Doctor Who

Print Error

No-one discussing Time Heist yet? I guess you're all waiting on the US broadcast.

Anyway, I'm going to post my non-spoilery thoughts behind a spoiler tag just to play it safe, and then put my spoilery thoughts inside another spoiler tag. It's spoilerception.

! Hi, I'm Print Error. You probably know me as the woman that complains about Moffat every week. But I'm actually going to out and say it: that was really quite good, and a lot of fun. Sure it's no classic but I'd happily watch it again (and indeed, already have). Didn't take itself too seriously but also wasn't pushing for comedy, and the supporting cast were all wonderful. Sort of a quintessential episode of Who, actually, the kind you'd show someone to explain what the series is like, without pushing a special on them and pretending they're all like that. Capaldi definitely felt like his own Doctor perhaps moreso than any episode yet, and boy it was fun.
! And now the spoilery spoilers.
! >! I sort of wish both one-off psuedo-Companions would stick around. I felt disappointed when they both got cheap deaths, but the lack of Missy showing up got my hopes up, and indeed they returned. Though I guess a shapeshifter is less standout if she can't shapeshift, Psi certainly could bring something to Team Tardis. Both definitely felt like real characters to me, and maybe I'm saying this because I found Psi really cute XD
! Keely Hawes was clearly having a lot of fun. And yet somehow the villain seemed consistent even with all that ham. Impressive. Also like how she managed to play the clone so that she was the same but different. Now that's how you do a one-off Who villain (if you're not going the dark route, that is). And as for the Teller…while I'm not sure the logic is quite as consistent as it thinks it is, it was quite an effective new monster. I mean, the idea of mind death disturbs me way more than actual death, and that's pretty much that. Also 'don't think' is a better variant on 'don't blink' than 'don't breathe' although if you put all these aliens in a room together, you'd be overwhelmed with things not to do.
! So yes, thumbs up from me...
! …and thumbs up from me!

…and I hope that works.

Warp Predator

I don't know, it doesn't really work once you know all the twists, so watching again, even a month after was kind of boring.
Not that it was really exciting back then. Still a good middle-season episode.

! I'm glad they concealed the Architect better, in the workprint his identity was really obvious from the start. Instead they made teleports equally obvious.
Teller is another monster with wrinkles with "don't do stuff" gimmick. It gets old.
! The Doctor was magnificent, as usual. Guest companions were fine too, except that one part where Psi decided to die for Clara. He wasn't shown to be really altruistic before, and frankly Clara didn't do anything to earn such undying trust. Ostrich herself is back to season 7 inoffensive level, guess that is something.
! I'm really really thankful that Delphox (and her boss) didn't channel River. Guess their parts weren't rewritten by Moffat.

Robby

Decent episode, though I somehow guessed every single twist along the way.

I dunno if that was the episode being obvious or if it was me just being ahead of it having seen way too much Who, I dunno.

! Seriously, the teleporters, the clone, the Doctor being the architect, and the doc being there to save the monster of the week I was ahead of. Really drained the tension right out.Sigh.
! It's also one of those cases where the title of the episode spoils the half-way surprise. Of COURSE it's a time heist, we knew that last week!

Still that same feeling where Capaldi is doing great, no complaints, no fault of his own, but I still miss the energy and enthusiasm Matt brought to it. I hope that feeling passes soon. Though the pace of the show has definitely slowed down and is breathing a little more with Capaldi, and that I do like.

@Warp:

Ostrich

I get you don't like Clara, but why the hell are you calling her that?

@Print:

No-one discussing Time Heist yet? I guess you're all waiting on the US broadcast.

It takes time for torrents/website uploads/us broadcast. Have to wait for the ep to air, and then to be uploaded, and then to download it, and to then watch it… discussion is generally gonna be a few hours behind the british airing here.

Warp Predator

@Robby:

I get you don't like Clara, but why the hell are you calling her that?

‘Clara Ostrich!’ The Doctor beamed.
‘The surname is Oswald,’ said Clara.
‘Well, I’ve been thinking. About the surname. You never really liked it, I’ve never really liked it. And Ostrich is much better. Because of the neck.’
Clara considered him coolly. ‘I’ve missed you,’ she said.

It was in one of the books. And I agree, it does sound fitting. Not because of the neck though.

Robby

Oh well in that case, maybe I'll switch to Ostrich too.

CosmicDebris

@Print:

No-one discussing Time Heist yet? I guess you're all waiting on the US broadcast.

Anyway, I'm going to post my non-spoilery thoughts behind a spoiler tag just to play it safe, and then put my spoilery thoughts inside another spoiler tag. It's spoilerception.

! Hi, I'm Print Error. You probably know me as the woman that complains about Moffat every week. But I'm actually going to out and say it: that was really quite good, and a lot of fun. Sure it's no classic but I'd happily watch it again (and indeed, already have). Didn't take itself too seriously but also wasn't pushing for comedy, and the supporting cast were all wonderful. Sort of a quintessential episode of Who, actually, the kind you'd show someone to explain what the series is like, without pushing a special on them and pretending they're all like that. Capaldi definitely felt like his own Doctor perhaps moreso than any episode yet, and boy it was fun.
! And now the spoilery spoilers.
! >! I sort of wish both one-off psuedo-Companions would stick around. I felt disappointed when they both got cheap deaths, but the lack of Missy showing up got my hopes up, and indeed they returned. Though I guess a shapeshifter is less standout if she can't shapeshift, Psi certainly could bring something to Team Tardis. Both definitely felt like real characters to me, and maybe I'm saying this because I found Psi really cute XD
! Keely Hawes was clearly having a lot of fun. And yet somehow the villain seemed consistent even with all that ham. Impressive. Also like how she managed to play the clone so that she was the same but different. Now that's how you do a one-off Who villain (if you're not going the dark route, that is). And as for the Teller…while I'm not sure the logic is quite as consistent as it thinks it is, it was quite an effective new monster. I mean, the idea of mind death disturbs me way more than actual death, and that's pretty much that. Also 'don't think' is a better variant on 'don't blink' than 'don't breathe' although if you put all these aliens in a room together, you'd be overwhelmed with things not to do.
! So yes, thumbs up from me...
! …and thumbs up from me!

…and I hope that works.

^I don't feel like typing anything long right now, so I'll just agree with Print Error.

Fun episode, pretty much the heart of Doctor Who right there. I'd think that people who have been complaining about Capaldi would be a little happier to see how things turned out here, but I guess some are still too stuck on the Tennant/Smith-isms to move past it yet.

Also

! Brain soup was the scariest thing I've ever seen in Doctor Who, to me, personally. That's just one of those trigger points, I guess. I'd have nightmares about that if I were a kid

I liked the really different feel of this episode, the music, the cinematography, it felt very fresh.

labmate

The Teller itself scares the living shit out of me. Good episode, I don't have much to say, I'm just gonna go to bed and not be able to sleep.~

WolfWood37

@krule274:

The Teller itself scares the living shit out of me. Good episode, I don't have much to say, I'm just gonna go to bed and not be able to sleep.~

Just don't look under your bed now…you know that nightmare you've been having?

CosmicDebris

Don't think, think and you're dead! Either that or the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man will show up.

TLC

Cute episode, though it's hard to be invested in a story you were ahead of every step of the way. Didn't call it being a rescue mission though.

I really do like Capaldi, he's brought some dignity to the character that that dork Smith all but ruined for me. He brings a slow "methodicalness" and deliberateness to the character I really appreciate instead of jumping around everywhere with unfocused energy. The pacing has become more of a slow burn as well which is good because I can get more… scratch that ACTUALLY invested in the stories and characters. So that's good.

Even Clara has much improved! Which I theorize it's because she works off better with Capaldi whose playing the straight man and she can be more wild and flamboyant than with Smith when she had to play the straight man and just came off boring. Or maybe it's because they were both playing over-energetic goofs and Clara was overshadowed? I honestly don't remember, hence theorize, Smith era Clara is just a total blank for me. She works so much better with Capaldi, it's amazing.

RamistaR

I thought that they would be in the paradise, but no it was just a teleportation.

Can someone explain me why old Karabraxos is a nice person ?:wassat:
I guess people can change, but she was a complete trash.

kevo_koma

@RamistaR:

I thought that they would be in the paradise, but no it was just a teleportation.

Can someone explain me why old Karabraxos is a nice person ?:wassat:
I guess people can change, but she was a complete trash.

Regret. She was old alone and dying and as she waited for death, she took stock of her life and decided imprisoning the Teller was the one thing she regretted most.

Nobodyman

I thought this was actually a really good episode. I don't know how it'll hold up on repeat viewings, but the first was pretty darn good.

! Honestly, the only twist I really saw coming was The Doctor being the Architect, and even that was more towards the end. I guess I just suck at predicting things, but hey, it keeps me in suspense.

Kazhar

@Warp:

I don't know, it doesn't really work once you know all the twists, so watching again, even a month after was kind of boring.
Not that it was really exciting back then. Still a good middle-season episode.

! I'm glad they concealed the Architect better, in the workprint his identity was really obvious from the start. Instead they made teleports equally obvious.
Teller is another monster with wrinkles with "don't do stuff" gimmick. It gets old.
! The Doctor was magnificent, as usual. Guest companions were fine too, except that one part where Psi decided to die for Clara. He wasn't shown to be really altruistic before, and frankly Clara didn't do anything to earn such undying trust. Ostrich herself is back to season 7 inoffensive level, guess that is something.
! I'm really really thankful that Delphox (and her boss) didn't channel River. Guess their parts weren't rewritten by Moffat.

Where does the "Moffat writes every female characters like River" meme even come from, anyway ? I've read it in a lot of different places, and I still don't know how it came to be. What's so "River" about Clara, Amy, Sally Sparow, the mother from the Empty Child, the villain from Bells of St John or even Kovarian and Missy ? You could argue that he likes the middle-aged-female-villain-in-a-business-suit archetype a bit too much, but none of them were River-like… ?

Warp Predator

@kevo_koma:

Regret. She was old alone and dying and as she waited for death, she took stock of her life and decided imprisoning the Teller was the one thing she regretted most.

One can even say that she was trying to atone for her sins, so she can reach the promised land.

@Kazhar:

What is so "River" about Amy?

Heh.

What is so "River" about the rest of them?

It's not "He writes every female like River". It's "he likes River so much, he can't resist creating "mysterious quirky woman in her 30-40, who knows the Doctor, and hints on their romantic relationships on every ocassion, and also they bicker like married couple". Tasha Lem says hello. Missy already fits, they just didn't have chance to bicker yet. Arguably you can count Vastra, only difference is that she does same things to Jenny. Middle-aged-female-villain-in-a-business-suit is fine (although they are very generic and practically interchangeable). The possibility of another Stiffler's mom appearing fills me with existential terror.

Mr. Zoro

@Print:

No-one discussing Time Heist yet? I guess you're all waiting on the US broadcast.

And while everyone else waits for torrents, I wait until Sunday for my iTunes edition to be ready for download, so I'm usually the last of the bunch to see it x)

Really fun episode, even though I'm in the same boat as most of you in terms of predictability. I can see new viewers being shocked, but for veterans you can definitely take a good guess at some of the major things.

! Although I didn't see the clones thing with Keeley Hawes, so that was a pleasant surprise. I was expecting the two one-off companions to end up in paradise as well, but nice to see they're alive and open to the possibility of coming back.
! You could also say that the writers gave a way out into explaining who the woman in the shop was, since Karabraxos has the number, but I feel it's just a red herring and too obvious for Moffat's taste (and he does love his red herrings!).
If anything, I see it as a way for the Doctor to convince himself that he finally found out how this mysterious woman in the shop got his number, which serves to cast his mind off of it and end up surprised in the end.
! Plus, I don't see Karabraxos settling down at some point in her life and just setting up a shop in Clara's area.

So far for me, series 8 has been 5/5.

CosmicDebris

I haven't been disappointed yet. Looking back at this point, I'd say Into The Dalek has been my least favorite. A lot of people seem to hate Robots of Sherwood, but to me that was the most fun and entertaining, I could see that being a future guilty pleasure episode.

LosKnoggos

Can someone explain the thing the "woman in a shop"-thing? My memories of all the New-Who episodes are fuzzy and I know little to nothing about the Old-Who, so I don't whats this all about.

RobZilla

@LosKnoggos:

Can someone explain the thing the "woman in a shop"-thing? My memories of all the New-Who episodes are fuzzy and I know little to nothing about the Old-Who, so I don't whats this all about.

In "The Bells of Saint John", Clara rang a "support" number given to her by an unidentified woman working in a shop.

The number was actually the Tardis' direct line, and that's how Clara first came into contact with The Doctor.

CosmicDebris

That Clara, at least…in the Doctor's timeline, he met one of her echoes first (Asylum of the Daleks).

labmate

@WolfWood37:

Just don't look under your bed now…you know that nightmare you've been having?

I don't want to talk about it. :ninja:

RobZilla

@CosmicDebris:

That Clara, at least…in the Doctor's timeline, he met one of her echoes first (Asylum of the Daleks).

Yeah, I meant this incarnation of Clara that's currently travelling with The Doctor, the one that was given the Tardis' number to ring.

Not Dalek or Victorian Clara.

Print Error

My favourite Clara was the third Clara. I felt the second Clara was too grumpy to play the Clara, whilst the third Clara had me believing she was the Clara within her first episode.

Warp Predator

@Print:

My favourite Clara was the third Clara. I felt the second Clara was too grumpy to play the Clara, whilst the third Clara had me believing she was the Clara within her first episode.

Time Lord Clara was still better than third Clara. And then there is Clara from this scene

!

which is considered one of the best Claras of all time.

labmate

@Warp:

Time Lord Clara was still better than third Clara. And then there is Clara from this scene

! http://38.media.tumblr.com/d3fcba4f388eb3bfcfed822cfcf5c73b/tumblr_n7rz478bTx1qemtt7o10_1280.jpg

which is considered one of the best Claras of all time.

That's a great Clara, though this is my favorite Ostrich:

!

Warp Predator

@krule274:

That's a great Clara, though this is my favorite Ostrich:

! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/43/RoryWilliams.jpg

Callin' best companion Ostrich… Truly a tragedy.

CosmicDebris

Ostriches are cool.

Warp Predator

Except when they bite. That is painful, worse than geese.

CosmicDebris

Well yeah, look how much bigger than are. They taste better, though.

CosmicDebris

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2014/09/kill-moon-press-details.html?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed&m=1

The shock of her life, eh?

Silver R. Bolt

@CosmicDebris:

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2014/09/kill-moon-press-details.html?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed&m=1

The shock of her life, eh?

Judging by this seasons' love of bringing up stuff that should've been known but was long forgotten, the Doctor is scared of Spiders.

CosmicDebris

Still? I thought he was over that after Planet of the Spiders. I wonder if they're the same spiders.

Warp Predator

Plot twist: All spiders in Planet of Spiders are Clara in spider costume. Shocking unexpected scene at the end of Kill the Moon is her putting the costume on and flying to Metebelis 3.
Moffat thinks it's best scene of the season.

labmate

@Warp:

Plot twist: All spiders in Planet of Spiders are Clara in spider costume. Shocking unexpected scene at the end of Kill the Moon is her putting the costume on and flying to Metebelis 3.
Moffat thinks it's best scene of the season.

For once in my life, I would agree with Moffat.

Robby

Plot twist. Clara killed Colin Baker's Doctor.

Warp Predator

The Watcher was Clara all along.

CosmicDebris

The Doctor has one of those spiders on his back and has been controlled all along!

But probably, he's going to take off in the TARDIS to do a thing and Clara will have thought that he abandoned her again or something.

Print Error

@Warp:

Plot twist: All spiders in Planet of Spiders are Clara in spider costume. Shocking unexpected scene at the end of Kill the Moon is her putting the costume on and flying to Metebelis 3.
Moffat thinks it's best scene of the season.

It's like we have a mole in the writing team or something.

Warp Predator

@Print:

It's like we have a mole in the writing team or something.

I wish.
Although, since you are in UK and personally know people who know people like Neil Gaiman…

Print Error

@Warp:

I wish.
Although, since you are in UK and personally know people who know people like Neil Gaiman…

I'm still trying to get our mutual friend to introduce us.

True story: my friend from university Writers' Circle was heading to Bristol once when the man in the seat next to her pulled out some papers and started reading them. She glanced over and it was a script for an unaired episode. She told me that it was about clockwork robots. And then sure enough…so I still wonder if she was next to Moffat (before he became famous (sort of)).

CosmicDebris

It could have been. I still see stories from random people saying they've seen Moffat sitting in cafes and whatnot. But I don't know if clockwork robots are unique to Doctor Who.

CosmicDebris

Apparently, there is a precedence for the next episode:

Remembrance of the Daleks.

[School corridor]

(The Headmaster is putting a notice about car thieves up on the school notice board when the Doctor and Ace enter.)
HEADMASTER: Ah.
DOCTOR: Good afternoon.
HEADMASTER: And you would be?
DOCTOR: The Doctor. And you?
HEADMASTER: I'm the Headmaster here. Doctor, eh? Well, you're a bit over-qualified for the position, but if you would like to leave your particulars and references.
DOCTOR: References?
HEADMASTER: You are here for the job of school caretaker?
DOCTOR: Oh, no. We're here for a completely different reason.

So 51 years later, he's finally taken up the job offer.

Print Error

I have a friend who thought Karabraxos was Missy. Can't see how you'd even begin to…

…oh.

Warp Predator

I sincerely don't remember who is top left one.

Print Error

@Warp:

I sincerely don't remember who is top left one.

Irene Adler from Sherlock, so not Who but still Modern Moffat.

Warp Predator

@Print:

Irene Adler from Sherlock, so not Who but still Modern Moffat.

Oh, that explains it. Sherlock is gradually being erased from my memory.
Although she is not really belongs here, since she is more like River than "woman in suit of the week".

herr_sebbe

@Print:

I have a friend who thought Karabraxos was Missy. Can't see how you'd even begin to…

http://media.tumblr.com/dda92d793f8c836a6bd0928fe5e21853/tumblr_inline_nc94esX7dw1sfdumh.jpg

…oh.

I have been wondering for some time what is the deal with Moffat's female antagonists. They're not the standard norm for women in television, I'll grant him that, but… still.

CosmicDebris

I figured the resemblance was intentional. Karabraxos had clones, I'm half expecting them to be related to each other in some way. We don't really know if Missy is even a villain, though.

I'm also pretty sure Moffat is into dominatrices.

Darkstorm

Another good episode, probably the best of the series so far(this or the Robin Hood one). Great dialogue throughout, and no paradox faffing.
12 seems to be taking a more McCoy "seeking" role rather then trouble finding him, which I also like.

Oh, and the ending will please any The Thick of It fans.

Kazhar

World saved by an amazingly well-placed trampoline