Zoro didn't do any of such. The only time Zoro used a fire based attack was little garden after Usopp melt the wax with fire and Zoro attacked Mr5 with the fire burning on his blade.
zoro vs ryuma
last attack he ignited his sword in blue flame.
Hiryu: Kaen, Flying Dragon Blaze
zoro vs ryuma
last attack he ignited his sword in blue flame.
Hiryu: Kaen, Flying Dragon Blaze
I think that was just friction between the speed of Zoro's slash and Ryuuma's dry zombie flesh.
Like creating fire by rubbing sticks, only an exaggeration. It's the only time that happened. I'd think Zoro had several opportunities to use the burning slash in the fights following that one. Against Kuma or Pacifistas at least.
zoro vs ryuma
last attack he ignited his sword in blue flame.
Hiryu: Kaen, Flying Dragon Blaze
You don't mean this, do you?
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I think that was just friction between the speed of Zoro's slash and Ryuuma's dry zombie flesh.
Like creating fire by rubbing sticks, only an exaggeration. It's the only time that happened. I'd think Zoro had several opportunities to use the burning slash in the fights following that one. Against Kuma or Pacifistas at least.
Well the fact he named it 'dragon blaze' implies the flames were intentional. Zoro cut up plenty of other zombies and they didn't go burning up.
Just because it happened once dosent mean it wont happen again. Zoro's ultimate attack, Three Thousand Worlds wasn't seen again from mihawk to oars 429 chapters later.
I'm guessing kinnemon uses a variation of this flame sword technique.
You don't mean this, do you?
[hide]http://www.onepiecebay.net/manga/mangas/One Piece/467 - Pirate Zoro VS Samurai Ryuma/One_Piece-v48-159.png[/hide]
Yea that. The anime took liberties with the flame color I'm guessing. I forget if the manga specified its color.
Well the fact he named it 'dragon blaze' implies the flames were intentional. Zoro cut up plenty of other zombies and they didn't go burning up.
Just because it happened once dosent mean it wont happen again. Zoro's ultimate attack, Three Thousand Worlds wasn't seen again from mihawk to oars 429 chapters later.I'm guessing kinnemon uses a variation of this flame sword technique.
Yea that. The anime took liberties with the flame color I'm guessing. I forget if the manga specified its color.
If I remember well, the sword itself wasn't aflame. Ryuuma just started burning after he was cut. Even the anime showed it like that.
Kinemon's sword is made to produce flames and to be able to cut flames, it's not a technique.
Until we see Zoro burning someone else with his slash, it's just a theory without proof.
If I remember well, the sword itself wasn't aflame. Ryuuma just started burning after he was cut. Even the anime showed it like that.
Kinemon's sword is made to produce flames and to be able to cut flames, it's not a technique.
Until we see Zoro burning someone else with his slash, it's just a theory without proof.
Thats just like saying Luffy's Red Hawk is just a theory just because he did it once. Its a named attack and Ryuma is clearly on fire, that should be proof enough.
Kinemon's technique is named firefox style, I don't think his sword is anything special unless he stated so otherwise.
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Zoro is interested in the fire cutting technique, not the sword itself. Maybe it relates to his dragon blaze attackβ¦
Yeah, Zoro was like "Fire attack? I can do that already."
guys(i'm new in this thread) what do you think about "black haki", i think that you have normal haki but you can make it harder and more effective by making it black. Look at this image:
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Rufy stops CC, whitout making his arms black but when he attack him he made his head black. Also rufy vs tashighi in smoker, he block him whitout any "black"
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but when he attack whit a power full atcck, like this to Hody, he make his hand black:
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. Alse it can Be a Oda-san way to make us look the haki, but I think it's like a conentartion of haki.
Yea that. The anime took liberties with the flame color I'm guessing. I forget if the manga specified its color.
Yeah I was thinking the same with the anime, like when Zoro and Sanji was arguing in Sabaody - they always use a blue flame for Zoro and it IS strange Ryuuma was burned by blue flames, pretty much trying to say Zoro caused it. The Little Garden scene doesn't count since the flame used was the fire already present.
I think that was just friction between the speed of Zoro's slash and Ryuuma's dry zombie flesh.
Like creating fire by rubbing sticks, only an exaggeration. It's the only time that happened. I'd think Zoro had several opportunities to use the burning slash in the fights following that one. Against Kuma or Pacifistas at least.
Let's not forget what happened to Zoro at the end of that same arc, shall we. Also seeing as Kin'emon can use the technique/sword, seems appropriate to say that he'll advance in learning/acquiring it where he's from.
If I remember well, the sword itself wasn't aflame. Ryuuma just started burning after he was cut. Even the anime showed it like that.
Kinemon's sword is made to produce flames and to be able to cut flames, it's not a technique.
Until we see Zoro burning someone else with his slash, it's just a theory without proof.
Actually it's been foreshadowed quite a number of times for Zoro to have a flame (-technique) sword.
[hide]
[/hide]
Regarding the second page - it's translated by Mangahelpers (If you google translate "salinity" to japanese you will get "enbun noudo" playing the 'listen' function). Here's the original raw of the panel - you don't need to know japanese (I certainly don't, I just recognize some characters) to see the kanji for "flame" η with the smaller hiragana next to it for "enbun" γγγΆγ (meaning salt - the joke due to salinity) and the katakana for "sword"/soodo γ½γΌγ [hide]
[/hide] While CNET's translations are great and used in most of the other sites for this chapter but their translations on this scene was "Saline density levels" which Luffy replied to with "Saliden City" and Zoro with "Slaying Dynasty" which localizes the joke but also lost translation and the foreshadowing.
Well, you're talking about possible implications and foreshadowings (which I didn't forget) and I'm talking about what we've seen on manga pages.
Burning Ryuuma was the only instance in which we saw Zoro actually burn someone and it can be explained with the condition of Ryuuma's body, friction, sparks from the clash, whatever.
After that, Zoro gives no indication whatsover that he's capable of setting his sword ablaze, not even when he sees Kinemon do it. He just says it's an interesting technique. He doesn't act like he can do it. And until there's evidence Zoro can do it, it's just a theory.
Luffy's Red Hawk is different, because we actually saw his fist burning in preparation for the strike. Just like with Sanji's Diable Jamble. No such thing with Zoro's "flame technique".
Hey, that's not to say I don't think Zoro might swing his swords fast enough to heat them at his current level, but until that happens, it's no more than a guess.
Well, you're talking about possible implications and foreshadowings (which I didn't forget) and I'm talking about what we've seen on manga pages.
Burning Ryuuma was the only instance in which we saw Zoro actually burn someone and it can be explained with the condition of Ryuuma's body, friction, sparks from the clash, whatever.
After that, Zoro gives no indication whatsover that he's capable of setting his sword ablaze, not even when he sees Kinemon do it. He just says it's an interesting technique. He doesn't act like he can do it. And until there's evidence Zoro can do it, it's just a theory.
Luffy's Red Hawk is different, because we actually saw his fist burning in preparation for the strike. Just like with Sanji's Diable Jamble. No such thing with Zoro's "flame technique".
Hey, that's not to say I don't think Zoro might swing his swords fast enough to heat them at his current level, but until that happens, it's no more than a guess.
I never once said Zoro can do it. I've said the instances where the foreshadowing lie. Also you're arguing that Zoro beat Ryuuma by a coincidence. Try and look at it this way, Zoro cutting Ryuuma's zombie body would do nothing - he also couldn't cut his body whole. Look at the following pages after their clash.
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[/hide]
Zoro ended up burning Ryuuma's dead body, not a cut. If you wanna call that a coincidence, that's up to you. As for me there's:
It's been established before that the sword chooses it's Master, if it's strength the sword needed to fulfill it's "long-cherished ambition" Ryuuma's dead body would have sufficed. If it's only the flame technique/cutting then samurai like Kin'emon would also have sufficed. Zoro however, burned Ryuuma's body and earned the recognition of the Meitou "Shuusui" - the same Ryuuma and Legendary sword from Wanokuni where of course Kin'emon is from (coincidence?). Whether it be the strength of his Haki/willpower to create the flames and deliver the finishing blow on a zombie or just his clearly different colored flames or maybe both, he was able to fulfill the sword's LONG-cherished ambition for a reason - there is no coincidence in my opinion.
But yeah we can wait until Wano.
Well the way I see it, zoro has dragon blaze, sanji hell memories, luffy red hawk. All three have some sort of flame generation method, and all three have haki. It could be something like hitman reborn (urg) that they manifest their will into flames. Hell Memories shows this the most being sanji's rage that ignites fire rather than friction from spinning his legs.
zoro vs ryuma
last attack he ignited his sword in blue flame.
Hiryu: Kaen, Flying Dragon Blaze
Zoro sword did not ignite in that attack, the Samurai's wound caught fire after the slash.
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Well the way I see it, zoro has dragon blaze, sanji hell memories, luffy red hawk. All three have some sort of flame generation method, and all three have haki. It could be something like hitman reborn (urg) that they manifest their will into flames. Hell Memories shows this the most being sanji's rage that ignites fire rather than friction from spinning his legs.
You are basically saying the SH crew are the only ones in the entire world who can use Haki to create elemental attacks, that is completely ridiculous.
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOUβ¦.
You are basically saying the SH crew are the only ones in the entire world who can use Haki to create elemental attacks, that is completely ridiculous.
Well, not the only ones. Kin'emon, Hannyabal, Fossa and Daruma can all somehow create fire from nowhere.
We also have McGuy creating electricity. Law's Countershock is also suspicious as he once used it outside Room.
Well, not the only ones. Kin'emon, Hannyabal, Fossa and Daruma can all somehow create fire from nowhere.
We also have McGuy creating electricity. Law's Countershock is also suspicious as he once used it outside Room.
LOL, Law countershock is his DF. He's using AED as a weapon and Law did Shambles without a ROOM as well. Folks like Hannyabal, Daruma, Fossa may as well be using the same technique like Don Krieg where something is inside the weapon or their body. Kinemon foxfire is his technique, same way Zoro use wind and Brook uses ice. Haki has never been shown anywhere as a form of elemental attack.
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOUβ¦.
To me it looked like Oda tried to give a representation to that attack by adding the dragon a la anime, and Ryuma catching fire might as well have to do with the fact that he was a "special" zombie and Oda tried to spice things a little by adding some unexplainable but cool effects to that scene, Ryuma doesn't bleed, so Oda has to show us where Zoro made the cut.
Zoro sword did not ignite in that attack, the Samurai's wound caught fire after the slash.
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You are basically saying the SH crew are the only ones in the entire world who can use Haki to create elemental attacks, that is completely ridiculous.
Same difference, the attack still created flames.
I'm just using the SH as examples, plenty of others have created flames like stated above.
Call it ridiculous, but Haki as a source of creating flames makes more sense than getting pissed off at memories of okamas imo.
Law did Shambles without a ROOM as well. Folks like Hannyabal, Daruma, Fossa may as well be using the same technique like Don Krieg where something is inside the weapon or their body. Kinemon foxfire is his technique, same way Zoro use wind and Brook uses ice. Haki has never been shown anywhere as a form of elemental attack.
Where exactly has Law done shambles without his room? His powers only work within a room.
Hayynabal and them very much could of used flame dials or something to create the flames, but those attacks were never explained outright yet. They could very much be examples of haki too.
I think the boa sister who used flames very much could be a good example of haki possibly having something to do with fire manipulation. She used a match to create the fire
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-2627-10/one-piece/chapter-520.html
but it didn't burn her and just made her attacks stronger, very similar to sanji's diable jambe. Maybe with more training she could generate the flames herself like how Sanji evolved diable jambe's flames to cover his entire body in hell memories, and without using spinning to create the flames.
To me it looked like Oda tried to give a representation to that attack by adding the dragon a la anime, and Ryuma catching fire might as well have to do with the fact that he was a "special" zombie and Oda tried to spice things a little by adding some unexplainable but cool effects to that scene, Ryuma doesn't bleed, so Oda has to show us where Zoro made the cut.
zombies bleed just fine
http://www.mangapanda.com/103-2561-18/one-piece/chapter-454.html
There should have been a need to spice things up withe fire needlessly. Also Ryuma was burning up for quite some time rather than just a special effect, it implies the flames were intentional imo. The dragon image was included in the manga as well.
Hope you guys haven't forgotten that Rayleigh only trained Luffy on just the basics of the three colors of Haki.
Also why complain about the possibility of elemental variations of Haki? I mean the fundamental of the person's fighting style that uses it doesn't change and just adds to it (and only from something physical as far as we've seen) - Sanji uses his legs, Zoro using his swords, etc. It's not like they're throwing out Kamehameha's or Hadoken's.
He's using AED as a weapon and Law did Shambles without a ROOM as well.
Law is not meant to use Shambles outside of Room. If you're correct, then I guess Oda is having trouble keeping up with Law's power (having to draw a giant circle everytime Law fights sounds tiring). Maybe Countershock is another case of this.
In that case, forget it.
Where exactly has Law done shambles without his room? His powers only work within a room.
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Anyways, I think am done with this as well. Until we see others that are confirmed Haki users(not random fodders like Daruma, etc) use Haki to generate elemental attacks, then everything else is DF based or personal techniques.
β- Update From New Post Merge ---
Anyways, I think am done with this as well. Until we see others that are confirmed Haki users(not random fodders like Daruma, etc) use Haki to generate elemental attacks, then everything else is DF based or personal techniques.
Not to interrupt but it was implied Law used two "Room"s to get to Sanji. The initial one that page you provided was a quick one that needed no showing as his "Shambles" always needs to be in a "Room", while the second one needed a larger one. If you want, compare that panel to the all the time Law's "Room" is shown extending and you'll see roughly the same sound effects ("roughly" due to some being longer or some shorter) with the larger ones having a line "γΌ" to extend the said sound effect. I'll provide some (the 3rd page is especially interesting since the sound effect is very small on the small bottom right panel).
[hide]
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Anyways, I think am done with this as well. Until we see others that are confirmed Haki users(not random fodders like Daruma, etc) use Haki to generate elemental attacks, then everything else is DF based or personal techniques.
Law sure needs Room to switch places with another person though.
β- Update From New Post Merge ---
Anyways, I think am done with this as well. Until we see others that are confirmed Haki users(not random fodders like Daruma, etc) use Haki to generate elemental attacks, then everything else is DF based or personal techniques.
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He still does room during that fight.
Room was first around the island, threw the log at the edge and switch with it to get further out, then did room again so that it reached doflamingo then swaped with him.
edit: ninjad
Also Doflamingos "Overheat" looks like Luffys Red Hawk in a way.
It also seems to be covered in CoA haki and flames - as name says its probably overheating thanks to friction
Erm, overheat was a whip, no flames or whatever. Either Haki is on it, is debatable
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOUβ¦.
this is very interesting
It's called Overheat but there's no chance it heats up while moving fast enough to cut walls clean?
Either it becomes heated or Dofla is worst attack namer in the world.
Sereques is using power of denial. You cant beat it with any kind of power, not even with haki or argumentation 
For me Mingo was making this string move so fast that it started to burn thanks to friction. Additionaly thanks to speed and probably haki it gotten great slicing power as well.
I now think that maybe spirit - related elemental powers that boost persons ability exist in One Piece world.
As we have Sanji starting to burn out of himself we also now have Brook who can add to attacks ice and freezing
Maybe haki is protecting person using that spirit-element attacks. I know its taking it far but we have different people showing somehow their spirits affecting fights- Zoro with his 9 swords, Sanji with his fire and Brook with ice. It makes me think that Oda is adding additional thing to some individuals fighting powers.
^ That's over thinking things dude
It's called Overheat but there's no chance it heats up while moving fast enough to cut walls clean?
Either it becomes heated or Dofla is worst attack namer in the world.
It's a pun.
Overheat = Obahito = hito = ito = Japanese for "String" (Ito Ito no Mi).
Parasaito, Tamaito, Goshikitoβ¦
It's a pun.
Overheat = Obahito = hito = ito = Japanese for "String" (Ito Ito no Mi).
Parasaito, Tamaito, Goshikitoβ¦
Ooh, nice info, KC! I totally forgot about that.
Fact that it's a pun doesn't mean it's not heated. Oda does that double meaning thing a lot.
Nobody said that it's heated. It's just a name that sounds cool.
Or are you going to say that Viola's "Hierro LΓ‘grima" involves literal tears made of iron?
Nobody said that it's heated. It's just a name that sounds cool.
Or are you going to say that Viola's "Hierro Lagrimas" are literal tears made of iron?
Funny. :happy:
Not made of iron, but they did seem hard and heavy. Hence the name iron. Same way Luffy's forearm in G3 doesn't have a shape of an elephant, just reminds of one.
I remember Moria's shadow spear he used to impale Oars Jr. Tsuno-Tokage means Horned Blade Shadow, but the way it's pronounced it resembles japanese for horned lizard, and the spear's tip looked like a lizard. Double meaning.
Now, if the attack name wasn't Overheat, maybe I wouldn't think it was heated. And he used it the same way Luffy perpares for his Red Hawk. Fact is, you don't know for a fact that Dofla doesn't heat that shit, just like I can't be sure he does.
It's called Overheat but there's no chance it heats up while moving fast enough to cut walls clean?
Either it becomes heated or Dofla is worst attack namer in the world.
Despite all the efforts CCC put into translating these pages and people still won't read. That attack is actually "excess whip string" but cannon explained why ti was called overheat.
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Funny. :happy:
Not made of iron, but they did seem hard and heavy. Hence the name iron. Same way Luffy's forearm in G3 doesn't have a shape of an elephant, just reminds of one.I remember Moria's shadow spear he used to impale Oars Jr. Tsuno-Tokage means Horned Blade Shadow, but the way it's pronounced it resembles japanese for horned lizard, and the spear's tip looked like a lizard. Double meaning.
Now, if the attack name wasn't Overheat, maybe I wouldn't think it was heated. And he used it the same way Luffy perpares for his Red Hawk. Fact is, you don't know for a fact that Dofla doesn't heat that shit, just like I can't be sure he does.
Yes we don't know but I argue with evidence not assumptions. The poor people watching the event in real time said "A whip"? Not a whip on fire or why is that whip in flames. Also, the building the whip fired to, got cut NOT burned.
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Sereques is using power of denial. You cant beat it with any kind of power, not even with haki or argumentation
I now think that maybe spirit - related elemental powers that boost persons ability exist in One Piece world.
As we have Sanji starting to burn out of himself we also now have Brook who can add to attacks ice and freezing
http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/05/24/o/read4fbe1e9656370/img000007.png
Maybe haki is protecting person using that spirit-element attacks. I know its taking it far but we have different people showing somehow their spirits affecting fights- Zoro with his 9 swords, Sanji with his fire and Brook with ice. It makes me think that Oda is adding additional thing to some individuals fighting powers.
The argument in the last few pages is saying Brook uses Haki in that move. Honestly, this just gets worse at every turn.
The argument in the last few pages is saying Brook uses Haki in that move. Honestly, this just gets worse at every turn.
Well you stated that Kyros is nothing special few chapters before he cut off Doflamingos head so somehow I dont expect you to be good enough for me to care much how you measure quality of discussion here.
Also I didnt wrote about Brook using haki for freezing attacks, if you would care just enough to read what I wrote instead of looking at picture and commenting I think that quality of discussion would get better.
Also to depict situation(hope nobody will heat up over how I will depict it):
Razh uses - "Argumentation!" -
Sereques - "Squeeeeeek!" - There is no effect on Sereques
Sereques uses counter attack - "Land of Confusion! - Bla bla denial bla bla CCC translations bla bla low quality disqusion bla bla bla"
Razh is unaffeccted - Razh goes into facepalm mode -
String most probably will be shown in flames in anime as heat/maybe fire is boosting attack named Overheat. Yea yea I know anime isnt best example but they sure get very basic stuff in crucial fights right. Overheat really looks very alike Luffys Red Hawk and it animated should look greatly alike.
Beside- Sereques - tower gotten sliced but that is no argument really as Red Hawk and Overheat have different properties. Red Hawks main thing is impact of heated up punch. Punches doesnt have same effect like tip of a whip. Also heat would most probably even amplify cutting properties of Mingos string attack.
So I dont get why using CCC translations as an argument holds up here any value for you.
Well you stated that Kyros is nothing special few chapters before he cut off Doflamingos head so somehow I dont expect you to be good enough for me to care much how you measure quality of discussion here.
Also I didnt wrote about Brook using haki for freezing attacks, if you would care just enough to read what I wrote instead of looking at picture and commenting I think that quality of discussion would get better.Also to depict situation(hope nobody will heat up over how I will depict it):
Razh uses - "Argumentation!" -
Sereques - "Squeeeeeek!" - There is no effect on Sereques
Sereques uses counter attack - "Land of Confusion! - Bla bla denial bla bla CCC translations bla bla low quality disqusion bla bla bla"
Razh is unaffeccted - Razh goes into facepalm mode -
String most probably will be shown in flames in anime as heat/maybe fire is boosting attack named Overheat. Yea yea I know anime isnt best example but they sure get very basic stuff in crucial fights right. Overheat really looks very alike Luffys Red Hawk and it animated should look greatly alike.
Beside- Sereques - tower gotten sliced but that is no argument really as Red Hawk and Overheat have different properties. Red Hawks main thing is impact of heated up punch. Punches doesnt have same effect like tip of a whip. Also heat would most probably even amplify cutting properties of Mingos string attack.
So I dont get why using CCC translations as an argument holds up here any value for you.
The name of the attack is "Excess Whip String". There's no reference to fire or heat in there.
"Overheat" is just a cool-sounding English name Oda used because it fit the "ito" thematic.
The name of the attack is "Excess Whip String". There's no reference to fire or heat in there.
"Overheat" is just a cool-sounding English name Oda used because it fit the "ito" thematic.
It still looks burning
Jokes aside its quite alike Red Hawk in ways. So I will be less than surpised if it will be pictured as buring for a moment while attack is executed.
Its presumably haki imbued whip like attack, it would be weird if it doesnt heat up during attack.
Its worth to take that into consideration.
Also is suprising that Overheat name is bit far from "original". Makes my take on this a bit less likely than I thought before as I based some posts on heating of some attacks and fact that as Razh said names of attacks have sometimes double meaning also affecting way how they look. Oh well.
It still looks burning
Jokes aside its quite alike Red Hawk in ways. So I will be less than surpised if it will be pictured as buring for a moment while attack is executed.
Its presumably haki imbued whip like attack, it would be weird if it doesnt heat up during attack.
Its worth to take that into consideration.Also is suprising that Overheat name is bit far from "original". Makes my take on this a bit less likely than I thought before as I based some posts on heating of some attacks and fact that as Razh said names of attacks have sometimes double meaning also affecting way how they look. Oh well.
Why is "Overheat" similar to "Redhawk"?
Why is "Overheat" similar to "Redhawk"?
Way it is executed.
Presumably both attacks are getting force of impact through same movement, putting force into them in similar way.
Its not clear from pages that we have but while Overheat was executed it looked to be haki imbued.
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Also you seem to pick at what I write, later not even bothering to continues some arguments so save yourself time and play with others.
Way it is executed.
Presumably both attacks are getting force of impact through same movement, putting force into them in similar way.
[http://www.onepiecebay.net/manga/mangas/One Piece/644 - To Zero/18.png](http://www.onepiecebay.net/manga/mangas/One Piece/644 - To Zero/18.png)http://img.batoto.net/comics/2013/10/09/o/read52558da5caed7/img000008.png
Its not clear from pages that we have but while Overheat was executed it looked to be haki imbued.
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2013/10/09/o/read52558da5caed7/img000010.png
Also you seem to pick at what I write, later not even bothering to continues some arguments so save yourself time and play with others.
So you don't see the steam from Luffy's arm being trapped by the Armament Haki and being released a couple of second later thus creating the "FIRE" effect on "REDHAWK" while Doflamingo just becomes Indiana Jones.
I could have pick on your comment about Brook and ice attacks, but I let it slide.
Why do people say that anyway, I don't pick on anyone in particular, you just share your thoughts way too much, so you give us more info from where to pick.
PS: If I stop in the middle of an argument is because the argument is heading the wrong way and I don't see any point in discussing it any feather.
Has anyone else seen this?
So you don't see the steam from Luffy's arm being trapped by the Armament Haki and being released a couple of second later thus creating the "FIRE" effect on "REDHAWK" while Doflamingo just becomes Indiana Jones.
I could have pick on your comment about Brook and ice attacks, but I let it slide.
Why do people said that, I don't pick on anyone in particular, you just share your thoughts way too much, so you give us more info from where to pick.
PS: If I stop in the middle of an argument is because the argument is heading the wrong way and I don't see any point in discussing it any feather.
Yup, you just openly proven yourself by fair length an ignorant poster IMO. That "argument heading in wrong way" line is like assuming you cant be wrong and your take is always right in judgement. Just being part of OP threads discussion and reading some of your statements over last few months proves you are not close to being always right. Being bit more open minded would not affect your time on forum negatively I think.
Also sharing my thoughts too much- thats kind of point of discussion on forums when you really want to get into conclusion or at least gain from discussion some new angles and constructive opinions, giving all that you think is a way to go imo.
With Brook it might be unpopular opinion - thing that I pointed out about ice - elemental attack, maybe even some form of haki utilization being in play. We have characters that add fire to attacks like Kinemon and Sanji just for an example, we had Thunder Lord McGuy during WB war that added electricity to his sword, now we also have Brook freezing his enemies after time skip. To add to list we have Zoro and his Ashura that projects somehow his spirit from the looks of it.
Is it so far-fetched to say that beside haki it looks like person spirit - related power can be introduced to fights in One Piece? I dont think so. It can be mixed up or used along with haki for all that I care if it makes fights more interesting.
Its easy to pick on somebody when you dont share much thoughts or quit discussing if something takes wrong way in your opinion but it gets one sided when discussion centers on pointing faults at somebodys thinking.. look at Darth and his anti-Sabo movement in last weeks chapter thread. It doesnt open up new possibilities if somebody is closed for others opinions. I read OP for like 6 years already and I quite enjoy just discussing and trying to guess what Oda hints at and what he has already planned and I am very wrong at quite few occasions with my guesses. Like everybody.
Your take on source of fire in Luffys Red Hawk doesnt convince me at all as even after Luffys whole arm is coated in CoA hardening steam is still gushing out of Luffys arm, its clearly visible. But thats the way you see it for now.
Once I think it was you who joked / put a needle at my line about Sanji using blue fire as his ultimate attack after time skip.
With CoA hardening on his leg and spinning gaining more heat in addition to his fire that starts just from get go now
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he might get blue fire on his leg as ultimate attack going along with his all blue theme. In chapter where Vergo was fighting Sanji and Luffy was fighting Cesar - CC shown his Blue Oxygen sword.
So blue fire out of very fast burning oxygen is hinted at in OP world as totally possible.
Also as I have few more minutes and this thread is for clearly haki related stuff by most- I will point to fact that Sanji has better CoO haki than Apoo who is a Supernova captain.
http://www.batoto.net/read/_/133283/one-piece_v67_ch660_by_mangarule/8
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Here Sanji noticed Nami being scared of something(frozen prisoners)/emotional over something from a far distance- check page before.
Later he also noticed Tashigi being hurt/Vergo becoming present next to her only with his CoO haki(Zoro also noticed Vergo judging by his comment about aura behind them)
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Later during Dressrosa Sanji was able to take out sniper on roof of building presumably thanks to CoO as well(he didnt looked in snipers way before going at him)
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Bit earlier Apoo was going wild at Kidds hideout as he had to make sure there is no snipers hidden.
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So Apoo didnt had CoO good enough to be sure if somebody is hiding around at Kidds castle.
Sanji after being gased by PH fodders pointed out that he could have noticed it before and that it was disgrace for him not to do so.
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After that we gotten all scenes that I posted that are linked to Sanjis CoO usage. So it seems he learned fast, he is also shown to be using color of observation biggest number of times out of all Strawhats so its somehow confirming Odas words from SBS that Sanji is best at using CoO. We are yet to see it being used by him in a fight as one slash from 5 CoA imbued strings from Mingo was not attack possible to dodge for Sanji as it seems. He could have only sky walked his way out of attack that works like 5 swords used at once but he would have to be overal faster than Doflamingos slash from close up. So his CoO haki in fight should not be judged only by this one time and we are yet to see it being clearly used by Sanji in a fight.
Sharing thoughts too much sure feels nice from time to time
Has anyone else seen this?
Its first time I am seeing it. Interesting watch. Thank you :blink:
Though you should also post this one
[hide]Yup, you just openly proven yourself by fair length an ignorant poster IMO. That "argument heading in wrong way" line is like assuming you cant be wrong and your take is always right in judgement. Just being part of OP threads discussion and reading some of your statements over last few months proves you are not close to being always right. Being bit more open minded would not affect your time on forum negatively I think.
Also sharing my thoughts too much- thats kind of point of discussion on forums when you really want to get into conclusion or at least gain from discussion some new angles and constructive opinions, giving all that you think is a way to go imo. [/hide]
Duuude, I'm wrong about a lot of things, but quitting a discussion doesn't make an ignorant, it just saves me some face palms and probably a headache, you been here for a few month now, so I assume you have seen some of the stuff that gets posted in here, I would have assume that you'll know when to quit a discussion and when a discussion is worth of your time and effort.
[hide]With Brook it might be unpopular opinion - thing that I pointed out about ice - elemental attack, maybe even some form of haki utilization being in play. We have characters that add fire to attacks like Kinemon and Sanji just for an example, we had Thunder Lord McGuy during WB war that added electricity to his sword, now we also have Brook freezing his enemies after time skip. To add to list we have Zoro and his Ashura that projects somehow his spirit from the looks of it.
Is it so far-fetched to say that beside haki it looks like person spirit - related power can be introduced to fights in One Piece? I dont think so. It can be mixed up or used along with haki for all that I care if it makes fights more interesting.[/hide]
"Even Blood freezes in the wind of hell" - Brook
[hide][/hide]
Spirit related power, this has only been done with Zoro, was never foreshadowed by Oda before and we haven't seen another character with this type of characteristics, some people attribute this type of power to the balance that Zoro represents (Wado Ichimonji being Light, Sadai Kitetsu - being darkness, Shusui - being neutral).
Elemental techniques, this is a shounen manga, this sort of thing pop up out nowhere, do they have to be attribute it to Haki, no they don't, Oda can just explain this sort of things in a simple way. ODA ie: Wano Kuni is a country where they teach swordsmanship, they can discover the affinity of your body to an element and train you in that regard just like Hunter x Hunter - NEN
[hide]Its easy to pick on somebody when you dont share much thoughts or quit discussing if something takes wrong way in your opinion but it gets one sided when discussion centers on pointing faults at somebodys thinking.. look at Darth and his anti-Sabo movement in last weeks chapter thread. It doesnt open up new possibilities if somebody is closed for others opinions. I read OP for like 6 years already and I quite enjoy just discussing and trying to guess what Oda hints at and what he has already planned and I am very wrong at quite few occasions with my guesses. Like everybody.[/hide]
Of course is easy, I've been here for a year now, so I've discuss tons of shit and those same shit keep repeating themselves like a train that visit the same destination every hour. I'm not saying that you should quit posting your thoughts, I'm not even saying that you should redefine them since its a lot funnier to read this way, is not prohibited to laugh at some post!!!
[hide]Your take on source of fire in Luffys Red Hawk doesnt convince me at all as even after Luffys whole arm is coated in CoA hardening steam is still gushing out of Luffys arm, its clearly visible. But thats the way you see it for now.
Once I think it was you who joked / put a needle at my line about Sanji using blue fire as his ultimate attack after time skip.
With CoA hardening on his leg and spinning gaining more heat in addition to his fire that starts just from get go now! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2013/10/09/o/read52558da5caed7/img000004.png
he might get blue fire on his leg as ultimate attack going along with his all blue theme. In chapter where Vergo was fighting Sanji and Luffy was fighting Cesar - CC shown his Blue Oxygen sword.
So blue fire out of very fast burning oxygen is hinted at in OP world as totally possible. [/hide]
Yeah, it was me! Caesar is gas himself, he removes oxygen and who knows how many more things he has done to his body, but Sanji getting blue flames is not impossible is just something else.
[hide]Also as I have few more minutes and this thread is for clearly haki related stuff by most- I will point to fact that Sanji has better CoO haki than Apoo who is a Supernova captain.
http://www.batoto.net/read/_/133283/one-piece_v67_ch660_by_mangarule/8! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/09/26/o/read5062e1682e749/img000008.png
Here Sanji noticed Nami being scared of something(frozen prisoners)/emotional over something from a far distance- check page before.
Later he also noticed Tashigi being hurt/Vergo becoming present next to her only with his CoO haki(Zoro also noticed Vergo judging by his comment about aura behind them)! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/09/09/o/read504c70f795d7f/img000015.png
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/09/09/o/read504c70f795d7f/img000016.png
Later during Dressrosa Sanji was able to take out sniper on roof of building presumably thanks to CoO as well(he didnt looked in snipers way before going at him)
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2013/04/10/o/read51659f4a9a770/img000014.png
Bit earlier Apoo was going wild at Kidds hideout as he had to make sure there is no snipers hidden.
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/08/17/o/read502e6bd0d1e4c/img000004.png
So Apoo didnt had CoO good enough to be sure if somebody is hiding around at Kidds castle.
Sanji after being gased by PH fodders pointed out that he could have noticed it before and that it was disgrace for him not to do so. [/hide]
Sanji has better Observation Haki than Apoo because Apoo wanted to have some fun and wasn't looking for a sniper at all, but used that excuse in order to make a flashy entrance in his enemy hideout while Sanji who was on his way to take out a mafia boss and was being in the look out noticed a sniper 15 meters above the ground and took him out because of lulz
[hide]
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/09/22/o/read505e0132895b9/img000019.png
After that we gotten all scenes that I posted that are linked to Sanjis CoO usage. So it seems he learned fast, he is also shown to be using color of observation biggest number of times out of all Strawhats so its somehow confirming Odas words from SBS that Sanji is best at using CoO. We are yet to see it being used by him in a fight as one slash from 5 CoA imbued strings from Mingo was not attack possible to dodge for Sanji as it seems. He could have only sky walked his way out of attack that works like 5 swords used at once but he would have to be overal faster than Doflamingos slash from close up. So his CoO haki in fight should not be judged only by this one time and we are yet to see it being clearly used by Sanji in a fight.Sharing thoughts too much sure feels nice from time to time
Nobody has picked on Sanji's Observation, we pick on Sanji for doing poorly in the New World.
Oda stated in which type of Haki the main three Strawhats are more proficient in, Luffy - Kings Haki, Zoro - Armament Haki and Sanji - Observation Haki, it doesn't mean that Sanji is better at Observation Haki than Luffy is or that Zoro has a better Armament Haki than Luffy, it just tell us that Sanji is more proficient at Observation Haki then at Armament Haki and the same applies to Luffy and Zoro.
So I dont get why using CCC translations as an argument holds up here any value for you.
You can't use CCC translations but you can rely on anime?
Damm, wasted my time with this debate.
You can't use CCC translations but you can rely on anime?
Damm, wasted my time with this debate.
Where did I rely on anime Sereques?
Point it to me because it looks like trolling attempt more than anything else. If you mean for Daruma I already replied that scene was same in manga with Daruma firing up on spot.
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To refresh your bad memory if you were writing about this as I dont know what else you could point as your line was silly.
If name of an attack is "Overheat" then searching reason for that name in that attack and backing it up with reasoning makes CCC translation being just translation explaining an pun of ending of Mingos attack, not argument that contradicts what I wrote. If you dont grasp concept like that then you surely are wasting time both yours and mine.
As for you Shadowgreed you decide over what is time wasting and whats not very easily, looks like often too easy. You give impression of person that doesnt like one thing about post and then all of it is not worth discussion even though it might hold some fair points.
Your argumentation now is basically- Zoro can do Ashura, Brook can freeze enemies, Sanji gets covered in fire- because its shonen manga and no need for any explanation. While Oda is master of detail, hinting and planning things shown in manga you just say that it is how it is as you dont want to bother to search for reasons yourself. As maybe then others might criticize you.
I am posting here for few months sure- I posted on Mangahelpers for 4 years before so sure I know what is worth time of discussion and whats not.
Read this page Shadowgreed before you will criticize again mentioning soul-spirit related power having connection to Brooks ice, Sanjis fire and Zoros Ashura.
Maybe you are not bothering with details but there is nothing wrong if somebody does. Brook himself speaks about his imbuing attacks with his soul-related energy.
Either it is haki or more probably what Brook says- persons soul/spirit energy is up to question for now. At next page we have Daruma firing up just as Sanji with Hell Memories
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But it seems you still prefere to ignore even Brooks own words and go with "its shonen, some stuff happens and there is no need for explanation" even if Oda hints at something directly.
So sure, not worth talking about.
Also Sanji doing poor at New World? Because he gotten one crack in bone and MAYBE would loose to Vergo if both went all out(excluding Sanjis already hurt - before fight - body etc) and because Doflamingo captured him with same move that stopped monster like Jozu during war. Those 2 things for you overshadow all that Sanji did in New World. Interesting. He is not rocking New World but to say he is doing poorly is ignorance or provocation imo. He developed better CoO than Apoo for example most probably because he was all time aware of Okamas, same like Sky Walk came as his new skill in funny but somehow natural way.
If you wait for obvious combat power show off you have to wait a bit longer as soonest it will be around end of Dressrosa arc with Sanji fighting somebody from Big Moms crew.
I wonder If you're some kind of a stupid, I explained what's worth my time and what's not, I explained Brook's ice ability with his own quote, I explained Apoo/Sanji crap in a sarcastic way and mentioned Sanji doing poorly in the New World. A large amount of text doesn't make your arguments stronger, it just complicate things or makes you look stupid.
I wonder If you're some kind of a stupid, I explained what's worth my time and what's not, I explained Brook's ice ability with his own quote, I explained Apoo/Sanji crap in a sarcastic way and mentioned Sanji doing poorly in the New World. A large amount of text doesn't make your arguments stronger, it just complicate things or makes you look stupid.
As soon as you attack person directly and not his/ her argumentation you lost whole argument.
Also calling somebody on looking stupid is most of time because you yourself might have felt that way so as its defense mechanism I dont mind.
With Brook you picked very confident(for your) line while I posted page when he himself says that he is imbuing his attacks with his soul power- thus make blade freezing anything it touches so I am named some kind of stupid and your page for you holds more value somehow. Brooks quote you used is not even comparable to explanation by Brook that I shown.
Complicating things with a lot of text as you say is backing up your statements with argumentation. Now I surely do wonder if that concept is lost to you or something. Next time you will think twice before pointing at me with irony as it might bite you yourself same as here.
Some posts before I added some pages with Sanji usage of CoO since time skip because I wanted to share what I observed in manga as this thread is here for that- General Haki Discussion - and to slightly change direction of discussion as it seems that even with all points and finally with Brook explaining a bit of spirit/ soul relation of ice attacks some people didnt wanted to understand stuff. So I dont know how pointing out Sanjis poor showing(in your opinion) adds up to what I posted about CoO usage.
I that most people post here to share thoughts and get better understanding of some stuff that happened or is happening in manga.
Where did I rely on anime Sereques?
Point it to me because it looks like trolling attempt more than anything else. If you mean for Daruma I already replied that scene was same in manga with Daruma firing up on spot.
! http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/05/11/o/read4face6da67696/img000011.png
To refresh your bad memory if you were writing about this as I dont know what else you could point as your line was silly.If name of an attack is "Overheat" then searching reason for that name in that attack and backing it up with reasoning makes CCC translation being just translation explaining an pun of ending of Mingos attack, not argument that contradicts what I wrote. If you dont grasp concept like that then you surely are wasting time both yours and mine.
String most probably will be shown in flames in anime as heat/maybe fire is boosting attack named Overheat. Yea yea I know anime isnt best example but they sure get very basic stuff in crucial fights right. Overheat really looks very alike Luffys Red Hawk and it animated should look greatly alike.
Beside- Sereques - tower gotten sliced but that is no argument really as Red Hawk and Overheat have different properties. Red Hawks main thing is impact of heated up punch. Punches doesnt have same effect like tip of a whip. Also heat would most probably even amplify cutting properties of Mingos string attack.
So I dont get why using CCC translations as an argument holds up here any value for you.
It doesn't matter what we are discussing, the fact that you big up Anime and discredit CCC translations in the same post isβ¦..........
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Read this page Shadowgreed before you will criticize again mentioning soul-spirit related power having connection to Brooks ice, Sanjis fire and Zoros Ashura.
http://img.batoto.net/comics/2012/05/11/o/read4face6da67696/img000010.png
Maybe you are not bothering with details but there is nothing wrong if somebody does. Brook himself speaks about his imbuing attacks with his soul-related energy.
Either it is haki or more probably what Brook says- persons soul/spirit energy is up to question for now. At next page we have Daruma firing up just as Sanji with Hell MemoriesBut it seems you still prefere to ignore even Brooks own words and go with "its shonen, some stuff happens and there is no need for explanation" even if Oda hints at something directly.
So sure, not worth talking about.
Just so you know, Brook's ice attacks is because of his DF. Before you comeback with a thesis, read the two pages preceding that page that you post. Brook clearly explain what he learned from Yomi Yomi No Mi.
