We know that Luffy has a very strong will and doesn't fear anything… but after this Chapter I want to know what do you think have the greater "spirit" or will...
Shanks or Luffy???
Ok Shanks is longer on the grandline and has more experience but for me it has nothing to do with someones will how long he is on or how strong he is... so Luffy maybe have some "spirit" near Shanks... but on the end we have to see who has the stronger will...
Luffy doesn't knock people down when he walks by, so I'm gonna go with Shanks right now.
yeah,Shanks spirit is greater(but i think he has a special ability or something like that)
@Fire Fist:
Luffy doesn't knock people down when he walks by, so I'm gonna go with Shanks right now.
Yup, so be it!
Luffys only display of a similiar "spirtit" was, when he turned to Cirkies (after defeating Bellamy) and C. tumbled down - but it was by far less impressive.
Hot thing to think that Luffy has to beat this when he really wants to become pirate king
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I have the unpleasant feeling the way BB will knock Ace's out, thus being able to hit him despite his Logia powers will have something to do with the fact BB has a stronger spirit than him.
You know I think this sorta explains how Shanks scared the living crap out of that giant fish in the beginning of the series.
I have the unpleasant feeling the way BB will knock Ace's out, thus being able to hit him despite his Logia powers will have something to do with the fact BB has a stronger spirit than him.
yeah,that´ll be a nice plot twist
lol
"i don´t need a freakin´ weapon,just gimme spirit powa`" rofl
but serious,i don´t know what to think about that :/
You know, cancelling devil fruit powers without the user being surrounded by water or touched by seastone already happend in the manga, the only thing is it has always been comic relief for the moment (Nami and Garp actually hurting Luffy with their punches). Now maybe Oda will use it again, but for a "serious" fight.
Probably Shanks since before this thread this concept would have been ridiculed to no end.
Carter, if you think the thread doesn't worth it, just ignore it. This is your … nth warning. We let it slide too much in the past.
You said it yourself. It's Luffy's will that's impressive. Shanks has a spirit like the pressure he gives when he just walks next to you. Luffy is always cheerful and carefree, who the hell will be pulled by the pressure he gives? He just never gives the fucking up. Or so I think about the spirit thingy.
Offtopic, I still remember how Ace was knocked through alot of walls way back at the resturant in Alabasta when he was suprised. Doesn't this show he and Smoker need to get ready to be immune to hits? Although I don't think he won't be ready when facing BB..
Luffy has more spirit. They're both really strong, but in my opinion, Luffy has risen closer to the top Shanks could ever have, and I bet Luffy is stronger both physically and mentally, in a totally non-fanboyish way.
@Private:
Luffy has more spirit. They're both really strong, but in my opinion, Luffy has risen closer to the top Shanks could ever have, and I bet Luffy is stronger both physically and mentally, in a totally non-fanboyish way.
**Please don't lie to yourself.
shanks is stronger in just about every way imaginable.**
He got knocked through a bunch of walls, but he got up right away afterwards, so it didn't really hurt him.
That's only because he's really stong phsycally.
If luffy was as strong as shanks cp9 wouldn't have been any problem at all. He'll get there but not yet he's got a long way to go.
I think there is a little more to this "spirit".. I think this because if shanks wasnt able to turn it off and on in a sense then when he was at luffys town he would have of messed up all the towns ppl..
I also think think because im sure WB has a strong spirit, and his crew is fine around him
@Octogon:
**Please don't lie to yourself.
shanks is stronger in just about every way imaginable.**
I'm not lying to myself. Luffy could kick Shank's ass any day of the week.
@Private:
I'm not lying to myself. Luffy could kick Shank's ass any day of the week.
**You're in denial. Luffy is nowhere near Shanks in any way shape and form.
Shanks would own Luffy with his ass in his mouth while drinking booze and running backwards.**
@Private:
I'm not lying to myself. Luffy could kick Shank's ass any day of the week.
um from what I'm seeing, not really. eventually yes, but for now, he has to beat out Ace (not like he would fight him) and Teach to stand a chance agaisnt Shanks (not like he would fight him either).
What's the deal with Ace? I know he always beat Luffy as a kid, but I bet Luffy could beat him now (using Gears of course). I never thought Ace was all he was cracked up to be. Luffy could have taken out all those ships at once with a Gomu Gomu Storm.
Private Zulen, your perspective on the strength of OP characters is extremely skewed.
I don't think either havs a stronger "spirit". I lack sufficient evidence to decide what "spirit" is. Is it just having a strong will and dream? If so, Luffy probably wins. But to manifest will into something that harms people? That's something beyond pure will, so this "spirit" is philosophical BS or some kind of power. In either case, a comparison can't be judged.
I think your reading too much into it
I think Oda made Shanks ambition or spirit knock down the weaker pirates of WB crew to show Shanks is very strong
But them again I might be wrong
I fail to see how Luffy with Gears would hurt let alone beat Ace. Ace is a logia so Luffy's punches will do nothing but make Ace laugh. But to each his own I suppose.
I wonder if Oda will get into the realm of spiritual/life energy(ki/chi/etc.) Shank's knockout aura reminds me of the whole nen/ren concept in Hunter X Hunter.
Falcore
I wonder if Oda will get into the realm of spiritual/life energy(ki/chi/etc.) Shank's knockout aura reminds me of the whole nen/ren concept in Hunter X Hunter.
Falcore
I hope not. IMO ki/chi/chakra doesn't really fit with the One Piece verse (except maybe Zoro Shanks & Mihawk alone). Other than those three, I hope nobody else uses energy attacks. But this is assuming that Shanks ability is even enery or whatever. Just my opinon
I think that the issue of spirit vs spirit here is more than just one dimensional
obviously we have shanks who floors people with his presence
but then again, luffy never showed fear of someone before. he might have been concerned certain techniques were gonna hurt him, but he was never intimidated by someone's presence
also, there is a question of the context of their meeting and whether they would be harboring presence towards each other that would be intimidating. shanks and luffy are close friends, especially since shanks is something of a mentor/father figure to luffy
that being said, if we were to ignore all of those dimensions and just look at spirit vs spirit, luffy has shown some crazy spirit when he finds the right reasons in a similar way to shanks. it is really measured by their conviction in what they are seeking whether its to kick crocodile's ass or to stop ace from getting himself killed. as far as that goes, there is no objective way to measure it.
but be assured that as far as fighting goes, luffy in 2nd & 3rd gear combined might STILL not match up to the experience and ambition of shanks
I think Oda made Shanks ambition or spirit knock down the weaker pirates of WB crew to show Shanks is very strong
That's the most logical thing, but what I mean is it's illogical. Using your spirit to make people pass out? How does that work? I understand OP is very out of the ordinary, but even if you use your ambition or your "spirit" to knock out people, how does one measure that? Shouldn't Luffy have a pretty decent amount of such energy then? I mean Shanks could in theory have enough to floor pirates, but shouldn't Luffy then at least have enough to floor common folk with no ambition at all?
I think this spirit thing is just crap, or some ability of Shanks that they refer to as "spirit".
@Octogon:
Private Zulen, your perspective on the strength of OP characters is extremely skewed.
I actually think Zulen was on a wind up in this thread, that's the only explanation :o|
Carter, if you think the thread doesn't worth it, just ignore it. This is your … nth warning. We let it slide too much in the past.
Excuse me, but where did i say it was "worthless"?
I also see you took the liberty of deleting several good natured posts. Good work.
You guys are forgetting that was a swordsman's spirit which Shanks let out. Zoro was the one to demonstrate this, Zoror and Kaku were talking about Spirit and Zoro's final attack had to do with his "spirit."
The "Spirit" seems suitable for swordsman like Mihawk, Shanks, and Zoro.
I didn't think the "spirit" thing was an ability so much as…they just kind of suffered a bit of a breakdown from being in his presence.
Put another way, since I think that sentence got nothing across, it's like if I were to get in the ring with a professional wrestler.
So you know, I'm 5'8 and nowhere near as buff as those steroid-enhanced maniacs. I would damn near faint from fear.
I think it's much along the same lines, here, just taken to the typical anime/manga extreme. As for why it never affects his crewmates or the villagers from the start of the manga, he was usually rather laidback. When he gets serious, though, he's scary as hell. Example: The sea king in the first chapter.
Also, as far as I can tell most Logia-Users need to prepare for a blow. Crocodile was exceptional in that he had trained to do it automatically. Ace, apparently, has not.
personally, I think Luffy has shown, maybe not a Shanks level of "spirit", but an almost similar type of "spirit". When Luffy fought Crocodile, Bellamy, or even Lucci, there wasn't an one person immediatley around him when he went into his "really pissed off" mode. So nobody was there to say what an incredible spirit (when I say immediate I'm talking 15-20 meters or so) that Luffy has. Zoro in his last fight is the first crew mate of the Mugiwaras to demonstrate the "spirit" so far. I'm sure if there were any kiddos around the Zoro/Kaku finish they could of fainted as well. So far we don't know how this "spirit" works, it could be something as when Kenshin threw his "spirit" at Sojiro in Rurouni Kenshin, lets see some more about it first. I personally think Luffy has some sort of "spirit" already, he just can't turn it off/on like Shanks, and he not too far off from messing with the big boys.
Yeah, you're right. Luffy only really kicked ass when he's really, really mad. Bellamy laughed at him, and got his face beaten into. Arlong said he "used Nami" so he was blasted down 3 stories. Buggy talked shit about Shanks so Luffy blasted him in the chest and kicked him the nuts. Crocodile… err killed millions of innocent people and led a cleverly plotted assault towards the King of Arabasta, involving the corruption of 1000's of soldiers.... So Luffy beat the living shit out of him, punching him through solid bedrock.
You've got a good point there. It takes a mean insult against Luffy to get your ass kicked.
You guys are forgetting that was a swordsman's spirit which Shanks let out. Zoro was the one to demonstrate this, Zoror and Kaku were talking about Spirit and Zoro's final attack had to do with his "spirit."
The "Spirit" seems suitable for swordsman like Mihawk, Shanks, and Zoro.
I'd have to agree, in that sense, it seems like a swordsman deal. Zoro's Asura was "Demon Spirit etc…" You could say the whole Shishi Sonson deal is "spiritual" in nature also.
Though spirit in the sense of having strong will, well, hard to tell. We don't really know Shanks goals if he has any (from what I recall.)
**I think people are taking this spirit thing way to literally. I doubt the spirit thing is going to be like in Bleach.
I'd say that everyone has chi. And that a HUGE difference in strength is required for an effect like what did to happen. It also seems like the SH are just now reaching the level where one's chi can effect other.**
Look guys I think we need a better understanding/translation of what Oda meant by "Spirit"
My understanding is that the Kanji he used for this so called "spirit" is not the average words used to describe say the energy or power of a Shonen character. Usually the character used to describe energy in a character like Goku or Ichigo is 気 ("CHI")
Where as the words used to describe Shank's spirit/presence/aura is 覇気(in chinese, BA CHI _). This is a slightly different variation, and does not necessitate an implication of energy or power, but a strong "bullying" or "reckless overpowering" presence. I'm not 100% on this because I don't speak japanese, but that's how I would interpret the chinese meaning of it. Someone help me out here on the Japanese pronounciation and definition. 気 ("CHI") can be interpreted VERY DIFFERENTLY in many cases because it is a word that people actually use in real life to describe some people, and obviously not as a description of a person's energy/powerful, but as a description of one's presence or overall impression viz. Martin Luther King's magnitism.
So in the face of an entire enemy crew, Shanks put on his baddass face, and heightened his aura to give off the most menacing impression. I HIGHLY doubt ODA will introduce an element of spiritual power or energy, just that at the Yonkou's level, Shanks has to show the enemy just how formidle an opponent he is. Just of a scary m'fukin Mob boss who wants everyone in the room to be afraid of him with one stare and multiply that by 1000 times._
@Rollo:
That's the most logical thing, but what I mean is it's illogical. Using your spirit to make people pass out? How does that work? I understand OP is very out of the ordinary, but even if you use your ambition or your "spirit" to knock out people, how does one measure that? Shouldn't Luffy have a pretty decent amount of such energy then? I mean Shanks could in theory have enough to floor pirates, but shouldn't Luffy then at least have enough to floor common folk with no ambition at all?
I think this spirit thing is just crap, or some ability of Shanks that they refer to as "spirit".
I would say it the way Oda chosed to express the power of Shanks ambition or spirit
Not that it would happen that exagerated in the real world but people sometimes get paralize by fear
So my guess is that probably Shanks power was feared by all WB's men was soon was they fell it coming
But like I said before I really don't have a clue if I'm right or wrong
You know, I don't think and don't want Luffy to have that same spirit and pressure Shanks gives. Although it's very handy, you can see them passing through Enies Lobby without using an atom of the tip of the fingernail. I can see Zoro advancing to something like that. Sanji too. Usopp can advance like that too as proof he became a Strong Warrior of the Sea. But not anyone else.
I think you guys are forgeting something….Shanks may have a great spirit but he is in the GrandLine for like more than 10 years and Luffy is there for like no more than a year and look how far he is!
Please look at page 5, the picture on the low right corner. The wood is cracking. That's not fear, ambition or anything: simply, Shanks' spirit is actually a form of real energy. Accept it.
Besides, we've already seen several magic tricks: mantra, Asura, the whole Klabautermann-Merry thing… I can accept Shanks being an ESPer or something.
Anyways I think the "spirit force" involves Zoro, rather than Luffy. Mihawk told him "Try to overcome me with your mental strenght" or something similar. And some of his techniques (Lion song, # pound cannon, Asura) seem to utilize such mental strenght along with muscle force. Since Shanks is also a swordsman, I guess the "spirit" we see in 434 is the same thing too.
Luffy, instead... He sure has pride, will, determination etc. But it never showed any actual "might" related to his spirit. His strenght is only due to muscles and rubber. His "will" is as strong as Shanks' one, but his "spirit" is surely weaker: indeed, he hasn't any spirit.
I don't think Shanks can use Soru or destroy buildings. Maybe he can't even cut a galeon from miles away, like Mihawk. But I'm sure he's far stronger than Luffy. I think Lucci can barely scratch him.
He's one of the four mightiest pirates in the world, and right now he's dueling with Newgate, which used to be Roger's rival. I think this proves enough who's stronger.
could Dragon's green wind be his spirit? 0.o
I don't think Shanks can use Soru or destroy buildings. Maybe he can't even cut a galeon from miles away, like Mihawk. But I'm sure he's far stronger than Luffy. I think Lucci can barely scratch him.
The sky split open when he struck Whitebeard's Naginata. I'd say that he could destroy buildings. And look at the jug of Sake he drags to Newgate with ONE ARM. It's gotta weigh at least a ton or two. Liquid is heavy, especially alcohol.
Luffy did actually show his aura once before, in Mocktown. When Sarquiss half-heartedly challenged him, Luffy simply turned to face him and it knocked him down. It may not be as effective as Shanks' aura, but it still works.
@Fire Fist:
Luffy did actually show his aura once before, in Mocktown. When Sarquiss half-heartedly challenged him, Luffy simply turned to face him and it knocked him down. It may not be as effective as Shanks' aura, but it still works.
Sarquiss didn't faint, he didn't have blank eyes nor foam pouring from his mouth. He just jumped backwards and fell, it's a common behaviour when being scared like hell.
Luffy doesn't have that kind of aura; otherwise he would've used it against EL marines (assuming that you can control it).
_
