I honestly think we dodged a bullet that there were no significant message boards back when Robin joined over Vivi.
Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)
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I honestly think we dodged a bullet that there were no significant message boards back when Robin joined over Vivi.
Oh god, could you imagine? "There's no way Robin will sail with the crew. An archeologist? On a pirate crew? How lame. Are we hunting for dinosaur bones now? Nah, Robin will just become the captain of the remnants of the Baroque Works and we'll get a cover story for her later."
Then we get Skypiea and Eneis Lobby in quick succession. I'll take whatever Oda writes over the fandom any day.
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Before ch. 180, I wouldn't get a "Robin might join" case. Wouldn't call it impossible either. Just don't see it. Wasn't reading that far back and I doubt most of the audience today were as well. I am curious as to what the evidence for Robin would be like before that chapter.
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Yamato will join… Carrot not even if I prefer her design wise while her character is lacking.
But if not a returning Vivi... I would fucking love Caribou joining. LOL
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There is definitely hate for Carrot joining in this thread, it's not even subtle. There's a difference between saying she hasn't been relevant much this arc and so that's a bad sign for her, and then acting like she never had any chance or hints at joining and its all stuff people made up. Both happen in this thread and the attitude of the latter really sours the first.
Is it really hate for the character or hate for the inane arguments for the character.
The only time I think she had a chance was during WCI and even then it wasn't a big chance cuz she didn't get anything close to main character focus and she didn't have any direct conflict with the antagonists. She was a supporting character. That's not what makes a strawhat. Doesn't even give signs of being one.
@wolfwood:Nah this thread was always a dumpster fire of sunk cost reasoning and tribalism
Yeah but Perona supporters never took it this far.
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and then acting like she never had any chance or hints at joining and its all stuff people made up.
We've been saying for six years that she wasn't being treated like a main character, but a prominent secondary, and that people were stretching and making a little into a lot. Just like we did for Hancock/Perona/Caimie/Monet/Shirahoshi/Viola/Rebecca/Pedro/etc.
That's not a new development or a retroactive dismissal.
But she's basically been off camera for three years so the continued insistence that she's got the same focus as the leads has long since worn thin.
Being tired of Carrot arguments has nothing to do with Carrot herself, or her supporters, and everything to do with it being a very thin argument stretched over literal years now.
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You're saying that there is a pattern and that Oda eventually does fulfill it for Strawhats. You are saying that any time something from the pattern is missing right now, it's 'a variance in the sequence'.
No.
You're confusing what I said.
I said Oda does it one way for the guys and one way for the girls. What he does are the same things but in what order he does it for the girls is a variance in sequence.
I didn't say anything about if something us missing from the pattern.
All I said in regards to Yamato is that the arc isn't over so pointing out something in the pattern is missing doesn't matter yet
Hope that's clear now.
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@Zik:
No.
You're confusing what I said.
I said Oda does it one way for the guys and one way for the girls. What he does are the same things but in what order he does it for the girls is a variance in sequence.
I didn't say anything about if something us missing from the pattern.
All I said in regards to Yamato is that the arc isn't over so pointing out something in the pattern is missing doesn't matter yet
Hope that's clear now.
But my point also applies to retroactive arcs like Alabasta, where you are still applying this same Pattern saying Vivi had no Dream, had no Backstory, but somehow you glaze over the fact that Robin joined in Alabasta.
Anything regarding Robin you start talking about following arcs like Skypeia and Water7, but at that point she was already an active part of the crew and considered a Strawhat
The Pattern did not apply to Robin at all at the point of her joining. It did not indicate any dream or backstory for her either. As far as reading goes, there was no narrative indication for Robin to join either.
And I'm saying that only to make a point of the reasons you're using in your argument. If you are saying that there is a pattern or using the narrative as a reason for Vivi never having any chance of being a Strawhat, then where do we stand with Robin in Alabasta? She is absolutely a 'pattern breaker' if we consider how she actually joined. The entire narrative process that allowed Robin to join all culminated at the very end of the Arc, and was not even clear cut that she would have made a decision to join at all.
Now, I will say that this doesn't mean I expect the same to happen with any other character than Robin, so don't get me wrong. I am just saying that if a possibility existed for Robin to join without Oda seeding a clear narrative indicator prior to her joining, then I think we should simply hold the same reservations until we get to the end of Wano. And this applies universally.
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The Pattern did not apply to Robin at all at the point of her joining. It did not indicate any dream or backstory for her either. As far as reading goes, there was no narrative indication for Robin to join either.
There were a ton of hints about Robin's past. Among other things we knew she got a high bounty at age 8 for sinking a bunch of ships, that she'd been with a lot of different bad dudes, and that she was the only person in the series we knew of that could read this ancient language that was now being shown to be a major thing. Heck, she betrayed Croc multiple times to save Luffy.
She had seeds and hints of more to her for sure.
Yes, she was and is "the surprise twist" candidate, but with hindsight you can see a lot of the setup in place. And we're all more trained to look for those kinds of clues now.
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There were a ton of hints about Robin's past. Among other things we knew she got a high bounty at age 8 for sinking a bunch of ships, that she'd been with a lot of different bad dudes, and that she was the only person in the series we knew of that could read this ancient language that was now being shown to be a major thing. Heck, she betrayed Croc multiple times to save Luffy.
She had seeds and hints of more to her for sure.
Hints are not clear cut indicators, they are just hints. If we were to have this conversation back when it was all still happening, any regard of those hints leading to her potentially joining would be regarded as 'fanfiction and narrative twisting'.
I think it's increasingly difficult to see any discussion on hints and possibilities because literally anything being thrown out will be criticized for not being part of the current narrative and all a result of fan fiction. Yet the narrative is never taken at face value when we're talking about surprise moments like Robin choosing to join on a whim. The narrative itself would have never actually pointed at this happening. The catalyst for it to happen came at the very end with Luffy saving Robin and her making an internal decision unknown to the Reader to join Luffy's crew as a result. The hint of her having joined other bad crews and jumping from here to there was not a direct hint that this was going to be where her narrative was going to go. Someone would actually have to suggest that she stops becoming a villain first, and if anyone had suggested that like we do today, then that'd be criticized for 'not following the current narrative' or 'making up fanfiction'.
For example, we have hints at Tama too. The current reason why she isn't a top pick right now is literally because the narrative has chosen not to focus on her, at all. I think that's fair to assess.
If, say, her age is the one thing holding her back from joining and we have Shinobu who has the ability to age someone up, we can put forth a theory that this could happen. Where do we stand with this as a theory? Is it a stretch, because she shows no interest in joining Luffy's crew? Is it narrative twisting, because she doesn't express any interest in being aged up? Or is all of this just 'not a hint at all' because Tama is not even considered a narrative focus and is being played out as the typical child-in-distress that we expect from most arcs? Either way, I typically see these kind of things being dismissed one way or another, rather than being regarded as a legitimate option (for the sake of discussion).
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We have hints at Tama too. The current reason why she isn't a top pick right now is
Because she's 8.
That takes her out of any serious discussion or thought by itself.
because the narrative has chosen not to focus on her,
You're acting like "the narrative" is a magical entity with its own will and whims, and not the conscious choices of the author.
Yet the narrative is never taken at face value when we're talking about surprise moments like Robin choosing to join on a whim. The narrative itself would have never actually pointed at this happening.
There were tons of hints for Robin. That was just a point in the series none of us were reading week to week and weren't looking for it. Most people here probably marathoned that arc in a handful of sittings rather than over a year.
Someone would actually have to suggest that she stops becoming a villain first,
The minute she started helping Luffy out and betraying Croc those seeds were planted.
It'd be like if someone guessed that Marine with a dog hat was actually Luffy's grandpa. They'd be right, but basing it on nothing. But if someone said "I think the body type and mustache on that dog hat marine look kind of like Luffy's grandpa in the one shot" they'd maybe have something. There's a difference between basiing a theory on something that's actually there, and just making it up completely from scratch.
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I saw this on the One Piece subreddit:
This would be the ideal scenario for me; it would be great if both of them joined.
The story seems to clearly be building up to Yamato joining, given lines like "I'm going to sail the seas with Luffy, after I drive you out of Wano, Kaido!" (we haven't really gotten Luffy's perspective on it, but I don't see why he'd say no, even if we probably won't get his point of view until after Kaidou's beaten), but Carrot meshes well with the crew, and she'd make for a great contrast with Nami, Robin, and Jinbei, at the very least. (seeing as she's goofier than Nami and Robin and more willing to join in with Luffy/Usopp/Chopper's shenanigans or stuff like Pirate Robo: Big Emperor, and Jinbei and her have sun and moon imagery, along with Jinbei being an serious veteran who's unprepared for the wackiness of the Straw Hats while Carrot's a naive newcomer who goes with the flow of the crew)
I realize that people are likely going to prioritize different details for why someone should join (in this case, whether it's more important to interact with Luffy or to interact with the crew as a whole - Yamato has more of the former but barely any of the latter, and Carrot's the opposite), but I don't see why it's impossible for both of them to join.
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In this topic rationalizations for why some opinions shouldn't be acceptable anymore.
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I'm guessing Komachiyo is holding them up because Tama is there as well.
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Call me crazy but my ideal scenario for who joins next will be entirely dependent on how strong their character arc/flashback is and if I'm insanely frank the only one that actually qualifies as of the current moment is Law.
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Law is easily the most developed non-main character in the series. His childhood flashback alone is bigger than most of the other SH's and follows a similar structure.
I think only Luffy and Robin are comparable. Maybe Jinbe, but that focuses on several characters besides just him.
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But my point also applies to retroactive arcs like Alabasta, where you are still applying this same Pattern saying Vivi had no Dream, had no Backstory, but somehow you glaze over the fact that Robin joined in Alabasta.
That's cuz Vivi showed up first in Whiskey Peak and did not join, then stayed around for several arcs before Alabasta and did not join.
I laid out the similarities for Robin and Nami. Vivi didn't fit at all. So then ok look at how the guy joined and she didn't fit that either.
You're saying that there is a pattern and that Oda eventually does fulfill it for Strawhats. You are saying that any time something from the pattern is missing right now, it's 'a variance in the sequence'.
Yet you also make statements like Vivi was never going to be a Strawhat because she didn't have the pattern. And you use the narrative to say she never was going to join.
The narrative never ended up in her favor and the pattern never matched up for her either.
Narrative wise, she was a strong contender at first as far as being a main character, having conflict with the antagonist, and getting a lot of focus but her character arc never pointed to her leaving Alabasta. Not once. Then the pattern just didn't fall in place either when it came to flashback or a dream.
How can you be so confident that her desires weren't going to change in the story by the time she was given a choice at the end
Cuz 5 previous strawhats all joined in a way that matched the pattern and the narrative supported their joining.
Also cuz by the end, specifically by the end, nothing about her character arc said she would leave Alabasta. As I've said numerous times that would've been a surprise move on Oda's part where he completely broke away from what he just did 5 times in a row.
, and she could have been given a flashback scene with a dream and intentions to go out exploring?
Only if said dream and flashback were shown earlier in the arc.
They weren't going to happen right before she made her decision to say goodbye.
You're saying it was never going to happen because the narrative didn't show anything for it, yet you allow a 'variance in the sequence' to apply to other characters like Yamato, and more importantly, Robin. Like, really, if Robin had zero indication of joining the crew while Vivi had all the reason to based on her adventures, then what was the clear cut pattern that indicated she was going to join?
No I don't.
You clearly misunderstood what I said.
I'm not allowing anything.
I simply recognized that the way both strawhat women joined was slightly different than the way the strawhat men joined. All of the same things happened just in a different order for the women. I singled out Yamato cuz I don't know for a fact if Oda considers Yamato a man or a woman. If it's a woman the sequence of events change. That's all. The things that happen in the pattern still happen.
Both Nami and Robin both joined first before their dream and/or flashback happened.
I'm pointing out that Oda can do anything with the story he wishes, and not base any of these reasons on a fan derived pattern.
I simply recognize something that Oda is clearly and obviously doing. Its not a fan pattern. Oda's doing it. He's done it every time.
It'll become a fan pattern when he stops doing it.
So sure Oda can do anything but when it comes to do this he's been fairly repetitive.
But even if you think its a fan pattern so far it's 9 for 9 and a 100% correct.
And when I put you to task to address these flaws in your argument, you have to bring up new reasons to address them, like 'look at the narrative! it was never going to happen!'.
Those weren't flaws. You just assumed I held the pattern as priority and as the only thing that matters when it comes to who joins.
Obviously the narrative matters.
After 20 years, I think some ppl can pretty easily identify some of Oda's storytelling techniques, his style, and go to plot devices.
Are you going to also disagree there isn't a pattern to characters who actually die in the story?
Especially compared to characters fans assume are dead or fakeout deaths? Is that just a fan pattern too?
Well I'm looking at Alabasta right now, and I never saw Robin fit the pattern you mention at all either.
Robin joined first just like Nami. Then in a later arc got the same treatment Nami got as far as the pattern goes.
Only difference is Robin was introduced as a villain and a woman of mystery.If you want to ignore stuff like her saving Luffy's life, lying to Croc, and Luffy saying its ok for her to join cuz she's a good person, fine.
I am not going to say that Carrot, Tama and Shinobu are going to follow in the same 'Suprise! New crewmate!' formula, but I want to point out that your argument is absolutely flawed
if you are cherry picking what characters you think the Pattern needs to apply to
Not doing that.,
then waive off the ones you think will join that aren't fitting the pattern as 'it's just a variance in the sequence' when you could just as easily apply this to literally any character. And you're not taking any time to consider this logically, because whenever this comes into consideration you will fall back to how these other characters aren't likely to happen because of Narrative reasons (which is what I DO agree with you on).
Like I've said before the pattern is not the end all be all of who joins. Its only natural to consider the narrative. Its not cherry picking. Its a logical approach.
Go ahead and apply it to Shinobu and Tama.
The point I make is that everything against Carrot, Tama and Shinobu joining right now is purely Narrative.
I would not put all 3 in the same boat but yeah sure.
I think there is always a possibility that Oda could do something absolutely insane and have multiple new characters join at the same time. Do I think it will happen? Probably not, but I think it's still possible,
Well you basically said it yourself. Just cuz something is possible doesn't mean it is probable.
Do I really have to pay mind or give credence to every single that can possibly happen?
given that we've literally had an arc where Luffy obtained an entire fleet without any real narrative prompts before it happened. Everyone still stuck to the 'one new crewmember' formula and never considered that they could all 'join'. I think that Wano could possibly build something similar in terms of building up to an unexpected surprise.
Well f you think more than 10 characters will join the crew then yes, definitely a chance of Oda doing something like that.
Anything regarding Robin you start talking about following arcs like Skypeia and Water7, but at that point she was already an active part of the crew and considered a Strawhat
The Pattern did not apply to Robin at all at the point of her joining. It did not indicate any dream or backstory for her either. As far as reading goes, there was no narrative indication for Robin to join either.
And I'm saying that only to make a point of the reasons you're using in your argument. If you are saying that there is a pattern or using the narrative as a reason for Vivi never having any chance of being a Strawhat, then where do we stand with Robin in Alabasta? She is absolutely a 'pattern breaker' if we consider how she actually joined. The entire narrative process that allowed Robin to join all culminated at the very end of the Arc, and was not even clear cut that she would have made a decision to join at all.
Like i've said several times before she isn't.
Robin joined the crew first and then got her dream and/or backstory revealed just like Nami. Nami joined in the Buggy arc, was around for Usopp to join and then bailed during Baratie. Robin joined at the end of Alabasa, was there for Skypeia, Davy back fight, and left during Water 7.
If you still disagree then Robin can be he exception that proves the pattern true.
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These whippersnappers weren't here for the AGOG days.
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Call me crazy but my ideal scenario for who joins next will be entirely dependent on how strong their character arc/flashback is and if I'm insanely frank the only one that actually qualifies as of the current moment is Law.
From a fan perspective its like Oda saw the fan poll results and decided to give Law the main character of your own manga treatment.
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Even Toriyama knew he had something with Vegeta when he saw the reactions.
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Carrot might stick around as a companion because of her insane popularity, same with Marco
If Marco stays with the crew for the next arc he better get an aerial team up battle with Sanji, or else I’ll be heart broken
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Weird some tried to bring up disagreemnts about Carrot as hating the character/hate speech, when you have something that qualified as hate speech earlier way in this thread (just by reading) when it came to Yamato.
What hate speech? Dying Yamato thing? I just think it will be fun narratively lol.
And no, 2 new crewmates joining at once (Carrot and Yams) is a defeatist, compromising theory. Because one has way more going at them and way more developed than the other one (you know who).
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I honestly can't remember anymore but i want to say that AGOG was worse.
Oh man, how could I forget AGOG. He was the Perona fan club and Perona 4 nakama manifested despite constantly getting his arguments destroyed he just wouldn't stop.
Almost erased him from my memory when I took my break lol.
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Wasn´t there supposed to be a pause for Carrot discussions?
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I think right after Shift suggested it, that was actually happening. Then I inadvertently revived it by whining about decorum soooo my bad. I definitely support a pause.
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I'm still down for it if everyone else is, but I'm happy to go with the flow, too.
Like the Avatar? / Like the Miis?Dragalia Lost ID: 97617932505
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I thought the Pedro will return stuff was dead, but it keeps coming back as well.
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I thought the Pedro will return stuff was dead, but it keeps coming back as well.
Not sure how that would benefit the story if it was decided to have Pedro come back.
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Not sure how that would benefit the story if it was decided to have Pedro come back.
It wouldn't. The story would actually be far better if he stays dead. I'd much prefer it.
But Oda can't help himself and his track record speaks for itself so I still fully expect Pedro to walk back onto the scene at the end of the arc along with Pekoms to help lift the mood of the whole party. (Or whenever the Big Mom stuff is fully done.) Or just treat it like Pell where its a blink and miss it thing until cover stories where he contributes absolutely nothing.
That said, Yasuie seems pretty certainly 100% dead so maybe Oda's being better about it now after Greg wrote him that letter.
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Greg had to write Oda a letter so that he possibly might start keeping seemingly dead characters dead or to stop fakeout deaths?
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It wouldn't. The story would actually be far better if he stays dead. I'd much prefer it.
But Oda can't help himself and his track record speaks for itself so I still fully expect Pedro to walk back onto the scene at the end of the arc along with Pekoms to help lift the mood of the whole party. (Or whenever the Big Mom stuff is fully done.) Or just treat it like Pell where its a blink and miss it thing until cover stories where he contributes absolutely nothing.
That said, Yasuie seems pretty certainly 100% dead so maybe Oda's being better about it now after Greg wrote him that letter.
Okay, so it's totally okay to talk about Pedro, who has been dead for 150 chapters being alive without any basis, but talking about Carrot in the next nakama thread is completely out of line?
Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Usopp, Sanji, Chopper, Robin, Franky, Brook, Jimbei, Carrot, Vivi, Smoker
"ONE PIECE, IT EXISTS" - The Great Pirate Edward Newgate
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
without any basis
Being a One Piece character is about enough basis. Virtually everyone agrees that keeping him dead would be narratively logical, but then again, One Piece.
We wouldn't even mention it, if it was like any other series.
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
Okay, so it's totally okay to talk about Pedro, who has been dead for 150 chapters being alive without any basis, but talking about Carrot in the next nakama thread is completely out of line?
Yes, because there's a considerable track record of Oda saving characters that SHOULD be dead. And post Alabasta with those three super water guys, that list includes basically everyone that isn't Ace or Whitebeard. (or Absalom) From the snow rabbits to the Franky family to the buster called CP9 to Geddatsu who fell off Skypeia to that pirate that bit his tounge to that slave that had his collar explode to Sabo to the ships of civilians Hody let go to Hachi to Pound to Jinbe to the Thousand Sunny. Even poster boy Pell wasn't the first example, Igaram did it first.
Even Going Merry couldn't stay dead because it got reincarnated into the skiff, and Merry was a boat.
Dozens upon dozens of examples, maybe even in the hundreds, including incredibly minor characters that were only in one or two panels and don't even have names.
And since the longest outliers to date are Mr. 9 at 13 years, (over 550 chapters!) and Bellamy at 11 years, there's no real statute of limitations on how long it takes a character to stop being dead.
"It's One Piece" and "Oda can't help himself" is the entire basis, and its a strong one.
If this was Naruto? He's dead. But its One Piece, so even with a tombstone and multiple people avenging him there's still decent odds he's actually fine since we didn't actually see the body.
Yasuie seems pretty legit though and no one is making a case for him still being alive.
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
Okay, so it's totally okay to talk about Pedro, who has been dead for 150 chapters being alive without any basis, but talking about Carrot in the next nakama thread is completely out of line?
Hasn't it been Carrot supporters begging to stop all talk about Carrot in this thread?
Ppl who don't support Carrot just think it's a waste of time to discuss Carrot's chances but some of us still don't mind in pointing out the weak arguments.
Zik Of The 7 Swords: Vision? What do you know about my vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions, and send the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you. Now ask yourself, Are you ready to see that vision?
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Pell
Pagaya
Pedro
Pound
PekomsThe Will of P will stay true! That is all.
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Okay, so it's totally okay to talk about Pedro, who has been dead for 150 chapters being alive without any basis
I'm fine with Carrot talk because it's completely like Oda at this stage to say, "….Fuck it! Carrot, Yamato, AND Momo are joining! Nobody called it!"
But as for Pedro....
Interestingly enough there is basis for it. It was set up so early that I was rolling my eyes until we finally got the 'Sanji staring out to sea' scene.
When Pekoms starts Sulong-ing he talks about how only Pedro could get him to calm down.
Well...there it is.
Not that Oda needs to use this...AT ALL...but if he so chooses, he now has a dramatic reason for Pedro to be still kicking.
If Pedro was picked up by Mom's crew and after Luffy escaped, Pekoms went ballistic, him having said that out loud all exposition-like, gives the family plenty of good reason to bring Pedro by and have him calm down his buddy before he kills himself.
Oda doesn't need to do that...but he totally could. It would help ground the twist and give it a meaningful reason other than, "He's alive...yaaaaay."
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@Zik:
Hasn't it been Carrot supporters begging to stop all talk about Carrot in this thread?
Ppl who don't support Carrot just think it's a waste of time to discuss Carrot's chances but some of us still don't mind in pointing out the weak arguments.
No, people who believe Carrot are going to join are basically being run out of the thread by a few people who don't want that opinion to be discussed anymore because it's 'objectively wrong.'
Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Usopp, Sanji, Chopper, Robin, Franky, Brook, Jimbei, Carrot, Vivi, Smoker
"ONE PIECE, IT EXISTS" - The Great Pirate Edward Newgate
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I think it's fine to have that theory, but I don't think it should be considered the null hypothesis.
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
No, people who believe Carrot are going to join are basically being run out of the thread by a few people who don't want that opinion to be discussed anymore because it's 'objectively wrong.'
No, your not being run out of the thread at all, there disagreeing with you and arguing there point, we’ve done it for hundreds of characters, Carrot fans are the only ones who have acted like this is a witch hunt and persecution to simply not agree with them, I have no idea what your ideal form of this thread is, it’s a thread about arguing who will or will not join, a few of you carrot fans are starting to act like we’re crossing a line every time we disagree with you, just a few pages ago you guys called some people disagreeing with you hate speech, to me your the ones crossing a line
Not agreeing with someone and pointing out what you think are flaws in there logic is literally the entire point of this thread, what is it you want exactly
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No, your not being run out of the thread at all, there disagreeing with you and arguing there point, we’ve done it for hundreds of characters, Carrot fans are the only ones who have acted like this is a witch hunt and persecution to simply not agree with them, I have no idea what your ideal form of this thread is, it’s a thread about arguing who will or will not join, a few of you carrot fans are starting to act like we’re crossing a line every time we disagree with you, just a few pages ago you guys called some people disagreeing with you hate speech, to me your the ones crossing a line
Not agreeing with someone and pointing out what you think are flaws in there logic is literally the entire point of this thread, what is it you want exactly
I mean, I'm not the only person who feels that way, clearly, as I'm only echoing sentiments others have already expressed, but there are a handful of people in this topic who are not just disagreeing, but saying it shouldn't even be discussed anymore. If people could just debate ideas without trying to make it personal, that would certainly be great. And I wasn't referring to you in any way.
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
No, people who believe Carrot are going to join are basically being run out of the thread by a few people who don't want that opinion to be discussed anymore because it's 'objectively wrong.'
So it wasn't Carrot supporters saying to stop or put a pause on Carrot talk. Those were ppl who are trying to run Carrot supporters out of the thread cuz they're objectively wrong.
Got it.
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@Zik:
So it wasn't Carrot supporters saying to stop or put a pause on Carrot talk. Those were ppl who are trying to run Carrot supporters out of the thread cuz they're objectively wrong.
Got it.
They suggested it because of the way a few people were responding to any mention of Carrot.
Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Usopp, Sanji, Chopper, Robin, Franky, Brook, Jimbei, Carrot, Vivi, Smoker
"ONE PIECE, IT EXISTS" - The Great Pirate Edward Newgate
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@Vongola_Boss_XI:
They suggested it because of the way a few people were responding to any mention of Carrot.
Which was their choice.
Could've just ignored those ppl and kept posting about Carrot like some other posters did.
Discussion wise you either ignore that Carrot is barely focused on in the story when others bring it up or you come up with an adequate reply for it.
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The self-victimization is ridiculous
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I'm fine with Carrot talk because it's completely like Oda at this stage to say, "….Fuck it! Carrot, Yamato, AND Momo are joining! Nobody called it!"
But as for Pedro....
Interestingly enough there is basis for it. It was set up so early that I was rolling my eyes until we finally got the 'Sanji staring out to sea' scene.
When Pekoms starts Sulong-ing he talks about how only Pedro could get him to calm down.
Well...there it is.
Not that Oda needs to use this...AT ALL...but if he so chooses, he now has a dramatic reason for Pedro to be still kicking.
If Pedro was picked up by Mom's crew and after Luffy escaped, Pekoms went ballistic, him having said that out loud all exposition-like, gives the family plenty of good reason to bring Pedro by and have him calm down his buddy before he kills himself.
Oda doesn't need to do that…but he totally could. It would help ground the twist and give it a meaningful reason other than, "He's alive...yaaaaay."
I don't know about that. They're really going at it on his eyes and there's blood as they hold his head still. Once they can't see the Moon, the transformation is over going by Carrot's situation.
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If Pedro didn't die I would've probably considered him the strongest contender for the Strawhat crew up until Yamato arrived. Somehow he felt so right, I genuinely wanted to see him sail.
One of my favourite characters in the whole post-time skip.
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They're really going at it on his eyes and there's blood as they hold his head still.
It's tough to address this without coming off as condescending online. Not my intention. As a text-based interaction my generally chipper attitude isn't coming through so you'll have to trust me that I'm saying this in a friendly tone.
Oda can make literally anything happen in that amorphous cloud of smoke.
I keep going back to my 'manga artists are magnificent BS-artists' mantra because it's true.
Yep, maybe they're hacking his eyes out.
Maybe he missed and hit a limb.
Maybe he hit a family member by mistake.
Maybe he struck a conveniently-placed ketchup packet.
Maybe that wasn't intended to look bloody. (Oda doesn't color those)
My point is, all of those types of scenarios laden with character exposition "Strike his eyes so it looks like we're competent and nefarious villains, giving the reader the chance to imagine something horrible and debilitating to happen!" they're hocus-pocus. If it serves the story, Oda can cook up any explanation for what happened there. It's believing that kind of stuff that gets some people in trouble because they go down one path so long and hard, that when Oda pulls out the rug, they feel betrayed.
It will help you as a manga reader, to assume that everything you read, is bullshit or has another point of view. Oda's job every week, is to lie to us, so that he can flip the situation on its head and surprise us.
Not saying that happened here, but it totally could have. I want Pedro dead as much as the next person….as grim as that sounds...
You actually think this is possible?
Possible? At this stage in the game? Absolutely.
Likely? All three? Nah. Carrot and Yamato? sucks air through teeth I wouldn't count it out! Has zero to do with what I 'want/don't want' to happen. Just that it seems like something he'd be willing to do at this point. Wouldn't be the first time he made a crazeballs choice on a whim.
