Game law passed in Louisiana

Taleran

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6152851.html

Quote:
(1) The average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the video or computer game, taken as a whole, appeals to the minor's morbid interest in violence.
(2) The game depicts violence in a manner patently offensive to prevailing standards in the adult community with respect to what is suitable for minors.
(3) The game, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value for minors.

WTF, what part of game don't people in government understand.

captain usopp

although I agree, young people, especially children should not be playing "violent" video games, I'm confused as to what they're trying to prevent here.

(1) The average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the video or computer game, taken as a whole, appeals to the minor's morbid interest in violence.
(2) The game depicts violence in a manner patently offensive to prevailing standards in the adult community with respect to what is suitable for minors.
(3) The game, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value for minors

what exactly does that mean?

how about, anyone selling a game rated M to someone under 18 will be fined…blah blah blah.

Strange_One

Aren't they already not supposed to be able to sell games like GTA to minors?

The only difference I can see now is they can be fined $2,000.

TakinawaTonfa

Lets see…

(1) The average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the video or computer game, taken as a whole, appeals to the minor's morbid interest in violence.
(2) The game depicts violence in a manner patently offensive to prevailing standards in the adult community with respect to what is suitable for minors.
(3) The game, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value for minors.

The game makes violence seem okay to minors.
Pretty much the same thing as #1 but applying to community standards.
To put it simply, the game isn't educational

Do they really need to pass a law for this? We already have the ESRB, people just need to enforce it.

GoAnderson

I don't expect much from my video games. They are what they are, games, things that give entertainment. I believe games like GTA are awful and should by all rights be restricted, perhaps even banned, but the wording of the law was ridiculously vague.

And it involves Jack Thompson, which is an automatic fail for his side.

Anime Master

Will old Jack ever stop? He must realize that he's one of the most hated people in America.

Taleran

the point you guys are missing is games like Katamari Damacy aren't in any way educational so this law makes them have to be rated M to be sold

Anime Master

The only games that are educational are Elmo Spells.

Thats about it.

Taleran

Typing Of The Dead!!!

Buuhan1

The day Katamari becomes rated M is the day 4kids yell "sorry for screwing it up!" and throw One Piece to a good dubbing company.

Cr4zy

or, when Cartoon Network would be 24/7 Adult Swim….I would love that. For you guys living in Louisiana, hope you dont get caught.

Usopp with a Pushpop

I live in Louisiana. I'm curious if my local Blockbuster is aware of this law. I should conduct a test. I'll take my little brother to Blockbuster. Tell him to pick out a REALLY violent game. Then send him to go rent it at the counter.

Le Lawliet

Goddammit. Shouldn't they be focusing their efforts on actually helping the thousands still without homes in Louisiana instead of passing ridiculous pieces of shit like this?

captain usopp

lol GOOD FRIGGEN POINT!!

Bellamy

(3) The game, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value for minors.

Well, apparently somebody never got to play Mario Teaches Typing.
What a sad, lonely childhood that must have been.

Dixxy Mouri

Actually, Congress is (supposedly) working on a new law that would more heavily enforce the ESRB - it's being lead by Hilary Clinton and I believe was in response to the whole "Hot Coffee" thing.

But here's my thing:

1. There is nothing stopping Mumsy and Daddykins from buying their little poopsie the game anyways, because Mumsy and Daddykins know that video games are always meant for children.
2. As has been mentioned: DOESN'T THE GOVERNMENT HAVE BIGGER PROBLEMS TO WORRY ABOUT?! Like, oh, I don't know, Iraq, Social Security, Health Care, poverty, just to name a few.

Buuhan1

Well, I think its safe to say what to lable the goverment.

DUMBASSES~!!!

captain usopp

@Dixxy:

Actually, Congress is (supposedly) working on a new law that would more heavily enforce the ESRB - it's being lead by Hilary Clinton and I believe was in response to the whole "Hot Coffee" thing.

But here's my thing:

1. There is nothing stopping Mumsy and Daddykins from buying their little poopsie the game anyways, because Mumsy and Daddykins know that video games are always meant for children.
2. As has been mentioned: DOESN'T THE GOVERNMENT HAVE BIGGER PROBLEMS TO WORRY ABOUT?! Like, oh, I don't know, Iraq, Social Security, Health Care, poverty, just to name a few.

what was this whole hot coffee thing?

My friends used to work in a movie rental store. there are so many stupid parents out there. She told this one dad " uh, that game is not for kids" "My kid can rent any game he wants, don't tell me what I can't rent for my kid"….later in the day guy comes back. "why did you rent this violent game to my kid" Oh man, did my friend dig into this guy. There was no way she was taking the shit for him being a stupid jerk.

TakinawaTonfa

The "hot coffee" thing was a mod in the game Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas which essentially unlocked a rythm based sex game, literally. Although the average player never would've been able to get to it, Rockstar still didn't remove it from the actual game. The only real reason why so much heat has been drawn to this is because Rockstar didn't disclose that information to the ESRB.

That new legislation that Mouri mentioned will (if passed) fine game companies if they don't tell the ESRB everything that's in the game.

Dixxy Mouri

@TakinawaTonfa:

That new legislation that Mouri mentioned will (if passed) fine game companies if they don't tell the ESRB everything that's in the game.

And it is, essentially, a good idea - I have a niece and nephew (twins who will be five next month) and I do worry about what they are/are not exposed to - my sister and my brother-in-law do a great job when they're at home, but as they get older and get out more and more often. . . I'm going to be a little more concerned. Gaming companies shouldn't pull crap like the Hot Coffee stunt because regardless of how difficult it is to obtain, they still lied to the ESRB about it.

But that doesn't change the fact that the government has bigger problems to worry about. Sure I'd like to see the selling of M games more regulated, but can we start worrying about things that affect people on a more widespread scale first?

Onigumo

For me, one and two I can understand. But its point 3 that I have a problem with. Sometimes I don't want to play something educational. And what qualifies as "lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value for minors"?
Zelda has a lot of problem solving.
Final Fantasy games has lots of reading and political waring factions.
Lots of games have obstacles that require problem solving skills.
And sometimes I just want to push buttons and not worry about my problems.

I remember the idea of making cartoons educational. In retrospect, it might have been what ruined Freakazoid. Oh well.

Le Lawliet

What kind of game has any sort of political value for minors? Unless republicans or democrats wish to sway idiots to one side.

Bellamy

Well, there is a political computer game subgenre… Not the kind of thing that I think would interest kids, but it does exist.

Le Lawliet

there is? Can you give some examples? Cause I can't really think of any.

Cr4zy

I have a cousin who plays GTA: Vice City on the PC. He's 6! I wonder how he will turn out at the age of 14. Probably gonna smack me on the head and stab me….5 TIMES!!!!!!!!!! I can hear it now....Humiliation!

Bellamy

Well I haven't actually played any myself, but it has a section with a fair amount of games in a computer game site I go to.

COWMAKAZE

I refuse to buy into the "playing violent video games makes you violent" hype. It's been said about every single new form of media, from books to new music to TV. And it's never really been true. In my opinion, kids shouldn't play violent video games only because it's going to scare the piss out of them. And even then, you make sure you tell the kid that this is wrong and you don't do it. The reason that people find violence so scary, yet interesting, is because for the majority of our lives we are told we can't have it. And natural human tendency is to want what you can't have, so we crave it. Show the kid violence in small doses from a young age and he or she will get tired of it soon enough. It used to intrigue me just like everyone else, but during my childhood I spent a lot of time watching my uncle play violent video games while he constantly told me that it's wrong to do these things. AS such, I'm bored of violence and it confuses me when people want to go see a movie because it's gory or when people like God of War because it's bloody - I really have very little reaction to those things now.

People are going to say this about every new form of media for the rest of eternity, so whatever.

EDIT: Sure, this is being desensitized, but not in the way most people think desensitization works - it's not that violence means nothing to me. Real-life human gore I find appalling. Instead, it's more like I got so bored of violence that I think most of the things that they do in these games is absolutely ridiculous and I will only play the game if it's fun, not edgy or bloody.

Taleran

thats exacally correct and also one of the Reasons the drug trade still goes on

(well that and that the drugs actually work)

Le Lawliet

@COWMAKAZE:

I refuse to buy into the "playing violent video games makes you violent" hype. It's been said about every single new form of media, from books to new music to TV. And it's never really been true. In my opinion, kids shouldn't play violent video games only because it's going to scare the piss out of them. And even then, you make sure you tell the kid that this is wrong and you don't do it. The reason that people find violence so scary, yet interesting, is because for the majority of our lives we are told we can't have it. And natural human tendency is to want what you can't have, so we crave it. Show the kid violence in small doses from a young age and he or she will get tired of it soon enough. It used to intrigue me just like everyone else, but during my childhood I spent a lot of time watching my uncle play violent video games while he constantly told me that it's wrong to do these things. AS such, I'm bored of violence and it confuses me when people want to go see a movie because it's gory or when people like God of War because it's bloody - I really have very little reaction to those things now.

Exactly. Like allergies, if you're introduced to something that causes allergies at an early age, the less likely you are to develop the allergy.

Anime Master

…dear god. Do you think after Thompson wouldnt get help from the Justice League he turned to the Leigon ofDoom?

Bellamy

http://gamepolitics.livejournal.com/309317.html

For lack of better words I could use here in an effort to try and sound a lot more clever, mature and witty than I actually am…

owned.

Buuhan1

I do also not buy the entire violent video games make you violent. One of the big points that people play violent video games is cause thats something they can't do/can't bring themselfs to doing in real life. Thats the entire point of video games.

To experience something you would probably never experience/never wanna experience in the real world.

captain usopp

that's an interesting point Cowmakaze. That makes me think of my mom and smoking. My mom has always smoked, so I think, when I became a teen, I didn't care about smoking. It was nothing new.

I still think really little kids should stay away from violent stuff though. Honestly, some of them can' tell the differnece between reality and make believe. ( thinks of imaginary friends )

COWMAKAZE

Well, you obviously aren't going to bring a toddler to a screening of Cannibal Holocaust, but little things at first will do just because of what you said - go too hard too fast and you'll warp their minds just because you made them see something so scary. But what people do with their kids these days is have them watch nothing but cartoons and little kids' movies until they're ten. By the time you're six, you're basically set mentally - only very huge things can change you then. So you should work your way up. Of course, there's the problem of not telling the kid that these things are wrong - forget that part and he/she'll just think violence is okay to do.

Oh, and the guy from the article Bellamy posted? Incredible. Finally, someone gets it. This part is what really got me: "Video games are a form of artistic expression much like other forms of protected expression such as movies, books and music." Hehehe, our government thinks that censoring books is wrong but censoring video games isn't? Nice job, Moreau, that's one of the best showings of a case of self-pwnage I've seen in a while.

Taleran

@captain:

t

I still think really little kids should stay away from violent stuff though. Honestly, some of them can' tell the differnece between reality and make believe. ( thinks of imaginary friends )

so your protecting them from something your just going to give to them in a couple years neway instead of teaching them about the difference and letting them decide

that like peoples view on profanity, oooo the children will hear the dirty language, they'll hear it in a couples years neway meh

COWMAKAZE

@Taleran:

so your protecting them from something your just going to give to them in a couple years neway instead of teaching them about the difference and letting them decide

that like peoples view on profanity, oooo the children will hear the dirty language, they'll hear it in a couples years neway meh

Profanity is a joke anyway, and it's also incredibly hypocritical. If a word offends people when it is used, it is simply because they have been told to react that way. If I started acting all offended by the word "muffins", I would just get weird looks, even though it is a word with a real meaning just like any other profanity - all of them have meanings that can be used in conversation, so it is ridiculous to throw out a perfectly useful word just because some guy hundreds of years ago decided that "Hey, the word 'poo' is okay, and so is 'crap', 'turd', 'feces', and 'excretion', but for reasons unnamed I have a problem with the word 'shit'."

And this ties in pretty well with my argument on violence in video games - if these words were regarded just normal words, would many people use them? Probably not. People like them because of shock factor, the fact that society frowns upon them and that they are denied their use in proper company. People want what they can't have, so of course because these are restricted people throw them left and right. Just like violence.

Taleran

@COWMAKAZE:

Profanity is a joke anyway, and it's also incredibly hypocritical. If a word offends people when it is used, it is simply because they have been told to react that way. If I started acting all offended by the word "muffins", I would just get weird looks, even though it is a word with a real meaning just like any other profanity - all of them have meanings that can be used in conversation, so it is ridiculous to throw out a perfectly useful word just because some guy hundreds of years ago decided that "Hey, the word 'poo' is okay, and so is 'crap', 'turd', 'feces', and 'excretion', but for reasons unnamed I have a problem with the word 'shit'."

And this ties in pretty well with my argument on violence in video games - if these words were regarded just normal words, would many people use them? Probably not. People like them because of shock factor, the fact that society frowns upon them and that they are denied their use in proper company. People want what they can't have, so of course because these are restricted people throw them left and right. Just like violence.

its scary how much we think alike…..you may have to be destroyed to save the future

captain usopp

@Taleran:

so your protecting them from something your just going to give to them in a couple years neway instead of teaching them about the difference and letting them decide

that like peoples view on profanity, oooo the children will hear the dirty language, they'll hear it in a couples years neway meh

Nooooo…frustrated over narrow view and asumption
I'd be protecting the child from it, until the child is older, and their mind has developed, so that they can understand, and comprehend what they see. I also understand that you can't protect a child from the world, but everyone's sets of values and beiliefs are different. Some people may like to watch violence, but for me it is rather disturbing and I would not show my kid a lot of violence for that reason.

as for the profanity; people are bothered by it because it is disrespectful. I was taught as a child not to swear, and then when I grew up, my parents swore. I still don't swear, because I know it bothers some poeple, and I want to be considerate of others and show them respect.

Taleran

@captain:

Nooooo…frustrated over narrow view and asumption
I'd be protecting the child from it, until the child is older, and their mind has developed, so that they can understand, and comprehend what they see. I also understand that you can't protect a child from the world, but everyone's sets of values and beiliefs are different. Some people may like to watch violence, but for me it is rather disturbing and I would not show my kid a lot of violence for that reason.

as for the profanity; people are bothered by it because it is disrespectful. I was taught as a child not to swear, and then when I grew up, my parents swore. I still don't swear, because I know it bothers some poeple, and I want to be considerate of others and show them respect.

that is the single WORSE reason to do anything ever

some quick questions to test this

1. do you eat meat

2. if yes, you realize in doing that they're are people out there that you are offending

3. therfore you should give it up to keep with this ideal of yours

captain usopp

I also don't stop others from believing what they want to believe. Even if I don't agree. I hope that they would do the same. And no I don't eat meat. But not for moral reasons. Although, my friend does, but she does not wail on others for doing so.

As for me, go ask 1 2 Jango my opinion of porn, and then ask him about some of our nice chats we've had, despite the fact that we totally disagree on the subject. He respects that it's just not for me, and I respect that he is a big boy and can like what he likes and I don't pester him about it.

#3 isn't a question.

And I try to be nice, but if someone's going to back me into a corner, I'll scratch. I'd just perfer to get along with people, even if we don't have the same values and beliefs. I think if more people tried to understand and accept people, the world would be a happier place. Try putting yourself in someone elses shoes before judging them.
(how is trying to be nice to people a bad idea)

Something on topic:
who said videogames are just like books and movies. Man, your totally right. I don't understand why the rest of society doesn't see it. Look at all the violent movies out there. I'm sorry, but videogames are not of the devil. Go fight the real war out there. There are lots of people who die from real violence every day.

Taleran

no since my feet are bigger than most people I meet and that'd be way to uncomfortable (out of control metaphor 4TW)

I don't hold it againy you I just violently disagree with people giving up their rights for the sake of others not being offended (and so you know that doesn't include stuff against the law like peeing on random cars)

captain usopp

see, that's where your asuming. I'm not giving up my right to swear. I don't want to swear. Of coarse, if you want to swear, then who am I to stop you. I may not listen to you though. (OMG, just noticed, we're both from ontario…intersting)

Taleran

@captain:

see, that's where your asuming. I'm not giving up my right to swear. I don't want to swear. Of coarse, if you want to swear, then who am I to stop you. I may not listen to you though. (OMG, just noticed, we're both from ontario…intersting)

sweet your not one of the crazy ones

cheer