i want sanji to learn something like Rankyaku…not exactly the same as Rankyaku...
and as long we dont see other straw hats using...shigan or the other moves
Throughout this month, we will be testing new features (like search) so you may experience some hiccups from time to time. We'll try to not be too disruptive...
Rankyaku for sanji
-
-
@Octogon:
Rember that attacks that use the air to attack like 35 pound cannon is ALWAYS goinng to be weaker than a full contact attack.
If this is true then why are Gear 2 "Jet" based attacks so much stronger than Luffy's normal Gear 1 attacks?
-
If this is true then why are Gear 2 "Jet" based attacks so much stronger than Luffy's normal Gear 1 attacks?
**First of we don't knw how he is attacking when he goes gear 2. And if it is an air attack then I am still correct. Ever think that gear 2 just makes him that much stronger/faster?
And I am correct. Since those attacks are the breeze from there attacks, just concentrated to do more damage. Saying a breeze attack is equal to or stronger than a contact attack is like saying the breeze from your punch is stronger than you actually punching the person.**
-
Sorry to disagree, but even if you are correct in the instance I mentioned (and you probably are now that you point it out), but I think its possible for air attacks to be stroner dependant on circumstance and type of breeze attack (cutting, bludgeoning etc.).
-
Sorry to disagree, but even if you are correct in the instance I mentioned (and you probably are now that you point it out), but I think its possible for air attacks to be stroner dependant on circumstance and type of breeze attack (cutting, bludgeoning etc.).
**the only way I can think of that ever happening is is you have some wind powers or if you are using some outside sorce of wind.
But honestly I think it's obvious. Why do you think Rankyaku is a cutting Wind?
Simply because if it wasn't a cutting wind it wouldn't effect someone like Zoro much if at all. And since it is the wind generated from an attack it is weaker than a full contact hit. These attacks are used if someone wants to keep their distanse, like zoro in Skypeia. But someone like luffy ir buggy doen't need to make wind attaks since that already have long distanse moves.
Are you telling me the breeze from your attack is going to have more force than a punch from you?**
-
If that breeze turns into a blade then yea its going to be more powerful than a simple kick from me will. Especially if the opponent is someone like Luffy.
-
If that breeze turns into a blade then yea its going to be more powerful than a simple kick from me will. Especially if the opponent is someone like Luffy.
If that breeze turns in to a blade all it gains is the ability to cut. Unless you have something that aplifies the wind itself.
-
@Octogon:
If that breeze turns in to a blade all it gains is the ability to cut. Unless you have something that aplifies the wind itself.
So what? It'll still be more powerful in that circumstance.
-
So what? It'll still be more powerful in that circumstance.
**Mind telling me how? How in any way, shape or form will it be more powerful? You saw Lucchi when he went leapord? It just went through the ceiling. But then he thrwe Luffy and zoro across the island.
The breeze is simply the by product of the speed. The wind is slower than a contact hit. The wins isn't even solii.d Even if they were going at the same speed the contact hit is more powerful since a solid boject is doing the work.**
-
@Octogon:
**But really I'm sure that Rokushiki are just basic skills for people on league with the great pirates.
Soru - It's certain they move that fast
Tekkai - There muscles and skin are no doubt tat hard.
Kamie e - Simply dodgong.
Rankyaku - I'm certain they can all do it, but not neccarily with feet.
shigan - most probaley don't do exactly the same, but most likley could
geppou - I'm sure t's been used, just not to run on the air completley.**Um ok, first off I have to say that only the CP9 have learned the Rokushiki, so they are not just additions to a person's basic skills.
Also what is Simply dodgong? I don't understand that term at all.
My theory is that the Straw Hat crew will learn downgraded versions of each Rokushiki move. So each copied move that the Straw Hat's do will be styled around the Straw Hats personal fighting style. Like Sanji doing a personal Soru.
-
Um ok, first off I have to say that only the CP9 have learned the Rokushiki, so they are not just additions to a person's basic skills.
Also what is Simply dodgong? I don't understand that term at all.
My theory is that the Straw Hat crew will learn downgraded versions of each Rokushiki move. So each copied move that the Straw Hat's do will be styled around the Straw Hats personal fighting style. Like Sanji doing a personal Soru.
No no, I agree with octo here. The CP9's roushiki are basically moves that many super strong shouen characters have used. Kami-e for example is "simplu dodging" that some skiled martial artirsts use. In fact, some of the characters in OP and on the SHs have already used downgraded versions already.
Zoro and Sanji already move similar to soru. It's superspeed.
-
@Octogon:
Mind telling me how? How in any way, shape or form will it be more powerful? You saw Lucchi when he went leapord? It just went through the ceiling. But then he thrwe Luffy and zoro across the island.
I'm sorry, but in a fight with someone like Luffy, it basically doesn't matter how powerful a blunt force attack like a kick is, it won't have much if any affect. A cutting wind from a kick will though.
Therefor, its more powerful in that circumstance. Regardless of whether its got less energy, force or whatever you want to use to measure it.
Hence, my argument, that its all down to circumstance.
Also, Kami-e isn't simply dodging. Take a look at Fukurou doing it against Franky. He compresses in part of his head for christs sake :mellow:
That is in no way normal or "simple".
-
Also, Kami-e isn't simply dodging. Take a look at Fukurou doing it against Franky. He compresses in part of his head for christs sake :mellow:
That is in no way normal or "simple".
No, that's not what was implied. Kami-e is a move similar to "effortless dodging" used in many shounen animes, like in DBZ for example. Yes, all the roushiki are moves the CP9 trained to learn, no one doubt that, but these moves are similar to moves already used thoughtout animes. Superhuman-fighting staple moves.
Tao paipai from Dragonball, for example, once stabbed someone in their forehead with a finger, and this may not be the first time it was used.
-
Okay, so Luffy is simply a brawler then?
Saying that doesn't make his style any less effective, any easier to emulate, match, or even surpass.
Yea, rokushiki is simply an extension, an evolution of stuff in other manga's, but what about One Piece isn't?
My post in its simpliest form: What is your point in saying its simply stuff from other manga's etc? Cause, being the dense guy I am, I'm not seeing one.
-
Um ok, first off I have to say that only the CP9 have learned the Rokushiki, so they are not just additions to a person's basic skills.
Yes, yes they are.
Also what is Simply dodgong? I don't understand that term at all.
You know what I meant. Sorry for the typo, I just woke up then. @TheSonofBattles:
I'm sorry, but in a fight with someone like Luffy, it basically doesn't matter how powerful a blunt force attack like a kick is, it won't have much if any affect. A cutting wind from a kick will though.
Therefor, its more powerful in that circumstance. Regardless of whether its got less energy, force or whatever you want to use to measure it.
Hence, my argument, that its all down to circumstance.
Honestly, what don't you get? First of I am talking about force if you havn't already grasped that. Yes you get more "power" by making the wind shard. But the fact remains that a full-force contact hit WILL cause more damage.
Also, Kami-e isn't simply dodging. Take a look at Fukurou doing it against Franky. He compresses in part of his head for christs sake :mellow:
That is in no way normal or "simple".
No matter how you look at it, it is dodging. They aren't making illusions. they aren't tricking the enemy. They are dodging. There fore it is simply dodging accomplished most lilley through meditation or expirance.
Okay, so Luffy is simply a brawler then?
Yes. But you are correct in saying calling him such doesn't take away his effictivness.
-
@Octogon:
Honestly, what don't you get? First of I am talking about force if you havn't already grasped that. Yes you get more "power" by making the wind shard. But the fact remains that a full-force contact hit WILL cause more damage.
Not against someone like Luffy it won't. Thats my point. Luffy is much more susceptible to slash and cutting attacks than to blunt force type attacks. Therefor while the kick/punch might have more force behind it, that force will do far less damage than a weaker cutting style attack.Therefor, dependant on circumstance, wind type attacks can be more powerful than their originating kick/punch/etc.
You never specified in your original post that you only meant in terms of pounds of pressure per square inch or anything like that. You just used the much more broadsweeping term "weak".
Yea, sure, I agree, if you're going to simply talk about pounds of pressure per square inch, or joules of energy or whatever other scientific measurement you care to name that your are right: wind based attacks will always be weaker than a normal kick/punch/slash.
But so what?
Dependant on circumstance (like Luffy for instace), all that extra power will be quite worthless, and the stronger on paper attack will be much less effective, much less powerful than its wind based counterpart.
Hence me saying: Circumstance.
@Octogon:
Yes. But you are correct in saying calling him such doesn't take away his effictivness.
Didn't I just say that myself?
-
Not against someone like Luffy it won't. Thats my point. Luffy is much more susceptible to slash and cutting attacks than to blunt force type attacks. Therefor while the kick/punch might have more force behind it, that force will do far less damage than a weaker cutting style attack.
Therefor, dependant on circumstance, wind type attacks can be more powerful than their originating kick/punch/etc.
You never specified in your original post that you only meant in terms of pounds of pressure per square inch or anything like that. You just used the much more broadsweeping term "weak".
Yea, sure, I agree, if you're going to simply talk about pounds of pressure per square inch, or joules of energy or whatever other scientific measurement you care to name that your are right: wind based attacks will always be weaker than a normal kick/punch/slash.
But so what?
Dependant on circumstance (like Luffy for instace), all that extra power will be quite worthless, and the stronger on paper attack will be much less effective, much less powerful than its wind based counterpart.
Hence me saying: Circumstance.
**When were we ever talking about attacks on lufffy? I was taking about the atack itself, not how it would effect certain peolple. Besides luffy is not weak against sharp objects. It's just that those are the only types capable of going through him. and there hasn't been a single Rankyaku I have seen capable of doing luffy enoughf damage to go more than half an inch in him.
And even against luffy. If I wer sanji I would hit him with contect. Luffy is still human. If whitebeard punched him he would be knocked out. But a blade made from a non-solid object from someone like sanji isn't going to do much direct damage to him.**
Didn't I just say that myself?
By point exactly…................ -
@Octogon:
When were we ever talking about attacks on lufffy? I was taking about the atack itself, not how it would effect certain peolple. Besides luffy is not weak against sharp objects. It's just that those are the only types capable of going through him. and there hasn't been a single Rankyaku I have seen capable of doing luffy enoughf damage to go more than half an inch in him. [/[/FONT]quote]
Hence me saying in my first post: Circumstance, and continuing to point out that strenght, weakness, power etc. is really only a matter of circumstance unless you want to be totally cold, scientific and above all unrelated about it.And I was talking about Luffy since my second post, as an example. I could probably think up more, but I'm lazy, so…meh...
Also, I think Lucchi's ryankyaku wuold cut quite deeply into Luffy. Maybe not slice an arm off deep or anything, but I wouldn't exactly dismiss it out of hand at the same time.
Edit: Hmmm…can't seem to get that quote to fall into line for some reason.
-
I put my bet on Sanji already knowing Rankyaku and CP9 is using an incompete version they stole/developed from Chef. Zef. Look how easily he blocked Kalifa's Rankyaku.
-
I put my bet on Sanji already knowing Rankyaku and CP9 is using an incompete version they stole/developed from Chef. Zef. Look how easily he blocked Kalifa's Rankyaku.
that could indeed be true. you're wetting my appetite.
-
I just remembered something from the Luffy - Blueno fight.
Luffy altered Blueno's rankyaku with a kick. Maybe Gear 2 also allows Luffy to perform rankyaku? They are both leg-originated techniques. -
Gear 2 is leg originating? Anyway about the contact vs aerial attack deal, it won't matter if Luffys gear 2 isn't based on physical force, if it's something alltogether different like (i know people will misunderstand this) ki altering… as in it changes the force of kinetic energy, gravity, static energy etc because it is like those real life shigan moves, then it wouldn't matter. See moves like that don't have a basis in physical ability, sure it ussually goes alongside them, but they're more focused on releasing energy in your body at a particular point, thus it wouldn't matter if it was air based or physical, because the result is an exploding alteration of the living current around that point.
That is if gear 2 isn't physically based, if he truly is moving so fast that we just don't see his arm hit Blueno, then it doesn't matter, but I highly doubt it's an air attack like Zoro's tornato that launches the enemy into the air. -
Actually, when I said both, I meant to refer to rankyaku and soru, no the Gear 2.
Although I do think that Gear 2 was used to increase Luffy's leg ability, since he did activate it by hitting his own leg.here is the panel
http://groups.msn.com/OnePieceMangav-3/387.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=8203 -
YOW
now that all of us saw Sanji s power up I d like to bring my analysis:
We know that Sanji s attack names are all food related
in the beginning the names were only places like menton, oeuil and others
then more powerfull, names of food treatment like concasse, decoupage,…
and now it seems that he is cooking the food : next step with his heat-up tecnique
what do you think of this?? -
I think we shall see both legs heated up in the future.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
-
You know what would be cool? Fire based projectiles from Sanji's legs.
Not necessarily rankyaku, but seeing Sanji throw a kick and have a fireball come out of it would be awesome. Or maybe a fire blade kick attack…maybe in the next arc.
-
You know what would be cool? Fire based projectiles from Sanji's legs.
Not necessarily rankyaku, but seeing Sanji throw a kick and have a fireball come out of it would be awesome. Or maybe a fire blade kick attack…maybe in the next arc.
Nah, we already have Usopps fire stars, and when Franky joins we have his fire breath, thats nuff..
-
Nah, we already have Usopps fire stars, and when Franky joins we have his fire breath, thats nuff..
I want to know if Sanji could already cut air. When he could do something like that fire legs so he should be able to cut air but he still was impressed by the air cutting move from Jab
-
i imagine that leg strength doesn't have to do with learning rankyaku as much as technique. the cp9 have already commented on how powerful sanji's kicks are, so i'm sure he has the potential to learn. i mean, if fukurou knows rankyaku, then it seems like even chopper could.
-
i imagine that leg strength doesn't have to do with learning rankyaku as much as technique. the cp9 have already commented on how powerful sanji's kicks are, so i'm sure he has the potential to learn. i mean, if fukurou knows rankyaku, then it seems like even chopper could.
But when someone like Fukuro was able to learn ist Sanji should be able to do it plain simple.
Don´t get me wrong I love his devil leg way more than that air cutting technic and ir seems more powerful than Rankyaku. But Zoro is able to cut ais Cp are able to cut air with their feets so Sanji should know it too, but he seemed a little suprised after Jab used a cutting move…
-
@SanG:
But when someone like Fukuro was able to learn ist Sanji should be able to do it plain simple.
Don´t get me wrong I love his devil leg way more than that air cutting technic and ir seems more powerful than Rankyaku. But Zoro is able to cut ais Cp are able to cut air with their feets so Sanji should know it too, but he seemed a little suprised after Jab used a cutting move…
He was surprised because it was about to hit him…
-
Zoro has always been the cutting guy. If Sanji starts cutting things too, WHERE WILL THAT LEAVE ZORO??
-
@IT'S:
Zoro has always been the cutting guy. If Sanji starts cutting things too, WHERE WILL THAT LEAVE ZORO??
That´s a word
and just once again his flame kicks could be long range moves too…
-
Sanji shouldn't get a long range move anyways. Zoro needs it since he lacks speed. Sanji is blindingly fast.
http://groups.msn.com/onepiecemangav-2/onepiece415.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=8371
http://groups.msn.com/onepiecemangav-2/onepiece415.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=8372
He was right in front of Jyabura, Jyabura didn't even look away, and yet Jyabura wasn't able to follow Sanji's movement. Also, throughout the fight, Sanji was always right up in Jyabura's face. When you move that fast, you don't need a long ranged attack, you're perfectly fine without it. -
Flame kick = the coolest thing since phoenix cannon. I think Sanji's new move pretty much makes the rankyaku debate irrelevant. He doesn't need it now.
-
I don't know quite how to put into words what I want to say regarding Sanji so this could ramble a fair bit and I ask ye have patience with me because of this.
I love Sanjis fights, they're always one of the most exciting to me, especially when animated. What I do have a problem with regards his fights, is, maybe, the finishes to them. Everyone else has special moves they can pull out, something extra special that adds some flair mid fight, and espeically as they finish their opponent off. Sanji seems to lack something like this to my mind.
Most of his attacks, with the exception of, from memory Concasse and Party table kick course, are just simple kicks to differant body areas. And Party Table at least is more of a group attack than anything.
I guess what I want to say is that I'd like to see Sanji come up with more attacks that aren't just kicks to differant parts of the body, and have more flair and such.
Which is why I'd like to see him do something like Zeffs wind blow on Pearl i.e. a blunt force wind attack, especially if he did it with his flaming leg and added a fire attack bonus on top of the blunt wind attack.
Not even that nessecarily, just something a little differant, a little special.
-
I think Sanji knowing of this kicking technique to kick slicing air, will have him attempt it himself some time when he fights a more ranged opponent.
But it'll probably be like a Super Rankyaku, with a different name since it will look different and be bigger/stronger.
-
hasn't zeff used something like rankyoku to stop pearl's fire pearls? sanji will learn rankyoku if not now maybe in the future and who said zoro is slower than sanji? zoro will show his boosted up speed in his fight with kaku and seriously how can zoro be threaten by sanji's cutting technique? sanji will never be able to cut steel and zoro will definately cut sea stone some day, don't tell me the air can cut something harder than diamond,sanji may become one day strong enough to surpass zeff's ability to leave his footprint in steel but he isn't gonna cut it with air
-
Sanji is faster than Zoro because he just is. Look at their fights. Zoro is usually battered after a fight. It's because he can't dodge as well as Sanji. It's their fighting style. Sanji has never and probably never will be able to toss a concrete house. Similarly, Zoro will (should) never be able to move in less than a blink of an eye consistently. He may (and already has if I'm not mistaken) be able to move that fast on and off, but never consistenetly in a fight.
Plus, if Zoro moves that fast, he will be very difficult to hit, and then he won't bleed like swiss cheese. And to me, a fight where Zoro looses less blood than all the blood lost in the other fights of that arc would be so wrong.
