that if not for the sheer stroke of luck that Luffy of all people countered lightning they'd all be dead.
This pirate crew has no chance against the other Logias at the moment. Neither does the rest of the world accept for a very small handful of people. Best part of that is we wont find out the secrets as to how to defeat these shit fucks for a few years...
-
What I find interesting about the Borsalino/Rayleigh confrontation is that the Yellow Monkey wasn't even a bit surprised on being confronted by the Pirate Kings first mate. Did Garp tell him about it? If so, is he really after the Strawhats?
-
@MB.:
I was actually able to forget about Ao Kiji…this time will be much harder. Having everything the straw hats have done become this trivial is hard to get over. Lets not forget that if not for the sheer stroke of luck that Luffy of all people countered lightning they'd all be dead.
This pirate crew has no chance against the other Logias at the moment. Neither does the rest of the world accept for a very small handful of people. Best part of that is we wont find out the secrets as to how to defeat these shit fucks for a few years...
This is exactly why One Piece is so interesting. The main characters can't take every single enemy they face. It would be so boring if they were able to just take out the Admirals and the Logias. Everything at the moment is very hopeless for the Straw Hats. It's helping to build one of the most riveting arcs One Piece has ever had. That feeling of hopelessness has the whole One Piece fan community trying to figure out how the Straw Hats will make it out of this one. It's an exciting time to be a fan.
-
What I find interesting about the Borsalino/Rayleigh confrontation is that the Yellow Monkey wasn't even a bit surprised on being confronted by the Pirate Kings first mate. Did Garp tell him about it? If so, is he really after the Strawhats?
i believe kizarus only time he will be shocked is the moment before he realize that he will now be defeated….so far it
s not interesting for him who appears or which abilitys his enemies have....as such a logia user he isnt afraid of any1 and like eneru he thinks that he is untouchable...
seeing that rayleigh could actually hit a logia user is more impressive ,but from such a high class fighter not unexpected...also kizaru is an admiral...won`t be the first time for him such a strong fighter appears in front of him (and maybe he likes the situation so that he finally can catch this legend)...
and his hole chara so far introduced seems to scream..."iam not interested in all this...just have to do my job...will be a quick one...whoever is so stupid to come in my way has to suffer"Unrevealed: Loki/Rocks/the man marked by flames/Im-san
Island: Elbaf/Raftel/GodValley
Unresolved: Weevil´s plan/Joy-Boy/Zunisha´s story/Rocks flashback/Void Century/Rioponeglyph/Uranus/the D.clan
DFWind/Metal/Acid/Liquid/Time-Stop
-
@Don:
i believe kizarus only time he will be shocked is the moment before he realize that he will now be defeated….so far it
s not interesting for him who appears or which abilitys his enemies have....as such a logia user he isnt afraid of any1 and like eneru he thinks that he is untouchable...
seeing that rayleigh could actually hit a logia user is more impressive ,but from such a high class fighter not unexpected...also kizaru is an admiral...won`t be the first time for him such a strong fighter appears in front of him (and maybe he likes the situation so that he finally can catch this legend)... and his hole chara so far introduced seems to scream..."iam not interested in all this...just have to do my job...will be a quick one...whoever is so stupid to come in my way has to suffer"Well actually I think quite the opposite. No matter what top fighters he faced so far, this one is the Pirate Kings first mate. Since Roger is no more, Rayleigh is the top name of the remaining crew. On top of that he was successful on being undercover for over 20 years. There should have been a little bit of suprise to see such a character make an entrance. Not because of battle power or anything like that, but because of the sure fact that he came out of nowhere. Even as an Admiral you're not supposed to run into Rogers men.
-
Your not serious, I know your not serious, but I have been wrong before, Moria rivaled Kidou, not to mention Doflamingo look as if he was about to die flat on his feet from the excitement of facing off against the Strongest the Yonkou's have to offer.
Edit:My Sig contains a strong point.
Your whole crew gets killed some rival…...
-
Too bad Dark King saved them. Are you reading the story man?
I have a feeling people, I have a feeling that something disturbing will happen in next weeks chapter. Everyone is anticipating some type of showdown between Silvers and Kizaru right? And maybe even some hints at damaging Logia's right? I think before They even clash I think Oda will throw a wrench in the well-oil machine and that wrench will be Garp to STOP the fighting. Lord Knows I don't want this to happen and I know I shouldn't even be speaking it into existence but it's been bothering me and it might happen.
well there still the Kuma bot and sentamarou to worry about.
-
Well actually I think quite the opposite. No matter what top fighters he faced so far, this one is the Pirate Kings first mate. Since Roger is no more, Rayleigh is the top name of the remaining crew. On top of that he was successful on being undercover for over 20 years. There should have been a little bit of suprise to see such a character make an entrance. Not because of battle power or anything like that, but because of the sure fact that he came out of nowhere. Even as an Admiral you're not supposed to run into Rogers men.
i tried to find a explanation WHY THERE WAS NO EXPRESSION..iamwith you that when such a legend suddenly appears everyone has to have a expression…but we see kizaru is fucking stone cold..:blink: -
Why is everybody on the "Rayleigh has a logia counter"-trip? We know from Enel that a logia-defense is not automatic… the logia user must be aware of the situation to turn into his element....
Kizaru might be an Admiral, but he only thought of Zoro... he didn't turn his leg into light and Rayleigh hit it.
If Rayleigh had a "counter" which makes a DF-power useless, how come Kizarus blast went into the tree afterwards? Rayleigh just redirected the course of Kizarus leg, because Kizaru let his leg solid...
There is no mystery-power...
-
this is what i think of the chapter. the whole rayleigh hitting kizaru i think this is a special technique that only he knows, you know a new fighting style or skill not this over hyped haki , spirit, or aura that people is hoping is the answer to fighting logias
i also like sentoumaru is cool character, he just have that appeal to me. also the whole thing with the crew being beat up is not a big deal its not like it's the end of the world, so they get beat up you know they are going to be saved by ray and who knows some old pirates might join like shakky cause she was also known for being chased by garp and it seems that garp have been known to chase powerful pirates. i believe that even cant protect a crew by himself against 3 powerful enemies so i think hes going to get hellp from some old and powerful pirates to back him up.
also wikipedia could be read in different languages so oda researching on the internet or specificly wikipedia woundnt be a surprise since a whole bunch of people do it XP
-
@Gecko:
Noticed this…
Since the SH beat PX-4 and PX-1 was the one with Kizaru, and there's another Pacifista fighting Kidd/Law, that only adds up to three, which means another Pacifista is probably on the archipelago, correct?
Or maybe there was a Pacifista with Sentoumaru all along and Kizaru ditched his, which would make 4.
The SH defeated 2 Pacifistas, first one attacked Kidd and Law, PX-1 is the with Sentoumaru not Kizaru.
Why would the Pacifista get to the SH before the guy who can travel at the speed of light when they were together? That makes 5 Pacifistas in all, wouldn't be suprised if they're more.
-
The SH defeated 2 Pacifistas, first one attacked Kidd and Law, PX-1 is the with Sentoumaru not Kizaru.
Why would the Pacifista get to the SH before the guy who can travel at the speed of light when they were together? That makes 5 Pacifistas in all, wouldn't be suprised if they're more.
the SHP defeated 2 ??????? I must have missed that chapter.
-
@MB.:
They haven't been shown to be that powerful yet no effort has been made to explain why they aren't that powerful. I mean this light guy just doesn't make any sense. I'm sorry I don't want One Piece to go the way of DBZ where every character just keeps falling ass backwards into untapped power.
It may sound ridiculous but it's better than just not reading OP anymore…or is it? I mean a few weeks ago I couldn't have loved OP more with all the new captains and their entertaining abilities. Now we have light-man fucking everyone's couch and the only reason Zoro isn't dead right now is because of some unexplained counter-fruit/ability.
I was actually able to forget about Ao Kiji...this time will be much harder. Having everything the straw hats have done become this trivial is hard to get over. Lets not forget that if not for the sheer stroke of luck that Luffy of all people countered lightning they'd all be dead.
This pirate crew has no chance against the other Logias at the moment. Neither does the rest of the world accept for a very small handful of people. Best part of that is we wont find out the secrets as to how to defeat these shit fucks for a few years...
As I said before all Shonen have their who's who of uber strong individuals, this one isn't any different. Do you ignore all of them too or is it just those in OP? Luffy and co are rookies, the existence of those that are far stronger than them is a given considering the position of those such as AoKiji etc
And even though they may seem invincible it doesn't necessarily mean they're, in fact it's much more likely that they aren't. It just seems to me that you're blowing this way out of proportion.
-
I liked how Sentoumaru let his name slip. Maybe he'll divulge more information about Vegapunk/the Marines by accident, lol
-
@MonkeyDMalcolm:
the SHP defeated 2 ??????? I must have missed that chapter.
they never defeated 2
that guy who posted is just confusedi seriously think law and kid may have already been taken out my their kuma
http://neomaster121.mybrute.com
Click above suprisingly addictive
http://mybrute.com/team/107019
join the team if your strong enough
-
I'm thinking Kidd and Law were defeated already. I don't see why Kizaru would go after the Straw Hats first, over going after two entire crews.
-
i feel like nobody is reading my posts T_T, but just wanna know if any body think that maybe SHAKKY might come and back up ray since she was a pirate . im guessing shes powerful cause she was chased by garp who is known for chasing some powerful pirates. also i dont think he could protect the crew from three strong enemies by himself ( dont get me wrong i believe he is powerful but i dont think he could multi task). so im just guessing pirates of the past might show up and if it does happen it will be so cool. ill be pissing myself XD
-
I'm thinking Kidd and Law were defeated already. I don't see why Kizaru would go after the Straw Hats first, over going after two entire crews.
if not for the SHP they Admiral wouldn't have been even called. He fought 4 captains b4 even moving on to the SHP so your logic is messed up.
-
they never defeated 2
that guy who posted is just confusedi seriously think law and kid may have already been taken out my their kuma
how can a kidd lose to something made of metal ????
-
easy just because you could manipulate metal doesnt mean your gonna win automaticlly and kuma also has some human parts in side so i think that tampers with kids ability
-
they never defeated 2
that guy who posted is just confusedi seriously think law and kid may have already been taken out my their kuma
Confused my ass.
The one Zoro,Sanji, and Luffy took down by themselves is not the same one the whole crew teamed up to take down later. Did Sanji not say in this chapter that the one that came with Sentoumaru makes it the 3rd they've come across?
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-511/page008.html
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/511/09/The SH suck far more than I thought if the whole crew got so exhausted from fighting just one when it seemed either Urouge&Drake could have single handedly taken down theirs if it weren't for Kizaru.
-
by third i think he is counting the kuma from TB and you guys are taking the fact the strawhats being exhuasted from one kuma clone to seriously. yeah the other pirate captains were able tofight the kuma too but they didnt beat it and they also look exhuasted to if you ask me
-
Confused my ass.
The one Zoro,Sanji, and Luffy took down by themselves is not the same one the whole crew teamed up to take down later. Did Sanji not say in this chapter that the one that came with Sentoumaru makes it the 3rd they've come across?
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-511/page008.html
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/511/09/The SH suck far more than I thought if the whole crew got so exhausted from fighting just one when it seemed either Urouge&Drake could have single handedly taken down theirs if it weren't for Kizaru.
Shaman Monk is right.
-
the kuma they're facing now is the thord one they meet, they lost against the real one at TB, and won against a pacifista at SA, and now they face the third one,
i don't think that Kid and law lost against the kuma they faced, just because it would make the SH too strong if they were the only ones who are able to beat a pacifista.
the only way i could imagine kid and law loosing is,if it would be the real kuma they are facing -
Why would Sanji count the real one from TB when in the very same speach bubble he is talking about another using Lasers instead of the Paw Paw ability?
Can you explain why the Pacifista goes from severely damaged in 509 from the Monster Trio's combination attack to perfect condition in 510?
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-509/page005.html
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-510/page009.htmlDrake looked exhausted? He was smiling after he nearly got hit by the laser and seemed in prime condition until Kizaru kicked him in the face.
Urouge looked exhausted? Yeah maybe before he got big but after that I dont' remember too many "pant", "pant", "Huff", "huff" sound effects like the few pages worth devoted to the SH.
-
No, I think Ryuk is right. They were able to take one down with the combo that Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji did. That one was destroyed(or at least beaten). The other one that they fight later doesn't have the same rip in his clothes and damage as the last one making that the second one. Then, Sentoumaru shows up with his clone. That would be the third one. That's why they were so tired and beaten up.
-
well, sanji said about the first pacifista that he is using lasers instead of the paw paw ability, so the kuma they are facing now would be the second one to use lasers instead of paw paw, so he would be the other one.
i don't see a pacifista recovering from 509 to 510
also robin said that the combo fromluffy,zoro and sanji couldn't be enough to beat the pacifista
-
ok now you are taking this to seriously 0.0 and if you ask me they did look exhausted
-
well, sanji said about the first pacifista that he is using lasers instead of the paw paw ability, so the kuma they are facing now would be the second one to use lasers instead of paw paw, so he would be the other one.
i don't see a pacifista recovering from 509 to 510
also robin said that the combo fromluffy,zoro and sanji couldn't be enough to beat the pacifista
No, she said Shichibukai. At the time that Zoro, Sanji and Luffy did that combo attack, she said that she doubts that just an attack like that can take down a Shichibukai. However, it wasn't a Shichibukai, but a clone of one. If it was the real Kuma, then no that wouldn't be enough.
-
arent pacifistas just as strong as kuma but with less abilitys cause they dont have the paw paw fruit
-
well, sanji said about the first pacifista that he is using lasers instead of the paw paw ability, so the kuma they are facing now would be the second one to use lasers instead of paw paw, so he would be the other one.
i don't see a pacifista recovering from 509 to 510
also robin said that the combo fromluffy,zoro and sanji couldn't be enough to beat the pacifista
I posted images of the Pacifista from 509 and the one from the beggining of 510 before they started attacking it. 509 shirt is torn and has bruises, 510's pacifisa is perfectly fine before Chopper went at it.
@Shaman King
Too seriously? This is a forum, a place for discussion, if you don't like doing that then why come here?
Really like to know in what panels you see signs of exhaustion from either fighter, especially Drake.
