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[VildaHawk]

So I finally decided that I ought to look into other manga besides One Piece. I've been just sort of browsing, reading the first few chapters of whatever sparks my interest.
I've read about 4 chapters of Bleach and the first chapter of Death Note. (A couple others, too, but those aren't the point of this thread.) I'm sure there are other similarities between the two, but the most evident one is that they both feature Shinigami.
I don't know much about Shinigami, or what role they play, if any, in Japanese culture, but the similarities and differences between the Shinigami in these two manga was enough to interest me.

So, the topic is Shinigami. Discuss.
Which conception of Shinigmai do you prefer?
What other versions of Shinigami are out there?
What traditions or lore, if any, surround Shinigami?

[Satsuki]

Well, Shinigami literally means "death god" and it definitely comes out of Shintoism. Other than that, don't know much of the lore. But there are so many gods or things that can qualify as a god in Shintoism that it's hard to keep track.

[VildaHawk]

Hmm, maybe I should've paid attention in my comparative religions class after all… :rolleyes:

EDIT: And doesn't "gami" mean "hair"?

[Himizujin_Eternia]

Well, kami or -gami can mean paper, hair, or god. It depends on the kanji used. The kanji here happens to be God.

Anyway, Shinigami take many forms in anime and manga. Although I have not read Death Note, I assume they play a similar yet different role from Bleach. In Bleach, the Shinigami are samurai-esque, and act alot like angels, in that they are sent from heaven (soul society) to guide souls and to defeat demons (Hollows.)

In another series that focuses on Shinigami a bit, Full Moon wo Sagashite, Shinigami are portrayed much cuter, but still carry the job of guiding human spirits to the next life.

In the end, it seems that mangaka interpret Shinigami differently, but they all focus on death in some way, hence the name "Death God."

[Buccaneer]

I like Death Note's concept of Shinigami a lot more. They're dark, calm(with a touch of crazy), and not your typical boy band rejects. :P

[Shylu]

Death Note's concept of shinigami is more convincing to me. They are immortal (except for that one condition), unattached, and they look hideous without being sinister (probably explaining why people can be scared to death ;)). Well, hideous at first, because now I find Ryuk cute.

The Soul Society is too much like humans IMO, with their power structure and their hidden agendas. Meanwhile Death Note shinigami mostly doesn't have a care about anything but their job, which is closer to being an "angel" of death then just "person from another world".

Nevertheless, my straight-femaleness loves Bleach's shinigami. :P (Kyaaa Renji! Shuuhei! Byakuya!)

Other manga with shinigami would be Yami no Matsuei (pretty boy shinigami) and Fullmoon wo Sagashite (ultra cute shinigami).

[Buccaneer]

my straight-femaleness loves Bleach's shinigami.(Kyaaa Renji! Shuuhei! Byakuya!)

…..You just assured that I will never read Bleach. :P

[VildaHawk]

Originally posted by Buccaneer@Mar 16 2005, 10:10 PM
**> my straight-femaleness loves Bleach's shinigami.(Kyaaa Renji! Shuuhei! Byakuya!)

…..You just assured that I will never read Bleach. :P
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There are hot female Shinigami in there too. One of 'em spends half a chapter trying to figure out how to use a juicebox.

[Shylu]

Originally posted by Buccaneer@Mar 17 2005, 11:10 AM
**> my straight-femaleness loves Bleach's shinigami.(Kyaaa Renji! Shuuhei! Byakuya!)

…..You just assured that I will never read Bleach. :P
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Now, now, can't we well-behaved women enjoy our fangirl moments once in a while? :P Or I can fangirl over Sanji, Kohza, Zoro and Ace if that's more befitting.

Vilda: juicebox? I don't remember a part like that. :blink: But yeah, Bleach has equal opportunity eye-candy.

[VildaHawk]

Originally posted by Shylu+Mar 17 2005, 08:49 AM–>QUOTE(Shylu @ Mar 17 2005, 08:49 AM)

[Satsuki]

You mean Rukia? That was WAAAAAAAY early in the series.

The reason the Shinigami in Bleach are so human-like is because they are basically human souls who have undergone training and education to hone their spiritual power and become Shinigami.

And I happen to LOVE Full Moon wo Sagashite. The manga, anyway. Very nice how they delve into the nature of Shinigami and how they came to be called that in the first place. Plus I like the artwork. :P

And all-together, Shylu! Fangirl squeal! RENJIIIIIIIII!!!!!!!!!!!!!! one of the hottest manga characters I have ever seen

[Shylu]

Originally posted by VildaHawk@Mar 17 2005, 10:38 PM
**Yeah, when she can't figure out how to work the straw? She's sitting in the background while Ichigo is talking to that tough guy and then Chad comes…

Anyhoo, back on topic.
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Oh… juice in a box. I was imagining an electric juice maker. Well, Rukia is one female shinigami, but I think many guys would prefer some of the other girls who appear later in Soul Society. :D

[VildaHawk]

Well, as I said, I've only read the first volume or so.

But it's interesting to see not only how humans react and relate to Shinigami, but also the way Shinigami react and relate to humans.

[Satsuki]

Originally posted by Shylu+Mar 17 2005, 11:15 PM–>QUOTE(Shylu @ Mar 17 2005, 11:15 PM)

[HopelessFollower]

And you see the one girl naked!!! :D

I've personally haven't read Death Note, but I think how Shinigamis are protrayed in the different mangas relate directly to how the authors think of religion. In Bleach we have these death gods but they're filled with deception and corruption while in Death Note it seems that they are more just there doing a job as Buc and Shylu said.

[Jeltz]

As reapers I prfer the Shinigami in Death Note. They actr more like immortal death gods would. Shinigami in Bleach are like humans.

[VildaHawk]

Does anyone know about Gods of Death in other cultures? It would be interesting to compare…

[Marred]

You mean like something like Thanatos? The Greek God of Death… that's the only one I can think of.. and I don't even know anything about him. Hades is more known than he is, and he's the God of the underworld.... He was mentioned in the Odyssey twice.. ¬_¬
Some cultures have angels that bring death.. (… heh, look at "City of Angels")

Anyway, I prefer the Shinigami of Death Note over the ones in Bleach. :P
Ryuk is so awesome...

[Yumi]

there aren't a hole lot of other creatures in any mythology that function as similarly as a shinigami is said to; their characteristics seem to be unique to Shinto.

however, there are gods and deities of death in all mythologies and cultures. messengers of death are fascinating too, like the sirens (whose wailing some believed to signify death) or the night washers (who are said to have been spotted at night, washing the clothes of those who will die)…

personally, one of my favorite images of death is that of the goddess Kali of the Hindu mythology. She's the dancing black-skinned goddess of strong passions, homicidal, violent, erotic, or motherly. Mortals are said to see her most often when she appears at battles or upon the burning grounds. She has an emaciated figure, whose tongue hangs out between her large fangs. She wears a necklace of of skulls and rotting heads. Her images often depict her trampling her husband, Shiva (also known as Mahakala) who embodies the Universe's binding and unbinding energies. He is the creator, but also the destroyer. As a result he is also viewed as the god of life and death. Kinda like a great recycler. They make a good couple...

I also prefer Bleach.

U.R.A.H.A.R.A K.I.S.U.K.E. :lol:

If the death god who came for me looked and sounded anything like him -Miki Shin'ichirou is one of my favorite seiyuus- I'd die a happy girl.

[e1n]

easily put, shinigami in bleach are way too bishie. but i have no complain over that; i still think hinamori is way cute, matsumoto has nice boobs (well, she's all boobs), yoruichi is way hot, urahara is by far the coolest dude alive, hitsugaya has the best i-don't-give-a-fuck-bout-anything look on his face, and kenpachi kicks ass. oh, and i wanna marry yachiru. call me a pedophile, but she rocks my freakin bleach world.

shinigami in DN is more…..... realistic? i mean, i would totally imagine that real shinigami (if they exist) would probably end up looking as deformed as that. basically if you like something realistic, go for DN. if you like something bishie, bleach.

as for what shinigami does, duties and shit like that... i wouldn't trust bleach too much. it looks like bleach is just another typical shonen manga. i mean, with the whole fighting hollow and things like that. shinigami in DN are more appropriately described.

i think.....

[Marred]

I wouldn't say they're more 'realistic'.. since it's mythological, but I agree otherwise, and I see what you mean.

I haven't really heard much shinigami myths other than the ones in these mangas, but my idea of a death god would be something completely ethereal. Perhaps something you can't see but sense. Something without a gender and a face. Something completely beautiful and deadly, (but not pretty). Not of the material world. That can travel inter-dimensionally? That can feel lives.

Death Note is such a great story, and it does a good job of creating these Shinigami, but it has such an evil vibe.. Of course, the feeling of the story makes it a good story, and I don't get as much feeling from Bleach, so I prefer DN. (It's my newest obsession really.)
.. But I digress.