The Enigmatic Dragon (Spoiler Warnings, JIC)

Kryptik

I postulated about the placement of Dragon and what his eventual role will be in light of recent…revelations in the latest Spoiler thread. Now that the chap has been released, I wanted to make a separate topic about this to possibly generate more discussion about this:

One thing I remember was his first appearance. For someone so mysterious, and supposedly never seen before (wasn't something said about how no one knew what he looked like?), Smoker knew him right off the bat. Not only that, but he talked to him in a very familiar way, and Dragon did the same toward Smoker. While the line "THe world is waiting for our answer" can be seen as a vague one, it can also be one Dragon said specifically to Smoker. It's a very interesting thought...and as such, it makes me mull over one of my old theories too: Could Smoker have once been a pirate himself? Pre-Gold Roger...or even post, simply disillusioned enough to abandon pirating and become a Marine himself? Or at least some kind of criminal or revolutionary?

Secondly...what will Dragon be when the Strawhat crew meets him? Enemy? Friend? Neutral? I'm sure he has tracked his son's progress since it became aware to him back at Logue Town. But will he be someone that Luffy and co. will need to fight? Will the Ally with him? Will he be incidental (in that he's not going to actively interfere in the STrawhat's course...just something they throw themselves into for some reason or another)?

Dragon is a revolutionary, against the WG and Marines, and as we've seen, there's been some corrupt crap going on within all of them. But does that necessarily mean that Dragon's a good force himself? WHat if his revolution is worse?

Dragon's less ambiguous now...but it still leaves his intentions very up in the air, as well as where he'll fall in regards to the Straw Hats and Luffy's goal.

Shishou

Smoker doesn't really approve of the World Government either. He may be fine with it being overthrown, thus not personally seeing this non-pirate as a bad guy.

Also I think Dragon has a Wind Wind ability. Turn in to wind Would be hax.

Dahna

I think the reason for Smoker knowing Dragon that well is that Dragon did a lot against the WG, so the marines probably fought him many times.

I also don't think that Smoker has ever been a pirate because he makes somewhere in the manga (don't know exactly where right know) very clear that he hates pirates and mistrusts even the Shichibukai (he said something like "once a pirate, always a pirate… I don't trust them").

Someone said in another thread that Dragon probably has a connection to Crocodile because he started a revolution in Alabasta.
I think that is a pretty good theory.
Dragon probably has a good motive but uses the wrong means. This would mean that Luffy has to fight his Dad in the end in order to show him the right way...

Kryptik

@Dahna:

I think the reason for Smoker knowing Dragon that well is that Dragon did a lot against the WG, so the marines probably fought him many times.

I also don't think that Smoker has ever been a pirate because he makes somewhere in the manga (don't know exactly where right know) very clear that he hates pirates and mistrusts even the Shichibukai (he said something like "once a pirate, always a pirate… I don't trust them").

Someone said in another thread that Dragon probably has a connection to Crocodile because he started a revolution in Alabasta.
I think that is a pretty good theory.
Dragon probably has a good motive but uses the wrong means. This would mean that Luffy has to fight his Dad in the end in order to show him the right way...

The translations, though, make that somewhat questionable. While they know his name, Robin makes it out to be that very few, if any, know WHO he is or have every really seen him.

The government is, of course, enraged… This man pulling the strings, Dragon, is 'the World's Worst Criminal' to them, and they've searched frantically for him, but...

He's a 'mystery man,' with only the barest fragments of his identity known...

Which is why I wonder, if he's truely that mysterious, and that dangerous…why is Smoker so comfortable talking to him, and vice versa. Almost like they knew each other before (as in, before they stepped into their current roles).

bedrock

a good revolution always has groundings in the old forces too. Obviously there has been a recent contact between Garp and Dragon (knowing about Loguetown) and there are bonds between Garp and Aokiji and Aokiji and Smoker. When you look at the known actions of those three top-marines you see that they do not follow "absolute justice" (but rather "real/personal justice"). need to say more?

Dahna

@Kryptik:

The translations, though, make that somewhat questionable. While they know his name, Robin makes it out to be that very few, if any, know WHO he is or have every really seen him.

Oh, thanks! I forgot that fact

but I still can't think of Smoker as a pirate… I mean, if he really was one how did he go to the marines? They wouldn't let a pirate join them (except the Shichibukai) so they either have another connection, Smoker is one of the few persons who know what he looks like or they know each other from the time when Dragon wasn't a revolutionary... Maybe they are even old friends who went different paths like Coby and Luffy (<- that topic again XD)

unchipu

I just have this to say. Look at Luffy, then look at Garp. How serious of a character can Dragon really be?

Shark

@unchipu:

I just have this to say. Look at Luffy, then look at Garp. How serious of a character can Dragon really be?

Well, based on how Oda drew him last chapter, he looks pretty serious, what with creating revolutions and all. Then again, we've all been deceived before.

Dahna

Well, when Luffy for example fought against the WG in order to save Robin he was (like in every other important fight) really serious.

Now, imagine Dragon who follows his own dream to fight against the WG… I wouldn't want to stand in his way

Kryptik

Focused Stoicism may skip generations in the Monkey family, ya know.

And even if Smoker wasn't a pirate before, there very well could have been some less than legal aspects of his pre-Marine life. Either that, or Dragon could have…gasp...been a Marine himself once!

But then again, that might not fly, since more people would know him for sure if he was...

psycho wolvesbane

If you didn't find out from Rogue Town, Smoker was only a little kid when Garp captured Gol D Roger, so as for your "pre-Roger" pirating theory there is absolutely no way he could have been one.

Polygon

@psycho:

If you didn't find out from Rogue Town, Smoker was only a little kid when Garp captured Gol D Roger, so as for your "pre-Roger" pirating theory there is absolutely no way he could have been one.

It was never stated that Garp caught Roger.

KizoFieva

I'm not sure that Smoker's familiar attitude towards Dragon necessarily implies a previous relationship between the two. Smoker seems the type to have that attitude towards anyone, regardless of how powerful that other person is.

Kryptik

Hrm…looking back, you're right that Smoker was a bit young back then. I thought he was in his teens for some reason.

But one thing I DID notice looking back is that young Smoker seemed quite reverent of Roger during his whole flashback. At least, he didn't look like he despised him at all and even looked like he was amongst those inspired by his speech and his unfaltering smile at the block.

Even his words looking back on it seemed quite respectful for someone who should hate all pirates.

As far as Smoker talking that way to everyone, you'd think someone with that kind of threat to the WG would garner more than a deadpan "The government is looking for you, you know." This, coupled with Dragon's seemingly familiar response too leads me to wonder. YOu know, not to mention the fact that Smoker actually KNEW it was Dragon, too.

Aldrich

The Roger flashback was filler.

Also I see no problem with the way Smoker adressed Dragon. Smoker despises pirates, it has been clearly stated in the manga, who knows maybe he has a Nami-like backstory. He may not have anything against the revolutionaries, as we've seen he's not too respectful of the WG himself.

As for him knowing Dragon's face… Remember that flashback during Drum arc? The kings had that pic of Dragon. Everyone who's worth something in the WG and Marine probably know how he looks like.

Kryptik

Hrm…do you remember which chapter that was?

Dahna

Penguin Zero's translation:

He's a 'mystery man,' with only the barest fragments of his identity known…

It only says that not much about his identity is known so this probably means his birthplace, family, and so on.
This means that his face can be known to the marines and only his face (at least that is one of the possibilities).

So Dragon and Smoker really don't have to have a deeper connection.

Darkariel

Smoker probably respects Dragon for is ideals

Smoker seems to know that W.G. is corrupt and sometimes he disagrees with them so maybe he thinks Dragon making a revolution won't be that bad

Also I think Smoker doesn't like Pirate because of the normal stereotype of Pirate (mostly all Pirates)

But he seems to respect the Pirates that are diferent like Luffy and Gol D. Roger maybe even Shanks

The young Smoker seing Gol D. Roger is filler but never the less Smoker seen to have respect for Gol D. Roger

It's never said that Garp captured Roger it's only said that he cornered him

I really don't know why some people still come with Garp captured Roger after being sometimes explained that cornered isn't captured

Kryptik

Hrm…finally found the chapter (Chap. 142), and I suppose you're right, they do know what he looks like at the very least, which blows at least part of my theories away.

Urian

I believe that Dragon is the master mind under Baroque Works (being Crocodile his subordinate) and the new era of DoFlamingo, remember both have (in the case of Crocodile had) in areas where the Ancient weapons are located.

Tik

i find it somehow strange that some of you think smoker could have been a pirate but not come to the idee of dragon being a marine in the past.
as seeing garp telling luffy that he has trained him to become a marine, i think that he would do so with his own son!

Simplicio

Whenever I think of Dragon, this page comes to mind
http://groups.msn.com/OnePieceMangav-3/volume25.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=4819

Bottom left: "The world is revolting"

I think Dragon is using his son to disturb the balance of the 3 force, possible weaken the Shichibukai and Marines so he can topple the World Government more easily. Luffy is doing a good job so far by besting Crocodile and bringing down CP9+Enies Lobby.

Hopefully the next father and son reunion would be more emotional than the one we had at Loguetown.

Malintex_Terek

Dragon is the "Satan" of One Piece; he goes around tempting the citizens of nations/kingdoms into sin, he's a force of anarchy, and his name seems to be a Biblical reference to the Dragon that tempted Eve into sin.

That would also imply he's fudging powerful, but hopefully not excessively so; I hate "ascended heritage" and thus far Luffy's family isn't exactly strong due to their genes, but because of their Devil Fruits or training.

Kryptik

@Tik:

i find it somehow strange that some of you think smoker could have been a pirate but not come to the idee of dragon being a marine in the past.
as seeing garp telling luffy that he has trained him to become a marine, i think that he would do so with his own son!

Well, thing is, if he was a Marine, and his name HASN'T changed drastically, the Marines would know a lot more about him than they seem to. Especially considering they have his father in their employ.

Eudaemonium

@Simplicio:

Whenever I think of Dragon, this page comes to mind
http://groups.msn.com/OnePieceMangav-3/volume25.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=4819

Bottom left: "The world is revolting"

Actually it says "revolving" - as in going-round, changing, things are happening outside the closed-little-bubble of the SH crew.

FireFistAce 0

Can we assume for a second that Dragon completely outclassed Smoker? Smoker fighting Dragon would be like Kuro fighting Whitebeard. Smoker's strong, but I'm sure that Dragon is infinitely stronger, especially if he ate the Kaze Kaze no Mi. The reason Smoker was talking to him was because he knew that he'd get his ass kicked if he even attempted to fight back. He's not stupid.

Gokou Ruffy

Garp could trained Dragon as Luffy when he was still a kid, so something bad happend then and Dragon turn against the WG, maybe its something with Gold Roger or Luffys mum.

Kaze

@Malintex_Terek:

Dragon is the "Satan" of One Piece; he goes around tempting the citizens of nations/kingdoms into sin, he's a force of anarchy, and his name seems to be a Biblical reference to the Dragon that tempted Eve into sin.

That would also imply he's fudging powerful, but hopefully not excessively so; I hate "ascended heritage" and thus far Luffy's family isn't exactly strong due to their genes, but because of their Devil Fruits or training.

Actually, it was a snake.