With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shinobu Mahara (1): Jabberwok
Not voting (8): Huschel, le crystal, Kitsune Inferno, Shinobu Mahara, Shuhan, SomebodyUDon'tKnow, SpaceCowboy, Wooden_Giraffe
There are a little over 19 hours left in the day.
Throughout this month, we will be testing new features (like search) so you may experience some hiccups from time to time. We'll try to not be too disruptive...
Mafia 57: Keeping it Simple
-
-
You seem to have the worst grasp of the parameters of this game and explaining everything is a distraction from more meaningful discussion. You're also in the no-lynch-today group, which I see as some reason for suspicion.
It seems like part of that logic is based on you believing that the mafia don't know each other yet, but usually they are given a link to their com room so they can introduce themselves. Is there any other reason?
–---------------
@Shuhan: You seem to be under fire because of your stance on lynching. What do you make of this?
@SUDK: You mentioned on #83 the possibility of 3 wagons based on a previous Jabber post, and while you haven't voted, you already expressed the intention to if a strong wagon forms.
However, does this mean you agree with his logic and think that it is the best approach, or are you simply going along with the flow? -
Post #68- lucky in this situation would be hitting a player that is already protected, not other way around.
A doused (gasoline) player would never result in good things unless a mafia accidentally killed the other.Post #72- The only reason hypoclaiming wouldnt work is because mafia can easily compare which ones they have or havent targeted throughout everybodys posts. But however brcause the mafia cant communicate, wouldnt hypoclaiming be more viable? Not only that but when the firefighter dies we can go back and actually compare real data.
Sure we would only find out, which players have avoided being doused, which doesnt give members of town much.
But it might possibly give insight on which players might be targeted next, depend on the results of night 2 actions.Post #87
You’re welcome for day extend vote. Even though we had more than enough.
Simply saying that the results of night teo are more than likely going to be 2 doused players rather than 1.
2 mafia, 1 firefighter, 6 tree, albeit a slim difference. I think its safe to say 2 trees will almost certainly will be coated in gasoline.Post #92- Personally i feel like jabberwok has tried pushing hardcore for a D1 lynch.
Sure i got vote against by both huschel and jabs but from huschels perspective it was to push me further along.
And now that ive been trying a bit better than usual, thats no longer a problem.
And they are seemingly doing so to get information out of others instead of actively looking to kill, albeit wanting a lynch.Post #96-
Was under the impression that each mafia could choose one action out of the two that they have. Douse or kill.
I understand they cant kill unless a player is already doused, but yet again if mafia arent communicating. Then ones actions wouldnt effect the others, meaning 2 doused players not 1. Or did i just miss another thing in these walls of text, that makes me look like a idiot again?In other words: i find voting for the purpose of scumhunting/info is perfectly fine because they are more likely to remove their vote, compared to that of jabberwok, where given the explanation is basically what i did last game to foolio.
“I dont like your play style, you’re going down”. Sure, yet again another damn person says im confusing.
But i dony see how thats a valid arguement at this point. You can see i am going to the effort of trying to change that.
After extensively reading, people have asked me to explain things ive said they themselves are confused about.
But youre the only one actually complaining about it anymore.
Also, making discussion is always great, and nobody might have posted for a bit..However you coted me without even asking me anything to solidify/nullify your vote.
Seems a bit hypocritical doesnt it?Man, it is great to be back home..
-
@Shinobu:
**#1)**Post #68- lucky in this situation would be hitting a player that is already protected, not other way around.
A doused (gasoline) player would never result in good things unless a mafia accidentally killed the other.**#2)**Post #72- The only reason hypoclaiming wouldnt work is because mafia can easily compare which ones they have or havent targeted throughout everybodys posts. But however brcause the mafia cant communicate, wouldnt hypoclaiming be more viable? Not only that but when the firefighter dies we can go back and actually compare real data.
Sure we would only find out, which players have avoided being doused, which doesnt give members of town much.
But it might possibly give insight on which players might be targeted next, depend on the results of night 2 actions.
**#3)**Post #87
You’re welcome for day extend vote. Even though we had more than enough.
Simply saying that the results of night teo are more than likely going to be 2 doused players rather than 1.
2 mafia, 1 firefighter, 6 tree, albeit a slim difference. I think its safe to say 2 trees will almost certainly will be coated in gasoline.**#4)**Post #92- Personally i feel like jabberwok has tried pushing hardcore for a D1 lynch.
Sure i got vote against by both huschel and jabs but from huschels perspective it was to push me further along.
And now that ive been trying a bit better than usual, thats no longer a problem.
And they are seemingly doing so to get information out of others instead of actively looking to kill, albeit wanting a lynch.**#5)**Post #96-
Was under the impression that each mafia could choose one action out of the two that they have. Douse or kill.
I understand they cant kill unless a player is already doused, but yet again if mafia arent communicating. Then ones actions wouldnt effect the others, meaning 2 doused players not 1. Or did i just miss another thing in these walls of text, that makes me look like a idiot again?**#6)**In other words: i find voting for the purpose of scumhunting/info is perfectly fine because they are more likely to remove their vote, compared to that of jabberwok, where given the explanation is basically what i did last game to foolio.
“I dont like your play style, you’re going down”. Sure, yet again another damn person says im confusing.
But i dony see how thats a valid arguement at this point. You can see i am going to the effort of trying to change that.
After extensively reading, people have asked me to explain things ive said they themselves are confused about.
But youre the only one actually complaining about it anymore.
Also, making discussion is always great, and nobody might have posted for a bit..However you coted me without even asking me anything to solidify/nullify your vote.
Seems a bit hypocritical doesnt it?#1) So lucky for us, and not the Mafia?
#2) How would knowing who the firefighter targeted help us determine who will get targeted next? Are you assuming that those who avoided being primed are now larger targets?
#3) You misunderstand. The Mafia as a whole can only do one action per night: prime, or ignite. There is no way we get two primed targets in one night.
#4) Both of Huschel's votes were genuine, though. Not to get information out of players.
How does Jabberwok's vote look like he's trying to get information out of you? You mention yourself that he doesn't ask questions to you.
#5) The Mafia can communicate. It doesn't say that they can't anywhere. Why do you think this? You mentioned something similar in an earlier post, too.
#6) I don't think you understand (or maybe I don't?). He says that you're a liability, having to explain things to you instead of advancing discussion, and he's previously voiced his suspicion of the no-lynch-advocates.@Space_Cowboy:
@SUDK: You mentioned on #83 the possibility of 3 wagons based on a previous Jabber post, and while you haven't voted, you already expressed the intention to if a strong wagon forms.
However, does this mean you agree with his logic and think that it is the best approach, or are you simply going along with the flow?I don't agree with his logic, and am going with the flow there. I had no strong feelings about Shinobu (within the game, love you bro). His recent post (after yours) made me wary, though.
-
It seems like part of that logic is based on you believing that the mafia don't know each other yet, but usually they are given a link to their com room so they can introduce themselves. Is there any other reason?
If the role information is copied nearly verbatim from the link provided, as it looks to me it is, then communication is specified to occur only at night. We haven't had a night phase yet, and since sign in and Day 1 occurred immediately one after the other, I think there's a decent chance that they haven't communicated yet.
And even if they have, a more aggressive player and a more conservative one is a pretty likely possibility.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Thanks for that post, SUDK, that covers most of what I wanted to say.
I'll also add that both Huschel's pervious votes and mine are intended to exert pressure. Outlining my reasons for voting against you is essentially another way of communicating what behaviors of yours I want you to address.
I think calling your frequent misunderstandings an ongoing liability is justified given that this latest post of yours makes another mistake that SUDK's corrected.
-
So here's some of the thoughts I have on some people and things.
Nothing Huschel has done makes him seem scum to me. The hypo firefighter is a most risky move for either side to implement and mostly comes down to whether the firefighter is revealed before the arsonists make their first ignition. Still, I'd expect the arsonists to be against it, perhaps not publicly, but I'd be most surprised for one of them to put the idea forward. The lack of investigative roles makes me think they'll play conservatively. That being said, I don't think them going for the win once they think they have numbers is much of a risk, unless of course one of them is feeling the heat.
Wasn't super happy about him voting for inactives before the day was even half over, seems a bit soon, but he took it down after he showed so to each his own I guess.The no lynch crowd is a concern, as I really think it's detrimental for us not to use our lynches. I understand that no lynching day 1 might gain us an extra day to talk, but you're assuming a perfect storm for arsonists(no scum lynched, no primed lynched, complete firefighter failure). I don't necessarily think both mafia are on this train of thought, I'm in agreement with Kitsune's lone post of substance.
I don't get the assumption that the mafia don't know who each other are. The example role pms had an [insert player name] spot on the arsonist pm. Not sure if this was just missed or intentionally misleading. Care to go into detail about your assumption Jabs?
-
#1 Luck for us, a mafia killing another mafia wouldnt be considered lucky for them.
#2 I would suspect that people that arent primed are either mafia, or just targets that arent high enough on mafia’s hitlist to have been targeted yet. I guess that could be considered an assumption. But that is where i was going with that.
#3, maybe i should read the wiki page a third time, i dont understand why when i read i do constantly misinterpret.
(#4 + post #105) Im not exactly sure what i can do if its a constant. A lot of the time it just seems that i overwhelm myself with a lot of the reading at once, and pay the price for it later in the form of votes by people early game, in most games of which im involved.
I guess i did word things wrong in terms of: getting information - exerting pressure to recieve wanted goal
Warranted, by all means. Liability, yeah i can see that perspective.
Not sure what else i you’d like me to do about it though. I can only read the same thing so many times..–- Update From New Post Merge ---
#5, not exactly sure why i think this, but from now on that wont be a problem.
Will go back and try to remember where i pulled that from.@wooden and jabberwok, in terms of #6. I understand that a no lynch advocate seems bad to both of you.
Im not going to change my views accordingly, even though i get why its frowned upon.
I simply am thinking more long term. By day 2 the first of trees my very well begin to die.In my head; day 1, no lynch. Day 2, 0-1 doused, possible information on who is targeted.
Which would give us some actual lead, however possibly outing firefighter for a N2 kill.
But if firefighter doesnt reveal themselves D2, then we could potentially show 2 people that have been targeted on those nights. Which would not only clear those people but give us a better idea on who might be mafia.Rough part im not so sure of:
but if the firefighter is unsuccessful in stopping a player from being doused, then you have already found the potential next target. But if im not mistaken you arent told if a player has or hasnt been primed, so i guess not? -
I don't want to post much right now because I'm about to go to bed. I'll try to give more input in ~6 hours. Anyway, here's some essentials:
Shinobu's replies to my inquiries have quelled some of my issues which is why he went down on my list of priorities.
I very strongly disagree with SpaceCowboy's assessment that stumps might be detrimental but he argues his point and I suppose he is allowed to have a different opinion. The claim that je thought I had been lying with my rules quote is still fishy though.
Shuhan has been absent for what, 48 hours? I'd been waiting for some answers but so far no luck.
Vote: Shuhan
I swear I have my reasons and you can probably figure them out by reading my posts. I'll build more of a case tomorrow.
@SUDK: You keep asking people who they are willing to vote for. I'd rather you give your own stance than fish for a possible wagon.
@Wooden: I'm happy you're the one to bring up the fact about arsonists knowing each other (most likely). I was about to propose following Jab's suggestion and lynch everybody who did not properly read the setup. I'd probably have to lynch myself sooner or later.
-
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shinobu Mahara (1): Jabberwok
Shuhan (1): Huschel
Not voting (7): le crystal, Kitsune Inferno, Shinobu Mahara, Shuhan, SomebodyUDon'tKnow, SpaceCowboy, Wooden_Giraffe
There are 15 hours left in the day.
-
that the mafia don't know who each other are. The example role pms had an [insert player name] spot on the arsonist pm. Not sure if this was just missed or intentionally misleading. Care to go into detail about your assumption Jabs?
Shoot, I did miss that part. I'll have to rethink things.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@Shinobu:
In my head; day 1, no lynch. Day 2, 0-1 doused, possible information on who is targeted.
Which would give us some actual lead, however possibly outing firefighter for a N2 kill.
But if firefighter doesnt reveal themselves D2, then we could potentially show 2 people that have been targeted on those nights. Which would not only clear those people but give us a better idea on who might be mafia.Got another misinterpretation for you: the firefighter doesn't know if their dousing did anything until the arsonists ignite their targets. They're essentially a delayed result Doctor, just like the arsonists are delayed result Mafia. So the Firefighter would only find out if they succeeded if the less-than-expected number of Trees die after ignition, and even then they'll probably only have a list of possible innocents instead of anything concrete.
-
Okay, so here we go. Issues I have with Shuhan:
#35: I had asked about when (if ever) the firefighter should reveal themselves and Shuhan's answer wasn't particularly interesting but it was non-committal. He then asks me right back.
#38: Shuhan asks a rules question about doused stumps that really doesn't seem to matter too much (Galaxy's answer post #41 didn't actually specifically address the question - at least in my mind - but Shuhan didn't seem to care).
#40: He concedes that 'the vote is our only real weapon against those dastards' yet he doesn't want to lynch today.
In the same post he says 'we need to keep our numbers high'. In this particular setup people don't even die for a while so our voting power is higher than usual.Overall, Shuhan's posts have a tendency to distract and he doesn't take a clear stance besides no lynching which contradicts his assertion that lynching is all we have. Also, he hasn't been posting for way too long. His last post doesn't even count because it's just an excuse.
Tbh, I thought there would be a little bit more. I asked him this: 'Do you think it is a Forest player's duty to appear not scummy?' for a reason but I can't figure out why anymore…
So let me say that I would also be fine lynching SpaceCowboy today. He's misread/misinterpreted/ignored parts of my post at least twice:
- he tries to frame me for role fishing about the firefighter and later retracts
- the thing about me 'lying' about a rule citation that was already brought up
Twisting other people's words to frame them is a huge red flag.
But SpaceCowboy is - at least right now - more active than Shuhan so I'd still prefer to lynch Shuhan. Even if stumps can still contribute.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Oh, and will be busy from 7am to 1pm (east coast). I think the day lasts a little linger than that but I might cut it close. Changing my vote should be doable.
-
@Shinobu:
In my head; day 1, no lynch. Day 2, 0-1 doused, possible information on who is targeted.
Which would give us some actual lead, however possibly outing firefighter for a N2 kill.
But if firefighter doesnt reveal themselves D2, then we could potentially show 2 people that have been targeted on those nights. Which would not only clear those people but give us a better idea on who might be mafia.How exactly are we supposed to gain information Day 2 based on who was primed? We won't know who was primed until after they've already been ignited.
-
Finally have a chamce to post. My apologies.
Huschel: The townie acting as scum question is a loaded one, considering it always seems like pepole twist me into being scummy. Jokes aside, a townies first responsibility is to scum hunt and find the arsonists, not distract from that issue.
Now, why would I advocate no lynch for today? No matter what, someone is going to be doused, be they stumped or not. I understand the theory that the arsonists might play the long game and wait till they have a substantial amout primed, but that theory is flawed in the fact that we really don't know what they are going to do. In the end, we could end up cutting our noses to spite our faces and Id rather not do that.
So why wait till tomorrow to lynch? Well just as we have done today, we have an entire day of discussion to work with that can be used to find the scum. The difference is that tomorrow, we still will have a full gambit of players to vote as opposed to more than likely hitting a tree vote.
-
@Wooden:
I don't get the assumption that the mafia don't know who each other are. The example role pms had an [insert player name] spot on the arsonist pm. Not sure if this was just missed or intentionally misleading. Care to go into detail about your assumption **Jabs?**Actually, I made this same mistake. Knowing that the Mafia know who each other doesn't change much in my opinion, though. I still feel as if they'd act as Town until they at least have a chance to communicate, rather than know who the other is. I don't think this information changes much, but it's good to know. I don't think that they'd have specifically taken opposing viewpoints this early in the game, especially with no discussion time.
@Huschel: I've only asked yourself and Jabberwok about your votes. You I asked because I was trying to understand the reasons behind your two votes. Jabberwok I asked because he'd made a point that I was confirming his stance on (no-lynch-advocates being targets). I'm fishing for a wagon because I want a lynch, and I want to see what the consensus is.
I'll concede that most of my views haven't been my own, and they've relied on the analysis/questioning from others. But when you agree with someone else's view and analysis, and can't think of a way to further pursue that, why bother? As long as I mention where I stand, it should be alright. It's not as if I'm not asking my own questions, or trying to clarify things.
On that note, I agree that Shuhan's suspicious, but personally Space is more dangerous to me. His thinking you were lying is still really rubbing me the wrong way. I can't really explain why, but I really don't like it.
How likely do you think it is for both Mafia to be advocating for no-lynches?
Do you think inactives are more dangerous than the Mafia? Being a distraction means that Shuhan should be lynched more than Space, who is legitimately acting scummy?I want to suspect Shinobu, but I feel like I'm just suspecting him based on the previous game and nothing more, due to it being the same reasons.
Vote lynch: SpaceCowboy
@Space: Have you had time to mull the idea over yet? You never answered my question in Post #75.
-
If the role information is copied nearly verbatim from the link provided, as it looks to me it is, then communication is specified to occur only at night. We haven't had a night phase yet, and since sign in and Day 1 occurred immediately one after the other, I think there's a decent chance that they haven't communicated yet.
And even if they have, a more aggressive player and a more conservative one is a pretty likely possibility.
I was about to warn you on this, but Wooden already did.
If you are going to follow the wiki, then the role PM of the arsonists tells them who their partner is. There's also the chance that the mod allowed them to introduce themselves in a separate thread without further communication because that's what is usually done.
It seems like a big part of your argument is based on them not knowing this, but that is unlikely. How does this change your views?(1) So let me say that I would also be fine lynching SpaceCowboy today. He's misread/misinterpreted/ignored parts of my post at least twice:
- he tries to frame me for role fishing about the firefighter and later retracts
(2) - the thing about me 'lying' about a rule citation that was already brought up
Twisting other people's words to frame them is a huge red flag.
But SpaceCowboy is - at least right now - more active than Shuhan so I'd still prefer to lynch Shuhan. Even if stumps can still contribute.
Besides this, I can't get behind your reasons to vote on Shuhan
(1) Lol, you are the one that started making questions about the Firefighter and then purposed a senseless Hypo strategy that multiple people have shut down.
(2) I already admit that it was a mistake on my part from not reading the "example role PM" part of the wiki. If I had scummy intents I would have avoided all of this confusion by simply saying "sorry, I didn't paid enough attention" and at most people would be pissed off at me for being distracted.
I didn't twist anything. I'm trying to understand your reasons for a vote on Shuhan, but I honestly don't get it. #35 and #38 are regular posts.
Him claiming that the vote is our only weapon doesn't contradict his stance at all.
Shuhan - "Since there is no investigation and only a firefighter, the vote is our only real weapon against those dastards. I understand your skepticism, but we need to keep our numbers high. At this point so early in the game, it's hard to tell what to do. We need more people to post."He's just stating the obvious that we won't have any cops or trackers to help us, and then claiming that he prefers to keep everyone alive for today in order to delay a do or die scenario. I understand his stance since I've advocated the same thing.
@SomebodyUDon'tKnow:
@Space: Have you had time to mull the idea over yet? You never answered my question in Post #75.
I mean, I already answered this. Twice actually. On #69 and #76. I even quoted you.
I was mostly thinking purely from a numbers perspective in 69 and then reconsidered on 76 because of a reason I hadn't thought about: "Also, if we lynch someone today, we do increase the chances of the firefighter protecting someone doused. "
Basically, while I still think the cons barely outweight the pros, it's not enough reason for me to stand in the way of a lynch when the majority of players has already claimed that they would want one.
–-------------------------------
Vote Lynch: Le Crystal I'll open up another vote possibility since the day is near the end.
A lot of people have complained about chasing possible inactives, and while Le Crystal has showed up a couple of times, I worry that he may not show up to vote, even though he claimed he would like a lynch.
Voting him now would still enable him to be around and participate, but it would nullify the risk of him not showing up to vote in future days which can be really dangerous to the Forest.
- he tries to frame me for role fishing about the firefighter and later retracts
-
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shinobu Mahara (1): Jabberwok
Shuhan (1): Huschel
SpaceCowboy (2): SomebodyUDon'tKnow, Wooden_Giraffe
le crystal (1): SpaceCowboy
Not voting (4): le crystal, Kitsune Inferno, Shinobu Mahara, Shuhan
There are less than 3 hours left in the day.
Note: Updated to account for Wooden's vote below.
-
I get that Le crys isn’t here, which makes her as bad as a no Lynch advocate, but adding a 4th wagon at this point is detrimental only 3 hrs or so left. Honesty SuDK starting a third was excessive as is.
Vote Lynch: Space Cowboy
-
And it's still the one with the most reasonable reason.
SUDK voted for me because I didn't answer a question… that I did answer. I don't buy Huschel's vote on Shuhan. I already explained why.
The only one I could see myself voting would be the one on Shinobu. -
I was about to warn you on this, but Wooden already did.
If you are going to follow the wiki, then the role PM of the arsonists tells them who their partner is. There's also the chance that the mod allowed them to introduce themselves in a separate thread without further communication because that's what is usually done.
It seems like a big part of your argument is based on them not knowing this, but that is unlikely. How does this change your views?Revising my thinking puts me closer to Kitsune's earlier statements. While the arsonists may or may not have communicated directly to fully coordinate their positions, it's easy enough for them to act just based on one another's posts. I'm tempted to still think they might split as one for/one against, but at this point I'd rather be cautious to avoid making too many assumptions.
Anyways, I'm not terribly suspicious of Space right now but I do see his accusers' points. I'll change my vote in a bit of the wagon gets more steam (and if Shinobu's doesn't).
-
And it's still the one with the most reasonable reason.
SUDK voted for me because I didn't answer a question… that I did answer. I don't buy Huschel's vote on Shuhan. I already explained why.
The only one I could see myself voting would be the one on Shinobu.So what’s your opinion on Shinobu? Would you have voted him if he’d had more votes?
-
So what’s your opinion on Shinobu? Would you have voted him if he’d had more votes?
I have some fear that his lack of grasp of the rules might influence his playstyle and affect the Forest negatively. If he can't keep track of the number of players doused/ready to be put on fire (in theory) he may not act when he absolutely needs to in order to help the Forest.
He seems like a passive player which I consider counter productive.
At the same time, I'm not a big fan of voting someone off simply because they have a different playstyle. Feels dirty.I consider that both he and Le Crystal might be detrimental on the long run if they don't show up to vote, but at this point I have more trust in Shinobu to be around then Le Crys.
My criteria right now is based on the chance of us getting fucked when we need someone to urgently vote. -
Sidebar: can we please refer to the firefighter's work as "dousing" and the arsonists readied victims as "primed"? Saying the arsonists douse people is just begging for extra confusion.
-
Oh God, please yes.
I'll just specify every single time.
-
Space I get and actually agree that crys is more detrimental then Shinobu right now, but you claim that they both are. Starting a fourth wagon with so little time left is pretty much the same as pushing for a no lynch, except of course it causes you to appear in favor of a lynch.
And honestly Kitsune is just as much if not more of a concern then crys. As he stated that lynching should be the main priority but hasn’t really given any suspects or put down a vote. Why is crys the only one getting your attention? -
She isnt the only one getting the attention.
It just seems like she will be more absent than the rest. Voting her off still allows her to participate without jeopardazing our chances of not managing to lynch someone. -
I'm leaving for the rest of the day in a few minutes. Someone change their vote or I'm voting Space.
-
At this point I’m willing to vote Shinobu as well. At the very least his lack understanding the parameters tells me he isn’t our firefighter.
-
Alright, I'll change.
**Vote Lynch: Unvote Le Crystal
Vote Lynch: Shinobu Mahara**
-
Unvote
Vote Lynch: Shinobu Mahara -
Oh? Alright I'll stay with mine. Good luck to us!
-
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shinobu Mahara (3): Jabberwok, Wodden, SpaceCowboy
Shuhan (1): Huschel
SpaceCowboy (1): SomebodyUDon'tKnow
Not voting (4): le crystal, Kitsune Inferno, Shinobu Mahara, Shuhan
Like 2 hours left?
-
More like an hour and 20 minutes.
Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
-
Mobile again. I can answer/clarify everything tomorrow, I have a feeling I won't die tonight.
Unvote
Vote Lynch: Shinobu MaharaShinobu's still third on my list and I admit I have some trouble following his thought process sometimes. If he gets stumped at least I'll know it to be worthwile to work it out.
-
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shinobu Mahara (4): Jabberwok, Wooden_Giraffe, SpaceCowboy, Huschel
SpaceCowboy (1): SomebodyUDon'tKnow
Not voting (4): le crystal, Kitsune Inferno, Shinobu Mahara, Shuhan
About 40 minutes left in the day.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Just a heads-up to all that I will have to get back to work in a few minutes and will not be present at Day's end. Galaxy may or may not be able to be here himself. One of us will end the day as soon as we can.
-
Well… You foresters didn't lynch anybody. I guess I have to delay my building plans... The uncertainty isn't fun.
You have 24 hours to send in any night actions.
Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
-
As trees, you spent the whole night standing in place. I spent the night planning to build something in your forest. How about one of you give me an incentive to do the right thing?
Oh… did something happen in the night?
! I'm not sure. There was a pipeline spill in the forest a few weeks ago, so I have no idea if that smell is from the spill, or if it's coming from one of you…
!
Day 2 has now begun. You have 48 hours to achieve a lynch. (3:15 EDT on Tuesday) With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Not Voting (9): SUDK, SpaceCowboy, Jabberwok, Shuhan, Huschel, Shinobu Mahara, Kitsune Inferno, Wooden_Giraffe, le Crystal
-
Well, the lynch as failed.
@Shinobu: How do you feel about the position in which you were last Day? You were one vote away from being lynched.
@Shuhan: You were arguably the least pro-lynch person in the group, alongside Shinobu. How do you feel about this result?
@Huschel: You changed your vote but weren't around for the discussion that almost lynched Shinobu. What would you have said if you had been around at that point?
@SUDK: Even if you completely missed my answer to your question, you ended up leaving a vote on me, which was a (third) wagon that would hardly gain traction, especially because you werent here to advocate fo it. Do you feel like your vote was wasted?
-
Sigh, that's frustrating.
Ok, everyone needs to agree we need to lynch someone tonight or we'll have officially wasted one of our only weapons. That's unacceptable.
Kitsune: you weren't around much yesterday to give too much input but you've said you'll be more available going forward. What are your reads on the previous day's events?
crys: will you be around more? We can't have any dead weight since lynches are already fairly hard to achieve with our split time zones.
-
Today (in game) I'm gonna be largely inactive. D3 I'll be back to normal.
Sorry for missing the end of D1.@Space: I don't feel it was wasted, no. I showed my stance clearly.
I would have hammered Shinobu had I been online.
-
@SUDK: And may I know why that is?
You had never confronted me about anything, and then suddenly lay a vote on me without explaining why. In that post the only thing you said was that I didn't answer a question… which I did. I guess #99 serves as enough justification, but I want to hear that directly from you. -
I feel like the forest got too close to doing something they wouldnt have liked.
I might have been 1 vote away and being a stump might not be so bad, wasnt on a lot by the end of the day.
However, i was around enough to be ready to claim, if needed to. And instead i didnt have to at all because of how it went all went down. All in all, i feel lucky that i didnt get lynched, and i would like to think mafia didnt bother priming me considering that i seem to be main lynch interest at the current time.Man, it is great to be back home..
-
@Shinobu:
I feel like the forest got too close to doing something they wouldnt have liked.
I might have been 1 vote away and being a stump might not be so bad, wasnt on a lot by the end of the day.
However, i was around enough to be ready to claim, if needed to. And instead i didnt have to at all because of how it went all went down. All in all, i feel lucky that i didnt get lynched, and i would like to think mafia didnt bother priming me considering that i seem to be main lynch interest at the current time.I'm sorry, what? You're soft-claiming firefighter but decided that, even at one vote from being lynched, you didn't need to claim? You were counting on inactivity being high enough that the remaining people who had expressed a willingness to lynch yesterday weren't around to do it? And you're saying that one reason you survived is because the arsonists weren't interested in thinning the forest.
Sure, dude.
-
Shinobu, why on earth would you claim now? There isn't a single vote currently on you?
-
How is anything i said, any different from claiming town role amongst any other game?
Im simply saying in my opinion, 1 forest member down is something people wouldnt want, considering that votes are precious to us.
I was indeed relying on inactivity, it runs quite the risk but it worked didnt it?
Im saying that had any mafia been online (that havent already voted against me) would have hammered me for sure, because of the very reason of people wanting a first day lynch, quite a lot might i add.
But not enough to actually execute it/me.. seems a bit to me like we need to call upon others to make them less inactive so you can actually pass a vote.Im not saying that i thing the mafia arent thinking of thinning the crowd. I just think the mafia wouldnt have gone to the effort of priming someone that was already being looked badly upon considering it would potentially waste their action.
Due to the fact that i may be lynch today by you guys if that was the case.
Dont you think that the mafia would perhaps try to go for somebody that is most likely a safe prime?
I understand my views on how the mafia will go about their business is different now, but yeah. -
Sorry, I meant to make it in before the hammer dropped but I overslept.
My main issue with yesterday was why on earth we wound up wifh four wagons and I think Im going to be focusing my efforts when I get online on those who started them. Thats utterly ridiculpus especially so late in the game.
That said, I also suspect at least one, if not both, of our arsonists stayed off of the Shinobu wagon. Im currently very suspicious of Shinobu and Space for those reasons.
Hopefully I can inpit more soon and Shuhan and le crys can join in as well. Sorry for the inactivity.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Sorry on phone. Suspicoous of Shinobi and Space for the multiple wagons. I am incapable of typing.
-
@SUDK:
How likely do you think it is for both Mafia to be advocating for no-lynches?
Do you think inactives are more dangerous than the Mafia? Being a distraction means that Shuhan should be lynched more than Space, who is legitimately acting scummy?Unlikely. It was Space, Shuhan and Shinobu who did that, right? Space posted later when several people had already stated that lynching would be better. If his partner had already advocated a no-lynch, I don't think he would have done the same. Thanks for making me type that out because it means that I find it unlikely that Space is scum buddies with Shuhan or Shinobu. But unlikely doesn't mean impossible.
The mafia kills us. Inactives just make me wonder why I'm bothering.
Mafia makes us lose. Inactives make us not win.–-
So let me say that I would also be fine lynching SpaceCowboy today. He's misread/misinterpreted/ignored parts of my post at least twice:
- he tries to frame me for role fishing about the firefighter and later retracts
(1) Lol, you are the one that started making questions about the Firefighter and then purposed a senseless Hypo strategy that multiple people have shut down.
Well, let's have a look then.
Shuhan, when if ever do you think the Firefighter should reveal themselves?
It's really up to the firefighter. I personally wouldn't want them to out themselves though. Same question Huschel, also, How do you feel about the lynch/no lynch issue?
@Huschel: Why are you so insistent on the Fire fighter revealing himself?
You made that suggestion on your first post of the Day, and now you are suggesting the Hypo scenario, which is frankly useless because the role of the firefighter is not investigatory. If anything, it allows the mafia to know if one of their Night targets for dousing is safe. It tells the town nothing.In my original question I did not ask for anybody to reveal themselves. You even agreed with that later on. Shuhan's answer didn't give anything away and if it had then that'd be on him.
So you first claim that I insist on the firefighter revealing themselves. And then you follow that with bringing up my hypo strategy which has nothing to do with the firefighter putting themselves in danger. There is no reason to link those two arguments together like that except for trying to make it seem like I am fishing for the firefighter. This is the misinterpretation I mentioned or assuming it was intentional I'd call it misrepresentation. Whatever the words are, it feels like you were really trying to make me look like scum to the rest of town when there wasn't anything there. And that is a mafia move.(2) I already admit that it was a mistake on my part from not reading the "example role PM" part of the wiki. If I had scummy intents I would have avoided all of this confusion by simply saying "sorry, I didn't paid enough attention" and at most people would be pissed off at me for being distracted.
I can follow your argument here and I might just be annoyed because I mentioned that rules part three times and it still didn't seem to be enough. It's an open setup. Everybody should do their homework and know exactly how it works. Of course, some people just want to watch the world burn. Anyway, you read my statement and assumed that I was lying instead of checking the rules again. I don't understand that. Lying is not something a townie player is supposed to do. I guess you would have called me out on it later at some point, maybe.
@Huschel: You changed your vote but weren't around for the discussion that almost lynched Shinobu. What would you have said if you had been around at that point?
I made sure to say all I had to say before I left. Shuhan showed up after I was gone though so I would have tried engaging with him more. I would have agreed with Wooden that you starting a 4th wagon was unwise. Other than that I might have made aggressive passive-aggressive posts about people who didn't vote but I am making up for that today.
–-
@Shinobu:
I feel like the forest got too close to doing something they wouldnt have liked.
I might have been 1 vote away and being a stump might not be so bad, wasnt on a lot by the end of the day.
However, i was around enough to be ready to claim, if needed to. And instead i didnt have to at all because of how it went all went down. All in all, i feel lucky that i didnt get lynched, and i would like to think mafia didnt bother priming me considering that i seem to be main lynch interest at the current time.For everybody, including Shinobu:
The first bolded part implies that Shinobu is a tree. The second bolded part does suggest that Shinobu would have claimed firefighter because any other claim wouldn't change anything. So I can see why people are questioning him about that. But in my opinion there's nothing there.
–-
Finally have a chamce to post. My apologies.
Huschel: The townie acting as scum question is a loaded one, considering it always seems like pepole twist me into being scummy. Jokes aside, a townies first responsibility is to scum hunt and find the arsonists, not distract from that issue.
I take it you're saying that a townie acting like scum would be a distraction. That's probably true. It's interesting that a stumped player wouldn't need to worry about looking like scum.
Now, why would I advocate no lynch for today? No matter what, someone is going to be doused, be they stumped or not. I understand the theory that the arsonists might play the long game and wait till they have a substantial amout primed, but that theory is flawed in the fact that we really don't know what they are going to do. In the end, we could end up cutting our noses to spite our faces and Id rather not do that.
Can you rephrase that bolded part for me, please?
Also, I'm assuming the arsonists will not be wasting night actions by igniting more often than they have to. I'm preparing for the case I see as most likely and as it is also the worst one I don't see an issue with that.So why wait till tomorrow to lynch? Well just as we have done today, we have an entire day of discussion to work with that can be used to find the scum. The difference is that tomorrow, we still will have a full gambit of players to vote as opposed to more than likely hitting a tree vote.
Well, according to my theory, we will have another full day tomorrow with as many players contributing to the discussion as there are today. See you all tomorrow, then. No wait, that's a horrible idea.
Also, inactives don't contribute a vote. We have a couple. Why did you not go after them?
How original is it to still have this in my signature 6 years later?
-
To answer your last question, it would have gone against what I was advocating all day yesterday if I lynched yesterday, but the several wagons business was informing at least.
As for the dousing wordage, I meant to say primed my apologies for any confusion.
I feel more comfortable with lynching today, especially this one.
vote lynch: Shinobu Mahara
The real point of me going for no lynch yesterday was to really gage reactions from other players. Don't get me wrong, I never lied and wanted a no lynch yesterday, but it was interesting to see who agreed with my position. Shinobu was a prime example and now with this ridiculous soft claim, not to mention the wording feels all wrong.
Huschel: why do you believe there is nothing there with Shinobu? For someone who wants tou hound me to near lynch, going soft here seems unlike you.
-
To answer your last question, it would have gone against what I was advocating all day yesterday if I lynched yesterday, but the several wagons business was informing at least.
Your reason for no lynching was the fact that you wanted more people capable of voting today. Lynching a lurker would have had that same effect. So no, that would not have gone against your stance from yesterday.
What practical information have you gleamed from the several wagons forming?As for the dousing wordage, I meant to say primed my apologies for any confusion.
That is not what I meant. You wrote that somebody was going to be primed no matter if they were stumped or not? As in if we had lynched somebody to a stump they might have been primed?
I feel more comfortable with lynching today, especially this one.
Why?
The real point of me going for no lynch yesterday was to really gage reactions from other players. Don't get me wrong, I never lied and wanted a no lynch yesterday, but it was interesting to see who agreed with my position. Shinobu was a prime example and now with this ridiculous soft claim, not to mention the wording feels all wrong.
This is it? You wanted a no lynch and you wanted to see how others would react to your stance of wanting a no lynch. Which to you was a reasonable stance to have but because Shinobu has agreed with your stance that makes him suspicious? More like an easy target. You could have lynched him yesterday but now you got an extra night to do your thing.
Huschel: why do you believe there is nothing there with Shinobu? For someone who wants tou hound me to near lynch, going soft here seems unlike you.
I stated how Shinobu's post was easy to be misinterpreted. I can 100% see Shinobu thinking that claiming Tree would make some sort of difference. He didn't actually imply that he was the firefighter but Jabberwock and Wooden both understood the post as such. I despise misunderstandings and am trying to nip this one in the bud. Or maybe Shinobu is the firefighter. But Space would tell us that we shouldn't talk about that.
Vote Lynch: Shuhan
I am even more comfortable doing this than I was yesterday. We're about halfway through the day, by the way. Kitsune, crys, find a way to put down a vote please.
How original is it to still have this in my signature 6 years later?
-
Alright so I agree that Shinobu is likely not primed, either due to being mafia or having a huge target on his back. At some point and time I might start considering who's more likely to be primed when deciding who to vote, as I'd rather accidentally lynch a primed townie then a non-primed one, but not this soon.
@Space:@SUDK: Even if you completely missed my answer to your question, you ended up leaving a vote on me, which was a (third) wagon that would hardly gain traction, especially because you werent here to advocate fo it. Do you feel like your vote was wasted?
Seriously? This coming from the guy who started a 4th wagon.
@Kitsune: Yesterday you were very much in favor of a lynch, I get that you overslept but you have to understand how bad that looks, your only saving grace at this point is that crys still hasn't showed up since her first post and is the biggest inactive liability at this point. Otherwise I'd see you as the top inactive target. -
Sorry on phone. Suspicoous of Shinobi and Space for the multiple wagons. I am incapable of typing.
Seriously? This coming from the guy who started a 4th wagon.
I can understand people being suspicious because of that, but I was here to defend my wagon and change my vote any time it was warranted.
That's a little different than creating a wagon with few chances of success and go away.I stay by my actions. A lot of my argumments were on how inactivity could end up bitting us in the ass, and if anything, what happened last Day is enough evidence.
Well, let's have a look then.
But Space would tell us that we shouldn't talk about that.
Yes.
This can't be hard to understand God dammit.If you are a tree, what the Firefighter does or doesn't, doesn't concern you at all.
You aren't going to gain extra information that's important in Scum hunting if you know who the Fire fighter targeted on N1, 2, 3 and Nπ.
Leave the bloody man to do his job in peace and don't bother him.In a normal game you can think about how you're going to make a tracker or a cop give his info out without risks, but you don't bother the bloody doctor. You trust him to do his job in a correct and informed way, even if he ends up not protecting anyone.
In this game the only guys that have any interest in knowing who the f the Fire fighter is, are the arsonists.In my original question I did not ask for anybody to reveal themselves. You even agreed with that later on. Shuhan's answer didn't give anything away and if it had then that'd be on him. So you first claim that I insist on the firefighter revealing themselves. And then you follow that with bringing up my hypo strategy which has nothing to do with the firefighter putting themselves in danger. There is no reason to link those two arguments together like that except for trying to make it seem like I am fishing for the firefighter. This is the misinterpretation I mentioned or assuming it was intentional I'd call it misrepresentation. Whatever the words are, it feels like you were really trying to make me look like scum to the rest of town when there wasn't anything there. And that is a mafia move.
Or, you know, because you are the only person in this game that even talked about the Fire fighter. Twice.
Even if I assume that you simply wanted Shuhan to talk and made up a random question, you bringing up the hypo strat was what caught my attention.You honestly don't see how dumb it is for the Fire fighter to tell the Arsonists who he targeted and in what Night? It's the difference between them cutting our numbers to a reduced number and increasing the Forest chances of catching an Arsonist, and the Arsonists winning the game the moment they decide to ignite the Forest.
Alright so I agree that Shinobu is likely not primed, either due to being mafia or having a huge target on his back. At some point and time I might start considering who's more likely to be primed when deciding who to vote, as I'd rather accidentally lynch a primed townie then a non-primed one, but not this soon.
Ok, so what's you idea? Going for an inactive person, or someone you believe may be primed?
–-----------------
@Jabber: What are your current feeling in a Shinobu lynch? How do you see Shuhan's vote on him?
