Luffy/Ace = Roger/Garp?

Taz

Garp DEFINITELY resembles Ace more than Luffy, both physically and narcoleptically. And of course, just about everyone has noticed a striking resemblence between Roger and Luffy.

Roger and Garp crossed paths in the past, an event that won Garp great notoriety and resepct for having "cornered" him (several times apparently!) But could it be possible these two are more connected than just a marine doing his duty of arresting a high-profile pirate?

A lot has been made of Ace being one of very few able to get the best of Luffy. Ace is also more of a follower (with his loyalty to Whitebeard) while Luffy is more independent, aspiring to be Pirate King himself. Could similar parallels be made between Garp (follower) and Roger (leader). Garp is also one of very few able to get the best of Roger - could they have been brothers?

That would make Roger a grand-uncle to Luffy, explaining the family resemblence.

Another theory by boiga in the 431 spoiler thread, is that Garp and Roger could be brother-in-laws. So their children would have married, making Roger Luffy/Ace's other grandfather, and Garp wouldn't carry the "D" title.

http://apforums.net/showthread.php?p=366059#post366059

@boiga:

Educated guess: Garp's son and Roger's daughter (also a D) fell in love and got engaged. Roger, having made it around the world would have given anything to be there for his daughters wedding. During the wedding, garp will have found out that Roger is his son's father-in-law.

He'd tell roger that his daughter's life would be at risk from marine persecution unless roger turned himself in. They would tell the Marine HQ that garp had cornered roger.

Garp turns Roger in, leading to rogers death. Their progeny mate, leading to Ace and Luffy, who also have the will of D.

Personally I think this is the only decent explanation possible for a "Roger turns himself in" scenario.

It'd be poetic if they were family (through blood or marriage) and Garp turned out to be the one who led to Roger's arrest.

Thoughts?

GearSecond

I think he cornered his own son, and Roger is Garp's son and Luffy's/Ace's dad/

Mr. All Sunday

Except that he died two years before Ace was born, and five before Luffy.

FireFistAce 0

GearSecond, we've told you 3 times:

Roger was Executed 22 years ago.

Luffy is 17.

Humans stay pregnant for a maximum of 10 months, a minimum of 7 1/2 months. The average is 9 months. Unless she got pregnant from Roger's ghost, there is no way that is possible.

chpollastrini

the narcolepsy is shown in the cover pages too…..when he sleeps while arresting Morgan....

Taz

I re-checked actually, and it didn't show him sleeping.

http://groups.msn.com/onepiecemanga/onepiecechapter92.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=1802

http://groups.msn.com/onepiecemanga/onepiecechapter93.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=1821

FireFistAce 0

Wrong Chapter:

http://groups.msn.com/onepiecemangav-3/volume12.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=2321

Taz

Don't know how that flew over me. bop Editing post.

Angel emfrbl

@Fire Fist:

Humans stay pregnant for a maximum of 10 months, a minimum of 7 1/2 months. The average is 9 months. Unless she got pregnant from Roger's ghost, there is no way that is possible.

Atually the minimum is now something like 6 and 3/4 months.

The pictures of Roger awaiting death right back at chapter one show Roger unharmed. If he fought Garp he has no signs of a injury on him that you can see. Two things:

1- Its possible he had time to heal between capture and death
2- The two of them came to an agreement without fighting, or a low struggle.

I don't think Roger was anything like Garp's brother, it may be something like 'cousin' (sometimes you tend to be closer to your cousin then your fellow siblings) that he was fond of or got along well with.

If we look at Ace and Luffy, while they do fight, they don't apparently have a bitter grudge between them and care about each other. If all the Ds are family to Saul, then this may be a universal feeling. Garp wouldn't want to hurt Roger therefore, maybe defeat him in battle, but not kill him (makes me wonder its taken Ace so long to bring Blackbeard to justice).

Taz

I don't think pirates are executed immediately after arrest. There's the whole Ennies Lobby process..

Brother or cousin is still family. It'd depend on whether Garp would place that before duty, which I guess we'll find out next chapter with Luffy. (Even then, his position may have changed after 20+ years).

Taking Ace and Luffy as examples: Ace wants to make Whitebeard the Pirate King, if commanded, would he fight Luffy out of duty?

Since it can lead to execution, in the case of marine/pirate relatives this decision would be even more conflictual - depending on the person and their priorities. People like Roger and Luffy don't seem concerned with trifle things like their own deaths.

Going with boiga's example of them being brother-in-laws, it actually gives a plausible explanation why Roger might have surrendered himself (ensuring the safety of his progeny).

boiga

I'll repost my slightly expanded theory from the chapter discussion here since it seems relevant. Sorry if you've already read it.

! Garp is grandpa. However, that does NOT prove that he is a D. There are still 3 other unknown grandparents from whom ace and luffy could have inherited the Will of D.
! Speculation: Gol D. Roger is luffy's other grandfather. Roger's daughter and Garp's son met and fell in love. Roger, having made it around the world in time for his daughter's wedding would not miss it for any price. Garp, also at the wedding would have informed roger that his daughter's life would be forever in danger from government persecution unless Roger turned himself in. Roger agreed and gave himself to the authorities to protect his family.

This explains how Garp "cornered" Roger, and how the most powerful man in the world got caught and executed by the government. I think Garp was so moved by this act that he lost his faith in the WG, which would explain his lenience towards subordinates, his lackadaisical attitiude towards Duty, and his rank being capped at VA despite his amazing power.

The progeny from this marriage of WG and D, ace and luffy (who were born 2 and 5 years after rogers death) gained the ability to eat their own weight in a single sitting from the D (think blackbeard), narcolepsy from Garp (blackbeard hasn't shown this trait, while luffy, ace, and garp have), and insane physical prowess from both sides of the family.

Also, I should mention that in this scenario, Roger would have turned himself in after already having accomplished his dream. This is why he could die happily in the same manner that Tom did, having accomplished everything he set out to do.

FireFistAce 0

@Taz:

I don't think pirates are executed immediately after arrest. There's the whole Ennies Lobby process..

Smoker: THAT STRAW-HAT BOY SMILED!!! EXACTLY LIKE THE PIRATE KING, GOLD ROGER, 22 YEARS AGO, AT THAT EXACT SAME EXECUTION PLATFORM!!!

It seems to me they wanted to do away with Roger very quickly.

Taz

How does them smiling the same way mean Roger was quickly sent for execution? And in Luffy's case, Buggy isn't a marine.

Mr. Death

Maybe Black Beard is Luffy and Ace's Father.

FireFistAce 0

@Mr.:

Maybe Black Beard is Luffy and Ace's Father.

I think Luffy would have recognized his own father if he knew his grandfather. Blackbeard is either not related or is an uncle that Luffy had never met.

As for my Smoker quote earlier, I'm sorry, I guess you missed what I was trying to point out:

Franky's Flashback took place a month or two after Roger's execution. Notice Kokoro's comment about increased piracy. That means that they executed Roger shortly after they captured him.

Or at least that's how it appears to me. The timeframe fits, because the ship is built, Roger spends a year doing his thing, finishes what he set out to accomplish, allows himself to be caught, executed, then they go and put Tom on trial.

Iwin Ulose

@Fire Fist:

I think Luffy would have recognized his own father if he knew his grandfather. Blackbeard is either not related or is an uncle that Luffy had never met.

As for my Smoker quote earlier, I'm sorry, I guess you missed what I was trying to point out:

Franky's Flashback took place a month or two after Roger's execution. Notice Kokoro's comment about increased piracy. That means that they executed Roger shortly after they captured him.

Or at least that's how it appears to me. The timeframe fits, because the ship is built, Roger spends a year doing his thing, finishes what he set out to accomplish, allows himself to be caught, executed, then they go and put Tom on trial.

yes that sounds about right, the timeframe.

and on another note… i am very interested to see how blackbeard ties in with the Ds. as was said before i believe, being a D doesn't necessarily make you related to other Ds. i would say Saul being a D proves that sufficiently, as luffy and ace clearly aren't giants or even part-giants. and now garp proves that being related to a D doesnt necessarily make you a D.

wow that was a mouthful. o_O

EDIT: but now that i think about it... blackbeard could pass as part-giant.... i mean, he's a really big guy, and he's pretty damn ugly too. could be a side effect of having giant blood? i'm really reaching here, but maybe there are two branches of the Ds? two families? luffy, ace, and roger belong to one, and blackbeard and saul belong to another. shrug kind of a pointless theory.

mugiwara no luffy

hi everyone, this is my first post on this forum, but it's been a while since i dicovered it

i just wanted to give my point of view:

luffy has 2 grandfathers like everyone… Ace looks like garp, and luffy look like Roger...

in fact, Garp falls asleep all the time just like Ace do... we don't know much about Roger... but he was cornered by Garp, he even lost against him

when he was in Arabasta, luffy said he never won against Ace so it must be familiar

(sorry if my english ain't perfect , but i live in morroco (yes, even over there, you can find unconditional fans of one piece ^^)

Taz

@Fire Fist:

As for my Smoker quote earlier, I'm sorry, I guess you missed what I was trying to point out:

Franky's Flashback took place a month or two after Roger's execution. Notice Kokoro's comment about increased piracy. That means that they executed Roger shortly after they captured him.

Kokoro said piracy increased since the Pirate King died. Besides that it doesn't really give any indication of how long it's been since the execution or capture.

Either way it doesn't really matter. If there was a few days between his capture and execution or a few weeks, OP characters don't take long to heal. After the exhausting, non-stop battling at Ennies Lobby it only took the Strawhats 2 days to almost fully recover.

A pirate doesn't surrender himself willingly. So if Roger wasn't captured by Garp or whoever, there has to be a GOOD explanation why.

Rokushiki

@GearSecond:

I think he cornered his own son, and Roger is Garp's son and Luffy's/Ace's dad/

how many frigging threads are u going to post this retarded theory?havent countless people told u its impossible?

back on topic,i like mugiwara no luffy's theory on garp is to ace as gold roger is to luffy

Mr. Death

@Fire Fist:

I think Luffy would have recognized his own father if he knew his grandfather. Blackbeard is either not related or is an uncle that Luffy had never met.

As for my Smoker quote earlier, I'm sorry, I guess you missed what I was trying to point out:

Franky's Flashback took place a month or two after Roger's execution. Notice Kokoro's comment about increased piracy. That means that they executed Roger shortly after they captured him.

Or at least that's how it appears to me. The timeframe fits, because the ship is built, Roger spends a year doing his thing, finishes what he set out to accomplish, allows himself to be caught, executed, then they go and put Tom on trial.

Unless he never met him, Blackbeard could have left his mom before he was born and with Ace being only about 2 or 3 years old he probably wouldn't remember.

Eudaemonium

You would think that Blackbeard would ahve remembered his son's name though - Ace's that is - he is being hunted down by him after all. However, who knows. It might have something to do with the fact why Shanks is trying to contact Whitebeard over the two.

And to comment on what Iwin Ulose said. Saul kind of proves that the D's are related to a degree not teh opposite, as he satates that it is passed down the family line. That doens't mean however that there cannto be multiple 'clans' of D's that have different family lines but the same original source - e.g. the ancient civilisation.

Also you can't really cite Garp as not being a D, as we don't know his full name (if I'm wrong here you can correct me).

The Dude

I think Garp and Roger as brothers is plausible.

smurfx

@Mr.:

Unless he never met him, Blackbeard could have left his mom before he was born and with Ace being only about 2 or 3 years old he probably wouldn't remember.

i was going to make that argument but blackbeard doesn't really strike me as a family guy. i think luffy's father is going to end up being some other infamous pirate we haven't seen yet or one of the schichibukai that we have yet to see.

Angel emfrbl

Hehee… All this reminds of when I found a whole thread on One Piece wannabe fans who posted a 'Shanks and Maniko are Luffy's parents' thread... I forget where I saw it now. Basically, not including Maniko's part of the story...

Shanks would have been 17 when Ace is born. It could have married by then and have a wife who has a kid. He goes off, does pirate training, comes backa few years later when he was about 20 has another kid.

When I asked... 'Why doesn't Shanks talk about it then?' I got no answer from the person who came up with this. XD

Why bring it up? I think its funny how Luffy, Shanks and Garp all have scars across their left eye. Lol. I just noticed that. XD

I could build another theory on the scars, if only Ace had one. I won't write it down, because I don't believe it myself. But all I say is this much... The theory I came up with... If it ever comes true... Dam will I be shocked.

FireFistAce 0

@Angel:

H

Why bring it up? I think its funny how Luffy, Shanks and Garp all have scars across their left eye. Lol. I just noticed that. XD

Go back and read Volume 2. Notice how many knives Buggy holds in his hand when fighting Luffy.

Angel emfrbl

I know about that thoery too!

I had included that. Its actually one of the first things I noticed about Buggy's attack after he spoke of his past with Shanks. I think ALOT of people have come to the same conclusion too… -_-'

My thoery was about how certain people in Luffy's close relationship (meaning family AND friends) were fated to get a scar... Well its a bit more then that. But I don't want to go on in detail about it.

Taz

@Angel:

Hehee… All this reminds of when I found a whole thread on One Piece wannabe fans who posted a 'Shanks and Maniko are Luffy's parents' thread... I forget where I saw it now. Basically, not including Maniko's part of the story...

Shanks would have been 17 when Ace is born. It could have married by then and have a wife who has a kid. He goes off, does pirate training, comes backa few years later when he was about 20 has another kid.

When I asked... 'Why doesn't Shanks talk about it then?' I got no answer from the person who came up with this. XD

Isn't it obvious? To protect his family's identity from his many many enemies.

I could build another theory on the scars, if only Ace had one. I won't write it down, because I don't believe it myself. But all I say is this much… The theory I came up with... If it ever comes true... Dam will I be shocked.

You should post it… and then call it if/when the theory does come true like everyone else here.

Quexinos

why is everyone so obsessed with this idea that Roger has to be closely related to Luffy? I would think Luffy would know about it and have mentioned it. "Im taking after my grandfather!.. or his brother! or my dad which is impossible.. or !"

know what I mean?

Angel emfrbl

All the Ds resemble each other from the closely related to the distantly related… It must be in their blood.

VLuffy

maybe gold roger is still alive and he has some kind of DF power which makes some people to have his image like Kaptain Kuro. If that could be true then he left piracy and starts a new life with a woman and gave birth to 2 baby which are Luffy and Ace

Taz

@Quexinos:

why is everyone so obsessed with this idea that Roger has to be closely related to Luffy? I would think Luffy would know about it and have mentioned it. "Im taking after my grandfather!.. or his brother! or my dad which is impossible.. or !"

know what I mean?

Well the resemblence is pretty uncanny. It'd be a shock if they weren't related somehow, though I think Oda might take a less predictable path. If not his other grandfather, then grand-uncle or a distant relation.

Refii

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