A Study of One Piece Animation

Aldrato

i see. how does it work in a movie with very fluid animation style, though ? can everything be called key animation ?

DigiM29

Well, even in very fluid movies, there will always be a smaller "upper tier" of animators who do key frames, and a bunch of "lower" animators who do in-betweens. The difference from less detailed animation is simply the number of frames you can do. So maybe there are a higher number of key frames, or a higher number of in-betweens.

Maybe this image will help:

Consider the bottom images: in each, the left-most, middle (red), and right-most poses would be drawn by higher key animators, and would be called "key frames". Then other lower animators would draw the "in-between" frames that go between the key frames – in this case, the second and fourth poses. In the animation field, they nickname this "tweening".

The in-between frames may be similar quality or poorer to the key frames -- but the more key frames, usually the better the art can be. So a movie can have more key frames. But sometimes, it's just too expensive to do that, so a movie can have a lot of in-betweens, too.

Aldrato

i see, i see. thank you all for the explanations, very appreciated

ARC-1300

@DigiM29:

Well, even in very fluid movies, there will always be a smaller "upper tier" of animators who do key frames, and a bunch of "lower" animators who do in-betweens. The difference from less detailed animation is simply the number of frames you can do. So maybe there are a higher number of key frames, or a higher number of in-betweens.

Maybe this image will help:

http://i54.tinypic.com/ws1wgn.png

Consider the bottom images: in each, the left-most, middle (red), and right-most poses would be drawn by higher key animators, and would be called "key frames". Then other lower animators would draw the "in-between" frames that go between the key frames – in this case, the second and fourth poses. In the animation field, they nickname this "tweening".

The in-between frames may be similar quality or poorer to the key frames -- but the more key frames, usually the better the art can be. So a movie can have more key frames. But sometimes, it's just too expensive to do that, so a movie can have a lot of in-betweens, too.

very educational stuff thanks for posting it :)

dawwe

I just wanted to say that this is a really great and informative thread. I'm gonna say my favorite animator is probably Tate but Inoue is great too, hoping to see some work from them. Sure there are some other great animators on this show but I just really like the way Tate handles fight scenes. I was looking over this picture and realized something funny, our great Oda forgot to draw Sanji's right arm.

!

And on another note I kinda "fixed" a picture posted earlier in the thread so it's easier to read, but I take no credit since I mostly just pasted names into the picture.

!

BucketheadFan23

Cool list. My personal favorite animator for each character from that list would be like this:

Jet Gatling

Wow, pardon my noobness if it shows, but when was the last time we've seen an episode made by Koizumi?

Yonkou255

I love how Nami Looks as drawn by Kenji Yokoyama! She looks really pretty!

Crossword

@Jet:

Wow, pardon my noobness if it shows, but when was the last time we've seen an episode made by Koizumi?

Not since part of Nami vs. Kalifa I think.

kaizokuo12

So, who did the animation for Gigant battle 2? I'm guessing Hisada!

XMURADX

So the nice scenes in #516 were the work of Ken'ichi Fujisawa…Awesome!!! I'm glad he is back!
The Zoro/Sanji scene was probably him!

I hope we see more from him soon.

JulieYBM

. I think it just ruined my chances of enjoying the animation for We go! Well, here's hoping We go! can look this awesome!

Crossword

Hm, looks like Shida had some work to do.

XMURADX

Watching it again, I think Shida did the part from 1:05 - 1:12 only. Lot's of great animators worked on the opening, it seems. Wonder if there is any list somewhere.

Shida also worked on the Gigant Battle 2 teaser as well. It's the part with Luffy in G2 and cut of Zoro right after, judging by the crappy quality.

I really hope the opening is better than this(But I'm keeping my expectations really low, since it's Toei after all), cause it will be a shame if it's not, specially since the current one was clearly low budgeted.

JulieYBM

Hopefully the animation staff will be listed in the credits of Ultimate Blast.

I have to say, I loved getting to see Super Saiyan 3 Gokuu in animation again. It's the first time since 2003, I think.

Conekiller

@dawwe:

And on another note I kinda "fixed" a picture posted earlier in the thread so it's easier to read, but I take no credit since I mostly just pasted names into the picture.

! [qimg]http://i56.tinypic.com/5wxg8o.png[/qimg]

Is there a larger version of this available?

Crossword

I've been wondering who did the Zoro vs. Baboon fight in 509, and it seems to be Kuroyanagi. Interesting.

Anyway, in the interest of being as thorough (haha) as possible, I've added Nami and Franky to Kawamura's post, as well as gotten a better Chopper for Deguchi's. That'll probably be my last cap update for the pre-timeskip episodes. As usual, follow this link if you wanna take a peak.

Trying to get a good shot that's in-between a character's lip flaps is such a pain.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

It just occured to me that it might be difficult getting a new full Straw Hat set for Hisada since he doesn't do as many episodes anymore as he used to. Oh boy.

XMURADX

@Crossword:

I've been wondering who did the Zoro vs. Baboon fight in 509, and it seems to be Kuroyanagi. Interesting.

Really, which part? I've watched it a lot, but I couldn't pin down his scene, so I assumed he have done a long talking scene, probably around the Brook part.

Crossword

That's because it's late, I need to go to bed, and I was looking at the wrong set of credits >< (50_6, not 509). So it's back to square one. The only ''special'' animators in the credits apart from Tate are Shuichi Ito and Naohiro Shintani.

There were a lot of individual named animators for that episode at any rate (14 compared to say, 516's five), and a couple foreign names too. How many Alfreds do you normally see working on anime production?

XMURADX

@Crossword:

That's because it's late, I need to go to bed, and I was looking at the wrong set of credits >< (50_6, not 509). So it's back to square one. The only ''special'' animators in the credits apart from Tate are Shuichi Ito and Naohiro Shintani.

There were a lot of individual named animators for that episode at any rate (14 compared to say, 516's five), and a couple foreign names too. How many Alfreds do you normally see working on anime production?

lol, no problem. Also, didn't I post about Shintani doing the Zoro Vs. Baboons in 506? or probably I just did it on twitter.

BTW, some parts of the fight looks Tateish, which caused me a lot of confusion at first, but I'm waiting for the next Shintani episode to confirm.

Not much, it's mostly in the talking episodes.

JulieYBM

@Crossword:

That's because it's late, I need to go to bed, and I was looking at the wrong set of credits >< (50_6, not 509). So it's back to square one. The only ''special'' animators in the credits apart from Tate are Shuichi Ito and Naohiro Shintani.

There were a lot of individual named animators for that episode at any rate (14 compared to say, 516's five), and a couple foreign names too. How many Alfreds do you normally see working on anime production?

Fourteen? Are you counting in-betweeners? O.o

Crossword

No, I'm just counting key animation.

If anyone's curious, the full list for that episode was:

! Yukihiro Urata
Shuichi Ito
Naohiro Shintani
Haruhiko Noda
Atsuko Kawamura
Naoki Tate
Yumi Horie
Mitsuo Shindo
Satomi Kamikubo
Paul Ano-nuevo
Francis Kaneda
Rem Valencia
Noel Ano-nuevo
Alfred Reyes
Studio Carpenter
AI
Dangan Pictures

JulieYBM

@Crossword:

No, I'm just counting key animation.

Yeesh, I guess times have changed. Dragon Ball never listed more than seven or eight for their bigger episodes. O.o

Crossword

Just a heads up; I recognize Yuki Hayashi, Shida, Ide, Hisada, and Yokoyama in the credits for We Go!.

EDIT: Ah, of course Ide would be credited with the copypasta from 515.

XMURADX

So, looking at the credits. Some big animators worked on the Opening, I posted the info in twitter, but I'll post it again here:

Yuki Hayashi, Naotoshi Shida, Takashi Hashimoto, and Masayuki Sato(Movie 10) are the ones I noticed and are considered big animators.

What I noticed…

Shida: SH with their names.
Hashimoto: Luffy Fighting Marines.
Sato: Luffy/Shanks?.
Hayashi: Final scene with Luffy running until the end.

About the episode, while I thought it was not impressive at all, I liked the intro, it seems to be the work of Shintani Naohiro.

Edit: Yeah, the intro was definitely Shintani Naohiro.

o-chan

@XMURADX:

About the episode, while I thought it was not impressive at all, I liked the intro, it seems to be the work of Shintani Naohiro.

Are you joking?! That was some of the nicest animation I have seen in the series. There were a lot of great lighting effects, the characters were on model and moved rather fluidly (something I don't see that often outside of Tate and a few others), and I can't understand how the episode can be "unimpressive". Personally, Toei and Kazuya Hisada exceeded my expectations and I felt the animation in the episode was very good.

O-chan

gottalt3OP

Was I the only one who really enjoyed the cup filling scene? I was just wondering how would the Tsunami look like with that kind of animation…

XMURADX

@o-chan:

Are you joking?! That was some of the nicest animation I have seen in the series. There were a lot of great lighting effects, the characters were on model and moved rather fluidly (something I don't see that often outside of Tate and a few others), and I can't understand how the episode can be "unimpressive". Personally, Toei and Kazuya Hisada exceeded my expectations and I felt the animation in the episode was very good.

O-chan

Some of the nicest animation you have seen in the series? You must be joking. lol

I agree on two things, Art was Solid and on model, and lighting was used effectively here. But the animation was just Normal for most of the episode save for some bits with Sanji and Nami/Usopp that looked nice, not to forget Zoro/Rayleigh scene. So…Not great, and not bad. And this is pretty much what this episode needed, so no complains. It's definitely one of the better Hisada episodes.

The intro of the episode was way better than the episode itself, which is a shame. Look at the animals movements, very fluid. Naohiro is one of the new brilliant animators, and his art style is fantastic, it got that soft and fluid animation, yet maintaining solid art quality. And it seems that he started to do lip sync.

I was hoping Usopp's intro would be much more dynamic than that but Hitoshi Kamata did a decent job, not his best though, and Brook deserved some fancy animation for his concert but that's me fantasizing after watching K-ON. Anyway, what I really care about in this arc is Zoro's entrance next week, and the little action with Luffy, Zoro, Sanji. These are enough to satisfy me.

I hope that Hayashi, or Hashimoto continue working on the show.

JulieYBM

I could tell I wasn't going to be impressed in the first scene when Luffy was walking and his sash wasn't moving, despite the focus being on his legs. >_<

Crossword

Hm, is it possible that Sato did the part where the camera pans across each of the Straw Hats' feet? The way that Luffy and Zoro's faces are drawn at that angle remind me of Movie 10's models, especially Zoro.

XMURADX

@Crossword:

Hm, is it possible that Sato did the part where the camera pans across each of the Straw Hats' feet? The way that Luffy and Zoro's faces are drawn at that angle remind me of Movie 10's models, especially Zoro.

You could be right. Also, the part at the end looks like Sato. I'm starting to think the Roger/Shanks/Luffy scene might be Hayashi, cause she is on the top of the KA list, so her scene must be long. I'm 100% sure about Luffy running at the end after the Roger/Shanks/Luffy scene.

gottalt3OP

While the animation was top-notch in the animal parts. I tought the faces were pretty simple, and could use a little bit more detail… I prefer a lesser animation, with good art, and attention to details... But thats just my tastes.

o-chan

@XMURADX:

Some of the nicest animation you have seen in the series? You must be joking. lol

Seriously?! I'm not entitled to my own viewpoint? The episode looked great. I'm not saying it was perfect, but given the track record of how One Piee's animation standards were since Marineford it was obvious that this episode was closer to above average standards.

The intro of the episode was way better than the episode itself, which is a shame. Look at the animals movements, very fluid. Naohiro is one of the new brilliant animators, and his art style is fantastic, it got that soft and fluid animation, yet maintaining solid art quality. And it seems that he started to do lip sync.

I was hoping Usopp's intro would be much more dynamic than that but Hitoshi Kamata did a decent job, not his best though, and Brook deserved some fancy animation for his concert but that's me fantasizing after watching K-ON. Anyway, what I really care about in this arc is Zoro's entrance next week, and the little action with Luffy, Zoro, Sanji. These are enough to satisfy me.

I hope that Hayashi, or Hashimoto continue working on the show.

I think this is the case of setting the bar too high. Look, I've pretty much accepted that shows like Bleach and Naruto have some epic moments in animation, stoyboarding, and style BUT even BEFORE these two series came into being One Piece's animation style has always been more simplistic yet effective compared to it's rivals. There are people who keep going on and on about how epic the animation Saobody was. Guess what? I don't agree. To me the good animation points in One Piece are: The end of Whiskey Peak, Chopper's arc, Water Seven, the end of Enies Lobby, Oars vs. the Strawhats, the Spa Island filler,parts of the subsequent arcs, and pretty much everything from the extended Luffy's childhood flashback. One Piece's animation has never tried to go above the bars that Naruto and Bleach set but still hold it's own, and given all that I do think that this recent episode is excellent compared with most of Kazuya Hisada's work on the series and for a mostly "talking" episode the animation held it's own and left me with a feeling that while this was still One Piece it had more care put into the animation that some of the stuff that came before.

O-chan

XMURADX

@o-chan:

Seriously?! I'm not entitled to my own viewpoint? The episode looked great. I'm not saying it was perfect, but given the track record of how One Piee's animation standards were since Marineford it was obvious that this episode was closer to above average standards.

If you are entitled to your own viewpoint, then so am I. And I thought the episode was good as well, I never stated it was bad. It just didn't impress me cause this episode marks the turn-point of the series, and it was handled like any normal episode, just a little better.

Well, I think you mean since Toriko started. Cause it clearly beats One Piece animation by far. But it's too early to compare it with One Piece. I'll give it a year to see how things go.

@o-chan:

I think this is the case of setting the bar too high. Look, I've pretty much accepted that shows like Bleach and Naruto have some epic moments in animation, stoyboarding, and style BUT even BEFORE these two series came into being One Piece's animation style has always been more simplistic yet effective compared to it's rivals. There are people who keep going on and on about how epic the animation Saobody was. Guess what? I don't agree. To me the good animation points in One Piece are: The end of Whiskey Peak, Chopper's arc, Water Seven, the end of Enies Lobby, Oars vs. the Strawhats, the Spa Island filler,parts of the subsequent arcs, and pretty much everything from the extended Luffy's childhood flashback. One Piece's animation has never tried to go above the bars that Naruto and Bleach set but still hold it's own, and given all that I do think that this recent episode is excellent compared with most of Kazuya Hisada's work on the series and for a mostly "talking" episode the animation held it's own and left me with a feeling that while this was still One Piece it had more care put into the animation that some of the stuff that came before.

O-chan

I didn't set the bar too high, Toei did. The animation style has changed to allow for better animation and we did see a lot of superior animation. Also I don't want to compare it to Bleach or Naruto, cause that's a different studio. But Toei started caring about animation, and now they are having a lot of talented animators, but they mostly don't work on One Piece, and no it's not a budget issue, cause the animator will be having the same salary, regardless of what he is working on. But to Toei, One Piece is clearly not on the high priority list.

Well, that depends on what you mean by animation, and to you it seems that art quality is more important than animation. Sabaody important scenes had great animation, but it was very inconsistent art wise, IMO. The rest of what you mentioned were great as well, IMO.

Every arc had it's ups and downs, and I judge an arc by seeing how the important parts are handled. And the important parts differ from person to person.

I do think One Piece's art quality went up lately cause I don't remember the last time I cringed at an episode since Shimanuki's #479, but the animation is mostly the same with some good scenes here and there.

I still have no idea why you are comparing it to Bleach or Naruto. Within One Piece standards that episode was not close to special.

I hope you didn't take the Brook comment seriously.

Anyway, I'm expecting the animation to pick up around the middle-end of this arc, and around the beginning of FI.

Crossword

I judge an episode's art and animation on a case-by-case basis. This episode/chapter wasn't exactly action-packed to begin with, so we didn't need anything with an absolutely insane frames per second count. What we got was art that was solidly on-model, vibrant colors, and nice special effects, like the lighting during Zoro's arrival, and that's what this episode deserved. Now, when we get to the action scenes in two or three episodes' time, then I'd like to see some great key animation, but for this episode, I didn't have any problems with the treatment that it got.

…

Toriko, huh? I've actually seen plenty of complaints about it, though most of it is nitpicky stupid stuff like ''these sound effects aren't 100% faithful to what was in my head!'' From the few clips I've seen of it's anime it doesn't look that different from most long-running shows; average-middleground work, and then more elaborate sequences for select important parts.

XMURADX

@Crossword:

I judge an episode's art and animation on a case-by-case basis. This episode/chapter wasn't exactly action-packed to begin with, so we didn't need anything with an absolutely insane frames per second count. What we got was art that was solidly on-model, vibrant colors, and nice special effects, like the lighting during Zoro's arrival, and that's what this episode deserved. Now, when we get to the action scenes in two or three episodes' time, then I'd like to see some great key animation, but for this episode, I didn't have any problems with the treatment that it got.

Yeah, pretty much what I thought. This is what this episode needed. So, me not being impressed with it =/= Bad episode.

@Crossword:

Toriko, huh? I've actually seen plenty of complaints about it, though most of it is nitpicky stupid stuff like ''these sound effects aren't 100% faithful to what was in my head!'' From the few clips I've seen of it's anime it doesn't look that different from most long-running shows; average-middleground work, and then more elaborate sequences for select important parts.

Just watch Hayashi and Onishi's episodes, and you will be more than impressed, not to forget many great animators are working on the show. Ep 22 intro scene which was the work of Hayashi was very impressive, Some great animators were impressed that they commented about it on twitter like Takashi Hashimoto, Ken Ootsuka, Fumiaki Kouta and Bleach animator Hiroaki Imaki.

The key animators for each Toriko episode ranges from 17 - 30 per episode.

dan2026

The Toriko anime has serious problems that are unrelated to its animation.
Before I gave up watching it, the animation seemed fairy slick when it needed to be.

ARC-1300

@dan2026:

The Toriko anime has serious problems that are unrelated to its animation.
Before I gave up watching it, the animation seemed fairy slick when it needed to be.

im really curious in hearing this, can you tell me what it is?

tina? (or how i call her, filler girl)
no blood?
pacing, the taking out of entire scenes?

im really asking, so an answer is appreciated.

Maron

I like Toriko the manga, but I really don't get the point of making a filler character and just adding her as part of the main cast. Seriously, what does Tina contribute??

JulieYBM

Wow, Tina is anime-only? Woah. I thought she was the obvious Toriko romance bait. O.o

Zack

@Yuugi's:

Wow, Tina is anime-only? Woah. I thought she was the obvious Toriko romance bait. O.o

Well, she was in the manga….for like one tiny panel in the background after the release of the anime.

ARC-1300

@Maron:

I like Toriko the manga, but I really don't get the point of making a filler character and just adding her as part of the main cast. Seriously, what does Tina contribute??

its not like they havent done that b4 with any other anime, YGO season 0 comes to mind. (i just pretend she's not even there,though it is difficult at times)either way it shouldn't ruin the entire enjoyment of the show.

is that the only thing? or is there something else im not seeing? i mean i enjoy the manga thoroughly to as well.
@Zack:

Well, she was in the manga….for like one tiny panel in the background after the release of the anime.

mind directing to that page?

Maron

It was probably just a color spread or something to promote the premiere of the anime.

@Yuugi's:

Wow, Tina is anime-only? Woah. I thought she was the obvious Toriko romance bait. O.o

I don't watch the anime enough to know for myself, but are you saying Tina's romantically interested in Toriko or someone else from the main cast?

JulieYBM

@Maron:

I don't watch the anime enough to know for myself, but are you saying Tina's romantically interested in Toriko or someone else from the main cast?

Well, I'm only eight episodes in so I figured Tina was meant to be the 'possible romance-bait' for the series, considering she's been involved with the cast as she has been so far.

Crossword

Well, here it is, my first set of caps for the series's timeskip. This set is for Hisada, but as I feared, there weren't enough good shots in the episode to include all of the Straw Hats, and given how infrequently he does episodes now, all I can do for now is to refer people to the promotional material if they want to see what Luffy, Zoro, and Franky now look like in Hisada's style.

Kazuya Hisada

!
(Having them all on one image is nice, but I'm not looking forward to the eventual updates I'll probably have to do.)

Oh, forgot the board now automatically resizes imageshack pics of a certain size.

Anyway, I noticed some new coloring-related stuff while watching the episode: Zoro's bandana, pants, and boots are no longer tinted green, everyone who had even slightly tanned skin before the skip appear to be a little bit paler, save Franky for some reason, and Nami's eyes are now apparently going to be fully brown 100% of the time.

Volpe

@ARC-1300:

mind directing to that page?

There you go
http://www.mangareader.net/toriko/145/2

And about the Toriko anime, I can't like it, even thought the art and the animation are very good. I really don't know what's the problem. And I really like the manga

Crossword

So the next few episodes look like this, apparently:

518: Shimanuki
519: Yokoyama
520: Shingaki
521: Takagi
522: Deguchi

Eh, that's the price to pay for having the finish to the first half looking as good as it did.

JulieYBM

Hah. Wow. I was hoping Tate would supevise an episode, but I guess not. Damn.

XMURADX

@Crossword:

So the next few episodes look like this, apparently:

518: Shimanuki
519: Yokoyama
520: Shingaki
521: Takagi
522: Deguchi

Eh, that's the price to pay for having the finish to the first half looking as good as it did.

Rough Titles by Archah.

Next titles (rough translation)

519: The navy starts moving · The target is Strawhat team
520: Big buildup · The fake Strawhat team threat
521: The battle begins! Showing training results!
522: Full rudder!! (temporary)

It's good since not much happens, but why Takagi for the good action in 521, and not Shingaki? Dammit!

Special Animators for the Rescue. I hope Shida does the First Luffy/Sanji/Zoro attacks.

Anyway, it seems a new director (Takashi Ootsuka) will be handling the Takagai episode, and it seems that he is a great director, that worked on most of the precure movies.
So, I'm expecting the episode to be well animated despite it being Takagi's.

Crossword

@Yuugi's:

Hah. Wow. I was hoping Tate would supevise an episode, but I guess not. Damn.

I really, really hope he comes back for at least Luffy's current fight. It would look amazing with his animation.