Are you talking about Ace? Because you know I don't think he's above VA level at all lol.
Nothing in the story point to him being a top-tier, that's the point I'm trying to make. Top-tiers don't get sent flying, bleeding and screaming by a single Jet Pistol. Honestly, he tanked the punch worse than Blueno. Top-tiers aren't completely decimated in an instant, along with their entire crew, by a man who isn't even a confirmed top-tier. Do I think he'll become top-tier as the story progresses? Definitely. But as of now nothing convinces be he can hold a candle to a true top-tier.
He hasn't received as much build-up, but he sure as hell has received a lot of build-up. He's basically the anti-Luffy, you can be sure he's going to be a major villain later on.
Though I may regret it, I'm going to try and jump in. Dude, the author's clearing trying to add to Blackbeard's mystery by having such a weird defeat happen to him in the middle of that arc. It just seems to me that quoting that as proof is falling for an obvious manipulation.
It's the same with Blackbeard taking that punch from Luffy. Look at this fight with Ace, his injury by Magellan, and his punch from Luffy and you'll notice his reaction is pretty much the same every time. He gets hit, falls on the ground, screams in pain, and eventually gets up.
There's no basis to call him weaker then these other character. There's no difference in fighting style, and probably ability, between Ace, Kizaru, and Blackbeard.
I never said any random weakling could fill it in, obviously you have to be of a certain strength. There's just no indication that level of strength is top-tier. Even a VA level guy is fairly rare I'm sure, and Ace is young, he will no doubt become top-tier soon enough.
And why would it suddenly mean that Marco, Joz and Vista wouldn't be the strongest commanders? Again, the fact that those guys are top-tier does not somehow mean the numbers are ranked by strength. For all we know, Atmos is stronger than Vista.
Sure it does, if he were facing an Admiral Teach would have gotten his face pounded in. Ace has obviously been neglecting his physical ability, while an Admiral has to be able to fight people like Rayleigh, Joz or Whitebeard who can actually harm them.
Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. Like I said before, different match-ups produce different results. BB had the perfect counter to Ace, it's a rock, paper, scissors concept.
**Kidd's bounty is 315 Million, while Doflamingo's is 340 M. The difference between the bounties is pretty negligible, hence Doflamingo having a Supernova level former bounty.
Bounties are indeed a rough indicator of strength. And:** http://www.mangascreener.com/stephen/onepiece/chapter474.txt
Worst of all is this baseless accusation of calling anyone "VA level." I have had problems with people doing this in the past, but unless you consider Garp to be high tier then I don't get it. What's a "mid level" VA and how would that guy match Ace?
Is it Monmoga and Dog-Zoan VA? Cause…the latest chapter just shows they use roushiki(sp). While many people consider this awesome, consider this. Oda didn't even create an original style for these guys. Really think about that. On top of it, Dog Zoan guy really is pretty much a Rob Lucci knock off. I normally hate to go to this area, but I can't help it here. I can't think of a Vice Admiral character with a significant enough part in the story to stand up to any of the previous character mentioned. Hell, when you get right down to it Giant John was just filler for an "important marine" so Oda wouldn't give away guys like Sengkou, Garp, and the Admirals too early in the story. Though I hope we see more of that guy later(after all, with none of these character being dead the story really isn't over for them), I never got why people were so uptight about a guy who's been in almost none of the 400 chapters of his existence got beat by Whitebeard.
If anyone is VA level, in the current chapters, it's the NW captains. There's no good indication to suggest Ace or Blackbeard would fight any worse then Joz and Marco, though there is a chance any of those characters could be the strongest. I can only shake my head to see something twist there way around Shanks mentioning that scar! Yes, it was mentioned because he is competitive with Shanks, then and now. The way you mention it in past posts dilutes it's meaning. If Shanks "got stronger" between then and now do you think he's not smart enough to take that in consideration? It's pretty ridiculous.
Also, when did this thread become another "shichiubkai thread." What the heck's going on here. Where are the theories.