Who is the final villain in One Piece? 2.0

Jabra

I can't take this … Luffy weak against heat & sword? If we compared rubber with human skin & flesh, which one more weak against heat & sword? Not to mention Luffy will possess strong COA and already have red hawk attack (use fire).

What do you mean, you can't take this? Luffy being vulnerable to heat and cutting attacks is established, he just learned to protect himself from weaker attacks. Hody freaking Jones was already enough to break his Coa. Similar, the flames produced from Red Hawk are hardly comparable to a magma fist from Akainu. It would surprise me if Oda wouldn't make that a thing when Luffy fights him near the end of the series (if only to show how he overcomes one of his greatest weaknesses on the highest level, shounen style).

@Pinelark:

This hunch just leads me to believe Blackbeard wants to tear apart the World Gov't, but instead of for a good reason, he'd probably do it with the intent of trying to descend the world either into madness or subject it to his rule.

Blackbeard destroying the World Government would be amazing, but I worry that I would probably start to root for him if he does.

desa

@Jules197:

Glad to see a guy who can definitely have a logical argument and is able to clearly explain why he disagrees with someone else's point of view. Bravo!

He discussed the subject to death in the first version of this thread. He must be tired to make lenghty post about it.

ArmamentHero

@Darth:

You know what I'm curious about?

How did anyone reading Marineford arc had come to the conclusion that Blackbeard is more dangerous and stronger of the two.

I don't know what you mean by 'anyone', but Blackbeard was dangerous then(not as dangerous as the two implied). He's now a yonkou, makes him much more dangerous.

desa

@Darth:

You know what I'm curious about?

How did anyone reading Marineford arc had come to the conclusion that Blackbeard is more dangerous and stronger of the two.

People are talking about his level at the end of the series not the one he had at marineford.

Darth

@ArmamentHero:

I don't know what you mean by 'anyone', but Blackbeard was dangerous then(not as dangerous as the two implied). He's now a yonkou, makes him much more dangerous.

Why does it?

See, it's like saying that Akainu being Fleet Admiral makes him that more dangerous. If we compare the resources the two had at their command, I would say that Sakazuki's growth has been more substantial.

Also, you people put way too much faith in the Yonkou title.

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@desa:

People are talking about his level at the end of the series not the one he had at marineford.

Baseless speculation then?

Akainu is a logia with the ability to ignore haki attacks. That means functional immortality against most opponents.

ArmamentHero

@Darth:

Why does it?

See, it's like saying that Akainu being Fleet Admiral makes him that more dangerous. If we compare the resources the two had at their command, I would say that Sakazuki's growth has been more substantial.

Also, you people put way too much faith in the Yonkou title.

I agree with your Akainu statement. When it comes to the Yonkous, we all know they are the most feared and respected pirates in the New World. I remember when Shanks blocked Akainu's punch and him(Akainu) sweating bullets. There's been a lot of emphasis on how terrifying a yonkou can be, so yes, I'm going to be hopeful for them.

ZoroXTashigi

@Jabra:

What do you mean, you can't take this? Luffy being vulnerable to heat and cutting attacks is established, he just learned to protect himself from weaker attacks. Hody freaking Jones was already enough to break his Coa. Similar, the flames produced from Red Hawk are hardly comparable to a magma fist from Akainu. It would surprise me if Oda wouldn't make that a thing when Luffy fights him near the end of the series (if only to show how he overcomes one of his greatest weaknesses on the highest level, shounen style).

I mean, it annoy me if someone say Luffy weak to fire & sword because his rubber, but common people also have same weakness. If Luffy doesn't eat DF, he still weak to heat & fire (that is the point). And you can't compare luffy's CoA from Fishman Island Arc with Final Arc … because it will be disappointing if Luffy's CoA not at least = Prime Garp, because both use fist-fights.

Darth

@ArmamentHero:

I agree with your Akainu statement. When it comes to the Yonkous, we all know they are the most feared and respected pirates in the New World.

Which is why everyone has been going around picking fights with them, without a care in the world…

@ArmamentHero:

I remember when Shanks blocked Akainu's punch and him(Akainu) sweating bullets. There's been a lot of emphasis on how terrifying a yonkou can be, so yes, I'm going to be hopeful for them.

I disagree. I would rather say that it was a simple surprise, which is understandable, since he basicaly teleported in front of him in a way that would make Kizaru proud.

ArmamentHero

@Darth:

Which is why everyone has been going around picking fights with them, without a care in the world…

I disagree. I would rather say that it was a simple surprise, which is understandable, since he basicaly teleported in front of him in a way that would make Kizaru proud.

Another reason why it's highly anticipated, the after affects of Yonkous falling(Big Mom&Kaidou), isn't that exciting?

Lao G

@Darth:

Why does it?

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

Baseless speculation then?

Akainu is a logia with the ability to ignore haki attacks. That means functional immortality against most opponents.

I actually somewhat want Kuzan to be Akainu's final opponent. For once in a while, I want to see two Logias dueling, with each fruit being an antipod of one another. Luffy beating Akainu's just doesn't sound right to me somehow, because a fight with Luffy Haki punching Sakazuki would be boring in my opinion. I also want Kuzan to have his ultimate revenge.

Light Bro

No matter what happends, I can't see it going down without Luffy trading some blows with the man who killed his older brother!

ArmamentHero

@Light:

No matter what happends, I can't see it going down without Luffy trading some blows with the man who killed his older brother!

Or the one that defeated/captured Ace and practically sent him to die.

Razh

@Bartholemew:

To be fair, I can actually see this happen - with the emphasis on 'fought' instead of 'defeated'. But Blackbeard completely defeated before the actual final war even started… Seriously?

Who knows. The way I see it, Blackbeard is going to be Luffy's biggest obstacle in discovering One Piece and becoming Pirate King. The story won't neccessarily end when Luffy becomes PK. And he could become PK before the final confrontation with WG.
There certainly aren't any guarantees.

desa

@Darth:

Also, you people put way too much faith in the Yonkou title.

They are the most powerful pirates. The strongest man was one of them. The hero mentor is one of them. Having faith in the yonko power is pretty normal when it's come to personal strength.

Baseless speculation then?

Akainu is a logia with the ability to ignore haki attacks. That means functional immortality against most opponents.

Speculation but not baseless. He has 2 fruit and is a yonko, after all. Him being stronger than Akainu is not definite but it is likely.

Razh

@desa:

He discussed the subject to death in the first version of this thread. He most be tired to make lenghty post about it.

That's no excuse. Certainly not when someone makes it instead of him. Better to not even reply, than to vent frustration with one liners. If you're going to make an effort of replying to someone, they deserve to know what the hell you mean. Otherwise it's just disrespecting other members.

RamistaR

@Light:

No matter what happends, I can't see it going down without Luffy trading some blows with the man who killed his older brother!

@ArmamentHero:

Or the one that defeated/captured Ace and practically sent him to die.

Akainu and Blackbeard aren't BFF either.

Akainu VS Luffy VS Blackbeard wouldn't be impossible to win for our hero.

Seafarer33

@Darth:

How did anyone reading Marineford arc had come to the conclusion that Blackbeard is more dangerous and stronger of the two.

I'd have agreed to that before Blackbeard got the Gura-Gura no Mi. But now? I'm not so sure anymore. Both command a fleet (advantage goes to the Marine, admittedly) and wield vastly destructive powers, yet Blackbeard doesn't have any of the boundaries that Akainu's status as a marine may involve (such as "answer to your higher ups" (Kong, Gorosei) or "try and protect civilians" (not that the thought of casualties would amper Akainu, but there might still be a Cobby or a Kuzan around to try and stop him)). If anything, I think this is what makes BB a greater threat. Of course, this argument becomes void if Akainu decides that he's had it with the WG and makes a coup.

Character-wise, Akainu definitely comes on top. He is ruthless and implacable, unbreakable even, whereas Blackbeard is more the cowardly type who will only enter the fray if he's sure to win and turn tail otherwise.

As for Magma vs Earthquake, now that Haki has boarded the ship curiously I find it hardly relevant. We've seen three people shrugg off a freakin' meteor, so what's a few thousand degrees burn after all ? Same goes for the tremor, of course.
The DF-nullifying power of the Yami-Yami, however, remains an unknown quantity. Can it be countered with Haki ? We don't even know that.

desa

@Darth:

Which is why everyone has been going around picking fights with them, without a care in the world…

Well they are in the way of most pirates dreams but on the other hand their names are enough to calm pirates visiting their island.

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@Razh:

That's no excuse. Certainly not when someone makes it instead of him. Better to not even reply, than to vent frustration with one liners. If you're going to make an effort of replying to someone, they deserve to know what the hell you mean. Otherwise it's just disrespecting other members.

Just explaining the situation.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@RamistaR:

Akainu and Blackbeard aren't BFF either.

Akainu VS Luffy VS Blackbeard wouldn't be impossible to win for our hero.

I'm all for it if Blackbeard get magma fisted.

Thebomer93

Are we as readers ment to hate Blackbeard. Me personally I don't think he's that bad. He's far more likeable than say Crocodile, DD and hody Jones that's for sure.

Dododo

Akainu is an opponent for Smoker, Dragon or Sabo.

Luffy will fight Blackbeard. I don't know how the things on Raftel are going to unfold, but I would bet a lot of money that the final war will be a clusterfuck between the WG, the revolutionaries, the strawhat pirates(+allies) and the blackbeard pirates.

Johnny B. Decent

@Darth:

You know what I'm curious about?

How did anyone reading Marineford arc had come to the conclusion that Blackbeard is more dangerous and stronger of the two.

While it's quite likely Blackbeard has indeed become much stronger since the timeskip, he always has been more dangerous then Sakazaki. For despite, being now the Fleet Admiral, Sakazaki is merely the WG's attack dog. Yes, he's pushing for a more aggressive turn for the Marines, but whatever the Gorosei or Kong commands, he obeys. Blackbeard organized a massive conflict between the Marines and the Whitebeard Pirates for the lust of power and released who knows how many Level Six ID prisoners onto the word and is now one of the four most powerful pirates in the world, and one who seeks to become Pirate King. He is a threat to the stability of the world's balance of power.

Ussop

Also , one of the arguments for BB as final villain was that we got to see his rise like luffy, he was not on top from the first like Akainu.

False, BB could easy be second division commander of Whitebeard's crew, but he din't want to. He was also the guy to give scars to Yonkou Shanks.

He was a veteran pirate, he wasn't far from the top, not some rookie we got to see rise from low to top.

Even akainu, we saw him go from vice-admiral to fleet admiral.

Shadowgreed

@Razh:

Who knows. The way I see it, Blackbeard is going to be Luffy's biggest obstacle in discovering One Piece and becoming Pirate King. The story won't neccessarily end when Luffy becomes PK. And he could become PK before the final confrontation with WG.
There certainly aren't any guarantees.

Why not have Shanks the protector fight Blackbeard while The Strawhats proceed to raftel thus allowing Blackbeard to kill Shanks + crew and then having the three way battle after the Strawhats learns what happens to Shanks crew + the true history, kill two birds with one stone.

I'm not a huge supporter of this Shanks will die by BB's hands but that fight has been set up already, and I'm huge supporter of the three way battle theory and If it happens like I described it above I'll be a happy weiner.

ICEMAN

Buggy's the final villain.

Shadowgreed

@Thebomer93:

Are we as readers ment to hate Blackbeard. Me personally I don't think he's that bad. He's far more likeable than say Crocodile, DD and hody Jones that's for sure.

I don't feel anything for him or his crew, so Oda is doing a good job at making me see worthless crap that doesn't even need recognition.

Razh

@Thebomer93:

Are we as readers ment to hate Blackbeard. Me personally I don't think he's that bad. He's far more likeable than say Crocodile, DD and hody Jones that's for sure.

I wouldn't say hate, but maybe despise? After all, Oda made him lie, cheat and betray to get where he wanted. Then he was shown begging WB not to kill him and cowardly shooting him along with his mates, afterwards. He's a mean son of a bitch, but he won't have a problem stooping so low to even beg someone.

I'm not sure if I despise him or like him. In some details he reminds me of a character called Logen Ninefingers, from The First Law trilogy (look it up then read it, it's awesome).

Monkey King

@Jules197:

Glad to see a guy who can definitely have a logical argument and is able to clearly explain why he disagrees with someone else's point of view. Bravo!

Someone whose been around here since 2011 and hasn't seen the already well accepted and insurmountable evidence of Blackbeard being the final villain, let alone my posts on it, needs to not post on it either.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Darth:

You know what I'm curious about?

How did anyone reading Marineford arc had come to the conclusion that Blackbeard is more dangerous and stronger of the two.

Actually that's exactly what people should have gathered from Marineford you dumb fascist lol.

Cyan D. Funk

I truly don't see why an evil Luffy who believes in an evil version of Luffy's ideals, has a crew made of evil Strawhats, killed one of the most morally upright characters in the series (preemptive shut the fuck up Darth), openly declared war on the rest of the world, sent the main character's brother to his death, is rampaging throughout the New World bringing nothing but destruction, and is named after the most famous pirate of all time would be a better final villain than Hideki Tojo in attack dog form.

desa

@Thebomer93:

Are we as readers ment to hate Blackbeard. Me personally I don't think he's that bad. He's far more likeable than say Crocodile, DD and hody Jones that's for sure.

You're suppose to hate Akainu. Blackbeard will come later.

Monkey King

@Ussop:

Also , one of the arguments for BB as final villain was that we got to see his rise like luffy, he was not on top from the first like Akainu.

False, BB could easy be second division commander of Whitebeard's crew, but he din't want to. He was also the guy to give scars to Yonkou Shanks.

He was a veteran pirate, he wasn't far from the top, not some rookie we got to see rise from low to top.

Even akainu, we saw him go from vice-admiral to fleet admiral.

Yet we are still seeing him build an empire, no one has ever said we've seen him come from the bottom.
Comparing what we've seen to Akainu gaining a rank is just pathetic stretching lol.

Razh

@Shadowgreed:

Why not have Shanks the protector fight Blackbeard while The Strawhats proceed to raftel thus allowing Blackbeard to kill Shanks + crew and then having the three way battle after the Strawhats learns what happens to Shanks crew + the true history, kill two birds with one stone.

I'm not a huge supporter of this Shanks will die by BB's hands but that fight has been set up already, and I'm huge supporter of the three way battle theory and If it happens like I described it above I'll be a happy weiner.

Happy and free!

Yeah, anything is possible. Hard to predict everything before the field was even set.

Cyan D. Funk

Teach went from a fairly unknown pirate who didn't even warrant a bounty to one of the major powers in the world within the span of two years.

Of course that's nothing compared to Sakazuki moving slightly up the ladder!

Ussop

@ICEMAN:

Buggy's the final villain.

Buggy vs Usopp would make one great, and funny, final battle.

RamistaR

Not to mention how he forced Wapol to leave Drum Island

desa

I wonder if we will get a flashback of the drum island incident.

RamistaR

I agree, for all we know it's his only move that didn't help his plan. Was it just for fun ?

Johnny B. Decent

@RamistaR:

I agree, for all we know it's his only move that didn't help his plan.

Like what happened to Banaro, it was just a simple case of pillaging and raiding.

RamistaR

@S.C.:

Like what happened to Banaro, it was just a simple case of pillaging and raiding.

Yeah I guess it's most likely that it was just his pirate routine.

Monquito

Alvida was the first and for the sake of the series will be the last!, leooulololl.

Voted Teach, way too awesome compared to the rest.

Ussop

@Monkey:

Yet we are still seeing him build an empire, no one has ever said we've seen him come from the bottom.
Comparing what we've seen to Akainu gaining a rank is just pathetic stretching lol.

A marine doesn't have the freedom of pirates, he's does answer to someone. He got there by doing his job, the only way he can.

Jules197

@Monkey:

Someone whose been around here since 2011 and hasn't seen the already well accepted and insurmountable evidence of Blackbeard being the final villain, let alone my posts on it, needs to not post on it either.

Oh I'm well familiar with your posts. But just because you have defended your theory in the previous version of this thread, that does not make it acceptable spam the new thread with replies that contribute absolutely nothing to it. Or do you think replying "nope" to someone is a good way of exposing your points of view? Honestly, that's the same as being on a politics debate and replying "nope" to all your adversary arguments just because you feel you have already explained your views on a certain subject in a previous campaign speech.

Anyway, back on topic: moments before his death, Whitebeard straight out said a great battle will engulf the world as soon as someone finds the One Piece, and that the Marines and the World Government live in fear of that day. Meaning, the battle against the World Government will happen AFTER someone becomes the Pirate King and finds the One Piece, not before. Fighting Blackbeard after becoming the Pirate King and destroying the World Government would make no sense at all.

Tahkyn

It makes the most sense for Blackbeard to be the final villain in One Piece. He has been steadily built up since Jaya to be so. Sakazuki may have dealt the killer blow to Ace, but it was in an act that was meant to kill Luffy. Blackbeard betrayed Ace and set him up to be executed. Sakazuki would have been my other choice, and I have no doubt that Luffy will deal to him for what he did, however, I don't see that confrontation being the final obstacle for Luffy obtaining the One Piece. Blackbeard is the one constant, foreboding, master of the dark devil fruit and a mysterious ability to acquire other abilities. We still don't know that much about him and there is so much left to explore that his story will effortlessly run the course to Raftel.

Razh

@RamistaR:

I agree, for all we know it's his only move that didn't help his plan. Was it just for fun ?

Maybe he recruited Doc Q there.

Would have been funny if Doc Q turned out to be Hiluluk's old rival.

King of Calzones

I think Blackbeard is going to be Luffy's last significant opponent, just because there has been way more buildup to support their clash than there has been for Akainu. With that said, it goes without saying that both will be huge forces to be reckoned with during the final saga, so I feel like you could easily say that both will serve as the final villain in some respect.

Darth

@S.C.:

While it's quite likely Blackbeard has indeed become much stronger since the timeskip, he always has been more dangerous then Sakazaki. For despite, being now the Fleet Admiral, Sakazaki is merely the WG's attack dog. Yes, he's pushing for a more aggressive turn for the Marines, but whatever the Gorosei or Kong commands, he obeys. Blackbeard organized a massive conflict between the Marines and the Whitebeard Pirates for the lust of power and released who knows how many Level Six ID prisoners onto the word and is now one of the four most powerful pirates in the world, and one who seeks to become Pirate King. He is a threat to the stability of the world's balance of power.

We don't know how much of it was concious planning, and how much was fate working towards his plans.

And two more things: A) Punk Hazard shows us very clearly that what Sakazuki was doing during the war was not nearly pinnacle of his power, something people tend to forget.

B) I agree that Blackbeard is a much bigger threat towards the world, and almost certainly a final villain, or at least a major part of final conflict, because I'm still of opinion that there will be more then one side to it, but on the level of being dangerous towards the protagonist?

See, Blackbeards clumsiness and overconfidence severely hurts the feel of danger he produces. Him getting hit all the time, screaming like an idiot in pain, all while doing those speeches full with self praise, and mocking his enemies. He give away a vibe of someone getting along thanks to luck, not skill.

And he does not hold the candle to Akainu's effectiveness. I just find Sakazuki to be much more threatning as a villain.

Tyrano

Wasn't there a thread for this already

Siranime

I am pretty sure that the final villain will be either Akainu or the Gorosei.I just cannot see Blackbeard as a final villain.No matter how powerful he gets,he's not final villain material.I guess that he will be the final PIRATE villain.

ArmamentHero

I see the Final Conflict like this:
Revolutionaries vs. WG
Strawhats & Allies vs. Marines
A battle that will eventually collide and turn into utter chaos, with the cost of many lives on both ends.

Like I said before, Blackbeard and Akainu will be at the tail end, as they are both dangerous/powerful opponents for the Strawhats.

Johnny B. Decent

@Darth:

We don't know how much of it was concious planning, and how much was fate working towards his plans.

And two more things: A) Punk Hazard shows us very clearly that what Sakazuki was doing during the war was not nearly pinnacle of his power, something people tend to forget.

B) I agree that Blackbeard is a much bigger threat towards the world, and almost certainly a final villain, or at least a major part of final conflict, because I'm still of opinion that there will be more then one side to it, but on the level of being dangerous towards the protagonist?

See, Blackbeards clumsiness and overconfidence severely hurts the feel of danger he produces. Him getting hit all the time, screaming like an idiot in pain, all while doing those speeches full with self praise, and mocking his enemies. He give away a vibe of someone getting along thanks to luck, not skill.

And he does not hold the candle to Akainu's effectiveness. I just find Sakazuki to be much more threatning as a villain.

I think you're confusing my statement of being dangerous as a individual opponent as dangerous as a force. Yes, obviously as a one-on-opponent, Sakazaki is highly dangerous, but I retorted as a force in the world regarding the balance of power, he is not. And yes, I think Oda made Blackbeard too underpowered in fighting ability in the pre-time skip, but as a danger to the world, or at least to the security of the World Government's regime, he is second only to Dragon, and will likely surpass him in that regard.

moud

why is everyone ignoring the fact that Whitebeard foreshadowed the final war for the pirate king to be against WG ?!
and we know for sure Teach will fall just before luffy becomes the PK , how is it even possible for Teach to become a final villain ?

i think it's either the gorosei or an "other" , akainu is more like a soldier he is neither a final "villain" material nor strong enough