Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 7 - Wano)

[Monquito]

@Robby:

I'm conflicted on that. Luffy's original promise and the number of BB's crew makes me think we're still gonna get 10, plus Oda's original height chart sketches have conveniently missing gaps where someone was erased (Jinbe obviously, but room for one more still) but Oda's intent to speed up to get the end makes that a little tougher to judge. Oda's having trouble juggling the characters he has and Kaidou was always kind of the last obvious stop for a newbie. and if there's really only 5 years left that not so much time and really if we need that extra we can always just put Vivi forward and say she trained during the tiemskip..

But if its actually 8-10 then there's still plenty of room. Pick up a unconventional viking from Elbaf, pick someone up from random island we don't know about yet (there's gotta be at least one more surprise locale) , Davy Back someone out of Shank's crew, someone they find at Raftel, something. There's still time and space to get one ore but it needs to be soonish because it IS getting to the endgame now and getting the last member during the world war doesn't work..

I can easily see a situation where when Franky joined, we had (at the time) gone a full half the series without a new member, and then just a week later Brook showed up.

Darth Vader Breathing

Aah I see you're falling to the dark side… Of Sunny coming alive.

The current situation of the Sunny does gives me hope for the Klabautermann's come back, tho with Law and possibly Jinbe around, it has other options.
Anything but Wadatsumi pulling it down would be fine still.

[Yxenz]

@Cockycent:

Would love to see 5 moments where Paulie is away from the Galley La group and having any moments with the crew

This happens every time I win the Carrot arguments
[qimg]https://media.giphy.com/media/6BZaFXBVPBtok/giphy.gif[/qimg]

Would you like to read Water 7 plz? There are plenty of scenes that highlight him. Not only with Luffy.

[Somali]

I thi,no the mostly likely option would be carrot

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

Would you like to read Water 7 plz? There are plenty of scenes that highlight him. Not only with Luffy.

When was Paulie away from his group and having 5 moments with the SH crew? It's very easy for me to say i'm wrong, just provide the ch. numbers

[Yxenz]

@Cockycent:

When was Paulie away from his group and having 5 moments with the SH crew? It's very easy for me to say i'm wrong, just provide the ch. numbers

Away from his crew: Chapter 334 when we see him in his house. Also going to the headquarters with a mad expression.

Chapter 342: He's chosen to keep take care of the thing Iceburg was supposedly hiding.

Chapter 343: He's the first one after Iceburg to see the ones who shot Iceburg and questions them.

Chapter 344: He's fought the murderers and lost, but Lucci says he must die.

With the SHs:
Chapter 345: Luffy joins da fight.

Chapter 346: Luffy and him join the room where the CP9 to fight them.

Chapter 347: He fights Lucci on his own but gets beaten and saved by Luffy.

Chapter 348: He's still theeeeeereer!!

Chapter 349: You won't believe this: he hasn't disappear from the room out of nothing yet.

After a couple of chapters, we get more scenes in which he's with his group, but:

-He's made the decision not to tell anyone about Lucci being the traitor.
-He leads the group in order to help the strawhats.

Also note that during the night in Galley-La's headquarters, he's taken as the one who's supposed to follow the path of Iceburg, known as the most important carpenter in the whole city by the moment, which fits well with what the strawhats are looking for in Water 7.

Another also: He's got a unique fighting style.

Another another also: He holds a grudge against the main enemies of the saga, and takes serious cause…

Another another another also: He's got strong ties with his leader Iceburg, who was saved by Chopper, one of the SHs.

He's also seen ALONE when he sneaks in the Rocket Man, even when later we see Lulu and Tilestone came, too.

He's got a protagonist role in Water 7, and he's seen in more situations than Franky. Also Franky is thought as an enemy in that moment and the only time he saw Luffy, was during the fight against him. Therefore, Paulie could be seen to have chances to join. But then the Rocket Man trip and Enies Lobby come and he's as a decor in the background, just as Carrot in Wano.

You can do the same thing with Camie. But do it yourself this time, I'm feeling too lazy and surely you also can use Google pretty well, too

[uniaka ikuzakas]

Maybe luffy will take out one of the bb pirates early on, like in weevil arc, or maybe sabo helps luffy and takes on one of them. Right now I'm not expecting nakamas anymore, luffy got 5600 men before him/her.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

Away from his crew: Chapter 334 when we see him in his house. Also going to the headquarters with a mad expression.

In no part of this chapter is Paulie with the SH crew and away from the foreman. I see that you put the indication of being away from his crew, but you are wrong here.

Chapter 342: He's chosen to keep take care of the thing Iceburg was supposedly hiding.

You did it again, he is not with the SH crew and is barely even away from the formen. You are 0/2 now

Chapter 343: He's the first one after Iceburg to see the ones who shot Iceburg and questions them.

0/3 Did you think I wouldn't double check this. He is in the same vicinity of the foreman and the SH crew are actually further away than the foreman. Did you actually read and look at what you're actually trying to find here?

Chapter 344: He's fought the murderers and lost, but Lucci says he must die.

Most of these chapters are Paulie being in the same building as the foreman (THE VERY NEXT ROOMS AND HALLWAY LOL), while most of the SH crew are trying to get in. You told me to reread and this is so ironic 0/4. This whole part of your argument was a waste to enter the conversation.

With the SHs:

Chapter 345: Luffy joins da fight.

Again, Paulie, like the other foreman in the same building, are defeated and there is no moment in this chapter away from him and Luffy on the floor. 0/1

Chapter 346: Luffy and him join the room where the CP9 to fight them.

Chapter 347: He fights Lucci on his own but gets beaten and saved by Luffy.

Chapter 348: He's still theeeeeereer!!

Chapter 349: You won't believe this: he hasn't disappear from the room out of nothing yet.

The foreman are in the very same vicinity as Paulie for all of these chapters. It's like you're reaching and forget the minor detail that they are less than 10 ft away on purpose. For 20+ chapters after Pedro's death, Carrot has no other Mink in her presence and even debuts Sulong for us. Do you see how much of a joke this is? I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt because my memory is bad. You thought I wouldn't double check?

This is what you bring to argue? Paulie actually has a better argument than Camie and the rest of the trolling meme characters for the nakama discussion. Please someone help this person.

After a couple of chapters, we get more scenes in which he's with his group, but:

-He leads the group in order to help the strawhats.

This is all I had to read. I can't see Paulie w/o his group because they are within the same vicinity for almost all of his appearances. He is constantly with his guys and used to highlight the betrayal and actions of CP9 against Tom and W7 via his emotion more than the others and that was dope. I really wish I didn't have to double check this and could've told you that you did good work and i'm wrong. Too bad you took advantage and possibly thought I wouldn't check

Update: For anyone who wants to try what Yzenx did, please do. It's fun going back to these chapters.

[Yxenz]

You kiddin right? In all those scenes he's seen alone and he's development is beyond the rest of the foremen's. Plus Carrot is always with Pedro xd. And when he died, she almost didn't appear even when she was on the ship besides to introduce the Sulong concept.

Using your arguments, Carrot's there only to go highlight Pedro's death via her emotion, and to introduce the Sulong.

Also, Paulie was a foreman. SHs were looking for one. Nobody's looking for a… watcher? Both have pros and cons, but in the end, they're more or less the same.

Ah, btw, of course the other foremen were near the scene on Water 7. It all happened in the same place, what did you expect? Kureha was in the same castle as Chopper all along Sanji was in the same restaurant as his fellas. Being close doesn't change the fact that the scene ain't the same. You're a joke, man.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

You kiddin right? In all those scenes he's seen alone and he's development is beyond the rest of the foremen's. Plus Carrot is always with Pedro xd. And when he died, she almost didn't appear even when she was on the ship besides to introduce the Sulong concept.

Using your arguments, Carrot's there only to go highlight Pedro's death via her emotion, and to introduce the Sulong.

Also, Paulie was a foreman. SHs were looking for one. Nobody's looking for a… watcher? Both have pros and cons, but in the end, they're more or less the same.

You keep dismissing that they were less than 10 ft away. In the very next room actually lol. Luffy is told that and it's hilarious how they are right there as soon as he breaks the wall. I understand that it kills your case, but cmon

[Yxenz]

I'm just copypasting this for you to read

"Ah, btw, of course the other foremen were near the scene on Water 7. It all happened in the same place, what did you expect? Kureha was in the same castle as Chopper all along Sanji was in the same restaurant as his fellas. Being close doesn't change the fact that the scene ain't the same. You're a joke, man."

I didn't know there was a rule that said you needda be more than 10 ft away from other people you know to join the crew! I think I missed that. Would you please, very please, tell me the chapter when this is stated? Dankeeeee!!!!

[Cockycent]

I didn't make a rule. You answered with a full understanding of what I asked. I asked if there were moments where Paulie was away from his group and was with the SH crew. Carrot was with them for 20+ chapters with no other Mink near or in sight.

For you to show Paulie, who couldn't go 1 chapter without the Galley La being right there (literally the next room) was hilarious. The effort is respectable. I'm currently trying to get some others to top what you did because this kind of discussion is cool. I can feel someone making a Hachi or Camie collage soon with chapter numbers listed

Edit: I wonder if people are really understanding how retarded Carrot is. She ditched her home and people, that were just attacked and almost destroyed twice, just so she can venture outside. She used the "pay the SH back" stuff as an excuse. She's the worst lol. She cried for a guy that technically committed suicide twice. She lacks awareness at times and all of it sounds too much like a SH character. It's almost forced. For people to bring up Camie or Paulie, instead of good arguments like

• no clear dream vocalized or hinted at all
• the most recent pattern for nakama is experience and she lacks it dramatically

When you're using emotion over reason and critical thinking, you miss these great arguments

[Yxenz]

Oh, my. Didn't know you were so square that you couldn't imagine that narrative facts don't give a damn about proximity. My whole point wasn't about proximity but about the role in the arc. But go ahead, you're free to think different than I.

I CAN ALSO EDIT: If I used emotion over logic, then I'd be saying Carrot is joining since I love her design, personality, fighting style, gags, and her synergy with the band. She would be one of my favourite SHs if she joined. But since she is taking less focus than a tree in Wano, and since I don't see any argument to make her remain with the band after this, I happen to believe that she's not joining.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

Oh, my. Didn't know you were so square that you couldn't imagine that narrative facts don't give a damn about proximity. My whole point wasn't about proximity but about the role in the arc. But go ahead, you're free to think different than I.

You replied to it and your message made the distinction between with and without his Galley La foreman. You can't use the "I didn't know" excuse here after going back to the chapters lol. His role in the arc was to emphasize how horrible CP9 was. The voice of the foreman. While Franky was the leader of his own group and away from his group multiple times on his own narrative, before and after Ennies Lobby and the betrayal reveal. The clues are there.

Take note how I have never called you "a square" or referred to you as anything other than your name for this whole discussion. I've complemented you effort multiple times, but like others in the past, you've chosen to lose composure over a OP discussion.

If I reciprocate your energy, a MOD would magically interject and act as tho you didn't initiate it. There is a pattern here.

[Monquito]

Thats still totally irrelevant and proves nothing tbh.

Is like saying Chimney was away from Water Seven for God knows how many chapters and no other children was.

It only leads you to a massive; 'meh okay I guess' still not joining.

[Cockycent]

@Monquito:

Thats still totally irrelevant and proves nothing tbh.

Is like saying Chimney was away from Water Seven for God knows how many chapters and no other children was.

It only leads you to a massive; 'meh okay I guess' still not joining.

Being away from the group that you were introduced with means nothing? "Other children" is a false equivalency. It would be Kokoro and Gonbe, you mean. Oda separating a character from whatever they formally were associated with is typical

Waiting on the Camie, Chimney, Hachi and etc collages btw

[Yxenz]

@Cockycent:

Take note how I have never called you "a square" or referred to you as anything other than your name for this whole discussion. I've complemented you effort multiple times, but like others in the past, you've chosen to lose composure over a OP discussion.

If I reciprocate your energy, a MOD would magically interject and act as tho you didn't initiate it. There is a pattern here.

Dude, take it easy, calling you a square is no insult. I used that term to illustrate that you were picking an abstract concept such as "narrative" or "dramatic role" and coming with a much simpler and concrete concept such as physical proximity.

Carrot was with Pedro all along. Pedro died to show how tough the yonkou are and Carrot is just the mink in an arc in which including more minks with be only ridiculous.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

Dude, take it easy, calling you a square is no insult. I used that term to illustrate that you were picking an abstract concept such as "narrative" or "dramatic role" and coming with a much simpler and concrete concept such as physical proximity.

Carrot was with Pedro all along. Pedro died to show how tough the yonkou are and Carrot is just the mink in an arc in which including more minks with be only ridiculous.

I never said it was an insult. I definitely was pointing out how they treat me saying something similar as an insult.

There's clear difference between no mink other than Carrot being on the ship for 20+ chapters and Paulie not being able to breathe without a foreman in the very next room

[Monquito]

@Cockycent:

Being away from the group that you were introduced with means nothing? "Other children" is a false equivalency. It would be Kokoro and Gonbe, you mean. Oda separating a character from whatever they formally were associated with is typical

Waiting on the Camie, Chimney, Hachi and etc collages btw

It means they're tag alongs. Thats it.

[Yxenz]

I get your point. It's not as important from a screenwriting point of view as the other things I pointed out, but I get it. Just don't feel bad, I didn't call you square even to substitute an insult or anything, but if I got you offended, I'm really sorry.

[Cockycent]

@Monquito:

It means they're tag alongs. Thats it.

Why not separate Chimney or Camie from her tag along, when you did it for some other SH. Differentiating a character from their tag along by separation means nothing? Jinbe was formerly introduced without his Sun Pirates, Nami was constantly hopping from pirate to pirate, Zoro was even different from bounty hunters and was technically not a bounty hunter, Brook's crew was killed off, Franky was pulled away from his gang, the Usopp Pirates, etc.

[Yxenz]

Sanji was tagged along with Zeff, Paty, Carne, and the rest. Chopper was tagged along with Kureha. Jinbe was tagged along with the rest of the former prisoners during Marineford. Really, being near other characters doesn't mean a thing about your chances to join. And we've seen other characters alone who didn't join. We've seen characters like Mr. 2 who were highlighted and didn't join. We've seen the past of Wiper's ancestor and he didn't join. We've seen Tonjit alone and he didn't join. Gaimon was great meat for a SH and he didn't join. It's hard to say who will join, but I believe they must make a dramatic function within the band. And I don't mean their role within the Sunny, I mean what will they add to the plot?

[Monquito]

@Cockycent:

Why not separate Chimney or Camie from her tag along, when you did it for some other SH. Differentiating a character from their tag along by separation means nothing? Jinbe was formerly introduced without his Sun Pirates, Nami was constantly hopping from pirate to pirate, Zoro was even different from bounty hunters and was technically not a bounty hunter, Brook's crew was killed off, Franky was pulled away from his gang, the Usopp Pirates, etc.

So you're saying spending time with a group is valid proof that she's staying with that group?
Cause just so you know, she's been with the Minks since forever currently. 20 chaps dont seem as much anymore.

Also claiming appearing in X amount of chapters should be considered as well?
Cause she's been also gone as much as equally if not more than she was at WCI.

See? 100% irrelevant points, bring something new to the table that isnt already in the crew and we're talking bussines.

[Yxenz]

This Monquito guy know what I mean.

I will say it again, speaking by emotion, I'd say Carrot will join cause I really love her. Thinking about it, that statement makes no sense. At least by what we've got by now.

[Gold]

Gonna preface by saying I don't like Carrot at all. Feels too forced, however…

Carrot is by far the most logical choice right now. Subverting and red herring her like Paulie, or being a temporary member like Vivi would just feel lazy and repeated.
Anyone extremely against it is really grasping at straws and having to ignore a lot of her spotlight time probably from bias of disliking her.

Lots of people say she has to fill a role.
She doesn't need a specific role as an inexperienced Cabin boy(girl) was always a role I felt the crew would eventually have.
Chopper doesn't exactly fill this slot as he is Doctor, Older (17) and somewhat experienced now.

Carrot so far has the highest probability aside from Jinbei, but there's room for both. The story can always go in any direction of course that's the fun.

Not gonna list obvious examples as I'm sure this dead horse has been beaten. (Pedro relationship, Sulong intro,

Rather list my main points against her. 1.) No proper fleshed backstory, 2.) no main dream or goal, 3.) lack of use in Wano currently
All 3 don't feel like enough to deter her chances so far.
Backstory flashback can happen at any pivotal moment for her (Senor Pink), Main dream or goal was Pedro telling her Straw hats would bring Dawn of the World(seems quite important to her and pedro), The less she is used in Wano the more suspicious I am of her.

I don't really care either way if she's a Straw hat or not. I just want to enjoy the ride. Hope something interesting develops with her.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

Sanji was tagged along with Zeff, Paty, Carne, and the rest. Chopper was tagged along with Kureha. Jinbe was tagged along with the rest of the former prisoners during Marineford. Really, being near other characters doesn't mean a thing about your chances to join. And we've seen other characters alone who didn't join. We've seen characters like Mr. 2 who were highlighted and didn't join. We've seen the past of Wiper's ancestor and he didn't join. We've seen Tonjit alone and he didn't join. Gaimon was great meat for a SH and he didn't join. It's hard to say who will join, but I believe they must make a dramatic function within the band. And I don't mean their role within the Sunny, I mean what will they add to the plot?

I didn't say all SH members are part of what is being applied with being separated (proximity wise). Being differentiated is the matter at hand. Being separated was 1 of the ways to differentiate and I outlined how some (not all) of the crew were separated.

You want to go into how Sanji was differentiated from the other cooks at Baratie like Zeff, Patty and Carne? I remember Zeff actually being asked. Yet, Oda differentiated Sanji from them.

@Monquito:

So you're saying spending time with a group is valid proof that she's staying with that group?
Cause just so you know, she's been with the Minks since forever currently. 20 chaps dont seem as much anymore.

I said that being with the SH crew and away from your former associations is partial evidence, not the whole. It's sequencing. You're introduced with a group, now will Oda do anything to differentiate you. Separation for some time, not being the usual in the narrative (with Sanji among the cooks or even Chopper with Kureha). I remember Kureha and Zeff being brought up for nakama, in story. Oda went with the less experienced characters who were having more moments in the crew. Are you saying that isn't an indicator at all when trying to see who can be possible for the future? A character who is different from their group, spends time away from that initial group as they are with the crew, and actually perform a role as they show off a role on the actual ship? For every lookout appearance for Pedro, Carrot was right there on the ship. Can you tell me who was on the ship, from the Minks, to lookout while Carrot was there?

Also claiming appearing in X amount of chapters should be considered as well?
Cause she's been also gone as much as equally if not more than she was at WCI.

See? 100% irrelevant points, bring something new to the table that isnt already in the crew and we're talking bussines.

Lets get to the point tho. Why is Hachi, Camie or Paulie compared to Carrot? I know why and have showed how Oda differentiated her from her group, while Hachi, Camie and Paulie could barely go a couple chapters without their associates being right there.

[Monquito]

Thing is, according to 20 years of serliaziation. Things are already planned.

There's no most popular or most logical ground here, if she's not intended to join, she will not. Doesn't really matter if you want to stay in the 'But why would Oda bubble'.
We've seen it with Perona, Shirahoshi, Hancock, Rebecca. People got overly obsessed with whatever their participation in their arcs was and stretch it into 'Strawhat material' with no solid ground for any of them, and as of now, there's no solid ground for Carrot either.

[Cockycent]

I've said the most popular thing is irrelevant for years, yet people still bring up

• what the "fandom said in 2007"
• popularity polls
• "no cares about Tama, Jinbei, Momo, etc"
• "I really like ___"

as if these things are going to make Oda change what he has planned

[Yxenz]

I'd like to add something. Now that you give me the "proximity isn't important" one. I want to ask you something. Would you really REALLY state that Paulie wasn't more developed than Lulu and Tilestone and the other at Galley La? Cause, you know, Sanji was developed more than Paty and Carne while standing on the very same plank on the Baratie than them. Same applies for Paulie.

Wiper also had this very same development and didn't join. Aisa was separated from the berserkers of Sky Island and didn't join. All of this characters have some development that Carrot didn't have, and Carrot has some development that these characters didn't have. That's because all characters are different and unique.

As Monquito states, if it's not planned that Carrot will join, it doesn't mean that she's gonna join only because she's logically the one with more chances. In Skypiea the one with more chances was Wiper and nobody joined.

[Monquito]

@Cockycent:

I said that being with the SH crew and away from your former associations is partial evidence, not the whole.

And as of now, 100% evidence that is just a tag along.

It's sequencing. You're introduced with a group, now will Oda do anything to differentiate you. Separation for some time

is that all the different stuff from Carrot?, Aiza had it, I don't quite see her in the Crew.

Are you saying that isn't an indicator at all when trying to see who can be possible for the future?

Again, according to Aiza, not at all. having in mind the current members with their whole different joining stories, there's no guarantee that said statement should be an indicator.

A character who is different from their group,

eeh uuh what, literally every Mink is a humanoid furry trained with the same martial arts, can use the same Electro and are all capable of doing Sulong.
Or, mind to elaborate is said differences?

spends time away from that initial group as they are with the crew, and actually perform a role as they show off a role on the actual ship?
For every lookout appearance for Pedro, Carrot was right there on the ship. Can you tell me who was on the ship, from the Minks, to lookout while Carrot was there?

He com' on, this is pretty much beaten meat, as she failed at said role, like multiple times.

Lets get to the point tho. Why is Hachi, Camie or Paulie compared to Carrot? I know why and have showed how Oda differentiated her from her group, while Hachi, Camie and Paulie could barely go a couple chapters without their associates being right there.

if the point is, she's a capable fighters, uuh well yes, like even children in Zou, not that different at all from everyone else tho.

Edit; I'm quite interested in those differences you do claim Carrot has, all I've seen is the claim of said differences existing but you pointed like zero.

[Gold]

@Monquito:

Thing is, according to 20 years of serliaziation. Things are already planned.

There's no most popular or most logical ground here, if she's not intended to join, she will not. Doesn't really matter if you want to stay in the 'But why would Oda bubble'.
We've seen it with Perona, Shirahoshi, Hancock, Rebecca. People got overly obsessed with whatever their participation in their arcs was and stretch it into 'Strawhat material' with no solid ground for any of them, and as of now, there's no solid ground for Carrot either.

Regardless of if she joins or not, I don't really care.

Just as of right now it seems that the story is pushing her as a Strawhat member or an honorary one like Vivi by including her for so long. That is the logic for me. It could easily be subverted of course.

There's no solid ground for Carrot joining, but there is no solid ground for her not joining. I just see lots more flags leading to her being more than a relegated side character than not. Especially how well she fits visually into the diversity of the Strawhats lineup.

Also about the 20 years of serialization, of course there are many plot points set in stone to make the long term storytelling hit harder and smarter. We must be reading different stories though if you haven't recognized how much unplanned improvisation goes into it as well to reach those plot points.

Examples like stating the One Piece and ending will be changed if it's guessed too early and Zoro originally going to be in Buggy's crew.

Either way I don't like Carrot, but being unbiased I still feel that she adds more to the Strawhats than she detracts and if it's in the cards for her to be a member it will probably work well.
If she's not, I'd rather that as I would rather see other Strawhats get more spotlight and fleshing out, but so far she feels more integrated than the princess side characters who have too much responsibility to join the crew.

Also lol at Perona as Strawhat. Waifu warriors do like to reach.

[Yxenz]

As of now, I think a character who has nowhere to go nor tu return, just as Caribou, has more chances that Carrot right now. I don't mean Caribou is gonna join cause he's got a bad heart. But someone like that, someone who you think "the only thing this dude can do is to go with the SHs". Pretty much as what happened to Brook or to Robin. But this character should also probably have a key to the main plot of the series.

[Monquito]

@Gold:

There's no solid ground for Carrot joining, but there is no solid ground for her not joining. I just see lots more flags leading to her being more than a relegated side character than not. Especially how well she fits visually into the diversity of the Strawhats lineup.

Except there is, its called Chopper.

[Yxenz]

Not being important since they entered Wano is a solid ground to say she's not joining.

[Gold]

@Monquito:

Except there is, its called Chopper.

Oh yes I forgot Chopper the sulong using, female, minkman, electro user, bunny inspired, non devil fruit user. They are practically the same character…

Seriously though do explain further, I'm interested in your logic.

@Yxenz:

Not being important since they entered Wano is a solid ground to say she's not joining.

This is very suspect, Her disappearance is a red flag for sure. It feels intentional, but if it's not that's some real character mishandling.
It feels too early still to judge this, it's like being upset like the villagers that Oden started dancing like a fool when there is obviously context that's been omitted.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

I'd like to add something. Now that you give me the "proximity isn't important" one. I want to ask you something. Would you really REALLY state that Paulie wasn't more developed than Lulu and Tilestone and the other at Galley La? Cause, you know, Sanji was developed more than Paty and Carne while standing on the very same plank on the Baratie than them. Same applies for Paulie.

I never said it wasn't important. I said that proximity isn't the whole matter. Differentiation is strong for the nakma case and how far away Oda pulls a character away from their associates is under differentiation. Do you see how proximity isn't the end all be all? It's part of a bigger picture, hence why I said it isn't everything. Saying that isn't everything doesn't equate to "it isn't important".

I agree, Paulie was definitely differentiated in a similar fashion to Sanji. Now we have to look at the other ways to differentiate and why was Paulie chosen. I highlighted it multiple times that his purpose was to emphasize the betrayal of those infiltrating the Galley La. What was the purpose of differentiating Sanji? Why do we get Pedro and Carrot, then pedro dies with a flashback where Carrot is highlighted?

Wiper also had this very same development and didn't join. Aisa was separated from the berserkers of Sky Island and didn't join. All of this characters have some development that Carrot didn't have, and Carrot has some development that these characters didn't have. That's because all characters are different and unique.

Wyper and Asia are bad arguments. You're checking off 1 of the many criteria I used. Differentiation is 1 of a few. To say this character checked off 1 of your criteria and didn't join, while Carrot checked off multiple boxes is an error. Maybe because we've been on proximity (which falls under differentiation) you forgot.

As Monquito states, if it's not planned that Carrot will join, it doesn't mean that she's gonna join only because she's logically the one with more chances. In Skypiea the one with more chances was Wiper and nobody joined.

Differentiation, chemistry, a want or sign that you want more than you currently have. Many pieces of my own criteria based on what i've seen. Does Wyper or Asia cross off more than 1 box? No.

Monquito is actually agreeing with my point that what is planned, isn't affected by popularity contest. I don't understand how that applies in what you're expounding on when it comes to criteria of what has happened in the story

[Monquito]

@Gold:

Oh yes I forgot Chopper the sulong using, female, minkman, electro user, bunny inspired, non devil fruit user. They are practically the same character…

Seriously though do explain further, I'm interested in your logic.

The… What...

As long as Carrot is a humanoid furry that transforms.. and as long as that's already covered within the crew, she and every other Mink are out the question.

Doesn't matter what animal she's based of, her concept its already in.

[Cockycent]

@Monquito:

Except there is, its called Chopper.

What does Carrot provide to the crew that Chopper filled up? A lookout and a doctor are on two different plains of existence. Is this the " they're furry meme again" or is it something I missed? Please don't tell me you're using personality, in which, there are so many similarities in the group already.

Update: Oh God, he is going with the furry meme. I thought this was going good with us exchanging decent arguments, but he ruined it smh

[Solid]

People still talking about the fan made up lookout position and ignoring the canon pirate disciple position smh

Happy to see some talk about my boy Paulie tho

[Cockycent]

Lookout happened, just check the almighty collage. Unlike Monster Trio

[Solid]

Cant find it, do you mind sharing it again?

[Monquito]

@Cockycent:

What does Carrot provide to the crew that Chopper filled up? A lookout and a doctor are on two different plains of existence. Is this the " they're furry meme again" or is it something I missed? Please don't tell me you're using personality, in which, there are so many similarities in the group already.

Update: Oh God, he is going with the furry meme. I thought this was going good with us exchanging decent arguments, but he ruined it smh

Believing Oda plans to override the conceptual traits of Chopper is pure faith.

And again, we're not guaranteed to have a lookout either since we've seen almost everyone done the job and she failed at it miserably.

[Cockycent]

It's in here. You'll find it whenever you want to. It was entertaining to see after multiple pages of me listing chapters to people who said certain things didn't happen

Actually, there was 1 prior from Oro Jackson that was in a Carrot "Mega Thread". I remember that 1 too

[Gold]

@Monquito:

The… What...

As long as Carrot is a humanoid furry that transforms.. and as long as that's already covered within the crew, she and every other Mink are out the question.

Doesn't matter what animal she's based of, her concept its already in.

Sorry this is not solid ground evidence at all.
Just your subjective opinion on the character designs being similar which I subjectively disagree with.

Not even one of Chopper's forms is similar to Carrot. I would love to rule out Carrot visually but it just isn't happening. The only similarity you reach for is fur and animal inspired.
I don't think that's enough to stop her from being included. Sulong = Werewolf, its quite different from the Human Zoan awakened drug induced transformations Chopper does.

The character designs are very different in race, size, shape, gender, role, silhouette, height etc. They both also assist each other as characters with the Bropper dynamic as seen from their interactions. My job is character/concept design so It's just my opinion but it is also informed from experience. I don't think Carrot and Chopper's designs cancel each other out otherwise she wouldn't have even left Zou. If anything Minks seem to be quite important and there is no mink in the crew.

Trust me I don't want another furry character on the crew, but I still don't agree with your point at all even though I want to dismiss Carrot as a member.

Shachi and Penguin are almost carbon copies, that doesn't stop them from being central characters on a crew too. Too big of a stretch for me.

Also as all the other people in the forum posted it's obvious you are just hating the furry meme. I understand disliking it but it's clouding any logic you have for reasons she might actually be in.

[Cockycent]

@Monquito:

Believing Oda plans to override the conceptual traits of Chopper is pure faith.

Still going with the furry bit huh

And again, we're not guaranteed to have a lookout either since we've seen almost everyone done the job and she failed at it miserably.

Has a SH member ever fixed the ship before Franky? Who helm any of the ships for the 800+ chapters before Jinbe touched the Sunny? Did any SH patch up another before Chopper came along?

What did Wyper or Asia do on the Merry?

[Yxenz]

I'll by that thing that Carrot is the ace under Oda's sleeve after we see the minks and she's not with them. By now, we can say she's just like Cockycent says Paulie was, a character who is there just to be the voice of their group.

[Shiebs]

The straw hats always excel at there role more than anyone else

We've seen Nami navigate the crew through currents other navigators couldn't predict and know when certain weather patterns will occur (Literally in her first intro she uses the weather to steal from bug guy's pirates)

Usopp Has shown multiple times, from when he first fired a cannon that he had a talent for it and Eneis Lobby when others couldn't fathom how he made the shot ( Although we've seen bb's sniper is superior at least for now, but Usopp is still exceptional)

Sanji's food is always shown to be top notch, hell his food was so good that Capone abandoned the thought of poisoning big mom because he didn't want to wreck something that tastes that good

Chopper has shown to be an exceptional doctor, but for some reason I'm drawing a blank on a particular scene that proves he's exceptional even though I know I've read one before

Nico Robin is literally the only one who can do what she does, except he three eyed tribe

Franky made the Sunny and all it's features from the coup de burst, to the submarine to the tank, he made a fantastic bridge in a matter of seconds at thriller bark and made a set of stairs in mid air as he was climbing said stairs

Brook's music is always said to sound amazing and can even put people to sleep instantly or make them hallucinate

And Jinbei showed in one spread that he can literally be a better helmsmen than anyone else due to his understanding of the ocean waves

Now if carrot is going to be a look out she needs to show that she's not only capable but literally better than anyone else in the series at said position

[Robby]

For Paulie, you had to actually be reading it weekly. Catching up on the majority of the arc and plowing through most of it just isn't the same thing, the momentum and the time to stew just isn't the same.

I was caught up with the anime as early as Alabasta, and switched over to the scans when I found out about them, when the anime was still in Skypeia. I binged through that and into the start of W7. when I found the scans was caught up a little bit into W7. I never thought it would be Kaku because the nose was just too similar to Usopp, and I didn't believe he was really going to leave forever.

But I was totally on the Paulie train for a variety of reasons. He appeared first, he had a decent design… Iceburg had basically promised one of his men if they could be convinced, after the betrayal he had no reason to stay there, his gambling and attitudes towards women gave him lots of possibilities in the group, and even as late as the big Enies Lobby battle, there were things like people asking him if he was with the Strawhats and him grudgingly accepting.

I also thought Franky was too damn weird. (Though 15 years later I understand now that "too weird" is a sign Oda put the effort in) Even up to the actual W7 fights I preferred Paulie and Franky didn't really grow on me till Thriller Bark with the pillar chucks and instant bridge... But it was pretty clearly going to be Franky after the flashback, I knew it was going to be him, I just didn't want it to be. But then the talk with Usopp, the bonding with Robin, the burning of the plans, the sea train, the color spreads, and him getting fight after fight, and showing all the variety in his skillset. There was no denying it beyond pure personal preference, he was getting huge moment after huge moment and tons of explicit bonding with the entire crew one after the other.

Brook was declared in from his first chapter, and I don't understand how anyone thought that the afro skeleton musician wasn't joining, even before Laboon.

And I was convinced very very early on with Jinbe due to all the backlog of scenes and moments and standout bits and history he got in incredibly fast order, even if I didn't care for his design or personality at first... that grew on me later, but him being an ideal candidate was pretty clear early, aside from his power level and bounty being too much, though even that was covered when it became clear there was going to be a time skip. Of course, he's STILL not around for whatever reason, I have to assume its cause he has some history in Wano and his being there at the start would have thrown something off.

I've been around this block. Carrot "has had one line of dialogue in the last year" ain't joining.

[Cockycent]

@Yxenz:

I'll by that thing that Carrot is the ace under Oda's sleeve after we see the minks and she's not with them. By now, we can say she's just like Cockycent says Paulie was, a character who is there just to be the voice of their group.

Actually, Inu and Neko are the voices on that specific front. The Minks are the brothers of the Kozuki and have to achieve Oden's goal. Inu and Neko emphasize the loyalty and people for that front.

Carrot represents that whole "dawn, it's your turn" thing and how Neko and Inu left their home to venture twice in leaving Zou and leaving to be with Oden on WB's ship. That's why, along with not having a clear dream or experience, the possible separate crew with Momo or even his retainer is a good argument as well, but hasn't been used that often.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Shiebs:

The straw hats always excel at there role more than anyone else

We've seen Nami navigate the crew through currents other navigators couldn't predict and know when certain weather patterns will occur (Literally in her first intro she uses the weather to steal from bug guy's pirates)

Usopp Has shown multiple times, from when he first fired a cannon that he had a talent for it and Eneis Lobby when others couldn't fathom how he made the shot ( Although we've seen bb's sniper is superior at least for now, but Usopp is still exceptional)

Sanji's food is always shown to be top notch, hell his food was so good that Capone abandoned the thought of poisoning big mom because he didn't want to wreck something that tastes that good

Chopper has shown to be an exceptional doctor, but for some reason I'm drawing a blank on a particular scene that proves he's exceptional even though I know I've read one before

Nico Robin is literally the only one who can do what she does, except he three eyed tribe

Franky made the Sunny and all it's features from the coup de burst, to the submarine to the tank, he made a fantastic bridge in a matter of seconds at thriller bark and made a set of stairs in mid air as he was climbing said stairs

Brook's music is always said to sound amazing and can even put people to sleep instantly or make them hallucinate

And Jinbei showed in one spread that he can literally be a better helmsmen than anyone else due to his understanding of the ocean waves

Now if carrot is going to be a look out she needs to show that she's not only capable but literally better than anyone else in the series at said position

Chopper almost let Luffy die from poison and Sanji almost let Luffy starve.

Both characters had a mentor being almost asked to be on the ship. Kureha and Zeff taught actual SH members, so are they the best?

[Gold]

@Yxenz:

I'll by that thing that Carrot is the ace under Oda's sleeve after we see the minks and she's not with them. By now, we can say she's just like Cockycent says Paulie was, a character who is there just to be the voice of their group.

I'm interested to see how her absence is dealt with, hope its intentional.
I definitely agree with you and Cockycent about the Paulie similarity.
It feels similar in that a lot of the audience is led to believe Carrot fits as a potential crewmember since her stowaway from Zou. Especially with how during Water 7 we were explicitly looking for a Shipwright so the intro and fleshing of Paulie was meant to make the audience think he was fitting but was a red herring to distract from Franky.

Also the Carrot = Pirate Disciple sounds a lot like a Cabin girl

[Monquito]

@Gold:

Sorry this is not solid ground evidence at all.
Just your subjective opinion on the character designs being similar which I subjectively disagree with.

Not even one of Chopper's forms is similar to Carrot. I would love to rule out Carrot visually but it just isn't happening. The only similarity you reach for is fur and animal inspired.
I don't think that's enough to stop her from being included. Sulong = Werewolf, its quite different from the Human Zoan awakened drug induced transformations Chopper does.

The character designs are very different in race, size, shape, gender, role, silhouette, height etc. They both also assist each other as characters with the Bropper dynamic as seen from their interactions. My job is character/concept design so It's just my opinion but it is also informed from experience. I don't think Carrot and Chopper's designs cancel each other out otherwise she wouldn't have even left Zou. If anything Minks seem to be quite important and there is no mink in the crew.

Trust me I don't want another furry character on the crew, but I still don't agree with your point at all even though I want to dismiss Carrot as a member.

Shachi and Penguin are almost carbon copies, that doesn't stop them from being central characters on a crew too. Too big of a stretch for me.

Also as all the other people in the forum posted it's obvious you are just hating the furry meme. I understand disliking it but it's clouding any logic you have for reasons she might actually be in.

You're whole reply is mistaken, I'm not talking about designs. but about concept.

Samurais, other fishmen, cooks, musicians, robots, furries. all covered.