I'm about 35 hours into DQIX but I don't really feel like updating my backloggery status at the moment.
Dragon Quest thread : DQXI on PS4, 3DS & Switch
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Having finished the main game, I can now say the plot was a complete dissappointment.
I pretty much saw it coming though considering all the focus was on multiplayer and post-game content, but still; the whole thing was just extremely bland and most of the story reeked of hamfisted disjointedness you'd see in an MMORPG where it's just an excuse to kill monsters over and over for loot. And the clumsy morals that kept coming up almost made me vomit towards the end. I can hardly believe this was written by the same man as DQV.
I'd gladly sacrifice the whole customization aspect of the party for characters I can give a fuck about. It should've been so that you could only create the main character to your liking and the rest were presets with an actual personality. The job system still would've worked that way and customization would not have gotten in the way of making a good story.
While the battle system was tremendously enjoyable I can't shake the feeling that I just played World of Warcraft for 50 hours.
And I want to fucking kill that fairy right now. Might as well have added a "HEY! LISTEN!" voice track.
It wasn't a bad game at all and the sheer amount of content they packed in was impressive but the clumsy paper thin plot and excesive focus on monotonous farming and annoyingly time-consuming quest requirements made the quality suffer pretty badly. Got nothing on the other two DQ games I've played, ESPECIALLY not V.
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Strange… I'm REALLY enjoying it. I like the story quite a bit, myself. I'd place it fairly high on the overall rankings, myself.
Just to get it straight, several of you are bagging on the lack of character personality in IX, but raving for V where, for the vast majority of the game, monsters (who, sans perhaps Saber, have no personality) and the hero (who also doesn't have any more of a personality than our friendly Celestrian) make up your party, right?
Now, I do love V, but I just don't see why it's so much better than IX. The only real thing I can really think of that defined V was that the Hero kept getting hugely screwed over (watching his father be slain, worked as a slave, turned to stone, never really knowing his mother) and other than that, each town and section had it's own thing to it, just as each town and section in IX has it's own story.
I mean, an undead knight wants to steal the daughter of Stornway's king, so of course he doesn't give a flap about some ghost screwing with kids at Swinedimples. Each town already has it's own problems, and they aren't all that united. DQ's always been like that.
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Because the story isn't as good. It's as simple as that. It doesn't stay with anyone long enough to care about them(like bianca, harry, etc in five), and the plot itself is not deep. Damn, I remember going back to harry's castle and finding out he had a son that was just as bratty as he was as a kid. How cool was that? DQIX so far is simply a series of fairly interesting scenarios. And what about the antagonist? Gema showed up quite a bit in DQV. Dhoulmagus in eight. The dream sequence that started DQVI was great. The story simply falls flat in several areas, and the story is why I buy DQ games.
Unless the remainder of the game is hiding something incredible, I'd plonk it here:
V
VIII
VI
IV
III
IX
II
I
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The story is weak. It's true. But it has more CONTENT than any other DQ game ever, and I don't play DQ games for their stories or characters; I play them for the extraordinarily charming world they present for the player to navigate, the oldschool dungeons and combat, and for the enticement of collection / completion. I'm having fun running through the legacy bosses and leveling up classes into higher tiers. I've also done a few multiplayer sessions (now that I've found one other person that owns the game) and it makes the game quite a bit better.
Also, I don't mind the player-created blank characters. There's a hidden level of enjoyment to designing and using your own characters; it's why I almost never use the story characters in Final Fantasy Tactics.
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I dunno. I'm enjoying the story, but I just like the overarching presence of the Grand Architect and the true meaning of Yggdrasil and such. I'm still quite interested in the resurrection of the Gittish and other stuff that is going on, and eager to finish this game up.
Gameplay, monster hunting, and quest-wise, however, this game is amazing and has given a TON of options for what I can do, so I am absolutely loving it.
And, again, I LOVE being able to actually hunt Metal monsters now, instead of whistling with hope. I'm able to powerlevel for the endgame material FAR easier, which I'm sure will help for when I start taking on the Legacy bosses and such. That was the one thing that really bothered me with DQ V and VIII was the leveling difficulty and time-consuming. I still haven't gotten around to beating Estark in under the 20 (or was it 30?) turns to get the only remaining prize I needed for my museum in V and couldn't stand the amount of time it was taking to push past the 50s. In VIII, I'm still in the 40s, and despite being able to stomp all over Rhapthorne, I can't make it through the Dragovian Trials at all, and leveling takes FOREVER. Seeing the high EXP yields helps a lot, but I noticed they are getting rarer quite quickly, even still.
EDIT: lol. I was thinking over and over "who the hell is Gema?" I'm pretty sure you mean Ladja, right? He had a name change or something?
Speaking of name changes, why is the legendary hero being called "Erdrick" again? I thought they finally fixed things up and officially made it "Loto" with the DQ I-III remakes.
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Oh, I agree there have been major strides forward in the other areas of the game. It's just sad that the most important area for my tastes has taken a major step back.
@Syan:
EDIT: lol. I was thinking over and over "who the hell is Gema?" I'm pretty sure you mean Ladja, right? He had a name change or something?
Yup. The ps2/ds versions actually enhanced his role from the original too, which was nice. One of the few times a remake did everything well.
@Syan:
Speaking of name changes, why is the legendary hero being called "Erdrick" again? I thought they finally fixed things up and officially made it "Loto" with the DQ I-III remakes.
New localisation team for IV/V/VIII. And hopefully VI.
Sales have been good though, I assume since nintendo have been hyping the hell out of it.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/bestsellers/videogames/ref=pd_dp_ts_vg_h__1
Bodes well for VI.
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Yup. The ps2/ds versions actually enhanced his role from the original too, which was nice. One of the few times a remake did everything well.
I'll admit, I was VERY happy to kill him and his two minions throughout the game after all the crap he put me through.
New localisation team for IV/V/VIII. And hopefully VI.
Even still, why would a new localization team decided to go back to a completely strange translation like "Erdrick?" The Japanese title was Roto which is essentially the same exact thing as Loto, so it seemed like a very odd choice. I mean the new DQ IV didn't keep Ragnar as Ryan and Torneko as Taloon, so going WAY back to Erdrick seems weird.
And VI BETTER get released!
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@Syan:
Even still, why would a new localization team decided to go back to a completely strange translation like "Erdrick?" The Japanese title was Roto which is essentially the same exact thing as Loto, so it seemed like a very odd choice. I mean the new DQ IV didn't keep Ragnar as Ryan and Torneko as Taloon, so going WAY back to Erdrick seems weird.
And VI BETTER get released!
Ah, but they did shoehorn in Ryan and Torneko. They renamed the characters Ragnar McRyan and Torneko Taloon when they were Ragnar and Taloon in the American NES versions and Ryan and Torneko in the JP versions. Basically, the new localization teams want to acknolwedge the old American localizations sometimes, but not all the time. They went for Erdrick instead of Loto, but renamed Metaly and Metabble to more sensible translations. They even averaged the names Saro and Pizarro into Psaro.
I'm a little perplexed at the name changes for DQ VI (taken from the renamed DQ IX equipment) - Hassan to Carver and Barbara to Ashlynn don't make sense. I'm fine with Mileyu to Milly, though, and I like the name Somnia (as in sleep). The fact that there was actual localization to those people and placenames in IX bodes well for VI, but it'll probably be Nintendo and not Square again.
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Did they? I must have glossed over the last names.
I know nothing of VI, aside from my burning desire to play it and the general look of the heroes.
I suppose Erdrick could be the name of the hero and Loto remain the title. I could get behind a compromise like that.
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Well I decided to order V. It's frickin expensive, but luckily i have graduation money to spend.
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Well I decided to order V. It's frickin expensive, but luckily i have graduation money to spend.
You won't regret it. It's really one of the best journeys in RPG history. It's also the favorite Dragon Quest game of series mastermind Yuuji Horii.
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Because it's the best story he's written.
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Well I decided to order V. It's frickin expensive, but luckily i have graduation money to spend.
Why is it expensive? I'm also in CA and have seen several places with DQ V for really cheap new. Last time I was at Toys R Us it was $20.
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@Syan:
Why is it expensive? I'm also in CA and have seen several places with DQ V for really cheap new. Last time I was at Toys R Us it was $20.
Really? That's lame. Iv'e checked places like gamestop, walmart and target and even toy r us where I live and non of them had it. Figures it be in Toys R Us where I don't live. The game is discontinued so all the sellers selling through Amazon had the game for like $60-80. I bought it for 60. O well. If I don't spend the graduation money, my mom will put it in my savings and I'de never see it again anyway.
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@Syan:
Why is it expensive? I'm also in CA and have seen several places with DQ V for really cheap new. Last time I was at Toys R Us it was $20.
Because it's out of print now, I believe.
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Because the story isn't as good. It's as simple as that.
While it's true that some DQ stories and characters were pretty great, a lot of DQ as an overall package is about charm (in the form of its characteristic sound direction and art design) and gameplay. If you're playing DQ for story and it's seriously a hindrance to the game for you, you're beyond missing the point. Especially in relation to DQIX.
Edit: nevermind, I just caught this.
The story simply falls flat in several areas, and the story is why I buy DQ games.
I'm not sure what to even say here. Western and eastern gamers tend to have pretty polarized concepts of gaming, but if there's anything about the US that baffles me, it's this obsession with "story" in RPGs to the point that things have to be cinematic, character-driven, or have an over-arching and mesmerizing storyline, etc. I'm not trying to be rude to you here, I'm simply just baffled by how a gamer cannot simply enjoy what DQ as a series does remarkably perfectly: create a charming environment to accompany fun gameplay. It's not flat. It's just you.
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@Gigglepuffy:
While it's true that some DQ stories and characters were pretty great, a lot of DQ as an overall package is about charm (in the form of its characteristic sound direction and art design) and gameplay. If you're playing DQ for story and it's seriously a hindrance to the game for you, you're beyond missing the point. Especially in relation to DQIX.
DQV is one of the greatest games ever made because of it's story. It sure as hell isn't because of it's gameplay. Monster raising was the only thing of interest there.
@Gigglepuffy:
Edit: nevermind, I just caught this.
I'm not sure what to even say here. Western and eastern gamers tend to have pretty polarized concepts of gaming, but if there's anything about the US that baffles me,
Firstly, I'm not American. And if I was so what.
@Gigglepuffy:
it's this obsession with "story" in RPGs to the point that things have to be cinematic, character-driven, or have an over-arching and mesmerizing storyline, etc.
What the hell are you talking about. Why shouldn't rpg's have an interesting story. When did I ever say it had to be "cinematic". I don't want some MGS style borefest, I just want what DQ games before have had. Why is this so difficult for you to get your head around.
@Gigglepuffy:
I'm not trying to be rude to you here, I'm simply just baffled by how a gamer cannot simply enjoy what DQ as a series does remarkably perfectly: create a charming environment to accompany fun gameplay.
I own every single DQ game save for VI. I have played them all and I know perfectly well what dragon quest games do "remarkably perfectly". V does it. VI does it. VIII does it. IX does not. It has plenty of other things going for it, such as changes to the gameplay, but it does not suck you into its world as previous instalments have.
@Gigglepuffy:
It's not flat. It's just you.
Ha ha ha. "It's not the game that's wrong, it's you". IX loses more then it adds from previous instalments. For someone trying not to be rude you're doing a pretty terrible job of it.
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DQV is one of the greatest games ever made because of it's story. It sure as hell isn't because of it's gameplay. Monster raising was the only thing of interest there.
… Actually, it was its gameplay. Alongside its art, sound direction, and musical scoring. That charming atmosphere was combined with some really enjoyable characters and in the end, it made the game very whole. But even without those characters, it still would've held up quite strongly. Not as much truly, but it's all about the complete package with DQ. DQV certainly did have a fantastic storyline, but that complete package is what made it such a great game.
Firstly, I'm not American. And if I was so what.
My apologies for generalizing. I mostly was illustrating that western perceptions on gaming can be incredibly polarized when compared to the east, which is why Dragon Quest seems to give lots of different impressions from Japan westwards.
What the hell are you talking about. Why shouldn't rpg's have an interesting story. When did I ever say it had to be "cinematic". I don't want some MGS style borefest, I just want what DQ games before have had. Why is this so difficult for you to get your head around.
I never said they shouldn't. I said that it should never be such an incredible priority to the extent that first and foremost, people look to the story of an RPG as its most important judgement. I notice far too many people who just look at RPGs and think of this universal standard.
I own every single DQ game save for VI. I have played them all and I know perfectly well what dragon quest games do "remarkably perfectly". V does it. VI does it. VIII does it. IX does not. It has plenty of other things going for it, such as changes to the gameplay, but it does not suck you into its world as previous instalments have.
I'm not sure if you "get" Dragon Quest then, as bizarre as that statement is for what is essentially the standard popular JRPG franchise.
Ha ha ha. "It's not the game that's wrong, it's you". IX loses more then it adds from previous instalments. For someone trying not to be rude you're doing a pretty terrible job of it.
You're faulting the game for something that isn't of much consequence. The story_telling_ in DQ has really always been quite well done and I think even here, it's not flat at all, nor is it something that pulls it down any bit. I was just as enthralled as I was in any DQ universe.
I can understand someone who plays RPGs for "story", however, not enjoying DQIX, considering the characters are roughly inconsequential. But if that is your major fault with it, then you're playing DQIX for, I'm afraid, the wrong reasons. I'd just call it missing the point. Don't fault DQIX for not being the game you want it to be. Earlier in the thread, somebody basically called DQIX "MMO Quest". That's right. It's basically questing, making characters, getting armor, questing some more, just "playing". It does it incredibly well and it was exactly what it was designed to be.
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Honestly guys, "to each their own." Everyone is going to have different opinions on which game they like the best. There are other things, but personally I do look for story in rpgs considering I don't want to role play as inanimate objects. I do enjoy the turn-base battle system of dragon quest and the armor and alchemy system which is also a huge part of rpgs though.
I like Dragon Quest IX, I just think VIII story just added a bit more that made it special. Also, the dugeons and caves just feel short in IX. I mean the ones in VIII were annoyingly long, but it also brought some satisfaction. It sounds weird, but yea.
VIII is one of my favorite games ever, so IX just felt a bit dissapointing. It's a personal opinion though.
Also, I found it funny that you think Americans are concerned with story. Have you seen most of the movies we make? Haha. Also, most people are more concerned with shooting something than they are with rpgs.
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Also, I found it funny that you think Americans are concerned with story. Have you seen most of the movies we make? Haha. Also, most people are more concerned with shooting something than they are with rpgs.
I'm… talking about RPGs though. Not movies, or shooters. The subject I mentioned was rather broad, anyways, and is only slightly related to the subject at hands. Maybe I can blame this on how my English can be too loose. For that I'm sorry. We don't need to talk about it in this case anyways.
And the issue isn't one that "to each their own" really resolves. If the subject was in regards to it being "fun", maybe, or something that is strictly undebatable.
But my issue was Darksturm complaining about something that is completely inconsequential in regards to DQIX's quality as a game and it sort of felt as if they approached the game with the wrong things in mind. There are certain things in gaming that, when done well, are never a problem. Good stories are one of them. But lacking a good story (in terms of the inspired or characterized), especially for certain genres and sub-genres of gaming (like the one DQIX falls into) aren't necessities and do not hamper the final product.
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@Gigglepuffy:
But my issue was Darksturm complaining about something that is completely inconsequential in regards to DQIX's quality as a game and it sort of felt as if they approached the game with the wrong things in mind. There are certain things in gaming that, when done well, are never a problem. Good stories are one of them.
"When you do a story well it's never a problem". What exactly are you even arguing here.
@Gigglepuffy:
But lacking a good story (in terms of the inspired or characterized), especially for certain genres and sub-genres of gaming (like the one DQIX falls into) aren't necessities and do not hamper the final product.
I assume by saying "lacking a good story aren't necessities"(?) you're trying to say that certain types of game don't require a good story.
Which is true but has never historically been true for DQ games. Every game has had as detailed a plot as the hardware allowed except for IX. If Horii wants to move away from that, then that's his business but don't try and act like this hasn't always been the case previously.
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"When you do a story well it's never a problem". What exactly are you even arguing here.
I'm … not arguing. I was stepping into the point by stating nobody can say a good story is a bad thing, but that it wasn't a necessity. I'm not sure why you're targeting that part of the post.
I assume by saying "lacking a good story aren't necessities"(?) you're trying to say that certain types of game don't require a good story.
Which is true but has never historically been true for DQ games. Every game has had as detailed a plot as the hardware allowed except for IX. If Horii wants to move away from that, then that's his business but don't try and act like this hasn't always been the case previously.
And I'm also not sure what you're getting at here. It feels like you're getting into something else entirely. My point was that DQIX's narrative was not a focal point and to hold it against it was sort of missing what the game was going for.
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@Gigglepuffy:
I'm … not arguing. I was stepping into the point by stating nobody can say a good story is a bad thing, but that it wasn't a necessity. I'm not sure why you're targeting that part of the post.
Because it didn't read like that.
@Gigglepuffy:
I'm not sure what you're getting at here. It feels like you're getting into something else entirely. My point was that DQIX's narrative was not a focal point and to hold it against it was sort of missing what the game was going for.
I know it wasn't and I was disappointed by that based on the previous games where it kind of was. As I already made clear to others. But then you quoted me and said it's never been important and here we are.
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I know it wasn't and I was disappointed by that based on the previous games where it kind of was. As I already made clear to others. But then you quoted me and said it's never been important and here we are.
I never equated DQIX's lack of story as a series constant, if that's what you're saying or interpreted my post as.
As I already made clear to others.
But this is just what is getting me a bit confused right now. I've gone back and read the last page again and I'm simply… just rather confused on your stance and actual opinions of DQIX. I never read any posts that far past the end of page 10, but if it was ever elaborated outside of that, I missed it. There are a couple of posts that sort of pointed to one direction, but other posts that seemed to point in another. I couldn't tell if you actually enjoyed the game/appreciated its direction, but lamented the lack of a narrative, or disliked it because of it. Becuase my posts were only directed at the option the latter presents.
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I appreciate what it has done to move the series forward in terms of gameplay mechanics, and how stuffed to the gills with features it is. But I'm disappointed by the extent to which the story has been pared back and the short amount of time they give to each scenario.
If I were to score it I'd give it 8/10.
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Ahaha, then fuck me, I flat out misinterpreted your post, due to I guess my having missed the full context of your issue. I suppose I feel rather silly now.
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Well I'm glad it took you guys a full page to finally understand each other ;). But in other news. It there any info on VI? Square Enix's Dragon Quest Website seems to say nothing, but Amazon already has it for preorder….sooooooo?
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@Gigglepuffy:
Ahaha, then fuck me, I flat out misinterpreted your post, due to I guess my having missed the full context of your issue. I suppose I feel rather silly now.
No worries.
Well I'm glad it took you guys a full page to finally understand each other ;). But in other news. It there any info on VI? Square Enix's Dragon Quest Website seems to say nothing, but Amazon already has it for preorder….sooooooo?
Nothing. Hopefully Nintendo have done enough to make IX a success(seems to be doing well on amazon in the UK at least, and retail is spamming the hell out of it) to ensure SE release VI. It's better then square-enix's marketing approach for IV & V at least(or lack thereof).
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Having said that, it looks like SE filed trademarks for "Realms of Reverie" just this week in europe.
http://www.ffring.com/news/Dragon-Quest-VI-a-l-approche-de-l-Europe-c34ea8193471d.html
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I'm just going to say again that I do like DQ IX's story. A lot. It's a good story, just very quick paced.
Maybe it just doesn't stand out as much because the amount of quests and alchemy work can be addicting and time-consuming, so you don't remain focused on it for as long. Final Fantasy XII had this same problem, but DQ IX is much more nicely presented, in my opinion.
The overarching theme of the Celestrians and watching over mortalkind intrigues me. I've always enjoyed DQ's ideas involving heavenly beings like the Zenethians and Celestrians (I am still somewhat surprised at them not being Zenethian, since, aside from the halo, they seem quite similar.
Each town has its own story that is really driven home while you are there. I talk to EVERYONE when I'm in an RPG, and DQ IX has really done a stellar job of having nearly every single NPC comment on the issue at hand both during and in retrospect. The extra commentary adds to my joy with the story, and is something that several other RPGs don't do as well.
Enjoyment of a story is completely based on opinion, but the story in IX stands next to its DQ brethren perfectly well.
V may have a more character-driven plot, since you literally watch your character grow through his life over 20 years.
VII may have a world-building ability with nearly every time having its own charm, but it is weighed down by being so damn SLOW.
VIII has the deepest and largest world, with a better handled overarching storyline (then again, my joy in IX also has to do with what I don't know. The mystery of WHY certain events have happened is quite interesting to me) in Rhapthorne's return, through possessing those who wield his staff (Dhoulmagus, Jessica, the dog, Marcello) and slaying the descendants of those who sealed him, in addition to a few good town-specific quests.
But IX isn't bare or without charm. Story-wise it stands right in the style of II, III and IV, especially III. IX seems more a tribute to the roots, jammed with tons of content and a revamped battle system, but it certainly FEELS like a DQ, and that's all that matters to me.
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Well I'm glad it took you guys a full page to finally understand each other ;). But in other news. It there any info on VI? Square Enix's Dragon Quest Website seems to say nothing, but Amazon already has it for preorder….sooooooo?
I'm guessing a Q4 2010/Q1 2011 release. Release seemed a bit shaky after SE saying the sales of IV and V weren't too good but I guess since the title has been trademarked we should still be getting it.
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S-E had a North American trademark for the name Realms of Reverie almost a year ago, and that same trademark was made in Europe fairly recently. It looked like they weren't going to release it, but the popularity of IX might have given them new confidence. North America and Europe will probably get it sometime in the first half of 2011, I'm guessing.
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ok. Slightly off topic. But does anyone have a link to an image of the female thief from the earlier games? I know there is one but I can't seem to find any trace of her. Would prefer if it was similar to the style of DQ 2 or 3.
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ok. Slightly off topic. But does anyone have a link to an image of the female thief from the earlier games? I know there is one but I can't seem to find any trace of her. Would prefer if it was similar to the style of DQ 2 or 3.
DQ II didn't have a thief, you were simply set with the three royal family members, the soft-spoken but hard-hitting Prince of Midenhall, the clumsy but balanced Prince of Cannock, and the tragic magic user Princess of Moonbrooke.
III had a class system similar to IX's. Here's pics of the thieves: http://www.dqshrine.com/dq/dq3gb/dq3gbart16.jpg and http://www.dqshrine.com/dq/dq3gb/dq3gbart15.jpg . I'm not a huge fan of the look myself.
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Brilliant! Thanks a bunch!
Anywho. In the realms of DQ9 Beat the Lleviathan and then Jack last night. Finally the bosses are starting to be a challenge. Specially the first one.
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Brilliant! Thanks a bunch!
Anywho. In the realms of DQ9 Beat the Lleviathan and then Jack last night. Finally the bosses are starting to be a challenge. Specially the first one.
lol, that's probably because you fought them backwards. You're "supposed" to fight the Master of Nu'un before Leviathan.
The fact that none of the bosses till REALLY late use Wave of Disruption means that you can buff your defense and Psyche Up your attackers to kill the bosses EASY.
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That probably explains it lol.
I saw the Tower of Trades but decided it was simply somewhere I went later (never figured out the bow) and continued onwards XD
Oh well. Still fun. Means my Hero 'Robin' is now a Warrior XD
Also. Is it me or was the choice of hairstyles for the guy REALLY weak? Unless you wanted a DBZ look-alike you were pretty much stuffed. Which is why my team is all girls and one guy.
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Just beat the main game. Loved it. Final boss was really cool, and I loved the theme.
Seems to be PLENTY left to do, as well.
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The game isn't even really over until you beat the game. I have three boss maps unlocked, and it's damn hard. I have to use some cheap-as-fuck tank tactics just to beat a medium-level Baramos.
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How do you unlock more maps? Or New Quests for that matter. Is it all download from Wi-Fi or that other one where you close the DS and pray somebody else is there?
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How do you unlock more maps? Or New Quests for that matter. Is it all download from Wi-Fi or that other one where you close the DS and pray somebody else is there?
Most of the special quests are download from Wifi by visiting Sellma's shop, which is totally worth doing anyway.
Once you clear a grotto, you can also sometimes get a new treasure map, or for the Legacy maps, you can power up the bosses so they get even tougher.
The canvass for guests option isn't going to do jack for you in America. You have to actually pass by someone who is physically near you with the game, who is ALSO in canvass mode. It seems like something that would have a fair chance in Japan for school kids and stuff, but in America, you really have to just know someone is there and plan out the canvassing, because I know I've never just walked around with my DS in canvass mode with hopes that someone else is doing the same.
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If anyone's having trouble with this game, my technique is to have two warriors using spear techniques and a priest with the same, and have them all learn multithrust. Then have the fourth character be mage - that way you get sap in the beginning and oomph in later days, so bosses are a breeze, and you're whacking metal slimes for 12 hits each turn.
Multithrust is learnt at 88 skillpoints, but you can get this easily by changing classes and hoarding skill points once you've at least gotten to where you can fight metal medleys.
Demon spears can also help as they give a chance of death, again good for levelling up on metals - 12 hits with each of them having a chance of an instakill - helps kill liquid slimes in a turn or two before many of them run. You learn the alchemy by the book quite late in the game, but looking at the recipe it seems possible to me as of getting your first mode of transport and starting off one of the next quests.
recipe is :
! Celestial spear which is made of(long spear(buy in coffingwell)+ holy talisman(gold rosary + 5 holy water + ressorock) + 2 platinum ore(map material northeast of bloomingdale)
! Then celestial spear + 3 terrible tattoo(rare manguini steal/drop, underground of gleeba)- Malicite(Narspicious(I think there's material near the school) + 2 terrible tattoo + 1 pink pearl(sold in gleeba)
Also sages "jack of all trades" ability rocks for training.
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My technique is to have a tank character using fan weapons (either a Paladin or a Warrior is best, but I use a Paladin for the extra MP) use Magic Mirror on the first turn (shield ability), Reverse Cycle on the second turn (fan ability), and then Forbearance on every turn thereafter, unless Reverse Cycle or Magic Mirror wear off or eliminated with a Disruptive Wave. Also, make sure your tank has the special scrolls for shields and warriors. To use this, you need a character with 82 in Virtue, 13 in Fans, and 100 in Shields. One of your characters (can be the tank, can be another character if you want) needs to be a level 40 Warrior.
When you do this, EVERY SINGLE attack that hits anyone in your party, even multi-target attacks, hit the tank instead. All magic spells will reflect thanks to Magic Mirror, all breath attacks will reflect thanks to Reverse Cycle, and all critical hits will be countered thanks to the shield scroll. The warrior scroll also has you counter almost every physical attack, which is just icing on the cake.
I've used this to completely annihilate all of the legacy bosses I've unlocked. They only become a challenge if they use Disruptive Wave to break my rhythm and kill either my healer or my tank in the next two turns after the Disruptive Wave.
EDIT: BTW, there are two places to get Narspicious. One is in the southern end of the marshes south of Batsureg and west of Swinedimples, and the other is just to the east of the Bowhole.
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@Syan:
Most of the special quests are download from Wifi by visiting Sellma's shop, which is totally worth doing anyway.
Once you clear a grotto, you can also sometimes get a new treasure map, or for the Legacy maps, you can power up the bosses so they get even tougher.
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I see. I take it this is later in the game yeah? I have Sellma's shop but I don't seem to download anything.
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EDIT: BTW, there are two places to get Narspicious. One is in the southern end of the marshes south of Batsureg and west of Swinedimples, and the other is just to the east of the Bowhole.
Yeah, it is closer to batsureg then the school. That's the one that I reckon would allow you to get demon spears so early in the game.
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Goddamnit this game sucks at giving you useful Magic/Skills/Abilities!!!!
It's not a 'bad' game but whoever came up with the progression of said traits is a FUCKING MORON.
I have a Minstrel, Thief, WM and BM.
PRETTY STANDARD FARE RIGHT!?
The only useful things my WM learned in 25 levels thus far are Zing and Midheal where Zing is almost useless since it CONSTANTLY fails DESPITE BEING A WHITE MAGE.
Meanwhile the last useful thing my BM learned was around level 14 and that was Crackle which my Minstrel practically started with!
Furthermore the Thief is a complete joke since she can't steal for SHIT even though she's a thief with CRAZY high Deftness.
The system is fucked. I've been using the same fighting strategy and relying on my main character the ENTIRE time.
And it's still 9886996959860238338099999x more fun than anything from FF13.
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I caved and bought 9 yesterday, after having enjoyed 5 and 8 a whole lot.
Not very far in yet. But hell. I wanna be one of the cool kids.
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Furthermore the Thief is a complete joke since she can't steal for SHIT even though she's a thief with CRAZY high Deftness.
I remember Zing always being rubbish. I believe there is Kazing later that revives with a 100% chance (at least there was in one of the earlier ones.)
I was just about to ask about the Stealing Mechanics. Seems to just be a low percentage of stealing chance most of the time. Do we just have to raise Deftness and hope for the best?
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I see. I take it this is later in the game yeah? I have Sellma's shop but I don't seem to download anything.
I got a few DL Quests already, before I had even beaten the game. You just have to talk to her and actually log on to the Wifi to download new things. The shop changes every day. I got lucky enough to get a Miracle Sword damn near the beginning so I was curb-stomping everyone in my path, while healing to boot! I even upped it to an Uber Miracle Sword very quickly, making it even more vicious.
You can't actually ACCEPT any of the DL quests until you beat the main game, though.
Goddamnit this game sucks at giving you useful Magic/Skills/Abilities!!!!
It's not a 'bad' game but whoever came up with the progression of said traits is a FUCKING MORON.
It is a bit annoying if you really just run with one class, since you don't get much till late levels, especially with Priest and Mage. It wasn't until I faced the final boss that my Priest finally learned Multiheal! But if you do a bit of diverse class leveling (best done via the Bad Cave while hunting Metal Medleys to get a bunch of classes to ~20), you can have a bunch of nice abilities that help. I stopped using Heal of any kind once I got Caduceus, and now am likely going to keep with Multiheal. Get to level 100 in Wands and you NEVER run out of MP.
I did really want to be able to switch Spells with my classes, since that would have been much, much better, but I can see that it'd make you a bit overpowered, I guess. I did it all the time in III, though, and loved it!
The only useful things my WM learned in 25 levels thus far are Zing and Midheal where Zing is almost useless since it CONSTANTLY fails DESPITE BEING A WHITE MAGE
Honestly, other than the very first time I fought Equinox at the end of a grotto, which I was severely underleveled for, I haven't been wiped out. The only one who has died a few times is my Priest, and Zing hasn't had that bad of a success rate for me so far, luckily.
Furthermore the Thief is a complete joke since she can't steal for SHIT even though she's a thief with CRAZY high Deftness.
I don't get how the Deftness works exactly. Is it only related to stealing? Or is that related to dodging attacks, too?
Anyway, stealing is REALLY difficult against certain enemies. It has taken 20+ turns to steal at times, even WITH the Thief's scroll (which says it will steal without fail, yeah right) AND the Thief's accessory.