So there's belief that Kuma will die and his fruit will end up on the SH? Hmmmmm… it's a great fruit. With what happened with Absalom, I kinda could see a tiny inkling of this happening... Tiny though.
Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 7 - Wano)
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Kuma's fruit is one of the most problematic in the series, and only bearable (ho ho!) because its current user is braindead. If I were Oda I wouldn't touch that power with a ten foot pole.
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I'm a plot focused individual, so I generally don't lend much credence to theories based on patterns (real or imagined), but I do admit that if any of them were to carry some actual weight, it'd be the DF numbers theory. As such, while I don't use it for my personal theorizing, it wouldn't surprise me if a future crewmate (or perhaps even one of the current non-fruit users) ends up with a "2-9" Devil Fruit of some sort. Having said that, I have significant doubts about the two current fruits that fit that pattern, as well as the individuals they're currently possessed by.
As far as the individuals go, Kuma has been portrayed as dead (for all intents and purposes) since Marineford, while Kinemon is the loyal vassal of Momonosuke. I can't see the latter leaving his lord's side under any circumstance - only way he'd join the Strawhats on a permanent basis is if Momo did, as far as I'm concerned. And while Vegapunk could certainly pull some future-tech tomfoolery out of his a** to bring Kuma back, there's currently no way of knowing what a newly-freed Kuma would want to do. Part of me thinks he'd be most likely to return to the Revolutionaries, but the rest is stuck on the question of why he allowed himself to be cyberized to "death" in the first place - until we know the answer to that, I don't know that Kuma would be willing to go anywhere, even if he had an actual say in the matter.
As to their respective Devil Fruits, to my mind, they suffer from opposite problems. Kuma's Nikyu Nikyu no Mi is GROSSLY overpowered, to the point where he could easily dispose of any threat he so chose with a single touch - whether he drops you safely on an island halfway around the world or into the middle of an empty stretch of the Calm Belt, whatever threat you were posing at the time is now gone. If Kuma or someone inheriting his fruit - for the sake of argument, let's say Carrot, since she already has paw marks on her hands anyway - were to join, there would be almost no tension in any fights they are involved in from now on, since we know that they have an "I Win" button on hand at all times. I like the idea that a new Devil Fruit owner may develop new techniques that suit their own style rather than simply aping previous users' techniques (a bit hard to do for Shiryu, and Sabo/Teach get something of a pass for sentimental/familiarity reasons), but even if Carrot acquired these powers and developed them in a different way, the fact that we knew they COULD be used in this way would mainly leave us wondering how long until she realizes she can "BAMF" an enemy to the other side of the planet, rather than really enjoying her own struggles and development as a warrior.
As to Kinemon's (presumed) Fuku Fuku no Mi, it suffers from the problem of being too…simple, at least as far as it's capabilities have currently been revealed. The ability to create clothes basically out of thin air is great for a quick disguise or wardrobe purposes, but doesn't really do anything for combat purposes and has little non-combat utility as well - while I don't think that every Devil Fruit needs to make one a combat monster, I do think that they need to integrate into the character's skill set in a meaningful way, and even with Kinemon, his powers don't really seem to. They're more just an extra trick he has up his sleeve. Unless placed in the hands of someone who goes full-on Final Fantasy X-2 and changes up both their fighting style and wardrobe mid battle, I have a hard time seeing this power as being particularly significant. Furthermore, the Strawhats already change outfits more frequently than most shonen characters do over their entire series - I don't know that adding Kinemon's Devil Fruit powers to the mix really does anything other than eliminate an excuse for a good shopping trip.
So long story short, even if a "2-9" DF-user is on the table for the future, I'm not sure Kuma, Kinemon, or someone with one of their Devil Fruits is likely to be our #11/12.
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So yea, the Nikyu Nikyu main issue relies in how overpowered it is, but still, recently gaining a df doesn't mean you get immediate control over it, so there's a chance in there, especially if the Nikyu Nikyu is eaten late in the series, when I personally consider the thing to be needed to jump from Raftel to Mariejois/Marineford/Gyiojin Island.
I even went back to check out if Kuma still had his paws on his hands and damn gloves, well there's a lot of time and thankfully the Reverie plot has Kuma's fate in the eye of the huracan, so whatever happens to him, we'll get to know thrughout Wano's arc.
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I even went back to check out if Kuma still had his paws on his hands and damn gloves, well there's a lot of time and thankfully the Reverie plot has Kuma's fate in the eye of the huracan, so whatever happens to him, we'll get to know thrughout Wano's arc.
Kuma was using his powers in Marineford, and his alive/dead status hasn't changed since then.
Purely coincidence
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Kuma was using his powers in Marineford, and his alive/dead status hasn't changed since then.
uuh, I know, but we're not 100% sure if he had any other changes before being turned into a slave for the CD's.
tho being known as the 'invencible' slave kinda hints that he's still is in possesion of the Nikyu Nikyu.
the other possibility is that since he's more dead than alive, it don't matter if he gets the fruit extracted.
the conflict between the Revos and the Admirals should end soon along with the Reverie, so we'll get to know what's the next step for Kuma's fate. -
So yea, the Nikyu Nikyu main issue relies in how overpowered it is, but still, recently gaining a df doesn't mean you get immediate control over it, so there's a chance in there, especially if the Nikyu Nikyu is eaten late in the series, when I personally consider the thing to be needed to jump from Raftel to Mariejois/Marineford/Gyiojin Island.
You're thinking about it more for the purposes of travel, in which proper "targeting" is vital to ensure those you send flying get to where you want them to go.
I'm thinking about it more for the purposes of combat. Devil Fruit powers never get stronger, their users only get more creative. So if the most basic function of the Nikyu Nikyu no Mi can be summed up as "whatever I touch goes as far as I want it to in the direction that I want it to" and you don't care where your opponent ends up, there's no reason you can't just slap a palm on their chest, say "600 miles, that way", and be done with it. That doesn't seem like a massive, "outside-the-box" revelation to me, especially if you are surrounded by people (the other Strawhats) who already know it works from firsthand experience.
I even went back to check out if Kuma still had his paws on his hands and damn gloves, well there's a lot of time and thankfully the Reverie plot has Kuma's fate in the eye of the huracan, so whatever happens to him, we'll get to know thrughout Wano's arc.
Kuma was using his powers in Marineford, and his alive/dead status hasn't changed since then.
What Avocado said. If he had his powers back during Marineford, there's no reason he wouldn't have them now.
Since we already know that inanimate objects can possess Devil Fruits (Lassoo, Funkfried), I have a hard time rationalizing Kuma losing his powers due to being "more dead that alive/more machine than man" if they survived his cyberization in the first place.
Plus, he's still technically a member of the Shichibukai. Without his Nikyu Nikyu powers, he'd be indistinguishable from any other Pacifista (so far as we know… Vegapunk may have loaded him up with experimental tech that the production models don't have).
Without love, it cannot be seen.
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I agree the paw paw fruit could be overpowered with the send anyone flying away with one touch….. but were also forgetting Oda convenintely forgets about observation haki all the god damn time, or Luffy's future sight, I mean seriously so many things they should be prepared for something but it sneaks up on them, or don't see it coming, when they should be totally aware of what's around them
I mean I get it happening every once in a while but stuff like that constantly occurs lol
I don't see why the paw paw fruit has to be any different lol
he'll just conveniently forget that power
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The teleportation is a non-issue where everyone has haki now. Just say you can't send haki users flying. Boom done
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You're thinking about it more for the purposes of travel, in which proper "targeting" is vital to ensure those you send flying get to where you want them to go.
I'm thinking about it more for the purposes of combat. Devil Fruit powers never get stronger, their users only get more creative. So if the most basic function of the Nikyu Nikyu no Mi can be summed up as "whatever I touch goes as far as I want it to in the direction that I want it to" and you don't care where your opponent ends up, there's no reason you can't just slap a palm on their chest, say "600 miles, that way", and be done with it. That doesn't seem like a massive, "outside-the-box" revelation to me, especially if you are surrounded by people (the other Strawhats) who already know it works from firsthand experience.
Well the jump-back to Gyojin Island is either coming from Kuma's or will be revealed a teleportation df user, but navigating all the way back is just a no for me.
and a SH having it in the last arc means it really won't be used much in combat, except to face a member of the BB pirates.Since we already know that inanimate objects can possess Devil Fruits (Lassoo, Funkfried), I have a hard time rationalizing Kuma losing his powers due to being "more dead that alive/more machine than man" if they survived his cyberization in the first place.
Plus, he's still technically a member of the Shichibukai. Without his Nikyu Nikyu powers, he'd be indistinguishable from any other Pacifista (so far as we know… Vegapunk may have loaded him up with experimental tech that the production models don't have).
The Shichibukai is bout to get offed anyway.
Kuma's plot is getting really interesting now, if it lands in rescue, next step will be to bring him back to human obviously which rises a lot more questions, starting from if such thing is even possible to who would actually accomplish it, otherwise he's useless for the Revos, unless they plan to use it as a weapon too:ninja: those fuckers.
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The teleportation is a non-issue where everyone has haki now. Just say you can't send haki users flying. Boom done
Certainly a possible solution, and one that might warrant revising my views on the Nikyu Nikyu no Mi's chances to be added to the crew, but it has in no way been foreshadowed as of yet.
Well the jump-back to Gyojin Island is either coming from Kuma's or will be revealed a teleportation df user, but navigating all the way back is just a no for me.
and a SH having it in the last arc means it really won't be used much in combat, except to face a member of the BB pirates.I suspect we may get a timeskip after Raftel, though how long of one is a different question. If the Strawhats follow the example of the Roger Pirates in reaching the end of the Grand Line and then vanishing for a while, they can pop back up pretty much anywhere they please.
And if all the post-Raftel action is centered around the entrance to the New World…well, that area holds Fishman Island, New Marineford, and Mary Geoise all in fairly close proximity.
Without love, it cannot be seen.
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Certainly a possible solution, and one that might warrant revising my views on the Nikyu Nikyu no Mi's chances to be added to the crew, but it has in no way been foreshadowed as of yet.
I suspect we may get a timeskip after Raftel, though how long of one is a different question. If the Strawhats follow the example of the Roger Pirates in reaching the end of the Grand Line and then vanishing for a while, they can pop back up pretty much anywhere they please.
And if all the post-Raftel action is centered around the entrance to the New World…well, that area holds Fishman Island, New Marineford, and Mary Geoise all in fairly close proximity.
But reaching Raftel and revealing One piece is supposed to trigger World War I according to Newgate, a comfortable time-skip while everyone's killing each other doesn't sound right to me, with the CD's and Ym involved in some shady worldwide conspiracy, it seems to me the conflict would eventually resolve in Mariejois, and with a df that sends people straight from point A to point B, it's just safer to do so and in the SH´s style, it would costs much less lives.
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But reaching Raftel and revealing One piece is supposed to trigger World War I according to Newgate, a comfortable time-skip while everyone's killing each other doesn't sound right to me, with the CD's and Ym involved in some shady worldwide conspiracy, it seems to me the conflict would eventually resolve in Mariejois, and with a df that sends people straight from point A to point B, it's just safer to do so and in the SH´s style, it would costs much less lives.
Until we know what the Strawhats are going to find on Raftel, I don't think we can really be too certain about what follows one way or the other, but I think we can distinguish between "finding" whatever's on Raftel and "revealing" it to the world. Roger "found" what was on Raftel, but didn't "reveal" it, and so I don't think whatever it is will necessarily set things off immediately as you're suggesting. And until the fallout from the Reverie is in full effect and we know what actions the World Government is taking, I don't think we can speculate too much on what schemes Im and the Gorousei have planned, or the urgency of dealing with them. Thus, the Strawhats may have time to consider their next move.
As I said, how long of a timeskip is an open question… A longer timeskip (3-5 years) might allow younger characters like Momonosuke and O-tama to hone their skills to the point of joining the coalition, but it could just as easily be a couple of months - enough time to get word to their allies and make the trip, but not much else.
Without love, it cannot be seen.
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If Vegapunk managed to duplicate the laser ability of Kizaru, is it far-fetched to think that in the 2 years since, he might have, at least to some degree, duplicated Kuma's Nikyu ability? That doesn't mean Kuma would have to have 'died' and had his fruit recycled, but it could present an issue for the Revos trying to figure out which one is the real him if the other Pacifistas have similar abilities to the original. That is, if saving him is still in the realm of possibility, or if Kuma going through all of this wasn't just intentionally done from the start, like being a sleeper agent.
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If Vegapunk managed to duplicate the laser ability of Kizaru, is it far-fetched to think that in the 2 years since, he might have, at least to some degree, duplicated Kuma's Nikyu ability? That doesn't mean Kuma would have to have 'died' and had his fruit recycled, but it could present an issue for the Revos trying to figure out which one is the real him if the other Pacifistas have similar abilities to the original. That is, if saving him is still in the realm of possibility, or if Kuma going through all of this wasn't just intentionally done from the start, like being a sleeper agent.
There's a diference between a scientist recreating a laser after seeing one, and a scientist recreating paws that somehow reflect literally anything (even concepts) and can create bear paw-shaped bubbles. Kizaru's power is very straightforward, while Kuma's power is super esoteric.
Purely coincidence
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Could the little cloud see as a nakama ?
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If someone is gonna join with a 2-9 pun in their fruit, I bet itd be a new fruit
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Besides the fuku fuku and nikyu nikyu fruits. I've seen Niku Niku fruit and Tsuku Tsuku fruit theories.
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There's a diference between a scientist recreating a laser after seeing one, and a scientist recreating paws that somehow reflect literally anything (even concepts) and can create bear paw-shaped bubbles. Kizaru's power is very straightforward, while Kuma's power is super esoteric.
Noted, but he's had two years after already having made such breakthroughs (and according to Sentomaru, there are upgraded ones even beyond what were seen prior to the Time Skip), it's not a stretch to think he could have made some impressive advances even beyond that. It need not necessarily be the authentic thing but mimic it in some way, like using massively compressed air to create something like Ursus Shock, or other air cannon style (we've already seen plenty of such things that were Franky-esque) means of throwing paw-shaped attacks at fools. It just wouldn't be quite as fun if it was immediately obvious which one was the real deal. It's already predictable that fighting him is going to be the hardest part, so why not build up to that by having to eliminate the fakes, and make it less obvious which ones are the replicas? Given how many there are likely to be at this point, they're likely to be the prominent force of the Marines since by and large the rest of the Marines' top-tier warriors are so limited in number. That'd make it a little more meaningful than plowing through them like the New Fishman Pirate rabble.
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Noted, but he's had two years after already having made such breakthroughs (and according to Sentomaru, there are upgraded ones even beyond what were seen prior to the Time Skip), it's not a stretch to think he could have made some impressive advances even beyond that.
He's been working on Kuma for a long time. If he wasn't able to mimic his fruit then, I don't think an extra two years would be enough, especially when he didn't have access to Kuma for study that whole time.
I agree that different workarounds are possible though.
Purely coincidence
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He's been working on Kuma for a long time. If he wasn't able to mimic his fruit then, I don't think an extra two years would be enough, especially when he didn't have access to Kuma for study that whole time.
I agree that different workarounds are possible though.
Yeah, given how the lasers obviously aren't coming from the same source as Kizaru's so even if it's the same effect, it's just a mimic, so I figured other DF abilities could be doppelganger-ed too, to some extent. Nothing like something that produces a substance like Mr. 3, Magellan or Katakuri's, but things like light/lasers and wind/air would be believable. Good point about him being unavailable for study during the time skip, but Vegapunk would have had ample time to think up the concepts I outlined in a few seconds, and tool around with it to power up the other Pacifistas with prototypes of them over the two years. If it's just compressed air, at least. I would hope Franky isn't the only person in the world who could come up with that kind of Coup De Vent/Boo/Burst technology.
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So When does the Carrot databook card come out? I can't wait to see who is right and who is wrong (though I doubt even that would be enough to sway her fans)
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July: http://www.arlongpark.net/showthread.php?t=49887&page=20&p=3928425#post3928425 But that will only matter if Merry and Sunny don't get #11/12 when EL pack comes out in June. If they don't, then 11/12 will really be kept for the next SH.
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I'd like to think they'll work out a way to avoid spoiling a major plot reveal like who might join the crew.
Even if it wrecks their numbering system, it's probably better to list a future Strawhat in whatever context they were originally introduced, and wait for Oda to make it real before "correcting" it.
Unless Oda's planning to make Carrot official in the next 7-ish months, I can't see the databook making that reveal ahead of the author.
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So When does the Carrot databook card come out? I can't wait to see who is right and who is wrong (though I doubt even that would be enough to sway her fans)
I doubt Carrot joining the crew would be announced with the cards. That's too big of a spoiler to be revealed anywhere but in the manga.
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7 months is about enough time to introduce a new character and write him off to join the crew tho.
Jinbe being numbered 10 already spoils his; 'nothing really happened to me, I'll be there eventually'.
besides, Vivre Card is a long-thought project from Oda and Shueisha, its much likely that if Carrot gets 11/12 or 173628, will represent a definitive yes or a definitive no, given the relevance of this project and the fact no character in the album has two different numbers and that would hardly change if its all been so perfectly planned.
interesingly enough, the original binder of the thing portays all of the SH's, Jinbe and Vivi.
Carrot didn't get a spot, there's Pedro tho. -
interesingly enough, the original binder of the thing portays all of the SH's, Jinbe and Vivi.
Carrot didn't get a spot, there's Pedro tho.You said yourself in the databook thread, it doesn't have anyone who'd be joining after Jinbe. It wasn't freshly drawn by Oda and most likely wasn't arranged directly by him either. It really seems like a non-issue.
It would honestly take a major narrative turn in the next 5 months for Carrot to get any shot at card #11, whether she joins eventually or not. I'm willing to hold out hope until then, but I personally won't keep fighting once her number comes to pass. It's gonna be at least a year from that point before Wano ends, so whatever happens will take quite a while longer.
Like the Avatar? / Like the Miis?Dragalia Lost ID: 97617932505
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But Carrot's been around for over 100 chapters, and from now until july there should be nothing 'spoilish' about her getting 11/12, her card number should pretty much settle her fate.
Another interesting thing to notice, if someone from Wano is planned to join, the Wano pack is not even scheduled yet, meaning we're really far far away from getting their cards out, and even further if it get divided into first and second pack, like Alabasta, so it all would work perfectly since the album wouldn't be spoiling anything about any wano-kunian joining simply because we're not getting theirs until like december 2019 or even further.
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But Carrot's been around for over 100 chapters, and from now until july there should be nothing 'spoilish' about her getting 11/12, her card number should pretty much settle her fate.
She's been around for over 100 chapters and people are still arguing about whether she's a natural fit for the crew or someone who never stood a chance, with very little in between.
It's way too early to know where the Carrot plot thread is going to end up (as distinct from the overall Mink plot), but it will require some decent narrative attention in order to solidify Carrot's fate as a potential new crew-member, and even if that happens, traditionally the confirmation is saved for the end of the arc. Even if it's looking like a strong case, I can't see them confirming it unless she unequivocally joins the crew mid-arc before the Zou pack comes out.
Same issue with a theoretical number 12, whether from Wano or not.
If #11 and #12 are not the Merry and Sunny (and I hope they aren't, because I would put Vivi before the ships, "former" Strawhat be damned) and their identities haven't been officially locked in by the time their cards are introduced, I can't see the databook getting out ahead of the manga.
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Whether or not Carrot will join the crew, she is not a Strawhat at the moment, therefore she shouldn't get a card.
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Whether or not Carrot will join the crew, she is not a Strawhat at the moment, therefore she shouldn't get a card.
She will get a card like everyone else eventually, if Carrot's card doesn't come out in the Zou pack, then that's just as much of a spoiler as it would be putting her in 11/12.
besides by July she'd have like 150 chapters since introduction, there should be nothing to spoil by then. -
She will get a card like everyone else eventually, if Carrot's card doesn't come out in the Zou pack, then that's just as much of a spoiler as it would be putting her in 11/12.
besides by July she'd have like 150 chapters since introduction, there should be nothing to spoil by then.My mistake for not specifying what I meant, but what I wanted to say is that Carrot shouldn't get a card numbered #11 or #12 if she is not a Strawhat at that moment, regardless of whether or not she will become one later.
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My mistake for not specifying what I meant, but what I wanted to say is that Carrot shouldn't get a card numbered #11 or #12 if she is not a Strawhat at that moment, regardless of whether or not she will become one later.
if you're proposing she should have two different numbered cards, that's hardly happening, not even the main character does.
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Without love, it cannot be seen.
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if you're proposing she should have two different numbered cards, that's hardly happening, not even the main character does.
That's a problem for the people managing the Vivre Card to solve, and it is a problem, because there is no satisfying outcome once the Zou booster comes out, since the publishers will be spoiling the fans whether or not Carrot is joining the crew (which is not cool whatever the case)… or else they mislead the readers with a fake number or maybe suspending the release of her card until later, both ackward solutions that will cause confusion.
Fact is that the publishers are releasing this product (for huge amounts of profit) even though the series is far from over, therefore they frequently fall into the trouble of having to deal with information.
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if you're proposing she should have two different numbered cards, that's hardly happening, not even the main character does.
That's only because no character so far has had their status change after the cards were printed.
Purely coincidence
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Luffy's not in a position where what is (or is not) done with his card could spoil his role in the series going forward.
c'mon, a character who's been around 120 chapters and will be something around 140/50 by July still needs 'time' to not to spoil things..
I mean, Jinbe being tenth in there already spoils his safeness and improbability of dying, it don't seem to matter.not to mention, newcomers would be confused by Carrot getting two different numbers and being the only one who does.
That's a problem for the people managing the Vivre Card to solve, and it is a problem, because there is no satisfying outcome once the Zou booster comes out, since the publishers will be spoiling the fans whether or not Carrot is joining the crew (which is not cool whatever the case)… or else they mislead the readers with a fake number or maybe suspending the release of her card until later, both ackward solutions that will cause confusion.
and there's no problem at all if she's not joining.
I don't think they would go as far as faking a number or suspending the release, Zou doesn't have that much big amount of characters to divide into two like Alabasta, and Carrot is one of the few notable characters, her card will come out yes or yes, I don't see a reason why would they keep it for later, tho keeping it for later indeed does spoils it as much as it would giving her 11/12.Fact is that the publishers are releasing this product (for huge amounts of profit) even though the series is far from over, therefore they frequently fall into the trouble of having to deal with information.
and another fact is Oda being involved on this, if he's okay with Carrot's card coming out in July, there should be a reason for it.
That's only because no character so far has had their status change after the cards were printed.
Aren't you the one regularly claiming the manga does not treats Jinbe as a SH?. because not being treated as a SH doesn't matter here, you still get to be where you're supposed to.
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That's a problem for the people managing the Vivre Card to solve, and it is a problem, because there is no satisfying outcome once the Zou booster comes out, since the publishers will be spoiling the fans whether or not Carrot is joining the crew (which is not cool whatever the case)… or else they mislead the readers with a fake number or maybe suspending the release of her card until later, both ackward solutions that will cause confusion.
Fact is that the publishers are releasing this product (for huge amounts of profit) even though the series is far from over, therefore they frequently fall into the trouble of having to deal with information.
I agree with you, but I think part of the issue here is that I doubt the publishers are looking at One Piece the same way that we do (if that makes sense?). Like we're here in a thread dedicated to theorizing who the next SH is, on a site dedicated to discussing and theorizing about One Piece. Like regardless of where you fall on whether or not Carrot is joining, we look at her as a character who has enough potential to at least warrant a discussion. Whereas I think the publishers of the Vivre Cards don't see it like that. Like they're not theorizing about who the next Straw Hat is, they just kinda take One Piece on its face (likely with some input from Oda, at least regarding the 11 and 12 slots). Idk if that made any sense tho. Like they're not looking at Carrot as a character who may end up being part of the main cast, and they probably aren't concerned with spoiling something like that because, realistically, that only matters to the small number of people who are theorizing about it happening/not happening (which is to say, us).
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I agree with you, but I think part of the issue here is that I doubt the publishers are looking at One Piece the same way that we do (if that makes sense?). Like we're here in a thread dedicated to theorizing who the next SH is, on a site dedicated to discussing and theorizing about One Piece. Like regardless of where you fall on whether or not Carrot is joining, we look at her as a character who has enough potential to at least warrant a discussion. Whereas I think the publishers of the Vivre Cards don't see it like that. Like they're not theorizing about who the next Straw Hat is, they just kinda take One Piece on its face (likely with some input from Oda, at least regarding the 11 and 12 slots). Idk if that made any sense tho. Like they're not looking at Carrot as a character who may end up being part of the main cast, and they probably aren't concerned with spoiling something like that because, realistically, that only matters to the small number of people who are theorizing about it happening/not happening (which is to say, us).
Who knows for sure what they are thinking, but I believe the publishers are aware of the consumers' interests/behavior, or at least they should be. Even if it's not a personal concearn of the publisher to theorize about who is going to join the Strawhats, nonetheless he should know that his work have an impact on the overall experience of the people who are buying his product… so their concern should be accounted by the publisher.
I understand your argument about minorities, but how much is that really the case here? The debate about the future nakama is not minor stuff for underground people, but rather one of the mainstream discussion of the community, and one of the most important things that any organizer/cataloguer should take into consideration. While most fans might not be interested in going to online forums to fight about who is going to become the next Strawhat, they probably are conscious of this kind of stuff and they have their own opinions/expectations on the subject. Part of the fun of reading anything is wondering about stuff.
Obviously, it shouldn't be a problem for the publishers to reveal that Dellinger is not joining the Strawhats, because that's not really something in debate, even if it's technically possible. However, Carrot is a different case. Even if some people are 120% sure that Carrot won't join the crew, it is unquestionable that there is an ongoing discussion about Carrot for the past two years... and I'm not talking about this particular thread, because this discussion is everywhere in the One Piece community. The publishers should be aware of it.
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Aren't you the one regularly claiming the manga does not treats Jinbe as a SH?. because not being treated as a SH doesn't matter here, you still get to be where you're supposed to.
Jimbei was a done deal ever since the end of FI. I'm annoyed that he isn't portrayed as such in the manga, but the writing's been on the wall for a long time. The cards hardly spoiled anything by lumping him with the strawhats.
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Jinbe's card doesn't spoil anything because it is not saying he will join the SH, it is saying he already did. Even in the impossible case he was killed by Big Mom, that won't change the fact he was a SH already by the time that happened.
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Who knows for sure what they are thinking, but I believe the publishers are aware of the consumers' interests/behavior, or at least they should be. Even if it's not a personal concearn of the publisher to theorize about who is going to join the Strawhats, nonetheless he should know that his work have an impact on the overall experience of the people who are buying his product… so their concern should be accounted by the publisher.
I understand your argument about minorities, but how much is that really the case here? The debate about the future nakama is not minor stuff for underground people, but rather one of the mainstream discussion of the community, and one of the most important things that any organizer/cataloguer should take into consideration. While most fans might not be interested in going to online forums to fight about who is going to become the next Strawhat, they probably are conscious of this kind of stuff and they have their own opinions/expectations on the subject. Part of the fun of reading anything is wondering about stuff.
Obviously, it shouldn't be a problem for the publishers to reveal that Dellinger is not joining the Strawhats, because that's not really something in debate, even if it's technically possible. However, Carrot is a different case. Even if some people are 120% sure that Carrot won't join the crew, it is unquestionable that there is an ongoing discussion about Carrot for the past two years... and I'm not talking about this particular thread, because this discussion is everywhere in the One Piece community. The publishers should be aware of it.
But wouldn't that be representation bias though? Like the community that we're involved with (Arlong Park, and on a wider scale the online One Piece fandom) makes up a fraction of One Piece's total readership. We see these discussions because we choose to be a part of them. We're all interested enough in One Piece to go online and actively discuss it. It's not an underground discussion in these communities, but these communities themselves are only a small part of people reading One Piece. I'm not sure if the casual One Piece fan is sitting there thinking to themselves about Carrot's chances of becoming part of the main cast. I don't think they care that much about the Vivre Cards spoiling if Carrot's gonna join or not because that's not even something they think about. Which isn't to say the publishers shouldn't be aware of potentially spoiling that mind you. I think it's safe to say that all of us here, myself included, would much rather look to the actual source material to confirm or deny Carrot's role. I'm just trying to make sense of their rational, you know?
Of course this is all speculation, idk what casual One Piece fans think about. And it also occurs to me while writing this that the Vivre Cards are kind of an enthusiast product that caters more towards fans like us (the fans dedicated enough to go online and discuss this stuff), which makes the management of Carrot's card that much more confusing.
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But wouldn't that be representation bias though? Like the community that we're involved with (Arlong Park, and on a wider scale the online One Piece fandom) makes up a fraction of One Piece's total readership. We see these discussions because we choose to be a part of them. We're all interested enough in One Piece to go online and actively discuss it. It's not an underground discussion in these communities, but these communities themselves are only a small part of people reading One Piece. I'm not sure if the casual One Piece fan is sitting there thinking to themselves about Carrot's chances of becoming part of the main cast. I don't think they care that much about the Vivre Cards spoiling if Carrot's gonna join or not because that's not even something they think about. Which isn't to say the publishers shouldn't be aware of potentially spoiling that mind you. I think it's safe to say that all of us here, myself included, would much rather look to the actual source material to confirm or deny Carrot's role. I'm just trying to make sense of their rational, you know?
Of course this is all speculation, idk what casual One Piece fans think about. And it also occurs to me while writing this that the Vivre Cards are kind of an enthusiast product that caters more towards fans like us (the fans dedicated enough to go online and discuss this stuff), which makes the management of Carrot's card that much more confusing.
As you said, this product caters more to fans, although it reach some casuals/kids too.
Anyway, as I said, I believe this discussion is spread throughout of the One Piece community, so most people are aware of Carrot being a candidate for next Strawhat. If you go to Youtube to watch clips of the anime you'll see this conversation, if you go read commentaries in stream services you'll see this conversation, if you go anywhere OP related you'll probably find something about it. I'd even speculate that if you are a japanese fan, at least one of your friends claims that Carrot is going to be the next nakama… since, you know, in Japan people buy WSJ or OP volumes and probably have friends that also read One Piece, so they talk about it in school or wherever. Even if most people don't want to argue about this kind of stuff, it's hard to be oblivious about this discussion, because Carrot is a popular character that has been mixed with the Strawhats for the last 100 chapters as a heroine (in an arc that had no business with her).
So yes, I think the publishers are in a troublesome spot, although I wouldn't say this is the end of the world.
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but again, if she's not join, the publishers aren't in any trouble at all and her card should come out normally.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Jimbei was a done deal ever since the end of FI. I'm annoyed that he isn't portrayed as such in the manga, but the writing's been on the wall for a long time. The cards hardly spoiled anything by lumping him with the strawhats.
you're annoyed by nothing then, the manga called him Luffy's subordinate already.
ever since he's in the official Youtube Banner, given number 10 in the Vivre Card collectible, along with the Strawhats in both the original binder of the thing and a poster that just came out, and he's even seen in the SH's secuence in the teaser for the upcoming movie; Stampede.he's all over the place already, his constant delayings aren't just all explained properly, but by the time he comes back I bet we all will be like; Ooh so that's why!!!!
as I previously said, Jinbe coming along earlier would've hurt the position of Sanji, whom hasn't taken down any notorious powerhouse. Wano offers both the chance of Sanji taking down a really big fish and re-introducing either a permanently nerfed Jinbe, or just uses him to hype a Calamity just for Sanji to miraclously defeating it afterwards. -
This would be a good question to ask Oda or his editors
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if you're proposing she should have two different numbered cards, that's hardly happening, not even the main character does.
Luffy and Zoro have three Cards so far
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Anyway, the Vivre Card can go anyway... I mean this arc is gonna go for so long and some characters I’m assuming might even die when there give cards have already come out with them still alive so this stuff is gonna warrant revision by force... The only real argument to be made is if/when some other people do end up with 11/12 and that’s how you’ll be able to tell anything definitively
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Luffy and Zoro have three Cards so far
I said, 'two different numbered cards', Luffy and Zoro are still numbered 1 and 2 in each of those cards.
giving us a system where a character can hold several cards, but cannot hold two different numbers. -
I said, 'two different numbered cards', Luffy and Zoro are still numbered 1 and 2 in each of those cards.
giving us a system where a character can hold several cards, but cannot hold two different numbers.They are not characters who would not need to be changes. But whoever is joining, they're not likely to get the top number if they get a card while the arc is still ongoing.
Like the Avatar? / Like the Miis?Dragalia Lost ID: 97617932505
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If the Vivre Card really intends to keep going indefinitely, then I agree it would be really weird for a character to get two numbers.
That said, one year from now Vivre Card should have caught up with the manga and every character introduced by then will have their cards, so I wonder what is going to happen after that. Will they hold new cards for like an year until enough new characters have been introduced to release a new pack? Or will Vivre Card be finished by then and maybe later they could start it all again on a "Vivre Card 2"?
If they finish Vivre Card by the time it catchs up to the manga, then it would be perfectly fine for a character to get a number here and then get a new number once a future databook (Vivre Card 2 or whatever) is released. If the same Vivre Card keeps going, then I don't think they will give a character a number now and then give another later.
In the case of an endless Vivre Card then (how it was advertised), I can't see the numbering spoiling future SH as well, so either Oda has planned it in a way that Carrot or whatever other character will have already joined by the time their card comes out or simply they are not going to join…
Still, it's hard to think how that would function for any future SH as they probably would be getting their cards soon after their introduction in the manga once Vivre Card catches up.(EDIT: There is also the possibility of simply holding a card back. Gaimon card came out much later than it should, Fullbody's still is nowhere even though he was introduced at the Baratie arc, half of Impel Down staff was completely skipped, Hachi's is only coming out next month instead of back on the Arlong Park pack... it is common for them to release a card outside the proper order, so it would be nothing new - still, if Carrot's card alone is not present at the Zou pack it will be hard to believe it was because it just didn't fit)
Too many "if"s to work with.
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They are not characters who would not need to be changes. But whoever is joining, they're not likely to get the top number if they get a card while the arc is still ongoing.
Unless Oda has it all perfectly planned being this a project that's been on his minds for years, then it should be all perfectly fine and keep each character with one number safely.
Most likely scenario as of now.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@.access:
(EDIT: There is also the possibility of simply holding a card back. Gaimon card came out much later than it should, Fullbody's still is nowhere even though he was introduced at the Baratie arc, half of Impel Down staff was completely skipped, Hachi's is only coming out next month instead of back on the Arlong Park pack… it is common for them to release a card outside the proper order, so it would be nothing new - still, if Carrot's card alone is not present at the Zou pack it will be hard to believe it was because it just didn't fit)
Too many "if"s to work with.
Yes, you can hold Carrot's card, but you'll have to hold a couple others cards from Zou as well, since holding only Carrot's would be as spoiling as it would giving her 11(assuming she's not being properly written to join by the time she reaches 150 chapters since introduction lmao)
