Posts made by Shinobu Mahara

Waiting on at least one well known character

Okie, here goes.
Huschel, Shuhan, SUDK
Not sure how well this will turn out but yeah

@SomebodyUDon'tKnow:

Shinobu, can you please answer my question from yesterday? When you get back, obviously.

Who do you think we should vote for today, if anybody? Do you have any suspects?

Im assuming that you mean this question. In which case at the current time I am more swaying towards Huschel flip. However that goes without saying that I really dont know who to flip at this stage.
I've essentially been not voting towards a lynch this entire game. So being able to pull a target out of thin air is a little hard pressed. But if I had to go with my gut..
I could be completely wrong, but its not exactly like there is a way to know.

@Huschel:

I'm interested in doing the hypofighter. I do have some personal investment in it. :ninja:

Care to explain this further? Or is this an attempt to rat out the one actually involved in firefighting?

It is only because of this earlier post that i even suspect anything, without it, id be clueless as to who to suspect.
(No hate please)

As much as I can understand people going towards hypoclaiming firefighter, considering how it was explained to me before, with great difficulty.
Statistically sound, multiple day extensions, little to no worthwhile communication. Possibly throw the firefighter to the wolves? Mmm doesnt sit pretty with me, but I'd guess if all agreed to do so, i'd tag along.
But I see no reason to discuss it, unless we will actually take that path of action.

Why do i feel like im only going to be questioned more for trying to answer something.. Anyway those are my thoughts.

Currently at uni, but Imma do this just in case:

​Vote: Day Extension

Personally not surprised by Kitsunes flip, there was bound to be one found eventuslly.
Le crys, flip helps a little bit i guess not they got stumped

I know the numbers are different now, but before hypoclaiming firefighter role was deemed a bad idea, you would honestly consider this option now that its closer because it statistically sound?

@Jabberwok:

Shinobu: I want to follow up on your response later since there's still imo a bunch of backwards logic, but I'd like to offer you the chance to name some of your own suspicious persons since I don't think you've done that yet. Do you have reads on anyone or have any questions for people?

Okay so you simply want me to display the people that I may find suspicious.. I can do that. Huschel im sitting on the edge, cause they are probably the day times best read. However not really based on much, I find it a little concerning that Huschel said that they believed they were safe for the night, which i realize was only one post but it still caught my eye. Not only that but aside from wooden agreeing with the idea that I wouldnt have been targeted due to lower lynch values. Huschel seemingly has been the only real one to consistently defend me.
Whether that says anything, no idea to be honest but i do find it weird.
I dont suspect jabs, cause at this point he hasn't really done anything that i would really deem unacceptable. Smiting le crys would have been incredibly lame, and im glad we avoided from doing so.
Asking me this, hard question to answer, not gonna lie. It's D2 and nothing has even happened yet really. I'd like to go to the effort of thinking that mafia had already placed their vote for me.

If anything, my opinion is that it was quite probable that only one mafia had voted against me, and the other never got the chance to come back to vote, otherwise it my lynch surely would have happened.

@SpaceCowboy:

@Shinobu
I reckon that everyone understood what you meant on your post. Jabber himself said that your "lynching value" went down because the mafia wouldn't target you.
However your claim at this point doesn't really say anything. You claimed you were around to claim if necessary. You were at L-1. Chances are, the guy that would hammer you wouldn't ask you to claim, he would go straight for the kill.
Then the next day the first thing you do is say you are a tree. What's up with that? Not claiming D1 is one thing, doing it D2 is another.

Not claiming day 1, perfectly understandable, fairly warranted from any player stand point. Claiming day (if you can even call that a proper claim) whats up with that, you say.. Aside from the potential of me being lynched today I guess i had no particular reason to claim. Getting the initial vote start of D2, scared me into thinking we'd actually start that wagon on me all over again but since you guys have noted that i am less of a risk now than what i was before.
I guess you'd call it taking an unnecessary risk, there really isn't much explanation I can give on this matter considering..

Not sure if i fully got what I was meant to do there, considering im trying to do scriptwriting at uni currently but i will be checking frequently so I can explain more if people really need it, i just dont know what else i can say

Post #146- i felt like there wasnt anything there either but here we are..
Post #147- i would have advocated for a no lynch regardless of who wanted to. Albeit hearsay at this point. I know others didnt like that, but thats as equally my choice as anyone else. Its just i was the only one okay with having 1 more person by the time D3 comes around, if indeed someone dies. Not a popular opinion, but i got my way in the end.
Post #149- finally someone that can see some sense in something i say
Post #153- can you specify what you want me to defend myself on, this is just asking for more confusion if i dont ask beforehand.
Post #154- I was around enough to make sure i could have claimed, i was checking in every half hour or so for a couple hours there. I guess i wasnt really held back by anything, it just seemed so quite at the time that i thought doing nothing would be the best solution. Even if i had of posted at day end anyway, i couldnt have made anyone vote except me cause i was the only one around at time (in terms of online status as far as i can tell, closer towards 5 hours until day end)
Post #162- you just explained me in a sentence, clearly jabberwok missed the memo.
Post #167- interested to see what he does have to say when he does finally reappear. Maybe having a different pair of eyes will make things clearer somehow.

Getting ready for uni today will be posting my thoughts over the next hour or so. Just so people know i actually plan on replying.

How is anything i said, any different from claiming town role amongst any other game?
Im simply saying in my opinion, 1 forest member down is something people wouldnt want, considering that votes are precious to us.
I was indeed relying on inactivity, it runs quite the risk but it worked didnt it?
Im saying that had any mafia been online (that havent already voted against me) would have hammered me for sure, because of the very reason of people wanting a first day lynch, quite a lot might i add.
But not enough to actually execute it/me.. seems a bit to me like we need to call upon others to make them less inactive so you can actually pass a vote.

Im not saying that i thing the mafia arent thinking of thinning the crowd. I just think the mafia wouldnt have gone to the effort of priming someone that was already being looked badly upon considering it would potentially waste their action.
Due to the fact that i may be lynch today by you guys if that was the case.
Dont you think that the mafia would perhaps try to go for somebody that is most likely a safe prime?
I understand my views on how the mafia will go about their business is different now, but yeah.

I feel like the forest got too close to doing something they wouldnt have liked.
I might have been 1 vote away and being a stump might not be so bad, wasnt on a lot by the end of the day.
However, i was around enough to be ready to claim, if needed to. And instead i didnt have to at all because of how it went all went down. All in all, i feel lucky that i didnt get lynched, and i would like to think mafia didnt bother priming me considering that i seem to be main lynch interest at the current time.

#1 Luck for us, a mafia killing another mafia wouldnt be considered lucky for them.
#2 I would suspect that people that arent primed are either mafia, or just targets that arent high enough on mafia’s hitlist to have been targeted yet. I guess that could be considered an assumption. But that is where i was going with that.
#3, maybe i should read the wiki page a third time, i dont understand why when i read i do constantly misinterpret.
(#4 + post #105) Im not exactly sure what i can do if its a constant. A lot of the time it just seems that i overwhelm myself with a lot of the reading at once, and pay the price for it later in the form of votes by people early game, in most games of which im involved.
I guess i did word things wrong in terms of: getting information - exerting pressure to recieve wanted goal
Warranted, by all means. Liability, yeah i can see that perspective.
Not sure what else i you’d like me to do about it though. I can only read the same thing so many times..

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

#5, not exactly sure why i think this, but from now on that wont be a problem.
Will go back and try to remember where i pulled that from.

@wooden and jabberwok, in terms of #6. I understand that a no lynch advocate seems bad to both of you.
Im not going to change my views accordingly, even though i get why its frowned upon.
I simply am thinking more long term. By day 2 the first of trees my very well begin to die.

In my head; day 1, no lynch. Day 2, 0-1 doused, possible information on who is targeted.
Which would give us some actual lead, however possibly outing firefighter for a N2 kill.
But if firefighter doesnt reveal themselves D2, then we could potentially show 2 people that have been targeted on those nights. Which would not only clear those people but give us a better idea on who might be mafia.

Rough part im not so sure of:
but if the firefighter is unsuccessful in stopping a player from being doused, then you have already found the potential next target. But if im not mistaken you arent told if a player has or hasnt been primed, so i guess not?

Post #68- lucky in this situation would be hitting a player that is already protected, not other way around.
A doused (gasoline) player would never result in good things unless a mafia accidentally killed the other.

Post #72- The only reason hypoclaiming wouldnt work is because mafia can easily compare which ones they have or havent targeted throughout everybodys posts. But however brcause the mafia cant communicate, wouldnt hypoclaiming be more viable? Not only that but when the firefighter dies we can go back and actually compare real data.
Sure we would only find out, which players have avoided being doused, which doesnt give members of town much.
But it might possibly give insight on which players might be targeted next, depend on the results of night 2 actions.

Post #87
You’re welcome for day extend vote. Even though we had more than enough.
Simply saying that the results of night teo are more than likely going to be 2 doused players rather than 1.
2 mafia, 1 firefighter, 6 tree, albeit a slim difference. I think its safe to say 2 trees will almost certainly will be coated in gasoline.

Post #92- Personally i feel like jabberwok has tried pushing hardcore for a D1 lynch.
Sure i got vote against by both huschel and jabs but from huschels perspective it was to push me further along.
And now that ive been trying a bit better than usual, thats no longer a problem.
And they are seemingly doing so to get information out of others instead of actively looking to kill, albeit wanting a lynch.

Post #96-
Was under the impression that each mafia could choose one action out of the two that they have. Douse or kill.
I understand they cant kill unless a player is already doused, but yet again if mafia arent communicating. Then ones actions wouldnt effect the others, meaning 2 doused players not 1. Or did i just miss another thing in these walls of text, that makes me look like a idiot again?

In other words: i find voting for the purpose of scumhunting/info is perfectly fine because they are more likely to remove their vote, compared to that of jabberwok, where given the explanation is basically what i did last game to foolio.
“I dont like your play style, you’re going down”. Sure, yet again another damn person says im confusing.
But i dony see how thats a valid arguement at this point. You can see i am going to the effort of trying to change that.
After extensively reading, people have asked me to explain things ive said they themselves are confused about.
But youre the only one actually complaining about it anymore.
Also, making discussion is always great, and nobody might have posted for a bit..

However you coted me without even asking me anything to solidify/nullify your vote.
Seems a bit hypocritical doesnt it?

Vote: Day Extension
Just for you huschel, do with it what you can.
Not sure how useful 1 vote will be but more discussion i guess means more scum-hunting.

So a firefighter can stop a target being marked, but cant stop an already doused player.
So N1 would result in two confirmed doused players, and a more than likely lynch D2.
If the firefighter has not put in their action before the mafia target a player, we could save a potential tree.
That part also falls down to luck considering silence among night phase.
Which by N2 would mean we either start burning, or we have more than comfortable levels of doused players.

If you prefer to not go about that strategy for now, thats cool.
I’m understand why you brought it up, and what benefits it would have for both parties.
Was more saying that im not sure what direction to take in the meantime, if we all decide to take that path.

2nd part: but wouldnt it be an more risky delaying the kills for as long as possible, but solidifying the fact that all trees are doused? But in turn making a longer game and higher stakes of mafia being killed off by the town in the meantime.
Logically, 2 people, albeit making it a little harder, a fast win may not necessarily be easy depending on whether or not both mafia can communicate. However, i believe in a setup like this; that its probably more than likely not the case.

But you tell if that point of view is wrong..

Okie, up to date and ready to not be hounded for confusion.
As far as i can understand thus far:
Me and Space advocate for a no lynch, although space seems like he’d consider a lynch.
Wooden, huschel, jabberwok and SUDK are all okay with a lynch yoday (good for them).

Not sure if i fully understand both sides of hypoclaiming. Its both beneficial for town and mafia.
And without it, what do we fall back on?

Also, after reading back in detail i realized how to answer the question.
If i was mafia, id prime as many people as possible, and then later game just be like “burn baby burn”.
Would that be considered conservative, or high risk high reward?

@Huschel:

Whether it's common or not isn't particularly relevant. If I feel like it's scummy behaviour I'm going to call it out. What was your alignment again last game? :ninja:

By all means call me out for scummy behaviour, but as a member of mere tree people I am not going to bother defending/pleading my case. There'd be no point, but i will try my best to read up on this stuff so you can go forward into a more pressing issue.
Alignment last game doesnt really give much for the current game, albeit aligned mafia at the time (hehe).

Can you elaborate on this, please?

On the bold part? Cause if thats the case i was talking about the firefighter possibly (at the time) could have saved themself at the same time as being targeted by mafia, much like a bulletproof/side effect of doctor.
If its not that you're looking for, then im not sure.

Of course, claiming must not happen prematurely. But keep in mind that it takes the arsonists two nights to kill a specific person (unless they had already been doused beforehand) so the firefighter might not even die immediately. Still, caution is obviously advised.

Noted. Will have read through extensively by next post.

@Galaxy, won't happen again boss. By all means if i do it in a future game, make sure you kill me for doing so. I need to learn from my mistakes.

@Huschel:

@Shinobu: You really need to familiarize yourself with the setup before leading people in unnecessary directions. Here's an incentive:

Vote Lynch: Shinobu Mahara I'll ask you the same question I gave Wooden: Do you think the arsonists would try to go for the win as soon as possible or would they try to be more conservative?@Jabberwok:The firefighter has to target 'one other player'.

@lecrystal and SUDK: Are you familiar with the hypo cop strategy? Or hypo firefighter in our case. You don't need to be because here is the crux of it:

Tell me why we should or shouldn't deploy this strategy.

@Shuhan: Do you think it is a Forest player's duty to appear not scummy?

I believe that the arsonists will kill off first at random unless of course someone does seem like a genuine threat. Really what i think doesnt change what might happen. As much as I think they would be more conservative, they could very well change their play style just to throw the game into chaos.
All I can say is your vote seems hella premature, and im not surprised. keep in mind I was having internet struggles at the time, however you're probably right in saying i should familiarize myself with it before i start the "unnessary directions".
By now you surely realize this is a common theme amongst how I play.. just let it go, dude/ ma'am.

No point really defending myself against your vote considering its "incentive". Regardless of whats been said I still dont advocate for a D1 lynch.
The chances are that the firefighter has/will save themselves for now, and mafia may very well get lucky on which one they hit. Saving not just 1 tree, but 2.
You guys seem to think just because there are limited players (9) that D1 lynch is a good thing. But through all the explanations I just dont see it.

On another note, there is a possibility that the firefighter may not be able to save themself, and only act like a doctor/healer role.
What do others think about this possibility, and in such a case, what might people suggest for that person? Claiming in that event would not be enough. It would be a confirmed kill at that point?
They may not necessarily be safe at night phase, we'd save someone, but the future safety of the trees would be in jeopardy.

But what happens under the circumstance that the firefighter dies D1 or N1. Then we have kinda boned ourselves.
Not only that but if the firefighter refuses to show themself, and its too late then where do we go from there?

2 mafia, 1 firefighter means we have a more than likely chance of getting a tree down than a mafia. Unless of course already there is dousing in play. In any event we may get lucky, but i wouldnt go to the effort of saying its more beneficial at this point to down a player without evidence.

@le crys, you may have faith in the firefighter, but does the firefighter have faith in themself? :ninja:

Okay so im gonna try and post something before my internet tries to tell me I cant connect again.
Personally I dont even know if this message will send but im typing it out anyway

As far as I can tell at this stage is Shuhan and I aren't okay with a D1 lynch. Where SUDK and Jabberwok are perfectly okay with it. Wooden is okay with lynching D1 inactives, which i can understand and by no means disagree with it, even if I don't want D1 lynches.

Never liked the numbers but if people really want my point of view on it
9 people playing, so i'm gonna go with either 2-3 mafia, 'cause that's generally 1/3rd.
Not exactly sure if there can be more than one firefighter, and I cant load another webpage to check which is great ;-;

Seemingly cant give much info due to internet struggle but will try to rectify it in the meantime so I can actually post something worthwhile if at all.. (if it lets me, we'll see i guess)

PM received. Character limit, pls.

Sign me up, yo. Ready for possible back to back wins

Got 'em foolio, haha. Strange hat reversed spacey's role on death

Okay after 7 and a half hours of me trying to move all my stuff into this god forsaken caravan, i am finally ready to have a break and quickly post my views.

However with todays events that i have slowly been working through, it seems the best call is to really see if jabber can flip mafia. I know personally that i dont believe he is, but losing a lynch this far into it im not completely okay with.
Its just that jabbers is getting some hella shade at the moment, and i havent exactly contributed much today. A hammer may look bad, but really if i dont actually contribute i'd look even worse.
Not only that but although SUDK and Wooden have been here and there in terms of posts, I cant say that i've proven myself more compitent than them, nor have i got a reason to really find them suspicious at all.
Aside from being interrogated by foolio i mostly agreed to most of his point of views. I wanna believe jabber is town, but by god do we need to do something today.. as you yourself say we cant afford to mislynch/not lynch today.
SUDK's take from todays events really put things into perspective if indeed they're right, which would be great but im still thinking that we are going after the wrong guy..

I understand its completely contradictory to what feeling ive discussed before. And i'm still really wanting to see foolio's flip.
So 99% probably gonna regret this but

Vote lynch: Jabberwok

@Jabberwok:

Oh boy, this again.

Look, circumstantial hypotheses about Mafia affiliation are fairly fruitless when there's a ton of ways a smart player like Space could have played this. It's pretty common for scum to avoid public association too much, for instance, and to eagerly bus each other as a form of proof. It's also a strategy to defend town players to ingratiate themselves and earn credibility. Space's vote for Shinobu when it would have been easier to vote for me was actually one of the main reasons I thought he was Town.

Foolio's right about one thing: Shinobu, you need to push more. It's Day 3, we don't have much evidence, and the only claim is my vanilla. Manicured neutrality isn't going to win the game. Push back. Interrogate someone.

Forgive me jabberwok, most of yesterday i was helping someone move out of my place, and today i am moving all of my stuff to my backyard, i will gladly try to think of questions, i just happen to be incredibly busy/exhausted in the last 2 days. How long is it before day end so i can make sure i post something worthwhile before the end of day that some people may be able to ask me more if necessary?

@Foolio:

@Shinobu, you also didn't place a vote. At least in your case it was consistent with your overall desire not to lynch (though I kinda lost track of where exactly you stood after all those posts). And honestly if I'd had the time to monitor the end of day I'd have switched my vote and you'd have probably been lynched. Anyway at the time I was your only stated suspect. Do you have a real case to build against me besides the fact that I questioned you aggressively?

Yeah, really wasn't feeling the hammer, it would have gone against what i said earlier. Cant say im surprised that you would have voted in me in the end anyway had you had the chance.
I've been unable to find any reason other than the fact that you were overwhelming me with questions. So i'm not exactly sure how to feel about that. Maybe when readying over more thoroughly i will find something more substantial.
Severely disappointed that the item shop didnt make its appearance but from what shuhan said in jabbers text i'd be really hoping it does even if its later on.
But at the same time, with more items, more chaos so, equally as good as it would bad? Hard to judge.

Finally the day started up again.. I no longer have to watch as the hours roll by with no new posts. Hallelujah.
First 2 nights the most strong posters go, this is not a pattern i like at all.
Keen to see what this item shop has in store, heh. ( Dad jokes are best jokes >:^) )
I think its incredibly likely spacey didnt target anybody, and especially not himself.
My guess personally is that Spacey was perhaps third party and mafia are out there somewhere.

In another scenario though, not sure if it works this way or not but, what if Spacey targets a person in the night, that person would have been potentially killed, mafia try to kill spacey, therefore stopping spacey's target to be eliminated?
Or would it have 100% killed both Spacey and his target?

Ahh okay that makes a lot more sense to me then. Not being able to completely connect the dots, and getting in the way of him questioning jabberwok. I guess i did think that he was trying to screw with me. And i do see it was warranted.
So if i think foolio is in fact guilty, i need something legitimate not just him accusing me. Makes sense i guess. I guess i'll have to read over all of his posts and try to see if anything stands out..?
If i do get one more vote, i would want the very last voter to wait until the latest possible chance so i am well and truly able to claim.

@Jabberwok:

This really doesn't clear up anything. And among other things, it doesn't answer why you'd switched to an interest in lynching me that seems to contradict your patient approach otherwise.

I'm definitely interested in hearing more from you, but for now…

Vote Lynch: Shinobu

At the time it seemed as though i was being told what to do, i was accused of sitting on my ass, because I wanted to wait out the first 2 days. And at the time that was the only bandwagon that was available.
And I pointed out that if that is the case, that i'd be more inclined to go for a different bandwagon if given one at the time.. although looking back on it.. why would i want a different wagon if i dont want hostility in the first 2 days?
Simply put, I didnt stand up for my own views after thinking i was doing a bad thing. And changed accordingly the way i see it.

@SpaceCowboy:

(1) I still have trouble believing this.
Even of the description was confusing, the first thing you do is ask the mod for clarification. You don't just barge into the game without knowing your powers and limits.

(2) But no one else was on his side like you were though. There was a point where you were actually making justifications for him. He could have easily latched into some stuff you said to defend himself.
This is not an argument on your favor.

(3) That's D3… in a 7 person format.
That's like purposing to stay idle until D5 on a 12 person game.
Besides, if you have something against Foolio, why not start building it now? What if you get killed tonight? Then we will never know what you have against Foolio other than the mysterious reference on post #160.
This makes it seem like the only case you have against him is... the fact that he thinks your suspicious. And that's the worst course of action, because while I don't think by any measure that Foolio is confirmed Town, I would have to be crazy not to see why he thinks you're suspicious.

(4) This is one of those situations where I said you are making up excuses for Jabber.
Now he even denies it by saying his text leaves no room for error, even though there's a chance he isn't being truthful.
Hell, you had Faith's item text format. How is that anything like what you described?

(5) I do agree with this and would like to see Woody's reply.

My stance is for Shinobu's unless there's a complete turn around while I'm gone.
If Jabber (or anyone else somehow) gets 3 votes, and a forth is needed, I'll hammer it 5 minutes before the time limit. It would be a waste of time to get to Night without a lynch.

1. Trouble believing it or not, it can happen. But possibility i want to see you or others opinions on, is what if the item only did something dependent on who has a certain role. What if that item could have done something if he had of just targeted a different person? Speculation, sure. More confusion, some might say. But its a possibility.

2. So let me get this right, your saying its bad for someone to actively defend someone that most believe to be town, when a lynch is involved? Am i not meant to try and sway they vote so its potentially not wasted?

3. I would build something against him but im not exactly sure how to go about doing that. I've said my point of view of most of the things hes said to me.
Now hear me out here. Your saying that hes throwing on me, for no reason. And because I think he finds me suspicious, and actively going against him because of that. Thats bad?
If thats the case then i completely understand the votes against me. A lot of these concepts arent really all that obvious to me.

4. This is one thing i genuinely screwed up on. My item text is well and truly covered in terms of what it does, and i can definitely see why that would have started confusion or even suspicion. and im not honestly sure why i thought it wasnt that extensive.
Either i clearly only focused on key words, or im incredibly forgetful. Either way 100% my fault.

5. Woo, finally something somebody agrees with.

Slowly going through and reading the posts against me, will happily clear anything up for anyone. I can see allegations have started against me.

(Would multi quote but 4 people have quoted me)
@Spacey, You say i got in the way of an interrogastion, which yes kinda true i guess. I did take jabbers side, compared to foolio, and i was kinda pressured into having my own stances by Foolio.
Or at least it seemed like it. As much as i can understand your reasoning behind a flip benefiting more if i flip first, i dont exactly like hearing it, but it does make sense.
And as for using items without fully reading the description, i've done it in previous games, i wouldnt be so sure, bucko.
You mention post 154, all in all it was mostly based of my own item. So I guess you would most likely label this as bullshit but i was being honest. But really what i say about that, from your perspective could be heresay.
You say I have no real reason to trust jabber, but really thats the case with anyone playing..

Passive game huh? On day 3 ive already pointed out i'd be instantly going after foolio, sure game has been fairly calm considering all the accusations thrown.
You seem to think that my post about item description is really worth something, but honestly look at it dude.
I said my own item wasnt that descriptive, and was saying perhaps it was the same for Jabbers. Everyone got one, and chances are they got almost similar description format. Sure, not baseless conjecture, but from your side it seems like complete trash, which is completely fine.

@Wooden,
I know i call out for help a lot, limited games played, begged to stay alive almost every game. Probably really annoying now that i think about it.
You say you think 1 maf is unbalanced but you'll only go for one target at a time? Would you say that trying to focus on one suspect at once helps?
You dont exactly say a hell of a lot, and in turn i havent much to ask you.

@Foolio,
You think your main problem with me is the confusion, and im trying to go to my best effort to really turn that around. I am glad you think the same when it comes to proving ones role off another.
There is no real way for me to drop your thoughts against me, without asking more question make everything clear. If you think that i am so confused, which is a damn fair assumption, then i suggest you ask me smaller, clear, direct questions that I may actually be able to answer straight, without others or yourself looking into it way too far.

If i have more to explain, please pull me up for it, there was just a lot of text to read through so i might have missed something.

Well i guess i never really thought about it like that, but at the same time i never actually voted towards you, and still to this point i still don't really want to, i'm just saying if not you, what else am i really meant to do in this circumstance, except hear everybody out. Sure, i can understand that up until this point i have be advocating for a no lynch for at least the first 2 days. And I still stand by that for the most part.
But for god only knows what reason, i'm apparently a threat waiting to be eliminated by Foolio. I don't actively think you're the problem here.
Just because i didn't actively say i don't like the numbers game, doesn't mean much. Like i tried to keep it to a minimal from my posts, but that's the only thing i can control.

I said that if given another option, i would sway more towards something substantial. And at this point i'm completely aware that some may perceive me as a threat.
I realize that it might seem like im trying to throw confusion out there, but it is simply that i myself am confused.

I dont particularly like the aggressive playstyle, am not a fan of highly likely killing a townie. I'm sorry but i don't really wanna buy what you're selling Foolio.
And i would take great pleasure in starting a bandwagon on you, but in doing so i would also be going against my 2 day no-lynch policy. I dont wanna be that guy that doesnt keep his word.
But by god, tomorrow you're the first one in mind.

As much as i may read this thread over and over, some things just dont quite click sometimes.

I wanna see more from others about this. As it takes 4 to lynch, 2 votes wont make the cut. I know you keep saying that they are more and more suspicious with every post. I'm just simply saying that i dont really see it.
That and I dont exactly see how i've made myself look like a target to you, I see the fact that I am to stop thinking about the long game. But aside from that, in general from me is either a lot of confusion and unwarranted cautiousness.
If you cant convince others to go towards your cause, then it simply wont happen, as much as we all might need it to.

@Everyone: What is your stance when it comes to me being next on the block? Cause Foolio clearly likes the idea of it.
Do you think overall i should really be next? If so why?

@Foolio:

Faith was already a townie with the indirect ability to kill. If you really want to question me on this, then I have to speculate on things like the knife item. Sure it could be a vanilla mafia role (would make sense to balance 2 mafia), but it could just as easily be a killing town role. Something like a vig would further cement it as a high risk / high reward town setup.

As for wanting to push for a lynch: maybe, MAYBE, if I had no real leads and I had to pick at random just for the sake of it, I'd think a little bit more carefully about whether it's worth it. Maybe. But I have some serious suspicion already. What's going to change between now and tomorrow? Will somehow gaining more insight into the number of mafia increase your ability to sniff them out?

Your "default assumption" makes no sense; if the town ever does decide to mass claim they're not doing it so everyone can just go "vanilla!" In general individuals don't claim unless they have important evidence to present or if they're about to be lynched. Another thing about a vanilla claim is that it's the safest possible claim for scum… so yeah. This does benefit the town, because I'm actually calling you out for scummy behavior. And if you're somehow innocent then well, you're actually distracting the town from the real scum.

I think there'd still be 2 mafia. Especially if the item shop is a real thing. Maybe the mafia don't actually know each other / are different factions. But I absolutely don't believe we only have to catch one person to win. Needless to say I don't believe Jabberwok though.

Sure if we're going to actually pursue some kind of action or meaningful conversation and not just sit around theorizing numbers without making progress.

I can completely understand that point of view, in fact I agree with it. As I have already said i believe there to be 2 mafia. And you're completely right, sitting around does do nothing if later items are going to make it much more difficult to determine, which players are the real deal townies. Something i've been wanting for a while is for others to stop hitting the numbers side of this all so that we can progress. Drawing questions out of something like that, can only really look into it so far.
From your perspective, you are saying it is better to lynch what could be either a distracting townie/mafia. And it is in best interest for town to lynch them so we can focus on the real matters at hand?

I realize before day end i will probably have to vote him, purely on the fact that i want to actually get some actual knowledge behind it all. You say that if picked at random you'd wanna be more careful about who you are picking?
And does that mean that when voting, that he'd be a safe pick? Not only that but wouldn't actively voting him for such a (not well thought out) small reason, would make me a target for others, because i've jumped on a certain bandwagon?
We have plenty of time to discuss it, at least now I finally have questions to ask.

TLDR: would vote jabberwok by the end of day if nothing else has really turned up, trying to be helpful, DOWN WITH THE NUMBERS GAME!

@SpaceCowboy:

@Shinobu: I understand that Jabber used the expression “Myitem did indeed do literally nothing”,but why are you coming up with so many scenarios about him eitherusing it or not using it?
Doyou think the mod would have given him an item without anyexplanation and just tell him “Yeah, you have to use this in orderto find out of it works or not, but I’m also not telling you whatit will do if it works.”
Why do you think he would use any item on N1?

As far as i can tell ive only pointed out one possibility. And that was that they might not have used it yet. I think with the incredibly limited text that all players would have gotten from Shuhan, wasnt that extensive.
I think its likely that he might not have given the most through description, as he did the exact same thing to me in the PM where i got my item. He could have very well used it without fully reading the description.
Might have seemed like it did nothing, when it did. Im simply keeping an open mind. And now i've posed 2 different scenarios for Jabs.
There would be many reasons to use an item in N1 depending on what you have. I personally dont think that there would be an item that specifically does nothing, cause one person holding that item is gonna feel real bummed out.

How do I feel about a day extension? I am perfectly okay with it, cause at this point only one person has voted and i want to make sure everybody gets their chance to vote if they are intending on doing so.

@Foolio:

Even if for some reason I can't comprehend you don't want to lynch, don't twiddle your thumbs. Ask questions. Get players to take stances, provide observations. Active conversation that we can look back on later to maybe actually benefit from flips. Otherwise you're next in line after Jabberwok on my list.

You've been saying the same damn thing since the first game i was involved in xD
As much as i dont like the possible threat of me being next, i'm not exactly going to go out of my way to trying to hold something to that. Considering my behaviour can easily be changed, im just not exactly sure what questions to exactly ask.

Something I can do however is; Giving information from what i think, to start possible conversation later.
Looking back on the things ive said earlier about not want to screw up a lynch and your aggressive play style, is already showing you my stance and observation. Getting other players to take their stand is a little bit more difficult.
Im sure that i am probably not the only one with that stand either. And seem to be less in the firing line than i am. But with time I can change that I guess.
Being over confident in what you believe in, can get you killed my man.

I think its likely its 2 v 5, I never really fully considered the idea of a 3rd party, but at this point i would like to think that possibility is out.

Indeed, there a no real leads in this situation. Not from my standpoint at least. Sure, it might look like im sitting on my @ss and not doing anything about it.
Might not be my first rodeo, but "going against everything mafia stand for" at this point sounds like a pretty solid plan. The information we get out of people using their abilities will tell us more.
And im not prepared to eliminate/ help towards eliminating a fellow town just for the sake of making it..

A. Play faster than it already will be
B. Feel like im helping the cause when in fact we just killed an innocent
C. Or in the very small chance that we do put the pin in the right donkey (which is the only thing i would be okay with out of these options.)

Its not the Fact that Jabs claim was soft. He simply didnt go to much of an effort to reveal his possible roll. I am still inclined to believe that they still havent used their item. As it is just as likely as Jab being honest.
It might be irrelevant to his part in all of this, but considering we dont really know all that much at this point, if anything at all other than Faith was a doctor and killed throughout the night.
It would seem me and Wooden, although want to believe the fact that he is in fact town. Personally i think his claim seemed more in passing. But at this stage, I dont see what he said as a big thing.

Hopefully you'll see my point of view, instead of what seems to be an aggressive play style. 2 vote choices this early worries me. But you know, thats just me.

@Foolio:

I didn't say getting into items would be pointless, but a potential benefit to the mafia. And new abilities themselves are only scary if the mafia also gets them; the real pain is the chaos involved because I like to be able to consider a known set of parameters and scum hunt accordingly… sudden wrenches thrown in mid-game disrupt my ability to effectively strategize and reduces things more to luck or obvious slips/behavior.

Shinobu, what do you think we should do today? Any hunches or suspects? Yesterday you acted a bit clueless regarding the question asked of you, and you never even took a stance on whether to go for a lynch.

What do i think we should do today, is wait until we have something more substantial. As for hunches or suspects, I have literally none. Sure I dont like any given player really trying to claim a certain role first day.
As anybody at that point can/most likely will say that they are vanilla town. Almost anyone can say it, with little to no repercussions because they are either honest, its first day, or its the best bluff of their life.
I'd probably more inclined to believe that Jabberwok may not have even used his item. Sure, he claims his power did nothing. But what if they just straight up didnt use it. Only speculation at this point, but its possible.
Frankly anybody could have done the very same thing, so jabberwok don't feel singled out.
It is simply you are the only one at this point that has actively talked about the supposed use of an item.

Personally i am against actively going for a lynch within the first 2 days, cause we dont exactly have enough facts to pick a certain vote. To me, going to the effort of voting for a no lynch is wasted time for all those who do so.
Either way first day usually will usually end in a no lynch at the end of D1 anyway.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Wooden_Giraffe:

Well that’s a tricky ability. Would have been more useful with a larger number of players.
Just got home from my work trip and I’m mostly just checking in before I collapse in bed. A few highlights with more sometime tomorrow afternoon.
-A Lynch should definitely happen today, no one is really all that inactoce(I might be the chiefest sinner there), so we’ll have plenty of dialogue to work off of. Even more so if we keep the conversation going. Something to note, however, is that if there are 2 mafia then we’re basically at mislynch and lose.
-I’d have no issues putting a Lynch vote down right now on Jabs after his soft claim, but there is still lots of time in the day and enough people have called him out on it that he should respond.
-Chester is taking his sweet sinister time getting us the shop, I almost wonder if it’ll be coming at all.

2 thoughts on this: A lynch today would go against what I personally think will benefit town. As if it is more outnumbered terms, actively seeking a lynch would have more chances in resulting in a dead member of town, which is always gonna be a bad thing.
Jabs claim albeit soft, just seemed too easy in my opinion. He should respond, but considering his claim was so soft, hes not going to be able to really defend/explain something that may not have gone in depth to start with.

Sorry for the late activity, had a couple drinks last night. Anyways, poor Faith. First day kills are always so hard to determine, but chances are it was chosen at random.
I personally dont think that Faith was that inactive considering she wrote a hell of a lot while she was around. Which i guess now being gone, everyone will need to do the very same.

My thoughts on possibly getting new abilities tomorrow scares me, cause that would only make things so much more difficult. But as Foolio said talking extensively into items before receiving them would be pointless.

@SpaceCowboy:

They discussed the possibility of a third party guy and the set up being 5 vs 1 vs 1. One mafia and one third partyish player.
You said you bekieved in 2 mafia, but i'm wondering what you think of this possibility.

Well across the entire dynamic, from first assumption, when looking at the items throughout… 2 mafia, 4 siding to town. With a possible bad or good 3rd party. What that might be exactly id have no idea cause at this point its pretty up in the air.
I don't really personally think that they would make the stakes that harsh, but usually i'm always wrong, so that doesn't say much. Water hose kinda threw me off, but i'm sure that in due time, a greater understanding will reveal itself.

@SpaceCowboy:

What do you think about Jabber's/Faith's hypothesis about a possible third element?

wut? Read over what they both said and i feel like i might misinterpret what element youre talking about. Simply meaning the items given out?

Im exactly talking about that first joke vote as soon as game started. So no you didnt miss one.

Hot damn, the madness has begun, not much of a statistics guy, but id like to think 2 maf sounds about right.
Seeing first day (fun) lynch votes makes me shake my head every time.

Gimme #5 baby

Sign me up, I'm ready to slay.

With great honour, an empty list, looks like im going to the top baby, WOO!
Count me in

Sign me up, i'm in, my dudes

I am so glad that Panz Fry can live on in Big Pan's memory :')

Survivor thread starter pack:
Plenty of rocks to throw at wooden
Be friends with spacey (if i even manage to figure out who is who)
Kill outerspec for backstabbing me games ago. (sadly cant happen cause they pulled out)
Try to be useful and be hopeless at it.
Most likely be killed off before the merge

From the lack of reply from Galaxy I assume my PM was perfectly fine
Keen as a bean.

Character list:
1. Miss Valentine
2. Panz Fry
3. Dalton
4. Miss Father's Day
5. Surume

Hey everyone, looks like imma try and have a hell of a time in this game >:D I'm unsure as to whats to come, but I can see fun is to be had. All aboard the hype train!