Hiatus x Hiatus III: Goodnight, Sweet Princes

Wagomu

Hisoka is likely eliminating them because if he doesnt theres a chance that Chrollo could borrow some of their hatsus again making him very difficult to defeat, that was the core lesson learned from essentially dying once in their previous fight: dont fiight Chrollo when hes the one who controls all of the terms of the fight. This was also illustrated by the one scene of Chrollo ducking Hisoka until he gathered more abilities (the no way jose scene). As for Machi he obviously has a soft spot for her which may come back to bite him later on or he'll kill her near to last.

Plotwise it also serves to get Hisoka involved in the DC plot and setsup possible Kurapica team action.

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

Watch-man

@Razh:

So how does letting Machi live fit in that theory? Especially since she's the only one who knows he can pull a trick like that.

He does not care about them knowing about it as he does not plan to die again

When I was reading fight today it was pretty clear that Chrollo himself without all those puppets is pretty close in strength to Hisoka(more of a defense/counter type of fighter) so result was as clear as Chrollo stated at start.

All in all even if fight can be seen as bit pointless, still it was fun ride and was prelude to second fight that will probably kill both of them as I hope. I dont want Gon or anybody else than Chrollo to kill Hisoka now, especially as with last few chapters they were builded up even more than before to be arch nemesis for each other. Chrollo will be more emotional during their second fight as now instead of one he had two more old time Spiders killed..

I liked Shalnark.

parklane21

@Razh:

So how does letting Machi live fit in that theory? Especially since she's the only one who knows he can pull a trick like that.

I got nothing but the usual emotional stuff (he likes her) that others already gave. Supplanted by the fact that Machi knew of Texture Surprise but never told anyone about it. Though there's really nothing to that.

desa

@zeff:

A man gets his priorities straight when he comes back from the dead.

Meh. It's just petty from Hisoka and such a cheap way to link Hisoka to the spiders.

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@pariston_hill:

He still wants to fight Kuroro

He got his fight and lost. I would expect him to comment on it and move on. Not suddenly holding some petty grudge over it.
He is also planning on killing the spiders now (which he wasn't already interested in).

Kaptayn

First time that the title of a chapter describes exactly what I felt while reading it.

Don_Freecs

@parklane21:

I got nothing but the usual emotional stuff (he likes her) that others already gave. Supplanted by the fact that Machi knew of Texture Surprise but never told anyone about it. Though there's really nothing to that.

There's absolutely nothing implying that she told no one about Texture Surprise. And he didn't even use during the fight, he just used it to mask his injuries after he woke up.

Underworld1991

So have Uvo/Paku been replaced by new members and Hisoka doesn't plan on killing Machi? Or do you think he's saving her for last?

KageKageKing

So, technically Team Chrollo won, right?

LordPerucho

@Razh:

So how does letting Machi live fit in that theory? Especially since she's the only one who knows he can pull a trick like that.

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For some reason spoiler tabs exist. Learn to use them already.

Nope.

Heath Ledger mode on.

Vadth Bluelock

@Don_Freecs:

There's absolutely nothing implying that she told no one about Texture Surprise. And he didn't even use during the fight, he just used it to mask his injuries after he woke up.

She didn't tell anyone when he was with the spiders and its possible but unlikely that she mention it after he left. When he used Texture Surprise to change his prophecy, the narrative told us that the spiders has abilities only one or two other spiders knows about. The example used was that only Machi knew about Texture Surprise but she didn't realize it could be used in such a way.

Sheep

This post is deleted!

HaxeyeMihawk

@Wagomu:

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

I see where you're coming from in regards to Hisoka's character but I think this is him being realistic and not seeing it so much as nerfing Chrollo but instead viewing it as respecting Chrollo's caliber by not thinking it'd be a fair and winnable fight if he just allowed Chrollo to smorgasbord style pick and choose abilities from his crew. Hes definitely all for fighting Chrollo at full strength but that doesnt mean giving him full ability to pick the terms of the fight and what abilities he can borrow from the rest of the troupe.

Average

@Wagomu:

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

This whole situation makes me think of when we saw his internal monologue during Illumi and Killua's confrontation in the woods, where he was deciding what to do/who to kill based on what would give him the best fights. Maybe he's going after the spiders more because he was always planning on trying to kill them, and they're almost all going to give him a good fight. I don't think it has anything to do with lowering the amount of powerful abilities Chrollo can borrow. As for why he's attacking them now, I have no idea. Maybe he just needed something to do lol.

HaxeyeMihawk

@desa:

Meh. It's just petty from Hisoka and such a cheap way to link Hisoka to the spiders.

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He got his fight and lost. I would expect him to comment on it and move on. Not suddenly holding some petty grudge over it.
He is also planning on killing the spiders now (which he wasn't already interested in).

He lost a fight heavily stacked in Chrollos favor, it was depicted here (http://readms.com/r/hunter_x_hunter/351/3367/9 )that Chrollo literally avoided Hisoka in order to collect more abilities before his fight which suggests hes not so confident in his belief that he could just beat Hisoka anytime which is why Hisoka is now on the warpath to get a proper rematch when the odds are more evenly stacked by killing off some of Chrollos hatsu pool.

algebro

Personality-wise Hisoka was definitely out of character. While Kortopi and Shalnark could still use nen, they didn't have access to their hatsu so they were under a pretty significant handicap and not the type of foes Hisoka is generally interested in.
The only logical explanation would be that the spider hunt is nothing more than a gesture to make sure he can get a rematch with Chrollo, since there was no incentive for Chrollo to fight him again.

@Wagomu:

Now I'm just confused at the narrative point to this. Is Hisoka spider hunting because he's salty now? It seems really weird for him to pick up that slack from Kurapika. At least now we're starting to see how this all relates to the upcoming dark continent stuff, but the fight still feels wholly unnecessary, unless the point was to get Hisoka made about spiders, which I still am not sure if that was something he was planning on doing anyways, or only now that he was beaten like a noob. Neat fight, but plotwise, this is about a ¯_(ツ)_/¯/10 for me.

I wouldn't say the fight was unnecessary. It provided a resolution to Hisoka's major earlier motivation, a fight with Chrollo, while transitioning both characters into the dark continent arc that's starting.

Desperado

Machi felt out of character too. She used to be calm and collected now she looks like the angriest char ever

sandman

@Wagomu:

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

Perhaps Hisoka was not satisified that Chrollo chose Heavens Arena as a battle stage since it seems Hisoka thinks Heavens Arena is not the best place for serious fighting according to his words toward Gon in chapter 63.

Even if Hisoka intends to fight Chrollo again, Chrollo may escape from Hisoka as always. Hisoka probably made a decision to kill Spiders to make Chrollo mad and fight him again even if it means weakening his prey.

@Underworld1991:

Hisoka doesn't plan on killing Machi? Or do you think he's saving her for last?

I remember Hisoka said it'd be great if Machi chases him to the end of the earth after he kills Chrollo. Maybe Hisoka wants to see her face when he shows Chrollo's head just like he showed Kortopi's head to Shalnark.

LordPerucho

@Desperado:

Machi felt out of character too. She used to be calm and collected now she looks like the angriest char ever

She had a soft spot for Hisoka as Shal mentioned it, of course she was mad that Hisoka did a sneak attack on her.

Hisoka will regret not killing her, usually in Shounen it should mean Machi will kill Hisoka on the boat..

Wagomu

@algebro:

I wouldn't say the fight was unnecessary. It provided a resolution to Hisoka's major earlier motivation, a fight with Chrollo, while transitioning both characters into the dark continent arc that's starting.

It was definitely a dangling plot thread, but I feel like the way they went about it provided no resolution. Even if Hisoka won that scenario, it would have felt like Togashi ticking a box off a checklist, and not really affecting the character arcs or the narrative in any way. As it stands, though, Hisoka hasn't accomplished his goal, and it looks like Chrollo would hav been set on stealing from the princes regardless of his fight with Hisoka. Maybe it happened first so that Chrollo could free his schedule? Still, there's just something weak about the way this scene connected these characters to the arc, and it feels more like an excuse than a reason.

@sandman:

Perhaps Hisoka was not satisified that Chrollo chose Heavens Arena as a battle stage since it seems Hisoka thinks Heavens Arena is not the best place for serious fighting according to his words toward Gon in chapter 63.

Even if Hisoka intends to fight Chrollo again, Chrollo may escape from Hisoka as always. Hisoka probably made a decision to kill Spiders to make Chrollo mad and fight him again even if it means weakening his prey.

I actually like this explanation. This one's satisfying and fits with Hisoka's character, though it make me wonder why he hadn't tried it before.

TLC

So I guess the fight didn't have much point to it other than fanservice. I'm fine with Hisoka's revival but him killing two spiders afterwards is just ugh

I remember the deaths of the spiders in the York Shin arc which had dramatic weight and impact and felt organic. Here they're fridged just to make Hisoka look cool. This just feels like textbook Togashi getting tired of a plot thread and jumping onto something else that's totally random. Blegh.

Don_Freecs

@KageKageKing:

So, technically Team Chrollo won, right?

Yes.

@Wagomu:

Still, there's just something weak about the way this scene connected these characters to the arc, and it feels more like an excuse than a reason.

The journey to the DC organized by Kakin is viral throughout HxH world right now. It's not surprising at all that Kuroro plans to go in the ship heading there, furthermore, he's probably somehow linked to the DC.
And that was actually predictable.

King Cannon

@TLC:

So I guess the fight didn't have much point to it other than fanservice. I'm fine with Hisoka's revival but him killing two spiders afterwards is just ugh

I remember the deaths of the spiders in the York Shin arc which had dramatic weight and impact and felt organic. Here they're fridged just to make Hisoka look cool. This just feels like textbook Togashi getting tired of a plot thread and jumping onto something else that's totally random. Blegh.

I kinda have to agree there. Uvogin and Pakunoda's deaths were really memorable, whereas Kortopi and Shalnark just went out like thugs.

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@Wagomu:

I actually like this explanation. This one's satisfying and fits with Hisoka's character, though it make me wonder why he hadn't tried it before.

Well, with two members being unable to use Nen and separated from the rest, he just took the opportunity.

KageKageKing

HunterXHunter is one of those mangas where it is easy as hell to die. Come to think about it, since there were 12 legs and now 10, does this means they found a replacement to Pakunoda and Uvo?

Don_Freecs

@KageKageKing:

HunterXHunter is one of those mangas where it is easy as hell to die. Come to think about it, since there were 12 legs and now 10, does this means they found a replacement to Pakunoda and Uvo?

Kalluto Zoldyck. The other one is probably Abengane.

@King:

I kinda have to agree there. Uvogin and Pakunoda's deaths were really memorable, whereas Kortopi and Shalnark just went out like thugs.

There is still plenty of time to make their deaths memorable and sad.

KageKageKing

@Don_Freecs:

Kalluto Zoldyck. The other one is probably Abengane.

Wasn't Kalluto Hisoka's replacement?

maxterdexter

Hisoka doesn't know how many spiders there are, he migth be assuming that they got back to 12.

Paku and uvo's deaths had a few chapters to sink in, specially nobunaga's reaction, this is the chapter that happened, and we'll probably go back to gon or vacation killua or something else next chapter.

LordPerucho

@TLC:

So I guess the fight didn't have much point to it other than fanservice. I'm fine with Hisoka's revival but him killing two spiders afterwards is just ugh

I remember the deaths of the spiders in the York Shin arc which had dramatic weight and impact and felt organic. Here they're fridged just to make Hisoka look cool. This just feels like textbook Togashi getting tired of a plot thread and jumping onto something else that's totally random. Blegh.

Uvo died like a scrub, and Paku was a bit sad, though.

The whole point was to give Hisoka character development, it looks like he isnt gonna fuck around if he gets to face Chrollo again, the only way Hisoka could get development is if he lost, and he lost…badly.

For some people, Hisoka is also part of the Main Cast.

His nen got stronger to the point that he can heal himself with Texture Surprise and replace missing limbs with his nen, but some people believe he just became Netero level, lol.

Wagomu

@Don_Freecs:

The journey to the DC organized by Kakin is viral throughout HxH world right now. It's not surprising at all that Kuroro plans to go in the ship heading there, furthermore, he's probably somehow linked to the DC.
And that was actually predictable.

I mean the portrayal is weird. Like Chrollo just decided that the logical follow-up to beating up a clown was stealing from the main plot point. It feels as forced as this whole encounter felt. I mean You're right, Chrollo's a thief and he probably would have gotten around to this big global event, anyways, it's just that we didn't see him take time to reflect on what just happened, or giving a second thought to his next course of action. I guess it's the lack of breathing room for the character that makes the change of direction feel so awkward.

@King:

Well, with two members being unable to use Nen and separated from the rest, he just took the opportunity.

Again, that opportunistic quality doesn't suit Hisoka, even if he was trying to lure Chrollo. If he wasn't confident that he could beat them up at full power, then I'm not sure what chance he thought he stood against Chrollo. Especially Kurotopi, who's nen ability had really low combat potential.

KageKageKing

Personally using your nen that has property of a gum and rubber to replace his own texture sounds like an asspull kind of power-up. I mean, does gum and rubber works like that?

LordPerucho

@KageKageKing:

Personally using your nen that has property of a gum and rubber to replace his own texture sounds like an asspull kind of power-up. I mean, does gum and rubber works like that?

Remember when he stuck the ball on Razors fists by making his nen as strong as a rock? And Now Hisoka got a powerup…

UndeadFailure

@Wagomu:

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

Not all the time, they just have to be strong enough, or be part of a greater goal.

Wagomu

@KageKageKing:

Personally using your nen that has property of a gum and rubber to replace his own texture sounds like an asspull kind of power-up. I mean, does gum and rubber works like that?

The texture thing was already his power, though. Like that's one of his two powers, to use a thin surface to recreate any texture. He just put that over his bungee gum nen, formed onto his missing pieces, which I guess it could interact with since they're both nen powers.

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@UndeadFailure:

Not all the time, they just have to be strong enough, or be part of a greater goal.

His goal is clown boners. He has no reason to need to beat Chrollo otherwise, so there's no reason why he wouldn't want to fight him at full power and win.

UndeadFailure

I don't think hisoka got a permanent nen power up, it was just stronger during that one time it needed to activate while he was dead.

Hanz

@desa:

I'm not really sure why Hisoka is chasing the spiders. Doing something out of spite doesn't really seems to be his style and he has no particular to want to kill them all.

Phone guy is dead. I kinda liked him.

kinda obvious. he killed them because he doesn't want chrollo to use their ability when he fights him again. kurotopi's ability in particular played a major role in hisoka's defeat, as now without it that stamp ability is useless (unless chrollo carries human sized dolls with him).
shalnark's ability was kinda op aswell, i mean… all it takes is an anatana poke and you can turn even the strongest opponents into mindless drones. so it also made sense to kill him.
plus, if he had killed chrollo then they're gonna go after him anyways, so he might as well just kill them before they do.
yeah, i don't think this is spite at all. it's kinda like chess, he's taking out chrollo's pieces.

sandman

@KageKageKing:

HunterXHunter is one of those mangas where it is easy as hell to die.

I remember Togashi said, "I will kill any of my characters even if he is a protagonist. Just because he is a protagonist, it doesn't mean he can feel easy. (laugh)"

At this point, it seems Togashi is nearly opposite from Oda, who said, "I wanted to protect Luffy. And basically I don't want to kill any characters."

source: "Kuroko's Basketball Official Guidebook" (2012)　(It includes Togashi's interview.)
Asahi Evening Newspaper (1999)
Theater Culture Magazine "T" (2012)

Luca

@algebro:

Yes he has to keep his nen turned on indefinitely or he'll revert back to his original state

His original state is always there, he probably fills the missing parts of his body with physical manifastion of nen, and just adds texture on top.

Hanz

@LegendarySSJ4:

Poor Kortopi
http://i.imgur.com/k252GrM.jpg

source? or is this fanart?

UndeadFailure

@Wagomu:

The texture thing was already his power, though. Like that's one of his two powers, to use a thin surface to recreate any texture. He just put that over his bungee gum nen, formed onto his missing pieces, which I guess it could interact with since they're both nen powers.

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His goal is clown boners. He has no reason to need to beat Chrollo otherwise, so there's no reason why he wouldn't want to fight him at full power and win.

I'm just saying that there are cases where he was considering fighting someone not at peak. Killua for example, he already considers him to be ripe enough, even though Killua will probably be stronger as an adult.

Hanz

@Wagomu:

I dunno, Hisoka's always been the kind of guy to want to fight someone at peak strength. Killing off the spiders only weakens his prey, and that's just very unfitting.

not really. chrollo probably has tons of abilities in that book.
@desa:

He got his fight and lost. I would expect him to comment on it and move on. Not suddenly holding some petty grudge over it.
He is also planning on killing the spiders now (which he wasn't already interested in).

you're looking at it wrong. hisoka loves people who give him a challenge, if anything he wants to fight chrollo even more now that he almost killed him. and he might get some enjoyment out of killing the spiders who might also give him a run for his money.
it's not a petty grudge, it's hisoka's way of having fun.
@TLC:

I remember the deaths of the spiders in the York Shin arc which had dramatic weight and impact and felt organic. Here they're fridged just to make Hisoka look cool. This just feels like textbook Togashi getting tired of a plot thread and jumping onto something else that's totally random. Blegh.

"dramatic weight and impact" for kortopi? we barely knew him.

KageKageKing

@Hanz:

source? or is this fanart?

Yeah. There is two of those actually.

Razh

@LordPerucho:

Nope.

http://i.4cdn.org/a/1465486238011.png

Heath Ledger mode on.

More like Scumbag Steve mode.

!

LegendarySSJ4

@Hanz:

source? or is this fanart?

It's a parody of this page

!

Don_Freecs

@KageKageKing:

Wasn't Kalluto Hisoka's replacement?

Nobunaga
Karuto Zoldyck
Shalnark
Shizuku
Feitan

Bonorenof
Franklin
Kortopi
Machi
Phinks

so, we add Abengane.
and don't forget Kuroro. it makes it 12.

@Hanz:

kinda obvious. he killed them because he doesn't want chrollo to use their ability when he fights him again. kurotopi's ability in particular played a major role in hisoka's defeat, as now without it that stamp ability is useless (unless chrollo carries human sized dolls with him).

Kuroro's abilities in his Skill Hunter don't disappear anymore.
Remember Sun and Moon ? the guy was dead right ?
it means that Kortopi and Shalnark's abilities will get stronger.

Hanz

@Don_Freecs:

Kuroro's abilities in his Skill Hunter don't disappear anymore. Remember Sun and Moon ? the guy was dead right ? it means that Kortopi and Shalnark's abilities will get stronger.

that only happened once. chrollo said that usually once someone dies their ability disappears. so sun and moon is a rare case.

Razh

@Don_Freecs:

Kuroro's abilities in his Skill Hunter don't disappear anymore.
Remember Sun and Moon ? the guy was dead right ?
it means that Kortopi and Shalnark's abilities will get stronger.

Wasn't Sun and Moon one of the exceptions to the rule? Some Nen abilities become stronger after user's death, not all of them.

Kisoto

@Don_Freecs:

Kuroro's abilities in his Skill Hunter don't disappear anymore.
Remember Sun and Moon ? the guy was dead right ?
it means that Kortopi and Shalnark's abilities will get stronger.

I think it's that the original owner of the Nen (that was stolen) had a condition that would make his Nen stronger. So if it was engaged before his death - whether by him or Chrollo - and then he died, then it wouldn't matter for the death clause (not sure what else to call it) to engage as well. Unless I'm misunderstanding and it's that one of Chrollo's abilities is to make Nen stronger after death?

It's honestly very confusing even when Togashi is explaining it word-for-word. That fight made my head spin.

Don_Freecs

uhm ok. so let's assume, that Shalnark's hatsu could be stronger after his death because he was very mad when he's seen Kortopi's head ?

it makes sense.

LordPerucho

Abengane is the 10th Ryodan member.

KageKageKing

@Don_Freecs:

Nobunaga
Karuto Zoldyck
Shalnark
Shizuku
Feitan

Bonorenof
Franklin
Kortopi
Machi
Phinks

so, we add Abengane.
and don't forget Kuroro. it makes it 12.
.

Kuroro is the head. 1 spider with one head and 12 legs.

Hanz

@Don_Freecs:

uhm ok. so let's assume, that Shalnark's hatsu could be stronger after his death because he was very mad when he's seen Kortopi's head ?

it makes sense.

we can't even assume that, because not everyone who dies angry has his nen come back.
uvogin was pretty damn mad when he died, yet his nen didn't come back. neferpitou didn't die angry, yet his nen came back.
shalnark didn't even look angry when he saw topi's head, he seemed surprised more than anything that hisoka is alive.