Does it need to be told specifically in a flashback?
There could be other ways to adress those things.
Chapter 968: Oden's Return
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Does it need to be told specifically in a flashback?
There could be other ways to adress those things.
He is a yonko who is a mystery why would Oda do different with Kaido.
There is no other way to tell Kaido's being without a flashback. This discussion is getting ridiculous tbh
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@uniaka:
it's like most of dressrosa would be about diamante and about doflamingo only at the end. Also kaidou got captured many times, so who else besides wg would even want to captured that thing, and vegapunk made artificial smile version of kaidou's dragon.
Doflamingo had the entire dressrosa under his control and was the focus since punk hazard, so not the same.
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Not specifically a flashback indeed, but Oda does like his formulas. However it is told, after several years of building up this saga and Kaido, it would be quite the troll to leave us with nothing more than "he was a big bad drunk who enjoyed a good brawl".
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Ehh, Kaidou might not be the most fleshed out character but he has at least still shown some personality compare to Lucci who was always a blank-slate muscle dude.
I would not call being a drunk and supposedly being suicidal which makes no sense, a personality yet.
He is more expressive than Lucci, which can be explained by the latter being a government agent who is supposed to keep calm, yet his bloodthirsty tendencies still came through. -
Thank you. I figured it would be something along those lines, the alternative being a child-friendly version of "I wish I had pussy" (which would also be in line with the Ninja dudes usual attitude).
Your previous comment about streaming had me thinking you were talking about Ninja for a moment and I was so shocked and confused.
Does it need to be told specifically in a flashback?
There could be other ways to adress those things.
I'm kinda surprised you're questioning a Kaido flashback. That always felt like it would be a given. I don't think he's that simple a character.
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OFC every opponent of Luffy has gotten one, so why would Oda do different with Kaido.
There is no other way to tell Kaido's being without a flashback. This discussion is getting ridiculous tbh
Alvida, Krieg, Smoker, Crocodile, Enel, Lucci, Moria and so forth did not get one, assuming you are referring to chapter long flashbacks, not small snippets.
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Alvida, Krieg, Smoker, Crocodile, Enel, Lucci, Moria and so forth did not get one, assuming you are referring to chapter long flashbacks, not small snippets.
True iirc Katakuri had just small snippets. Cracker even had none of it, but yeah I take part of my comment back.
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Putting aside all the will it or won't it. Y'know who was so much better for not having a flashback? Crocodile. Honestly a chapters long wind on about how he got his scar and how WB humiliated him and how he ended up in Alabasta would've taken away from his shine. We learned enough from the snippets of info given and who he was in present time to not care about where he came from.
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Putting aside all the will it or won't it. Y'know who was so much better for not having a flashback? Crocodile. Honestly a chapters long wind on about how he got his scar and how WB humiliated him and how he ended up in Alabasta would've taken away from his shine. We learned enough from the snippets of info given and who he was in present time to not care about where he came from.
Well, Crocodile was a contrast to Luffy in the sense of not stepping on the bike immediately after you fell off, hence why he could not comprehend luffys stubbornness and determination to face him over and over again.
And if you looked carefully at what transpires and what crocodile reveals of himself by denying luffys will and mocking those that actually try, yeah you get that fully even without any flashback and revealing that WB was essentially the wall he could not overcome, while he was supposed to be the same for luffy.
Later it was a nice addition.
Not everything has to be explained witb flashbacks, characterization has many paths. -
Very interested about the whales comment.
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But i mean the door is of course wide open for a standard cry for the monster story. Maybe he was bullied in the lab where they made him, and he doesn't want to be what he is which lead him to become suicidal. And maybe having all of this spelled out for us will lead to a better story.
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I really liked this chapter.
I didn't like the previous Roger chapter but in this one if you disregard the previous one. There's a certain sense of wonder about the accomplishment they just did perfectly conveyed in those first 2 pages with the newspaper and everyone taking arms. The name thing being a giant conspiracy instead of a typo or convenience seems ridiculous to me but whatever.
I like Oden trying to make them appear more manly and them being crying at the idea of breaking up. But Roger speech is too cheesy for me.
I am wondering if the whole Shanks crying is just their different personality. We already saw him not take kids and be way less violent. I could see it be that Roger found the irony quite funny while Shanks simply ended an emotional wreck.
Roger asking when the mermaid will be born makes more sense now. It was because of the voices annoying him in the sea and he wanted to make sense of it. Also I wonder if Oden can control Zou or only Momo. Is he the other king maybe? I don't think we're clear they have any information on the other king. Just that they want their own king to meet the other in like 25 years. Also I guess Shiraoshi powers unlocked at 15.
Guess the Roger/Whitebeard reunion wasn't on Wano then. Im not sure why he left the crew before meeting with him tho. It's weird to me that Oden would just randomly never see Whitebeard again. He doesn't know that he needs to hurry so I feel he would have gave him a quick visit before returning home. At least show them talking to each other on the phone or something.
Oden learning everything that happened to Wano during his trip made me think
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My son is acting completely off. My dad is dead. Wano is making weapon. Orochi is my brother and destitute noble and . How TF did all that happen.
Sooo What is Denjiro doing exactly? HE is giving money to people because they don't have any or is borrowing money because he doesn't have any? I feel like the 2 part of his described action were in contradiction or cancelled each other's out.
Funny how in this chapter Oden acted more Whitebeard than Whitebeard has been in this flashback. Fuck logic, you mess with my family I cut you down. Maybe Whitebeard was never about that and all this reputation of protection at any cost actually comes from Oden while Whitebeard is super chill actually. Quite enjoy this sequence.
I am not a fan of skipping over how Kaido got involved into this mess. He's a foreigner. I feel that would be a pretty big deal. Also it seems neither Roger or Whitebeard mentioned Kaido to Oden. Since Kaido lives in the regular world I suppose he, on the other hand, knows who Oden is.
So we are still years away from the end. I'm really curious how stuff were still confused for the next 4 years when we seem on the last act.
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Mostly odd because it'd be weird to go out of one long flashback that covers one era and then have another long flashback that covers the same time period but from the villains point of view. Like i said, it could happen, but i'd need some proper motivation to warrant that kind of flashback bloating
I think we had that in Dressrosa. One regular flashback to tell what happened in the past. Then another one with Kyros perspective.
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Very interested about the whales comment.
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Doflamingo had the entire dressrosa under his control and was the focus since punk hazard, so not the same.
You say this like Kaido hasn't been built up since Punk Hazard.
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Kaido is getting a flashback because he’s been the overarching antagonist of nearly the entire post skip narrative. Add to that that there are multiple questions about him with the main one being exactly what the hell is he. He is no human, he is a thing, a monster
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Wow, I feel bad for Izo. He decided to stay with WB only because he knew Oden was coming back after a few years, but then we was left behind entirely without anyone even checking on him to be sure he want to stay there. And even his family is fine with it.
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With how much the Roger Pirates learned in Laugh Tale, it suddenly makes sense that Oden weirdly said on chapter 958 that was going to open Wano borders and "wait for a future in 20 years". Back then it sounded weird because it was like he knew he was going to fail and that the opening would only happen now, but now it is more likely because of what they learned about Joy Boy coming back and everything else.
All the hints about Joy Boy and the two kings are also probably behind why Toki decided to send Momonosuke exactly 20 years to the future. -
The egg is still there as the crew disbands!!! So it's not a part of the treasure/One Piece nor Roger took it with him… what the hell is that thing? Where is it now? What is it now?
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Also, where is Oro Jackson if Roger didn't took it with him?
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I like the detail Rayleigh is not crying and waving with the rest of the crew as Roger parts. Instead you can see he turned his back and is walking away in that panel. Touching.
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Orochi is very well established as a villain, but so far Kaido seems kinda lost in there. He is strong, sure, but no true involvement with the arc besides being the one they need to take down. Hopefully the flashback will last enough to fix that now that it is moving there.
Also, Shinobu when? -
I wonder when the purpose of the cover story will be revealed. So far it is 100% forgettable.
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What the heck is going on?
In which world is Kaido not going to have a flashback?
Lol this. I don’t follow the logic that he can’t have a flashback bc oden just had one?
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@.access:
- Wow, I feel bad for Izo. He decided to stay with WB only because he knew Oden was coming back after a few years, but then we was left behind entirely without anyone even checking on him to be sure he want to stay there. And even his family is fine with it
Also this. Weird how oden is just like oh yeah he’s fine just tell him to stay with WB. And oden doesn’t go back to his old crew at all?
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Felt the need to update the flashback- related timeline because I was starting to get lost:
41 years ago - Flashback starts. Oden (18) is disowned, leaves the Flower Capital, goes to Hakumai followed by Kin'emon and Denjiro to live under Yasuie. Orochi works for Yasuie after being taken under his care.
Unknown - Oden leaves Hakumai towards Kuri to defeat Ashura Doji (meeting Izo, Kikunojo, Kanjuro, and Raizo on his way). After taking Ashura Doji down, he decides to take command of Kuri and pacify it.
39 years ago - Roger (38) becomes the first pirate to reach Lodestar Island, believed to be the end of the Grand Line, but suspects there is another secret island left. In Wano, news of Kuri pacification reach the Shogun Sukiyaki, Oden's father, who decides to reinstate Oden (20) as a member of the Kozuki family and declare him the Daimyo of that region.
38 years ago - Roger (39) and Garp defeat Rocks. Rocks Pirates are disbanded.
33 years ago - Former members of the Rocks Pirates start recruiting for their own crews. Oden (26) is joined by Inuarashi, Nekomamushi and Kawamatsu. Following Yasuie counsel, the retainers decide to become proper samurai. Orochi has left Yasuie's care and is constantly getting monetary help from Oden.
30 years ago - Oden (29) returns to the capital to meet his father again, who has fallen ill. Orochi is now working under Sukiyaki.
Later that year, the Whitebeard Pirates reach Wano. Oden, Izo, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi set sail on Newgate's ship along with Toki.28 years ago - Roger (49) finds out he has an incurable disease and decides to set sail on his final adventure to conquer the Grand Line. Momonosuke is born. The Whitebeard Pirates install their division system and Oden (31) becomes the 2nd Division commander. Sukiyaki dies and Orochi is appointed as the acting Shogun in Oden's absence.
26 years ago - Hiyori is born. Roger (50) and Oden (32) meet during a clash between crews and Oden joins the Roger Pirates along with his family, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.
Some time later, as the Roger Pirates close to Wano, Toki falls ill and leaves the crew along with her children, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.25 years ago (current point in flashback) - Roger (52) conquers the Grand Line by reaching the final island he then baptizes as Laugh Tale. The world starts calling him the Pirate King and his treasure the One Piece. Soon after, Roger disbands his crew and leaves Oro Jackson.
Oden (34) goes back to Wano to open its borders, but finds out Orochi became the new Shogun, is backed by Kaido and currently opposes the Kozuki clan.24 years ago - Roger (53) is executed, giving birth to the Golden Age of Piracy.
20 years ago - Oden (39) is killed. Toki sends Momonosuke 20 years to the future along with some retainers.
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Also this. Weird how oden is just like oh yeah he’s fine just tell him to stay with WB. And oden doesn’t go back to his old crew at all?
Oden knew that Izo wanted to stay on Whitebeard's ship, else he would have already joined him on Roger's voyage. Telling Izo to take care of Whitebeard was just an inofficial order to live the life he wanted, regardless of his scabbard duty.
As for why Oden didn't bother to meet Whitebeard in person? Well, he's still an asshole, that's why. Surprise surprise.
I guess one could say that he simply wanted to head back to Wano as fast as possible due to the bad feeling he had when he visited the last time, but… eh. Another one or two-week delay wouldn't have made a difference.
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@.access:
- Wow, I feel bad for Izo. He decided to stay with WB only because he knew Oden was coming back after a few years, but then we was left behind entirely without anyone even checking on him to be sure he want to stay there. And even his family is fine with it.
It's especially weird when you think about how Izo only left Wano because he was trying to get him back home. The least he deserves is a real conversation.
@.access:
Felt the need to update the flashback- related timeline because I was starting to get lost:
41 years ago - Flashback starts. Oden (18) is disowned, leaves the Flower Capital, goes to Hakumai followed by Kin'emon and Denjiro to live under Yasuie. Orochi works for Yasuie after being taken under his care.
Unknown - Oden leaves Hakumai towards Kuri to defeat Ashura Doji (meeting Izo, Kikunojo, Kanjuro, and Raizo on his way). After taking Ashura Doji down, he decides to take command of Kuri and pacify it.
39 years ago - Roger (38) becomes the first pirate to reach Lodestar Island, believed to be the end of the Grand Line, but suspects there is another secret island left. In Wano, news of Kuri pacification reach the Shogun Sukiyaki, Oden's father, who decides to reinstate Oden (20) as a member of the Kozuki family and declare him the Daimyo of that region.
38 years ago - Roger (39) and Garp defeat Rocks. Rocks Pirates are disbanded.
33 years ago - Former members of the Rocks Pirates start recruiting for their own crews. Oden (26) is joined by Inuarashi, Nekomamushi and Kawamatsu. Following Yasuie counsel, the retainers decide to become proper samurai. Orochi has left Yasuie's care and is constantly getting monetary help from Oden.
30 years ago - Oden (29) returns to the capital to meet his father again, who has fallen ill. Orochi is now working under Sukiyaki.
Later that year, the Whitebeard Pirates reach Wano. Oden, Izo, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi set sail on Newgate's ship along with Toki.28 years ago - Roger (49) finds out he has an incurable disease and decides to set sail on his final adventure to conquer the Grand Line. Momonosuke is born. The Whitebeard Pirates install their division system and Oden (31) becomes the 2nd Division commander. Sukiyaki dies and Orochi is appointed as the acting Shogun in Oden's absence.
26 years ago - Hiyori is born. Roger (50) and Oden (32) meet during a clash between crews and Oden joins the Roger Pirates along with his family, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.
Some time later, as the Roger Pirates close to Wano, Toki falls ill and leaves the crew along with her children, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.25 years ago (current point in flashback) - Roger (52) conquers the Grand Line by reaching the final island he then baptizes as Laugh Tale. The world starts calling him the Pirate King and his treasure the One Piece. Soon after, Roger disbands his crew and leaves Oro Jackson.
Oden (34) goes back to Wano to open its borders, but finds out Orochi became the new Shogun, is backed by Kaido and currently opposes the Kozuki clan.24 years ago - Roger (53) is executed, giving birth to the Golden Age of Piracy.
20 years ago - Oden (39) is killed. Toki sends Momonosuke 20 years to the future along with some retainers.
Those timeline post are really useful to me cause I do not have the patience to make sense of everything.
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@.access:
Felt the need to update the flashback- related timeline because I was starting to get lost:
41 years ago - Flashback starts. Oden (18) is disowned, leaves the Flower Capital, goes to Hakumai followed by Kin'emon and Denjiro to live under Yasuie. Orochi works for Yasuie after being taken under his care.
Unknown - Oden leaves Hakumai towards Kuri to defeat Ashura Doji (meeting Izo, Kikunojo, Kanjuro, and Raizo on his way). After taking Ashura Doji down, he decides to take command of Kuri and pacify it.
39 years ago - Roger (38) becomes the first pirate to reach Lodestar Island, believed to be the end of the Grand Line, but suspects there is another secret island left. In Wano, news of Kuri pacification reach the Shogun Sukiyaki, Oden's father, who decides to reinstate Oden (20) as a member of the Kozuki family and declare him the Daimyo of that region.
38 years ago - Roger (39) and Garp defeat Rocks. Rocks Pirates are disbanded.
33 years ago - Former members of the Rocks Pirates start recruiting for their own crews. Oden (26) is joined by Inuarashi, Nekomamushi and Kawamatsu. Following Yasuie counsel, the retainers decide to become proper samurai. Orochi has left Yasuie's care and is constantly getting monetary help from Oden.
30 years ago - Oden (29) returns to the capital to meet his father again, who has fallen ill. Orochi is now working under Sukiyaki.
Later that year, the Whitebeard Pirates reach Wano. Oden, Izo, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi set sail on Newgate's ship along with Toki.28 years ago - Roger (49) finds out he has an incurable disease and decides to set sail on his final adventure to conquer the Grand Line. Momonosuke is born. The Whitebeard Pirates install their division system and Oden (31) becomes the 2nd Division commander. Sukiyaki dies and Orochi is appointed as the acting Shogun in Oden's absence.
26 years ago - Hiyori is born. Roger (50) and Oden (32) meet during a clash between crews and Oden joins the Roger Pirates along with his family, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.
Some time later, as the Roger Pirates close to Wano, Toki falls ill and leaves the crew along with her children, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.25 years ago (current point in flashback) - Roger (52) conquers the Grand Line by reaching the final island he then baptizes as Laugh Tale. The world starts calling him the Pirate King and his treasure the One Piece. Soon after, Roger disbands his crew and leaves Oro Jackson.
Oden (34) goes back to Wano to open its borders, but finds out Orochi became the new Shogun, is backed by Kaido and currently opposes the Kozuki clan.24 years ago - Roger (53) is executed, giving birth to the Golden Age of Piracy.
20 years ago - Oden (39) is killed. Toki sends Momonosuke 20 years to the future along with some retainers.
Good, I was wrong. I thought Oden was killed 4 years from now, but it is 5. I wonder if it was the prophecy or Oden just being hard on himself that prevented outside help. He could've felt that he turned his back on his people, so he has to correct things on his own. Or this is just purely sticking to some prophecy. Maybe WB, Izou and whoever else make an effort during the 5 years and Oden forbids it.
I doubt we get what Roger did for the year before surrendering himself , outside of the Roger and Rouge stuff.
I love all the Roger and WB stuff, but from this flashback, I need
- Orochi and Kaido's connection explained
- more hints for who the traitor is
- reason for why no interference by Oden's friends
- Denjirou update
- why Neko and Inu were arguing
- Is someone reading Oden's logs
- to see young Jack, if he was there, and if not who was
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I will certainly agree that Oda shifted his focus towards the antagonists more beyond simply being symbolical contrasts to Luffy in comparison to pre-TS with Doflamingo and Big Mom getting a background, but Kaidou has completely played second fiddle to Orochi, with his main motivation being "i am bored", seems empty.
I'd put it this way: Kaido's personality beyond muscle is as essential to this arc as Luffy's personality is. The main tension, in terms of personality, is between Orochi and Oden (family included). Yeah, we know Luffy is the protagonist and the saviour, but in some sense he's is just the promised muscle (too
) who is going to redeem Kosuki's clan and Wano… -
@.access:
The egg is still there as the crew disbands!!! So it's not a part of the treasure/One Piece nor Roger took it with him… what the hell is that thing? Where is it now? What is it now?
Whatever hatches from that egg will be the last straw hat crew member :ninja:
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The "game" discussion made me remember that Law's design is almost certainly based on this asshole:
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It's a fictional discussion whose tenets don't require fleshing out, but I imagine that Roger and Whitebeard would have definitely mentioned Oden and Izo in their final talk. Whitebeard says Izo is his favorite son from Wano, disowns Oden and Inu and Neko lol, clears everything up. But I'd imagine Izo will get his homecoming, the WB pirates have been way too involved in this flashback to stay out of Wano in the present.
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Really loved Kinemon's explanation and apology in regards to what happened to Toki. I really felt bad for him in that moment.
Very interested about the whales comment.
Yes! I'm taking this as a clear hint that Laboon will have a much bigger role in the future. To what extent I couldn't say but Sea Kings and whales are excited for their new king? Hmmm…
The Sea Kings say that they've been waiting for so long and that "this time" it should go well. No doubt it's related to Joy Boy's apology and/or failure. I just like the implication that there is indeed some sort of destined inheritance of will or reincarnation but the outcome of their lives is not set in stone.
Folks who read One Piece… Just better people. ¯\(ツ)/¯
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So far we know that Luffy and Momo can hear Zunesha, but Momo can command. Luffy and Shirahoshi can hear the Sea Kings, but Shirahoshi can command. From this chapter, there are said to be 2 Kings and also that Joy Boy is to return. There are 3 weapons. Luffy has not shown any ability to hear anything from Poneglyphs yet. Roger was able to hear voices. Oden was able to understand the PG's text, but it wasn't said that he could hear the voices like Roger. Shirahoshi is a King and a weapon. We don't know if Joy Boy is a weapon or a King. It can be assumed that the promise from Joy Boy is what "all will go well this time" might mean. Then, Luffy and his crew also made a promise with Laboon and Shirahoshi.
It is interesting that Whales are said to come from Shank's sea. We also have the whale forest on Zou that had the Road PG. The only connection that I can even think of with Minks and Fishman is that Zou has a whale forest and the Energy Steroid that ages someone for strength and the hair can grow really white like Pekoms and Carrot in Sulong. The steroid is said to be the real content of the long kept treasure in the Tamatebako Box. Jinbei was well informed on the Sulong and I just tossed that up as Jinbei being an encyclopedia at the time, but is there more to it? Can the other King be a Mink? Mink's Sulong is said to be an awakening of their inner beast.
Momo was around when the Roger Pirates visited Fishman Island and the Sea Kings were acting up. He showed no signs of hearing them like Roger and Oden tho. Does this rule out Momo or did he just not have the ability yet? When Zunisha was being attacked, we didn't see two Minks. The same 2 Minks that showed us Sulong first. If a Mink is a King, is it one of those 2? One of them is way too old if we go by the Sea King's dialogue.
If Luffy is king, maybe it wasn't acknowledged by the Sea Kings because it was too early in the narrative. So far, they spoke of Luffy similarly to how they did Roger. This is the main reason why i'm skeptical of him being their other King. Is Joy Boy = 1/2 Kings = 1/3 weapons? I feel like we can take interpret this as what is being said, but it still isn't confirmed
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The chapter was pretty sweet, I really liked the final days of the Roger Pirates. :)
Oden finally returned to Wano and read to strike down Orochi…
We know the rest sadly.
But I think its time to go back to the present. -
Man, I was starting to wonder how close we were to getting an unprecedented whole volume of flashbacks for volume 96, but it's not even close. This is only the fourth chapter of the book. All the end of year breaks have thrown my sense of time off so badly. Every year, it never gets any easier!
Shanks question to Roger is something we're definitely coming back to. Is it about what he expected the One Piece to be? Was he hoping the last island would have a cure for Roger's illness? Does his question and the answer he received have anything to do with his current role in the world and he relationship with the Five Elders?
The treasure being dubbed the One Piece while Roger lives is a really interesting point. I kinda liked the idea of the name coming from his last words (as per the 4kids intro I guess) but it seems to have just popped up on its own. Meh. At least the line "and they have no idea" reads like the name is somehow fitting for what they found. Maybe it leaked from the World Government, after some meeting from the upper echelons who might actually know what it is they're covering up.
I'm seeing a lot of people feeling real unhappy about the second Neptunian sovereign and the talk of the return of Joyboy and the implication that either or both could be Luffy, but let's be real, One Piece has always had talk of destiny and inheriting the will of your predecessors. Luffy was accepted as the inheritor of Roger's will long ago; does it make all that much of a difference if he's inheriting from Joyboy as well? Or inheriting Roger inheriting Joyboy? And in terms of being a chosen one, we've got the Will of the D, the King's Haki and the Voice of All Things before you factor in being the son of Dragon the Revolutionary and the grandson of Garp the Hero. Listen, I think chosen one tropes are as boring as everyone else, but Luffy has always been a special little guy. The interconnected lore of big fantasy stories always seems to end up tying the hero back to important figures and concepts. It's something you learn to live with in the genre I guess.
I did see the counterpoint to Luffy being the sovereign/Joyboy that the Neptunians didn't really care about him being at Fishman Island or making contact with Shirahoshi. They were surprised he could hear them at all, so that doesn't scan him being the one they're expecting. What I think would be neat would be a royal sovereign for each of the ancient weapons. Perhaps in form of the three princesses Luffy's saved over the years. The royal family of Alabasta was entrusted with the location of Pluton, which is interesting, but there's little to connect Dressrosa to anything else. And also, if the Neptunians knew about two sovereigns it would make sense for them to know about the third as well, but they don't mention them. Another mystery for the ages.
And then we're back to Wano and as much as I've been keen to see how things got the way they are in the present, it can't help feeling slightly flat after all the Roger stuff. Especially factoring in the knowledge that the pivotal moment of the story is still five years away. What could possibly come from Oden's raid on the palace that would be both a satisfying outcome and still allow the next five years to happen. I think we've got at least another chapter to get through one way or the other before we're close to Kaido arriving. That said, the run to the palace was a pretty great sequence, and the storytelling through the damaged environment as Oden makes his way in were pretty great.
I'm looking forward to the next chapter, but not expecting anything super huge from it. Just a transition between where we are now and the climax of the flashback. Gotta adjust my level of anticipation from Roger's journey back to the Wano plot. Hopefully no breaks until until we reach the final stage of the story.
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What could possibly come from Oden's raid on the palace that would be both a satisfying outcome and still allow the next five years to happen.
The way I see it, Kaido may show up next chapter yet be driven back (maybe taking a wound from Enma in the process). Kaido isn't invincible after all, in fact we were told he has been captured plenty of times in the course of his life. He doesn't die, but he can be defeated in battle.
So Oden drives him back, probably after he cut down the mysterious hag who was acting as Orochi's body double. Her Devil Fruit becomes available again and Bon Clay will find it a few years down the road, but that's another story.
Life goes on. Oden assumes the position of Shogun while Orochi and Kaido plot in the shadows. He works hard to open the borders (and mentalities) of Wano, except that this gradually turns against him the more conservative among the scabbards (or someone else in his entourage). When Orochi and Kaido make their comeback a few years later, this person will assume the role of the traitor and, unbeknownst to the other Scabbards, let Oden's family (whom had been protected earlier) be captured. He surrenders to save his loved ones and the rest is history. -
So flashback is over soon and I really liked it.
But this also means… Sanji will return soon <333
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The way I see it, Kaido may show up next chapter yet be driven back (maybe taking a wound from Enma in the process). Kaido isn't invincible after all, in fact we were told he has been captured plenty of times in the course of his life. He doesn't die, but he can be defeated in battle.
So Oden drives him back, probably after he cut down the mysterious hag who was acting as Orochi's body double. Her Devil Fruit becomes available again and Bon Clay will find it a few years down the road, but that's another story.
Life goes on. Oden assumes the position of Shogun while Orochi and Kaido plot in the shadows. He works hard to open the borders (and mentalities) of Wano, except that this gradually turns against him the more conservative among the scabbards (or someone else in his entourage). When Orochi and Kaido make their comeback a few years later, this person will assume the role of the traitor and, unbeknownst to the other Scabbards, let Oden's family (whom had been protected earlier) be captured. He surrenders to save his loved ones and the rest is history.That's a pretty reasonable prediction. If I was editing the story I'd worry about repetition with Kaido arriving, being driven back, then arriving again in what would essentially be consecutive chapters. Hag shenanigans are definitely something I'm looking forward to though. I wonder if there's a way her switcheroos with the real Orochi could be used to keep Kaido from arriving at all until the timeline syncs up.
You also have to wonder if and how Moria might play into this whole thing. At first I thought his arrival might be used as a distraction that helps keep Oden in place for another five years, but apparently his clash with Kaido isn't until after Roger's execution, so who even knows if we're getting an acknowledgement of that this time around.
I trust Oda to have it worked out, we just probably don't have all the pieces to see his plan yet.
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Didnt a bunch of whales welcome Luffy on his arrival to the NW??
U did it again Oda
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I see a lot of people including Oden as Shogun in their predictions, some people asking when he is becoming Shogun… am I forgetting something? Because I don't remember he ever being addressed as the former Shogun, just as a Daimyo.
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Well, in chapter 654 whales literally carried Sunny.
It now seemed to be a sort of recognition.!
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@.access:
I see a lot of people including Oden as Shogun in their predictions, some people asking when he is becoming Shogun… am I forgetting something? Because I don't remember he ever being addressed as the former Shogun, just as a Daimyo.
He is the actual Shogun now, Orochi is just supposed to be a vassal and placeholder for Oden, so yeah technically he already is.
Practically he probably never will. -
So whatever the One Piece is Roger had to leave it behind because there was some condition he hadn't met?
Maybe Whitebeard and Shanks knew they to get their own shot at the treasure they had to have someone with them that met it and both could've known that Roger's son was the best candidate, even if neither knew exactly who that was.
This increases my suspicion that Shanks wasn't in Foosha Village by coincidence way back then, he was actively searching for Ace. Maybe when he met Luffy he sensed the same qualities and decided saving him was worth an arm because at the very least it meant he had a back-up option out there. -
@.access:
I see a lot of people including Oden as Shogun in their predictions, some people asking when he is becoming Shogun… am I forgetting something? Because I don't remember he ever being addressed as the former Shogun, just as a Daimyo.
I'm under the (possibly mislead) impression that Kinemon & co always presented him as the Shogun ; since he has another 4 years to live (and 4 years before Toki sends Momo & co to the future) I'm assuming he will get to occupy his rightful position at least for a while.
Then again, "the rightful shogun" is the one and only way his retainers will always see him even if he never actually sets foot on the throne. Maybe he is betrayed, beaten and captured right now, then civil war breaks out between Orochi and the Daimyos and 4 years is how long it will take Kaido to try and break him, then failing that, boil him. -
So whatever the One Piece is Roger had to leave it behind because there was some condition he hadn't met?
Maybe Whitebeard and Shanks knew they to get their own shot at the treasure they had to have someone with them that met it and both could've known that Roger's son was the best candidate, even if neither knew exactly who that was.
This increases my suspicion that Shanks wasn't in Foosha Village by coincidence way back then, he was actively searching for Ace. Maybe when he met Luffy he sensed the same qualities and decided saving him was worth an arm because at the very least it meant he had a back-up option out there.My bet is that Roger & Co probably found a certain profecy (since this is a thing now) that says something along the lines "When one true successor of D will unite all of the free kingdoms to go up against the usurpers (WG)" and is the reason why people who know this decided to back-up Luffy since he is able to bring people together all the time.
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Really loved Kinemon's explanation and apology in regards to what happened to Toki. I really felt bad for him in that moment.
If nothing else, this flashback and the last few chapters before it started have made me really like Kinemon as a character!
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Oden was able to understand the PG's text, but it wasn't said that he could hear the voices like Roger.
They both heard the voices in the water. When Roger mention it, Oden say he hears it too and they both had the same feeling of being watched on Zou.
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They both heard the voices in the water. When Roger mention it, Oden say he hears it too and they both had the same feeling of being watched on Zou.
The voices from Zunesha and the Sea Kings is not what i'm referring to. When Roger was near the PG, he said he heard voices and that made it easy to find. Oden was not shown to do that. I still question how VOAT works.
Is it like Haki where there's CoC, CoO, and CoA? Basically multiple capabilities. Can some hear for certain creature and objects, while others can command. Maybe whatever Roger and Luffy can command hasn't been shown yet. Roger and and Oden have CoC, but Shirahoshi and Momo haven't been addressed on that front.
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Shanks crying is very intriguing, wonder what he asked Roger.
I really hope the second sovereign is not Luffy, that would be so cheesy. I would actually prefer if it was an antagonist/villan.
I think it safe to assume next chapter is the final flashback chapter.
maybe Roger told him Bagy was right about the North and South Pole
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The voices from Zunesha and the Sea Kings is not what i'm referring to. When Roger was near the PG, he said he heard voices and that made it easy to find. Oden was not shown to do that. I still question how VOAT works.
Roger doesn't listen to the stones either while Oden is there. I think the sea king scene was an indication that they could both do it. They just didn't need to do it anymore because of Oden reading the stones instead of super vague voices.
Is it like Haki where there's CoC, CoO, and CoA? Basically multiple capabilities. Can some hear for certain creature and objects, while others can command. Maybe whatever Roger and Luffy can command hasn't been shown yet. Roger and and Oden have CoC, but Shirahoshi and Momo haven't been addressed on that front.
Did we Oden use conqueror?
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Roger doesn't listen to the stones either while Oden is there. I think the sea king scene was an indication that they could both do it. They just didn't need to do it anymore because of Oden reading the stones instead of super vague voices.
Did we Oden use conqueror?
Roger said specifically in 966 that hearing the voices from the stones in Skypiea made them easy to find.
When Luffy subconsciously used CoC, Asura said that Oden could do the same. Also, when WB and Oden clashed, it was clearly shown that they were both Conquerors.
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So the two sovereigns are Shirahoshi and Vivi. Poseidon and Pluton.
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The few stuff we know about Pluton is all too strange.
Our first source is Crocodile, who cannot read Poneglyphs and got to know somehow about a gigantic ship that blows entire islands.
Tom San, talks about the blueprints of a thing that could counter the power of an ancient weapon.
Said blueprints literally read "Pluton" on them but Franky doesnt want to talk either.
Robin who knows whats up, haven't said a thing about it.I said there's a chance Crocodile got it wrong and Pluton is not a ship, but still uggh. I need more answers than ever before.
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The few stuff we know about Pluton is all too strange.
Our first source is Crocodile, who cannot read Poneglyphs and got to know somehow about a gigantic ship that blows entire islands.
Tom San, talks about the blueprints of a thing that could counter the power of an ancient weapon.
Said blueprints literally read "Pluton" on them but Franky doesnt want to talk either.
Robin who knows whats up, haven't said a thing about it.I said there's a chance Crocodile got it wrong and Pluton is not a ship, but still uggh. I need more answers than ever before.
It was not just Crocodile, Iceburg and Tom also said that it was a warship and I think it is very unlikely that carpenters so talented and who looked at the plants several times cannot realize that it is a ship.
